>> good morning to you, this is mosaic. welcome. it is always a privilege to host mosaic. there is a passionate of scripture within the 133rd psalms that says how wonderful and beautiful beautiful it is u in unity or harmony. the contemy the contemporary translation

says brothers and sisters. for our purpose of our the today, we we will stay with brothers. brothers to brothers. i have had had the privilege of going to this group, brothers to brothers brothers for a few times and i will be going back. when i asked asked them that i would like them to have a representative from mosaic to be on the program they almost unanimously recommended reginald -- welcome. >> it is a pleasure to be here. >> thank you for taking the time time to be here. >> yes. one of the things before before we get to brothers two b, two brothers, share a little bit bit about what your experiences have been. >> i am raised in north oakland. . although i lived in other places in the city of oakland. i am a member of allen temple bat temple baptist church. been there for 40 years. was a

chairman of the deacon board at one time. i am still a deacon. i i am a servant, believer. i teah i teach sunday school class ix, an adult class. it is interesting. we really try to me to make the word become alive in in our lives and context as our understanding. i also teach old. old testament. old testament one one and two with the leadership institute. i am a seminarian gr. seminarian graduate. graduate of of san francisco state. high school to oakland ,. i am married to dolores gibson, the flower of berkeley. >> she had better be looking at this.

>> yes. >> we love up in marin county. i i was in law enforcement for 30. 30 years. started in the berkeley police department for 20 years and came over to -- as a captain and deputy chief. and, and, i still live up there. >> i told you earlier i did not know you have that police background in law enforcement. i i was at a gym one day and they said their church, allen temple do a lot of work and you have been that liaison. he said wow, he is a police officer. i said i i did not know that. he said yes, he has had a lot of experience in law enforcement. you have a great reputation for that. >> i always believed in matthew, matthew fives, blessed are the . the peacemakers. for they should should be called children of go. of god. i always wanted to be ar

a peacemaker as opposed to a pe. a peacekeeper. anyone can keep the peace if you have enough power and weapons and authority. authority. but a peacemaker has to listen and understand all fa. all factions. and try to navigate and create a peaceful . peaceful solution. where everybody is affirmed. where everybody is left told. >> i like that concept and understanding. we know there has has been a lot of tension in the the african american community with police. i am sure you have had to walk that line. >> i have been one of the fierct the fiercest critics. i love cops but i have to be honest, in in this last say 20, 25 years, they have walked away from theil their ethical positioning. not all of them. >> but, there is a percentage. >> that have walked away from the ethical understanding of who who and what they are in our society and community. thereby

we have mario woods and, eric gardner and philander castillo. it is, it is wrong. >> you are speaking from experience. not a critic outsid. critic outside. that makes a difference. >> they are not happy, some of m of them are not happy. but, the truth is the light. they had to get back to ethics. >> the truth sets us free. >> mario woods,-6, 120 pounds, homeless with a penknife. and nine officers stop him? they all all shoot him? terrible. >> we are going to come back to brothers to brothers but i am glad we have this introduction about what you do and who you are. thank you for being with u. with us. please join us in our next segment. brothers to brothers.

>> welcome back to mosaic. we have been speaking to reginald . reginald house. you have heard some of his great ground and ex. and experience. one of the reasons -- talk about brothers to brothers. >> brothers to brothers has been

going on for 20+ years. it emanated or, started from a genn a gentleman by the name of herbie lofton. who was trying to bring african american men togr men together and focusing on bible study and just navigating. navigating life. it started with with two or 3 friends that he knew. that attended church with. with him. it has grown to now, we will have a session every tuesday night and maybe 65 or 70 men come. they are an eclectic group. we have of course 7-day , 7-day dentists, baptists, a large group of catholics. we have muslims that attend and, we we have people who are agnostic and, etc. >> you have a methodist now.

