park "fortune" magazine calls him the smartest man in tech. google's uncanny ability to find what you want. and the geekiest fireman you will ever want to meet. richard price, using the iphone to save lives. and ben parr of marshable and kim mcnichols on "press:here." >> good morning. the capitol of burendy, i looked it up on google and it took them parts of a second to give the answer. you know what, you are not

amazed. you should be amazed. google as a public company is a little more than 2,000 days old. yeah. i looked that up on google, too. in those 2,000 plus day, we've grown accustomed to the fact anything can be found through google, usually on the first try. the internet may be the library, but google is the world's librarian and like all high-tech company, it's facing threats. the internet becoming increasingly mobile, away from their core strength on the desktop, becoming increasingly realtime, information moving too fast for google to index. the internet is becoming fractured. properties like facebook with its wealth of information generally off limits to much of google's reach. >> dr. amit singhal is the

highest honor for an engineer, they build self-driving robots on the car just for fun. he is responsible for the ultra secret search algorithm. which means he is rarely allowed to talk to the press. joining us is kim mcnichols on ben parr from marshable. earlier this week, there were reports google was stealing their search results. you kind of led the bing sting, did you not? >> i did. it was a scientific experiment. >> we prefer "bing sting." kind of has a ring to it. >> it's your show, so havicours. >> why the need for a bing sting. last summer, when we were working on the system, which is incredible useful for me. >> i use it. >> we had been working really

hard. the team had been working really hard to improve spelling for hard to spell terms, like a rare medical procedure. and what we noticed last summer, around june time frame while we were working on that system for a misspelling of that rare word, we got the spelling right and started returning to users the best results for the query. a few weeks later, our top result, only our top result started appearing in bing without the spell correction and without any other results. they did not get the spell correction and the result. >> the statistical changes of that happening are impossible? >> are very small. >> so how is that possible? >> let me carry on this story. that's what's rather suspicious, as you would say.

however, you know, we being fine, said maybe those at bing came up with a great algorithm, kudos to them, however, we kept watching the phenomena in the months that followed. over the next three or four months we saw increasingly bing's results look like our results including some of our mistakes showing up there. >> in the most obscure things. >> in the most obscure things and not so obscure things. that was too much of a chance. then, in october, we noticed a huge jump in bing's results overlapping our results. by now, our suspicion was way too strong to let it go. in december, we started a scientific experiment. >> amazing. >> i amazing. >> in which we took nonsensical query, no user would ever type.

>> i think they pronounced it -- >> very good. >> a nonsense word. >> created links to it. >> no. we did not create links, no way for that word to be associated with anything on the web. all we did was associate a random web page. you would say hyy and we would say page x. >> here's that honey pot no one would type in that query and will it show up on bing. it does. >> two weeks later, our results show up on bing. >> what if they're just indexing everything on the web? >> they're clearly indexing everything on the web. there is no way to associate one synthetic query to that one

page. >> the nonsense word does not appear on -- >> does not appear on the website. >> there's no connection -- >> other than we decided to put it there. >> so how did they do it? we suspect, we don't know exactly how they're doing. suspect people who download ie 8 -- >> internet web browser. >> many people use or the big toolbar they have a toolbar to do various things are getting their queries and their clicks on google sent to microsoft. we're suspect they're using those in some way. >> you decided to call out bing actually by name in a prominent blog post this week. why did you go that route? >> we basically first talked to danny sullivan because he's an independent third party. we wanted him to verify. >> explain who danny sullivan is. >> the editor and chief of

search engine language, prominent blog on search engines. >> and authority. >> danny has been following the industry many, many years and knows quite a bit how things are done and we wanted to give our evidence to an independent third party in danny. we did. he contacted microsoft, had a conversation with them and denny decided to go public with this. >> so microsoft released this pretaped response. normally, this is not a he said-she said show. because they're not here, we can roll this little bit of tape, about 18 seconds. >> i want to categorically state bing does not copy any search competitor period full stop. what we do and what i've said now -- we said now for years. we do use quick string data across the world help send in to microsoft to help us improve our products. >> send it to microsoft. >> let me say, microsoft has been invited on this show dozens

of times and always said yes and never quite gotten back to us, including bing. the reason they're not here they never say yes to being here. you're here. respond to what he said. is that similar to what you analyzed, as far as where they're getting their results? >> from their perspective, they may be learning from their customer data. there is a wide difference between learning from your customer data and competitor's work product. in my view, the only way those results showed up on bing because they're our results. if that's not copying that's the way it is. >> is it a fear you will be giving them more press and more people turning to bing. a lot of times when you come out like that and attack microsoft, it makes it look as though you're scared of them. >> we clearly wanted to go public with this because we wanted everyone in the world to know what's happening out there,

what practices microsoft is following with bing. we have deep trust in our users and intellectual trust out there that they would analyze the situation, that this is definitely unethical for microsoft to do. >> what do you want microsoft to do? >> from one scientist to another scientific team, all we want is microsoft to stop this practice. >> stop it there. we will break with a commercial and be back with a mt.omen g in aoment. cnichols.

