the crisis with russia over the downing of malaysia airlines flight 17. strong reaction this morning from the obama administration as russian-backed rebels take the outrageous step of removing bodies from the website. how will the u.s. force president putin to cooperate. war in the middle east after a failed peace push by the obama white house. i'll ask secretary of state john kerry if the president's foreign policy vision is up to all of these global tasks. later, the blow to aids research. some of the world's top experts killed in the malaysia airlines disaster. i'll get exclusive reaction from the doctor from the national

institute of health. an active week on the campaign trail over shadowed. trends with our roundtable. >> announcer: from nbc news in washington, this is "meet the press" with david gregory. >> good sunday morning. the very latest in the standoff are the details emerging how russian backed separatists are interfering with the investigation and removing bodies from the crash site. the latest u.s. intelligence suggests the missile that downed malaysia airlines was fired by russian rebels in the ukraine after they gave missiles to two separatists in two weeks. putin denied and said the u.s. shouldn't leap to conclusions. in a moment i'll speak to secretary of state john kerry. first andrea mitchell with high stakes in what might be the lowest moment in u.s. russia relations since the cold war. >> american intelligence officials are convinced that russia supplied the missile,

trained the separatists who shot down the plane and now this new outrage. the removal of the victims from the crash site. all this evidence pointing to vladimir putin's policies to this horrible sequence of events. now the question is, what are president obama and other leaders going to do about it. launch button on the missile that blew the malaysian airline out of the sky could signal diplomatic dead-end to the reset buttons the obama administration pushed in 2009. >> we will do it together. >> times have changed. >> there's a lot more that needs to be done and put putin on notice that he has gone too far and we are not going to stand idly by. >> latest flash point, ukraine. >> we want russia to take the path that would result in peace in ukraine, but so far, at least, russia has failed to take that path. instead, it has continued to violate ukrainian sovereignty

and to support violent separatists. >> the challenges are, what leverage does obama have? while he's suffering his lowest approval ratings, president putin's popularity is surging on his revival of russian nationalism as he flaunts russian power abroad. from the world cup to cuba. russia is arming u.s. adversaries, supplying heavy away in ukraine, syria and iraq, frustrating u.s. diplomacy. >> what we're seeing is vladimir putin implementing a policy of regional instability, arming with very sophisticated weapons these pro-russian separatists. >> another political challenge do they have the will to impose sanctions that will hurt russia. before this, europe put economic interests against put. >> i'm not counting on europeans being prepared to sacrifice but i would say it's much more

likely. especially if the evidence becomes overwhelming that russia is implicated in this event. >> assume agnew round of sanctions can be agreed on would it force a new course or push russia and united states closer to another cold war. >> u.s. and allies have a vision of vibrant democracy, market economies. russia and vladimir putin have a very different vision. >> it isn't a new cold war but a new low in relations. no amount of pressure including a call from secretary kerry to the russian foreign minister yesterday seems to change behavior. even as body parts are being removed and valuable evidence hauled away from that crash site. david. >> difficult moment at this particular moment, andrea. thank you very much. this morning i spoke with secretary of state john kerry. secretary kerry, welcome back to "meet the press." >> i'm glad to be with you, david, thank you.

>> the president demanded absolute cooperation from russia, from the separatists in eastern ukraine and now the whole world is watching the startling developments that the rebels are removing bodies from the crash site, putting them on refrimg rated traens even talk of removing the black box. >> what's happening is grotesque and contrary to everything vladimir putin and russia said they would do. reports of drunken soldiers unceremoniously piling bodies into trucks. removing both bodies as well as evidence from the site. they promised unfettered access, david. the fact is that right now they have 75 minutes on friday. yesterday, three hours. there were shots fired in the area. the separatists are in control, and it is clear that russia supports the separatists,

supplies the separatists, encourages the separatists, trains the separatists and russia needs to step up and make a difference here. >> how might the investigation be compromised, the government's ability to determine, with certainty, who fired this missile based on what's happening now. specifically i speak here about these reports of the black box being removed. >> let me tell you what we know at this point, david, because it tells you a lot about what's going on. in the last month we have observed major supplies moving in. several weeks ago about 150 vehicle convoy, including armored personnel carriers, tanks, rocket launchers, artillery, all going in and being transferred to the separatists. we know that they had an sa-11 system in the vicinity literally hours before the shootdown took place. there's social media records of that. they were talking and we have

