he owns slightly less than half of "forbes" and a major investor in palm, where he's not the only rock star. bono sits with him on the board.

"usa today" once said roger mcnamee is living a fantasy. a speaker and a multi-millionaire and, most impressively, draw a direct line from his band to the grateful dead. joined by rich of bloomberg and john schwartz of "usa today." i just don't even know where to start with all that. let me start with, how's bono? >> he sends his best regards. he is a big fan of your show. >> i knew that. >> get him on the show one day, i guess. >> he's really hoping if he performs well enough, one day he will be good enough to get on the show. looks to me for leadership for this kind of thing. >> you sold paul. wh what did you make of palm? >> the funny thing about being an investor, this is generally forgotten, you have to make mistakes in order to have great things happen. you need to try things that are bold. what we were trying to do with

palm was to marry the worldwide web with mobility in a smartphone. and to try to do some things that we perceived apple would not be doing. in the end, we did not succeed. we made a couple mistakes right off the beginning. when you go back and look at a thing like this, the thing that killed us was something that we never thought about deeply, which is we assume that business people would not want a smartphone that didn't have a physical keyboard. it was, that's the way it had always been. we were taught logical about it. and in the end, it caused us to make a design that was too expensive and too hard to manufacturer which slowed us down. we got to market after android instead of before android. >> by that pressure, blackberry is not doing. >> -- in fairness, a lot of different use cases in the mobile world. our assumption was neither blackberry nor apple would address all people's needs. blackberry would be too slow to

implement web things and that apple would focus on consumer needs. the part we missed, obviously, apple did a much, much better job at broadening the use cases available for an iphone and they had no trouble convincing business people it was okay to use a virtual keyboard. the team that we worked with there, we learned some amazing things and, you know, you didn't mention before, we are also an investor in facebook and yelp and the experiences from palm have helped us in those two cases profoundly. and, you know, i'm a big believer that if you don't fail regularly, you don't learn much. and we only made eight investments in our fund and palm, in the end, was okay for our investors. because of the nature of the deal, we got our money back. we didn't make anything, but we got our money back. i'm quite certain if we hadn't done that, we would never have had a chance to do facebook. >> you mention an opportunity to invest in zynga.

>> we turned down many things. when you only make eight investments, you have to be very picky. we turned down twitter and we did facebook and yelp, we chose them because they felt to us as the businesses which had the best combination of an enduring model and a team whose character and values we rare really shar thought we could help. the problem i had at twitter was not that they were going to be successful, i was convinced both were going to be game changers, but i was not compatible to the people managing those companies. the abilities of my partners to add value there was going to be restricted because their communication style was too different. >> let me play devil's advocate. you make a lot of money, so what. we're not compatible, but let's make a lot of money. >> you may find this hard to believe. i have never been mote vaed by

money. i enjoy creating businesses. i like the changes technology brings. john and i have been talking for 15 years over the years and this is the first time we ever met face-to-face. over those 15 years, though, the things that we have seen has been astonishing and i get my thrills from seeing my fingerprints on things that make the world a better place. and this is really important point because the world's not in a good place right now and i very strongly believe that we have to find ways to get america back on track. >> let's get back to it. that's a topic i want to touch on. >> you mentioned spotify and i wanted to ask the question. you're the one, and that was pete townsend's a month or so ago his lecture where he called apple and itunes a digital vampire and said more broadly that silicon valley needs to do more to nurture artists. what was your reaction to that?

>> so, i view that as an understandable emotional response by somebody who would like to think that the things that he created 40 years ago are as valuable today as they were 40 years ago. very few things people created 40 years ago that are more valuable than they were then. >> but one of those things? >> so, here is my view. technology is a pendulum. before 1984 and the mcintosh. the best thing you could do is green print against a black screen. everything was the same. dolby invests post script and desktop publishing and for 12 years the focus of technology was increasing production valus and making things look great. the pendulum swings the other way. then in 2006, apple comes out with the iphone and we start the pendulum back the other way. we have the first production

value introduced. i believe to the first approximatation we'll spend the next ten years making content on the web much more differentiated and much more compelling and much more interesting and therefore more valuable. that doesn't mean that the songs pete wrote 40 years ago will be more valuable. he'll have to put them in a form that people say, wow, i got to have that. but the opportunity will be there. >> roger, you bring up the changes on the web. your band, we're going to hear from your band in a little bit has become sort of a laboratory on it. so you have a band, so what. my viewer is going to want to know. it's a laboratory. >> the key thing to understand is, when we formed elevation in 2004, bono had a plan for saving the economics of people like pete townsend. it was, we put together an idea we call project independence that would have allowed artists to have a balance sheet so that they could compete against record labels. it was a harmless, really cool idea. and it got shot down by a music

