captioning sponsored by cbs >> dickerson: today on "face the nation." candidate enter the final stretch of campaign 2016 and east coast prepares for another possible round of hurricane hermine. saturday, donald trump went to church looking for minority votes and maybe some divine intervention to help his campaign against hillary clinton. >> i am he your message and i hope my presence here will also help your voice to reach new audiences. >> dickerson: after surprise trip to mexico and speech on immigration further muddled his message, outreach strategy work income we'll find out battleground tracker poll numbers plus analysis of where the race stands. we'll talk with new jersey governor chris christie who heads donald trump's president

senator jeff flake see if he's any closer to supporting the republican president shall nominee. is hillary clinton closes books on a big month of august fundraising we'll talk about the fall out for new revelation that of her fbi interviews of the private e-mail server while secretary of state. plus former attorney general alberto gonzales talks about his new book on the george w. bush years and weighs in on campaign 2016. all ahead on this labor day we good morning welcome to face the make i'm john dickerson. we've got a lot to get to today but we begin with hermine the storm that's caused heavy rain, high winds, power outages, dangerous surf and two fatalities as it moved across florida now up the eastern seaboard. eric fisher is chief meteorologist at our cbs affiliate wbz in boston. >> good morning, john. tricky storm we've been tracking

east that's what we saw overnight tonight, many along the coastline will see conditions over time as we head overnight. tropical storm warnings are up from the mid atlantic, tropical storm watches in southeastern newt gingrich. staying farther to the east with that means lot less rainfall, really no rain ex stept getting showers, heaviest rain stays off shore. at the same time very strong st going to move very slowly. we head through sunday into monday and tuesday strong winds churning up the surf. impacts are coastal flooding lot of beach erosion up to newt gingrich, rain totals some seeing the sun but beaches really taking a beating. john. >> eric fisher thanks so much. turning now to the other big story this weekend campaign 2016. cbs news battleground tracker today looks at north carolina,

46-42%. in pennsylvania state donald trump promises he'll win, clinton enjoys a comfortable lead with 45% to 37% for trump. we've added arizona and georgia to our original 11 battleground states, now, if we look at the race in the 13 most potentially competitive states, hillary clinton is up by two points over donald trump. 42-40%. remaining voters are either undecided or support can a third joining us now from his home in new jersey is governor chris christie, governor before we get back to politics quickly on hurricane hermine you declared a state of emergency, what is the situation as you see it now? >> well, we got some good news overnight that the storm is tracking further east which will mean less water. we still expect, southern most counties where we did declare

moderate flooding starting later today into tomorrow. because of slow moving nature of the storm so far unless it turns back west which these storms always can do. unless that happens i think that we'll look at moderate flooding rather than very severe impact. >> dickerson: let's switch now to politics. you helped set up the meeting this week between donald trump and mexican president what was the point that have meeting? >> listen, i think what donald trump wants to show everyone is americans. he'll be someone who is going to reach out, even though disagreements to reach out open dialogue, the words he used at the end of that meeting were very important. that he enjoyed the meeting, that he likes the president, that he thinks they can work together to help improve the economies of mexico and the united states. all those things are very important i think those are states that they also stand for which are that they're going to fight for the people of their country.

anything less from a president trump or president of mexico, but the meeting was to make sure that everybody understands that this is going to be a president who will work with our allies, to make sure that lives of citizens in both countries improve over the next four years. >> dickerson: after the meeting donald trump then gave a speech in arizona which he said, they don't know it but they're going to pay for the wall, he was talking about mexico. after setting up a meeting to show this part of his character and building a relationshi mexicoy say something like that to show that he's dominating the mexicans or would as president? how does that work? isn't that a mixed message? >> , no john, i think he's being candid. that's one of the reasons that they disagree upon. they're going to have to be topic of further discussion going forward. but i think what donald is doing being very candid with the american people about this is one of the areas where they disagree. this is the kind of transparency you get from donald trump as opposed to what you get from