the intercepts of their conversations, talking about the transfer and movement and repositioning of the sa-11 system. the social media showed them with this system moving through the very area where we believe the shootdown took place hours before it took place. social media, which is an extraordinary tool, obviously, in all of this has posted recordings of separatists bragging about the shootdown of a plane at the time right after it took place. the defense minister so-called self-appointed of the people's republic of donetsk actually posted a bragging statement on the social media about having shot down a transport. then when it became apparent it was civilian, they quickly removed that particular posting. >> are you bottom lining here

that russia provided the weapon? >> there's a story today confirming that, but we have not within the administration made a determination. it's pretty clear. there is a buildup of extraordinary circumstantial evidence. i'm a former prosecutor. i tried evidence on circumstantial evidence. it's powerful here. even more importantly, we picked up the imagery of this launch. we know the trajectory. we know where it take from. we know the timing. it was exactly at the time this aircraft disappeared from the radar. we also know from voice identification that the separatists were bragging about shooting it down afterwards. so there's a stacking up of evidence here which russia needs to help account for. we are not drawing the final conclusion here but there is a lot that points at the need for russia to be responsible. what president obama believes and we the international

community join in believing, everybody is convinced we must have unfettered access. the lack of access -- the lack of access, david, makes its own statement about culpability and responsibility. >> given that, given that, and what comes next, "the washington post" has editorialized this weekend what was missing, a clear moral conclusion about the regime of vladimir putin or an articulation of how the united states will respond. what about it? >> well, we're in discussions about that right now. i had a conversation yesterday with my counterpart, foreign minister lavrov. i made it very, very clear that we need this cooperation. we're going to try to find a way immediately whether or not that's going to be forthcoming. as you know, president obama only the day before this incident took place unilaterally moved in order to impose tougher sanctions. he imposed sanctions on gas,

sanctions on military companies. we've taken tough sanctions. we hope this is a profound wakeup call to those countries in europe that have wanted to kind of, you know, go slow and soft pedal this. >> but call vladimir putin what he is, what is the threat he and russia present to the united states and to the west. >> it's not a question of the threat they present to the west, david. it's a question of whether or not you're going to get the cooperation necessary in a way they have said they would. we're trying for the last time to see if that will be forthcoming at this moment or not. but obviously the additional sanctions are reflections of the president's exhaustion of patience with words that are not accompaniedy actions. going back to the meetings i had with mr. lavrov in geneva several -- a couple months ago

now, the fact is they agreed to do certain things and ukrainians agreed to do certain things. ukraine declared a soois fire. 26 soldiers were killed during the course of the cease-fire. we need russia to publicly, publicly, start to call for responsible action and itself take actions that they can take with the separatists they have encouraged, they have enflamed, they have supplied, they have trained and that are still engaged in a contest for the sovereignty of ukraine itself. russia said they would respect the sovereignty of ukraine. that is not respectful to be transferring those weapons. >> i detect in your words, mr. secretary, some reluctance to make this a one-on-one battle. you want to give russia a little bit more room here. the question is still about

consequences. how can anyone view this as anything other than the lowest moment between united states and russia in the post cold war environment. >> david, you can get into these grand proclamations about where things are and where they aren't. the fact is we live in an extremely complicated world right now where everybody is working on 10 different things simultaneously. russia is working with us in a cooperative way on the p five plus one. we just had important meetings in vienna. >> this is about iran's nuclear program. >> in order to try to deal with iran's nuclear program. russia was constructive and helpful and worked at that effort. russia has been constructive in helping to remove 100% of the declared chemical weapons from syria. in fact, that was an agreement we made months ago and it never faltered even during these moments of conflict. so this is more complicated than throwing names at each other and making declarations. there has to be a continued

effort to find a way forward. that's what we're trying to do. we made it clear, even as we do that, there's no naivete in what president obama has done with these sanctions. united states has been working diligently with europe trying to bring europe along. they have included additional sanctions. we think, frankly, they may need to be tougher. it may well be that the dutch and others will help lead that effort, because this has to be a wakeup call to europe that this has to change. we cannot continue with a dual track policy where diplomacy is winding up with nice words and, you know, well constructed communiques and agreements. but then there's a separate track where the same policy continues. this is a moment of truth for mr. putin and for russia.

