hello. on behalf of the archdiocese of san francisco welcome to mosaic. the day we introduced to the ministry of the catholic church, this is an office, a function, an order referred to in the earliest jip chooser of the new testament. it endured for several centuries but for about 1,000 year after that it laid dormant. only in the 20th century did a renewed understanding of this

ministry and awareness of the church's need for it's become resurrected. the prescription was given in the documents of the second vatican sun sil in genesee yum. in 1968, the catholic bishop said the united states petitioned pope paul the 6th. more than 18,000 men in the united states have been ordained since then to this office. so, we're talking about the office of deacon. today our guest is one of the deacons who is ordained for the chdiese saancio. now after this brief break, come back and stay with us as we learn abut this in its new application.

hello and thank for jog us. this is deacon michael. you go by mike. >> i go by deacon mike. >> it is an it italian consonant in there. you're a deacon in the archdiocese of san francisco. you're an ordained minister. i start everything i know about it i learned from you recently. this idea it is an ancient christian vocation, i will read from the a pistol of st. paul that you turned me on to and paul who is in jail now, jailed

by the romans for his catholic christian faith writes to the people in greece and he says i write to all of you to the holy ones in christ jesus who are there with the overseers and deacons, ministers. traction lace is different. grace to you and peace to you our father. i give thanks at my god for every remembrance of you, because of the partnership from the boss spell to the first day until now. vo. is ancient roots of i want you to tell mebout ae is vocation of deacon if you can. >> well, the rst deacons 6. >>of the a poss sols >> when the greek widows complained they were not being served, they were being ignored and they asked the apostles to a point someone to serve them. so the they appointed seven good men, the first deacons, among them steven on that.

this is recorded in acts chapter 6. >> this was the coun mow ty in jerusalem finding its way with these deacon? >> right. exactly. to begin with on sure >> and it was necessary because like i said, they were forming into different facets and as it began to spread, pe op wein re the faith but were also greek and it was the greek widows that wanted someone of their background so it was a need that needed to be filled literally in the early church. >> i get it. i'm very vague on this. already the jewish disciples had gentile converts. >> exactly. >> and with a different culture and needs and so on. >> yes. >> it says the apostles were busy with the preaching.

what did the deacons do? >> literally they cared for them and with food and shelter. when they gathered for the meal, the lord's meal, then they also they would have a little meal afterwards to make sure the widows, too, were served, the greek widows were served. howdo pu t it? in a new organization or a thing that is not well organized, a new move: jobs have to get parceled out, right? >> that part of it. >> they chose -- you mentioned the phrase what were these men described as? >> the act con notes which is servant. >> what was their able men or? >> good men. >> good men. >> men of good virtue basically and that description is later used in timothy to describe deacons so hopefully, we measure up today.

>> and everyone knows about saint steven but i didn't connect him until you mentioned the de act co nats. >> steven be came our first martyr on that and we don't know a lot, but he was also doing some preaching and he was very adamant and it was because of his preaching that he was eventually martyred. >> in jerusalem, these deacons were at work. they are namend in the acts of the apostles, the 7 men. do we flow the history of the other men? >> we know a little about philip a story about philip an ethiopian but others we don't know as much about as to what they did or where they went. >> now, we understand that the offices of -- in the church, became organized and distinguished over the early centuries, right? and there were three main categories? >> three main categories. >> tell us about that. >> bishops. >> you have to speak greek to

get this program but a pes scho pals. >> which our term for bishops. priests and then deacons orser vants. >> and these were, are there any other notable deacons in the early history? >> in the very early history, we have lawrence in rome, who was asked to bring about and present to the emperor the riches of the church. >> >> now let me pause. i learned about limb in 3rd grade maybe, famous martyr. >> >> not to give it away. i had no association of rihim h being a deacon but tell us that story. >> so -- becausaconwere con rolling the finance the emperor the riches of the church. he brought all the poor and presented them to him and he wasn't warmly received. he was martyred for that.

