this sunday, the growing covid crisis. >> covid is out there. have to be cautious on how you deal with it. >> with a million people a day taking holiday flights. >> i really want to see my family. my dad was really sick. it just needed to happen. >> hetens of millions on the ro, new fears of a deepening pandemic. >> this is a superspreader event and we can see a surge of cases. >> health care workers over worked, under staffed and frustrated. >> i don't know how to get through the next day of work without breaking down for an

hour or every hour. >> we have 20 to 30 people probably caring for each patient every day. that is what is going on. >> vaccines are on the way but how soon? this morning my interview with dr. anthony fauci. >> plus, transition politics. president elect biden starts forming a cabinet. >> it's a team that reflects the fact america is back. >> as president trump continues to say cite non-existent fraud. >> how much is president trump trying to tie president elect biden's hands in iraq and afghanistan? i'll talk to the joint chair chiefs about why a smooth transition is critical to national security. joining me are nbc news kasie hunt, hue huet host on the salem n radio network and michael dyson of vanderbelt university.

welcome to sunday, it's ""meet the press.". >> announcer: from nbc news washington, the longest television running in history. this is "meet the press." good sunday morning, i hope you're having a safe and enjoyable thanksgiving weekend:throughout america's covid crisis there is grim statistics. this morning there have been more than 13.3 million dalss cad 266,000 deaths in the united states alone with little reason to believe things will improve in the short run, but if there is one statistic that stands out above others, the united states has 4% of the world's population and somehow has 19% of the world's covid deaths. this is hardly what people mean by american exceptionalism and no amount of game saying or presidential tweeting that increase testing is somehow to blame can wish away this dubious honor.

tens of millions ignored pleas from health experts to avoid travel and instead spend time at home with their immediate families. the result may well be a covid surge beyond the record numbers we've seen. how did we get here? did we lose faith in our government because our government gave us reason to lose faith in it? it a decade's long assault on science and objective facts, particularly by some on the right? was it a fractured media environment that has people seek alternative facts to fit their personal world view or are we fed up, done with months of zoom meetings and closed stores and kids home from school that we've simply had enough? enough that millions feel it's worth taking a big risk to have a brief sense of normalcy. whatever the cost, the results are clear, millions are being infected. hospitals are near their breaking point and health care workers are the ones paying the price.

>> i've been a nurse for 20 years and never experienced burnout like this. >> reporter: on the front lines health care workers are exhausted overwhelmed and at times angry at an american public only half listening. >> i hope the last moments of your life don't look like this because this is what you'll see at the end of your life if we don't start wearing masks. >> we're under staffed. we have so much on our plates as nurses. >> reporter: with coronavirus cases over 13 million and continuing to climb, up in 44 states in the past two weeks, roughly 90,000 americans are hospitalized, icus are overwhelmed. >> it's not entirely clear to us we'll be able to move personnel from cold spots to hot spots because the hot spots are everywhere. >> reporter: according to federal data, by the end of the week 22% of hospitals, nearly 1400 expect a staffing shortage. >> one of the plans in utah is to open up one of our big event

centers as a hospital. well, where are the doctors coming from? >> you can't pick up medical professionals from the grocery store when you're in need of staff. >> reporter: nearly one in four physicians say they know a physician that committed suicide. 58% express feelings of burnout. health care workers are surrounded by dying patients. >> we decided to take the oxygen away. that was really hard. that was hard. >> reporter: health care workers are sacrificing their own lives. >> willing to put her life on the line to help others so that they could then help others. it was such a tragedy. >> reporter: but while travel on thanksgiving was down from previous years, more than 6 million people flew over the last week. >> are you concerned about the coronavirus surge? >> i'm not. i don't anybody that's got it. >> it doesn't seem like it getting better so try to have a