russia needs to step up and prove it's bona fides to prove its willingness to put action behind words. >> the war is taking your time. what to gain between engagement of gaza and bombardment of gaza. >> this is a very difficult moment also and a difficult situation. israel has been under attack by rockets. i don't think any nation in the world would sit there while rockets are bombarding it and you know there are tunnels from which terrorists have come jumping up in the dead of night, some with handcuffs and tranquilizer drugs on them in an obvious effort to try to kidnap people and hold them for ransom. the fact is that is unacceptable by any standard anywhere in the world. israel has every right in the world to defend itself.

but we're helpful, very hopeful we can quickly find a way forward to put a cease-fire in place so that the underlying issues, so that we can get to the questions. but you cannot reward terrorism. there can't be a set of precondition demands that are going to be met. we support the egyptian initiative joined in by israel and others to have an immediate cease-fire, and we're working that cease-fire very, very hard. i have been in touch all day yesterday, day before, many days now, with my counter-parts. the president has been in touch with prime minister netanyahu i think day before yesterday. they will talk again today. i talked to prime minister netanyahu yesterday, and i believe the president wants me to go very, very shortly to the region in order to try to see if we can get a cease-fire in place. >> mr. secretary before you go, i want you to answer critics who accuse the president of an uncertain course in his foreign

policy. it harkens back to something the president wrote in his own book, audacity of hope, critical of the bush years. without a well articulated strategy the public supports and the world understands, america will lack the legitimacy and ultimately the power it needs to make the world safer than it is today. is that a problem president obama faces? >> no. let me tell you, what he faces is a problem with a bunch of critics who want to jump to conclusions without looking at the facts. the facts could not be more clear. the united states of america has never been more engaged in helping to lead in more places than we are now. i just came back from china where we are engaged with the chinese in dealing with north korea. you will notice since the visit last year, north korea has been quieter. we haven't done what we want to do yet with respect to the denuclearization but we are working on that moving forward. with respect to syria, we struck a deal where we got 100% of the chemical weapons out. with respect to iraq, we are

deeply involved now in the process of government formation helping the iraquis to be able to choose a government of unity. they can reunite, elect a speaker, about to elect a president. we believe that's moving forward. on afghanistan, we help strike a deal recently to help waring parties in the contest of the election to be able to come together and hold afghanistan together. with respect to iran. this president has taken the risk of putting together a negotiation for the first time in 10 years the iranian nuclear program is rolled backwards. israel and the region are safer than they were. we've negotiated a cease-fire in an effort to try to bring troops into south sudan. we've negotiated a disarming of the m23 rebel group and democratic republic of congo. we're negotiating a major economic treaty, a package trade agreement with europe. forty percent of the world's

gdp. same thing in asia. i would tell you something, david, one thing i've seen for certain, people aren't worried around the united states sitting there saying we want the united states to leave. people are worried that the united states might leave. the fact is that every fundamental issue of conflict today, the united states is in the center leading and trying to find an effort to make peace where peace is very difficult. i think the american people ought to be proud in terms of what this president has done in terms of peaceful, diplomatic engagement rather than quick trigger, deploying troops, starting or engaging in a war of choice. i think the president is on the right track and i think we have the facts to prove it. >> secretary kerry as always, thank you for your time. >> thank you. >> i'm joined now by republican senator lindsey graham of south carolina. senator, welcome back to the program. >> thank you. >> a lot to get to. let me start on the middle east and war in gaza.

