f pastoral need do you see challenge the church today? and we'll listen and we'll listen hard. it will be interesting for me to listen to cardinals from latin america and they tell us it will be important for thom listen to us and this will be a time to begin to not only get a good consensus, what are the what are the major issues, the mission of the church-- but we'll get to know one another and probably decide which man we're going to elect to be the next successor of st. peter. >> schieffer: the pope himself said his papacy has been marked by periods of dark as well as periods of light. he said at some point it was if the lord was asleep. what issuedo you think are going to be discussed and what do you as the archbishop of new york see as the major problems now your eminence, facing the church? >> sure, bob. the holy father was remarkably

realistic in his assessment. we 99 the 2,000-year history of the church, there have always been those difficulties, those flaws, though sins, those sorrows to which we herd to so eloquently. what do we see now? even in the informal discussions among the cardinales, i hear cardinals speak about issues of religious persecution throughout the world that christianity and catholics seem to be in the crosshairs of fanatic preponderance of the evidence i hear religious liberty. i hear a restoration of the nobility of the vocation to marriage and family. i hear the difficulty that we have particularly in europe and north america that's been well documented and that affects not only the catholic church but every religion that a growing number of people have no trouble with god, no trouble with faith but they have a lot probables with religion and with the church. fur us as catholics, that's a tough one because we always see jesus and his church as one.

so to restore that sense of luster and reform and purity to the church to attract more people, that's another one we hear about. you hear again about want new evangelization. how are we going to win back those nations especially in europe that are nominally catholic but have drifted from catholic fervor. you hear about the growing churches in asia and latin america and africa where there's more people than they know what to do with, where there's massive material needs. they need more such of churches. they need more schools and hospitals. they need more priests and sisters and qualified lay leaders. you hear all about the joys. you hear all about the sorrows. it's a magnificent symphony in the life of the church they find very embracing very uplifting. >> schieffer: well, there is also your eminence, things like the cover-up of sexual crimes, pedophiles. you've got the cardinal from

california-- >> sure. >> schieffer: who was accused of not being candid about things out there on that front. are we going to hear something about that because i take your point about all of the points that you just made. i understand that. but what we read borough and what we hear about are some of these very unsavory things that have come to light. >> you bet. >> schieffer: how seriously do the cardinals take these things, your eminence? >> we have to take it with the utmost seriousness and we have to have a sense of contrition, realism about confronting that. you're dead right. there's no cardinal with his head in the sand when it comes to these issues. the church, of course, while it is not of the world it does exist in the world. so it shouldn't surprise us that the afflictions of the world-- and you just named some of them, sexual immorality, perversion, abuse of children, that affects all elements of society and culture are particularly hideous

when it comes to the church, and that that will be an issue, i predict it will. >> couric: your eminence,a what about some of the more radical ideas we hear from time to time about the church. should priests be allowed to marry? should women be allowed to become priests? will those kinds of things come up for discussion? >> well, from what i hear, there's complete lib tee on what cardinals will want to see. from my own point of view, bob-- and, again i'm a rookie. i've never been in one of these before-- i wouldn't think those kinds of things would come up explicitly. you've got to remember, bob in catholic wisdom, we're electing the successor of peter whose job description says he is to preserve the integrity and the patrimony of the faith. if you're talking about radical changes, that's not part of the job description of the pope. he's supposed to exprrv hand on intact. now, here's a big distinction.

we can talk and we better talk about perhaps a more credible, convincing way of expressing those immutable timeless truths will of the church because sometimes people tell us they find those things tough to accept or tough to believe. we better think about that. we can't change the "what." we can change want "how." how we teach and how we pass it on. and that will probably be part of our conversations. >> schieffer: well, your eminence, i want to wish you the very best as you embark on this mission, and i hope you'll keep us informed. >> thanks, bob. i'll keep you informed. i'll keep you in prayer. and i've still got that coffee cup you gave me the last time i was on. >> schieffer: all the best, your eminence. and we'll be back in just a minute.

