this sunday, omarosa, one-on-one. they met on "the apprentice." >> i adore you. we've had tremendous success together. >> absolutely. >> in 2016, she campaigned for him. >> let's make mr. trump the next president of the united states! >> and mocked his critics. >> it is the ultimate revenge to become the most powerful man in the universe. >> as president, donald trump said, you're hired at the white house. but now she says mr. trump used the "n" word at "the apprentice." >> it had finally sunk in that the person i thought i'd known so well for so long was actually a racist. >> there's also this -- >> his mental decline could not

be denied. >> and she has a recording of her firing by john kelly. >> is the president aware of this? >> don't do -- let's not go down the road. this is a nonnegotiable discussion. is this a rare look inside of the trump white house or the work of a disgruntled employee humiliated by her firing? this morning my interview with omarosa. plus, midterm preview -- what that neck and neck special election in a red district in ohio tells us about a possible blue wave republicans may be facing in november. i talk with ohio's republican governor john kasich, who may take on president trump in 2020. joining me for insight and analysis are nbc news white house correspondent kristen welker, "new york times" columnist david brooks, former democratic congresswoman donna edwards, and former republican governor of north carolina, pat mccrory. welcome to sunday. it's "meet the press."

good sunday morning. she was a reality tv star who wound up working in a reality tv star's white house. by her own admission, omarosa and donald trump used each other. in her new book, omarosa writes, "donald and i had a symbiotic relationship as i've said. i gave him ratings and he gave me, a woman of color, opportunities. that relationship started on the apren tis in 2004 and continued through a series of reality tv shows. >> i adore you. we've had tremendous success together. you helped make me a star. dennis, she helped make me a star. but omarosa, you're feared.

>> in 2016, she joined the trump campaign as director of african-american outreach. on the trail and subsequently as the most senior african-american woman on the white house staff. and she became one of mr. trump's most vocal supporters. >> when i say trump train, i want you want to say choo-choo. y'all ready? every critic, every detractor will have to bow down to president trump. i had the honor to travel around the country with the president for the last two years. you all know him as the president. i know him as a friend. i know his heart. >> but since she was fired in december, she's turned on president trump and now in her new book she calls him a racist, a bigot and a misogynist and said he's losing his mental faculties. the white house said this is riddled with lies it's sad that a disgruntled former white house employee is trying to profit off these false attacks. and omarosa has a recording that she says she recently made -- that she secretly made of her firing by john kelly. >> we want to talk to you about leaving the white house.

it's come to my attention over the last few months that there's been some pretty in my opinion significant integrity issues. >> you'll hear more of that recording in a moment. so omarosa manigault newman, former assistant to mr. trump, joins me now. >> thank you for having me, chuck. >> welcome to "meet the press." let me start with what you describe as a year-long effort to learn the truth about a rumor that donald trump had been caught on tape using the "n" word on the "the apprentice." here's how you wrote about confirming with a source, page 322 of your book. on this phone conversation i was told exactly what donald trump said, yes, the "n" word and others in a classic trump goes nuclear rant. and when he said them during production he was miked and there's definitely an audio track. for over a year i was so afraid of hearing the specifics of someone from the room, hearing the truth freed from that fear. did you hear the tape or did you

hear a description of the tape? >> well, first of all, thank you for having me on. and in this book, i describe this long journey of hearing these rumors over and over again. and when i had an opportunity to meet up with three different sources, they described the same exact statements. after i closed the book, i had an opportunity to go out in los angeles and sit down with the person who actually has a copy of the tape and i heard his voice as clear as you and i are sitting here. >> you have heard the tape? >> i have heard the tape -- >> since publication of this book? >> absolutely. >> so you know it exists? >> i know it exists, and what i regret is that these people are trying to leverage it as this october surprise. i don't want to be a part of that. but i had heard for two years that it existed, and once i heard it for myself it was confirmed what i feared the most -- that donald trump is a con and has been masquerading as someone who is open to engaging with diverse communities.

