captioning sponsored by cbs >> dickerson: it's september 30 i'm john dickerson this is "face the nation." anguish then anger took center stage on capitol hill in emotional testimony by kavanaugh accuser christine blasey ford and brett kavanaugh himself. ford told her story of being attacked by kavanaugh at a high school party 36 years ago. and what she remembered most from that night. >> the uproarious laughter between the a their having fun at my express. >> ford said she's 100% certain kavanaugh assaulted her. kavanaugh said he was 100% certain he didea me in the final vote, but you'll never get

me to quit, never. >> dickerson: thursday's drama led to head spinning chain of events and left america split about who to believe the 11th hour call from jeff flake to have the fbi further investigate allegations against kavanaugh seemed to cool tempers at first. >> they have free rein even the scope of that investigation has become controversial we'll tell you why. cbs news scott pelley spokes with flake and democrat who helped prompt the his decision for tonight's "60 minutes" we'll have a preview. then hear from two key senators, one a supporter of caw gnaw arkansas republican tom cotton plus minnesota democratic senator amy klobuchar. and author michel lewis his new book is the fifth wish all that along with plenty of political analysis is coming up now on "face the nation."

good morning welcome to "face the nation." republican leaders hope to move forward with votes in the senate later this week on brett kavanaugh's nomination as soon as the fbi concludes its investigation current credible allegations against him. we begin with a preview of tonight's "60 minutes." scott pelley spoke to six members of the senate judiciary committee including republican jeff flake and democrat chris coons. >> i'd like to ask both of you what you made of judge kavanau kavanaugh's very emotional response on friday and what it may or may not say about his judicial temperment. does this man belong on the supreme court? >> well, when he walked out, open his binder and put his papers here and we knew that he was eager to testify.

and i have to say that when i heard him, i heard someone who i hoped i would sound like if i had been unjustly accused. and to see his family behind h him, it was anger. but if i were unjustly accused that's how i would feel as well. and as it went on i think his interaction with some of the members was a little too sharp. but the statement, the beginning i thought was pretty raw, but in keeping with someone who had been unjustly accused. >> he had exchanges with others that i thought went over a line. he was clearly belligerent, aggressive, angry and i thought there was a tough dynamic there.

as i watched him part of me thought this is a man who believes that he did nothing wrong and he's completely u unjustly accused and he's being railroaded and he's furious about it. there were some lines that he delivered that were sharper, more partisan, more, this is the clintons paying me back this is democratic smear campaign that i was surprised, struck to hear from a judicial nominee. i'm not at all surprised hear that from other colleagues in the committee or on television but i was really struck that i thought his anger got the best of him and he made a partisan argument that would have been best left to be made for his advocates and defenders. >> made you wonder about his suitability. >> in my case, yes, it made me wonder about his suitability. >> senator flake, you identified with it you -- >> well the part that he talked about the mention of the clint clintons i didn't like either. it seemed partisan. but i had to put myself in that

spot. give a little leeway there. >> dickerson: scott also spoke with two republicans who are strong supporters, south carolina lindsay graham and louisiana's john kennedy. >> could either of you change your minds depending on what the fbi report comes up with? >> of course. >> open mind? >> absolutely. >> i said going into the heari hearing, i talked to judge kavanaugh, i called him after this happened, the allegation. said, did you do it? he was resolute. determined. >> senator graham? >> my mind is made up about brett kavanaugh and it would take a dynamite accusation, here's the deal. dr. ford, i don't know what happened, but i know this. brett did not -- everybody she named couldn't verify it, it's 36 years old, i don't see anything new changing. >> be sure to tune town "60 minutes" tonight for more of scott's interviews.

7:30 eastern, 7:00 p.m. pacific after football. we are joined by arkansas republican senator tom cotton. welcome, senator. >> after watching the hearings, you are supporter of brett kavanaugh how did you process the new information that came out in the hearing? >> well, john, first off let's understand why we had to have this hearing, miss ford made these allegations in confidential letter shortly after the nomination. chuck schumer said that he would do everything in his foyer stop the nomination that's what happened. for three months the democrats have turned advise and consent into a search and destroy mission. these allegations are completely unsupported by any evidence, what evidence there is to a 3 36-year-old claim, dge kghenia the democrats have disgraced this process and united states senate in the orchestrated smear campaign of character assassination they run against

