and healthy, and join us when our trumpet sounds again next sunday morning. ♪♪ [trumpet] ♪♪ captioning sponsored by cbs >> brennan: i'm margaret brennan, and today on "face the nation," the world watches in horror as vladimir putin continues his rampage through ukraine. what will it take to stop russia's aggression? we'll have the latest from kyiv, the capital city under siege, plus reports on the hundreds of thousands of ukrainians desperate to escape the violence. we'll talk with ambassador to the united nations, linda thomas greenfield, republican congresswoman liz cheney, and former national security advisor h.r. mcmaster. and we'll also look at potential financial fallout from the crisis with the president of the world bank, david malpas, and explore how a crisis 5,000 miles away is

impacting americans. and we'll talk about president biden's historic supreme court pick with south carolina congress james clyburn. it is all just ahead on "face the nation." ♪♪ >> brennan: good morning, and welcome to "face the nation."the rea of eoa pi bus the r illhard fatho thtuation is getting more dire by the hour as the russian military surrounding most of ukraine tightens. but ukrainians are literally fighting in the streets to defend the key cities of kyiv and char kharkiv. in the past 24 hours the u.s. and allies ratcheted up financial pressure on

putin with massive sanctions. and in return for those tougher sanctions, putin has put his nuclear deterrence forces on high alert. cbs's david martin is here for more on that, but first we begin with charlie d'agata in kyiv. >> reporter: good morning, margaret. the ukr ukrainian president has accused russia of potentially targeting civilians in another night of airstrikes in the capital. but russian deriaught vernight tg aim oil and gas attacks. in ukraine's second city of kharkiv...street battles are under way as ukrainian soldiers and civilians struggle to keep control of the city. in kyiv, a missile tears through an apartment block. where we found dazed and

displaced residents dragging belongings away. this is some of the debris and rubble that reigns down from this apartment block after a missile strike. the russian military says this is not one of ours, instead blaming ukrainian air defenses forgoing off target. many have sought shelter deep underground in the city's subway network. angela moved here from crimea after the russian military invaded there in 2014. >> you don't know what to do. you are just scared. but now i know what to do. >> reporter: the government has called on men 18 to 60 to step up and fight, handing out around 18,000 weapons. they don't want us revealing this location because they don't want it to be a target for the russian military, but we have seen a steady stream of volunteers. the commander told us it is not hundreds but thousands, very few with

any military experience. every single one of them ready to fight. ukraine's soldiers and reserveists now man check points in the city streets, on the hunt for plain-clothed russians trying to in infiltrate the capitol. explosions have continued overnight and throughout the day. the mayor has ordered everyone off the streets until at least tomorrow at 8:00 a.m., saying anyone caught outside will be considered an enemy. margaret? >> brennan: charlie dagang, stay safe. the united nations estimate about up to five million ukrainians may flee to neighboring countries. cristina has been following that. here is her report.[speaking fon language] >> we're all here. >> reporter: for ukrainians trying to leave, there are no more good options.

this train from lviv was overrun by panicked passengers. and on the road, it is mostly women and children, dragging what they can carry past gridlocked cars. military-aged men aren't allowed to leave. the cold walk to poland can take more than 20 hours, but once they cross, aid agencies offer warm soup, free rides, an0 ukrae ukrainians have fled to poland, and to nearby romania -- >> my husband is still there. we'll fight, even if europe doesn't help. >> reporter: and 10,000 to latvia, where the government is offering financial aid to anyone shelters refugees. this 25-year-old is a ukrainian living in poland. she says if the u.s. and others don't do more to

stop vladimir putin, other countries could be next. >> now ukrainians are fighting for all of us. my country is dying for all of us. >> reporter: despite the exodus, we have actually seen intimate lines going back into ukrainian. many are young ukrainian men from all over europe. they told us they're going back home to join the fight. margaret? >> brennan: thank you. national security correspondent david martin is here with more on the troop movements in ukraine. the reporting is that the ukrainian resistance is putting up a fierce fight, and russia isn't moving as quickly as they thought they would. >> reporter: well, it seems to be true. the russians have basically bogged down. they are still about 20 miles from the capital of kyiv, and they are starting to experience shortages of fuel, shortages of ammunition. and it is turning into a siege. and, in fact, they are

starting to use rockets, which are much less precise than missiles -- using rockets to bombard the city. the fact that the russians are bogged down may be good news for the defense of ukraine, but it is bad news for the citizens of kyiv because it puts them in even greater danger of being harmed. russia has now committed about two-thirds of those 150,000 troops that had amassed around the border, 100,000 troops, and it has not been able to take a single major city. but you have to look at it and say, they've still got 50,000 there on the border ready to commit. and lots more troops back in mother russia. so they may be suffering an embarrassment of arms, but i think most people still expect a breakthrough will come.