but when he talks that way, the way he did on this tape, it confirmed that he is truly a racist. >> why didn't you get that in your book? >> it closed too soon and this person is so afraid because of the forces who are working to keep this tape from coming out. i mean, we first heard about it in the fall of 2016, got on a conference call with katrina pierson, lynne patton and jason miller as you will see in the book, and they all suspected it was true. in fact, katrina pearson, the spokeswoman for the campaign, said he said it. it's true. >> she never heard him say it. she's denied the -- >> i mean, she knows i have receipts. i think she should probably read the book first and then hear herself saying it. >> before listening to that tape, before getting the tape that you described, had you -- were you ever in his presence when he used a racial slur? >> you know, i was in his presence when he said inappropriate things but never used the "n" word in my presence

ever. >> let me move on. you said that the betrayal -- the idea that he might have used this word, that it would be this betrayal because he might have used it about you. >> absolutely. >> do you believe he used it about you? >> possibly. because donald trump talks about everyone behind their backs. you leave the room, he has something for you. he has a nickname for everyone in his administration and his circle. i'm certain he's said derogatory things about me. in fact, yesterday, on this moment before charlottesville, the anniversary of charlottesville, instead of talking about how to unify the nation he actually insulted me by calling me a low-life. that is a man who is inclined to start racially charged engagement and use race to kind of stir up his base. >> here's what i think a lot of people are going to have trouble with. he has said a lot of racial things. he said a lot of racial things during the campaign, calling

mexicans rapists. attacking a federal judge because he was hispanic. you talk about his obsession with the, quote, central park five mythology there. retweeting false crime statistics. you said -- you acknowledge he did things that were racial, that he used race to manipulate people. you have said all those things and then you wrote this in december of 2016. "i'm living the american dream because of donald trump. look at the wealth and the exposure that i had. it's hard to make the argument that donald trump doesn't like black people and black women." >> absolutely. being used for donald trump for so long i was like the frog in the hot water. you don't know that you're in that situation until it keeps bubbling and bubbling. it is clear in hindsight because it's of course 20/20. as i talk about in "unhinged," you see from 2003 when i first met donald trump the evolution of a very unique relationship

between he and i. and i talk intimately about the things that he said. his pledge to do more for the community. his, as i said, investment in my own career. but what i know now i didn't have the benefit of -- in 2003 or 2004 or 2010. so yes, it is hindsight. but i will say this to you. i was complicit with this white house deceiving this nation. they continue to deceive this nation by how mentally declined he is. how difficult it is for him to process complex information. how he has not engaged in some of the most important decisions that impacts our country. i was complicit and for that i regret. >> one of the moments complicity took place after charlottesville. this is the president -- the day after charlottesville, he condemned the egregious display of hatred, bigotry and violence on many sides. this is before he said the both sides comment. he had already used the phrase many sides. two days later you were on fox news defending him. here's what you said. >> president trump, he said that he condemned the acts. he knew that they were disgusting and loathsome.

but he did not come out until the facts were known about the investigation, and today he made a statement that was very clear and very decisive about where he stood on these acts. >> what do you think of that, omarosa? >> absolutely. i mean as you said -- >> was that complicit? >> totally complicit. in fact, i had a blind spot where it came to donald trump. i wanted to see the best in him. and obviously i failed miserably because after that he gets up and he says that there are good people on both sides when he should have been denouncing what we saw as clearly racist, nazis, going against the grain of this country. and it's just really difficult to see that i was so much a part of this. and i accept and i admit that i was. but now i think it's important that as we are celebrating -- well, actually observing the anniversary of charlottesville that he has an opportunity actually to bring the country together. but you'll see that he doesn't have the ability to do that

because he puts himself over country every day. >> here's what many people are saying though. that after charlottesville you didn't resign. and yes, you wanted to work on the -- i think historic black college initiative. >> that would have been big. >> i understand that. but then you didn't leave after that. you didn't leave after he had that unfortunate call with the widow of the dead soldier. you didn't leave after he called kneeling nfl players s.o.b.s. and this is what was written in "the new yorker" about your new perspective. "her realization about the trump's outlook appears to have emerged during her book deal. that's not a gradual awakening. it's a glacial self-interested one." there's many people here that say you're now identifying himself as a racist after you got your book deal. what do you say to the criticism? >> first of all, i need to push back about that. first of all i'm an author. this is my third book. i write about my life and so the assertion that i woke up and decided to write a book when