>> and then, we have people who have been very accomplished in r in their careers. had the president of peralta junior-college district. we have have had presidents of colleges. colleges. we have had former mayors and city council people, former city council people. law, people. lawyers, businessmen, developers. >> one of the things i found interesting was at my first time they said they wanted two things not to be mentioned, your your title and denomination. >> that is correct. >> so you do not get in the way of -- >> yes, we have to leave that at at the door. they try to go on first name basis, they respect everyone. we have to listen and that is what we are working hard hard on. forcing ourselves to ry

to really -- with your brother , brother and, we use the platforf platform of studying the script. the scriptures. we read the bible from genesis to revelation . and it starts over again. >> how many times have you gone through the bible do you think? >> i have been there, i would sy would say -- years and at least four times. >> sometimes, we get maybe three or 4 versus. and people raising raising their hand having a question or want to expound on the passage. from that exchange, that exchange, we believe that what needs to come out and needs needs to be heard is heard. >> i heard you mention earlier that you teach the old testamen. old testament. why that? some people would say why not the new new testament? why not the gospels? why not paul being the

primary choice? >> yes. >> some people say the old testament is so complex, diffict complex, difficult and challenging. >> it is in some places. but, it it is important we understand we we who follow jesus christ need to understand jesus christ wasn't a christian. he did not read paul, he did not read matt, read matthew, mark or luke. he was trying to reflect on the profits and the law and, he was trying to say, i think, this is how you have been taught. i want want to reveal to you another way of looking at this in the ct the context of where you are and and where you are living now. this is not to be a word from gd from god that is exclusionary. , exclusionary. but, inclusive. ik i think, when we understand tha, that and, then, the attributes

of christ, the christology of christ. then, i believe we can understand that her how we should live. what was jesus talking about when he was quoting isaiah? what was this elijah moment when he was running away from the profits o? of --? do we have the same situations here? i do not think you can really understand new testament scriptures unless you understand what they are reflecg are reflecting off of. how they are revolving off of that. they are echoing off of what they know, what they have been taught taught and launching out into a new way of applying it to their. their lives. >> without the roots, you do not not get the fruits. you need thy the history and -- >> that is pretty good. that is correct. we could understand the , we should not call it the old

testament. it should be called -- and, we should understand it as such and, we can understand t understand it as such. then we should understand who those people were, they were african asiatic people. we should embrace that and, understand that, and apply that evolution how the scriptures evolved through time to the day. and how how we are evolving. i do not be not believe god has stopped revealing god sells to one of gs of gods creations. >> i think the theme of the you cc is god is still speaking. >> yes. >> yes. >> i noticed in the two times i have come, each individual is able to speak, but you say listg say listening is some of the skills we develop. i did not see see anyone saying, you are wrong to say that. >> we do not allow that. we do not allow that or we do not allow arguments. we can have an

exchange. you can have a person saying i believe it is this. this is how i heard it and another person can say well, i have heard this. but, we do not have that direct back and fortht forth argument or debate. >> why is that got too much conflict or? >> people's feelings get hurt. we are not hurt to -- anyone's . anyone's feelings. we are there to open up their mind. we believe in the renewing of the . the mind. i have heard often times people would say, i have never heard it like that before, before. well, that is fine. and, and, as you well know, learning can be a struggle. it takes courage. you have to launch out on things you do not know. and, see if it will be embraced. we pray for the presence of the holy spirit. we believe the holy holy spirit is an agent that is

here with us. so, we are guided by it. >> i see you also pray for others who are not there. we want to come back to another segment. it is so inspiring but, but, we need to take a break and, we will come right back.

>> as reginald mentioned earlier, they have brothers with -- who come. one of the% who come is an author and, he happens to have the author's bo. author's book. i think it would be good to lift him up and tell us who he is. >> his name is ronald cole. reverend ronald cole. he is book book is paying attention. the

inspirational journey. ronald ce ronald cole is a dear friend, i think we met one another in the third or 4th grade. he was a phenomenal minister of god and t of god. and of course, we both serve under jaclyn thompson the senior pastor at allentown baptist church. this is a great. great book. a great read for men men to see how god is used in individual. this gentleman is a very uncommon man but, he writes writes for the common man. >> okay, now, why brothers? why? why men? why that emphasis? >> well, we -- that is one of the struggling issues of our gr. our growth. i have heard folks say well, we need time when we

can be alone and to talk and etc. i hope that we can evolve into having men and women but, at this point, that is where it. it is. but, when we have our retreats and we have a retreat every year. we have brought in like doctor jaclyn thompson that that presented in front of us. and, then, reverend doctor pope has also presented and, she and doctor thompson did a session for us together. >> i do not see it as sexist by any means. i see it as men needn need certain things to address. women have certain groups. that is the way i see it. >> you are probably right about that but, i think we need to have a time when we come togeth.