industry lawyer at signing because it was too great a threat to the status quo. i was so angry and frustrated that bono, t-bone and burnett and i were sitting around afterward and said we're never doing anything with the music industry again. and t-bone, burnett said, yes, you are. we're going to start a new band, new legend and you're going to prove everything you were trying to do. we started that four years ago and a month and a half ago, our first single which we put out a couple years ago passed a million downloads. no band has ever come even above 100,000 off their own website. there is no itunes, no nothing. there's been itunes, but that's separate. nobody has given it any help. all the effort was ours off of facebook and twitter and now the first music apps you can get anywhere. there's an audio player, so, if you're on an iphone or ipad, you have access to 400 shows of

music. if you go to our video player, now we have a satellite system, so they're all not only high def but the highest def video you can get on an iphone or ipad. that's the laboratory. i've given up trying to invest in the stuff. instead, we're doing it to show people how it's done. i interviewed lyle lovett the other day and this is exactly what he needs. he has a great business in 40 cities around america. he could go to 80 cities really easily by using the video thing to make lyle loved better known. >> does something like google music, what type of impact do you think that would have on somebody who wants to become discovered or is that just another platform for popular bands? >> i think it's another platform for popular bands. to me facebook and twitter are the way a band on the way up finds its audience outside of its local community. and the trick here is, if you meet bono or pete townsend or mick jagger the thing you discover, they're not just

musicians. they are entrepreneurs. and the truth is being a great musician is no more important to great music than great food is in restaurants. mcdonald has consistent food, not great food. a lot of bands are like that. >> marketing and creating an image. >> i'm going to break in with you, we have a minute left. after the break you're going to play for us with your band. set up what we're going to hear? >> "american dream rag." i wrote it three years ago, apparently, anticipating occupy because the song is about wall street stealing the american economy and i spent 30 years in the career as an investor and i'm currently embarrassed by what is going into my world. it's gangster capitalism. people with no sense of control or perspective who are, you know, you see these things and a problem in a local company here the last couple weeks where

hedge funds have more or less destroyed one of the companies that is growing our economy. it's a manufacturing company, lots of new jobs. they made a short-term capital gain on the short side by destroying this company, over what was a fabricated thing. i mean, right now the rules are so asymmetrical and it is terrible. >> we'll hear it after the break. moon alice coming up after the break. back in a minute. this is an rc robotic claw. my high school science teacher made me what i am today. our science teacher helped us build it. ♪ now i'm a geologist at chevron, and i get to help science teachers. it has four servo motors and a wireless microcontroller. over the last three years we've put nearly 100 million dollars into american education. that's thousands of kids learning to love science. ♪ isn't that cool? and that's pretty cool. ♪

here they are, moon alice. ♪ ♪ i've been out of work since the plant shut down ♪ ♪ they shipped our jobs to china left behind our town ♪ ♪ tumble weed rolling through

it feels like we've all been screwed ♪ ♪ every day is a struggle but we finally took everything we had ♪ ♪ but we don't cry living the american dream ♪ ♪ politicians say back with trust they gave them all the money that once belonged to us ♪ ♪ in the name of red, white and blue it feels like we've all been screwed ♪ ♪ every day is a struggle but we get by ♪ ♪ they took everything we had but we don't cry ♪ ♪ee we can't afford to drink living the american dream ♪ ♪ i used to have insurance and a steady job ♪ ♪ but a banker bought the business with intent to rob ♪

♪ he closed all the factories thousands out of work makes his stock worth more ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

♪ debt and unemployment we got up the wazoo ♪ ♪ change we can't believe in is long overdue ♪ ♪ it's past time to sing the blues ♪ ♪ it feels like we've all been screwed ♪ ♪ every day is a struggle but we get by ♪ ♪ took everything we had but we don't cry ♪ ♪ we can't afford to drink living the american dream ♪ ♪ every day is a struggle but we get by ♪ ♪ they took everything we had but we don't cry ♪ ♪ we can't afford to drink but we still get hi♪ ♪ living the american dream living the american dream ♪ ♪ living the american dream

this is an rc robotic claw. my high school science teacher made me what i am today. our science teacher helped us build it. ♪ now i'm a geologist at chevron, and i get to help science teachers. it has four servo motors and a wireless microcontroller. over the last three years we've put nearly 100 million dollars into american education. that's thousands of kids learning to love science. ♪ isn't that cool? and that's pretty cool. ♪

welcome back to "press:here." recently, the nonprofit organization the clean tank open recognized some of the world's most progressive and promising green companies with its 2011 global forum awards, prestigious awards despite the rather pedestrian. rex northern of the clean tech open joins us as well as jim davis of chevron energy solutions. this is jim's second appearance on the show, i should point out, as i should point the last time you were here. chevron is the major sponsor of the clean tech open and a major

sponsor of "press:here," as well. wanted to get that out of the way. awards in the clean tech competition is how pedestrians that high-tech stuff is. nano robots that will mine the chlorophyll or something. insulating your house would make more sense energy wise. >> you were magnificent, scott. and, of course, jim was on the same stage with you last week. so, the answer to the question is that, of course, people are always looking for the sexiest thing. you know. >> yes. pink insulation isn't sexy, but it's effective. >> the pink stuff is sexy. >> if you think so. >> the government spend a fair bit of the stimulus package going around weatherizing people's homes. it was quite a big deal, actually, in the past few years. so, perhaps the best way to spend the money we have and here's a man who is in the energy efficiency space is in