months. hides, doesn't answer questions except for high dollar doane others. donald trump is going to tell you what he thinks, sometimes you agree, some times you don't. never have to wonder. hillary clinton she's a mystery woman of 2016. all we know is that she told us she had one device that's why she's the private e-mail server, john, now we find out this week from the fbi, 13 different mobile devices and five different ipads, all of which are now gone. >> the w really going to happen that mexico is going to pay for it? >> listen, i think that donald trump is negotiated some extraordinary deals over the course of time. in his career. this will be another challenging deal for him to negotiate. but absolutely believe that is the way he sees it, will be part of overall negotiation to improve the economies in both countries to make sure that the lives of people in both countries are protected from drug running and gun running and

listen, people have lost a lot of money so far in the last 16 months betting against donald trump. >> dickerson: because the law is such an important part of his canned da see you said, this makes no sense referring to the wall, i don't think if we present him with a bill he's going to pay for it. were you wrong then? >> i disagreed with donald trump at the time. big shock, i was running against him, john. so disagreed with her during the primary as well. we can be fair. of course i disagreed because i was running against him. >> dickerson: do you think -- but john, a lot of people -- john, a lot of people, myself included, have lost betting against donald trump. and i think he's going to be a very good negotiator for the american people. not only on this issue but on trade deals that will help improve our economy to make the world safer and more secure. >> dickerson: the question of the 11 million undocumented

donald trump at one point said they would be leaving america so fast it would make your head spin. now saying something that will be worked out. in the way we see immigration talked about that kind of softening to use his words, usually is prelude to not ultimately dealing with all 11 million. that's what it feels like here. why is that not the case? why is this not basically moving away from his position he had in the primary? >> listen, we want -- candidates, any leaders to, listen and if they hear new information or different information that leads them to conclude different positions, we want people to do that. be really clear, donald trump is going to get rid very early on two to three million criminals that are here illegally in this country. that will be priority number o one. once remove those two to three million from the country, return them to country of origin because of their criminal

at where we are in the country find out if you find humane way to deal with those that remain. what he's talking about is a pause. after the two to three million get put out of the country, because they're committing crimes, hurting americans, selling drugs, doing things that are illegal. once those people are dealt with first, everyone agrees on that issue then deal with the remaybing eight million people. that's what donald trump wants to d. i think that is humane way to deal with it. i'm proud of the fact he's willing to stand up anday he really believes on this as he's learned more about the topic. >> dickerson: your point an evolution to a pause that shows his ability to adapt to, changing information. >> absolutely. that's something that hillary clinton will tell you donald trump can't do. what i'll tell you about hillary clinton, john, is that she doesn't evolve, because she doesn't talk to anybody except for mega rich donors in the hamptons all over america,

places where she answers questions. >> dickerson: i hear line much attack that might be used in part of the debate, you also went up against him how much does he really need to prepare for debates? >> everybody needs to prepare, john. needs to get ready, donald is taking that process very seriously. but in the end there's nothing you can do in preparation that can hide the essence of who you are. the essence of who donald trump is, he is outspoken, smart, successful businessman who is going to be a strong leader for our country. he essence of hillary clinton, she's a political insider who over and over again not told the truth to the american people different rules that apply to her than everybody else. you are not going to be able to hide that no matter how many coaches she hires not going to change the essence of who she has been and who she is that is what you are going to see in the debate. >> dickerson: a report in

paying fine to the i.r.s. for $25,000 donation had given to a political committee supporting florida attorney general pam bonding in 2013. she was looking into maybe investigating trump university ultimately didn't. donald trump said he knew better than anybody how to use the system, how to to use political donations to get the system to work for him. is that an instance of that in that situation, gave the money then investigation didn't happen? >> i can't believe, johha anyone would insult pam that way. she's an outstanding attorney general. who has been re-elected by the people of florida, she's somebody who has been an outstanding law enforcement officer and continues to be. i can't imagine that pam would ever make decisions on that basis. with you but what i will tell you know to bill clinton has taken over $16 million of taxpayer money to help to fund the clinton foundation. foundation that auto sen systemly was the person and group that was screaming who

