i'm margaret brennan in washington. and this week on "face the nation" -- with former president trump now officially a convicted felon, how will that impact campaign 2024? donald trump was among the faithful when he dropped in on the saturday night ultimate fighting championship in new jersey last night. >> boy, the round of applause he's getting right now is pretty staggering. >> what do voters think of the

trump conviction outside the ufc? we've got early reaction from across america and we'll tell you what's ahead on the legal front. >> so we're going to be appealing this scam. >> plus, how is the outcome of the case playing with the parties? for democrats it's a defense of the judicial system. >> it's reckless, it's dangerous, and it's irresponsible for anyone to say this was rigged just because they don't like the verdict. >> and the republican refrain, attack it. >> the republican party is really -- they've stuck -- they stick together on this. it's weaponization of the justice department, of the fbi, and you know, that's all coming out of washington. >> north dakota governor and trump running mate contender doug burgum will be here and we'll talk with former u.s. attorney preet bharara. finally, the u.s. makes a major announcement in hopes of pushing israel to end the war with hamas. as the gaza humanitarian crisis

continues to grow. it's all just ahead on "face the nation." ♪ good morning. and welcome to "face the nation." the seven-week new york criminal trial is over. former president donald trump has been found guilty on all 34 charges against him, and he is no able to campaign freely until july 11th, when he will be sentenced. that's exactly four days before he is officially nominated at the party's convention in milwaukee. as a felon, trump cannot own a firearm or serve in a jury, but he can vote for himself as he can run and be elected president. but we are clearly in unchartered territory and it will be some time before we can fully see the impact of the

conviction. our new cbs news poll finds that 57% of americans think the jury reached the right verdict, with virtually the same share, 56%, saying he received a fair trial. as more evidence of the partisan split in america, 96% of democrats said the guilty verdict was the right one, so did 56% of independents, but eight in ten republicans say the verdict was the wrong one and that the trial was not fair. finally half think that trump is not fit to be president now that he's convicted, with 40% saying he is and 8% unsure. what you just heard trump say about the case coming from washington is not true. charges in this case were brought by the manhattan district attorney. it is a state case, which means an appeal would not automatically go to the supreme court. for analysis and context, we want to bring in our chief

campaign and elections correspondent robert costa who covers trump and the entire trial for us in new york and our chief legal correspondent jan crawford who has been covering the supreme court for decades, but, jan, nothing like this ever before. jan, can you help us to understand, trump said he will try to appeal this conviction. what is the next step? >> well, i mean as he said this was a long way from over, but there is, i think, zero chance this is going to be overturned before november, and the road ahead for trump on appeal doesn't look too good either. as for timing he's got 30 days to file what's called a knotice of appeal that's procedural that could start the process through the new york court state system, which could take over a year. now you said, as you pointed out in the intro, his supporters have been throwing around the supreme court should get involved, the supreme court this, but you have to go through, when you're challenging a criminal conviction, the state court system first, then he

would turn to try to get the supreme court to take the case by raising constitutional issues. as for the appeal itself that he'll try to file, the lawyers throughout the trial i think were laying the groundwork for possible issues from start to finish. i mean, starting with the venue and heavily democratic new york. the indictment, the charges themselves, a pretty novel legal theory bringing in federal election law to a state case. he's going to talk about the evidence that was allowed or not allowed. he could talk about the jury instructions and certain components of that. even attacking the impartiality of the judge himself. that is a very tough road to hoe. he has to show this is clear reversible error. that is difficult to do on any kind of appeal. people say, and bob, if you're ever in trouble, spend your money on a good trial lawyer because once you get into the appeals process, the odds are not good and not good for donald trump here. >> bob, the political impact

here, obviously, we're in the early stages, but we know that lara trump, who is chair of the rnc said on another network this morning they raised $70 million in 48 hours. is this only helpful? >> it's helpful in terms of raising money, but for former president trump there is still a logistical nightmare on the horizon. when i spoke to his lawyer todd blanche he didn't rule out the possibility that trump could be in jail during the republican national convention. when sentencing happens on july 11th there's an expectation he could be put on probation, but this was a tense trial. i was there for seven weeks. when you sat inside that court, at times, the judge cleared the courtroom because he was so frustrated with the defense and one of the witnesses that was being called. trump violated the gag order multiple times. so republicans, the top republicans in this country, are privately telling me they're not ruling out the possibility that trump could be in prison when he accepts the nomination. there's a real concern some