it's my third book, i have to push on that. but certainly i was working to try to find someone who could take my place. i was the only african-american at the table. if i left, which i did, when i left, there has been no new appointment of an african-american assistant to the president, which means that people are making decisions about us without us. and as i worked to try to find that replacement, i realized that they could care less about having an african-american voice at the table. and to this day, there is no one serving in that administration in the role that i was in and that's a great void. so the people who want to judge should probably read the book first and give me an opportunity to at least examine the journey that i was on before making decisions and judgments about my story. >> i have heard the -- >> they should read it first. >> you know, part of the reason that you're there is to stand in front of the racial freight train and that you didn't -- you didn't do that. that -- you have admitted that you were complicit --

>> i described myself as a guardrail in the book. i'm not -- >> were you a good guardrail? >> i got banged up a lot. i got banged up by people who thought there should be no african-americans in this administration and they're seeing the result of having absolutely no voice, that it is impacting the policies that affect our children, inner cities, policies that inform all the things that are happening in regards to crime, particularly in chicago as we see the deaths. without a voice there you're going to continue to see them neglect the needs of a community that really does need leadership right now. >> all right. i want to go to your white house time. we'll start on your last day. were you fired or did you resign? what's the story? what do we call this? >> it's pretty clear from that recording that john kelly came in and said, this is the end. we want you to leave. but what's interesting is they take me into the situation room. the doors are locked. they tell me i can't leave. and they start to threaten me,

put fear in me, to put me under duress. >> look, i want to play this tape. i'm curious, how is it -- you recorded the chief of staff -- >> absolutely. >> the white house chief of staff in the situation room. >> yes. >> this takes place before the -- >> in the situation room. >> you prepared in a moment's notice to record him -- >> no, first of all. i'm the only african-american there. when you walk into the meeting with john kelly who's refused to meet with me the whole time he's there, in the situation room, chuck, we're not going in there to talk about, you know, parking or scheduling issues. >> you knew this was -- >> we're going in there to talk about something very serious. >> you prepared to tape. >> i was prepared because first of all john kelly had been very vocal about trying to find a reason to let me go. he had gone to the press instead of coming to me, never giving me an opportunity to meet with him. so the question is why not have the meeting in the chief of staff's office? why put me in the situation room, lock the door, and tell me over and over again, you'll hear his part, that i couldn't leave? that i couldn't consult an

attorney? that i couldn't talk to my husband who was sitting outside of the door? yes, i was prepared. and as you'll see in "unhinged" -- >> how often did you tape people? >> wait, chuck. in "unhinged" i protected myself. because this is a white house where everybody lies. the president lies to the american people. sarah huckabee lies every single day. you have to have your own back because otherwise you'll look back and see 17 knives in your back. >> do you know how it looks that you taped people? >> it's not disloyalty. let me tell you, chuck, if i did not have this recording, people would still believe the false incredible story that i was running around the white house -- the false story that was told by a reporter and repeated by this network and other reporters that i tried to charge the residence at the white house. that's a lie. if i didn't have this recording, listen, people would still think that i was trying to set off alarms. so yes, i had to protect myself and i have no regret about it. >> let's listen to the recording. >> i think it's important to understand that if we make this

a friendly departure, we can all be -- you know, you can look at your time here in the white house as a year of service to the nation. and then you can go on without any type of difficulty in the future relative to your reputation. >> how did you take that comment about your reputation? >> it's very obvious a threat. he goes on to say that things can get ugly for you. the chief of staff of the united states under the direction of the president of the united states threatening me on damage to my reputation and things getting ugly for me. that's downright criminal. if i didn't have the recordings no one in america would believe me. no one. so i protected and i'm going to tell you i'm so glad i did. now we can put to bed all the false rumors that that one reporter stated and the false reports spread around by the media. >> all right. let me play the portion where you jump in and have a conversation with mr. kelly. >> please. >> can i ask you a couple questions? is the president aware of this?

