captioning sponsored by cbs >> it's sunday, july 14th, i'm marge brendon, and this is "face the nation." tensions are high this sunday morning after president trump announced a crackdown on undocumented migrants in cities across the country. >> president trump: people come into ourñi country illegally. we're taking them out legally. very simple. >> brennan: as the political battle over how to handle migrants seeking asylum in the u.s., and how theom detention centers gets even more devisive. >> no great nation tears families a. >> brennan: vice president mike pence toured facilities,ñi defending immigration

officials' treatment of detainees. >> are they taking good care of you here? do you have enough to eat? >> brennan: even he concedes...it is a crisis situation that needs urgent attention. >> to be honest with you, i was not surprised by what i saw. this is tough stuff. >> brennan: can leaders put politics aside to fix the broken immigration syv >> we are 40 days here. we haven't taken a shower feq >> brennan: we'll discuss with mark morgan, and dick durbin, and former homelan homeland security secretary, jeh johnson. and as cbc news launches a week of network wide coverage of the apollo 11 mission to the moon, we'll look back at how we got there. and we'll talk with jim

bridenstein about what is ahead for space exploration in the next 50 years and beyond. it's all coming up on "face the nation." ♪ >> brennan: good morning, and welcome to "face the nation." as we come on the air, residents and local officials in nine major u.s. cities are preparing for agents from the immigrations and customs enforcement agency, commonly known as i.c.e., to round up immigrants who have missed a court appearance or who have been ordered removed from the united states. we begin with mark morgan, the acting commission of cb.p., which in forces immigration law and controls the u.s. border. good morning. >> good morning. thank you for having me. >> brennan: i understand you're at c.b. p., and you worked previously at i.c.e. the president said those arrested today will be put in prison or sent back.

what can you tell us about how many people will be rounded up and where they're go? >> the numbers are going to be left up to i.c.e., and i really want to stay away from the operational details specifically, and focusing on the numbers and cities, but what we need to do, part of this narrative is we need to be intellectually honest when we're going forward with this. the individuals that i.c.e. goes after, and they do this every single day, are not individuals that are here undocumented. they're individuals that are here illegally. in this case, their priority always has been, and it will be, to go after those who are here criminally. and they committed additional crimes against american citizens. part of that priority is to also go after and apply consequenses and enforce the rule of law to those individuals who had due process and received a final order of removal from a judge and they still remain here illegally. to maintain integrity in the system, we have to

apply consequences to everyone. >> brennan: can you say whether there will be family separations? if someone is arrested, their children come home, either they're u.s.-born or they're coming home to find a parent now in detention, what happens? can you avoid that situation? >> of course, the design is not about family separation. that is not the intent. it never has been, and never will be. the intent -- >> brennan: can you avoid it? >> the intent is to enforce the rule of law. absolutely. the men and women of i.c.e. are heros, fathers, mothers, sisters and brothers, and they're going to apply this with humanity and compassion. there is a whole host of scenarios they can go. if they run across a mother that came here illegally, had due process, but she is currently in her third trimester of pregnancy, of course they're not going to apprehend that individual. they're going to give her a paper, notice to appear,ñwd and come back later when it is appropriate.

>> brennan: where will these people go? as we've beenñr talking about, and in the facilities you run, there is this crisis of overcrowding. is i.c.e. putting these people in centers that are already overcrowded as well? >> no. and i'm glad you ask that question. there is a lot of confusion with respect to the holding facilities that customs and border protection hold, they're meant kind of like a police station. they're not meant, nor were they designed to be long-term holding facilities. i.c.e., the facilities that have, are. and families will gow3 toxd family residential centers that are specifically designed to house families on a longer-term basis.j:it is t environment from what you'll see from a c.b c.b.p.border parole holding facilities. >> brennan: there is this question of why these arrests are happening now at a time when you have been talking about overcrowding, at a time