traditional suburban republicans might look at someone called a convicted felon and say i really can't go there, even as it motivates so many of trump's core supporters. >> jan, i mean, from all the research we've done, it seems like legal experts do not believe that there will be jail time. >> not in this kind of case. >> is that a political talking point? >> i mean, i think it would be pretty shocking to most people who follow the new york court system that he would get jail time for this. >> and that's not just because of secret service detail. >> no. it's -- >> or who he is. >> treated like other defendants facing a similar charge, again, also because of his age, he would be a first-time offender and the charge itself is somewhat unusual bringing in that federal election law. typically in these kind of cases you would have other charges, fraud charges, that could then carry jail time, so that makes this case different as well. it's just this one issue. >> but he does now have a criminal record. and there are three other criminal cases, just to remind

people, in the federal level, the special counsel has the two, one related to national security, and mishandling classified information and the other trying to change the outcome of the 020 election and the georgia case as well. when will the supreme court make a decision on whether mr. trump will face charges and trial ultimately for these federal cases? >> of course trump has said he's absolutely immune from prosecution. he lost that argument in every court that has first considered. i think he's going to lose that in the supreme court that he's absolutely immune. this court does seem to think, like on the civil side, there may be some immunity, and so they're working on that decision now. we expect it by the end of june. they have agreed to expedite this case. this case f it were on the normal course of business work come some time in the fall or jack smith, the special counsel, asked for a decision some time this term. he is going to get that. the question now is whether or not he will then have time, if this case has to go back to the

lower court and figure out what immunity trump does have, whether he will have time to have a trial before november. i think this verdict does lessen the pressure on the supreme court and on jack smith to get that conviction. there is a conviction now already and it's not going to be overturned by november. >> interesting point. bob, quickly, our polling also shows 85% of republicans feel loyalty to trump as either very or somewhat important. how is that impacting the campagn? >> people close to former president trump tell me that he is watching very closely who is on television defending him. who is going throughout and really speaking out and saying trump did not deserve to be found guilty. who is going to rally to his side at a crisis moment. inside the trump campaign, this is seen a lot like the "access hollywood" moment in october 2016, which was involved in a sense for why this trial unfolded, and they're saying if you're not out for trump right now, good luck trying to get a spot in this administration should he win. >> great analysis and insight from both of you.

thank you. jan, you have a busy june ahead you have. we'll see more of you i'm sure. we turn now to former u.s. attorney for the southern district of new york, preet bharara who endorsed alvin bragg, the district attorney of manhattan n his election. he also used to work with and actually hired trump's attorney in the case, todd blanche. good morning to you, preet. >> good morning. just one correction, i didn't hire todd blanche, but i did promote him twice. i consider both to be friends of mine. >> he was mr. trump's attorney in this trial. so what does having this criminal record now do for donald trump with these other three criminal cases? >> oh, that's an interesting question. you know, there's a lot of speculation about whether or not this criminal conviction will result in a incarcerated period for donald trump. that's up in the air. there are arguments in favor and arguments against. whatever happens the fact of this criminal conviction will be on his record, if it remains, at

such time as the future criminal trials take place. if he gets a conviction in the future, the fact of this here if still on the books, would result in a potential higher prison sentence in the future cases. it has a consequence because he will now, unlike a week ago, have a criminal record and they are taken into account meting out punishments. >> important point. you said you promoted the president's attorney when you used to work together. would you promote him based on his performance in court defending mr. trump? >> you know, it's a very easy thing that i do and other people do on the panel in criticize people's performances. sometimes it's case someone could do a better job at trial. trials are difficult and there's scrutiny here. sometimes the fact in law are what the facts in law are. terrific defense lawyers who perform well lose and sometimes not good defense lawyers win because the government hasn't