>> brennan: vladimir putin is known for having a very heavy hand. so how do we understand what he said this morning on tv, when he said he was increasing the nuclear deterrence readiness level. that sounds like a threat to the west. >> well, you know, he started before the invasion threatening. he said anybody who tries to under fear will suffer consequences like they've never seen before in history. he didn't say nuclear, but that's what he was talking about. now he is putting his troops -- or says he is putting his troops or nuclear forces on higher alert. and this is clearly an effort to sort of shock the rest of the world into realizing how important ukraine is to him and what he is willing to do to take ukraine. and the pentagon war games

stuff like this, a russian invasion of a country in europe, bogs down the u.s., and nato starts to come to their defense. russia sets off a small, low-yield nuclear weapon just to shock everybody into staying in place and stepping back for a moment and considering what is going on here. i don't want to scare people with the thought that russia is somehow getting prepared to launch nuclear missiles at the u.s. i don't think that is likely. but the problem is if just one, low-yield nuclear weapon goes off, even if he just does a demonstration shot out in siberia, there is just no experience for what happens next. so it is a dangerous moment, not just for ukraine but for the world.

>> brennan: a very dangerous moment. thank you very much, david, for giving us the bottom line on that. we go now to the u.s. ambassador to the united nations, linda thomas greenfield, who joins us from new york. good morning to you, madam ambassador. vladimir putin has been speaking on state tv with his top officials and said he was ordering russia's nuclear deterrent forces to be on alert for a special regime of combat duty. can you tell us what that means? >> it means that president putin is continuing to escalate this war in a manner that is totally unacceptable, and we have to continue to condemn his actions in the most strong -- it possible way. >> brennan: to be clear, is this just loose talk about nuclear weapons, or is there some kind of heightened readiness and reason to be concerned? >> i'm just hearing this

from you, margaret, but i'm not surprised at this information because putin has tried every means possible to actually put fear in the world, in terms of his actions, and it just means that we have to ramp up our effort here elwhere to hold himns an accountable. >> brennan: this morning the united kingdom's foreign minister said the conflict will get very, very bloody, and she raised the prospect of unsavory weapons. and i know ukraine has also raised concerns about russia handing out gas masks in the eastern part of the country. is there a threat of chemical and biological weapons being used? >> certainly nothing is off the table with this guy. he is willing to use whatever tools he can to intimidate ukrainians and the world. and, again, we have to

continue, as the president has indicated, to hold him accountable, and that is exactly what we're doing here in new york. >> brennan: let me ask you about the biden administration's strategy here because sanctions have really been at the heart of the policy. but we've seen an evolution in explaining their purpose. take a listen. >> the president believesa3 that sanctions are intended to deter. >> the purpose of the sanctions has always been and continues to be deterrence. >> once you trigger the sanctions, you lose the deterrent effect. >> no one expected the sanctions to prevent anything from happening. >> brennan: if the sanctions weren't meant to prevent anything from happening, then what was the purpose? >> we always had a two-pronged approach to this. the president indicated that nothing was off the table, so while we were using -- >> brennan: well, he said u.s. force was off the table. >> i'm sorry? >> brennan: he did say

u.s. force, u.s. combat troops, were off the table. >> u.s. combat troops in ukraine are off the table, but u.s. troops in our nato countries, bolstering our support for nato, has never been taken off the table. and as you know, the president has approved additional troops to support nato. >> brennan: but on the issue of sanctions, which have been the prime tool, and they've ramped up over the past 72 to 48 hours, the president said earlier in the week we would have towait a month to see what the impact would be. do you think ukr ukrainians have a month to wait and see? >> we're continuing to support ukraine, not just with the sanctions we have imposed on the russians. there is other support that is going to the ukrainian government and other pressure that is bog being put on russia across the world. >> brennan: but can the government in kyiv hold on

for a month? >> we're working to support the government as much as possible, and the president of ukraine has indicated they're going to be fighting back constantly. and it is our plan to support their efforts. >> brennan: madam ambassador, there was already a refugee crisis in eastern europe, and now we have about 400,000 refugees spilling into the surrounding countries. it is wonderful to see them welcomed, but there seems to be a contradiction here because if you look at the border of poland, as you know, there are detention camps for some refugees who had come from syria, from afghanistan, from other countries. and it appears as if some refugees are treated differently based on their country of origin, if thaurifthey're european or not. how do you explain that? >> the polish governments and other governments have indicated they're opening their borders from all who

are crossing from ukraine. but we're also engaging very closely with these governments, we're engaging closely with the u.n. agencies on the ground to ensure we provide them with the resources that they need and the support that they need to ensure that every single refugee crossing into neighboring countries are received equally and with the same amount of protection. >> brennan: you know i'm talking about poland building a wall against the border with belarus to block refugees in the past. madam ambassador, big picture here: i understand your role at the united nations, but it is just the entire purpose of the u.n. to prevent something like this from ever happening again. it is why it was created after world war ii in the first place. isn't what is happening now, though, showing that that global order is failing the people of

