tavis: good evening from los angeles. i'm tavis smiley. first up tonight a conversation with acclaimed actor, writer and director kenneth branagh. he has become synonymous with shakespeare thanks to numerous films he's acted in and directed but starting this week out with something zilededly different. the marvel comic film "thor." and a conversation with ice-t. the law and order star is out with a new member hoyer called "ice." film maker kenneth branagh and actor ice-t coming up right now. >> all i know is his name is james and he needs extra help with his reading. >> i'm james. >> yes. >> to everyone making a difference. >> thank you. >> you help us all live better. >> nationwide insurance supports "tavis smiley." with every question and every answer, nationwide insurance is

proud to join tavis in working to improve financial literacy and remove obstacles to economic 'em mourment one conversation at a -- empowerment one conversation at a time. nationwide is on your side. >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. [captioning made possible by kcet public television] tavis: pleased to welcome kenneth branagh to this program. the four-time oscar come natured director, actor and writer is out this weekend. what promises to be one of the biggest films this year, "thor." stars natalie hopkins, and here now "thor." >> the express command of your

king. and for your stupidity you opened these peaceful realms and innocent lives to the horror and desolation of war! you are unworthy of your title! you're unworthy. and i now take from you your power. the name -- i cast you out! tavis: we know you regard you and celebrate you as a wonderful shakespearean actor. and so i start by asking, how does that inform this? >> well, you have anthony hopkins here, fantastic and great shakespearean actor, bring tremendous weight and graph tass to the role --

gravitas to the role oden. he says "cast you out." you feel the intensity and high stakes. and at the center of the story, this troubled royal family with the fates of many other peoples dependent on how well they get on that little connection between the personal and then the public lives of powerful people is a shakespearean theme. i think that he was always fascinated by basically what goes on behind closed doors. in the lives of the rich and powerful. and it's -- for me, it gave a lovely sort of backbone to a story that was also full of humor as well. and a world that was very direct and different. so i guess this bit of the story was useful point of connection for me in something that was also very unfamiliar. tavis: yeah. are there other or different parallels between what we appreciate about shakespeare's

work and the storyline in "thor"? >> i think that if you look at a play like the henry iv plays where prince shoul a reckless -- howell is a reckless youth and much concern about whether he's a good can date for the throne. he keeps bad company, drinks out too much and stays out late at night. his judgment is suspect. in this story, all of that applies to thor. and in henry v, the story of the assumption of -- true and responsible leadership by henry is hard won. he has to lose friends. he has to risk his life. that also is paralleled i think in "thor." and in those cases, i think, and again a shakespearean theme really, i suppose, is that there's the investigation of what does it take to be a hero? what are those constituent parts? on the outside, privilege and entitlement and being a very fine warrior. but on the inside, what is it

that allows you to make balanced, if that's what you think they should be, judgments and decisions? and i hasten to add, this is wrapped up in our case in something that's trying to convey pleasure and have fun and entertainment. but of course i feel that's shakespearean as well. because i feel -- there was a man who was a shareholder in his own theater and actor in his own theater and producer and commercially led. and the records what little we know about shakespeare including the records. plays in his playhouse were often the story of how quickly they came off if they didn't work. and they had to move on. they were absolutely led by box office. so there are very many parallels. tavis: more themes i want to ask you about. but since you made a comment a moment ago that made me think about it i should stop for a second and let you -- you've already started to do some of this -- what the storyline here is. for those who haven't seen or heard as yet what it's about. >> sure. thor is the prince of azgod, home. gods. one of nine recommends in the cosmos.

that family runs the universe. -- realms in the cosmos. that family runs the universe. at the story thor defies his father in his search to prove himself willing to be an -- and able to be king. his coronation is interrupted by an attack from the frost giants. thor defying his father and says he will see why they did it. in so doing, he creates almost a sort of nuclear war. that provocation means that he's brought back to azgod and must be punished. he defies his father once again and banished to earth. tavis: without his powers. >> you lose your friends, family, powers, exactly right. you lose your home. and in this case, quite comically as well, he has to deal with the idea that it's trickier than he imagined for a god to order coffee in new mexico or indeed to find easy equine transport. in new mexico. these are challenges. people bring those along for him normally.