welcome back to "press:here." we'll start with ben parr at mashable. >> google announced a change in leadership. larry page, one of the co-founders is leading the company now. how will that change the company

and how you're doing business. >> he has been a brilliant ceo and it has been a pleasure working under him and have seen tremendous growth in the last ten years under eric. however, 10 years is a long time to operate a company google's size on a day-to-day basis. eric, larry and sergei collected over the holidays and decided it's time to clarify their rules and always good to make a change when things are going well. 2010 was an amazing year for google. as things are going very well at google. this is a perfect time to make a change and larry is ready, as eric said. >> what can we expect for the change in 2011? >> the company will be operating in the same vein but more clarified rules for eric, larry

and sergei. >> was there confusion? you say clarified rules. >> there wasn't confusion in that sense because they always worked together closely and a single voice always came out. however as we grow and face new challenges, it's better to clarify who does what role. larry will be focusing on product and technology direction and starting in april, take on the day-to-day responsibilities as ceo. >> it almost sounds like there was a little bit of disagreement who was doing what. >> confusion, a nice way. >> i always found the conversations very energizing. >> you are one of the top men at google, you're responsible for the algorithm that gets me the response i need. when you had an emergency, who did you go to before? >> if we had an emergency, i would talk to either sergei or larry because they were on the technology side of things. eric paid a lot more to business

and governmental output. >> you will still be doing the same thing. >> we worked with larry and sergei so many years, were the ones who wrote this engine to begin with and have deep involvement in our search. >> while google had a very good quarter and good earnings report, there have been issues under surface, google wave disconsistendi discontinued. nexus one didn't continue and google buzz mediocre, especially in social for google you have had problems. how do you think larry is going to lead the company to fix that kind of problem and get google into social? >> i wouldn't characterize all those as problems. indeed, as a company, you try different products. several are amazingly successful. android, our mobile operating system is shipping 250,000 units a day. >> they're number one now.

>> yes. and doubling the traffic over the last year, display advertising over a half billion. our mobile business is generating over a billion a year. for so many successes, to pick two or three things that we wish could have succeeded more is fine, right? because as a dpcompany, you hav to do several things and several succeed tremendously. several we wish had succeeded more but we learned from what we did there. >> and be allowed to fail. >> be allowed to fail. >> let's throw this up on the wall. >> google is all about failing fast. >> when you have facebook and you can't get in and see what's going on completely in facebook or some other site, when you have twitter moving so fast, these are the future of the web or at least the e citing parts -- exciting parts of the web,

that's got to be a threat to the web. >> facebook is good for the web and whatever is good for the web, is good for google. as the web grows billions of dollars of advertising money comes online and we benefit from that as a business. facebook is a great service for its users. it has allowed many people to come online and we are benefitting from the growth of the web. i think there's enough space for both of us to exist in this open web eco-system and that's what keeps me so excited. >> ben, i have to cut you off there, go to commercial and our next guest. dr. amit singhal, thank you for being here. up next, saving a life. >> there's an app for that. the amazing power of community linked by smartphones.ed you ar

welcome back to "press:here." what you are about to see is amazing. if you were to heavy a heart attack right now, you would have about seven minutes to live. heart attack to brain damage at best, death at worst, seven minutes. >> the problem is on average, it takes seven minutes for a well trained rescue crew to reach you. the math is not in your favor. >> 911, what are you reporting? >> cities try to speed the process up, spending millions on new 911 systems and faster ambulances, but the answer probably lies in the moments between. if you can get someone to perform cpr in those critical minutes, a life will be saved. >> iphone application that empowers everyday citizens to

provide life saving assistance. >> richard price, a former software engineer turned fire chief, helped develop a revolutionary iphone app which notifies people minuteman star when someone near them needs cpr.