there are reports this morning of a serious escalation in fighting with heavier casualties as israel has expanded its ground offensive. what are you hearing? >> i'm hearing there may be some israeli casualties coming from the tunnels where they come out into israel. my view of the israeli operation, stay as long as you need to stay, go wherever you need to go to deal with the viper's nest called hamas. it's not the number of casualties that determines the moral outcome here. there are more german soldiers that got killed than american soldiers. if i were israel, i would stay in gaza as long as i needed to to stop the rockets for good. >> when you see a ground operatio moving in this direction, and you see, again, an operation that may be resulting in heavier israeli casualties, what do you think that means? do you have any words of caution for israel at this point? do you think the government, the administration will seek to caution israel? >> i hope not.

my only words to the israeli government and people is clear it out. close the tunnels. shut down the rocket sites. stay as long as you need to stay. over 1500 rockets have been fired. the only reason there have been a few israeli casualties because of iron dome. if it was left up to hamas, thousands of israelis would be dead. i hope the international community will not find a moral equivalents here. do what you need to protect your people, stay as long as you need to stay. as for secretary kerry, he gave the most ridiculous and delusional summary of american foreign policy that i can imagine. it scares me he believes the world is in sup good shape. america is the glue that holds the free world together. leading from behind is not working. the world is adrift. president obama has become the king of indecision. his policies are failing across the globe and they will come here soon. >> senator, there's a lot to

unpack there. specifically with regard to russia. this crisis over the downing of the malaysia airlines flight, what did secretary kerry not say? what is the administration not yet prepared to do that you think must be done? >> one, he didn't call putin the thug that he is. he didn't call for arming the ukraine so they can defend themselves against rebel separatists supported by russia. all of the enemies of our nation are being well supplied. russia and iran are helping syria. 160,000 syrians have been slaughtered, john kerry, by russian supplied weapons to assad. syria has become a safe haven for terrorists to attack our nation. how about sanctions that would hit putin as an individual, their energy sector, their banking sector. the europeans are never going to lead on this issue. it's indispensable that america lead. there is a battle of wills between the kgb colonel and

community organizer and the colonel is winning. >> there is, you heard from secretary kerry, this kind of knee jerk response he would lay at your feet and others who call for a more robust military action. is that really what you see here or is it working with europeans for the kind of sanctions that you think can actually work to cripple the economy in russia? >> good point. nothing knee jerk is going on here. indecision reigns. president obama is trying to be deliberative. it comes off as indecisive. he's trying to be thoughtful. it comes off as weakness. i'm suggesting sanction that is go after putin individually, the energy sector in russia, the banking sector in russia. i'm suggesting that we arm the ukrainians so they can defend themselves. i'm suggesting we put more nato troops surrounding ukraine, that we rebuild missile defense systems obama took down to let

putin know the path of least resistance is not to continue to dismember ukraine. >> i've got about 20 seconds, crisis on the border, immigration reform. this is an international problem but also a big political issue as well. is your party prepared to move with the president on this? >> there will be no money for supplemental without changes in the 2008 law. we have to streamline and quicken deportations. there will be no immigration reform because of the crisis on the border. i blame obama for this moment. but in 2015 if we start over and the republican party doesn't get immigration reform right in 2015 and the house should lead, not the senate, our chances in 2016 of winning the white house are very low. >> senator graham with a lot of reaction to what we've heard this morning. senator, as always, thank you. >> thank you. >> reaction from our political roundtable. andrea mitchell still with us, ron we covered the white house

during bush presidency. author of the new book "please stop helping us, how liberals make it harder for blacks to succeed." amy walter national editor of the cook political report. welcome to all of you. ron, the president's response. two visions here of how he's dealing with russia in this moment, another crisis. how do you see it? >> first of all, lets make clear, of course, putin is the thug here. of course, it's very complicated what's happening between israel and palestinians. what we have here is a president for better and worse partly reflecting american sentiment really has not tried to impose his will and vision on the global community. what we have here are consequences in part of an aloof foreign policy. >> you have the secretary of state saying it's not as simple as calling people out. it appears to me they are giving putin some room. maybe that is silly but they are giving him some room to step up

and diffuse the crisis. >> it makes it easier than having to do what senator graham is asking for, to arm the public. the public is not there at all. where the public is on this, they want to see somebody who looks bold, who is going out and calling people out as thugs or whatever we want to call them, but we don't want a consequence to that. they don't want a foreign policy that looks like bush's foreign policy. he's in a bind. the public lost confidence in what the president is doing. they lost it when the website crashed and he has not gotten it back. >> editorializing, is the president calling out the russian government for what it is and really spelling out what america is prepared to do about it. >> no, he's not. that's called leadership. he's not leading. vladimir putin is rebuilding the russian empire. obama is worried about maintaining a lightfoot print internationally. what happens is a void, a power vacuum is created.

