tv This Week With George Stephanopoulos ABC January 27, 2025 12:00am-1:00am PST
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>> announcer: "this week" with george stephanopoulos starts right now. >> martha: a head-spinning kickoff. >> america's decline is over. >> martha: from terminating federal diversity programs to deporting immigrants on military aircraft, president trump aggressively begins his first week back in office with a blitz of executive actions. >> all illegal entry will immediately be halted. >> martha: this morning, our sunday exclusive with new border czar, tom homan. if they have been here 30 years, if they have a job, if they're working on a farm, they should be scared? >> if you are in the country illegally, you got a problem and
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we're looking for you. >> martha: abc's matt rivers on the border with american troops and michigan's new democratic st senator, elissa slotkin, responds. presidential power. trump pushes the limits of his authority, hardenpardoning more 1,500 january 6th rioters. >> these were people that actually love our country. >> what happened to backing the blue? >> reporte >> martha: so what's legal and what's on shaky ground in these orders? chris christie and preet bharara on what's next. >> so help me god. >> congratulations. >> martha: and after the narrow confirmation of pete hegseth, will trump's remaining nominees make it through? our powerhouse round table tackles it all. and elon's influence. >> he takes risks. he sometimes blows things up, and that's what he's going to do in government. >> martha: with the world's richest man now joining
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president trump at the white house, elon musk's biographer explains what drives the tech titan. good morning, and welcome to "this week." the first week of donald trump's return to the oval office, and he wasted no time. the president ordering an end to federal diversity, equity, and inclusion programs, freezing federal hiring, and firing at least 17 inspectors general who serve as independent watchdogs of federal agencies. trump also made good on his commitment to free those convicted for their actions during the january 6, 2021, attack on the u.s. capitol, commute orgaing or pardoning so 1,500 rioters including those who violently assaulted police officers, and on the world stage taking aim at russia, warning president vladimir putin of possible economic sanctions if
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he doesn't engage in negotiations with ukraine, declaring, it's time to make a deal. the president also pledging to take back the panama canal, threatening tariffs against china, mexico, canada, and all of europe. it is a rapid rollout of trump's agenda with no issue more central to his presidency than immigration. president trump declaring a national emergency at the border, shutting down refugee arrivals, ordering 1,500 armed, active-duty military to the border. and all of this will no overov overseen by his new defense secretary pete hegseth, sworn in after vice president jd vance had to cast the tiebreaking vote for his senate confirmation late friday. he takes over a department already deeply involved in delivering on trump's america first agenda. for the first time in history, military aircraft transporting
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undocumented immigrants back to their home countries, a practice trump's border czar tells me will continue every day. we'll bring you that conversation in a moment, but we begin with abc's matt rivers who embedded with u.s. marines headed for the border. >> reporter: this week, the beginning of president trump's military buildup at the southern border. this is part of the very first steps of the u.s. military being deployed down here, those taking off from camp pendleton making their way down here to the u.s./mexico bo 1,500 active-duty, u.s. marine, and army personnel being deployed to the u.s./mexico border to aid protection efforts. they're going to bring those right down to the border to reinforce it. it's meant to be a deterrence against future migration, and flights like these may be happening a lot more over the coming months. the pentagon releasing these images saturday of additional troops now deployed in texas and california to assist with trump's latest border security
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mission. according to a u.s. official, the newly deployed troops will not be engaging in law enforcement duty, and are being sent in support of the department of homeland security as president trump's deportation efforts get under way. u.s. military aircraft carrying undocumented migrants out of the country for the first time. the white house releasing these pictures of migrants in chains, boarding two c-17 jets. approximately 160 people in total taken to guatemala friday. president trump touting these moves during remarks in las vegas this weekend. >> we're getting them out. you see it. you see it yesterday, first day. our message could not be more clear. >> reporter: meanwhile, thousands of migrants are now stuck in mexico with no idea what comes next as the administration halts all applications for asylum through the cbp-1 app. one asylum seeker says, i lost
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my hope. i feel depressed, really. i don't know what i should do. but the trump administration warns this is only the beginning of their border crackdown, and thousands more troops could be flooding in soon. for "this week," matt rivers, along the u.s./mexico border. >> martha: our thanks to matt rivers. one of the very first appointments donald trump made after winning the election in november was tapping one man to be what he calls his border czar, tom homan is a former border patrol agent and acting director of i.c.e. with decades of experience in republican and democratic administrations. i sat down with him this week and began our conversation by asking him about the role of the u.s. military. >> we got military on the border, not only helping us with the departure flights on military planes, but to build infrastructure. they're down there to create a secure border and lock that border down, and d.o.d. has helped administrations before, but not at this level. it's a force multiplier, and it's sending a strong signal to