little fun. >> doctors, nurses, health care front liners are frustrated and angry. >> people say covid is a hoax and masks don't work, that masks are politicized. >> reporter: while some elected leaders are showing urgency, others continue to down play the virus. >> i think oklahoma should be with their loved ones over thanksgiving. let's be safe about it. >> reporter: in denver, the mayor michael hancock urged residents to stay home. >> i'm asking, urging, pleading with everyone to please stay home. >> reporter: then flew to mississippi for thanksgiving. >> he said we should not stay with our family and travel for thanksgiving and goes behind our backs. >> one of the things that we have been struggling with is what we do with our kids if we can't keep them safe, that includes potentially sending them to live with a relative away from us. so stay home. please. >> in the two days since thanksgiving, there have been 346,000 new confirmed covid

cases in the united states and 2700 deaths. of course, we won't know for awhile how bad the surge of cases and deaths due to thanksgiving weekend travel will be. joining me now is dr. anthony fauci as the director of the national institute of allergy and infectious diseases. dr. fauci, welcome back to "meet the press." this other statistic tells the tale of november. the total number of coronavirus cases in the united states in november surpassed 4 million on saturday. that's more than double than october. what are we staring at in december considering i guess halloween was part of this early surge in november. what should we expect in december, sir? >> well, if you look at the slope of that curve that led to the numbers that you just mentioned, chuck, we're going to be seeing as we go towards the end now and getting into december, we're seeing the surge with an inflection curve like this.

the concern we had as we entered into the thanksgiving holiday and as we're coming out of the thanksgiving holiday is that the travel and the people congregating at dinners that you'd expect we tried to get the word out for people, as difficult as it is, to really not have large gatherings of people, family and friends but try to keep it confined to the immediate household, but, you know, people are not always going to do that so what we expect, unfortunately, as we go for the next couple of weeks into december that we might see a surge super posed upon that surge we're already in. when i give that message, i don't want to frighten people except to say it is not too late at all for us to do something about this because as we travel back to be careful when we go back to where we are to just continue to do the things we've been talking about. an important issue, chuck, we know when you mitigate with

masks, with distance, with not having crowds in settings, states that have done that, the conflexion of their curve starts to do this. we know we can do something about it, particularly now as we get into the colder season and as we approach the christmas holidays. >> look, it took, what was it? about a week before thanksgiving that the cdc came out and advised against travel. are we going to see more dire warnings given about travel now, essentially now in the next week or two as we prepare for the end of the year holidays and new years? >> chuck, i'd have to say, honestly, unless something changes dramatically, which i don't see that happening because the curves when you look at the dynamics of an outbreak that you see usually three, four, five-week period of time before curves start really coming down. so i think we're going to be

faced with another situation we're going to have to make decisions as a nation, state, city and family that we're in a very difficult time and we're going to have to do the kinds of restrictions of things we would like to have done particularly in this holiday season because we're entering into what's really a precarious situation because we're in the middle of a steep slope. what people need to do, we say it over and over again. we know it works but also that there is, as i mentioned to you before, chuck, there is light at the end of the tunnel because we'll really be seeing vaccines soon. we likely, almost certainly, are going to be vaccinating a portion of the individuals in the first priority before the end of december and then as we get into january and february and march, more and more. so if we can hang together as a country and do these kinds of things to blunt these surges until we get a substantial

proportion of the population vaccinated, we can get through this. there really is light at the end of the tunnel -- >> what is your confidence level that various hospital systems will hold uprig right now? the warnings are coming from all over the country. i know you guys see these reports on the task force. i saw one earlier this week, something like one in five health care systems around the country were on the brink of basically being over capacity. they were already over capacity. >> right. >> the next two weeks could make the worse. health care workers themselves, there is not enough of them. are you concerned about failing systems around the country? >> you know, chuck, i have to say that i am and i am because reality stairs you right in the face. just last night i got a couple of calls from colleagues and associates who were very much involved in different states throughout the country saying we're at that point where we soon if things don't turn around