state. if you wrote your multi-million dollar check to the clinton foundation you got a visit with the secretary of state. no doubt about what was going on there, john. same way no doubt with hillary clinton said she -- had private e-mail server for one device to use one device now know from the fbi she had 13 devices, one of which was the story with a hammer -- detried with a hammer. why were they hammering her cell phone, john? let's talk about the real issues of trust in this race, real issues of trust in this race, i prosecutor i'm stunned given what i saw in the fbi files that were released friday that hillary clinton was not prosecuted -- >> dickerson: governor christie we've run out of time. thanks for being with us. joining us from phoenix is republican senator jeff flake. senator, donald trump this week visited mexico, met with the president then and gave very fiery speech in your state of arizona at the end of the week what do you think the net result

action, i think all of us had some hope after that that he might be changing the tone and tenor of his campaign. but then when the speech was delivered in arizona later that day, he seemed to be right back where he has been. >> dickerson: what's your understanding of how he's going to handle the estimated 11 million undocumented immigrants in america? >> that's not clear at all. some people, said it was heartening, some said softening i say there really isn't any clear indication of whether or not, for example, kids who are brought across the border when they were two years old, so-called dreamers, whether they would be forced to go back to mexico and if they would be visa slots for them to return to the united states if they so choose later on. it really is unclear right now. >> dickerson: you have been part of the immigration discussion in washington, spent a lot much

with that experience and listening to the speeches donald trump gave in arizona how do you think his immigration plan can h he plans to kickoff the minute he gets in office how would that be received in washington? what would those early days and months of his administration be like? >> well, any serious immigration reform has to include four elements. obviously border security, donald trump has talked quite a bit about that, although just really what element, building a wall, making mexico pay for it is not v and of itself. then talk about interior enfo enforcement. having an e-verify style system to allow employers to know who they're hiring. then you have robust, temporary worker program, both for skilled and unskilled labor. he's talked very little about that. and then the mechanism to deal with those who are here illegally now and that has been just kind of muddied at best.

the tone and tenor of his campaign we'ved that 134 conversation you and i before, since then, donald trump has made a bit of pivot he said he regretted some things. he's tried to change his position on undocumented workers, also kind of layered over his view about not allowing new muslim integration, any of those moves done anything to change your thinking about him as a president? >> i'd like to see him stick with some of those positions for awhile. the ban on muslims, he does seem to have walked back, more about regions or visa -- vetting the process that seems to be bert i'm glad to see that. with regard to immigration, he pivots then pivots right back so it's kind of 360 degree pivot if at times. i'd like to see a firm position that he sticks with for awhile. and obviously i'd like to see it have more realistic position in dealing with those who are here illegally now.

version that have before given how long you've held this position aren't you at a point november return in terms of ever supporting him? >> well, it becomes increasingly difficult to see that he's going to change. i don't expect that i'll be able to support him in november. i'd like to, but he's a republican nominee i just don't see how i can. >> dickerson: and other republican senators running including john mccain in your state to distance themself from donald trump, john mccain appears to be doing he'll be check against hillary clinton is he taking your advice? >> i wouldn't suggest he take my advice but he's doing what i think republicans need to do. if we want the future of our party to be what it needs to be, we can't associate with this kind of message and certainly with this kind of tone and rhetoric that's being used long term i think that drives away young voters. certainly drives away a lot of people in the minority community

ahead. i think john mccain and others are doing exactly what they need to do. >> dickerson: hillary clinton has been saying that donald trump is not a part of the republican party, she's been saying republicans who are not like him, does actually help republicans who are trying to win in the same year he's running as president? >> probably does. for anybody to say that. for people to be reminded that this is not what the party stands for, i think is a good thing. i wish more republicans would say that as well, but if hillary clinton wants to say it i'm glad people reminded. >> dickerson: finally quickly, hillary clinton spending money in arizona, thinks competitive in the general election is that just trickry or is arizona really up for grabs in the president shall contest? >> it shouldn't be up for grabs, mitt romney won by eight points. but frankly it is. i think that they're spending money because they have some indication that she might be in play. unfortunately i think that is the case.