>> let's no go down the road. this is a non-negotiable discussion. >> i don't want to negotiate. i never had a chance to talk to you, general kelly. so if this is my departure i want an opportunity to understand -- >> we can talk another time. this has to do with serious integrity violations so i'll let it go at that. this staff and everyone on this staff works for me, not the president. >> you have made no bones about it that you have a lot of tapes. >> wait. he just said the staff and everybody works for him, not the president. you don't have a problem with that, chuck? >> for what it's worth, many white houses are organized like that where the chief of staff -- >> it tells you donald trump has no idea what's going on in the white house. >> he did not know that minute that you -- >> no, i know he knows because i have talked to him subsequently. he said he delegated. i delegated. so he knew. he knew that john kelly was going to take me into the situation room and lock me in there, threaten me and say that things were going to get ugly

for me, there would be damage to me reputation, you know what, the next day there was damage to my reputation because they used and exploited an african-american reporter to say i was running around the residence and trying to break into the christmas party which is ludicrous, chuck. it is unacceptable. that's the way these folks operate. when he said that people answer to him and not the president, that should be concerning for every single american that hears that. >> let me ask you about the integrity issues that he brought up. if the white house asked for permission to release your file -- >> i would love for them to do it. i'm saying this light right here on "meet the press" -- >> release the hr file of whatever violation -- >> please, let's bring it all to light. i'm saying right here on "meet the press," you took a car to the national baseball game -- >> so if the white house released the -- >> release it. absolutely. >> transgression that john kelly -- >> absolutely. because in the same breath, rob porter is accused of allegedly abusing his wives, and you know

what kelly said, he's a man of great integrity. he's accusing me of integrity violations. i'm saying, please release it so the american people can see i worked my butt off to work for the country and they were looking for ways to frame me, and they tried to buy off my silence which is also unlawful. >> i want to get to that in a second. but the "daily beast" in 2017 -- >> are we really quoting the "daily beast" on "meet the press"? >> i want to ask you this. it says you were called the most despised person in the white house, that you'd hijack the white house meetings, you would distract president trump with negative news coverage. could that be why john kelly fired you? >> at least they didn't call me the coffee girl. that's an upgrade to their usual go-to excuses they make when they mistreat people. people despise that i was close to the president that i had access to him, that i talked to him often and influenced his policy making. i will admit to you, chuck,

there were times donald trump asked me to do things that were down right bizarre. he said, go pull an article about joe scarborough and mika. i want to know about this and that. i wondered why he asked me. i wasn't his press secretary. he was working around the people who would -- >> and the negative coverage -- >> i was giving him whatever -- when the president calls you and says get this and that for me, i did it. yes, i was one of the people feeding him the things he's asked for, because he's the president of the united states. when he calls and asks, you answer. >> you talked about you were offered a job on the campaign. you have shown me the e-mail offer, i have read the offer that you received from laura trump. >> it wasn't from lara trump. it was e-mailed from the campaign. >> from the campaign. >> yes. >> and i want to put up the nondisclosure agreement here. it is a very stringent one. it said this, the no disparagement clause during the term of your service and after, you agree not to disparage the campaign. mr. trump, mr. pence. any trump or pence company.

any trump or pence family member. any trump or pence family member company or an asset, any of the foregoing -- by the way to avoid any doubt at the bottom of the graph, you agree that this shall survive the termination of this agreement pursuant to paragraph 10. did you think they were offering you a real job on the campaign or did they want you to sign this agreement? >> they were not offering a real job. they told me i could work from home if i wanted to work. they didn't really care if i showed up. in fact, there are several former employees from the white house who actually signed this agreement, who are all being paid $15,000 for their silence. the only reason "unhinged" -- >> you believe all the people on the campaign are being -- that left the west wing of the campaign are being bought off? >> absolutely. the campaign, the rnc, and america first, which is why sean spicer described the president as a unicorn jumping over rainbows, because he signed this agreement. >> you read "the art of the

deal" and he said the final key is the way i promote the bravado. it's an effective form. anywhere in this book, when you have donald trump chewing up a piece of paper, anything here truthful hyperbole? >> i have a treasure trove of documentation for everything you see in this book. people should be asking what did donald trump and michael cohen discuss to make him so irritated to rip up the paper that was in front of him and then put it in his mouth? that's the question that the american people should be asking. what went down in the oval office. >> all right. what do you want people to take away from the book? >> i need person to understand my journey. i talk about growing up in the projects, i talk about my father being murdered, my beautiful mother who allowed me to go on and get educated and live an incredible life. this story isn't a story that