quickly, we're going to have a situation with capacity not only of hospital capacity but staff. you know, what do you think we should do? almost pleading for advice about what can we do? we don't want a lockdown completely but we might have to -- i'm talking about locally, not nationally. i'm talking about individual locations of people starting to see significant stresses on the hospital and health care delivery system. so again, that's such an even more important reason why you have to realize that we do have within our capability to be able to blunt that by doi ing the simple things we talk about short of locking down. so we don't precipitate the necessity of locking down. >> is this -- look, i don't want to belabor a point about the federal response we talked about in the past. how about getting the president to talk about not traveling over the holidays or getting the president to talk about wearing

a mask again? is that possible? >> you know, i don't know. i mean, it certainly is possible, chuck. but i don't think i have any power in that regard. so what i'm doing is the best that i can do, you know, and thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak to the nation on a national program to talk about the importance of those kinds of things that can have an impact. >> let's talk about the vaccine. the cdc is going to put out protocols who should get it first. it's clear in the conversation you and i are having, it's health care workers probably should be priority number one and priority two here. what does that look like? how realistic is it to get the nation's leading front line health care workers vaccinated by the end of january, say? >> well, chuck, i think certainly the health care workers will be among those. i don't know exactly what the precise final decision is going to be. certainly, health care workers will be up there. there may be others. i don't know. as you

-- advisory committee, either tuesday or wednesday will come next week and come and meet with the cdc and make those kinds of decisions. if you look at the number of health care workers, obviously, you have to do it in a graded way. we don't have enough vaccine right now in the first, in the last week or two or three of december to be able to get everyone who needs to and that's the reason why what happens is that a certain amount of vaccine get shipped locally to the states and then the final decision of how to do that properly will be left up to the states with strong recommendations from the cdc. >> so let me get into some specifics as there is people watching here. hey, i've got a parent or grandparent in a senior facility. maybe it's a nursing home, maybe it's a senior living care. when will they get it? how early in this process do you expect them to get a vaccine?

>> again, i don't want to get ahead of the advisory committee but i can tell you what likely will happen, certainly not definitive that people in nursing homes will likely be very high up there in that facility. if you look at the number of people in what's called official nursing homes, there's about 1.5 million people. if you look at the people who are the staff that staff those official nursing homes, that's about another 1.5 million. so you probably have around 3 million people. i think you can get them protected reasonably soon because obviously, they are very vulnerable and go down the list of people who are elderly, with or without underlying conditions and get different priorities after that. >> let's talk about kids here. moderna did not do any clinical trials with anybody under the age of 18 and pfizer did some of the clinical trials down to age 12. there hasn't been a lot.

what is your sense of -- when should we expect school aged kids to be able to get vaccinated? are we looking at the summer? will that be a longer period of time here? >> well, traditionally, chuck, the answer to the question is months. the reason is traditionally, when you have a situation like a new vaccine, you want to make sure because children, as well as pregnant women are vulnerable. so before you put it into the children, you want to make sure you have a degree of effectiveness and safety that is established in an adult population, particularly an adult normal population. then there are ways to get children vaccine by, let's say, maybe in january and again, this is my estimate, may not be exactly that that you go ahead and you do what's called a phase one and a phase two trial in children. in other words, you find out is it safe in children, and does it induce the kind of immune

response that's comparable to that in adults, an immune response that you know protects adults and then what you can do is you can do a study, what's called a bridging study. you can say okay, now, we have safety in the children. we have comparable immunization, namely the same type of immune response. we can get this expedited approved for the children before going through a 30,000 person trial that may take a longer period of time. we'll start the process very likely in january to get it to the children sooner rather than later. >> if someone had covid-19, do they get vaccinated? >> the answer is very likely yes. when the trials were done, the moderna trials and other trials and we looked at the data, there were people when you looked at the antibody response they gave indication they had been infected and actually recovered quite well, and at the time of

the vaccine study, they were actually well and normal as it were and yet, they still got vaccinated. since we don't know the durability of protection from someone who has already been infected, how long that protection lasts, it would not be surprising that we would be vaccinating people who have recovered from covid-19. >> given the -- and you've admittedly said this, our rough rollout of a testing strategy in this country, arguably we still don't have -- we're still dealing with a testing strategy that prioritizes sports leagues over health care workers at times but let me ask you this, why should we feel confident vaccine distribution will go smoothly considering frankly how unsmoothly testing went? >> the reason we should feel more confident about that, chuck, we have a long, long history of the distribution of vaccines. i mean, it not to the extent