hispanic voters or any other part of the vote that's at play here? >> no, it's not. not just about hispanic voters i've always said that independent swing voters and others expect the major party candidates to have serious policy proposals and with regard to immigration just saying that you're going to build a wall make mexico pay for sit not a serious policy proposal i think most arizonans know that. >> dickerson: senator jeff flake we appreciate you being with us.

>> dickerson: we're back now to talk numbers more from our cbs news ballets ground tracker poll, we're joined by cbs news director of elections, anthony salvanto. let's walk through this slowly. 13 states we're going to be obsessed with them election night they are where the race is taking place. give us sense where things now stand in those 13 battleground states. >> clinton is still leading, in that sense the race is essentially unchanged still

but you look at her numbers underneath that lead and she's got historically high unfavorable ratings. some things haven't changed aren't good news. we haven't seen in that polling from a front runner before. what that does, it introduces a little bit of uncertain too still in this race because then voters say that they feel like they're settling, like they don't really like either choice, picked a front runner but settling for a choice rather than a little bit up in the air. >> dickerson: this is not an act of joy just bit more grudging. recapitulate of people who haven't paid attention, what sit underneath this week about her? >> she still has persistent issues on trust, on telling the truth and some of it stems from the e-mail server. people say in this poll they feel like her answers to that

not more so. but to really understand this public opinion you have to the bigger picture. in polling people consistently say they feel in america there are two sets of rules. one for them, one for people with special advantages. seems like the e-mail server is just reminding people of what they don't like. what they don't like about politics as usual. then they see that bleeds into some of her numbers where people say like they feel like she is running on behalf of big rather than trying to help them or help the country. even more so she's running because she wants to help herself rather than them. that's where it spreads out and makes her numbers weaker. >> dickerson: to the bigger issue than just about specific e-mails. talk about donald trump big challenges, he's been trying to fix them, what's his big challenge on how he's been trying to fix it. >> you look at his numbers among minority voters they are low, they haven't moved yet.

to minority voters are also a signal to those reluctant republicans that we see who worry. they tell us they worry, his appeal is based on racial division, they don't like that. not as moved even by immigration issue as well. but you see the balancing that can he has, this week people said if he felt immigration policy was staying the same but conservatives who felt like they were choosing, becoming easier on people in the country illegally, less enthusiastic that. >> dickerson: so this question on immigration, signature policy of donald trump when chris christie says that he's going to take a pause about the 11 million undocumented, that would seem to be a message to those reluctant republicans you were talking about. that donald trump can change his mind, that he's not -- yet he said that there are those conservatives who always been with him who are step kick dash are skeptical who were softening, changing their mind

so, let's step back look at the big picture then, the state of the map. what does it look like? >> for hillary clinton she's leading in most states that we've gone through, state by state. but she's got enough of a cushion in the states that she can even afford to drop a couple to lose her lead in a couple still get elected. battleground states like ohio and florida she can't afford to lose them and still win if she keeps the lead like in north carolina. democrats start with group of states that are voting for democrats and she's doing well in enough broad states in these battle ground states. what does the path look like then for donald trump. >> donald trump has more challenges quite frankly. not just numerically hear toss pull back so many of these states. he's got to win florida. got to win ohio then he's got to go get the lead back in north carolina and in pennsylvania.

electoral votes that he's got to pull back some of those democratic states. the good news for him, though, is these states are not that dissimilar. if you can change people's minds probably start to see sequence of states start to move not just one or two. >> dickerson: all right. you've added arizona and georgia to the mix which are usually republican states that means bigger map for hillary clinton we'll see. thanks, an to on this knee. he'll see lot of you and continue to what is going on in the president shall race and out th for now we'll take a pause we'll be back in a moment. this car is traveling over 200 miles per hour. to win, every millisecond matters. both on the track and thousands of miles away.