so we have some fun with that, the fish out of water stuff. but we also have fun with the idea of him trying to assess, well, what does he feel about all those things? does he earn the right to be as we use the word in the film "worthy" enough to return? and that story is both comic and dramatic. and via the illuminations of natalie portman it's also romantic. tavis: this notion of powerlessness and losing one's power, losing one's home, i think you see where i'm going with this. there are so many americans right now who understand now what it means to lose power, to lose authority, to lose means of making a living, etc., etc. and i thought about that. i don't know what you think about it but i thought about it when i wrestled with the film and how so many americans are in the positions strangely that the comic character thor is in in the movie. does that make sense? >> it does make sense. these things, it's never an accident that pictures like this end up being made at this kind of level. it isn't just that -- there's

some spectacle and action and drama and what you would find in a summer movie and reflects in some way things that are going on or having some kind of mirror at work. and particularly with classic tales with myths, archetypal stories. and wrapped up in what you hadn't at is the enforced, painful and difficult process of perhaps necessarily re-evaluating what you feel is important. what is important about who you are, about what people think of you, about whether their approval or parental approval or your own approval is -- whether that's fundamental to once rediscovered in some beautiful and fall way, does that help cope with the removal of things, surface elements? things that you felt you could not do without before. but maybe when that inner strength can be accessed, when you have a true sense of who you are, you got two feet in the ground, and you may not have all the food you want or indeed the income you want, or indeed the place to live. if you start from that sort of

position of -- with yourself and with other people, acquiring respect, self-respect, respect for others, then maybe although they weren't necessarily put bread on the table, they're the beginning of maybe a different -- a different way of looking at how those things happen. tavis: without giving the storyline away, what does thor the film say to us about redemption? we talked about loss. just now. what does it say about redemption? >> i think it says that -- it offers the question of -- good art, good entertainment, in a way hopefully offers it up and i would be interested what you think it may say something different to you. i don't tell people what to think but kind enough to ask the question and my view is it -- it talks us i suppose about the freedom if you like, the happiness, the certainty, in his case almost the sort of beatitude to understand the clear, clear message that in order to help others, and that that's a good and sort of

dominating theme, he now understands, he must sacrifice whatever needs to be sacrificed. certainly his own ego and vanity and perhaps if that's what it takes, and without self-glorification, his own life. and i think the nature of the redemption means that it's a very full, it's a very rich moment. one of the glories of chris helms workt's performance is you -- hemsworth's performance is you take the idea that he is someone changed from entitled and arrogant and sometimes funny and witty and aggressive and a great fighter into someone who cares about you or him or her than himself. and actually in so doing he accesses through that heroism, that truly self-less, unpublicized heroism may be some even kind of redemptive power. tavis: after this film, the name chris hemsworth is going to be much better known in this country and around the globe. and i thought i read something, he beat his brother out for this part? his blood brother?

is that true? >> i don't know what the life is like in hemsworth household on that evening. but, you know, they're both very handsome young men and both at the start, tremendous careers. inevitably they go for the same parts. and in the end, as our version of the script developed, it just all absolutely sort of played into slighter maturity that chris has a. little bit older but in both cases, fantastic physiques, great access to comedy, twinkle in his eye, romantic. and chris was able to do the kind of work to produce the kind of body that obviously you and i both have as a matter of course. but he was able to -- he was able to really work it and in a way that we won't do right now. taking your shirt off and let the world know that he had the body of a god. tavis: no, we shant. and here's another question from me, back to the big issues and themes that resonate with

me about a project like "thor," what does this say to us about the kinds of leaders that we want? >> two billion people watched the royal wedding. clearly they're interested in interested in that, the outside of what appears to be lives that have a certain amount of privilege. they have gifts. they have history. they have a sort of -- unusual and separate position which may be involves paying a price. certain loneliness and isolation. certain out of touchness and certain kind of inability perhaps because of circumstances to connect with as many people as we might freely connect with. but nevertheless, it continues to fascinate. i think that fascinated because at the center of it was a certain purity and goodness and good will, youthfulness and uncynical kind of warm hearted support for what we all understand. our partnership at the beginning of its life heading out into the great, you know, adventure of life. and something very good hearted about that. i think that's quite separate

from what we often feel about our political leaders. where we bring to that cynicism and disappointment, a belief or skeptical attitude that suspects that perhaps corruption, compromise is at the center of it all. and i think we want the sort of rugged and robust engagement with politics and with leadership that we know to be these days ever more complicated. but we would love it to contain. some of the idealism, the youthfulness, the bright shiny camelotian kind of glory that that kind of ceremony and ritual symbolize ds. -- symbolizes. we like them to be like us. we like them to be able to stand up and be counted. but we want compassion. and we want sensitivity. and we want a hell of a lot. the burden on modern leaders and modern heroes is tremendous. but you see that -- for instance, in maybe one of the great and sort of unchallenged modern leaders of our time,