people like vladimir putin are more than happy to make mischief here. senator graham mentioned syria. i think there was a turning point. we set a red line, assad ignored it. there were no consequences. putin was taking note. he not only took note, he took crimea. there have been no consequences. >> andrea, how do you read where the add manage is headed. >> i agree sia was the turning point last weekend it was interpreted in the gulf and around the world as ineffective american leadership. the problem is drawing a red line. i understand why critics think the president's rhetoric on friday was not even up to the moral outrage expressed by samantha power. it was a more forceful presentation at the united nations than the president. what you spotted is they are trying to leave some running room with vladimir putin. they know they have to deal with him. angela merkel is not where the president is.

even the dutch up to the last 24 hours have not been. they have sided with putin. >> on gaza, another area of leadership, secretary kerry saying he's prepared to go there quickly. go to do what? >> that is the other problem. they have been prepared. their bags have been packed. israel and gift have the cease-fire that mahmoud abbas was buying into but not hamas. israel will not go with negotiations that turkey is trying to launch. who to negotiatew there is some talk secretary kerry wasn't even desired in the region, not even by israel because it wasn't clear what he could do. israel wanted something more accomplished on the ground. they have suffered casualties among its military and that is going to potentially escalate it. >> we'll take a break and come back with all of you in a moment. we're later going to go to a midwestern town embroiled in a dispute over a plan to bring child immigrants there. chuck todd with the story who is

ready for hillary and who isn't. just what did chris christie mean by this? >> lets not let up, lets work as hard as we can the next 110 days and i'll see you back soon. thank you very much. and i'll see you back soon. thank you very much. >> announcer: if energy could come from anything?. or if power could go anywhere? or if light could seek out the dark? what would happen if that happens? anything.

coming up here, running the numbers for 2016, who is already in a good position for a 2016 race for the white house? our chuck todd has the latest nbc news polls. >> announcer: "meet the press" is brought to you by the my name is karen and i have diabetic nerve pain. it's progressive pain. first that feeling of numbness. then hot pins. almost like lightning bolts, hot strikes into my feet. so my doctor prescribed lyrica. the pain has been reduced and i feel better than i did before.

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low dues... great terms... let's close. introducing at&t mobile share value plans... ...with our best-ever pricing for business. we're back. the news of the week has overshadowed interesting political maneuvers ahead of the 2016 race for the white house. potential candidates were out in early voting states this week signaling their intentions and some new polling provides interesting insights into the race. our political director chuck todd with his takeaways. >> reporter: for most of us, summer travel takes us to theme parks or beaches. for presidential wannabes is anywhere they can find potential supporters. this week particularly busy. chris christie, joe biden and elizabeth warren and hillary

clinton finishing her book tours. good and bad news for hopefuls on both sides. here are three key takeaways. number one, democrats are ready for hillary. in head-to-head match-ups clinton handily leads joe biden in most states by 50 or more points. take a look at these favorable ratings among democrats, 89% in iowa and 90% in new hampshire. as excited as democrats are, it's not going to be a cake walk in these two swing states in a general. in head-to-head match-ups with six potential republicans, the race tightens substantially. while she's tied or leads all of them, she didn't do any better than 50% against anybody. the republican that runs best against her is kentucky senator rand paul. that's our second takeaway. the senator is the closest thing republicans have to a 2016 front-runner. what gives him the label?