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>> dickerson: welcome back i'm john dickerson. joining us now is former attorney general alberto gonzales he is out with new book called "true faith and allegiance" a story of service and sacrifice in war and peace about his life and time serving the george w. bush administration. ia were briefly the one administration official to be off in a secret location. temp us first a little bit about that experience. and then you said it gave you new appreciation for the presidency, how so? >> well, of course, when a disaster and presidentsial

and so, i spent that evening on airplane flying around, i remember thinking, watching president bush give the address that evening. i would advise him through two cars, i've experienced pretty big moments with him before. but sitting on that airplane suddenly hit me, my gosh, something happened in washington, would i and people on that airplane be able to govern a wounded nation. presidentni headed back to andrews air force base and we land. i had an appreciation of the tremendous pressure and power the opportunity to be president of the united states was really special. >> dickerson: we're in the middle of campaign where people are imagining the candidates stepping into that role that you stepped in to for 45 minutes or however long the speech was. saw said it takes a special kind of perp to be president, what do

decisions about who should go on the supreme skort or decision to send mend and women into battle it takes someone are you few where integrity matters most. people want to know the person, most powerful person in the world is constrained by constitution. wisdom is very important. a pos come with me. i can take to you a better place. america is one of the lead someone who believes in them. and courage. the office of bad decision making i heard president bush say this often. you have to have the courage to make the tough decisions because at the end of the day, that's what the american people expect is you make right decision to be bold and promise of this country. >> dickerson: you're a republican, does donald trump

dickerson: what's to evaluate? >> he shifts positions from time to time. i don't know donald trump. i don't think i've ever met donald trump. i think being able to know someone takes some time. and i know there are lot of good people that i trust and know who are not supporting him. what it tells me is that i need to study this man very, very closely. i don't think americans should make a decision based upon the recommendations of anyone else. for example, today support donald trump i do support donald trump i wouldn't expect other americans to follow my lead. i would expect them to do their own investigation, evaluation to whether or not this is the right person for them and their families and to lead this country. >> dickerson: based on the criteria you outline in the book, let me ask you another thing you said about donald trump's comments about mexico because he made the trip this week. donald trump said just remind people they bring drugs, they bring crime, they're rippists, you said, you can't unring that

>> there are consequences when a president makes a statement. i talk about that in the book in terms of, once the president makes a statement, it's very, very difficult to walk that back back. i think someone in the oval office very careful about the words they say. because there are consequences, quite frankly there should be when president draws red line in the sand, there will be consequences. there can nobody doubt any minds of our enemies that we intend to ll consequences. words are very important from someone who sits in the oval office. >> dickerson: an anecdote in the book got lot of attention, it was march of 2004, john ashcroft was attorney general, scene in his hospital room where you're trying to get extension for the warrantless wiretapping program. and there had been different stories told about this, director comey of the fbi said that you and andy card were

take advantage of a very sick man. you tell your version of the story of what happened in the hospital room trying to get that extension. what -- how did it go as you saw it? >> you're right, i spent some time in the book talking about this. i say that, i testified under oath about what happened in the hospital room. inspector general of the department also spoke about what happened in the hospital room. i am on record, under oath about what happened, no one has contested my description of what happened. listen, andy two times before that hospital room about our concern that he might not be competent. >> dickerson: the attorney general john ashcroft. >> if he wasn't competent we're not going to ask to do anything. we were primarily there to report on meeting we had just had with congressional leaders about the very same program and about the dispute and congressional leaders telling us we believe it should go forward with the program. >> dickerson: continue the program. >> because it's so important in