>> schieffer: and we're back

again with bob woodward, rana foroohar the chief washington correspondent for the "new york times." david sanger and cbs news political director, john dickerson. boy, you don't have much of a title compared to these other people. ( laughter ). >> i'm hoping to get something out of rome in the next couple of weeks. ( laughter ) >> schieffer: does anybody here think that the catholic church could do better-- i'm not saying for pope-- but if they were looking for somebody to make their case, could they find a better spokesman than cardinal timothy dolan? >> no, they could not. i wonder if he has the chance. i don't think they're going to pick an american pope. that's almost a certainty. but there's a kind of reasonableness and hey we're listening. we're talking. maybe he should come do some meadeation between the white house-- >> we hear political parties when they are in a fix and there's always a debate. is it the underlying message or the messenger that's the problem. and here you heard the cardinal

basically saying it was just the-- the packaging not the underlying message that's a challenge for churches and political parties. >> but he also went out of his way to say the issues of sexual abuse and so forth have to be addressed in this conclave. and i haven't heard many others say that. >> schieffer: yeah, i thought it was very telling what he had to say. well reporter, so we know the sequestration has happened. this thing that everybody said is so stupid, so awful so ridiculous that washington would have no alternative but to find a better way to do it. they couldn't find a better way to do it. what happens next, david? >> i think the most remarkable thing is what's changed in the past 18 months. as you said, everybody concludedly that this was such a meat cleaver way to cut the budget that it would never be allowed to happen. and what happened? not only did it happen, but congress left town in the days beforehand. there's been no sense of crisis here. and i think actually the absence of a sense of crisis is in some

way the news of what's going on, that you saw president obama make, i think a fairly serious misical clalings. he knhals knliepgz believe wooddwhawtsd in defense wowstlesd not be allowed to happen. but they won out over the traditional side that would defend the defense department. >> schieffer: what happens next john? >> i think what happens next-- we've been so pessimistic and it seems every minute we get another reason to be pessimistic about what's happening in washington, let's try to find the optimistic case. we had this bad thing happen. the republicans can say we didn't bend on the question of revenues. they have buckled on two previous fights on the fiscal cliff and the debt limit. they can say we stuck. there's also consensus that they need to go big again and this month wore going to have a budget from the white house, the senate-- they said they'd do one

before and haven't. everybody is going to offer a budget and get back to the big discussion about taxes and spending and investment and how to do things in a time of scarcity. that may get us back to a big conversation. why is that important? in a big conversation you can make this trade that everybody knows has to happen, which is republicans accept a little bit of revenue, and the president offers some entitlement cuts that he's already offered so we get back to the big deal. that's failed many times before, but in a time of despair that might be a little glimmer of hope. >> schieffer: rana you are our economic person here at the table. how bad is this going to be on the economy? >> most economists say it will shave a half a percentage point off of growth, which means that the economy-- which might be more robust at this point-- will probably not feel that way. we will be in a 2% growth and that's too bad. one thing sathat is interesting is markets are neither a record high. they're a few hundred points

from being where they were in 2007. that's in fact to do with with the fact that the fed has buffered a lot of problems in washington by want asset buying program that's been going on for some time. stock markets are up, houses are coming back. i think the recovery in the private sector that happened and will continue to happen is going to buffer some of what's happening and the dysfunction in washington. >> schieffer: what about unemployment? will this have an impact on that? >> i think unemployment will hover around 7.9%, roughly where it's been. we'll seal a slow recovery because areas again like housing, construction, manufacturing, are growing. it's just too bad because if we had things together in washington, i think we'd have a fairly robust recovery by now. >> i agree with that. and in fact you might have more than a robust recovery. and i-- i think what's missing here is a discussion of the impact on real people, and the human twol toll here for something that everyone says, "this is total idiocy "and by

conservative estimatees, hundreds of thousands of people are going to lose their jobs. now the people who-- you know, the president of the united states, the leaders of congress, the members of congress i think have a moral responsibility to the people, and if you devise something where hundreds of thousands of people are going to lose their jobs, people are going took furloughed who cannot afford it. , i mean, this is-- this is very-- this is sad and out in the country people are saying, not just what's going on, but this is madness. >> schieffer: you know, i campaign thinking back to casey stengel, who was the great baseball manager and when he was managing the mets with in those early years they couldn't do anything right and one day he just looked up and said, "can't anybody here play this game? to me, it is a question of competency here. >> and the president -- >> i mean on both sides. i'm not talking about