that you are giving it to 300 million people but every year the system is set up in a relationship between the cdc and the state and local health authorities that they distribute 80 million or more vaccines every year. so this isn't something that they've done just for the first time. obviously, you're going to want to scale it up bausec the numbers will be greater but there are a couple of aspctse to getting vaccines into the arm of someone who needs it. one, is to get it transported from the place where it's made and stored to the local state and city areas. that's being handled by general gus perna and the military and transport of that. once it gets there, it's the state and local authorities who are responsible for the distribution. so there are a couple of taspha. the part about 300 million doses getting shipped will be taken care of by people who know how to do that.

the part at the end of getting into people's arms will be more challenging than the regular flu season. i think it would be foolish to deny that. i think it will be able to be done because the local people have done that in the past. hopefully, they will get the resources to help them to do that. >> january 20th, president biden calls you up, dr. fauci, what's the first thing you say to him? he says i need you, what's the first thing you want me to do dr. fauci, what do you say? >> there will be a couple things. i think it will be continuing to make sure the vaccines get distributed in an efficient and equatable way. that's important. i together with dr. birx say there are two types of testings, a couple, more than two but one is the testing for a situation where you want to find out is this person infected and can we be able to do good identification, isolation and contact tracing? then there is broader testing,

namely one that's less sensitive but testing people that are not symptomatic, a much broader blanket over the country in a way that's easy, cheap, even a home test. i'll be pushing for that. because i think when you really allow us to know in a very quick way what the infection is in any given way, that will be very important. the virus is being spread throughout the country by people without symptoms. so we've got to go beyond the symptomatic people and get a better understanding of the asymptomatic transmission. >> every day when i make a right turn to come into the office when i do come into the office, there is a big sign that says thank you, dr. fauci. let me just say the same thing right now. thank you, dr. fauci, appreciate you coming on and sharing your perspective. >> thank you very much, chuck. thank you for having me. >> you got it. when we come back, the head

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whatever your business is facing... let's workflow it. servicenow. welcome back. not every presidential transition has to be as difficult as this one has been and under president george w. bush. admiral mullin was chief of staff and bob gates defense secretary and president obama kept both in their jobs. admiral mullin knows what a proper transition looks like and why a rocky one can have serious implications. admiral mullin, welcome back to "meet the press." i was very focused on getting you on here about a week, over a week ago on the news about afghanistan and the decisions that the president was making right before he was handing over power and i had my own flash back to decisions you were

involved with in afghanistan and then the iranian, the assassination happened last night or over the weekend. so i want to start with iran, admiral mullin and what you think the implications are going forward for a president biden and the iran nuclear deal. >> i think the assassination makes it much more challenging, if you will, chuck, in terms of where a president like biden wants to go in terms of renegotiating or making, you know, reentering into the nuclear deal specifically. i'm hopeful that actually president elect biden can do that. he was at the heart of iranian new clear program and has been for years, not only the brains but also the passion behind it so his assassination is really a significant event, not unlike a year ago when we took out

soleima soleimani. that's a real grab for the program. that doesn't mean there are other nuclear scientists iran can't continue on. expect this, certainly, the media's reporting that tensions are on the rise. there is an israeli component to this meaning israel is, you know, iran is a nuclear weapon in iran is a threat to israel and israel will do all it can to make sure that never happens. so i'm hopeful that president elect biden can actually reach in and calm the waters but i think this heightens tensions significantly. >> look, we still have another 50 days before the transfer of power. it certainly looks to the layperson that and israel looks at the national security priorities and thought, boy, the timing we better do this now