nelson mandela, that the -- the sell operation and the admiration -- the celebration and the admiration, the belief in his absolute integrity, even though he as sullied by the tar of politics as anybody could be, because it's in the nature of the game. i think people -- people wish to be inspired in that way. and i think as thor has, some of that questioning going through it about essentially what it takes to be a hero. and a leader, and it's tough. it is unquestionably tough. and maybe the toughest thing is starting with that series of inner questions that ask yourself how fit you think you are to do all that. tavis: there are a lot of big issues to wrestle with, courtesy of the film "thor." but a lot of entertainment. a lot of fun to be had as well. and as if you didn't know, the film is called "thor." showing in just a moment all over the crinlt. i'm sure it's going to be a huge blockbuster and i'm honored to have you on this

program. >> thank you so much, tavis. tavis: up next actor and groundbreaking hip-hop artist ice-t. stay with us. ice-t is a legendary hip-hop artist who has enjoyed a terrific acting career as well as starring of course on "law & order: s.v.u.." he's out with a new memoir about his unique and unlikely journey. it's called "ice, a memoir." of gangster life and redemption. from south central to hollywood. he joins us tonight from new york. ice-t, good to have you back on the program, brother. >> hey, good to hear from you, tavis. yeah, man. it's an honor. tavis: i think most people as i mentioned a moment ago, most of you -- of us know you as a west copy rapper and in the memoir it didn't start on the west coast. not too far from where you are tonight, in newark, new jersey. >> yeah, i was born in newark, new jersey. raised in summit, new jersey. my mother passed when i was in the third grade. my father when i was in the

seventh. and that's when i was shipped to los angeles to live with an aunt. and that's where the story most people are familiar with begins. tavis: that doesn't sound like ice-t. that sounds like will smith the fresh prince. >> oh, no, absolutely. i lived in a nice middle class household. and even when i moved to l.a., my aunt was a social worker. we lived in an area called view park. it wasn't that bad. but when i made a decision to go to crenshaw high school, which was at the time one of the toughest high schools in l.a., still is, that's when i ended up dealing with the gangs and starting to make some different decisions with my life. tavis: they called it as you recall, fort crenshaw. that's how bad things were then. they called it fort crenshaw. how did you get pulled into that? how does a kid who grows up in a nice area like view park get pulled into that? >> well, you're going to have to deal with what the masses are doing. and, you know, crenshaw is on the other side of crenshaw boulevard. so all the kids from the

avenues, horace mann, bethune, all those different junior highs that come into that high school, and, you know, it's rougher turf. and you're going to either be with them or be without them. so it was funny in the book i actually say that the three guys from my neighborhood went to that school. we had to convince them that we had a gang. you know? we had them convinced that we had our own gang. up in the hills just to keep people off of us. tavis: you write in the book that even though you got pulled into it you never got caught up in the drirninging and the drug -- in the drinking and the drugging. >> when younger i never drank. even today, i sip occasionally, socially. but as a kid, no, i never drank. i never did any weed or drugs or anything. because i felt it was compromise my position, you know. i was an orphan and i had a feeling like if i ever hit the ground, i may never get back up. so yeah, i was very straight edged. but it was a survival instinct that i had. tavis: you say you thought if you hit the ground you might

not get back up. it reminds me of the subtitle of your text which is a memoir of gangster life and redemption. there clearly has been redemption for you. but is there redemption for everyday people that end up not being a rapper, end up not being on "law & order"? those other kids that went to crenshaw and other kids wrestling with the gang culture, is there redemption for them? is there redemption for everybody or are you just unique? >> oh, absolutely. i mean, redemption just means you just make a change in your life and you try to do right versus what you were doing which was wrong. so i think a lot of people, people get hooked on drugs and when they get over that addiction, they go out and they try to talk to kids. and they try to work in rehab centers. i mean, a lot of people start off in the wrong direction. you know? and i was a full-blown -- street cat. he was trying to hustle my way and thought i was going to hustle my way to a mansion or something. and i was doing pretty good. but i was just -- i didn't realize that there was no way

to win that game. and then all my friends started to go to prison and started to die. and it started to sink in. and rap music just came along to save my life. and i started to tell the stories. streets. and that was my way out. but now i talk to kids that, you know, elementary schools and junior highs. and i go to the penitentiaries and juvenile facilities. i think everybody wants to redeem themselves after they've done something that might be considered negative. i don't think anyone wants to go to the -- to go to the grave negative. tavis: do you have a thought on this? i've often wondered and after reading the book this time whether i'm more impressed with your life vis-a-vis the change you made from the gangster lifestyle to the street and narrow, whether i'm more impressed with that or impressed with the fact that you made an anthem out of a song called "cop killer." and you end up playing a detective on television.