brett kavanaugh. >> dickerson: they asked to have this held in confidentiality and this they tried to do that and that's what -- >> let me -- no, john, legal me talk to you about that. let me talk to your viewers about that. there is a well established process of confidentiality on the committee, dianne feinstein could have showed that to chuck grassley shared it with the fbi who could have discretely conducted this in july and in august without betraying miss ford's confidences. they pointed her to lawyers who lied to her and did not tell her that the staff was willing to go to california. all that is water upped the bridge. those lawyers have to face a dc bar investigation in their misconduct. fine sign will face investigation why they leaked that all this could have been done. it happens hundreds of times every year in the judiciary committee. >> dickerson: it doesn't happen hundreds of times with issues that are this sensitive. >> john, it's the --

dickerson: not getting a chance to talk about the testimony. you watched it i assume what was your take away from that? >> judge kavanaugh 100% denied these allegations. there's not a single bit of corroborating evidence. every evidence that we do have to include the people that miss ford herself named, either don't recall this instant or they deny that it happened. >> dickerson: did you find dr. dr. ford credible? >> miss ford was sympathetic and she was in fear. she's been victimized by the democrats in this process, john. they have betrayed her own request for conpi den she at, they leaked this to the media the last minute because they were on search and destroy mix for brett kavanaugh. >> you said women feel they can come forward. change in the norms and expectations of our society. a woman came forward here, you're saying basically she said nothing credible how can welcome forward if when they do they are told they're not credible. >> she came forward conif i den shal to dianne feinstein.

she did not share that with the proper authorities, chuck grassley with whom she served for decades -- >> dickerson: i understand that. >> that could have reviewed these matters confidentially. then they leaked it to the medi- >> dickerson: all right. >> creating the circus environment you've seen. >> dickerson: a woman thinking about coming forward with have immediately turned into a partisan issue as you've noted. her issues are not being discussed by you, you haven't discussed them since you've been here. why would a person want to come forward if immediately the response is to get ground up in this partisan thing? you're blaming it on the democrats, fine. she's still a human being who has come forward. how do you process what she -- >> john, any impact this entire episode is had on women's willingness to come forward or report sexual assault, encourage them all to do immediately after it happens, is caused by the democrats. caused by dianne feinstein and chuck schumer not requesting her confidential. it has to be tested against the

evidence and against proof. we would have known that confidentially inside the judiciary committee -- >> dickerson: are they wasting the time? >> i don't know what the fbi is going to find. the committee staff has already interviewed all the witnesses that miss ford cited, interviewed miss ford and judge kavanaugh for six hours. >> dickerson: mr. judge sent them a letter that wasn't an interview. >> they have either interviewed them for received letters under penalty of perjury. >> dickerson: these are actual interviews. >> if any of these people under penalty of perjury change their claims. >> but that's why we have investigations. have a neutral fact pattern, clearly the members which of the tee want kavanaugh to be confirmed. so why should people want him to be confirmed why not have neutral observessers wrestle the facts to the ground so it's not a waste of time. >> john, we already know what everyone who is alleged to be at the party has said. they submitted statements or been interviewed under penalty

of perjury, i would be shocked if any changed their statement under penalty of perjury to the fbi f. this makes a few senators more comfortable about going forge war and voting on judge kavanaugh's very highly qualified nomination, in the face of an orchestrated democratic smear campaign then that may be a good thing. >> dickerson: was judge kavanaugh truthful? >> i found him to be truthful. i found him to be appropriately indignant at the smear campaign and i'm disappointed what chris said on that video leading it reminds me of old proverb, this animal to very wicked when it defends itself. if they didn't want him to come in, come in be angry and indignant at their false accusations they should have thought about that before they accused him of being a serial sex criminal. >> dickerson: if he was not truthful about something that has nothing to do with what allegedly happened 36 years ago, truthfulness still something you want in supreme court nominee, though, is that relevant? >> what are you talking about? >> turns out in the course of

the fbi investigation. >> open ended fishing expediti expedition. >> dickerson: that's not fair. >> what are you talking about? dickerson: if it turns out that something outside of that is -- if his testimony turns out -- >> as john kennedy and lindsay graham said if there is some shocking bit -- but evidence and proof then of course, i'm open to evaluating that evidence. but i strongly suspect that every statement that was made to the judiciary committee under penalty of perjury is the exact same statements going to be made to the fbi. >> dickerson: we'll know in a week. thank you, senator. want to get some perspective from key democrat, minnesota democratic senator amy klobuchar is in minneapolis this morning. senator, what are your expectations about what the fbi will be investigating? >> well, i think it's really important that the fbi get to the bottom of the evidence here. because what happens in that hearing was that a number of my colleagues on the other side of the aisle said that they respe