before there is a new american president. what other situations are there around the world right now that you're concerned there might be more attempts at tieing the hands of the new president? >> well, i'm very concerned about the trump loyalists who have now gone to work in the pentagon. i mean, recently, secretary esper was fired and a host of other people left the building and there are some real trump loyalists there now in charge and it pretty difficult to think over the course of 50 or 60 days you can do something constructive but you can do something really destructive. a week ago there was media reports there was a debate about action against iran, specifically, but the president reportedly turned down but i would be concerned that those issues continue to be raised. you mentioned the troops in afghanistan coming out there,

there are reports now of bringing troops home from somalia, i guess, generally trying to get as many troops home before the inauguration as soon as possible. i think we need to be very careful with that. i'd like everybody to come home, as well, the reality is on the ground in places like somalia and afghanistan, there are still terrorists that would do us ill and i want to play the game on their turf and not play it here. if we just come home, my fear is that they arrive here in the united states and we've been through that before and i never want to see that happen again. >> i made a point at the start of our interview about sort of the transition from bush to obama but i want to put it in starker terms here. here is the "new york times" headline a week ago. trump using last days to lock in policy and make biden's tasks more difficult and here is an excerpt from the book "duty" in december bush was prepareded to approve the additional 20,000

troops and steve hadley asked obama's national security advisor, jim jones, whether the new president take it and the new team opted for the second course. this was a transition made easier because gates was staying over where there was cons consultation and a concern what would the world think if one president boxed in another president. now we have one american president boxing in another american president. what message does that send to the world, admiral mullen. >> you want to do all you can to not box in the president. you want to give as many options as possible. this is obviously, the opposite case right now and in fact, i thought president bush set the tone for the issue you mentioned but also a hand full of other

issues that i saw that these were decisions that were going to be impactful on the next president and it was his desire to make sure that president obama had a vote specifically and the example that you layout is one significant example, specifically. so it appears that the current administration is trying to lock in as many options, as many issues as possible to make it much more difficult for president elect biden to govern and actually, historically, that has just never been the case. i worry that in a time where you just went through, you know, where we are on the pandemic, specifically, the challenge we have in the economy and national security issues do not wait. that's going to be a particularly did i have cut transition in that arena actually having started three weeks late.

it is our allies, our friends and enemies look at us in a time of real fragitilty in that regard. >> very quickly, what do you tell those still wearing the uniform active duty, whether it's general millian down and they see what the staffers are doing at the pentagon and very nervous about it, how publicly should they be sounding alarms? >> i have a lot of faith in general milly he understands where he's working and who is in the building and confident he's sending the right message and he said it recently at an event locally in washington where the united states military men and women support and defend the constitution. we do not support and defend an individual or an individual office and i think that's the message.

milly is very strong on that and that's the righ messageo them. >> admiral mike mullen, retired admiral. thanks for coming on and sharing your perspective, sir. appreciate it. >> thank you, chuck. when we come back, president trump finally said he'll leave the white house if he loses the the white house if he loses the electoral colle vote but is the white house if he loses the electoral colle vote but is these days, we want sophisticated but simple. cutting edge made user friendly. in other words, we want a hybrid. and so do retailers. which is why they're going hybrid, with ibm. a hybrid cloud approach with watson ai helps manage supply chains while predicting demands with ease. from retail to healthcare, businesses are going with a smarter hybrid cloud, using the tools, platform and expertise of ibm.

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welcome back. the panel is with us. nbc news capitol hill correspondent kasie hunt, hue huet. the radio iowa network and michael eric dyson of vanderbelt, "reckoning with race in america." president trump, folks, is still insisting he won the election, however, which he did not and joe biden did not win 80 million votes. he has. and that the election was marred by massive fraud. it was not. he put to rest the idea he would not leave the white house on january 20th. listen. >> if the electoral college does elect president elect joe biden, are you not going to leave this building? >> certainly i will. certainly i will.