republicans. i'm not talking about democrats. >> i agree but the president talked about a caucus of common sense, which if the great-- glu can have a small room. >> he could lead that. he could lead that. and he was saying oh, there's no secret formula. there's no secret sauce. but there is. and that is for him to lead. >> bob we forget, in some ways we're closer to a solution here than we think. there was a fascinating story in the "time" this morning laying out how close we are to basically $4 trillion in cuts, and $1.5 trillion came from the reductions agreed on by the congress and president in 2011. the $700 billion from the tax increase they agreed on. there's another $700 billion in projected reductions in the debt that will reduty amount of interest we have to pay. so we're getting much closer in reduction to medical costs as well. we're a lot closer to that initial goal so doing what john just described before shouldn't

be all that hard. we've seen bigger deals. >> because the president can say to republicans look, we've cut a lot and so-- and republicans sway we didn't give in on this latest request for revenues. so that gives a little bit of breathing room for each of the sides. and what hasn't been resolve read two big questions-- one what to do with entitle ams. all this cutting going on is just not main thing. the main thing is the increasing cost of medicare and medicaid. and descrawltz to get together on that. if you look at the polling basically the diswrint bomb televisions to messw mess with entitlement upon's. they will only way they are going to solve that big problem is to come together. and the other thing is growth. how does the government get out of the way and allow economic growth. those are two conversations that can't happen unless we get back to the big deal, the conversation, run congress the way it is supposed to be done, go back to regular order so these can get worked out nay

non-crisis atmosphere and that's the hope. >> one thing to remember is looking at this in a global context. we're back where we were in august of 2011. we benefitted from the fact that everybody else was doing worse than we were. europe was in crisis. europe is back in crisis. china is growing much more slowly than it used to be so we're still the prettiest house on an ugly block in the global economy and that's an opportunity if congress would see it to spur growth. >> but what do people out there hear? they hear the white house saying it's all the republicans' fault. you hear the republicans saying, it's all obama's fault. and they're in their bunkers and then something happens and they all call out their bunker maintenance crew, and they say "they're the ones that did this. they're the ones that did that." i really think it's fixable with conversation. and john's right. this not touching entitlements when people talk about the

long-term debt and deficit that's the problem. and you've got to address it, and it's a bitter pill to swallow. the president has said he would accept it. over the summer he told me, he said, it is untenable-- strong word-- to not cut these things. okay let's-- let's-- >> smith: just worry thatlet's. >> schieffer: i just worry washington has forgot how to compromise. maybe these people are too new to washington to remember how people used to get together-- and i don't want to sound corny about this but they talk to one another. now they go out and run ads against one another. that's not working. the old ways make was old fashioned, but want old way worked. >> well, there are a few people blowing on the dying coals of compromise in washington on both sequester and immigration. you've got people on both sides-- in fact, republicans have said to the president "stay out of this conversation. we're doing okay over here in our little attempt to build a

bipartisan conscious." on gun control there's a little bit of a bipartisan group working together to get something done. it is happening mostly out of the spotlight. once the spotlight arrives everybody misbehaves. >> the place to look for this is just where bob said in medicaid, social security, and also in defense. i'm a big believer in the willy south boston rule-- you rock banks because that's where the money is. our total national security budget has basically doubled since 9/11. there's almost no one you talk two with in the with with sweeper whrestles boston built who won't tell you that it there are big cuts you can do if you do them smartly and certainly they are not done smartly there this. but, you know, you want more money in cyber. you want more money in drones. there are now more with grienlts being trained by the united states than there are pilots for human-based pleaps. more in special forces. and a real discussion about which old cold war systems we no

longer need. that's the hardest thing to cut. they're in a lot of different congressional districts. >> schieffer: one of the big things that happened this week, john kerry the new secretary of state, said we're going to give some more aid than we have been giving to syria. where does that go? is that a good thing? what do you think bob? >> it makes sense. and the more that can be done, i suspect there are covert ways they're doing things, and you know, this is-- this is a big deal. again, it goes to the moral authority of the united states. tens of thousands of people killed. you've got to do something. you've got to do the maximum. the president's committed to not putting troops on the ground. that's probably quite smart. >> schieffer: one other question-- i'm not even going to make a question. i'm going to say two names. dennis rodman and kim jong un. the head of north korea. >> my favorite part is president obama sent at least one and

