every day we talk with experts about issues important to the

area. today, a clear portrait of homelessness in california. researchers have thing many on house people say could have kept them from experience in homelessness. also, it is one of the most stunning and popular spots in california but its popularity is one of its biggest problems, we are talking about lake tahoe. now there is talk about the need to balance visitors, locals, and the environment. first a big developing story happening right now the massive operation to find the missing submersible with five people aboard. the search is focused off cape cod where banging sounds were picked up today. >> this is a search-and-rescue

mission 100%. we will continue to put every available asset we have in an effort to find the titan and the crewmembers. >> time is of the essence with five men above dashboard submersible. two have ties to the bay area. one is the ceo of oceangate expeditions the company that owns the missing sub. also on board, a man has ties to the bay area. he has been on a board based in mountain view. his son was with him. joining us live to talk about the ongoing search for the men is jeff carson. professor, thank you for joining us. we know the submersible has about four days of oxygen on it, so we are coming down to the wire.

how much time is left? >> about 12 hours. our calculation for the maximum amount of oxygen available. time is really running out. >> what can you tell us about those underground sounds that have been detected? >> i wish i could tell you something positive. it is potentially coming from the submarine on the bottom. it has been interpreted by some as banging. probably someone inside banging on the hall. that is one possibility, but we need to look at this with some caution because we know so little about what is going on in the bottom of the ocean, sounds bouncing around the ocean. it is possible it's coming from some other source entirely.

part of the titanic settling, gas coming from the sedimentary material on the bottom of the ocean, maybe from something like a whale. that has yet to be investigated. >> is that something the people in a submersible like this would do is bang on it? are they trained to do that? is it a potential sign they are alive? >> yes all of us who have bee involved in this science and been to the seafloor into submarine, you can't help but think about what if scenarios. what would i do if we were in the situation? banging is a logical thing to do. sound is what will lead investigators to the submersible. >> how deep do rescuers believe they may be and what are conditions like at that level? >> it is 2.5

the pressure is immense. it is completely dark and utterly soundless. temperature just above freezing. it's not a place that we will visually spine something that is lost. the submersibles being used powerful lights on them, but you can only see a few feet ahead. we need sound to help us pinpoint wherever the sound is coming from. yet to be confirmed that it is the submarine. >> do you know if they have heaters or lights inside? >> there are certainly lights, but they must've had a power failure. it's not clear that anything other than a flashlight would be available. no heaters and i guarantee it is very cold and uncomfortable under the best conditions. >> that is certainly scary to

think about. what do you know as the best way to reach them for rescuers? >> the only way the rescue is going to take place is to bring the submarine to the surface. first it has to be found. the best bet is the sound and that has to be pinpointed than located with a remotely operated vehicle on site now. one possibility is the summary -- submarine has not dropped the weights that keep it at the seafloor. it is buoyant, it needs to drop its weights and bob to the surface. for some reason, that hasn't happened. the weights haven't been dropped, or its tangled up in wreckage or debris, something like that that is restricting it. >> let's locate them, then what?

how do you get them to the surface and out of there? >> all that has to happen is it has a clear path to the surface and the weights that should be easy to drop off submarine, that that is done. then it should come directly to surface, it could be at the surface in two hours. all of this supposes that no catastrophic accident has taken place. >> do you have a prediction of what may have happened? perhaps they have sadly already denied? >> unfortunately that is possibility but we will not know until it is located. >> in terms of oxygen levels, is there anything they can do to prolong the four days? >> four days is an estimate. we all use oxygen at different rates. if we are sleeping and being calm, we will not use as much.