very next day we had madrid train bombings. very dangerous time for our country. try to do what we could to have the tools necessary to protect america. >> dickerson: in terms of the warrantless wiretapping and in hansed interrogation that you over saw as well -- >> i didn't oversee it. dickerson: in your capacity with the president. >> i was counsel to the president but advice came from the department much justice, the senior leadership of the department and lawyers within administration sayi certain way would be effective. and it would be lawful. >> dickerson: i apologize. not unimportant fact. how do you feel looking back on both of those things, both of those policies have been changed. in the republican race right now there are some -- donald trump saying bring back waterboarding, it would be great. >> should only do those things that are absolutely necessary and effective and lawful. >> dickerson: is that true of enhanced interrogation? >> absolutely. we've had testimony by folks

about information that we got from the program. and at that time the department of justice issued opinion that if waterboarding, for example, was done certain supervision, it was only done to three people, high level detainees who we believe had information that it would be lawful. so, this was obviously very, very controversial and i don't mean try to -- in that who believes that waterboarding wasn't torture, merelyea point out that the lawyers worked very, very hard to get this right. to ensure that the cia and policy makers had the tools that they believe was necessary protect this country. >> dickerson: just very briefly parting question here, your view now, there's legal pathway to bring waterboarding back or -- >> would i support it? i'd have to want to talk to the cia folks to say, first of all, what is the threat. if in fact someone has

next half hour and we have someone in custody that has information about that even chuck schumer said in that scenario said, yes, we authorize torture assuming, again, i'm not suggest can it would be torture as legal matter but would be tool that we should pursue. >> dickerson: all right. alberto gonzales. thanks very much. >> thanks, john.

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is. >> dickerson: joining us now for political analysis, susan page is "usa today's" washington bureau chief. jamelle bouie chief political correspondent and cbs news political analyst, molly ball covers politics for the atlan atlantic. ramesh ponnuru is the national review and fellow at the american enterprise institute. ramesh are start with you. at the end of the week donald trump has been to mexico met with the mexican president and gave a the same day. do the calculation, where do things stand at the end of the week with donald trump and immigration? >> well, i think that it is confusing story. today on the airwaves trump supporters chris christie on this show and rudy guiliani are saying, he softened on immigration, no long for mass deportation. one of the reasons it's not getting through is that trump

he implied it. and he did it in a speech that was all of the -- were extremely hard line. the speech that actually reads differently than it looks. and i don't see how the trump campaign can expect that it is going to get credit for softening which it clearly wants if it won't actually come out and make that message more explicit. >> dickerson: molly, i was surprised that chris christie used the word "pause." undocumented immigrants will be out so fast your head will spin. that is very different than the word pause. >> it is. there's been a lot of 'teams muddy the water but i think that a decision was made when trump gave that immigration speech that he cannot walk back. as ramesh was saying the decision was made to cast this issue in very harsh terms. to continue to depict illegal immigrants as criminals and as a danger to this country. so whatever policy is in the fine print and i don't think we

taken all of the positions at once in a way. but the tone that have speech, i think really closed a door for trump. with some voters who were looking for him to be more compassionate. to strike a top more of acceptance no matter what policy he's add slow kateing, i think with certain hispanic voters certain non-hispanic voters there might have been an open door that door was closed by the desection that trump made to give that speech. >> dickerson: who are those voters that he's trying to -- donald trump trying to appeal to with want to call it, whether it exists or doesn't exist. >> think whatever percentage of voters, republican voters are staying away from states like arizona and georgia and north carolina. north carolina, mitt romney won that by slim margin in 2012, pretty much a must win state for donald trump. i think that margin is mostly the result of republican voters who were just staying away. and you have all these activated, energized democratic voters who are taking their