you know that. but i think that there will be a lot of things happening between now and the 20th of january. >> kay henderson, you're the one not stuck with the rest of us coastal elites and i guess michael eric dyson gets to be in longer a coastal elite when he heads to vanderbelt from georgetown. literally geographic middle of the country, what do the americans hear when the president complains about this election? >> not everyone is hearing that, number one. number two, in terms of a concession, in the state of iowa, jim lose light foot has still not conceded the 1988 election. tom still went on to serve both terms as president obama's u.s. ag secretary. so therefore, i think that when historians look at this period,

they're likely going to look at the policies that were discussed and debated during this period and perhaps what trump may or may not be able to do with congress in relation to pandemic relief. >> you know, kasie hunt, this is not new with this president. he is complained about whatever has happened, whether it's a bankrupt bankruptcy, you know, 1990, he himself is always claiming somehow what we're reading or hearing isn't true. whether it's a message or financial, i never seen press reporting as i have with regard to me. i hope the general public understands how inheritry dishonest the press in this country is. every company in atlantic city went bankrupt, every company. there is always an excuse and reason. there is never a point where admits the facts on the ground. this is not just his political

career, business career and celebrity career. >> he spent most of the time in all of those careers trying to avoid the label of loser and in this very particular case, it's clear. he lost the election to joe biden in a significant way. that's something he can't escape trying every avenue to the point of absurdity over the course of the last couple of weeks since the election was actually declared, and you're right, in iowa remember, i don't think he's conceded he lost the iowa caucus to ted cruz. >> in '16, yeah. >> when he was first running for the republican primary nomination. this is something that clearly for him, he's spent the entirety of his presidency attacking the media and he's been pretty transparent about why he does that. he says well, the reason i do that is because that way when they say something i don't like, no one will believe them.

that's the question here that i think history will reflect on. how much damage was done to trust in the systems and institutions and elections during this period when an out going president was trying to do everything he could to convince his supporters that the results couldn't be trusted s. >> hue huet, your listeners, they don't -- maybe they don't want to believe the facts on the ground. do you feel like you confront your listeners enough that don't want to believe the facts or do you think you could do more? >> every day i talk to people that believe there is massive fraud in fw georggeorgia and i m no and they have to vote for perdue and kelly that i support. i think that are sophisticated and know president trump is as of today planning on running for election in 2024 against president elect biden. and he's doing things consistent with that and i think he is going to spend the next four years under scoring the big

successes of his tenure, including operation warp speed. it was great news what dr. fauci said that most of the front line people will be vaccinated by the end of december. he's going to emphasize his military rebuild, the supreme court and emphasize conservative realism versus the chinese communist party. he's setting up a campaign that's already begun and i wouldn't be surprised, chuck, if on or before the inauguration of president biden, he announces trump 2024 is formed and it's off to the races. >> he announced his reelection campaign on inauguration day in 2017. michael eric dyson, the damage president trump is using old dog whistles to talk about voter fraud. he's talking about the cities and i guess we should maybe we should be glad he's only using a dog whistle when he says the cities. long-term damage that's being redone here in your mind? >> it's pretty unparalleled.

a sitting president of the united states of america attacking with sump viciousness the democracy that landed him the job to begin with. while he under cuts democracy, he's under cutting the very thing which he's been obsessed over these years. think about the dog whistle. in some instances it's been far louder. he's attacking detroit. 79% black. he's attacking atlanta 59% black, philadelphia 42% black, he's attacking milwaukee 39% black. we get what he's doing here. he's trying to have his cake and eat it, too, so to speak. he has an uptick in voting among african american people by 5% among black men 4% among black women and at the same time, he wants to whistle to white supremacist and white nationalists he's still their guy and he will continue to send out the notion that somehow this is a fraud, the fraud is related to race, race is illegitimate

and as a result of that, you as a white person have every reason in the world regardless of your strategy, whether you're making $100 million a year or barely making $10,000 to vote for me because i'm your guy. this is destructive to the process of american democracy and one of the most powerful repudiations of enlightenment. he is anti science, he's anti race, he's anti everything that makes this country it seems the very great thing he wants to make it. >> kay, this issue of we're hearing basically two different sets of facts, two different narratives. how does that come -- where do you see it the most in iowa and where do you see it in your job? >> well, frankly, i'm not seeing that much. the iowa republican party state central committee passed a resolution a couple weeks ago saying they support president trump's pursuing, you know,