proven its case. i'm not going to take potshots at todd. i think he could have been stronger in some of the cross-examinations and leave it at that. >> well, sentencing is july 4th. excuse me, july 11th, four days before the convention, as we mentioned. what grounds for appeal do you think mr. trump has here? >> so i think they'll make a number of points. you know, donald trump is not one to leave anything on the cutting room floor. i think some of his arguments are nonfrivolous. i agree with what jan said in the ordinary course it's difficult to get a criminal conviction overturned but it happens. it's happened to me and any good prosecutor's office that brings aggressive cases. nobody has 100% record on appeal. that said it's a very low percentage. i think a number of things, including the fact that the judge didn't change the venue, the fact that judge didn't recuse himself, i don't think those are strong, but i think those will be made. the fact that stormy daniels testified broadly about the

details of their sexual encounter they'll argue were prej shall. there's the technical business that causes lay people's eyes to glaze over, the degree to which the second crime skmts thing that made and transformed the misdemeanor into a felony, the bases of that did not have to be decided unanimously by the juryp. the further crime the felony, was appropriate based on the jury's decision if there was the falsification of the business documents was done to further or to conceal or to commit some other crime, namely, an election crime in new york, and that could have been done three different ways in the jury instructions they don't have to be unanimous on three different ways and that's probably an issue for appeal. >> let me zero in on that. that has been something mr. trump and his allies have talked about. in terms of this case, this was about trying to manipulate an election and fraud related to that.

his allies say this was just a paperwork thing. somebody mislabeled this as a legal expense. how would you tell a lay person to understand this? >> look, the underlying misdemeanor, that's why it's a misdemeanor, falsifying business records, the reason the becomes a felony, not the most serious felony on the books in new york, but any felony is serious, the misdemeanor crime was done to conceal or commit some other crime. the crime the prosecutors got the conviction on, promoting someone's election by unlawful means either by the falsification of other documents or committing some tax crime or further election fraud crime so the prosecution i think did it as well as anybody could do for lay people because the jury was a series of lay people, that this was a serious thing that undermined and interfered with the election in 2016 and that's serious and not to be taken lightly. >> so we're seeing some rhetoric

from republican lawmakers, including senator marco rubio, who said mr. trump was held hostage, the victim of a sham political show trial like the ones the communist used in cuba and the soviet union railing against the ruling class. in terms of our judicial system in this country, how should someone understand a characterization like that? >> well, i think, you know, it's silly. it's completely silly. the trial in all aspects of the trial were done openly in public. the jury selection process someone needs to be reminded was participated in by the trump legal team as well. they had all the preemptory challenges record by law. the judge, although there's some accusations made about his impartiality or lack thereof his rulings are there to see as other people have pointed out. he ruled in favor of the trump team sometimes, ruled against the trump team sometimes. pretty fair and even handed. a jury of 12 people who were

selected and approved by both sides, brought in the verdict so i don't know what a sham is about it. the rules of evidence were followed and complied with. i don't know what's happening here other than pure partisan politics. >> yesterday, president biden was spending time with his son hunter, and tomorrow in another unusual situation, our country is in, the biden justice department will begin a trial in delaware against the president's son where hunter faces three felony gun possession charges. maximum 25 years prison. how much hot water is he in here? >> he's in substantial hot water because he's been charged federally just like donald trump is in a lot of hot water being charged in state court. but i think an important thing to consider here, by the way in the wake of your question about the accusations of the vast conspiracy by both state prosecutors and the federal

justice department that is acting in a witch hunt fashion in a partisan fashion to bring down the republican party, here you have the son of the sitting president of the united states of america, going to trial at the hands of his own justice department. in a million years, can anyone listening to this broadcast understand and expect that if donald trump was elected again, in a biden holdover u.s. attorney, were to indict donald trump jr. that donald trump wouldn't do something about it in the way that joe biden has stayed out of it? i don't think so. that's an important thing to remember. the other thing that's happening this week is a continuation of the trial against democratic senior and important senator bob menendez by the same justice department the politicians are accusing of being partisan. >> thank you for your insight and analysis. "face the nation" will be back in a minute. that's why at fisher investments, we keep a disciplined approach with your portfolio, helping you through the market's ups and downs.

