building a better area for a safe and secure future. >> hello. i'm kristen sze. we're asking experts to get answers for you in real time. today we're talking to an expert about vaccine passports, the benefits and the worries. first, we'll tackle attacks against asian- americans. we'll listen to hear histories. joining us is the provost

mendlum conditioning and a member of barack obama justice department. 69. welcome, katrina, too, grand. by all measures, you are children of immigrants. even though stories,you cannot get away from someone not being allowed here. you encountered your own horrible spent can you share that? >> thank you so much for having mow on here. it's wonderful to be here with grand. i want to thank chrissen it and kdo-tv for helping to raise awareness i want to be clear

and i will try to give a short synopsis is not extraordinary. i don't consider it to be extraordinairey i consider it to be part of a day that i experienced yesterday but many a going to walk through the feelings that i had when going through it and afterwards when this sunk in. yesterday i was walking down a busy street with my two daughters to our car and a luxury suv pulled up to the red stop light, so it's a messy street. we're walking. we're not in a car. i take note just instinctively. then sure enough out of the corner of my eye i see the windows roll done. my kids are starting to put their kids in the car. every parent knows this routine then i see, right, the windows

cope rolling down and i think to myself this isn't for air. they're rolling it down for a reason. i think here we go. i troy to act calm, very calm in front of my my instincts kick in. i don't say anything. it was slow motion. i had this familiar feeling. again, the windows are just rolling down at this moment and i had this feeling of sheer terror, like i don't want it show it because i'm terrified for my kids' safety. i'm terrified for myself but this is familiar just the couple of seconds. and instead of yelling at my kids to speed up, get in the car for safety, i try to remain calm and that took place in my mind in two seconds and then

the racial taunting started. the racial taughting that i knew just having lived was coming and sure enough, white males were spewing racial taunts directly at me and my children. again, the suv is at a stop light. i'm thinking to myself don't make high contact. wait until the light turns green and we're going to be okay. we just have to get through those few seconds and sure enough, the light turns green, the suv moves on and we're safe and i breathe this sigh of relief quietly, very quietly, and i am just thinking to myself okay good. we're good. we can go on with our day. we get in the car. i start driving with my kids in the car and i think to me self,

oh, my gosh. my kids, they did what i did? they didn't make contact. they didn't -- they pretended like they didn't hear, and they just kept moving on, just like i did, and that's -- so i went from great fright, great terror to this moment of like pain and sadness, like i'm still trying to process because this just happened yesterday. i am realizing that my kids, right -- i think i realized it before but i'm realizing it very consciously new that my kids know this routine. i share this with my kids now, the same routine, no contact. cope your head down. cope doing what you're doing and hope it passes without any physical injury, without any

sustained engagement and i just -- i know i've done on for a bit about this, but it makes me really, really sad, and so that's what i wanted to share. >> katrina, can i ask you two things. one, what was it that they said at you and your it's safe for tv. >> i can't say what they said. does it start with a c and end with a k? >> its not a variety i have heard before. >> okay. can i ask you were you conflicted when they say we were safe. dead you feel you were unscathed though or did you feel a little part of you died even though you were not physically hurt?

>> in that moment, in that moment, i don't know if i felt that a little part of mow died but when i got in the car and i realized that i had just experienceds this and shared this moment with my children, that's when i think a little part of mow might have died. that was the moment. >> from that age, he know. put your head down. don't be noticed. grande, i know you feel this. when you were in the obama administration, you actually worked to prevent such hate crimes based on identity and race. yet, your op ed published in the san francisco chronicle a very moving one which encourage everyone to read. you said watching on an elderly thai man brought

back painful memories of your childhood. can you walk us through that? >> sure. katrina, my heart goes to you, both recognizing the normalcy of it and the difficulty. we know what happened to him in san francisco. i was really it happened on the same street i drew up on in san francisco. it shook me to my core. when i was a teenager, my father was one night like fathers do, take out the garbage so the garbage trucks can pick it up the next morning and he was confronted by a man with a pistol who was robbing him there, and, you know, my