if we are doing vigorous activity that uses more oxygen. that's the best they can do, to remain calm. sleeping would be great. they can only extend oxygen a few hours probably. >> there's been a lot of questions about the known safety concerns of the submersible. why was a videogame contr being used to to steer it? >> don't be full, that is not an unsophisticated mechanism for steering summary. -- steering the submarine. it's a simplification that allows untrained people to manipulate submarine. there are testing and mechanical tests need to be carried out before anyone gets in submarine like this and i'm sure that is going to be reviewed very carefully as it plays out. >> professor, thank you so much

for joining us and giving us your insight into all of this. we are certainly hoping for the best in this situation. now copperheads a study since the 1990's on the homeless in california. it comes up (bell dinging) how's john? oh, much better. that was quite a scare. got us thinking about a lot of things. like life insurance. if something happened to either one of us, we'd really be in trouble. but where can we get coverage with john's health problems on a fixed income? go with a sure thing. colonial penn. friends have been telling friends about colonial penn guaranteed acceptance whole life insurance for more than 50 years, and with good reason. if you're between the ages of 50 and 85, it's a sure thing. your acceptance is guaranteed because full benefits are not paid in the first two years. you don't need a physical exam

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same time next week? sure thing. the largest and most comprehensive study of the homeless population lessons does it hold on the problems of homelessness and can solutions be gleaned from the

findings? let's get some answers. our guest is the study principal investigator. thank you for jo give us a sense of how the research was conducted. i understood it was over 300 interviews with adults experiencing homelessness. >> we took a random sample, we chose eight counties throughout the state that we thought could give us a picture of the state as a whole then we took a random sample of all adults experiencing homelessness. we did 3200 surveys and of those, we chose 365 people to do in-depth interviews. our results reflect the randomly selected individuals and the in-depth interviews of from some of those. >> what are some of the major findings that you think people should know? >> first of all, people

experiencing homelessness in california are californians. nine in 10 lost their housing. a significantly higher portion were born in california. the population is aging. almost half of the single adults were age 50 and older. of those, 41% had never been homeless before the age of 50. people were really poor and when we looked into all the reasons that they lost their housing, the single biggest reason was simply they couldn't pay their rent. >> i want to dig into that more but how is the data going to be used? >> we are talking clo policymakers the local, state, and federal level to make sure this data is useful to them. the whole idea for the study started when we were called by the director of health and human services for the state who asked us hard questions about what we

knew and didn't know. we with policymakers, we hope the public reads it, and learns some things perhaps they didn't know. >> i think the study dispels the myth. your study shows money more than addiction, mental health, or poor decisions is the main cause of homelessness. would you talk more about that? >> yes to give you a picture, the median monthly income before people were homeless brought the state was $960 for the whole household. what people told us of a litany of reasons why they might have left that housing. the single one was they could not keep up with the rent. that people lost income. they were living on the margin and when their hours got cut back, when somebody in the household lost a job, they had

no cushion at all. we asked people what would have prevented their homelessness through a series of different questions, different choice options. what we heard was money and surprisingly low amounts. 70% of people said if they had an additional $300-$500 per month they were not a become homeless. some said if they had a one time $5,000-$10,000. others, people were working, they fell behind in rent, they lost their housing then they fell further behind than they couldn't work than their income went further down. >> do you think perhaps you could glean a stipend for folks is a solution? >> absolutely we need to create more housing and bring down that cost and increase people's incomes. stipend rental subsidies could probably go a very long way. we still need to work on the

supply, we have a shortage of housing, but we need to get our focus on what the problem is and the public instrument or that while people with substance use and mental health were over represented, most of them live in housing. the reason these pope -- people lost their housing estate certainly could pay the rent. >> are tiny homes a good solution? >> as long as housing is permanent. tiny housing is a great way to shelter people. again is what helps people heal, get back in the workforce, address mental health or substance use challenges is permanent. having a place that is really there's. we heard in interviews poignantly, they said i want to

be treated like everybody else. if my boyfriend or girlfriend comes over, i'm not one to get in trouble like most of us don't get in trouble if we bring someone to our house. they just wanted what the rest of us want and have which is safety and security of home. >> also the notion that a lot of these people are coming from outside of california because of the weather. what did you learn about that? did that surprise you? >> it was really consistent. nine out of 10 people lost their housing in california. of the california. very few people who came from outside were returning home. these are californians. i don't think we are doing ourselves any favor. i think we have the most expensive housing market in the country.

