pauley. "face the nation" is just ahead. please join us when our trumpet sounds again next sunday mor ngngngngngng. ♪♪ [trumpet] ♪♪ >> brennan: i'm margaret brennan in washington. and this holiday weekend on "face the nation." russia responds to the ukrainians sinking a key battleship with a powerful barage of missile fire in the west, while president zelenskyy says the situation in mariupol is as severe as possible just inhumane. we'll talk with dimitri, and get analysis from the former commander of the u.s. army in europe, ben rogers. plus, delaware democratic senator chris coons will be here to talk about his fight to get more covid aid included in a relief bill that is stalled in congress. and what impact will the war in ukraine have on the

world's food supply. we'll talk with the head of the united nations world food program, david beasley, and take a look at yet another jump in the inflation rate here in the u.s. will our food and gas prices go even higher? it's all just ahead on "face the nation." good morning and welcome to "face the nation." on a day when we're honoring the holy holidays of easter, pasover, and ramadan, it is difficult to come to grips with the bleak news this morning. overnight, there have been mass shootings at a shopping mall in columbia, south carolina, and at a party in east allegheny, part of pittsburgh. in jerusalem, there were more clashes at the temple mount between israeli police and palestinian

protestors. in north korea, pictures released showed kim jong-un celebrating what appears to be the successful test fire of a tactical-guided weapon. in the first outdoor mass since the pandemic began, pope francis said the world is marking an easter of war and he urged peace. we begin, as we always do, with the news. but we do hope you'll stay with us through our second half hour, when we focus on some of the efforts being made to help those who are suffering all around the world. our chris livesay is up first reporting from kyiv. >> reporter: good morning. as vladimir putin refocuses his land war on the east, the russian president is reminding us he can still strike ukraine wherever he wants by air. russia has increased missile strikes here in the capital and continues to pound major cities on the front lines. the kyiv region now a graveyard. the bodies of more than 900 civilians have been

found in and around the capital, police say. the killing continues at kharkiv, where overnight shelling killed seven people, including a seven-month-old. ukraine's local authorities say, but nowhere is the misery more total an mariupol. thousands have been killed in weeks of airstrikes, artillery, and even starvation. russia now claims victory. if true, we may never know the full-scale of horror. but ch chernhiv offers a look. cut off from food and water for weeks, until ukrainian forces, dramatically outgunned, pushed them back. shooting down this bomber, it crashed into his house, killing one man inside. but shockingly, no more. te pay load is failing to

detonate on impact. landing on nikolah's doorstep. >> i was sitting and praying, when all of a sudden there was a huge boom in flames. two pilots ejected. one survived. and not just anyone. here he is posing with vladimir putin and bashar al-assad, the president of syria, where the aid carried out airstrikes. soon after russia pulled back its forces from ch chchernikiv. though not without a devastating cost to ukraine. there is an unprecedented look at war. never before have events in battle been so closely documented, thanks to cell phone footage, and a local population that is incredibly tech savvy.

margaret? >> brennan: chris livesay, thank you. we go to the foreign minister of ukraine. minister, welcome back to the program. mariupol's governor says the city has been wiped off the face of the earth. how long can ukrainian forces resist russian control of that city? >> the situation in mariupol is both dire, militarily, and heartbreaking. this the citylí doesn't exist anymore. the remainings of the ukrainian army and large group of civilians are basically encircled by the russian forces. they continue their struggle. but it seems from the way the russian army behaves in mariupol, they decided to erase the city to the ground at any cost. >> brennan: president zelenskyy said the elimination of military forces in that city will mean an end to all negotiations with russia.