you would hear if in fact i subdued to those threats and signed that agreement. this is a story that you have to hear because it's the embodiment of the american dream. >> do you regret auditioning for "the apprentice"? >>, i -- no, i don't. it changed my life. i wouldn't have gotten a chance to know you and others in my life. i don't regret it out all. >> omarosa, you'll get a lot of arrows, not easy to put you out there. good luck with your book tour. thanks for coming on "meet the press." >> thanks for having me, chuck. >> i should mention you'll be on the "today" show tomorrow. live exclusively there as well. the panel will be here and we'll talk about everything we just heard. stay with us. ♪ i was able to turn the aircraft around, and the mission around, and was able to save two men's lives that night. my first job helped me to grow up pretty quickly. that'll happen when you're asked to respond to a coup. in 2001, i signed up for the air force.

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kristen welker and "new york times" columnist david brooks. david, where do you do from here? donald trump/omarosa. >> everybody is dirty here that's what strikes me. it's the snake pit in the white house, as she said, everybody is lying to each other. everybody behaving kind of despicably. firing people in whatever manner. trump delegating. it's just a lowering thing to hear about the way that this white house works. we have heard it over and over again and to me the dangerous thing it gets -- it's all intermixed with the most sensitive subject in american history which is race. >> yeah. >> and so you combine poisonous politics with racial bigotry and unfairness, and it could get very ugly. if this tape exists and it comes out in october, that will put race in the middle of the election in an explosive way. the one thing i take away from this, a lot of my friends are trump supporters, i don't pay attention to the nonsense, i like the policies.

nobody remembers where george wallace stood on tax reform and that's what matters. >> kristen, was her description of her time in the white house and what you have seen in the book, was it familiar? >> well, it was. and the couple of things struck me. one, i go back to some of the early days the tensions that existed between omarosa and some of the top officials there who felt as though she overpromise and underdelivered. she would push back on that assessment but she said something that struck me. once she left, there's really been no one who's replaced her. i spent the weekend on the phone with a number of officials trying to say who is now the point person for the african-american community? who is directing this outreach? and there is no name. they say hey, wait a minute, look at the policies. the african-american unemployment has come down. we're working on prison reform and we're coordinating with leaders within the community on that. but again, chuck, there's no one in the white house who is taking the charge and i think that's going to be increasingly a problem for them. >> governor, you spent a lot of time on talk radio so you hear

from the trump base. how are they going to react to this? >> i don't think they're going to trust her. i don't trust her. being a former governor and mayor i wouldn't trust anyone who secretly recorded the chief of staff and other employees and we don't how many other employees during her tenure in the white house. it's unprofessional and unethical from journalism to business to politics. and i think doing that is terrible. i might add i thought -- >> where do you think she learned it from though? is she right -- a cesspool top down. everything goes. >> you didn't hear from the chief of staff. the chief of staff handled that extremely professionally. my chief of staff when i was governor who was african-american fired people on my behalf and they took them out of the office. you do this in all work environments. you do this in all work environments. if you have been in the west wing it's a very small west wing. there are not many rooms to go to and the situation room is probably a good room to go to by. by the way i recognize the --

i'd recommend the white house hire thomas stiff, he would be an excellent communicator for the white house. >> donna, how is the african-american community going to react to her and the questions like you hear now? >> i think it's a mixed bag because she knew about donald trump from housing discrimination to the central park five to the mexicans as rapists to charlottesville. i mean, the list -- birtherism. the list is so long so there's nothing that african-americans are going to take from that and say, well, you know, why is this your -- you know, your come to reality moment? many of us knew those things about donald trump before and we're not surprised to hear them. and we don't understand -- i don't understand why she's surprised either. >> look, we have the protesters coming today, we don't know if

they'll create a charlottesville like atmosphere. the riots in charlottesville a year ago resulted in senseless death and division. we must come together as a nation. twitter, is this the way to bring america together? >> well, he's just distancing. i mean you can say this group -- this group, i find abhorrent, but it's distanced. so that's just the way of signaling to his people, hey, i'm still -- don't get mad at me. i'm on your side. to me the most disturbing thing about all of this and the march is happening the way trump leads the country right now, we're going through a big debate, a big transition which we should have a debate about in two years, the majority of children of america will be nonwhite. in 20 years after that the majority of the country will be nonwhite. we can have a debate about that. i think it's a good thing, but we can't have a debate about that and what immigration is doing to the country as long as bigotry is so present. >> can you have the debate on democrat graphic changes without