the highest in any states, leads in horse race not including undecided vote and runs best against hillary clinton. it's not just good poll numbers. he's been very strategic in the last six months. he hired rick santorum's manager, teamed with cory booker and backed a policy more popular with the public. this could mean paul will be an early target of established republicans all of next year. the third takeaway, chris christie has a lot of work to do. the new jersey governor has the heightest negative ratings among any of his rivals and that's among republicans. that's why he's pledging to come back to the state a lot. >> i'll see you back in iowa soon. >> all this activity and a mere 560 days away for iowa caucuses. for "meet the press," chuck todd, nbc news washington. back to the roundtable to talk about the politics of the

moment, still away from 2016. i want to pick up on chuck's point, rand paul, does he look like a republican front-runner this far out. if he does, he represents libertarian wing of the republican policy on foreign policy, such a big foreign policy week this is. you were saying that's striking to you. >> it is. particularly views on foreign policy don't sit well with republicans. >> where is dick cheney. >> in fact, rand paul's views on foreign policy isn't that different from president obama in terms of disengagement. he doesn't loo like to put it that way. the gop bench is deeper than democratic bench. it's basically hillary or bust. i was surprised how well jeb bush and chris christie are doing. in republican circles there are deal breakers supposedly, immigration with jeb bush and moderation on climate change and gun control with chris christie.

voters seem to be telling pollster otherwise. >> president obama channeling the american public and looking weak. rand paul channeling american public, even a big part of republican sentiment now seeing the party make him look weak. >> the other thing where hillary clinton stands on foreign policy. she may be a big guide to president obama and his views. >> i don't know americans are looking at phone policy, midterm elections but even right now thinking about elections, there are number one concern is the economy. i think that's the bigger problem for hillary clinton. she's going to have to come in the wake of the obama presidency. his approval ratings quite weak, his handling of the economy quite weak. there's no sign the economy is going to suddenly catch fire by the time we hit 2015. that is going to be a bigger weight on her than what's happening overseas. >> real quick, pushing russian reset button.

>> i do think elizabeth warren is a real issue here. she was greeted as such a celebrity at this conference. >> huge -- >> she was all but a candidate. she can say what she wants about not running. if there were a slip or if there were any reason where hillary clinton has to take a step back and if the foreign policy becomes an issue, which she has to own part of -- >> i think there have been slips, on the book tour talking about her personal wealth. those are unforced errors. i think the elizabeth warren folks see an opening. on the left, how big is the problem president obama is too conservative. that's who elizabeth warren would be going after. i don't know how many they are. >> one other thing about the economy being everything here. leadership is the issue. it's leadership whether it's on foreign policy or the economy. >> that's true.

>> she's not projecting. >> but liberals like hillary clinton right now. they like her more than they did in 2007 and 2008. they are coalesced behind her. they believe it's her turn. they like somebody that's change, different. you're seeing it on both sides. that's why rand paul is exciting. >> if hillary clinton doesn't run -- >> let me ask you about republican party. chris christie is having a tough go in our poll as chuck todd described. he had a pretty good trip to iowa as people aren't as concerned about traffic over the gw bridge as the media might be. >> actually i think it helped him with conservatives. any time the media takes you on it's a good thing. long-term the fact federal prosecutors are still looking at him. until he gets out from under him and squares that with his authenticity brand, he's got a problem here. >> he's a blue state governor. that in and of itself says to conservatives i don't know if we can trust him.

that was a bigger concern long before gw bridge. >> i hear over and over again from republicans jeb bush will not run. a lot of his activity about helping his son george p. as we know land commissioner in texas had a hard time covering texas politics, that could run for governor and beyond that. is that the feeling? >> it could be true. it could be true. what christie has going for him is money. a lot of financers have backed him. if the bridge scandal, prosecutions pick up, the money will go away. the question is where will it go. that's when the real pressure on jeb bush to do something. >> the thing about jeb bush, considering his names, the polls in the teens is really telling. he's the most known candidate out there and yet very far back in the field. he should be by his name front-runner. >> the republican party about how represents pure conservative values in the age of the tea party, mitt romney was still the