have you been instructed to stop contact with russia diplomats? >> well, we didn't really have any contact with russian diplomats in recent weeks at the level of foreign ministries. the only level of contact is the negotiating team that consistent of representatives of various institutions and members of parliament. they continue their consultations at the expert level. but bullsa, it became difficult talking with the russians. but as my president mentioned, mariupol may be a red line. >> brennan: the general staff of the armed forces of ukraine said last month that russian soldiers were being told the war must end by may the 9th. what exactly are you expecting in the coming

weeks? >> anticipation of heavy fighting in eastern ukraine, in donbas. large-scale offensive of russia in that part of ukraine, and also desperate attempts of the russian forces, as i said, to finish with mariupol at any cost. this is my expectation. and, of course, missile attacks on kyiv and other cities across ukraine seem to continue. >> brennan: this past week president zelenskyy released images of the una oligarch with close ties to vladimir putin, saying that ukrainian forces that captured him. he had been involved in a platplot to take over your government. what do you intend to do with him to aid in that capture. >> he is a citizen of ukraine, so he will enjoy all season nal rights

because we're a country of the rule of law. and his future will be decided on the one hand by the legal process and on the other hand, the political process. as i said, we're a country of the rule of law, and first and foremost he will face responsibility for the crimes he committed against ukraine. >> brennan: what exactly was he involved with here? how much contact did he have with russia? and what do you mean political solution? >> well, he was extremely close to president putin. in fact, vladimir putin is said to be the godfather of one of the daughters of mr. medvechoc. i believe this fact speaks for itself. when i mentioned political solutions, you know that the spokesperson to president putin, mr. pascal, said that russia has no interest in

exchanging mr. medvechoc, but we'll see how the situation evolves. >> brennan: the white house says president biden will not visit ukraine. a lot of other world leaders have done so. is it important to you to see a high-level u.s. official come? is it important for the americans to reopen the embassy in ukraine? >> since the beginning of the new wave of russia's aggression against ukraine, president biden has demonstrated true leadership in helping providing assistance to ukraine in mobilizing the international community to support ukraine, so, of course, we would be happy to see him in our country, and it would be an important message of support to us. and, of course, a personal meeting between two presidents could also pave the way for new supplies of weapons, of american u.s. weapons to ukraine,

and also for discussions on the possible political settlement of this conflict. >> brennan: well, we'll see if any officials are sent. i do want to ask you about a report that came out this week. 45 different countries who are part of the o.f.c. e., the organization for security and corruption in europe, had this investigation into war crimes. it mainly faulted russia. but it also faulted ukraine, once the soldiers had identify russian forces using facial tech until. according to this report, ukraine is apparently sending this report to the families of the dead. is that accurate? >> as it was mentioned,

when you discover 900 bodies of civilians killed, tortured, when you know that thousands were raped, of course, there is a people's rage and people's desire to bring those responsible for that to account. and we, as the government, work on legal ways to bring those responsible for these crimes to responsibility. >> brennan: it also said ukraine has not permitted the red cross to visit prisoners of war. will ukraine commit to doing so and to investigate war crimes by its own nationals if you find that some have been committed? >> well, i have good reason to complain on the way the red cross rolled out its operations in ukraine since the beginning of the war, and on the visit of the president of the red cross to moscow and the way it was handled. but i don't do it because we have a good working relationship with red cross, and we sort out all issues at the working

level in the spirit of cooperation. >> brennan: all right, mr. foreign minister, thank you for joining us today. we go now to lieutenant general ben hodges, the former commanding general of the u.s. army in europe, and he joins us from frankfurt, germany. good morning to you. >> good morning, margaret. >> brennan: you heard the foreign minister what wa happening in the southeast port city of mariupol. many believe vladimir putin will intensify this assault leading up to may 9th. what do you expect to see? >> i agree with all that i just heard the minister say in what has been going on in mariupol, the incredible courage and resilience and the courage, as well as from the soldiers that have been fighting. but i do think that the pressure on the general staff to deliver mariupol ahead of 9 may is immense.

that is the celebration of russia for the end of world war ii. it is a huge parade in red square every year, so obviously they need to have something to parade, to show as a victory on 9 may. so i think this date does have importance there. >> brennan: well, you describe a new offensive as a whole new war now. what do you mean by that? >> well, what we saw in the last seven weeks, of course, was a mishandled effort by russia. they totally overestimated their ability. they were not prepared for the fight they entered. ukrainians defeated them at every turn. so, of course, russia now has withdrawn from most places and they're focusing on the donbas region. and interestingly, the general staff has decided not to mobilize all of their reservists, which tells me there is not going to be a phase three. what we're going to do now for the next few weeks is