it turning racial, governor mccrory? >> i think some people want to turn it racial, the left and the right, because the fringes ben it from the types of debate. i don't like the fringe groups. i wish the president should call out the nazis more. >> he called out the nfl players protesting but not the white supremacists -- >> the president has a problem with race. >> well, let me say this. the nfl players, there's controversy with them. it's not just racial. jim brown disagrees. jim brown one of the greatest -- not only football players but civil rights activists who made courageous stance as a famous athlete and actor at the time, he even disagrees with that process. so we have to be careful talking about policy versus race and where's that gray area between the two. >> i think the two -- >> sorry, donna. >> i want to say that, you know, for many of us it's really difficult to separate policy from race because our lives every day are about the intersection of policy and race.

and the fact is that the president of the united states today could say no, i don't think it's acceptable for white supremacists and white nationalists to be outside of the white house. and he hasn't done that. and to me those nonwords speak more clearly than anything else. >> well, to your point not only is he not doing that, he's tweeting about the nfl players and a lot of people are wondering where's the forum at the white house to discuss this issue? he had one on guns. other critical issue that we're dealing with as a country. why not invite these various groups to the white house and have a discussion about it? instead he's taking to twitter and only spinning things up more. >> we'll take a break here. it would be cathartic if he let -- maybe even yell at them at the white house for a little while. when we come back, the man who hopes to mend the growing the day after chemo shouldn't mean going back to the doctor just for a shot. with neulasta onpro patients get their day back...

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but there are some turned off by his rhetoric and some positions like health care. the one who voted in tuesday's special election outside of columbus, ohio. they sound like the kind of voters former congressman and current ohio governor and past and possible future presidential candidate john kasich would have called his voters. well, i spoke to kasich yesterday and i asked him by the apparent narrow victory by the republican candidate constituted a good or a bad night for the gop. >> well, it wasn't a good night because this is a district that you should be winning by overwhelming numbers like, you know, the last guy won by -- i don't know, 17 points, something like this. and so what you had is a -- i think a message from the voters to the republicans that you've got to stop the chaos and get more in tune. stop alienating people and trying to figure out how do families do better? you can't be talking about, you know, being in a fight here where maybe people could lose

their health care if they have a pre-existing condition or this business of separating children from mothers and fathers and at t the border, plus the chaos here and overseas. chuck, people just want the government to do its job, to improve the situation for them, not to be -- not to be on the front page in creating a chaotic environment all the time. they opt want that. >> let me get your reaction to something that mark leibovich, this is what he writes, governor. republican leaders are so unwilling to condemn trump because their voters support him so vigorously or because they support him because of chicken

versus egg? speaker ryan has walked a quieter line than you have. is that the issue that not enough people are making a case essentially against the president inside the republican tent? >> you know, i don't think it's so much making a case against the president. it's making a a case for what you believe in. the republican party hasn't been for protectionism or support a notion that families shouldn't be held together or the republican party doesn't support we should put our -- putting our kids in debt by doing things that are not responsible. the republican party has never believed we should walk away from our allies who helped us keep the peace since world war ii. these positions they don't resemble the republican party. >> right now, only president trump is making that case. they're not many people making the other case here in washington. >> the other thing i don't like -- the reason why i did not go to our convention and support

donald trump as president is i'm not for a divider. i'm not for people who say the reason you don't have something it's because somebody else took your stuff that's told victimization. i don't believe in that. >> some people hear you say that and say, john kasich wants to run for president. but the question is does he want to do it as a republican and fight inside the party or do it as an independent and put together the coalition you just described? >> well, chuck, i'm a republican. and the fact is that the republican candidate for congress here really called and pleaded with me to do more to help him. no, i think that when they look at the formula for success, not only -- look, you not only have success electorally but when you help people to rise you feel good about yourself. >> you're punting me 2020 question a little bit. >> chuck, i don't know what i'm