how do you pull that off? and what do cops say when they see you on the streets? >> i mean, i had -- i've had a lot of experience dealing with the cops. and when i was out there breaking the law, i didn't hate the cops. they were just the opponent. and i thought i could beat them. i have no hatred for cops. i have hatred for racists and brutal people. but not necessarily the cops. cops are just doing what they're told to do. so, you know, when it was time for me to play a cop, i played a cop in "new jack city." i was worried. how will my fans take it? they know me as the original gangster. but they said hey, ice, you're acting. and now after 12 years on "law & order," you know, i have no problem with it. i sleep good at night. because even on my -- in my role on law and order i'm chasing child molesters and rapists. even criminals don't like them. i'm good in the hood. i'm good on both sides of the

fence. let's put it like that. tavis: when you put out a song like cop killer you end up becoming or regarded actor on a very popular television show. i wonder whether or not you've ever had to encounter an element of your former life that regards you as soft, as a sellout, as a traitor? ever had to deal with any of that? >> well, you know what it is, when you come out of the hood, you're always going to have certain people that might feel that you're doing something that they necessarily wouldn't do. the thing of it is that i look at somebody like yourself. i'm a guy that really admires you, tavis, because i watch how you can flow with the highest level, politicians when you take over for larry king, and was doing your thing. i watched that. then i watched how you can kick it with me. and a real -- a real player, there's no limit. i can talk this way. i can talk that way. it depends on who i'm dealing with. so the real catch that i admire , they love my getdown and

always love my getdown. the suckers on the sideline, they're always going to have something to say. so i've never really worry about them. and i look at people like you, i look at people that are always moving upward, and i say, that's who i'm -- i'm rolling with. because no matter what i do or what i play, a person like yourself, you know who i am. so it doesn't really matter. tavis: is there anything that ever happened in your life that you did or did not talk about in the book that you wonder might come back one day to boomerang on you? and i'm deliberately asking the open question because i don't know what that might be. anything that you have concerns about that does trouble you from time to time that it might -- >> oh, absolutely, absolutely. you know, when you're out there and you're doing things, i never know if the person i'm shaking hands with is coming to kill me. i don't know. you know, i kicked up a little bit of dust when i was young. you don't know. and that's something you have to live with.

you know, when you cross those lines. but i've been on the right side and the positive side for a long time now. 25 years in the rap game, and in the film game. and, you know, i'm not really worrying about it at this point. you know, i just -- i just try to do the right thing. you dig? i'm not trying to make any more problems. tavis: right. speaking of not making more problems, that's one way to view it and you view it that way. the other way to view it is that every day you wake up you get a chance to do some good to make the world a better place when you leave it than when you found it. so for those who are trying to find redemption, particularly those who the folk around them, the system, everyday people, won't let them redeem themselves, what's your message to them about how they use everyday to redeem themselves? >> i mean, it just goes on inside of you. in your head. you really wake up saying, hey, i'm going to try to do the right thing. or i'm still going to try to do the wrong thing. i'm always going to be

considered wrong because i'm opinionated. i'm a speak on a topic in a different way. and i'm a far cry from politically correct. you know, because i don't really care what the political views are. i don't care what the people say. i say my opinion. that will always make you controversial. but it's all in your heart. it's what you really believe and if you're doing the right thing, i think you know when you're doing the wrong thing. the thing of it is for me, when i was doing the wrong thing, at the time, i thought i was doing the right thing. it's like if you're dealing with somebody who is high on drugs, they can look back at it and say, wow, i was destroying myself. but during the period, they think they're doing the right thing. so it's very confusing. you just have to let the smoke clear so you can see the whole picture. and fortunately, i made it to this position where now i can look back on the whole thing. and that's why i wrote the book. tavis: ice-t doing his thing. for more of my conversation hit hour website at pbs.org.

the book is called "ice, a memoir of gangster life and redemption from south central to hollywood." ice-t, i love you, man. honored to have you on this program. >> i followed you on twitter. follow me. i'm@finallevel. tavis: i'll find you. good to see you, igse. >> peace. tavis: that's our show for tonight. thanks for watching. and as always, keep the faith. >> for more information on today's show, visit tavis smiley at pbs.org. tavis: i'm tavis smiley. join me with r&b star rafael saadig and a special performance from his critically acclaimed new c.d. "stone rollin'." that's next time. >> all i know is his name is james and he needs extra help with his reading. >> i'm james. >> yes. >> to everyone making a difference -- >> thank you. >> you help us all live better. >> nationwide insurance supports "tavis smiley." with every question and every

answer, nationwide insurance is proud to join tavis in working to improve financial literacy. and smotch obstacles to economic -- remove obstacles to economic empowerment one conversation at a time. nationwide is on your side. >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. captioned by the national captioning institute --www.ncicap.org-- >> be more.