that group, college educated, suburban, which is predominant in states like virginia, colorado, important in pennsylvania. donald trump losing that group of voters then his path is very narrow, if increasingly nonexistent. >> it's interesting if you look most of the demographic groups they are pretty available four years ago. one exception are college educated whites. the exit polls in 2012, college educated whites went r pew research poll by 14 percentage points that is kind of swing, i don't think we've seen before with a big group in american politics since we started polling. >> dickerson: up by 14. >> up by 14 where as barack obama lost by 14 points just four years ago. think of big swing among college educated whites, huge part of the u.s. population, huge part

years. i was talking to political scientists at emery who looks at these questions, we couldn't come up with another example that have kind of swing since 1952 started to be able to look at the demographics of president shall elections. >> the gamble of trump cam in that he is realigning by 'tracking nor noncollege educated white voters and democrats. we haven't seen him do. that all the other groups are stable. >> you mention him, he has a model of elec predicts based on the economy, based on the variables, trump should win, clinton should lose. but he doesn't think that will happen because trump has run such different kind of campaign that scrambled the electorate in that way. >> dickerson: do you think going back to this point that molly was making about realigning the electorate, if that's your take wouldn't you not need to do the softening because you're realigning? in other words, do you see in the softening undermining this notion that there's a huge group

this group of people isn't there, or not large enough to make up for the voters you're losing. i think the original theory was trump could have this hard line message be pull noncollege educated whites and white men from democrats, those who aren't voting pull them booty electric tort. what happens basically, yeah, you have this action, reactivating bunch of voters but a reaction, too. from african americans, latinos, action. trump campaign now trying to figure out how it can mitigate the reaction but i just don't think it has time to do so at this point. >> dickerson: is this what you saw in the visit to the detroit church, this is also part of this effort and where do we think that is going to be successful, meaningful, all about african americans or about this group of college educated voters that we've been talking about? >> if there is saw political calculation, that is always an if with trump and his campaign

and based on the gut f. there is calculation, it is probably much more about those white swing voters. on the other hand you see him getting zero or one or two percent of the african american poll there may be no where to go for up. and images where he at least seems to be making contact and listening to african americans, could give him some lift there. but it does seem to be mostly about the predominantly white portion of the electorate that looks at him and believes that he's a racist, that he's intolerant, he's hateful wants to be reassured these people want to vote for the republicans. they want to vote for the person with the r next to his name that's why i think trump still has some upside but he needs to convince them that they can do that. >> there's some good political science that part of the of the presidential election function of white racial views, that women can have softer, less conservative racial views than men. when they see candidates who are hard line or seemingly hard line

negatively. george w. bush, for example, did better than would you expect among white college educated women in part because his brand as it were was republican with more liberal racial views than typical republican. >> dickerson: ramesh, let me ask you a question how to fix this brand issue. because you can't do it in one event. yet when donald trump went to meet with the president of mexico, the word presidential got thrown around a lot. apply to the wisdom of the group here. what does presidential in campaign context? what is the real benefit of presidential? >> if you look at the breakdown in that north carolina poll from cbs, a majority of north carolina voters don't believe that donald trump is ready to be commander in chief. that is what it means. that is i think the central problem of this candidate. people dislike him, people dislike her but think she is ready to be commander in chief. they don't believe that he is.

about president shall, talking about gravitas, changing his image idea can you do those -- you've been to those moments but can you do it in just standing up there and having an image is that good enough? >> well, i think that combined with good performance in debates is probably good enough. because if in fact have electorate that wants to vote against hillary clinton because they don't think these honest and trustworthy and ready for change. but donald trump at least so far has not of looking like you can trust him to be commander in chief. that doesn't -- i don't think you can say there's no time left for him to do this because despite all disadvantages that we've talked about so far for donald trump, he is still within striking distance. two points in your battleground states poll. we have 65 days left? >> dickerson: right. you've given us segue to talk about hillary clinton. gentleman nell, new information about her fbi interview, the