respected dr. ford. that they thought she had dignity, that they found her system compelling. you don't respect her if you don't try to figure out what actually happened. so that's why i was so pleased when senator flake rose to the occasion said it was beneath the dignity of the senate and the the court if you don't follow up. and that's what this one week investigation is about and as long as it is conducted in a professional manner we give the fbi the ability to do their job instead of having it be micro managed by the white house, we can at least get to the bottom of the evidence. >> dickerson: is your expectation when they do their job just interview the four people who were allegedly at this party or that they will do things outside of that going to look where mr. judge worked at the safeway and so forth? >> it is the latter. i think they have to have the ability. i'm a former prosecutor. they have to have ability to

pursue the evidence. you look at background checks, when either whether it's obama white house, the trump white house, yes, they can order a background check when they put in a nomination in place. but they cannot say, only interview the people in their neighborhoods on one side of the street or only interview people from a certain period of their life. you let the men and women of the fbi, the professionals do their job and that is what three republicans, three undecided republicans did not feel comfo comfortable moving forward with the vote on the floor without having this information. that is how you show dr. ford the respect you deserve. unlike what i just heard from my colleague senator cotton, i think that there is evidence here. she six years ago before judge kavanaugh was famous, she said his name to her husband in a therapy session and there are notes from that session. she took a polygraph test and

passed with flying colors. and the fbi can look at that. there's all kinds of evidence that they can look at. >> dickerson: senator, do you expect the fbi to look into the claims that judge kavanaugh made to you and others on the commit deity about his drinking habits, about college, about high scho school, is that -- is the inquiry going into testing whether those statements were true? >> well, i think that is relevant, because when i was asking him about whether or not he had blacked out or maybe partially blacked out in the past because of excessive drin drinking, he turned it back on me instead of really answering that question. the reason it's relevant is perhaps he doesn't remember what happened because there were repeated incidences of this excessive drinking. so, i do think it's relevant, again i don't think people should be micro managing the fbi investigation, we can make very clear that we think they should do the broad investigation we can get in a week which is all senator flake would ask for.

but again, at least he asked for it, unlike some of my colleagues that just thought they should march ahead when a woman was telling her story, not just to a jury box of strangers, as so many people have to do when they're a victim but to a nati nation, to the world. >> dickerson: let me ask you about senator graham's claim then claim you heard senator cotton make repeatedly this morning which is essentially that the democrats on the committee have held this information, sprung it at the last minute. senator graham in the hearing said you had no intention of protecting dr. ford, none. >> you know what i thought when i heard senator cotton i thought of that old legal adage if you don't have the facts you argue the facts, if you don't have either you prone the table. the truth is this is a woman that went in and called the receptionist of her congresswoman just to report something before this man had even been nominated. she was concerned because his name was out there and she

wanted to get the information. then after she wrote this letter which i didn't know about until a few weeks ago but when she wrote the letter she asked her congresswoman and senator feinstein for confidentiality. that is why they hadn't given it to the fbi. >> dickerson: one thing -- the news organization -- dickerson: say we've got this information, let's work on this get this investigated together. >> i think that senator feinstein took this very seriously when she requested confidentiality. here is the thing, the justice system is -- things come in at the last minute all the time before trials, the question is not, what happened in the past, we can exam in that later, there may have been better ways to handle this. the question is when you have power, what do you do with that information. do you just sweep it under the rug and say, well, what happened in a house doesn't blog in the courthouse? no, you look at it. you don't sweep it under the rug and that is the question that i

posed to my colleagues that day and i am just thankful that senator flake didn't have the stomach to let this continue without giving this woman the respect she deserves. >> dickerson: 20 seconds. this question of temperament, doesn't judge kavanaugh, isn't he right to defend himself if he feels he was wrongly accused? >> of course he has the right to defend himself. but this isn't a criminal trial. that is a job interview for the highest court in the land and my colleagues who are still u undecided that's not me, are going to have to evaluate that temperament and evaluate his decisions from the past which i think are extreme when it comes to presidential power. hand picked by a president. >> dickerson: thank you so much, senator. we'll be back in a moment with more "face the nation." don't go away.

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people were wrung out, too, from just watching. each an expert on their pain, 100% certain and the only certainty was that only one could be right. the woe accumulated, kavanaugh's daughter praying for ford. ford calling lawyers from the walgreen's parking lot so that even 36 years later her parents wouldn't find out. the high school calendars that judge kept like his dad and fo ford's dispute with her husband over adding a second door to a renovation because, the attack left her scared of enclosed spaces. the arena added to the anguish, the world's greatest deliberative body handled society's toughest question with the nuance of a freight train. partisanship shattered the dish that is supposed to cool the hot cup. at the end have of this drama there will be no winners and y yet, calls to sexual assault hot lines have increased to 0% since ford's testimony.n both sides en

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