>> we will see what happens, we will follow the holy spirit and see what happens. i can't take t take it either way. >> as i mentioned earlier, the contemporary translations say brothers and sisters in harmony and unity. i think that is the ultimate. >> if the bible was written by women, it would probably be a whole lot different. a lot of vs of versus would not be in there. there. that old of being your husband and submitting and all of that kind of language >> and women be silent. >> be silent in church. >> that was horrendous. >> i was in seminary and heard a story of howard thurman who wag was reading the scripture to hi. his grandmother. no formal education and, when he got to the point where it said women should be silent in church and his grandmother said do not read read that part. >> also, the part about the servants be obedient to your ma. your masters. the grandmother

said no, i do not want to hear that either. >> which is a way of controlling controlling people. i think the gospel is liberating. i believen believe in a liberation theologd theology and that is the context context from which i come. and,t and, that is what i try to promote. >> one of the interesting discussions when i went the last last time is that we talked about the text and context of ps of people's lives. some people wanted to talk more about the context of people and their lives and some people say no, we we are here for the text. what are your thoughts on that? >> i think it has to be a combi. a combination. i do not think that literalists study the text without context, without makinge making some application, the text will not serve us. the bibe is not merely a history lesson. and, when it is looked at like ,

like that, it allows us to not k not think that we had to act out out what the bible is asking uso us to act. it is almost apart from us. it is outside of us. the word of god is supposed to e to be inside us. we are supposed supposed to apply our behaviors based on the truths andheroes within the bible. if a hero does does something that is not godly, we are not to replicate it because it is in the bible. the text has to be challenged. it has to be wrestled with within the confines of where we are living. i do not believe god god would come to me and speak to me in the mandarin lang whic. lang which. i do not understand

mandarin. god will speak to me in the language in the context of which i understand and use me me where god would want me to b. be used. >> that is a good story. i think think the bible is alive becaus+ because 3000+ years ago it spoke spoke to people then and it still speaks to us now. that is what makes it so dynamic. >> i think god does speak to folks who speak mandarin and uses them wonderfully as well. i i want to hear that up. >> we have one more segment, please join us.

>> we are so grateful for reginald louse as we speak about the bible and the scripture. how does the word speak to us in in our day and time? >> we are living in difficult times, as you well know. we have have a person in the white house house who is anti--- as far as i i am concerned. and mean-spirited and causing a lot of pain. so, the scripture will educate us on folks like that and, tell us not to give up hope or faith that god is still in the blessing business. and that better times are on the horizon. >> what about those who considet consider that evangelical who

overwhelmingly supportthesidt? ovwhelmingly support someone who lies and has the horrible moral lifestyle. that this one has. i pray for my evangelical brothers that they will wake up, up because, they are not supposed to follow that type of readership. >> i think that is pretty provoe pretty provocative and challeng. and challenging. >> yes. >> i do not censor anyone who comes on my show. i want everyone to hear what you said., said. and, i appreciate your thoughts. >> if you are following someone who can separate babies from mothers, something is wrong with your application of jesus chrit jesus christ and his love for his people. >> how would you apply it in

terms of seeing the scripture in in light of that? you quote scripture quite well. >> yes. >> you want are some of the scriptures he would say to backt back that kind of injustice? >> first of all, old man, you know what is good. do justice, y justice, mercy d walk before do and, mean-spirited and, he has caused more pain than not. >> why do you think micah put je put justice first before love and humility. >> i believe justice is the foundation of love. you have people that can love a lot of things, gambling, drugs, money. but, justice is the foundation on which the house of love is constructed upon. if no justice exists, you cannot love a perso. a person. that is why i understd

i understand the song what love got to do with it. >> i do not know how anyone can disagree with that. i understand why people have asked you to be be the spokesperson of brothers two brothers, thank you, regina. you, reginald. i will see you again soon. i will be there to. >> come early and have a meal has. >> thank you for being with us, see you next month.

>> life from the cbs bay area studios, this is a kpix 5 news. news. >> we have ran across the bay area with the potential for a record amount of the next couple couple of days. we have your complete forecast. several oakland families are looking for for answers after a fire they say should never have happened.