>> so he was -- he had access to the finances of the church and was told hand over the treasures. that is good. >> yes. >> that is a good man. he was yrbyma rtthe thromance? >> in rome on that. >> and then i heard about doctor of the church, learned theolo jen in syria. >> saint e triple. >> in the 4th century. >> and he became a doctor of the church. he did many writing and letters that would still come down to us today. >> so the office of deacon as i understand it, it became part of the order of advancements toward priesthood, is that right? >> it became one of the onders. in other words ks we had a variety of orders. we had porter, sub deacon, deacon and then priest on that but there were others also in there. >> we have supressed most of

those with the exception of lecter and reader or lecter or reader and acolyte that we use as steps to the de act that and steps to the priesthood. >> that good to know. we're going to take a brief break and then take about the change of the fee october that from a change tomopped modern o [ cell phone rings ] >> yi see them every day.too.

>> the curtains, they're always drawn in this place. >> i know. >> that guy, it seems like he's in charge of them. i don't know, i don't feel very good about this. >> we have to report this. >> yes, absolutely.

or so. now, let's talk to your personal -- let's talk about this. you're not a deacon from the third century a d. >> no. >> you're from the 20th century. you are ordained as a minister for the archdiocese of san francisco. as i said in the opening, your vocation, your office is a new one founded about 50 years ago. what happened there? >> yes. in 1967 after vatican 2, the church was looking for ways to involvement laity more than the participation in the church. part of that was expanding the office order of the diaconate and so the act that is a bridge between clergy and laity. that is what we're supposed to -- the idea we bring those people to the church and so one of our formation directors

told us that chould ou. eabe preaching to the people in the back pew. >> okay. >> because that is the ones we're bringing into church. the ones that don't quite feel like they belong, bring them into the church to full rtpaio ipat icinn liturgy, service. >> i knew the last step on the way to the priesthood before he is ordained as a priest, he is ordained as a deacon. >> transitional deacon. 0 and your office is permanent deacon. >> yes. >> and you are ordained to what ministry? you're not a junior priest of some kind? >> no. a lot of people think you're a mini priest so when the priest is there, you'll take over. that is not the call to the diaconate. it is more one of service. the priests have christ as the

icon of the high priest. that is their kind of goal. for the deacons it is more christ the service is our icon, the one that we try to imitate. >> that is interesting. there is a theology of the priest as out there. he does the sacrifice in the uke crist. >> that is why the deacon cannot say a mass or consec crate the uke crist. we can assist the priest but we cannot hear confession, and we cannot anoint the sick. >> you do have la ter jig cal and pastoral duties and specialties. >> yes. >> give me those. >> we can preach, rican proclaim the gospel, we can preach, we can baptize. we oversee vigils or committals at the cemeteries. >> sola turning cal and pastoral. as you mentioned before the

pastoral side involves outreach to the laity particularly to the marginalized people, is that right? >> exactly. it is specifically meant if you think of the old testament call to take care of the widows, orphans and stranger in the land or the immigrants, that is the call to the diaconate. >> and you know, i don't have experience of deacon. an elder gentleman i knew in oakland had become a deacon there, but in my upbringing i haven't had much experience of them, but from the statistics that we agree we read, 18,000 men in the united states ar this ministry throughout the states. >> people have answered the call. who are these people? what about the call brings them in? >> well, the vast majority of deacons are married and so you're not only having a deacon, a married man, but the wife also participates with

him. very often in ministry. my wife works with me in marriage preparation and in preparing couples to get married within the church and things of that nature. deacons, we have deacons who work with the homeless, work in soup kitchens, jail ministry, juvenile ministry. anywhere there is a need of service to the people of god. >> and fascinating you mention the wife because i think the majority of ordained deacons are married men. >> about 90%. >> okay. so the church looks for that and the wife has to be how do i put it, dis seven her over vocation in that as well. >> she has to be willing that her husband become ordained. we ask that before they join the diaconate formation and we ask it every year until ord din flation and then they ask it during the ordination itself. >> it is a i mean, very--a

complex vocation. ner must be severe training, discernment process. >> i don't know if hter] years of theology. >> okay. >> and we start with the catechism of the church general systematic theology, then we move anon to new testament, old testament theology, chris stoll gy, all different types of immoral theology, all different types of things we need to learn because people will be asking us questions. >> well, of course. yes. >> so you have the training. five year program. that is done locally for our archdiocese? it is done actually we take it two saturdays a month done at the seminary, saint patrick's seminary. it is from 9:00 to 3:00 so two saturdays and we'll have some evening classes sometimes but