phase two, and they're going to focus on trying to gain control of all of donbas. and i think that is going to be it for the rest of the year because they don't have the capability, i don't believe -- especially if they don't mobilize reserves -- to continue the fight after this. >> brennan: does that mean the fight could be wrapped by the 9th of may? >> no. it means that they will not have the ability to conduct any further offensive operations after this. >> brennan: okay. >> for sure the fighting is going to continue. thy're going to continue as long as they have missiles, murdering innocent ukrainian civilians, and putting pressure on ukraine, but my sense is they have made a decision, because of the pounding they have taken, and the lack of resources -- frankly, they can't even build new tanks because the sanctions are restricting the types of parts that they have to bring in for new equipment -- ty really are culminating in their ability to launch further offensive operations, particularly

towards odessa or kyiv. i don't see them having the potential for that this year. >> brennan: president biden authorized new weapons transfers. we know now that some of them have been arriving just over this past weekend. in this new package, artillery, 18 medium range howitzers, arm moderna armored personnel carriers, how long does this weaponry last and how significant is it to the fight? >> the howitzers are particularly important, and the 40,000 rounds of ammunition. this is substantial, high-quality weapons system. but i have to say, it is still not enough. what the ukrainians need desperately are long-range fires, rockets, artillery, drones, that can disrupt or destroy the systems

that are causing so much damage in the ukrainian cities, and it will also play a critical role in this next phase if and when it begins. the hundreds of switch-blade drones, for example, these are very good, but we need about a thousand more. if you assume one drone per tank, per artillery system, per infantry fighting vehicle, you can see why the numbers -- this is about us being the arsenal of democracy. this is about us supporting democracy versus autocracy. i would really like to hear the administration talk about winning and having a sense of urgency on getting these things like, otherwise this window of opportunity we have, the next couple of weeks to really disrupt russia's attempt to build up, is going to pass. >> brennan: well, we hear from the administration is that the aim of all of this is to strengthen ukraine's hand at the negotiating table. but we've heard from the ukrainians, there is no table to sit at right now.

are you saying it doesn't look to you like the administration has decided they want ukraine to win? they just want a stalemate? >> i would say that i don't hear the administration talking about winning. i'm reluctant to say that the administration doesn't want them to win, but what needs to be stated is what is our objective? the united states? we're nott( cheering for ukraine here. this is about democracy across europe and stopping an autocracy. and, of course, the chinese are watching. so there are implications well beyond mariupol or even kyiv. and so if the united states were to say, we want to win, that means all russian forces back to pre- 24 february, and all ukrainians who have been deported are all back home immediately. a commitment to the full restoration to ukrainian sovereignty, and that

means crimea and donbas. and they can threaten georgia, to threaten mal maldova. >> brennan: thank you. happy easter. "face the nation" will be back in a minute. stay with us. digital tools so impressive, you just can't stop. what would you like the power to do? can a company make the planet a better place? what if it's a company that's pursuing 100% renewable energy in our operations. and aiming to protect millions of acres of land. so we can all live better. frank is a fan of fast. he's a fast talker. a fast walker. thanks, gary. and for unexpected heartburn... frank is a fan of pepcid. it works in minutes. nexium 24 hour and prilosec otc can take one to four days to fully work. pepcid. strong relief for fans of fast. you're probably thinking that these two are

in some sort of lover's quarrel. no, no, no. they're both invested... in green energy. and also each other. digital tools so impressive, you just can't stop. what would you like the power to do? >> brennan: we turn now to the economy. inflation in the u.s. surged to yet another new four-decade high of 8.5% in march, according to the labor department. mark strassmann takes a closer look at how the price spike is impacting businesses and families across the country. >> reporter: inflation is not running, it is sprinting. and sometimes everything on life's menu seems to bring sticker shock. year to year, meat, fish, poultry and eggs jumps almost 14%. >> i can't believe how much everything has gone up. >> reporter: used cars and trucks, up 35%. gas, up 48%.