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the world, our border's closed. >> martha: so is this what we will see every single day ending in what the president has promised is millions and millions being deported? >> yes, but you're going to see the numbers steadily increase. the numbers nationwide as we open up the aperture. that's a smaller population, and we'll do this priority-based. that's president trump's promise, but they'll be more nationwide. >> martha: when you talk about the aperture opening, the estimates of perhaps those who have been convicted or arrested in the past 700,000 to over 1 million, so after you do that, then you go after everybody who is there illegally. >> if you are in the country illegally, you're on the table because it's not okay to, you know, violate laws in this country. you got to remember every time you enter this country illegally, you violate a crime under the title 8 in the united
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states constitution. it's a crime. you got a problem and that's why i'm hoping those who are in the country legally who have not been ordered by the federal judge should leave. >> martha: you are emphasizing you go after security th you have said no one's off the table. if you are in the country imlegally, you should be looking over your shoulder. you should be afraid and you should start packing now. is that what you're doing to get hotel workers out, or people working on farms, that they'll be so scared they just leave? >> look. i think -- if you are in the country illegally, that's not okay. it's not okay to violate the laws of this country. we have millions of people standing in line, taking the test, doing their background investigations, paying the fees that want to come in the right way. >> martha: let's talk about the arrests so far. numbers released the first day were over 500, and there were reports that one was a suspected terrorist. others were gang members. were all of the people who were arrested on day one as far as
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you know, convicted criminals or those who had been arrested before? >> no. let me explain that. there were collateral arrests. where do those happen? sanctuary cities. what does that mean? they lock us instead of i.c.e. being able to arrest those people, where the officer is safe, the alien is safe, and public is safe, they're leased back into the community which endangers the community, but when we find them, he'll be with others most likely. many times you're with others. if they're in the country imle illegally, they're coming too. >> martha: were all these in sanctuary cities? it doesn't appear so. >> many of them were. >> martha: so the arrests in massachusetts, in chelsea, massachusetts which the governor said it's great to arrest the criminals who have been convicted, but were there people taken there as well who were not
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convicted? >> i'm sure there were. >> martha: were they as you say, collateral? >> i'm sure there are. >> martha: you talk about those numbersexpanding. 500 the first day. what do you think you can get up to? >> as many as we can get. >> martha: what can happen at this point given your manpower? >> look. i think we're in the beginning stages. we're bringing more resources into this operation. as a whole government, we'll have doj assisting us, and elect the d.o.d. piece helping build infrastructure, helping the transportation. that takes i.c.e., badges and guns out of those and puts them on the street. >> martha: i want to go back to who you're deporting aside from the long list of executive actions. the administration said it will no longer tell i.c.e. agents they have to avoid sensitive locations including schools, hospitals, b benjamin huffman said, criminals will no longer be able to hide in america's schools to evade
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arrest. what criminals are hiding in schools? middle schools, man-to-? >> how many are aged 14 to 17? many of them. look. it's a national security threat, public safety threat, and it's a case by case. name another agency, another law enforcement agency that has those type of requirements that they can't walk into a school or a doctor's office or a medical campus. no other agency is held to those standards. when it's that, it's a superrisery review. it's not like an open issue, but i.c.e. officers should have discretion to decide if a national security threat or a public safety threat is in one of these facilities, it should be an option to make the arrest. >> martha: but someday you could into into those schools and grab people who are just in the country illegally. >> on a case by case basis, depending who they are, what the circumstances are. it's never -- it's never a zero game. >> martha: you know that this
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creates fear in the immigration -- in the immigrant community. the chair of the u.s. conference of bishop's committee said turning places of care, healing, and solace into places of fear, and sun certainty for those in need while endangering the trust between pastors, providers, educators and the people they serve will not make the community safer. >> here's what i think. if congress has a job to do, we're enforcing the laws congress enacted and the president signed. if they don't like it, clang the l -- change the law. i find it hard to believe that any member of congress is telling us not to law. >> martha: but opening it up to anyone who's in the country illegally, and grabbing them, kids, adults? >> there's consequences. >> martha: estimates are that there are 11 million undocumented immigrants in this country right now. how can you possibly afford to deport all of these people? >> i'll leave it up to congress.