nominee last time. republicans still want to nominate someone who they think can win. is that going to fall to rand paul? do you think that mission he's got can carry? >> my first and second instinct is no. but we're living in a time of politics you can't predict anything. we're living in a time of society you can't change anything. look how everything has changed in a few short years. who knows. >> i want to talk about immigration. we heard from senator graham who had an interesting point. we know this is another big challenge for president obama. he's got this immigration prize at the border. the number of unaccompanied children from central america crossing the u.s. is slow but still leaves tens of thousands in the country and in limb bochlt the debate over what should happen is ranging a long way from the border. kevin tibbles went to davenport, iowa, a town trying to decide whether to accept some of these child immigrants. it's this week's "meeting america." >> reporter: on a clear july

afternoon in davenport, iowa, the sights and sounds and smells of summer waft up from the banks of the mississippi river. and even though it sits some 1500 miles from the southern border, america's immigration crisis is the subject of much agitation and debate. >> i don't want them here. >> we have to take care of them. >> davenport's mayor says he wants to shelter many of the young undocumented arrivals here in his town. for more than 65 years, the gentry shop and its rainbow of color and selection has been the place to go for those seeking an exact fit. the owner tailers with a keen eye. >> compassionately as a father of four, i understand the needs of children. we have laws in place that are here to help us deal with what

we have. he does not support the housing of those who have come here illegally. >> washington needs to get this immigration under control. random placement of individuals in random places doesn't seem to me to be the way to find a long-term answer for these people. >> reporter: alderman is an opponent of the plan. >> i said i'll stand in front of the buses if i have to to stop them. i'm not the only one. >> at the coffee grind baristas grind and blend for customers who drop by to sit and chap. byron brown supports the mayor. >> i think the mayor should try to bring 5,000 of them here. i don't see how anyone could turn their back on an unaccompanied child. >> reporter: brown who sent 20 years in the army said it's time america stepped up. >> one thing people look to the united states for that's a sense of hope.

once we stop giving that beacon of hope to the world, in my opinion, we cease to exist. that's not what our country was founded on. if someone doesn't come in and help the children, they are going to be exploited. >> if they see there are cities such as davenport that are accepting these people in, the word gets back really fast and they will send more of them. >> then the sobering question of who pays and why? >> reality is a rough issue at times. we don't live in that society where we get to pick and choose. the law is the law. >> in davenport, as elsewhere in america, it's a dilemma not easily sewn up. for "meet the press," kevin tibbles. >> the roundtable is back with this. i've talked to administration officials who say, gosh, it's so hard to think about sending children back. it makes this issue so complicated. >> what also makes it complicated, a big story in the "washington post," the administration has known about this quite sometime.

i think that's where the frustration continues to bubble over with the president's handling. if you knew about this in the middle of the campaign trying to pass comprehensive reform, can we trust you'll handle this. >> the front lines with towns like davenport struggling and others, too, we're going to be a compassionate people. we can't turn them away. >> there's a division in the administration between those who say compassion are should come first. others say you have to deal with border enforcement. the political context of this. the bottom line is the president has to show more engagement. people are saying i think that that photo-op. >> lindsey graham says no more money. who owns this as a political liability. >> right now the president has to. the compassionate thing to do is

prevent countries sending kids. that means putting the right incentives. under the bush administration we had the same problem of brazilians coming. the bush administration made a big show of sending them back. word spread. >> if this was happening anywhere else in the country, we'd be passing the plate raising money, pushing countries to take refugees. instead our political system is broken. we have both parties from the far right and far left pushing for extreme options. we have the president of the united states asleep at the switch. everyone owns this one. >> i think he wants the issue. >> we're going to leave it there. thank you very much. coming up here, a huge loss to science after some of the world's leading aids experts loss their lives. i'm going to speak to world

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one day, factories will work with the cloud. one day... is today. >> these were men and women who had dedicated their own lives to the lives of saving others, and they were taken from us in a

senseless act of violence. >> that was president obama friday remembering the world's top aids experts who lost their lives on malaysia airlines flight 17 heading to the international aids conference in melbourne, australia. among those killed was renowned aids researcher, former president of the international aids society. his loss and the loss of five others leave a lasting impact on the future of aids work and global health. here with me to remember his friends and colleagues is the director of national institute of allergy and infectious institutes of health. he was also at the conference in melbourne. doctor, welcome. we have been talking about geo politics with regard to this disaster. you give us the insight into the aching personal loss so many people are feeling. >> well, it's really permeating the meeting, david.