>> connecticut families are getting slammed by inflation. especially at the pump. >> reporter: among major cities, atlanta has seen america's second highest rate of inflation year to year, 10.6%, behind only phoenix and just barely. biggest factors: housing costs and energy prices. blame supply chain issues, trucks waiting up to 30 hours to cross from mexico into texas. wal-mart offered new truckers up to $110,000 in their first year, more than double the national average. ukraine's crisis, it's impact on energy prices, and our pandemic economy. it went from deep freeze to red-hot and needs relief. >> the fed is telling us it is not going to be this year. it is probably going to be the end of next year. >> reporter: an inflation forecast that leaves many restaurants shaken. inflation eats up their

thin profit margins. >> restaurants have had to raise prices by at least 10%. >> reporter: karen bremmer leads georgia's restaurant's association. >> i think we could lose another 3,000 restaurants, probably. >> reporter: because? >> because people are just stretched to the max right now. >> reporter: all eyes turn now to the fed, which uses interest rates to achieve two goals: one is full employment. >> their other job is to make sure we h have price stability. they have failed on that front. and they are late to the game. >> brennan: mark strassmann reporting from atlanta. china is wrestling to contain the worst surge of covid in two years. dozens of chinese cities are under some form of lockdown right now. but the city grabbing the headlines is shanghai. elizabeth palmer reports from tokyo.

>> reporter: 25 million people live here, but you would never know it. for going on three weeks, this dynamic metropolis has been shut down. private companies, like alibaba, china's amazon, have been working flat out to feed millions of people who can't go out to shop or even seek medical help. it hasn't gone well. protests have erupted when food has actually run out. anyone who tested positive had to board a special bus and check in to a government isolation facility, including one in shanghai's retrofitted convention center. last week there was desperate pushback when police tried to evict residents from their apartments, slated to be turned into even more isolation centers. you might think all of this would convince the communist party to change course. well, think again.

chinese television reported a few days ago that president xi is doubling down on the so-called dynamic zero covid policy. but the costs are mounting. trucking has slowed dramatically. so has freight moving out of shanghai's busy port, and companies that make everything from cars to iphones are partially or completely closed. public health experts, even inside china, off the record, will say that the current covid policies are unsustainable, but the communist party has staked its reputation on them, and for that reason they're not budging. margaret? >> elizabeth palmer, thank you. we'll be right back. uh carl, are there different planning options in here? options? plans we can build on our own, or with help from a financial consultant? like schwab does. uhhh... could we adjust our plan... ...yeah, like if we buy a new house? mmmm... and our son just started working.

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canceled it tor a different reason: to call attention to the post world war ii food crisis. this year the united nations predicts the war in ukraine could cost an estimated 1.7 billion people to go hungry. coming up in our next half hour, a conversation with the head of the u.n. world food program about this hunger crisis 76 years later. and prescriptions as low as $4. so you can live a little better each day.

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♪♪ >> brennan: welcome back to "face the nation." a new covid-19 relief funding bill is working its way through congress, but it is facing some challenges in the senate. democrat chris coons joins us from delaware. good morning and happy easter. >> happy easter, margaret, great to be on with you. >> brennan: schumer has said global money for new vaccination will have to wait until later in the spring because the senate couldn't come to an agreement. there is still more than 3,000 people dying from covid around the world. a new variant coming out roughly every four months. what do you see as the real world impact of this

stall? >> well, margaret, i was so disappointeded that we in congress could not come together and deliver critically-needed global help, to deliver the vaccines we have already invented, developed, and purchased, and to make sure that the nearly three billion people around the world who haven't had a single vaccine dose get some protection against this pandemic. as we were fighting over this additional payment, this additional funding for covid relief, one of my colleagues said, well, my constituents are done with this pandemic. margaret, just because we're done with the pandemic doesn't mean it is done with us. and the best way to protect the american people from the next variant that might kill more variants and more people around the world, is to ensure that the rest of the world has access to america's vaccines. last point: there are dozens of countries that have had to rely on chinese and russian vaccines that don't work. >> brennan: senator

romney has argued that this needs to be paid for. is there any compromise that you see here? because i think you just said that the vaccine is sitting, already purchased. so what happens? does it just go bad if you don't come up with this funding? >> we are going to lose millions of doses of vaccine that will expire, and i think that is part of the argument that i've been making to my republican colleagues. we shouldn't waste this moment, this opportunity. i respect senator romney's press for us to find offsets, but in a moment when we badly need additional emergency fnding to support the ukrainian military resistance against russian aggression, to support mil millions of refugees in