when you're in the middle of a re-election campaign. it seems to be, to many critics, politically motivated. >> i can't speak to you from a political side. i can speak to you from a law enforcement side. i can tell you, one of the largest incentives is you grab a kid, and that is your passport into the country. once you get into the country, you're allowed to stay. if we don't apply interior enforcement action consequences for those who have received due process -- >> brennan: but what did the president announce it? this is a law enforcement action? >> you have to ask the president on this. but all i can tell you is i support this 100%. this is a consequence we need to apply to take that pull factor away, so they stop making a dangerous trek and risk in their lives. >> brennan: the president this morning put out a series of tweets, he suggested that foreign-born female members of congress need to go, quote, "go back to

the places to which they came." who is the president talking about and how is this helpful if you're trying to get democrats in congress to work with you. who is he talking about? >> i think you need the talk to the president about his specific tweets.ñr what i will tell you is we absolutely have a crisis on the border, 100%, and congress -- i can tell you, unequivically, congress has failed to do what they need to do to address this crisis. we've been pleading with them for a long time, you fix the settlement agreement, you fix the catch and release, and 85% of this crisis ends the next day. that's what we need congress to do on a bipartisan effort. >> brennan: let me ask you about what is happening in some of the facilities you oversee. today the president tweeted there have been great reviews of children's detention centers. we know that the vice president went down and toured multiple facilities, one of them

being a children's center. the house oversight committee this week released a report there are at least still 30 children separated from their parents for more than a year who have not been reunited with them or released to somebody else to take care of them. do you understand why facts like that make it hard for anyone in congress, the democrats say, to trust the administration withholding children in detention or potentially for longer periods of time, as some are proposing. >> what i would say is, facts matter all the way around. neither does the rhetoric that is out there that is absolutely false. >> brennan: this is a house oversight report. >> you said facts are important, i agree that facts are important -- >> brennan: you agree that is a fact, the 30 children who continue to be separated? >> yes. we've been talking about that a long time, to reunite those families that have been separated a long time.

let's talk about facts. the facts areww3 we've been asking congressp,"f]r a very supplemental, for example, because we agreed that children should not be in facilities that border patrol has, they're holding facilities -- >> brennan: that's the 4.5 billion. >> 3.5 billion of that went to h.h.s. i'm not in that department, but i'm asking for the supplemental to get them the money they o re can t out of the border patrol holding facilities where they don't polan.ñixd bel. we'veñr been asking that for months.xdçóta e've beençó askint funding. >> brennan: we have the video on the tour he went where he saw men are being held, a different facility from where the children are. i want to read from the poll report: "cages were

so crowded, it would have been impossible for all of the men to lie on the croat. there were 350 men, some sleeping on concrete. when they saw the press arrive, the men began shouting, telling us they were in 40 days or longer. they were hungry, and wanted to brush their feet. it was sweltering hot. agents were wearing face masks." are these acceptable conditions? >> the way you describe it as conditions, i would not describe them as they were described. >> brennan: this was the video. this is a video and a reporter's eye witness account. >> i would not consider it sweltering hot. i was there, alongside the vice president, when i was there. make no mistake,ñi was itñi overcrowded?y3 margaret, weçó havexd beenñrçó saying that fo( a very long time these conditions are crowded -- >> brennan: you agree it is unacceptable? >>bsçó unacceptable. >> brennan: what are you doing now?

the funding has been approved. >> had congress given the funding earlier than we asked, it would have helped alleviat alleviateing soe of the overcrowding. senator lindsey graham has a bill he is trying toñr push forward rightñr no that would absolutely overnight helpñr eliminate what youxd saw when we went down there with the vice president. congress needs to act. they know it and they're failing to do so. >> brennan: we're going to talk to senator dick durbin next, thank you. who is working with senator graham, who's legislation you mentioned here. senator durbin joins us from chicago. good morning to you, senator. >> good morning, margaret. >> brennan: you're in one of the cities where the i.c.e. arrests are expected to happen. what are you seein things, the third level in the community, particularly the hispanic community, have never seen it at this