avenues through the courts all the way to the supreme court. you have republican voices like the chairman of the republican party here in iowa still supporting the president. you don't hear a lot of talk among republicans about the voter fraud issue. we do have an election here that is still on going. there is a congressional race here which currently has a republican in the lead by six votes, and it's likely that this will also be going through the court system. so you don't hear those talking points here as much because of the vote counting that still is on going in iowa's second congressional district. >> i tell you, kay, we could go real deep on the second congressional district to think they went from dave to where they go today just tells you everything about the changing

dynamics not only around the country but in iowa, as well. anyway, when we come back, while joe biden held socially distant campaign events, presidentrump i'm still discovering what's next. and still going for my best. even though i live with a higher risk of stroke due to afib... ...not caused by a heart valve problem. so if there's a better treatment than warfarin, i'm reaching for that. eliquis. eliquis is proven to reduce stroke risk better than warfarin. plus has significantly less major bleeding than warfarin. eliquis is fda-approved and has both. what's next? i'm on board. don't stop taking eliquis unless your doctor tells you to, as stopping increases your risk of having a stroke. eliquis can cause serious and in rare cases fatal bleeding. don't take eliquis if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. while taking eliquis, you may bruise more easily- -and it may take longer than usual for any bleeding to stop. seek immediate medical care for sudden signs of bleeding, like unusual bruising. eliquis may increase your bleeding risk if you take certain medicines. tell your doctor about all planned medical

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welcome back. data download time. did the rallies help trump? a tally shows there were 30 trump campaign stops in the last two weeks in states from arizona to nebraska to pennsylvania. in five counties that mr. trump visited, he saw better results than he did in 2016 but in the remaining 25, either his margin of victory shrank, his margin of defeat grew or the county flipped to biden all together. so let's look at a few of these counties in a few battle ground states. we'll start in michigan. on october 27th, president trump held a rally in ingum county, home of lansing. he wound up doing five points worse than he did there in 2016. in oakland county, north of detroit, he did six points worse

than in 2016 and grand traverse county after an election eve rally, he won for a second time but his margin fell by nine points. there was a similar pattern in pennsylvania. president trump visited erie, the state's ultimate swing county on october 20th and in the end it narrowly flipped to joe biden by a single point. he won lancaster by six and home to joe biden scan ton, the president lost by more than eight, five points worse than last time. finally, the swingingest of swing states florida that president trump carried much more easily this time around, despite mr. trump's rally, his winning margin fell belive it or not by five. he lost tampa's hills bury with a big exception to this pattern was, that's right, miami-dade. president was there on november 1st and made huge gains, shrinking his loss by 22 points guaranteeing a win in that state. to be clear none of this is

provable. mr. trump's rallies may have helped him in places where he lost ground, but in a time when public health experts warned about covid risks in large gatherings, there may have been more of a liability than asset. anyway, some evidence to back that up. when we come back, joe biden it's been a tough year. and now with q4 wrapping up, the north pole has to be feeling the heat. it's okay santa... let's workflow it. workflow it...? with the now platform, we can catch problems, before customers even know they're problems. wait... a hose? what kid wants a hose?! fireman? says "hose". -it says "horse"! not a hose! cedric! get over here! now our people can collaborate across silos, from across the globe. so how's the new place? it's a 4 bed, 2.5 bath igloo... it's great! yeah, but you have to live in the south pole.