dad holds things in but it was hard that night when he claim back and said what had happened. i mean, he was in shock and i'm not sure at that age i knew how to react as i hear katrina talk about her kids. your child and probably the first time my brother jordan and i ever even thought of the possibility of the loss of someone so close to you. i'll add that. my dad is now older than he and that could have happened to any of us, to anyone's parents. police captured a suspect had did the same thing in another house. my father refused to testify dow it concerns about retribution. i understand that now, as his

son and as a father. that's hard that asian- americans are targeted sometimes because of the reluctance to endamage in the legal system and we know asians, especially elderly asians have been targeted because sometimes they do carry a certain amount of cash or they're reluctant to doing so. that's the pain that it brought back for me because of the location and pause of the place. again, i would say it's not uncommon. i've been talking to friends. it's happened to others. it's common to talk to others and hear that. >> i know you hear a lot from your students at menlo

and we are black we're with grande lum, provost of menlo college and and a law professor. i'm going to ask you guys this. it's painful but raise your hand if that's you. growing up, did you hear random change chong chong chong chong n >> yes. >> did you have people pull their eyes? >> yes. it happened at the health club on the peninsula just recently where somebody did that. >> an adult. >> an adult did that did that dh

yes. >> did you have professionals in your working lives tell you, oh, your english is so good. i've had that as a as a you too? >> i've had people walk alongside me when i'm dressed in my professional clothing, obviously on my court classroom and ask me where are you from. >> wait, wait, but where are you really from? >> exactly. where are you really from. >> i say ema from san francisco. that's where i'm originally from sometimes i refuse to engage as a response to that because i don't want to endamage in the way they want to. i don't want to answer the question the way it's framed. >> because you know what they're getting to. ever have a problem on the road and someone says go back to

chinas a the default i win, you lose response? >> something like that. something like that, rolling the windows down. >> you guys, this is the thing, right. living here in the bay area, for long time, i felt like it was getting better. i encountered that as a child and a teen and i thought it was less overt as otherring, but then suddenly it seems like it's worse again. i wonder with your opinions are on that. >> yeah, i mean, it happened to my daughter in new york where she's on job trying it convert people to use sustainable electricity at a both and a bun of guys come to her and start taunting her. it happened to my nephew in the sunset of san francisco and he's walking home and someone trying by is yelling at him.

the good thing others yelled back at him. yeah, i think it continues to be a problem here. >> we know from the numbers that the incidents have done up, the number of reported incidents. i actually worry those incidents are underreported and i think time will tell. >> we'll dive in to the the the in our next segment. katrina, i want to ask you given that your daughters know the routine, pretending they didn't hear. are you going to have conversations and how they mitt want it respond in the future? >> so, we have had conversations before that, but i think that -- and we'll continue to have conversations is the answer. but it just didn't hit mow as hard until that moment that

they're really good at this and to realize that. they were really good at handling that type of situation. it hit me so hard and i was just so upset and sad that what i you up with, my children are getting conditioned in the same way tend makes mow sad that there's ad in for them to be conditioned, that there's a ned for mow to have conversations with. that makes me sad and just, yeah. >> well, katrina, grande, hopefully its something your grandchildren, our grandchildren won't have to deal with. >> we can only hope. >> grande you authored a new book called american peacemakers. i know in it you have advice and your experience in working in the obama administration how

to respond and prevent it. grande lum and katrina lee, thank you. take care. stay safe. >> thank you, kristen. >> okay. so how did we get he

we want to put to asian-americans into historical perspective. history is important. knowing the past helps us understand the present so we can build better future. so if seeing what happens angers you and you want a different future, let's have a conversation. joining usa a former journalist and russell jung of stop aapi