doing. you know that. what i'm doing now, i'm staying alive, i'm speaking out. any time i observe something, people say i'm running for president. maybe i will, maybe i won't. i don't know. but here's what i do know. my job as a human being ultimately is to serve the lord. and if i'm helping people to realize their god given purpose and destiny then i'm striking ten and that's good. >> i want to put up something that henry olson in national review wrote about your -- he calls it john kasich's 2020 dream. he's too republican for disaffected democrats and too experienced for those voters who want radical choice. you lost two bids for office and he thinks the third one wouldn't end differently. are you too republican for the centrist democrats and are you too experienced for the times? >> i don't know, chuck, what the mood is. what i know is what's true today is not true a couple hours from now. that what's on your show now is going to probably be old news in like two hours.

>> thanks a lot. >> you can't predict. you cannot predict where this country is going. where the mood is going. because everyone in the country knows that it's chaotic. they know there's something wrong with our compass and they want it fixed. so i don't really worry too much about this. i'm going to do my job and that's all i can do. >> i want to get your reaction very quickly. there's some discomfort from some corners about some commentaries that have taken place on fox news and primetime. given you're a former fox news host. let me get you to react to what laura ingraham. >> in some parts of the country it does seem like the america we know and love doesn't exist anymore. massive demographic changes have been foisted upon the american people. and they're changes that none of us ever voted for and most of us don't like. >> reaction? >> you know, she said it didn't have anything to do about race. i'm not -- i know her a little

bit. i'm not going to say that she was saying this because of race. but what i am saying is this kind of language of division is not helpful to us, chuck. and so, look, at the end -- >> do you worry though -- if you think about it, this issue with the republican base they talk to it. they talk to the republican base directly. has that made your job harder inside the republican party? >> you know, chuck, i think one of the things that's happening is that people have been increasing -- not everybody, but many have been increasingly unwilling to put themselves in the shoes of somebody else. even when you think of family separation at the border, you know, they had a choice, they didn't need to go there. many of them had to go there to save their kids' lives literally. so look, i don't want to be doing -- some sort of religious hour here, but what's fundamentally changed our country is that many people have not come to understand what

faith is. which is loving your neighbor. elevating others in front of yourself. putting yourself in other people's shoes. and when we don't do that, we lose the essence of our country. when my father and my uncle talked about the great depression, everybody pulled together. and what we're seeing now is people pulling apart rather than being -- than coming together. i think that's an element of religiosity. if you're a humanist, you believe in making a better tomorrow, but we need the compass back. i think it comes from on high. faith, togetherness, we can do it. >> the special election, why >> the special election, why wh us. >> the special election, why wh it's what this country is made of. but right now, our bond is fraying. how do we get back to "us"?

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congressional district where democrats turned a place that donald trump won by 11 points into quite the nail-biter so what is it about ohio 12? well, it's literally that next rung out when you think of it via cities. it includes the outer sub suburbs of columbus and large rural areas. and there are places like ohio 12 across the country. these districts, you can argue were where the gop's original makers, they drew the districts specifically after the last census in order to guarantee a republican majority. there are places like missouri second. with more democrats and the republicans showing up to vote in last week's primary, things may get more uncomfortable there for the gop. there's washington's fifth district. this is the district home to spokane, washington. eastern washington. not seattle on the western side. it's a mix of rural and urban

areas. they could defeat the top ranking woman in the republican leadership. she won the last election by 20 points. let's go to kansas's second district. including kansas city and plus a large rural swath of the state as well. 2016 it went republican by 28 points. just this week, cook moved it up over to the tossup column. and finally, the outer suburbs of racine, washington. the seat went republican by 35 points and cook only rates it lean republican. the seat was vacated by the speaker of the house, paul ryan. that's right. there is a good chance that paul ryan's congressional seat goes to a democrat in november. look, we talked about democrats taking over the suburbs but the

next rung out where the suburbs start to bleed into the exurbs and the rural areas. this is a wave year, a difference been a wave and nonwave. coming up next, a couple years ago, i was working at a coffee shop in pittsburg and i got laid off. i did not know what i was going to do. i started reimagining myself and i came up with these bowties. that's how knotzland was born. i was a one-woman show. i took a class that taught me the basics of how to get