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under serious consideration by the former president to become his running mate in this campaign. good morning to you, governor. >> good morning. good to be with you. >> good to have you back on "face the nation." you just heard our polling there, 57% of americans think the jury reached the right verdict. 56% think trump got a fair trial. a majority of americans are unconvinced by this claim that it's all a sham. why do you think it is? >> well, i think part of it, of course, polling is in a point in time and had a chance to briefly look at some of your poll numbers this morning and saw almost two-thirds of the respondents said they weren't paying close attention and i understand that they're not paying close attention to the trial because most americans out there, you know, they've got working americans don't have time to watch, you know, tv all day, read every report because they're facing all the things, putting food on the table, the gas in the car, all the challenges that they're facing, and i think as this moment in time passes when we have the election coming this fall, people are going to make a decision about were they better -- are they better off

today than four years ago? and this is an unusual thing, this is not -- president trump is not a candidate that's unknown or never run before. they had an opportunity to live their life under four years of him, and they had a chance to, you know, prosper and they had a chance to understand what the world was like, no wars, and now it's a very different situation. i think while this is interesting and it's captivating right now to a lot of people, the election is not going to turn on this trial. >> the u.s. isn't involved in a war right now either -- >> we're involved in two proproxy wars. >> donald trump spends a lot of time talking about these trials. it's not just journalists. and it's historic. he talks quite a lot about it. in fact, he held an extensive news conference friday with a litany of grievances against the judge who will still have to decide on his sentencing. personal judgment wise, do you think that was a smart thing to do? >> well, i have a lot of empathy for what he must feel like because as a business person,

someone who spent -- spipts spent 30 years in tech but a lot was in software business processes, i've never seen anything like this where you can magically take a transaction that gets spread out over 11 paychecks or paychecks, 12 vouchers, 11 invoices, and suddenly each of those around one decision, they magically become a set of misdemeanors, they become a felony. and -- >> because of the election fraud, as you just heard. >>well, i don't know that anybody in america, if we're asking about the voter, i don't know that anybody in america can explain how a business transaction filing errors from seven years ago become federal election law when federal election law is not a state -- brought in the county court, federal election is federal, an i don't know, the alchemy of transforming these misdemeanors had a statute of limitations, ceos around america if you've

had hundreds of millions of business filings in america in the last seven years, why aren't courts clogged with other ceos that were dragged in front -- >> if they were running for president and changing the business records to obscure donations to their own campaign, you know what i'm saying. this isn't just a filing earer. >> i hear what you're saying, but most americans cannot explain it, many of the legal expert -- >> it's complicated, sure. >> many that stood on the curb for six weeks can't explain it. americans are going to come back to the issues that affect them because this trial outcome doesn't affect them. their inflation affects them. >> it does. i want to talk about those issues more in depth in a few minutes. we put up a graph to show you our polling, two-thirds of those polled said they are watching closely. in terms of like the book keeping argument, this was about a crimnal conspiracy to influence an election and create paperwork to cover it up.

if the quibble is about paperwork violations, the president of the united states, his son says under the influence of drugs, he committed a paperwork error, that's now going to federal court because of what he did in purchasing that gun. that was a paperwork violation. are you also offended by that? is that also a miscarriage of justice? >> i think what's sad for america is the whole weaponization of the system and what we're going to see more of this. i mean -- >> you think it's weaponized against hunter biden? >> i think it is weaponized against president trump but if you're going to talk about kwifr lensy in the courts we know that media companies have acknowledged that they worked in convungsion with the federal government to suppress information about hunter biden's laptop during an election year. >> that is not true whatsoever when it comes to this journalist or the journalists involved with this program. >> why were his stories about it taken down off of media

companies? why was it being suppressed during that election? so why -- we talk about the steele dossier. we could go back. there are all kinds of things going on in our country, related to election integrity. when you're an independent, democrat, republican, we should all care about election integrity and if we want to have equivalency to make sure that we have a level playing sealed in we have to finish this conversation on the other side of this commercial break. let me do that and we'll finish it. stay with me, governor. and stay with us. one second.

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