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the president has a mandate. this is the number one issue that people voted on. i think congress has a mandate to give us money that we need. what price to you put on national security? >> martha: more detention centers? >> what price do you put on these young ladies that have been raped and murdered and burned alive? what price do you put on national security? like i just explained, when you have a source and you don't secure that border, that's when sex trafficking goes up. that's when, you know, the fentanyl comes in and kills a quarter of a million americans and i don't put a price on that. >> martha: many those detention centers, do you need more beds? >> absolutely. >> martha: there's 100,000. where do you get those beds? do you build more camps? do you do those military installations in texas and elsewhere? >> a little bit of everything. eexpand our contracts to outside contractors, so yeah. we're going to need more i.c.e. beds. a minimum of 100,000. congress needs to come to the table quick and give us the money we need to secure that border. >> martha: let's talk about
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flights again with the host countries. you flew all of those people back. were all the people arrested on the first day for instance, repatriated, and what about those countries that won't take them back? >> oh, they'll take them back. >> martha: what do you mean by that? >> we got president trump come into power. mexico has the remain in mexico program. they did it. they didn't want to put military in the southern border. they did it. >> martha: how do you convince them? >> el salvador didn't want to take their ms-13 members back. it took president trump 18 hours to make that happen. >> martha: all appointments through the cbp app have been canceled. that is a legal way to claim asylum and get in the country. so what should people do who are seeking asylum? how do you do it? >> go to the embassy, go to the port of entry. do it the legal way. you shouldn't come to this country and ask to get asylum, and you break our laws. >> martha: tell me what the definition of success is over
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the next six months, the next year, by the end of the administration. what is mission accomplished here? >> take as many public safety threats off the street as possible. watching illegal alien crimes in this country decrease. deporting every illegal alien gang member. making our country safer, when we see the crime rate from illegal ail liens go down, thata success. every national security threat that we find removed from countries, success. there is no number on it. so my success can be based on what congress gives us. more money, the better success. >> martha: you didn't put in that list of things that will be mission accomplished and success, getting every immigrant who is in the country illegally out. why not? >> because i'm being realistic. we can do what we can with the money we have. we're going to try to be efficient, but with the more money we have -- if i don't have the money to remove that many
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people, i'm not going to sit here and -- one thing -- no one can say i haven't been frank in everything i've said. our success every day is taking the public safety threat off the streets and get the national security threat out of here. >> martha: and our thanks to tom homan. i'm now joined by michigan's new democratic senator, elissa slotkin, a former pentagon official and cia analyst who now sits on the armed services and homeland security committees. welcome, senator. it's good to see you this morning. so let's get right to it. you heard tom homan there saying that while criminals on the priority, national security threats, public safety threats, that he is warning everyone in this country illegally, and they asked hthem to leave. what effect to those warnings have? >> well, look. clearly they're trying to deter people from coming and they're d trying to send notice to people here, you know, that this could be happening to them. i think they campaigned on this, and one of the things that, to me, has been a real hallmark,
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when i listen to some of these immigration announcements lately is it's still in their campaign, right? now you have to govern. now you're in the seat. you have to actually make this work with the money you have available, so i think that's more of a signal to try and keep people from coming to the border, trying to get in, and it's part of this transition that they're not quite into yet between campaigning and governing. >> martha: what about the schools and churches? you heard him there say you can go and do a middle school, you can go into an elementary school. i mean, he said that's, you know, case by case basis, but your reaction to that? >> yeah. i mean, i just don't understand, you know, if the focus and the priority is on criminals, i'm not sure going after an 11-year-old is where you start, and this is, again, the inconsistency between what they're saying and then what we saw happen in this past week, right? going after places that were not sanctuary cities kind of in this -- what felt sort of
