announcer: building a better bay area. moving forward, finding solutions. this is abc news. liz: that afternoon. i'm liz kreutz. today, we are going t t t t t latest covid-19 headlines including the news that more than 100,000 people are now hospitalized with the disease in the first of course, we begin with the latest after the deadly attack at the kabul airport in afghanistan. 12 u.s. servicemembers are dead and 15 others injured along with a number of afghans. we just heard president biden address the nation and joining us with the latest is my friend and abc political director rick klein. good to see you. a very sad day. we did see a very emotional

president biden. rick: yes, you saw the full weight of what it means as commander-in-chief to put u.s. troops in harm's way, talking about this as the father of a veteran, his late son beau biden who served in afghanistan and elsewhere. you heard what this means to a political leader. this was his decision. this was his deadline. this was his operation he ordered to be approved to put the soldiers in harms way. there's no way to fully cope with the fallout of that and you could feel what that decision meant to him and what it means to so many around him and in the country at this time. liz: you certainly could feel the weight on his shoulders. . what are your takeaways? he still stands by his decision to pull out. rick: important in what he said moments ago, the word of the united states matters and that is a phrase i think will be

parsed extensively. the word of the united states being we would leave august 31, but there's another thing he was asked about, the word of the united states and the commitment to the afghan people to build a stable society and the tens of thousands of afghans who helped the mission as translators, drivers, xers, -- fixtures, friendly faces, people desperate to get out of the country. he acknowledges even today there's no way even all of them would be able to get out safely. there would be some number of american citizens and afghans who need refugee status and will not get out. that has its own applications. the word of the united states on the international stage is at stake at this moment. clearly he's not moving from the august 31 deadline. this would have been an opportunity to recalibrate, but he said that is the commitment he will keep two and he saying there's no way to avoid a messy end to the longest of wars.

liz: it is true, he kept to the august 31 deadline. and as you point out, he said the word of the u.s. matters and he will make sure if you want to get out, you will get out. what does that mean? are we going to keep troops in past august 31, or out? rick: i don't see any scenario where there is a significant number of troops, although he raised the possibility of strikes against individuals responsible for today's actions. very strong in saying that so it does raise the possibility of combat on the ground. beyond that, it is clear the mission does not end. it gets more complicated. that means not just coordinating and cooperating with the taliban , and insurgency the u.s. was fighting for 20 years, but also fending off terrorist elements. this has now been prescribed to an offshoot of isis that wants the taliban to fail and wants further chaos. so you have terrorists fighting

against an insurgency which somehow creates a government structure the u.s. will rely upon. that does not seem like a recipe for success. liz: so you mentioned this group isis x. excuse me, isis-k. how is that different from isis? rick: it is an offshoot. it shares some of the visions but has a different geographical base. in this case, has a slightly different vision. islamic fundamentalists that are also terrorists. this is a group of very scary people, dangerous people, who have a much more decentralized organization. it is not as easy as even going after one singular head like osama bin laden. this is one of the many groups that has sprung up and has been a major concern. it has been on the radar of the u.s. for some time but i don't know if there was specific indication of this complex or coordinated attack was within the capabilities of this group.

liz: the pentagon says the u.s. is coordinating with the taliban on these negotiations and president biden said it was not a mistake to have them there. what is your thought on that? rick: it is certainly risky. maybe we have no choice because they are the de facto government of afghanistan, but these are people who are not particularly trustworthy. as president biden said, they are not good guys. the trust is beyond anything they could have potentially earned. the question is whether they will -- they knew about the attack or allowed for it. just on the question of whether they can be held to their word, this is not a group that has engendered confidence on the world stage. there's a potential for them to become a pariah state if they don't respect women's rights, the rights of minorities or afghan citizens who want to leave. there's been no indication that

a new and improved taliban even cares how they are seen on the international stage. they don't think about that in the same way. maybe as they are inheriting a different economy, they take the leadership in a different way but this is difficult. you saw questioning moments ago about whether the taliban was provided a list of americans who should be evacuated. the flipside of that is it could be a roadmap for taliban interests to use against people left behind. it could be essentially a hit list of people to kill afterward. that's a concern about any cooperation with a set of people, with unsavory ideas, principles that are anathema to the united states, and have filed -- fought against u.s. interests for 20 years. liz: president biden talked about how risky this operation is and why he wants to keep to the august 31 deadline. is there any talk about him putting more troops in?