europe and around the world, and to provide food relief and additional covid relief, i think we should treat this as emergency spending. frankly, we'll negotiate what we have to in order to secure a chance to move forward and not waste the vital vaccines that america as already purchased. >> brennan: there are some republicans saying there should be no spending except for on defense. are you saying this is how it should be characterized? >> we have already lost million americans. this weekend as families gather to celebrate easter sunday or to celebrate passover or doing the holy month of ramadan, we have folks from all three major global faiths, from islam, from judaism, from christianity that jointly have their roots in the middle east. all of these great faiths have a common principle: to do unto others as you would have them do unto you, and to care for those in need around the world. i think we can and should justify this additional spending as critical for our national security or as teaching our values, showing to each other the best of the human spirit and the most central tenents of the faith that inspire so many americans.

>> brennan: for the 10 billion of funding that is sitting in congress for a future vote, that would go towards vaccines and treatments here in the united states, even some senate democrats are saying they want to attack some kind of amendment regarding these border restrictions related to covid. do you see a way out of this standoff? >> margaret, it is going to be challenging. >> brennan: so what is the compromise to get around the issue at the southern border? >> well, frankly, what i think you're referring to is the announcement that title 42, which is a public health measure, may be rolled back in a number of weeks. that is something where the c.d.c. declared that they could no longer justify this ongoing practice of expelling folks who come to our border based on the pandemic. in the region where i'm from, we're seeing infections rise. i think philadelphia, for example, just returned to a mask mandate. my hope is that that will be reconsidered appropriately. i know that there are both

republicans and democrats calling for a reconsideration. and the administration just announced a plan for how to deal with a possible surge in crossings at the border. margaret, we do need to come together and show our values, that we can secure our border and improve the inhumane immigration system, the immigration system that so many of us have worked to try to address for years. but i think we can separate that. we should separate that from delivering covid relief that will protect american lives and other lives, billions of lives, around the world. >> brennan: in some public remarks this week, you said the country needs to talk about when it might be willing to send troops to ukraine. you said if the answer is never, then we are inviting another level of escalation and brutality by putin. are you arguing that president biden was wrong when he said he would not send troops to ukraine? are you asking him to set a red line? > margaret, i think those

of us in congress who have a critical role in setting foreign policy and in advising the president in terms of his decisions at commander in chief, need to look clearly at the level of brutality. this is a moment of enormous challenge for all of us. and i deeply respect president biden's leadership in pulling together the west in imposing crushing sanctions on russia and in bringing to this fight countries that have stayed on the sidelines before. i think president biden's leadership has been steady and constructive, but this is a critical moment. if vladimir putin, who has shown us how brutal he can be, is allowed to just continue to massacre civilians, to commit war crimes throughout ukraine without nato, without the west becoming more forcefully to his aid, i deeply worry that what is going to happen next is we will see ukraine turn into syria. the american people cannot turn away from this tragedy in ukraine. i think the history of the

21st century turns on how fiercely we defend freedom in ukraine, and putin will only stop when we stop him. i'll close with this, margaret: this is a weekend when so many families gather to celebrate the very best in the human is spirit, and where we grieve the loss to many due to covid, we should also be prayerful and mindful of those fighting in ukraine and how much their patriotism inspires the rest of us. >> brennan: senator coons, thank you and happy easter. >> thank you, margaret. >> brennan: we'll be right bask back with a look ag the defe devastating food crisis. don't talk about your cats. you're gonna do great! at least geico makes bundling our renters and car insurance easy. we do save a lot of money. oh no no no...

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>> brennan: we go now to david beasley, the executive director of the u.n.'s world food program. he joins us from ukraine. are you cont confident you can keep food supply lines open? >> no, i'm not.