high level. i was handed this note by a young girl who is a high school student, ga gada loop.çó3 she couldn because she was crying so hard. she said her parents worked hard. the second thing i'm feeling sis amobile mobilization. and the families simply want a chance to be part of america's future. >> brennan: senator, you said many of these people haven't broken the law. according to i.c.e., 90% of migrants they arrest have qrkminal chargesçó or they illegally re-entered the country after being removed. are you arguing that law enforcement shouldn't be enforcing the law as it is written? >> if someone has come to this country and broken the law, they have disqualified themselves -- >> brennan: by entering illegally, though, by definition, they have broken the law. >> yes, but that's a

significant difference. even mr. morgan went to that point. he said if there was an additional criminal violation. i feel the same way about a serious criminalthey havquiede but what we're finding, as we did with the zero-tolerance policy, the simple fact of crossing the border and having a technical legal violation at that point is being used as a basis for deportation of people who otherwise have nothing in their background or radio that is a dangerous to us. that is when you get into trouble. that's when you start not only deporting people who may be serious offenders, but people who want to have añi good life here. >> brennan:w3 thei]xd presidendr tweeted that congress who are foreign-born should go back to whereasj from.ñ wha to your attempts toçóxd workjfçó across the aisle? do you consider it a --

>> that kind of careless rhetoric by the president, it doesn't help one bit. my mother was an immigrant to this country, brought here byñiok msiñ$tçó grandpareni fromçó lithuania, do i fit into the president's fktjnh;: the united states,ñi as myñrjf moth%rd didxd andlk did, trying to make this a better so'ntry.w3 and i say the same for these members of congress. i think there is only one in particular he is pointing to. the fact that they went to refugee camps, came to the united states, clawed their way into an existence and eventually were elected, thanks goodness. that iswoat america holds as a dream for people around the world, and the president should not diminish it. >> brennan: why didn't you go on this tour with republicans and the vice president down to see the border facilities on friday? >> i've been there. i was just there eight weeks ago in the el paso area. i'm going to return in the next week. i watched as this group was information, and it

became apparent to me it was more about public relations than really getting down to serious policy discussions. >> brennan: what we saw on the video, not all of it is necessarily favorable to the administration. wouldn't it have been helpful for you to be there, alongside republicans, to make the statement you're working across the aisle or trying to. >> senator lindsey graham, republican, and the chairman of the judds sheethe judiciarycommittee are h the policy. we will continue to. i've been there, and i'm going back. what was in the video is bad, and what i saw>7#re worse. the kids in cages were not part of the video. the fact is, it is happening, and america is rejecting this approach by the trump administration. they don't want to see more of these mass arrests and deportations, families split apart. now, listen to this, we're hearing from the administration the serious humanitarian challenges at the border. those are going to beñioke6

i.c.e. raids across the united states as families are divided andñi young people arekor sent to more detention facilities. it is not going to make it any better. >> brennan: the administration says that the work you and senator graham are doing is essentially the only game in town. you said there are at least five or six areas of common ground that democrats in the senate and the house could support. what are they? >> i can give you several of them. unlike the president, we believe you need to have foreign assistance to these three countries exiting to find their way into the united states. secondly, when it comes to the to them like human bricks. stricter penalties, more enforcement, i'm for it. more judges and courts, i'm for it. faster times for the cases, particularly children, of course. we ought to reinstate what

obama had, in the embassies of these three countries, we could have young people, and perhaps adults as well, applying for asylum in that country -- >> brennan: if they're in úigger from the country they're fleeing from, how does applying from that country protect them? >> you úu) your finger on one of the flaws in what i just said. we answer it by saying if we can find a place in mexico, for example, maybe under united nations' supervision, where there is a safe venue for them to apply, for asylum status cnññi the united states, i'm open to that conversation. but we have to understand,xd and state representative ramerez just came back from guatemala, and theñr situation is desperate in that country. people have nowhere to turn, games, extortion, threats of rape and murder that is going on constantly. they're going to risk know staying in guatemala in many circumstances is deadly. >> brennan: senator durbin, thank you very much. we'll be back in win