rick:rick: he says he's open to that if military commanders say they needed. we heard earlier from the head of central command, the top general over the marine corps say that in his view, it is not necessary, that there won't be a necessity to have anything like that. if that changes, he said he would do it and make the order if it comes to that. liz: big picture, what do you think is the political fallout for this for president biden? rick: i think it is best. you are seeing -- vast. you are seeing republicans call for his impeachment. you also see a significant number of democrats break with the white house and say they think he's making a mistake and think the deadline should be withdrawn. we have seen public opinion polling suggesting his approval rating has taken a significant hit. i think more broadly, the blow to american credibility and the sense of competence from the

white house is consistently, the white house is in the position of being behind the storylines, behind the news reacting to events instead of dictating them. i think that dictates the political calculus. this week and horrible events of today, it would be indelible marks on any legacy of any president. liz: i heard some democrats say they almost feel like president biden took one for the team, maybe he thinks he will be a one term president and somebody had to do this. do you think there is merit to that? rick: in the way he framed this, that i would not leave it to another american president, there is something about that. some officials talk about public opinion polls backing them up before the operation began. certainly polling before today's tragedies, it appeared there was broad public support in afghanistan. that shifted a little bit as the consequences have become known. there have been a few white

house aides saying he's on the right side of history. he has talked about in somewhat selfless terms. he said he inherited bad choices from the previous administration and he needed to pull off a band-aid that he did not want to pass to a fifth american president. liz: i think i have 25 seconds so i want to ask about the california recall election overlapping with the situation in afghanistan. vice-president kamala harris's event has been canceled tomorrow. do you think she had any other choice? the optics probably did not look good. rick: this would have been a terrible time to make a campaign stop. she had to return to washington after the trip in asia. i think it's a bad time generally to be a democrat running. gavin newsom will have to deal with that. it will be hard to get people to focus on that with a little more than two weeks left. liz: i could go on forever, but i'm told it is time to wrap, so

thank you for your insight as always. rick: gh yo thk yarea woman who was born in afghanistan and has a lot of ties to the country. we will take a break, but this conversation

liz: welcome back. liz:the situation in afghanistan hits close to home for many afghan americans living here in the bay area. many are doing what they can to help. this is a faculty member faculty jose university's human rights institute. she was born in afghanistan and spent more than a decade training scholars and befriending afghan journalists and activists. she joins us live. thank you for being here. first, how are your friends and

family in afghanistan doing? >> thank you for giving me the opportunity to talk about their lives and what so many of my friends and former colleagues are going through in kabul. since the fall of kabul been in touch -- i have been in touch for years all the time with friends and colleagues, but it has been an emotional roller coaster. one day they are hopeful they will get on a flight to evacuate and the next day, they realize the airport is getting worse so it is just an emotional roller coaster. i get messages every 10 to 15 minutes from people especially at our night which is their morning and they wake up to a day worse than the day before. liz: are they all in kabul, are

they hiding? what is their situation? >> i hear from people all over the country. i have friends in all provinces, many provinces, the taliban took over different provinces at different stages and some have been owned or this rule for months. some have been weeks. a western city now has been a couple weeks. kabul has been 10 days. each place is different and their experiences are different. all eyes are on kabul right now and because of the airport, the international airport is the only international airport in the country, so all eyes are on that and the situation is terrible. we have through the scholars at risk program at san jose and uc berkeley, we are

trying to evacuate scholars who have contacted us and placed them with u.s. universities, but we can't get them out. some have received passes, gate passes, but they are afraid to approach the airport because of the explosions and the attacks. some have not received any gate passes and are afraid to enter with avon -- with even letters of invitation for visas. some are considering -- right now where we are and i'm in touch with so many afghans, trying to figure out ground transportation because air evacuation does not seem likely for a lot of afghans now. liz: a lot of your friends as you mentioned are scholars, academics, journalists. what is life going to be like for them under taliban rule if they cannot get out? halima: thank you for asking. the focus has been so much on afghans who do have access to get out. i'm worried about the ones that

have not been able to get out and who won't be able to. i spoke this morning to a professor who is a very good friend. she was very high-level -- i'm trying to be careful about identifying her. she told me they already got word that when they resume classes, she has not been to work at the university in 10 days, that when they resume classes, men and women have to be separated. it is not clear when female instructors can teach classes with men. the things we expected, some of them are coming true. they are happening. the segregation of men and women at the university level and schools. at least at this point, it sounds like women will be able to attend the university. there's one thing that is important to point out, what the

taliban and affiliates are saying, and on the ground are for women and girls to actually participate. so they can say women can go to the university, but if the conditions are not conducive for that activity, women are obviously going to stay home. girls are going to stay home and families will want to keep everybody safe. liz: gosh, it is heartbreaking hearing you say that. everybody, including myself, we hear these stories and we want to help. please talk about this effort you are doing to try and help these people. i know you have raised $160,000 so far. rick: yes -- halima: yes. this was originally intended to help people arrive. it still is. once we have scholars arrive who have been in touch with us the last couple weeks and placing them in our universities, they can continue the wonderful and

important work they do, they can continue that. their lives are disrupted but perhaps we can help maintain their careers and contribute to our understanding of afghanistan and there's. however, there's a good number of them we have not been able to evacuate because they don't have the special visas the state department has assigned for categories of afghans who have worked with u.s. organizations or served as interpreters. there are a lot of others like professors and scholars and journalists who don't have affiliations with international organizations who have done incredible work where at risk and we can't get them out. liz: i have 15 seconds for people who want to learn more about what you are doing. what is the website they can go to? halima: they can actually go to san jose state university's institute -- human rights institute or the uc berkeley

human rights center. we have project information there. that is a good place to start. liz: all right, halima kazem, thank you so much for what you are doing and we hope your friends and colleagues are safe and able to get out. thank you. halima: thank you for having me. liz: next, we turn our attention to covid-19. with more than 100,000 people hospitalized, we'll talk about that. first we will ta

