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hello. on behalf of arch diocese of san francisco, welcome to mosaic. i think we know the word evangelist and other words. back up to the root parts of the word and it looks less narrow and focused that angel indicates a message. that ev is a greek particle of two letters, a tiny particle with a large meaning. it means good, helpful, welcome. an evangelist is a person bringing a welcome message, glad tieings, good news, useful information. is it only

preachers who evangelize in that sense? not at all. we discuss about how picture, film, poetry are bringing good news and revealing truths that can help us live waysly and well if, that is, we know how to read the books and watch the films. how do we watch and read even the product of our secular culture so as to grow in wisdom and faith and grace? stay with us as we talk about the fiction, film, and faith around us and the depths of rich human insight that can be found in the best of the arts.

hello. welcome to mosaic. meet our guest today, dr. turek. may i call you margaret? >> absolutely. >> all right. now you are a teacher, professor of dogmatics at the st. patricks seminary in menlo park. you have taught also at the university of dallas. >> yes. >> you have an m.a. in systematic theology and doctoral degree in theology as well. >> yes. >> so you are a learned scholar. you are an experienced teacher, a writer. i know all

that. what do you want to talk to us about today, evangelization and film and art. we know what it is as a catholic outreach to people about the faith. where do film and literary arts come into that? >> i would like to suggest that the serious screen play writer and movie director and novelist, fiction writer, they're all in the business of revelation. >> okay. >> by that i mean that the serious screen play writer and movie director, they apply their imagination and talents to the task of bringing others to see. to see more than action packed like car chases and more than beautiful costumes and

breath taking scenery. the serious screen play writer, movie director, writer of fiction has as his or her primary aim to bring others to see, to see a vision of life. a vision of life. i am mindful of what jeff conrad had said. joseph conrad is a november list. >> yes. >> perhaps his best known is novel heart of darkness that inspired movie apocalypse now. joseph conrad, he summed up his task in this way. he said my task is to bring you to feel. and above all, to make you see, to see the meaning of life. it goes on and says my stories are concerned with nothing less

than the whole point of living. >> right. >> the whole point of living. >> that is serious art. >> that's serious. so the serious screen play writer, the serious novelist, they're intent upon intensifying our capacity to feel. but to feel what it is that we truly hunger for, thirst for, what it is we long for, hope for. they're intent upon deepening our capacity to see, to see what makes life worth living, to see what makes life fully human and leads to authentic happiness. >> that's interesting in that i have mentioned the word evangelize and we think of that as giving a religious message to someone you can accept or reject. what you are talking about is whether conrad is a

catholic or not or whether any artist is, a serious deep human humane artist is trying to get us to see, trying to get us to feel. >> yes. >> not to adopt a position about something, maybe not even to ascent to a metaphysics he is selling but to see truly and to feel. >> yes. to intensify their experience of being human. >> what seems paradoxical, being human is such an experience already, we tend to defend ourselves. i think you develop a little crust, a shell. >> yes. >> what is the artist breaking us out of the shell, taking scales off of our eyes. >> absolutely. back to conrad, my task is to make you feel, make you see at intensity and a depth as never before. flannery

o'connor as well, catholic fiction writer. >> american writer active in mid 20th century, famous catholic. >> yes. famous catholic. i know you know of her works quite well. she'll admit that her literary method often involves this kind of shock tactics, she has to shock readers to come to a spiritual awakening to see the human condition, especially in its contemporary setting as never before. we think we see. we think we feel. but we are riddled with so many blind spots. we are hampered by so much spiritual blindness. >> let's talk about that, our contemporary situation which i think dates back to flannery o'connor. there is endless media available. there are movies, videos, books, every kind of mode we are discussing

here. there is so much of it, we may have to guard ourselves against it. but what is the challenge to the makers of the products to in this age of ours, what's missing? it seems to me that the structure of christianity as the narrative of our world has sunk in importance. >> yes. i am sorry, you want me to address the challenge? >> yes. >> in the first place you are saying the christian artist, christian writer of fiction, christian screen play writer but also his or her readership, his or her audience. if i might, i have recourse to the wisdom of flannery o'connor and rely on her experience, she bemoan the act that she says today the world is going through something like a dark

night of the soul. the world in its increasingly secular condition is losing its capacity to seeto see the presence of god, stirrings of grace as well as conversion experiences. >> hold that thought and we will take a brief break. we'll be back again shortly with our guest to talk about faith, fiction, and film.

hello and welcome back. we are talking with dr. margaret turik and talking about evangelizing and that is not only preaching the christian

message but seeing the christian truth and finding unexpected ways in which to see it. you mentioned flannery o'connor and her encapsulation of vocation as a writer. >> she had said at one point that the primary gift that she needed as a catholic writer was the gift of prophetic vision. it is vision, a capacity to see and to see prophetically by which she meant not the capacity to read the future but the capacity to see what is hidden. again, for her, it's primarily the hidden presence of god. our god is with us. but in our increasingly secular age, god is less and less visible. more easily forget able. god is becoming

increasingly hidden. what she needs to do, she says, is find ways in this secular culture to impregnate stories with the presence of god. often the presence of god is best seen or recognized by the negative pointers that she embeds in her tacts. she forces you to face the seeming absence of god, the seeming void, this desert experience of our contemporary and secular culture. >> desert experience meaning there is not really nourishment for the soul available. we are talking about film and fiction. there is lots of escapist literature, erotic, as you said car crashes and other things. >> yes. >> the serious art is perhaps