there are places we can't reach, like in mariupol, and other places where russian forces have bsieged the city and are not allowing us the access we need. if we get the access, we can reach every single person that is suffering, struggling for food right now. >> brennan: given the lck of access to mariupol, do you believe vladimir putin is using starvation as a weapon? >> we've seen food depose that have been blown away. i've seen places where there is nothing in the warehouses but food, and that's not even in mariupol. so there is no question that food is being used as a weapon of war in many different ways here. i don't know the reason or the rational for it. >> brennan: we know the whe phy fighting is expected to pick up. we have seen images of ukrainian farmers wearing

bullet-proof vests, still going out there and tending to their food. do you have any sense of how the food supply in ukraine is going to be affected? >> it is going to be a major factor, margaret. ukraine grows enough food to feed 400 million people around the planet. in fact, we buy -- 50% of all of the grain we buy is from ukraine, which allows us to feed about 125 million people. this is a very serious problem. if we don't get the farmers back to the fields, not just a few, but all of the farmers back into the fields so thathey can put fertilizer out, and equally important, we've got to get the ports open again. 400 million people get their food from ukraine that way. and it has got to happen quickly. >> brennan: the u.n. issued a really

frightening report this past week, saying food prices are up 34% versus a year ago. and that spike is threatening social unrest in countries all around the world. what areas are you most concerned about? what is the crisis in ukraine going to cause violence in? >> it is going to cause problems all around the world. for example, we have 45 million people in 38 democrats that are knocking on famine's door. you may see a general increase in food, 38% to 40%, but in some of the tough places, it will be 100% to 200%. in yemen, we cutr cut rations. and we are talking about them migrating from central america into the united states, from el salvador, honduras. if we don't get the food

we need to reach the people in need, whether it is in the middle east, middle africa, or central america, you will have famine and deep destabilization of nations, and you will have mass migration, and it's going to cost a thousand times more than if we can get the food and reach the people before they either die or create political unarrest or migrate. >> brennan: you're already cutting back on food rations in certain countries because of the crisis in ukraine. how do you decide that? >> because of increased fuel costs and shipping costs, we're already experiencing a $71 million increase in operational costs per month. so when we don't have enough money, well, guess what? we have to choose which children eat and which children don't eat. we try to reach the most vulnerable children, but it is based on money. this is $430 trillion

worth of wealth around the world today. there is no reason a single child should be dying from hunger, much less going to bed hungry. >> brennan: the united states is the single largest donor. in the past, russia has provided millions of dollars in funding. do you expect them to cough up a dime right now? >> well, we'll just have to see. they are a major producer of food, there is no doubt about that. just like ukraine is the bread basket of the world, and now they're the bread line to the united states, which is stepping up in a major way, but it has to step up in a way it never has before. we're facing a perfect storm right now. we'll need an extra few billions this year. if we don't get it, you'll have more conflict and destabilization,■ which will cost four times that. >> brennan: there was a food aid which was cut out on a recent bill. for those who say the united states has to be

more fiscally responsible, that it can't continue to pump in more aid money, what would you say to that? >> it's not difficult at all. it's like having a leaking water line in the ceiling, and you don't fix them, and you're going to replace the flooring, you're going to have to replace the table, the chairs, the c curtains. it is a lot cheaper to fix the water lines. if you don't reach the people where they are, it will cost a thousand times more. i know from firsthand experience, people don't want to leave home. they don't want to migrate. but if they don't have food -- for example in syria, we can feed someone in syria for 50 cents a day. that same syrian ends up in brussels or the united states, the humanitarian suport package is $70 a day. >> brennan: the world food program put out a report that that surge of

migrants into europe was driven by a cut in funding in world food program aid. because people couldn't find food in the camps, they went elsewhere. are you predicting you see a refugee crisis resulting if there is not more food aid? >> there is no question about it. that is what germany realized. i talked with the german leadership, and they realized the mistake they made by not going upfront. when you feed 135 million people, like we do, we survey them and talk with them. they don't want to leave home. but if they don't have food, i don't know a mother or father in the world that won't do what they need to do to get their child food, that includes leaving home. >> brennan: is the crisis in ukraine leading people away from desperate places like afghanistan? >> the last thing we want to do is take food from a

hungry child t a starvingo child. we have covid then the ethiopian crisis, and then on top of yemen and syria, and then afghanistan, just when we thought it wouldn't get any worse, we were running short of money, and then you have ukraine, the bread basket of the world, so we don't have enough money to reach the children in afghanistan, ethiopia, and ukraine, and now because we're devastating the bread basket world, there is a possibility that children all over the world will not have the availability of food. >> brennan: good luck to you, sir. thank you for your time. >> thank you, margaret. >> brennan: we'll be back in a moment.