minute with former home land security secretary jeh johnson.okçó ñi ñr

>> brennan:çó secretary jeh johnson served in the obama administration, and he joins us from new york this morning. good morning to you, mr. secretary. president obama deported three million migrants from the united states. you were secretary at that time. how is what president trump is trying to do any different? >> well, first, margaret, i have to say mr. morgan dubbed your question about the president's tweet.ñi i will not. i cannot believe a president of the united states would make a statement about foreign-born members of congress, suggesting they go back to where they came from. what the president needs to appreciate, in addition to it being offensive, you're unb very own administration's efforts at working with congress constructively on what mr. morgan referred to as needed legislative

fixes.q so americans should not become numb to this kind of language and offensive statements. and we need to work with congress and the executive branch in order to get anything done. so in the obama administration, certainly the last few years i served as secretary of homeland security, we13!0@6 the interior, deporting those who are convicted felons. 7ou have to alsow3 havex< priority those apprehended at the border for the sake of border security. but the number of deportations over time in the obama administrationñi actually went down while the percentage of those deported, who were convicted felons and who were in local jails, went up. and it's all about enforcing ourçó im laws,ñi butñi inñi a wayçóñi thi fair andñrçó humane and promotes public safety. and that was or priority. and on day one of this administration, the president literally tory

up those priorities. and soçóñi now -- >> brennan: the president -- >> now we'reñr seeing -- go ahead. >> brennan: the president summoned his they're up to one million migrants that have impendingñrders of removal against them. isñrñrw3ñixd it realistic to say that many people canx#k be deported? >> no, it is not. it is important for people to know their rights in this circumstance. if someone from i.c.r.o. comes to someone's home, unless they have a warrant, that person is not required to admit them. they have a right to remain silent. they have a right to a lawyer. and they should not be deported from this country unless there has been a final order of deportation by an immigration judge after the individual has had an opportunity to go through the appellate process and make whatever claims for asylum they have. and so there must be a final order of removal. very often if someone is ordered deported in ab

abstentiía, they have a right. and they need to know exactly what their rights are. >> brennan: we've been talking about theñi conditions at facilities, detention facilities of many forms, under i want to show an image of you touring a f arizona back in 3 president trump often refers to the language, referring to the chain link fence dividers, cagesñi as some call them, as unique,ñli thatçó the obama administration is doing, though, all of this in a way he just had to contscuqk things essentiallyñi the same way.xd heñi inheritedñr theçóhh what is soñi different? >>ñi wwln, there are a number of things different, margaret. first, there was no zero-tolerance policy in the obama administration. we did notñr separate families as a policy and practice. and the photograph you showed -- i remember that visit well. it was arizona, june 2014, during the spike we had

then, though the numbersçó were not as high as they areñr now. and under the law, if you have an unaccompaniedñi child cross t border, d.h.s.çó in 7 required to turn that child over to d.h.s. and we needed to have places, like the one we set up temporarily in arizona, to house the kids until theyxd can be placed with h.h.s. and theó partitions you see, some call them cages, are meant to separate the women from the men, the girls from the boys, but these were temporary. what that photograph.f spent half my time at that facility actually inside those fenced-in areas, talking to the youngñi boys and girls about their situation and about the conditions. >> brennan: all right. secretary johnson, thank you for your time. we'll be back in a moment. don't go away. x ñi

>> brennan: 50 years ago this week, cbs's walter cronkite reported from blast off to putting a man on the moon. we will celebrate that, including a prime time special tuesday night anchored by no norah o'donnell. and they will reair chron chrons coverage of the liftoff in realtime.

>> brennan: some of our stations are leaving us now, but we will be right back with a lot more "face the nation," including a look at what is ahead for the network this week as we honor that 50th anniversary of the apollo 11launch and landing, but our panel is up next, so stay with us.

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