i just came out of the opening ceremony and a feeling of sadness and loss, despite the fact there's many people in hiv research and advocacy, it's a really rather close-knit community. we focus on one particular disease, one particular virus. he was very well-known, an extraordinary personality. i've known him and been working with him close to 30 years. he's really had a major impact among europeans and even worldwide. he has been a very strong advocate for getting treatment particularly for those people who are in most need. in fact, he's well-known for saying years and years ago if we can get coca-cola to the remote parts of africa and elsewhere, why can't we get hiv drugs there. he's constantly pushing. he was an inspirational thought leader and his loss felt by

those of us here. >> you've been working most of your career on trying to combat hiv and aids. can you put into words as you think about your colleagues, you think about the work at this conference, what has been lost? >> well, what has been lost are really extraordinary colleagues. activists who have been in it from the very beginning pushing the envelope. he has made contributions clinically. one of the most important things he's done for the field is an inspirational thought leader. someone very, very passionate about it always pushing you to do more. it's that kind of constant tension he led to the field i'm going to miss personally. he was constantly pushing me and my colleagues to do more and better. it's that kind of inspiration all of us are going to miss. it's really a terribly sad day

here in australia. >> what is the one area in your work that you focus on with renewed zeal given the loss of these colleagues? >> it's just to get better treatments and treatment to the people who need it. globally we have the drugs. he was involved with the clinical trials to prove it works. the real goal is to get people care, treatment, not only to save their own lives but bring the virus to the point they will make it less likely to in effect other people. that's what we're all striving for. >> thank you so much, doctor, i appreciate it. >> you're welcome. we'll be back here with the big question that's going to be we'll be back here with the big question that's going to be driving the political debate we'll be back here with the bias parents we hold our kids'e dhands when crossing the street so think of the internet as the world's busiest street. teach your kids to surf and post responsibly. they'll be safer

with a dedicated crossing guard... the more you know. . here now some of this week's

images to remember. here nows images to remember. >> powerful images this week and big milestones are images to remember. we've got the big question that's going to be the big debate all week long, is vladimir putin a threat to the world? jason, is that how he must be understood? >> absolutely. why is he going to stop at ukraine. if russia speakers are the justification, protecting, why aren't the baltic states next. >> what does real western opposition look like, andrea? >> weak. really weak. they are more interested in their economic -- >> what should it look like,

then. >> strong sanctions, energy, banking, all the rest of it, the arms deals. you don't see it. in fact, france and italy have been pulling back against merkel and uk. >> it's interesting, ron, people don't like to make comparisons to hitler. david cameron wrote, europeans should remember our history. that was not so veiled. >> i won't compare anybody to tler. there's no doubt he's a threat to the world. a bully is a threat on any playground. the way you handle the bully, draw a line, say what you're going to do. when they cross the line, you do it. the west has not done that. president obama has not done that. >> the question is what to do. that's what is elusive. you heard from secretary kerry today. we don't want to get into the name calling business here. sounds like they are giving him room to step up. >> to see if he can step up and do what? when people flying on airplanes 33,000 feet in the air feel that they are not safe, that's a

threat to the world. >> so ultimately western opposition looks like what? not how does it look now but what does it have to be? >> there's many things we can do. we can arm ukrainians to fight back, stop exporting energy supply so russia customers know there will be alternatives whether europeans or so forth. we can do that. >> we'll leave it there. you can find our big question and weigh in on the debate on our facebook page. that's all for today. we'll be back next week. if it's sunday, it's "meet the press."

. max levchin, chairman, billionaire and mathematician uses big data to help couples get pregnant. plus, blogger founder lisa stone on the next generation of women bloggers. our reporters pendo daily's sara lacy and martin giles from the economy this week on "press here." >> good morning, everyone. it says a great deal about any motorcycles guest is that most remarkable thing about max isn't that he's involved in getting thousands of women pregnant. his biggest claim to fame is right here in this now