ukraine? >> what is happening now is that the russian government has shown its disrespect for the u.n. charter and for all of the principles that we believe in. and they are isolated in that approach. they're isolated here in the united nations. we are pushing here at the u.n. to continue to call out their aggressive actions. we will continue to isolate them and to push for them to respect the charter and cease this aggressive action against ukraine. >> brennan: madam ambassador, thank you for your time this morning. "face the nation" will be "face the nation" will be back in a minute, so please stay with us. system iny in boston, where biotech innovates daily and our doctors teach at harvard medical school, and where the physicians doing the world-changing research

are the ones providing care. there's only one mass general brigham. every big idea every game changer every "how'd they do that?" starts here the blank page artists and writers know the tyranny of it well but so do developers, data scientists, ctos the new creators to them, we say let's create something that changes everything ♪ ♪ ♪ ibm let's create >> brennan: we go to representative liz cheney of wyoming. good morning to you, courtroom. congresswoman. >> good morning, margaret. >> brennan: have we reached the limit of what is possible to do here with sanctions, or is

there something more you think would make a difference? >> oh, we certainly haven't reached the limit. i think we have seen impressive progress. i think the fact that we've had european countries and nato united with the united states as we go forward is a very positive thing. i do think we need to do more. i would like to see us move, with respect to the russian central bank completely. i would like to see swift sanctions that don't leave any carveouts. i would like to see the oil industry affected. i would like to see very clear that the united states ought to be looking at ourselves as an arsenal of energy for the world, in a way that in world war ii we were an arsenal of democracy. we ought to be unleashing our own energy resources, our own energy production. we have to stop the import of russian oil to the united states. there is certainly more we could do. we ought to be sanctioning not just putin and lavrov

and the oligarchs, but all of their families. this aggression against ukraine is something the world simply cannot tolerate. so the sanctions ought to go further. as i said, we've made good progress so far. >> brennan: do you agree with president biden's strategy, rather than go nose to nose with the russian military, u.s. force should be completely off the table and it should all be dependent on sanctions? >> i think there are several things we need to be doing. we need to certainly be increasing the sanctions, as i've said. i would have sequenced the sanctions differently. i would have d done more early on. i think we need to make sure we're rushing additional javelins and missiles to european. we need to make sure we get the supplemental package moving. we need to make sure we're moving to the play forces as we are in eastern europe. we need to make sure we're

continuing to encourage our allies to do the same. i think there are a number of things we need to be doing that make very clear that the united states stands with ukraine. as you look at things like vladimir putin's threat, for example, this morning about his nuclear forces, you know that is something we need to take seriously, but we also need to be clear we're not going to be intimidated. john herd has pointed out that it cost putin nothing to make that threat, but it would cost him everything were he to follow through with any use of nuclear force. so the united states has to be absolutely clear about that. >> brennan: i want to ask you about where the conservative movement is these days with russia. j.d. bans, said on a podcast recently, i don't really care what happens to ukraine one way or the other. senator josh hawley told cbs news the u.s. should not send any troops to any non-nato country because

the u.s. can't afford it. there is this movement that president trump endorsed with america first. how do you explain to voters why that view, republican view, is wrong. >> we've been down that road before. we've seen isolationism before and it has always been dangerous. america cannot defend and maintain our own security if we think we can withdraw from the world and leave. we are watching vladimir putin as he attempts to invade a democratic, sovereign nation. anyone who thinks that u.s. freedom and security is going to be maintained if we take a step back and don't lead, you simply need to look at what is happening in ukraine to recognize those who fill the void when the u.s. steps away are people like the russians, like the chinese, like the iranians. so the idea that the world will be safe and that america will be able to be safe and free with an

isolationist approach is wrong. it is also wrong morally. america stands for freedom. america was founded on fundamental principles of freedom. and i think it is indefensible for people to abandon knows. those. >> brennan: the first impeachment trial of president trump was triggered by and intelligence official who said the president was withholding aid to president zelensky in order to win political favors. do you regret your no vote then? do you view what happened then differently now? >> brennan: i don't regret my vote. i think any impeachment vote has got to be one that is based very clearly on the evidence. and i think that we certainly have learned a lot from that first impeachment trial that we are using as we move forward in the january 6 committee. i think it is very important -- you'll see

with the january 6 committee, we have a very aggressive litigation strategy. and i think there were a number of instances in the first impeachment where it would have been important and decisive to have witnesses testify who did not come in and testify. we did not enforce those subpoenas. i think, though, it is very clear, if you look at some of the challenges that we're dealing with now, president trump spent a large part of his presidency, for example, attacking nato, saying that nato was obsolete. attacking our allies, and we're certainly seeing how crucially important nato is, how crucially important our allies are. i was very pleased to see that germany has announced they will be raising their defense spending to 2%. one thing that president trump got right was increased spending for the military. it is very important for us, especially as we look at the challenges now, as we look at putin's nuclear threat, we cannot adopt policies like a

no-first-use nuclear policy. we can't accept defense spending that is insufficient to defend our interests. we have to make sure we are recognizing here at home what is important to defend ourselves. >> brennan: i think that picture looks a lot different now that we see a city being bombed by russia. we're going to talk about some of that ahead with h.r. mcmaster. thank you, liz cheney, for joining us. we'll be right back.

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