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welcome back. as we turn more towards president elect biden and the transition, i want to highlight a quote michael eric dyson that i think paifeeds into somethingu write in your book, as well. first, let me play that quote from president elect biden on the evening of when he was declared the victor by many media organizations. >> especially those moments when this campaign was at the lowest, the african american community stood up again for me. they've always had my back and i'll have yours. >> you write this about third rail race and you say this, despite president obama's attempt to gently but directly address the hurts and hostilities between black folk and the cop, the reactive white discomfort kept him for awhile from touching the third rail of

race. that was a little more than disconcerting to black folk because if america couldn't listen to the truth from obama then few other voices stood a chance. so i'm curious, does joe biden and his voice stand a chance? >> i think so. i think my assessment there has been born out by facts. i'm pure s a word falsified and verified through the census. we saw the tests, polls when obama spoke about race there was extraordinary disconcert and discomfort but with joe biden, the white privilege he has as a figure deeply rooted in tra igs d -- traditions respectful of african americans makes him an ideal figure. he can use the privilege as a white man that is mature and wise with his ideas there are fresh. he has people like cedric

richmond, a brilliant congre congressman to guide and lead him. already he has instincts about police brutality, about the economy that's hurt african american people and the ways which covid-19 has attacked their bodies. i think those things put him in good stand and when have you heard a president before say i owe you black folk because you stood by me and now i'll stand by you. >> kasie hunt, does the african american lawmakers in cop 'tapi hill, do they expect joe biden to deliver? >> i think that they do, chuck:i think there is pretty deep trust there. i think that's part of what explains why joe biden did so well, why jim clyburn stood at his side when he did at that critically important part of the presidential race and why black people listen to him and went out there for him. this is not a relationship that developed overnight or came out of nowhere. this is a relationship that

developed over many years and decades of joe biden's time in public life and that trust has always been, as i'm sure professor dyson knows very, very well, that trust has always been kind of the bedrock for black people in politics and political life and something with which they have a long history. president obama to what the professor's book was saying, his time in public life was simply much shorter. it was -- he's a much different type of political figure than j joe biden is. i think there is deep trust and faith that biden is going to follow through on what he said there. >> hue huet, i feel there will be some sort of, i don't know if it's a reckoning or what do you want to call it on the right where you will have some who say hey, there is plenty of african americans that would like to support conservatives or republicans but the branding thanks to thanksgiving makes it very hard to have that conversation. do you think that changes in a post trump world? >> i think it's already changing.

professor dyson saw the numbers that increased significantly for biden and a month ago kevin mccarthy and the house and senate will look at 16 republican women that got elected and two african american congressman and look at michelle steel in orange county, young kim in orange county, california. they will want to diversify the party. i haven't read the professor's new book. i read "tears we cannot stop" and i would recommend mceldercc and mcconnell and every republican read that and that 50% gain made by putting his arm around tim scott and other people who speak for african american republicans and latino republicans and say what worked, what didn't, let's build on the former. >> kasie hunt, you're here. i got to ask you, covid relief, i feel like it's something i ask you every time you come on the show and it's always yeah, maybe

next week but unlikely. are we there again? >> it's really tough, chuck. and as you saw, even through the course of the president trying to challenge the results of the election, people from his own party from states who are struggling with this came and said please, we need this. please, we're watching our health care workers struggle with this day in and day out. it is something that is deeply, deeply needed still and the politics of it remain incredibly difficult. so i think that there is a window for them to do some of the things or at least try and help a little bit. there is a must pass bill to keep government open and i think there is a significant push to try to put some things in there to help people really struggling with this. it certainly something that i think the president elect has focused on and not necessarily a hope for a big bill at this point. >> all right, guys, that's all i have for today. i wish we had more time. thank you for watching. i hope you enjoy the rest of your thanksgiving day weekend.

i hope you're not traveling. be safe. we'll be back next week because if it's sunday, it's "meet the press." come experience floor and decor's grand opening in san leandro! safely shop our wide aisles and be amazed with our even wider selection. discover the perfect floor at the perfect price in whatever way is perfect for you. floor and decor's newest location is now open. also open in milpitas and burlingame.

this week on "press here," hospitals are full of patients but not profits. the costs of coronavirus threaten silicon valley med tech startups as health care cuts back on spending. venture capital investor tells me about the prices ahead. plus, president-elect biden's ahead to improve american's credit scores and call it peloton for weight lifters. an entrepreneur makes a heavy bet on the future of fitness. that's this week on "press: here." >> good morning, everyone. i hope you had a