>> rich price is the fire chief of the san ramon fire district, a former high-tech start-up entrepreneur. joined by kym mcnicholas, and ben parr, the world's best

public service announcement demonstrates what this thing is. the first time you showed it to me, i just got it. you have smartphones in everybody's pocket, somebody's 100 yards away that knows cpr. that's kind of how that started. >> it did. it started at lunch i was with my it staff on a regular day, heard the sire ren and wondered where the crew was heading and pulled up in front of the deli we were eating at. we were aware of someone in great need on the other side of the wall. i had a paramedic with me, defibrillator in my car, on duty, crowded restaurant, shocked something could occur so close to us without us being aware of it. that was the genesis of the app. we worked the rest of the afternoon on napkins an got a plan together. >> how does this app actually work? uses location-based technology, correct? >> it does. users download the application,

they opt in, saying, i'm cpr trained, willing to help in time of an emergency. if an emergency occurs we determine to be somebody who's unconscious and unresponsive, we'll dispatch our crews and simultaneously, will notify all citizens in the area cpr trained that have opted in, in the immediate vicinity, to start cpr and locate the nearest -- >> we have viewers all around california, san ramon fire district is where this works. you can download it where you want, only works in your fire district. >> that particular feature is for our fire district and too good to keep in our small district. we are aggressively working to make it available to other agencies. >> how will you work around that. i don't live in san ramon. i need to retake all my cpr training. >> a normal reaction.

>> two, i really want this for my city. how do you hope to get this to other cities? >> one of the things we've done. partnered with workday ceo, dave duff field. >> he was the one who actually was a ceo of peoplesoft and oracle bought peoplesoft and he ended up now starting workday. >> they have lent us world class engineers resources to start a foundation. that foundation will really be external and separate from the fire district now. they will be responsible to get an open source framework in place that will allow developers from around the world to get the application running in their jurisdiction. >> you're aware most fire chiefs do not say open sources framer. in the show i called you the geekest fire chief you ever want to meet. you have all kinds of stuff on internet. you are one geeky fire

department. >> we're very technology -- >> geeky is a kilometecomplimen. >> we have a number of issues going on and projects in the works. i have technology focus in our agency and used technology in a ways other people haven't. we believe and this is a good example, technology can make a big difference. we are trying to take the tools available to us today and apply them to the mission of saving lives. >> what response have you gotten nationwide? i'm sure you have been contacted with other fire departments that have seen stories on other apps? >> we have a large number of fire departments interested and many communities that want to duplicate what we've done here and working very aggressively to make that happen. >> apple may know about it but hasn't contacted you. the psa, you see the simulation of the heart attack ought to be at the next apple developer's conference, they show the commercial, this is why we

invented the iphone. apple has not contacted you. what's your status with apple? >> we have a typical developer relationship with apple. we think the world of the device, thrilled with what we were able to accomplish with the device. we always thought when we looked at applications and where applications and what we were able to accomplish, we would impress the apple engineers, who said we put this gp s-chip in this phone and what are people going to do with it. we are an excellent example what you can do when you know where the phones are located. >> hopefully after seeing this interview, they will give you a call. >> i pitched this story to the magazine as well. i think it's a great story at forbes and they said it's too localized. >> it's extraordinary. you have not saved a life with this, yet? >> it's only been about a week. >> how many people have heart attacks? >> we probably in our district maybe 100 events that would

qualify for this level of response in our district a year. we're only notifying in public places. >> right. if you're within that zone. you won't get it if you're in the living room couch. >> that's right. only in public places that cuts that number down more than half probably. important to note we are only doing this in public places. that save is ort theut there fo. >> not just that. it has traffic and i also saw it has -- >> dispatching. >> you can listen to the dispatch radio. >> we put all our calls up. very much an app that involves the community, a lot of civic engagement in the application, so people get notified of traffic accidents. >> is this because you think it's cool or because it's better taxpayer relation? >> i don't doubt you on the iphone app. that's extraordinary. your website firedepartment.org? right? >> that's right. >> it's really great.

why is that great? you're a fire department. >> i think we're trying to engage our community and use the website and application to lead to some new technologies like this, where we do think it's mission critical. these are life saving tools. we do notifications for maybe evacuations and other requests to the community where the need is localized. >> go ahead. >> do you see a lot of extra traffic? is there enough traffic to support the investment in a website like yours? >> we do believe that with the capabilities of the website. they're trying to reach out to the community, give them a lot of tools. ben says, i'd like to have a cpr class when i seek this out. you can go to our site and have a full menu of cpr classes and buy kits to take in your living room. you can see any example of one particular need. we don't want people to have to

drive to the department. >> richard price would make an excellent software ceo. he's a fire chief and good one at that.usin jmit a we'll be ba.

that's our show for this week. my thanks to amit singhal from google and ben writes at marshable.com and kichl writes at forbes. both are well worth reading. we are preempted by nbc sports for a couple of weeks so we'll see you in a few weeks after that. thank you for making us part of your sunday morning.