maybe two secret missions the state department and n.s.c. officials and they never even got an audience with anybody but midlevel functionaries. dennis rodman shows up and is laughing with kim jong un, and somebody said yesterday maybe they should have given him the brief and handed it over. it would be interesting to see dennis rodman tbhiecialtz wor. >> tbhiecialtz. >> schieffer: we had ping-pong diplomacy, hardball diplomacy. ( laughter ). >> bus butt that's serious. we better worry about north korea. david knows about this. >> schieffer: absolutely. >> they have the bomb, and it is a regime that you can't really figure out. >> and bob's right. for all of the jokes about how strange want country is and i was there 20 years ago and it's pretty strange. the fact of the matter is, they've now conducted a third nuclear test.

>> test. we are still living in the fiction they are not a nuclear power. they are a nuclear power and the united states doesn't want to admit to it for a good reason which is the north koreans want to be treated like pakistan, that we basically admit they've got the weapon and move on. >> schieffer: all right, well, thanks to all of you. i'm not sure we got many-- we solved any problems here, but we started down the road. we'll be basement with our "face the nation" flashback. flashback ñáçwçñ ♪ secondhand smoke affects

everyone's health.

it's not just irritating. it can cause heart disease and even death. speak up about secondhand smoke. your health and the health of your family depend on it. >> schieffer: pope benedict's resignation meant one of the most fascinating and mysterious rituals of the cattle church, the papal conclave, would soon begin to elect a new pope for a process that hasn't changed in 1,000 years. that's our "face the nation" flash back. the cardinals gather in vatican city, the voting begins, and the world waits for a smoke signal. >> if the smoke from this tiny stove is white it would signal the election of a new pope. >> schieffer: but sometimes the smoke signals aren't very

clear. in august 1978, when pope john paul was chosen, the crowd in st. peter's square couldn't tell if the smoke was white or black. and when pope benedict was selected in 2005, it wasn't just the crowds in rome who were confused. >> we have should smoke rising again from the cystine chapel. at this point we do not know for sure what color it is. in this time when we can flash news around the world by the speed of light and yet we're all sitting here trying to figure out if we're seeing white smoke or black smoke. allize will soon be on that chimney again and even in the age of twitter we'll all be doing what people have done for thousands of years-- trying to read the smoke signals. our "face the nation" flashback.

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>> schieffer: well, that's it for today. be sure to tune in next sunday when we'll be talking with former florida governor jeb bush. and tomorrow "cbs this morning" kicked 'd kicks off a special series "eye opening women." they'll talk to former supreme court justice sandra day o'connor. that's it. thanks for watching faips the nation. captioning sponsored by cbs captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org

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you don't think it was justified? >> absolutely not. >> the police and communities on edge after a series of police shootings it this weekend. the latest this morning. why officers say they had to open fire on a car trying to get away. good evening. the most recent police shooting in the bay area was in haywood. one person is dead, another under arrest. it happened early this morning near fletcher lane and watkin's street. the shooting brings a number of bay area police shootings this week tonight 4. kpix tells us how a traffic stop in hay--

hayward turned deadly. >> reporter: the car tried to flee, hitting the open passenger door of the patrol car. >> the officer fired in defense of the civilian's life and his own. >> reporter: the car came to a crashing halt half a mile away. the driver was captured but its passenger was already dead. >> it is unfortunate. i mean, people would comply it has been my experience that when they comply you don't end up in this situation. >> so he is dead now. a man is dead now because of that. makes no sense. >> you don't think it was justified? >> absolutely not. >> it is a condition occurrence. >> reporter: within 15 hours of that shooting two other men, one in san francisco and one in san jose were shot and killed by the police as they tried to flee. they perceived the actions as an attempt to shoot officers. >> several officers killed this year. at the end of last year, so, yes, it