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arbitrary way, so i think to me, you know, the idea of going into children and terrorizing children, i just don't believe in supporting that kind of action, and i don't believe that most americans think that 11 and 12-year-olds are the ones who are the hardened criminals that need to go back to their countries. >> martha: he said that would be a case by case basis, but let's talk about the military. 1,500 on the way or already there. there's probably more to come. those troops will be armed this time. first of all, your reaction to those military flights, and the influx of troops going to the border, and the idea that they are armed? >> yeah. i mean, look. i think we have had multiple administrations who have sent uniformed troops, active-duty troops to the southern border in support roles, right? according to our constitution, you can go in supporting roles, logistics, driving, setting up facilities, setting up, you know, border locations,
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whatever. it's very different when you cross the line into law enforcement. our military are not trained as law enforcement officers. they'll be the first one to tell you that. that's not why they got into service, and it's also in violation of our constitution. so i think it's very important that we keep that line. we knew that the administration was going to use military aircraft to start sending people home. they were going to put that on tv. we knew that, but you're coming right up to that line of logistics and support and law enforcement. if there is people as they say that are criminals on those planes, who is the one enforcing order on those planes? you just -- you come really close to it. so it was something i raised with mr. hegseth in his confirmation hearing. i just want to know, you know, not that you're pledging an to donald trump, but you're not going to use the uniformed military in ways that violates the constitution and makes american citizens scared of their own military. that was, you know, we were scared of the british when they occupied us. we don't want to repeat that. i'm watching that very, very
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closely. >> martha: and you brought up pete hegseth who was narrowly confirmed with jd vance breaking the tie there. what are your concerns? you voted against him and had some pretty tough questions for him about his -- his job going forward. what are your concerns? >> i mean, as i stated, i mean, i have been very consistent with all the people that i have been talking to in these hearings, right? whether it's the secretary, the agriculture candidate, or secretary of defense. confirm for me you'll be raising your right hand and pledging an earth oath to the constitution, not donald trump, and that if donald trump asks you to do something that contravenes the constitution, you would pushback. it's not theoretical. mark esper said that trump asked him to send in the 82nd airborne to put down peaceful protests in washington, d.c. he convinced him against it. i want to know that this secretary isn't a watered down
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version of the previous secretaries and is going to actually push pack back. he couldn't unambiguously say he will push back with the president asks him to do something that is unconstitutional. that is why i couldn't confirm him. there are a lot of other things in his background i don't like, but i look at the strategic and irreversible threats to our democracy, and that's using the uniformed military in ways that violate the constitution. >> martha: you have the confirmation hearing this week of tulsi gabbard for director of national intelligence. you spent a good part of your career in intelligence. what do you want to ask her? >> well, i'm not technically in those hearings, but we will be voting on her. look. i mean, the people have been asking me and other senators have been asking me. you want someone of character and of competence, right? and i served with tulsi gabbard. we were on the armed services committee together. she didn't spend a lot of time showing up to hearings, so i didn't get to, like, see her in action all that much, but from
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what i understand from people who have been meeting with her, and she hasn't asked to meet with me, is she doesn't show the competence, the understanding, the democrpth. she wasn't prepared prepared for her meetings, and cozying up to vladimir putin, flying and cozying up with assad in syria. having someone in charge of our intelligence organization, that shows preference for our adversaries is right off the bat, a deep question. my colleagues who now have the control of the senate, and the house, that they think about their commitment to the country, not to any one party. i do not believe she's qualified for this role. >> martha: thank you very much for joining us. much appreciated. up next, just a week into the job, president trump issues a slew of executive orders. will some have a short shelf life? our legal experts give their verdict when we come back.