polls coming down what is the state of hillary clinton's campaign, now been several weeks it comes up it's a bruise that keeps getting hit. >> think at this point you can tie hillary clinton's fortunes to national polls to the tenor of her news coverage. when news coverage of clinton is good or neutral like just after the convention her poll numbers hit your 48, 49% level. she ends up establishing a seven or eight point lead over when the e-mails come in, when the foundation comes in, when the questions that remind people of all the things that they do not like about hillary clinton, they do not like about broader political worldcom in her numbers immediately so soft phone 45, 44. that street story going back to april or may. her lead after the convention was very similar to her lead at that time, difference but same pattern happen in april and may

speeches and bernie's attacks, soft earned her to 44, 45. it sort of -- almost like a timing game that will just see come november where she is in the cycle. >> dickerson: ramesh, did u take anything away from the fbi reports that is new or just sort of general issue that she has on this that will within her all the way through to november? >> there's always another piece of evidence that tends to there is a lack of transparency, a lack of honesty, forth comi comingness from hillary clinton and i don't think that story is about clinton aides destroying phones with hammers is going to help her in any way. i talked to republicans strategists at least somebody is keeping this race competitive. >> yet big potential candle involving donald trump, i'm glad

trump in 2013, foundation made illegal $25,000 contribution to a campaign committee associated with the florida attorney general who was at that time deciding whether to pursue an investigation into trump university. this is the kind of thing he's now paid a fine, which is -- at the "washington post" reported, this is -- should be major story i'm perplexed by why it hasn't gotten more attention. so much attention to her scandals and credibility to make at and trustworthiness it's so low it's harder for her to generate outrage about this potential scandal involving him. >> the news cycles of the third party candidates. >> dickerson: donald trump boasted about being able to do precise ly, that give donations to get what he wants. he hasn't been shy about. this he hasn't spoken directly to this thing but he has said that's why the system so corrupt because i was master at playing it. let me ask you about hillary clinton, when she speaks, is

>> i think it depends. i don't think it is the case that every time she opened her mouth she makes things worse. and she would hold a press conference, i think that whether or not she got herself into further trouble with her answers to questions it would be refreshing to see her facing the press and answering questions. and she's playing a very conventional campaign strategy where you spend your august fundraiser, then assume that the campaign gauges in full after i think it's safe to assume that we will see more of her doing public events and giving speeches after labor day. >> jamelle, she's likely more policy speeches is that a way to the criticism that she's disappeared during august raise a lot of money while she disappeared is that a way out of the fix sheets faces. >> i'm not really sure. i think when it comes to hillary clinton's public perception people just think that she knows a lot, she's very prepared with regards to policy.

like or do not believe, do not like that she's secretive or believe that she cares about people like them. i'm not sure if more policy speeches would fix that latter problem. bill clinton never quite fixed about trustworthiness but able to convince people that he compared about them. and i think that is clinton's challenge going forward. >> dickerson: maybe impossible to fix the first. she could presumably if she gave good enough speeches without solutions that might work. that's it for us. we'll be back in a moment.

>> dickerson: turn now for a moment from negativity of our presidential race to eveha celebration. at the vatican this morning mother theresa was declared a saint for mass of 120,000 people in st. peter's square. pope francis praised her who died 19 years ago to serving the poorest of the poor in indian slums. calling on world leaders to end the crimes of poverty they themselves created. st. theresa stood just five foot

the world. we'll be right back. so onsite teams can count on early warning of approaching weather. because safety is never being satisfied. and always working to be better. bp drilling teams train in virtual reality simulators in here, so we're better prepared for any situation out there. because safety is never being satisfied.

>> dickerson: that's it for this today thanks for watching. join us next week when we'll have cia director john brennan. for "face the nation" i'm john dickerson. enjoy your labor day. captioning sponsored by cbs captioned by media access group at wgbh

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