(music throughout) >> brennan: the number of migrants crossing the u.s. southern border has already hit a record in march, and we aren't even at peak migration season. we want to go to shi sister norma pimentel. good morning to you, sister. happy easter. >> good morning to you, too. >> brennan: we know all of these numbers are

expected to climb in the coming weeks, after some of those health restrictions are peeled back at the border. are you prepared for what is to come? >> most definitely. what is happening has happened for a while already, for many years. the numbers have in increased. but i'm not focused on that, per se. i'm more focused on ensuring that those families who are at our border, that i see daily, who face violence, face persecution, can have access to protection and to a humane treatment. >> brennan: well, you wrote in an op-ed last year, you made an appeal for president biden to come down personally to see some of what you are describing. he hasn't been there yet. what impact do you think a personal experience would have? >> i definitely believe that somebody -- everybody

should come to the border so that they can have an opportunity to see our community and the people we serve. they can see for themselves and meet families, and i believe that impacts somebody's way of looking at what is happening. and so i definitely encourage president biden t come and see and to be able to understand more closely what a family that is suffering at the border -- ht decide how to proceed, you know? >> brennan: you have spoken out, as well, about something called the migrant protocols, the remain in mexico policy that i know the supreme court is about to take up later this month. and this would allow for asylum-seekers who are trying to get into the united states to have to stay on the mexican side of the border while they go through u.s. processing. you said it is immoral and

abhorrent to deter people who are legally and peacefully seeking safety in the united states by deliberately exposing them to the very perils they are hoping to escape. can you tell us what are those conditions and what safe alternatives are there? >> i visit the border on the mexican side almost daily. and what i see is families suffering because of the fact that there is a lot of abuse to them. the conditions are terrible. and there are dangers -- their children are being exposed to being kidnapped, to being hurt. so it is not right for us to do this. i think that someone who faces violence fears for their lives, for their children -- there needs to be a way to access protection, and that is something that we as a nation can offer to them. >> brennan: so you would

like to see them housed on the u.s. side of the border, rather than the mexican side? >> i believe that we as a country can find ways to be able to offer protection. that could be in the u.s. most definitely they're asking for protection and they fear for their lives. there needs to be a way to be able to access that protection, and there is not anything right now. and so whatever that answer is, i think it is something that we can work to make it happen because these families are in great danger. >> brennan: we are still in the midst of this public health crisis. and i know the federal goernment has relied a lot on organizations like yours to help carry out covid tests for those migrants who do cross the border. and recently have started to offer them vaccines as well. how does someone who is undocumented even prove that they are vaccinated?

how do you reassure american people at home that there isn't a health risk? >> because we, at the border, are making sure that anyone that enters the country is being offered that safety, that care, so that if they are exposed to the virus, they can get islolated and they can receive that care so they don't enter our country and spread the virus anywhere else. i think that the partnership that i have here in the rio grande valley with our ■law enforcement and the government and the border patrol, we work together to make sure we address this correctly, and there is not that -- there should not be that fear for the people that are entering our country. i think that we must help us understand differently what the border is like, so come and visit and see

for yourself, and understand our community and how we work and also hwho are the people we serve. >> brennan: i know your not a political person, you're a humanitarian, but the work that catholic services do for children who cross the border got some sharp criticism from a conspiracy person in this country, alex jones. and i understand pope francis heard the criticism, and i want to share his personal message to you. he said in a video: "the migrants must be received. they must be protected. they must be accompanied, and they must be integrated." fofour things: receive, protect, accompany, integrate. what did that personal message mean to you?

>> it reaffirmed the fact that we, as a country, must have that heart to welcome those who are fearing for their lives, and to offer them protection, offer them a humanitarian response that cares for humanity. and to care for our most vulnerable and fragile and hurting at our border. >> brennan: okay. sister, thank you for leaving us on that note this easter. we'll be right back.

>> brennan: for more on some of the organizations we've talked about, visit our website. we'll see you next week.

- [narrator] the following is a paid program that is paid for by cathedral of faith, where anything is possible. (high energy rock music) (ethereal music) - [ken] i recently had the chance to visit the van gogh exhibit and it was amazing!