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the only topical with 4 powerful pain fighting ingredients that start working on contact and lasts up to 8 hours. since i became the 47th president at noon on monday, i have been moving with urgency to fix every single calamity of the biden administration that they've created. every single day of my term, we're living by the motto, promises made, promises kept. i kept my promises. >> martha: president trump speaking to supporters in las vegas saturday, touting action on promises he made as a candidate. he's also issued executive orders at a furious pace on a host of issues, but will it all hold up in court? let's ask our legal experts, former new jersey governor and u.s. attorney, chris christie, and preet bharara, former u.s. attorney for the southern district of new york. welcome to the show, gentlemen. good to see you here, chris. let's start with you. president trump issued the slew
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of unilateral executive actions. what is the legality what can he do, what can't he do? >> look, martha, it varies from subject to subject, and so there's some where it's very clear that he can do certain things, and particularly in the area of immigration and directing troops. that's certainly -- >> martha: he can't create new power. >> no, seche certainly cannot create new power, although he'll try, and i think you'll see that. look. donald trump, more than anything else, would like to have a presidency where his say goes no matter what. now the constitution is a bit of an impediment to that, and what he'll do through these executive orders throw as much up against the wall as he possibly can, and if he knocks against the courts, he can blame those courts for it not being kept, and if it goes through, he can say, look how strong a leader i am. we've seen a lot of court actions already, and we will see more of them. i think some of these executive
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orders will be struck down. one of them has already gone a temporary restraining order against it. >> martha: the birthright. >> yes. the birthright citizenship which seems to be to be a very clear constitutional issue that he's on the wrong side of. >> martha: and preet as you look at these, 51 so far. what's precedent here in terms of numbers, and as chris said, he's just kind of flooding the zone here. is that the point? >> you know, i guess that's the point. as chris sort of alluded to, this is a win-win for trump and his administration because either the policies are enacted and upheld and he gets his policy or they're not and he gets to blame other people, and he still gets to rely on the message, the political message to his base that he wants to put forward. on birthright citizenship where i hole wwholly agree with chris virtually every other legal expert and lawyer who spent a year or two in law school would agree, that's not going to fly. he sends a message to his base. >> martha: the judge specifically said, is there any
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lawyer who could claim this order was constitutional? i take it you don't think so. >> no, i mean, he said -- it's maybe the most, you know, lacking in basis in the constitution argument that he's seen in 40 years on the bench, and he's no left-wing liberal, but donald trump gets to make his point. some of these executive orders are kind of superfluous, have no point at all. there's one about free speech and censorship which as i read it is just an elongation of the first amendment. some of these things are pure message. some of these things are, you know, hopeful, aspirational policy. it's also interesting to me that you have an administration that constantly talks about wanting to live up to the letter of the law and the letter of the constitution, and promotes such a blatantly unconstitutional executive order. so i think a lot of these things are not going to fly, but it's going to take a while, and meanwhile, donald trump and his -- and his allies and his
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supporters have the arguments that they want to make and bludgeon the other side with. >> martha: and chris, i want to specifically talk about trump firing the 17 inspectors general. should have told congress about this 30 days in advance. what happens with this one? >> well, first off if you are donald trump, and you've got a three-vote majority in the united states senate and lisa murkowski and mitch mcconnell and susan collins have already shown themselves to be willing to say no to him, you don't want to tick off chuck grassley, and if you look at senator grassley's comments, the chairman of the judiciary committee, he's not happy about the fact that they didn't get notice and he's going to want to know what the extraordinary circumstances were for the firing of these inspectors general. so what i would say to you, martha, is from a legal perspective, he's not right. he needs to give this notice. on the other hand, he doesn't care. i mean, if he wants to get in a fight with chuck grassley over this, he's going to.
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to him, the, it's about letting all these people get in charge. you've seen the transfers he's made in the department of justice. you can see some of the other firings he's made. you can see even from the wholly irresponsible, selfish, vindictive action of pulling mike pompeo's security detail. this is a guy who helped to execute the assassination of soleimani in iran at donald trump's order. >> martha: and dr. fauci -- >> yeah. these folks all put themselves at risk. fauci aside, the lthree on the policy area i'm most concerned about, and there's an active death threat against all three of them because of what then-president trump orpded der them to do. he said, remember, i am your retribution during the campaign. that is how he's executing it innin part. >> martha: and preet, i want to
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ask you specifically about the pardons of the january 6th rioters and joe biden had some pardons there at the end as well. >> yeah. look. there are people who have been president of the united states who have engaged in pardons that are not necessarily appropriate or wise, or are popular. bill clinton did it. in my opinion, joe biden did it at the end of his presidency just a few days ago, but then donald trump as in so many areas says, i see your pardons. hold my beer, and he goes far, far beyond. you know, again, as i said about the issue of aspiring to be a constitutionalist as the trump people say that they are, and belying that by the kinds of things they propose, they pretend to be law and order supporters, and you have -- and i'm not going to repeat what so many other people have said this past week, doszens and dozens ad dozens of officers treated violently at the hands of these people who were being pardoned
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and it doesn't matter to donald trump. further to what chris said a second ago, these executive orders and these actions are not just, you know, policy proposals. they're not just messages. they're also tests. you can put a lot of blame on some of these policies and proposals and you talk about flooding the zone on the part of donald trump, but they're talking about putting mechanisms if place to stop these things, and the question is will they? will they stand up to him? >> martha: chris, i got about ten seconds for you. i just want your reaction to the pardons. >> look. i think the pardons by joe biden were disgraceful, and i think donald trump has taken it to another level as well. these are the two most selfish politicians in the presidency in my lifetime. joe biden pardoned his family proves it, and donald trump t trying to whitewash january 6th proves. >> martha: that was quite a ten seconds. thanks to both of you this morning. coming up, with elon musk working side by side with president trump, we spoke with the man who literally wrote the book on the world ast richest man. my conversation with elon musk
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this is what victory feels like. yeah! and this was no ordinary victory. this was a fork in the road of human civilization. one of the most american values that i love is optimism, and this feeling, like, we're going to -- we're going to make the future good. we're going to make it good. >> martha: that was elon musk speaking at donald trump's inaugural rally here in washington on monday. musk, the richest person on this planet who has dreams of taking humankind to mars has been tasked by president trump to make government more efficient. the man who's known for launching rockets and electrifying cars is an enigma to many, but few know him better than walter isaacson who wrote the number one best-selling biography, "elon musk," pulling back the curtain on trump's favorite tech titan. you spent two years with him? >> two years by his side, yeah.