hate. russ system and helen, good to see you both. i wish the conversation were different. look, new data shows hate crime is down but not when it comes to asian-americans. russell, stop aapi hate has been tracking the numbers. they can be scary, but give them to us. >> we've been receiving reports from asian-americans since last march. we've seen 3,800 incidents of asian-americans from every 5 states. they've been traumatizing because we've conducted studies. they're showing signs of trauma and depression. again, it's a widespread occurrence. at least every one is one degree of separation from the hate and you've seen it happen with the shootings >> yes and we've seen it

the last two guests. helen, some are surprised to see it as a new thing but we know it's not a new thing. it dates back to the 1800s. educate us in one, two minutes. >> absolutely. as you started this segment saying history, don't tune out. history shows us what's been happening. it could have been anticipated. actually, a year ago i wrote an op ed piece saying it will get worse. it his likely to get worse and many of us who have been following what's going on, including the folks from stop aapi hate, one of the conversations we had was this could lead to a mass killing. no one wanted to say that but it's our worst nightmare come true. as shocking as it is, we can't

be surprised because the history of asian-americans has been built on ethnic cleansing. there have been massacres of asian-americans before. it was written into state of california law as well as federal law to target, blame, scapegoat and get rid of first chinese-americans and other asian-americans. this goes back more than 100 years. asian-americans have been experiencing this kind of blaming and attacks for a very long time. so for asian-americans, this is not new. >> let's talk about the blaming, right? chinese laborers were weapon. >> absolutely. when there has been economic distress, it's chto

blame another group, an identifiable group that has been otherred and for asian- americans, that is the convenient role they have put us into. back in the 1800s during economic depressions here in san francisco, asian-americans were being driven out. that was a dole. the chinese must goal. that came here in california, in san francisco, and so that's resurfaced over and over again. whether this was in the 1800s, in the 20th century and incars nateing 12 you, japanese americans with the big economic crisis of the 198s where japa was blamed. so a chinese-american was killed because he looked japanese. what the history shows us today there's been heavy duty, for

the past more than five years china blaming, china targeting. so anyone who looks chinese nows had a bull's-eye on their back. >> i know you've been talking about how the attacks have have against the women, asian- american women. >> most of the

it's probably the last question. >> all right. we do apologize that we dropped out so suddenly there earlier. we have a couple minutes that we want to finish and have some takeaways from this. we talked about what happened

from a historical context. it's always been there simmering and the events that trigger it suchs had when there are issues with the government which shouldn't spill over on to people but it has and it does. look, i want to ask you, russell what are the tangible results of as to attacks on asian-americans? >> i think helen said history is repeating it self. we're being attacked and scapegoated, but in every case asian-americans have resisted. the results i see is americans are standing up. we're galvanized. we're outraged and working with our allies. that's what i see happening. >> it does feel we tipping point, a watershed moment and pretending we didn't hear and see.

helen, how can people be horrified? >> i think number one, allies will want to learn and be curious pause as russell just said and you are pointing out that this may be a tipping point, for asian-americans this has been going on for a long team. we are aware of all of this hate and it's been very upsetting to hear other people say oh, new you know what racism is b oh, now asian- americans are experiencing racism. there's nothing further from the truth about that. so our allies should troy this understand, be supportive. there's a lot online about how this can be. when we hear oh, it's sex addition, so when does an illness allows them it do a mass killing. that is a complete insult to every woman and asian. the thing is to hear police

officers saying that, are allies will stand up. >> thank you. tonight, several developing stories as we come on the air. the deadly shooting rampage in atlanta. authorities now revealing new details tonight about the alleged gunman charged with eight counts of murder. opening fire at three different spas. eight people killed, including six women of asian decent. tonight, growing out rage across this country. what's being done to stop the hate? and the county sheriff who will no longer be the spokesperson on this case, one day after he described what the suspect told investigators going on to say yesterday was a really bad day for him. tonight, president biden ordering flags lowered to half staff. the president and vice president traveling to atlanta tomorrow. steve osunsami with late reporting. also tonight, president biden late today revealing his goal of 100 million s