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we will be right back liz: welcome back. more people are in the hospital with covid-19 this august compared to last august when we did not have a vaccine. joining us to talk about that and answer your questions, we have a lot of them. dr. lee riley is a professor at uc berkeley and head of the division of infectious disease and vex analogy -- vaccinolo more than 100,000 people are

hospitalized due to covid. more than 90 per -- 97% of those people are unvaccinated. if that does not send a message, what do you think will? >> yes. this is thought if enough people get vaccinated, transmissions will decrease. we continue to see transmissions especially among unvaccinated. a lot of these unvaccinated people might also be getting infected from vaccinated people as well. this is not what without would happen and it is a serious development. liz: it certainly is. i want to talk about delta airlines charging unvaccinated people $200 a month. the ceos say the hospital stays cost $50,000. should companies follow this lead? >> i think companies should do

anything they can to get people vaccinated. insurance companies might raise premiums. this is something industry companies need to participate in to get people vaccinated. liz: we are getting a question on facebook from linda who says what is asymptomatic and pre-symptomatic spread among vaccinated? >> we are beginning to see some data that a symptom at a people can spread the virus. pre-symptomatic, we don't really have that information because in order to get that information, people have to be tested before they develop symptoms. so we have few data from places where they have these outbreaks such as the one that took place in massachusetts earlier this month. about 74% of the fully vaccinated people were infected

and many of those were asymptomatic. liz: are we on a plateau at all with delta in the u.s.? we heard from some experts that say there might be signs we could be. >> yes, we are beginning to see that. i don't know if this will be sustained, but this is something happening with all variants. at some point they plateau and then decrease. even places like india where the delta variant first appeared, india is a country where not many are vaccinated, it peaked and then decreased. this is something that could happen even without vaccination. liz: but if it is the delta variant that plateaus, doesn't that mean another variant will come in just as strong westmark >> exactly. we are beginning to see other variants. we don't know what will happen to them, but we have seen so far every time a new variant

appears, it seems to do better to outdo the previous variant. if this trend continues, we might see another variant that might do better. i think what will happen right now is delta is the main variant circulating. what we will see is a variant that is a descendant of the delta various -- virus. that might be less susceptible to the vaccines we currently have. liz: that is always concerning. you did say though that we need to go forward to a new type of normal. what do you mean by that? >> we know that normal we had is exactly the situation that created this pandemic kicking off in the first place. we did not have a highly prepared public health system. we were totally unprepared when the pandemic hit. we did not have the ability to do contact tracing in an efficient manner. we also saw there was a huge disparity among people who

suffered the most from this disease, the underrepresented minority populations had a higher rate of hospitalization and death. it is exactly because of kind of conditions in the health system that existed that allowed that to happen. when we say going back to normal, we don't want to go back to that normal. we need to go into a new type of normal that we don't have this kind of disparity and we are well prepared to handle the next pandemic. liz: i want to ask about booster shots. how do you think these should be rolled out? do you think it should be staggered, available to all? >> this would depend on the number of vaccines available. there's a debate especially from organizations like the who, that rather than focusing on boosters, we should focus on

maximizing distribution to countries where they are not widely available. ideally we can do both. we can give the boosters to those, especially those who are vulnerable to severe disease, but at the same time give the vaccine to countries that have not had many. we do need to vaccinate as many people as we can because that is where the transmission is taking place. that is where the variance will emerge. we need to be doing both. liz: i'm told to wrap up but we

joining us on this interactive

show getting answers. we will be here every weekday at 3:00 on air and livestream answering your questions. tonight, breaking news as we come on the air. president biden speaking just moments ago on the devastating american losses in afghanistan. 12 u.s. service members killed. saying for those who carried out this attack, we will hunt you down, we will make you pay. those 12 service members killed, 15 wounded in a suicide bomb attack at the airport in kabul. the deadliest day for the u.s. military in afghanistan in more than a decade. coming just days before the u.s. deadline to withdraw from that country. isis-k and isis affiliate in afghanistan claiming responsibility. the pentagon saying the bomber detonated near the abbey gate, one of the main entrances of the airport. isis gunmen then firing into the crowd. another explosion taking place outside a n