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>> martha: following him around everywhere? >> and watching his mood swings, and watching him do amazing things, but also watching him really become intense. >> martha: and describe that a little more, really becoming intense. >> you know, he has a mode that's engineering mode where he can do things, like, figure out how to do a rocket, landing upright and catch it with the arms and he has a very giddy mode and a silly mode, and he has what one of his friends calls demon mode which is when he gets really dark and he's really intense about something, there's no distracting him, and he can leave a lot of rubble in his wake. >> martha: you start the book by saying, as a kid growing up in south africa, elon musk knew pain and learned how to survive it. >> psychological pain, he learned as a child, physical pain. he was beaten up. he was bullied. he's on the autism spectrum to he had no friends, and he would sit in the corner of the bookstore reading x-man comics and science fiction, and imagine himself as a superhero avatar in his own video game.
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>> martha: this week especially it's been pretty extraordinary. there he was by donald trump's side, basically in the cabinet. he now has an office on the white house grounds. what is that about? >> you know, elon musk really wants to blow up and disrupt the bureaucracy and all the things he feels is choking american growth, and it's something that trump i think, loves billionaires, and loves people who are kind of on the edge and crazy, and so they're suited to each other. they're kind of bonded on this project. >> martha: you have made the point, however, that the federal government is not something elon musk owns, and i'm harkening back to a statement that robert gates, the former defense secretary, spent a lot of time in the federal government. he said it's like a dinosaur, heavy feet, small brain, little hands. it's a new challenge for elon musk. >> this is the biggest
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challenge, and musk doesn't own the federal government the way he owns tesla or pretty much controls tesla and spacex, and so he's going to have to keep trump's backing if he's really going to blow up regulations and the bureaucracy. i think musk is going to go hell-bent to get things done. >> martha: and doge as it's called, the department of government efficiency, rahm ramaswamy's already out, and even bannon wasn't the tech billionaires. >> elon musk doesn't really have good partnerships in working well with others. he tends to want to be in charge. the big fight was with bannon, sort of the populist type of republican conservativism, versus in some ways, the tech utopian, tech bro populism of an elon musk and bannon said, i'm going to make sure that by inauguration day, musk is no longer around, but you saw the scene.
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there's musk sitting the commerce secretary and ban bannon's not to be found. >> martha: on tuesday t day after the inaugural, president trump announced a $5 billi investment into stargate a.i. you had sam altman there, and a few other tech heavyweights, but not elon musk, and then later, elon musk was saying, those guys don't have the money. >> musk can develop intense rivalries, and the two chapters in the book of this sort of intensity against sam altman because they started openai together. this whole idea of artificial intelligence, they were going to create this idea of nonprofit, and sam altman decided to make it a closed system and for-profit, and musk just never forgave him. you're seeing this battle happen just this week. >> martha: so it wasn't against trump in any way. it was just all about altman. and, in fact, trump said -- >> elon, one of the people he
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happens to hate, but i have certain hatreds of people too. >> martha: like they're bonding over hatred. >> you know, they are in some ways. they both have resentments, and that's exactly what trump said. obviously you can see throughout i'll see them again. they'll talk, but there's a resentment. donald trump is the same. he has deep resentments against people, but sometimes he's sitting there joking with them. whether it's adam schiff or barack obama. >> martha: did anything surprise you about musk and trump so far? >> no. you know, if you read throughout history of him being in weird ways, attracted to the power of trump, the larger-than-life quality of trump, musk answer whole life has been leading up to having some role like this, and i think it's going to leave a lot of rubble in its wake just like his rockets do, but i think it's going to get a lot done. >> martha: if that relationship
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falls apart, if after one year or maybe before, do you think it would be muck that ended it or donald trump? >> oh, i think it lasts for a year, and i think that's all. i think it's really destined to last for maybe 18 months because musk doesn't want to stay in, and yes. there will be divisions because trump doesn't like to share the limelight, and musk has never worked for anybody before, and it's a relationship where they both have their interests being served, but you've never really had somebody this rich, this powerful, and this intense be a partner of a president of the united states, and to have his own mission and be willing at times, it seems to defy a bit what the president wants. >> martha: our thanks to walter isaacson and that terrific book. coming up, republicans have complete control of congress, but does president trump care? the round table on why executive action is taking center stage in washington these days, when we come back. woman: we've waited so long for this spa day.