not building new power plants, is in the what not produced. so, you're right. a huge proportion of this that is called energy proficient solutions. >> you see my point, though. when you go to a venture capitalest and you say, listen, i have something lenses that will orbit the earth, that sounds cool. >> it does. >> it is cool. everyone just insulating their home or double glazing their windows would have much more an effect than everyone buying a prius, would it not? >> in our projects, we commercialize a lot of these techna technologies and we look at our customers wholistically. reducing their consumption of energy to energy efficient technologies and then we complement on the supply side with on-site generation like solar or behind the meter wind and many times the majority of the savings come from the energy efficiency part of the project,

but the media always wants to take photos of the solar projects. and that's the sexy part and we often say that energy efficiency needs a hollywood agent. >> yes. okay. fair enough. >> as you, as you go around to these large industries and say here's where you can cut back on power and i always wondered this of pg&e and your company used to be owned before chevron. if you're an energy company, that is a bad business model. is it not? why in god's name would chevron tell me ways to save energy if chevron makes money saving energy? >> the reality is that the world's global demand for energy is expected to increase by 40% between now and 2035. >> you're not worried about the downside? >> it's going to take all forms of energy to meet that global, growing demand for energy. and energy efficiency is the cheapest, most plentiful source

of alternative energy there is. energy saved is energy found. >> rex, one of the things that i discovered is that people realized what a gallon of gas would cost. they don't have any idea what a kilowatt would cost them or for that matter, what a kilowatt hour is. why is it we get so upset about one thing and not the other? >> here i am sitting with this bizarre foreign accent. >> very bizarre. >> i come from the place where gash lean pri gasoline prices are not the same big deal they are in the united states. it is a big deal. in the u.s., no means to tax gasoline to the level you could to cover it. in the u.s., there's a massive focus on the price of gasoline. why? well, it is one of those key things that americans have. >> we buy it every time, but we buy electricity all the time, too. >> we do. but we buy our electricity on the credit card principle.

you don't buy the old-fashioned way with the slot in the meter. >> if we had to put a dollar bill in the thermostat. >> maybe we should go back that way. in europe, that still exists in some of the cheap hotels in paris. >> really? let's pivot a minute. the competition model seems to work well for generating interest in a space. the x-prize in space launches, that kind of thing. why does competition seem to work and the winner of the competition, by the way, said this did huge amounts for my business. it taught us a lot. why is that? why a competition? >> a competition traditionally is a process whereby you enter, you apply for something because there's a prize at the end of the rainbow. i mean, there's money -- >> there's a prize at the end of the rainbow for creating a great new product everybody wants to buy. the marketplace is a competition

itself. >> this is one of the reasons why we actually work with chevron. it's not much about the competition. that's much more of a wrapper than anything else. if you're an entrepreneur and you see an opportunity to get some cash based on competing with some other companies, that's going to get you off the sofa. but the real deal here is we provide as an organization, a nonprofit basis. we provide mentoring and training and like the awards event last week. big events that people can visit all the way across the country and throughout the world nowadays. it's not just about the competition. in fact, the competition is the last piece, it's the fifth thing we do in this whole list. >> and chevron skin in the game is that you can come in early and grab those companies. you can buy them or invest in them. you see everyone's cards early. >> they can mentor them, too, which they do. >> sure. for us, we get to see these great innovative ideas early. we can help them develop those ideas by providing mentoring as

the technology becomes ready for demonstration. many times we'll allow them to demonstrate their products on a chevron site or facility. and then, once they are commercially viable, my company can be -- >> there's a financial incentive for them. >> or we can provide them to chevron's own operations and lower our costs. >> hollywood movie and i invented a oil saving thing and they want to help you. we know how that plot would come out. you do have an advantage to help. >> we are a huge consumer of energy to produce energy. so, deploying new emerging technologies to our own operations makes good business sense. and, of course, my business that also helps external customers can apply the same technologies to help our customers lower their cost of energy. >> we have just about 30 seconds

left. you touched on that. people don't realize that nrmg companies have huge electric bills. >> indeed. we have massive costs of energy both in terms of electricity needs, steam, natural gas needs to run our worldwide operations and finding innovative ways to reduce that demand makes good business sense. >> jim davis of chevron and rex norton of the competition. thanks for being here and we'll be back in just a minute. this is an rc robotic claw. my high school science teacher made me what i am today. our science teacher helped us build it. ♪ now i'm a geologist at chevron, and i get to help science teachers. it has four servo motors and a wireless microcontroller. over the last three years we've put nearly 100 million dollars into american education. that's thousands of kids learning to love science. ♪ isn't that cool? and that's pretty cool. ♪

that's our show for this week. if you enjoy your time with roger mcnamee's band, you can watch it there and you can find essentially every appearance the band's ever made on its website moonalice.com. i'm scott mcgrew, thank you for making us part of your sunday morning. ♪

♪ ♪ the sun sets in the western sky ♪ ♪ it's only out for us to see what's right or wrong and what to say ♪