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back now with "end game." david wasserman who covers the house for our friends at the cook political report put out a tweet after the disappointing performance for the gop and troy balderson and the red ohio district. his tweet says this republicans watch out. and he tweeted, signs you're in danger of a wave. number one, your voters aren't turning out. check. number two your incumbents are getting outraised. check. number three the other candidate has parties in all 435 districts check. you keep waiting for things to get better and they don't. things only got worse when chris collins of new york was indicted on charges related to security charges. he decided yesterday to suspend the campaign, even though it's impossible for republicans to replace his name on the ballot at this late stage. governor mccrory, do you see a wave coming against your side?

>> i'm very concerned and north carolina we have two competitive congressional races, all the rest are gerrymandered after the primary, and in the two competitive races the democrats that are run having no track record whatsoever. they do not talk about any democratic policies. they take no stands on anything and they're raising a ton of money. >> so what david wasserman was like, yeah, i know that, check check check. >> they don't know how to spell pelosi and they're collecting her money. she's using the fund-raising skills to give to the candidates in north carolina and then they disown her. they're having the best of both worlds. there's hypocrisy. >> donna, do you see a wave? >> a few months ago i thought there would be 35 to 40 seats and people laughed at me. i think it will be way more than that. i remember when in 2010 we lost seats as democrats that we didn't expect to lose. they got swept up, i really feel like this is coming here. you can see it in some of the

primary results and washington state with cathy mcmorris-rodgers, jamie herrera butler. all across the country. i see the wave coming. >> david, we're talking about the seat that belongs for the number one guy in the leadership are on the battlegrounds. >> it's a not a trump thing. if it's trump tweets we would see leakage across the republican base. we don't see it. we see it as a specific demographic. >> the same people. >> these are men and women who work in i.t. they're one, diverse. they benefit from the global economy. they like free trade and immigration. this is the entire republican party leaving behind a major part of the base. >> does the white house know this? the white house political staff knows this. >> right. >> does the president? >> the president doesn't know it, chuck, because he's prepared to go out on the campaign trail and based on my conversations he's going to be out at least 40 days after election day.

but here's the reality, when you talk to his political team they say look, we'll be smart about this. not every event is going to be a rally. there may be some roundtables. ivanka trump is going to be out as well. they realize he's not going to play well in every district, but the wild card is is he going to actually drive some republicans away and is he going to energize democrats? >> he might have simultaneously drove up the base when he did that rally, but may have turned out more suburban votes. >> president obama and president trump are very similar in one way. they both have a core of 30 to 35% of people who no matter what they did they wouldn't leave them. it's the additional percentage on what will do they do and president obama lost the midterms because they didn't come out to vote that's the danger to donald trump. similar dynamics. >> if there's an undertow, that might be called pelosi. and i'm curious of your thoughts here. you had rashida tlibe, who is

will replace john conyers, and she said, i probably won't vote for her. there's a growing number of lawmakers who say that. is she going to be speaker if democrats won't take control? you have been there. you know her. you know how this works on the inside. how strong is her hold on this caucus? >> well, first of all, nancy pelosi is the best vote counter ever. she's not going to run for speaker unless she believes she can get the votes to do it. i just don't see where the transition plan will be. i mean, you look at the various factions of the party and i can see in a vote that's -- you know, a majority winner takes all. then she comes out ahead in that. but you know what? i think she may deserve it. i mean, she's already raised almost $90 million for democrats across the country. she knows that, you know, she can be a lightning rod and she says just when, baby, because she knows when they come in they have to make the decision she's the one who brought them there. >> could she be the difference

between a majority and a governing majority, david? look, they used pelosi attend. was that worth 1500 votes? may not have been worth 15,000, but worth 1,500 in ohio? >> i followed the history of the democratic party, but how will they screw it up this time? they will find a way. >> we're hoping. >> but they're not doing the obvious things. you know, the obvious things will be to swing super far left. they're not doing that. with pelosi it's become the symbol of change. but she's a great speaker. and it would be -- >> she delivers. >> all right. i'm going to leave it there. thank you all. wonderful panel. thanks for watching, everybody. we'll be back next week because if it's sunday it's "meet the press."

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