that is the majority of the classes held na su' five years of night school, weekend school with your wife's accompany neyment and permission and coopation and then when you're ordained deacon can your work range from a few hours a week to a full-time job? >> yes. yes. we ask that deacons put in about ten hours a week and that can work it out with your pastor as to what that is. if you're doing homilies and you're presenting at all the masses, that will be ten hours easily if you have six masses. it is going to easily come from that but also we have them doing things like sending food baskets or food harvests or anything that they bring -- that st. vincent de paul, all different types of things flat deacons work wit in the parish and then we also work with the

jail ministries and things of that nature or the meoutssse le for the whole archdiocese. >> my understanding is 40% or 50% of these men are holding down full-time jobs, as well. >> yes. almost everybody is holding down a job and maybe the wives are working too and still they are putting in these hours above and beyond, and they are not compensated for this. >> and we thank mo s e ons ar ing.

hello. welcome back. we're having an enjoyable conversation, a loom thin mating conversation from deacon mike. i haven't asked you for your full title where you work. >> i'm the director of dough acinate ministry and life. >> i take it that means the deacons have a ministry but they also have a life. >> yes. >> how many deacons do we have in the archdiocese? >> this is always an excellent question. we have 110 in coordinated in the archdiocese of san francisco. 20 of those are work outside the archdiocese. in ministry. >> in ministry as far away as guatemala and honduras. retid so 75 active deacons

for san francisco. >>they are mostly in parish work? >> almost all are. some are in like jail ministry or things of that nature that are specific or some of them are both in parish work and an arch dao sis ministry. >> we have like to have? >> ideally i would like to have two deacons per parish. that way erl peovrsonal itand w actually use two deacons per parish. we have plenty of room to grow and we also have plenty of time and we need people joining us who are a little bit younger. we ask that they don't apply >>ter the anyone of mase owti6 a time when a man who has prior responsibilities looks around and says this might be for me

so you have some of these people applying. >> yes, we do. but you can't be younger, say 35. you need to be ordained at 35. >> i the were three evening meetings in different places, different counties of the archdiocese. the advertisement was interested in being a deacon? come tort informational meeting. find out about it. >> no salesman will call. no commitment or anything of that nature but information. >> people are able to find out red dilly what the de act that is and how they can find out about it from you and you're on the website? >> website. you know, sf.org. we also have an office at the chance sorry, office of the diaconate. they can call deacon fred or deacon mike. >> deacon mike, i have to say the job seems to have agreed with you, because when we first met i thought you were 20 years

younger than i am. i find out that is not the case so something is working well for you. >> i have been very fortunate. >> tell us how you got into this. how did you discern this vocation? >> it is a long process for me. out of grammar school i felt called to the seminary. >> you're a local boy, san francisco. >> san francisco. and my senior year in high school, senior year in college, i discerned that god wasn't calling me to the priesthood. he was calling me to service within the church but not the priesthood so i kind of put that a marrraed a family, four children. it wasn't until oh, i guess i was about 50, 55, i began feeling a call to more, to do more. i kept saying i don't know what that is. well my best friend, pod dry said mike, you're being called

to the diaconate. i'm like no, god doesn't want that. i argued with him for a long time about it. he turned out to be correct. i was being called for that. it took me awhile to realize li god but as i decided to aspire to it, to join, discern whether or not this was for me and obviously i fo wiwas on too she said what took you long? >> >> okay. >> so you and your wife with four kids and a prior career you told me. you were a teacher. >> i was a teacher. i had a teaching score in san francisco. >> a resource store. >> yond awe have a masters. all walks of life are found in the diaconate. i hope you guys have a good college yual relationship instructor. i think you need one. >> we definitely do.

that was the surprise for us, me and my wife as we joined the diaconate community. it was such a warm and welcoming community. there are so many good people there. i'm constantly humbled. why am i the spokesperson, they are much better than me. >> that humility. we have win minute left. give us a brief prayer to close? >> thanks. in t of the father, son and holy spirit, lord we thank you for the day you have given us, we ask you to guide us to where you want us to be today as you do always. this we ask through christ our lordnt amen. >> thank you very much for joining me. you can as i said find out all about the diaconate it archdiocese of san francisco by going to the website sf

arch.org. there is a web page, mike's telephone number is there and informational eve next. these will continue. >> they will continue. >> ask about the diaconate. it is fascinating occupation and a great service to the church. thank you once again for being with us. we'll see you next time on mosaic. $%c1

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