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don't leave! it's fine! ugh! i was worried about this side of town! mucinex in, mucus out! don't mask symptoms, treat the cause. >> martha: our many of president trump's cabinet nominees in danger of in the making it through? find out when we come back with the round table. always had trouble with your weight? same. discover the power of wegovy®. with wegovy®, i lost 35 pounds. and some lost over 46 pounds. and i'm keeping the weight off. i'm reducing my risk. wegovy® is the only weight-management medicine proven to reduce risk of major cardiovascular events such as death, heart attack, or stroke in adults with known heart disease and obesity. don't use wegovy® with semaglutide or glp-1 medicines, or in children under 12. don't take if you or your family had mtc, men 2, or if allergic to it. tell your provider if you plan to have surgery or a procedure,
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shingrix is a vaccine used to prevent shingles in adults 50 years and older. shingrix doesn't protect everyone and isn't for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients or to a previous dose. tell your healthcare provider if you're pregnant or breastfeeding. increased risk of guillain-barré syndrome was observed after getting shingrix. fainting can happen so take precautions. most common side effects are pain, redness, and swelling where injected, muscle pain, tiredness, headache, shivering, fever, and upset stomach. ask your doctor about shingrix today. >> martha: we are back with the round table, john harris is politico's global editor in chief. david sanger is the correspondent, and rachael bade is a contributing correspondent and capitol politico bureau chief here. a lot of politico here today, and we need that today. i want to start with you on that note. it was hard to miss your headline inu your column to say
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time to admit it. trump is a great president. he's still trying to be a good one. explain. >> sure, and that headline was maybe a little bit of a hand grenade to get people's attention, be yut the argument was making is president trump is great in the sense of being a large and consequential figure who is putting his imprint on every aspect of american politics, even american culture. that's distinct from saying he's a good president whose policies are in the public interest and will make the country better. that's of course, the source of a terrific argument and i don't weigh in on that. >> martha: you said he is everything his supporters hoped for and everything his adversaries fear sgld absed. >> absolutely, and i think the point is obviously this week that president trump is not a fluke, as a lot of democrats thought after 2016 and thought throughout his first term, and i think now you have to see he has legitimacy. he didn't steal the 2024 election men won it not by a huge margin, but a pervasive
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margin geographically and among these groups. if somebody is a movement president, that means democrats have to reckon it with them. they can't just push him to the margins because it's singularly awful. he has the support of a huge swath of the american public, and he's using that very purposefully to achieve some big things. that's what we saw. it's not just a cult of personality. it's tied to very disruptive ideas and programs that are dividing the country in historic ways. >> martha: and boy, rachael, you're seeing that on the hill in your column this week. you basically said, he's steam rolling republicans. >> i mean, absolutely there's a lot of unity and excitement amongst republicans with their takeover of washington, but he's sticking his finger in republicans' eye on a lot of issues right now. in particular, i mean the january 6th pardon of rioters who went after police officers, the tiktok ban, stopping that when republicans think that's the national security threat. this move just yesterday, or over the weekend that he's going
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to fire all these inspector generals without notifying congress as he was supposed to do under the law, but this is an intentional strategy on the part of trump's ner circle. i have talked to people close with donald trump who said the sooner republicans on the hill, you know, get nit thit in their that he's the one with the mandate, not them, the better their lives are going to be. how much are they going to sort of take on this? i mean, republicans are not protesting. they're just sort of falling in line. you hear a little bit of criticism, but it's very gentle, and i think that's very telling about how the next four years are going to be. >> martha: and david, one of the things he has been doing is taking aim at biden's policy and cutting staff, especially the national security counscil. >> what he's done with the national security council in some ways, hasek k echoes in wh you heard of immigration with mr. homan. he has told the national security staff, these are career staffers who work, whether as a democrat or a republican, they usually come from the state