>> homelessness as a problem that can be solved or alleviated? >> it's going to take us a while. this took us 40 years of policy failures at the local, state, and federal level to get us into this mess and i don't think it is going to be solved overnight. we know what to do and we need to stay on focus. we have to knock it sidetracked by these issues or certain agendas. really the solution is housing. it's going to take us a while to get there, but we need to keep doing it and we need to recognize that housing needs to be affordable for our lowest income neighbors, friends, californians. >> thank you, this was really fascinating and insightful. the effort to keep tahoe

entering a new phase. a care plan has been released in an effort to attack tahoe's unique environment. up next our guest talks

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although tourism can be good for parts of the economy, any locals who live there say it also has a negative impact. this is a live look our camera at tahoe. want to preserve and that has led to the creation of a protection plan unveiled yesterday. it seeks to address issues of over tourism, affordability, and the environment. joining us is tahoe fund. what other concerns?

>> i think there's just, there 55,000 people live in tahoe full-time. and if she million visitors every year. there are natural conflicts that take place when you have that many people coming to such a small area. our roads are only two lanes all the way around the lake and it creates conflicts between people living here and people enjoying coming here. the idea is to try to address some of those conflicts to make it better for everybody. >> picture. who created it and what is it seeking to do? >> i joke that tahoe has been for decades run as a resort where sales and marketing never got to talk to operations. for the first time ever, this

amazing group of 17 organizations got together for the last year and a half to say let's new table, all set around it and figure out how i can continue to grow the economy tourism brings to tahoe that gives people so much of their livelihoods. but at the same time shows benefits to the local community and also to the local environment. >> i want to talk about this idea of over tourism. what does that mean and how is it impacting tahoe as well? >> that term has been used a lot lately. when covid hit, people around the world flocked to the outdoors because it was so good for your mental health and physical health and it was safe to be outside. there was a feeling that there were too many people for the space that we had. the way we look at it is tahoe is open. no gate, we are not keeping people from coming here, but we have to do a better job of

managing when people are here. we also have to recognize we don't have to advertise tahoe in the summer, plenty of people are coming. instead, the resort associations are focusing on messaging to those people when they are here, how they can treat tahoe with more respect, how they can take care of it when they are here. >> full transparency, i lipreading because apparently, everybody can hear you but me. i will say t items in the document. what are some other parts other than over tourism being addressed? >> it's about destination management, bidders -- visitor management. it's also about taking care of the local community. how can we take the revenue we generate and give it back to the local community in a way that people will appreciate? this summer will see a num back take -- of activities

happening. take care tahoe ambassadors at local beaches and trails. they will be very welcoming, help people understand and they are high school kids thank you uniforms, to help people understand how they can take care of tahoe and answer questions. come in reminding people to pick up after your dog, ditch the water bottles, pack it in pack it out. we hope whatever you bring in, you will take home with you at the end of the day. >> what about issues of affordability? can you talk about how those are addressed in this plan? >> this is a big moment for us. it's not all happy right away. -- it's not all happening right

away. then things like affordable housing and transportation, those are big issues we need to deal with. that's going to take us a while to figure out. we convened a new counsel. then through that counsel, we will start looking at these big problems we have to solve as a region. we have made it very unaffordable for our workforce to work and live in tahoe and we need to come up with a solution for that because without workforce, we don't have much of an economy. >> what can folks in the area do who want to come to tahoe, they love it, they want to keep it blue as well and they want to be a good samaritan? what can they do to be respectful when they come to visit? >> being respectful starts first. leave your plastic water bottles at home.

if you bring your dog, remember you have to pick up after your dog. if you are on the trail, rimmer you have to share with others. we live in a fire danger area so make sure you know what the fire restrictions are. we have options. it will take you to a trailhead, a beach, a restaurant or bar. that will eliminate a lot of cars on the road. it's important that everyone realizes everybody has a role to play in taking care of tahoe. it's about being thoughtful and remembering to leave a place better than you found. >> i look forward to going back and listening to all the wonderful insightful things you had to say. thank you for rolling with me on this interview and all of your insights on this. we look forward to seeing the plan in action.

thank you for joining us.

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thank you for joining us. >> whit: tonight, time running out. the missing titanic sub with just hours of oxygen remaining. the desperate search expanding at this hour. the coast guard bringing in more ships, underwater vessels, and advanced equipment to help find the sub and the fpe