having a struggle. >> yes. >> you mentioned you told me about you do teach or hold seminars on watching film and sharpening your vision to see what's in that film. you do this for all ages. >> i do. i have done it for high school students as well as their teachers. i have done it at the college level, at the graduate level at the seminary, st. patrick seminary most recently. i have also gone to parishes throughout the bay area. i have given evening presentations, full days of retreat a weekend where i train the eye to see god, to find god and recognize his patterns of relating to us albeit in the dark and to recognize also the stirrings of grace, promptings of grace. god is always trying to lure us, to woo us back to himself, to see him with us

under any condition. since the current condition is most pervasively in the dark, we've got to develop a night vision. the capacity, this prophetic vision to see god in the dark, to recognize stirrings of grace, opportunities for conversion in the shadows, in the twilight. >> i think it is difficult to develop a humane sensibility. the human race is kind of a villain these days. either accidents or a virus on the planet's health. where is the affirmation of my human nature and my soul, where can that be found? we'll talk about films i think from here on out. this seems to be a vivid speciality. you mentioned groundhog day. >> yes. >> is that an examination of

despairing world? >> yes. now, as i see and interpret groundhog day. >> everyone knows the film from the '80s. bill murray lives the same day over and over again. >> bill murray as phil conners and andy as eventual love interest, rita. it's a story, a portrait that's about the whole point of living. it's a wonderful illustration of conrad's point in film, that this story is about the point of living. what makes life worth living? as the movie opens phil conners the pro tag nist believes he knows what makes his life worth living. as i view the movie, and there are a variety of ways in which you can view it, i see phil conners

initially illustrating freudian psychology, freudian theory of the ultimate motivating factor for human behavior. why do we do what we do? what are we seeking? freud of course is better known for the pleasure principle. >> sure. >> what motivates is we seek pleasure. today more than ever erotic pleasure, sexual pleasure. phil conners initially goes throughout his life seeking sexual pressure and he does so quite winningly we can say. but it's not enough. you watch his character because according to the story groundhog day he has to live this day again and again. he is forced to live out intensifying

concentrated form this theory of life. he comes to realize soon enough experientially, not by reading a book, experientially that the pleasure principle is not enough. phil will choose to kill himself. he will choose to stop living rather than be forced within this one theory. it's not enough. the pleasure principle is not worthy of phil's humanity. that's what he shows us. >> he is better than that. >> he is better than that. >> let's pause and take a break. we'll come back soon for our final segment of the program and talk about the movie "gravity."

hello and welcome back. dr. margaret turik has keen insight into films and a sense for where serious artist is revealing god to you, whether the artist intends to or not. we had talked about this wonderful film from a few years ago, i think an oscar winner. >> yes. >> gravity, a space movie. tell us what you see there. >> the movie at the surface level, it's a survival story. it's about a woman who survives a life threatening accident in outer space. but the story is really about much more. it's really about the

whole point of living. the title "gravity" in my mind, now this is my interpretation, it eludes to gravitas, weight, fullness, meaningfulness of life. we need gravitas, meaningfulness, sufficient to prompt us motivate us to say yes to our next breath, to say yes to a life that often is shrouded in darkness, that often confronts us with very tragic, very heart breaking events. so in this movie, it begins with a dark screen. the screen is black. then these stark letters in white emerge. it says basically life in space

is impossible, is impossible. now space, it's a metaphor. outer space is a metaphor for inner space. what the woman, sandra bullock's character, dr. ryan stone is living on earth. the condition of her life on earth is impossible. it's impossible to affirm it, to endure it in any meaningful way. so what the film makers do is they show you what life in space is about. it is cold. it is dark. it is silent. there is no communication. there is no air to carry sound. so it's a state of isolation, silence, noncommunication, darkness, coldness, and so forth. that's really the state of dr. ryan stone's life on earth. but in

space, she's now living this out in a way that's magnified for us dramatically. what the story brings us, what her story as sheen cerrillos to survive in outer space, the themes that become prominent are themes such as the importance of being tettered, importance of being in communion with others. we learn that on earth, she lost her daughter, her four-year-old daughter died a very tragic accidental death. from that moment on, dr. ryan stone lived a life disconnected, disengaged, disoriented. every day she said she would wake up and go to work and she'd just drive. it was purposeless. it was aimless. it is dark and

cold. in outer space, she finds herself following this accident adrift, aimless. >> there is an accident, her life is at risk, yes. >> and time and again she's trying to communicate with houston saying houston, i am in the blind. i am in the blind. i am running out of air. and i am adrift. that describes her life on earth. >> that's a wonderful moment to stop because i think that's now in dante's position, in the midst of life, found myself in a dark wood, had lost my way. i don't think we can talk more about gravity but you would recommend everybody watch it. >> absolutely. and look for the cues. this film maker is quite deliberate in bringing you to see that she is going through a journey in the dark but towards conversion from spiritual

blindness to spiritual insight. everything depends on importance of discovery of being tettered not only to her comrade matt but discovers she remains tettered to her daughter in the afterlife. all of this is because she's ultimately and always tettered to god. she'll speak about importance of prayer and how no one ever taught her how to pray. no one trained her in this original fundamental way of being tettered to our god who provides our tetters with each other, this communion of love and life that makes this life worth living and that endures into the afterlife. >> we have about 60 seconds left. i know you told me that when you have developed your vision in various ways and have the eye to see, you should return over and over again to the scriptures. >> ultimately to scripture. >> to read those better and

better. >> yes. the best authors of novels and poetry and of screen plays are those who have learned something from sacred scripture. salvation history, human drama as portrayed there as never before. they will embed their works of art with hints, with clues that lead you to see and experience the poignancy of the moments because you recognize they're elusions to biblical meanings. >> right. developing your vision for art can blow the dust off the old scriptures and you go back with renewed interest and possibility. thank you for coming from st. patrick seminary and spending time with us. we urge you to see the movie gravity and read and see everything that you encounter in the arts with a discerning eye, an eye for revelation that will serve you well. thanks for

being with us on mosaic.