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department or the cia, or the energy department. they said, you all go home. don't call us. we'll call you after we review whether or not we think you are loyal enough to the president. so there's a built-in assumption here that they are the deep state and will get in the way of his initiatives, and you see this to some degreen the way secretary of state rubio just announced a blanket halt on all international assistance, right? so they're not going case by case. they're going to make a point and in the international assistance case to the horror of many of those career staff, they are stopping the flights in of afghans who helped the united states during the war, of ukrainians who have gotten visas, legal visas to the united states. so there's a sense in the city that right now they are going blanket, not case by case. >> martha: and john, he's also
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really getting what he wants, including pete hegseth, just barely. you covered the pentagon decades ago. you watched those hearings. pete hegseth says he's going to bring back this warrior ethos, but when we talk about loyalty tests, the pentagon, the military is supposed to be the most apolitical in the nation. so what -- what effect can he have on the pentagon? >> i mean, i think the pentagon is made up of professional soldiers and professional civiler is civil servants who are going to do their best to implement the polls from the commander in chief. i think this is a very, very, sorry high-risk appointment, most of all for donald trump. this is a hard job and we've seen time and again, we saw it in the biden administration with the afghan pullout. we saw it under president bush, the second we saw it in the clinton years. things can go wrong in national security in an instant, in 24 hours. you can have major setbacks that
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can shadow a presidency and at times, even cripple it. >> martha: we've seen that over many years. >> for somebody without deep experience in the policy issues in a critical job, and to me it's one of the big, big dramas of this administration. how is that -- how is that big bet going to work out? >> martha: and everybody will be watching them, but was it a surprise to you that everybody -- or nearly all the republican senators supported hegseth, and what about tulsi gabbard next week? >> i kind of feel like his confirmation was sort of locked in once you saw joni ernst support him. if you can have a woman who served in combat, who is a sexual assault survivor herself. >> martha: who had questions in the beginning. >> a lot of questions and said she was krconcerned he couldn't get there, and she got in line pretty kwukly. after that, it was a question of how many republicans would actually vote for him. i think when we talk about, you know, these nominations, it's important to keep in mind, you know, this frustration that a
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lot of republicans are feeling privately. what i just talked about, because donald trump, he's burning capital with a lot of these members, and the question is, how much capital does he have? tulsi gabbard is something to watch. she's going to have this confirmation hearing. we'll hear from senate republicans privately that they don't like her. they feel like she's a democrat, she's on the other team and flip-flopped on national security and public policy positions way too much. if they want to make a point and send a signal to donald trump that he needs to actually respect them, she could potentially go down, but i'm going to believe it when i see it because a lot of these guys, they don't want to be crosswise with the big guy. >> martha: that was clear this week, and you brought up marco rubio, david. what else have you seen that he's doing? i mean, he seems like the most conventional pick from donald trump, and yet what does he do about panama? >> so he is the most conventional pick, and i don't think there was anybody who thought even among the democrats, he is qualified for this job. the fundamental question that
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came up about hegseth was, is this somebody who can think deeply about china and re-orienting the force and move the whole thing? you don't have those questions about rubio. we know who you are getting there. rubio is now in two odd positions with president trump. the first is if you listen to his hearings, he was much more hawkish on china and the long-term threat than you have heard from president trump who's fundamentally a dealmaker and, you know, in the tiktok discussion, he isn't discussing the threat anymore. he's just talking about what kind of deal he can put together. the second interesting thing for rubio is that as he makes his way around the world here, he's now got to explain why it is that russia -- just announcing that it was going take all of ukraine is a huge violation of sovereignty, but a president who told me back in early january at
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mar-a-lago he wouldn't take military force off the table for going after panama or going after greenland. >> martha: and john, i just want to end with you and we have ten seconds. what do you think when you see him on the world stage there, marco rubio? >> look. he's -- it's one of the most interesting fault lines. he has a different world view than jd vance. we look to who's the next generation of the republican party? that's an interesting debate. >> martha: very good keeping it. thanks, all of. great to see you. we'll be right back. dave's been very excited about saving big
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