tonight alan mulallylyoe of the auto company talks about the automobile industry, the uaw, management and leadership and whatçó kind of cars we'll be seeing inñr the future, includig electric cars. >> it's the love of the automobile and the technology associed with it, just attractsñi the best and brighte. i had fantastic career, great jobs in auto manufacturing. the people that are attracted to this industry, plus they care. it's so interesting that the automobile is at the center of, that we have been talking about. it's about economic, right charlie roseñr charlie rose weçi talk aboutñrçóçó richñiç(ut):ç h

kathy bolkovac called "the whistleblower" about a peaceçóñr keeper in bosnia. >> she felt this was h job to investigate ime. there was a crime. >> i think that there's been so much attention now put on the film and my story that it's forcing a lot of organizations and government organizations to take a second look about what happened to me back then and what more can be done to hopefully make that right. charlie rose charlie rose alan mulallyly, rachel weisz and kathy bolkovac when we continue. the@20 yea@a e you'u've h a h hand giviving llegege sclarsrships.

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charlie rose charlieçóñi rose charlie rose charlie rose alan mulallyly is here. he steered forward in the crises of the americanñi auto industry, in 2009. chrysler and general motors received it for the downturn without bailing out or declaring bankruptcy. the company just announced the 9th consecutive quarterly profit yesterday. microsoft ceo steveñiñr has saii mulally ford is fortunate to have this man at the table. welcome. >> good to be here. >> charlie: i talked to the ofeign car company and hea the u.s. he said mulally is the guy,çó hs our hero, the guy we look up. there's admiration for you in terms of what you've done. let talk about that. first you came in 2006, you came after you've been turned down as

you said for the boeing ceo job. what did boeing miss that ford saw? >> well, i'll always love boeing and i hadñr the honor to serve, charlie four 27 years in boeing, to contribute to -- i was president and ceo of theñi military and space side.ñrw so loveboeing. i'll alws love boeing t then i gotçó a call from bill ford ad i remember at theñi time thinkig ford, th ford motor company. iñr grew up with ford,ñi it was bright in each of the cities. and at the end, what i decided was i was really being asked to serve a second globalñi american icon. it was just an opportunity that i had to answer. >>ñi charlie: so in 2006, you come to detroit.ñr whatçóñi did you find? >> oh charlie, you knowçó clear,

ford wasçó in trouble.çó and i'll alwaysñi haveñi the utt respect for bill ford for reaching out and asking me to help him turn ford arod. but what i found -- >> charlie: and he had been a ceo and of the family and he realized heñi needed something else. >> exactly. which youñi just have to admiree would give uthe ceo job and asd foromebody a little more experienced thatçó could help hm transform it. here's what we found. ford had really becomeñrçó a hoe of brands, as youñi know. ford as we know cars, trucks, must taxes. they also have t astin martin and jaguar and landrover and volvo. they've takenñppñr 33 equity position in mazda and of course they had ford, lincoln and rcury. soñi really they were a house of brands now and they had kind of lost what does a ford brand reallytand for. so that was one thing. >> charlie: it standsor >> exactly. so the nextçóçó point is we havo become very regionalized9 so wi

had a great ford of europe, ford of the united states,ñr america, ford of india, ford of china. but henry in order set ford up that way because he wanted t participate in the economies, not only provide people with great cars andruck but al is he be part ofñr the fabric of te economy in every part of which we operate. but he never anticipated they would operate completely independently. thereñ2hu8zñi no syner and yet e were competing with the best anotigr reallyñr important thini found was thatñr because of our cost structure and the agreements we had we hadñi made with usa, we uld not make kawrltzçó in the unitedtates. that's why we were focusing on usv's and trucks. if youñi want toñi pick it up, e weren't making cars them. we wereñr losingñi money on alle brkn and a the models. and my first forecast thatñi i shared in 2006 was a $17 billion loss for the year for 2006.çóñr

plan andñr we needed to mov decisively. >> charlie: there's a story which has been repeated often. you're in a meeting with some of the executives who report to you and you saido em, are we doing anything wrong or mething like that. and they nobody raised their hand to say yes, we've got a problem. and you said how can you be losing $17 billion and not have a lot of problems, is that correct. >> exactly, charlie. if i could share a little bit about the story, it kind of shows you the culture change around ford. we had a comprehensive brand to focus on the ford brand. five year plan to profit the growth. we divested all the other brands, we focused on ford and lincoln. we decide to do have a full family of vehicles, small, medium and large. every one of them would be best in class in terms of quality, fuel efficiency, safety, really smart design for ford and of course t best value.

and we decided to fance the plan. we went to banks, we got a home improvement loan. >> charlie: ñr this was what, 2006. the first year, that's when you did the financing. >> exactly. because we needed to do it decisively, not only to restructe ford but also the investors new vehicles plus we took out a cushion for the economy. >> charlie: to allow you to act on yourñiñi strategy. >> exactly. all the leaders arehere, we got 250 charts going through, everyone has the plan. everyone's looking for forecast and they're looking for special attentn. and they're alii color coded, hw the launch is going, how the marketing's going, how th technology's going. we're doing this for three weeks into it, they have a new ceo and all of the charts are green. up come the finance chart and we

project a loss. >> charlie: of $17 billion. >> i stopped the meeting and as nice as i could i said team, is there anything not going well. course the eye contact goes down to the floor. and i'll never forget, charlie, the next week we had a launch of the edge in our plant in canada. the president of the americas and up comes this chart on the launches>x'f the new vehicles. here it can comes up to the edge and it's bright red. and the room gotñr silent. much what is this new guy going to do now. he said it was going to be saved. he said wanted to know what the situation was. all of this knowledge, it was to bem. and so we all looked at it and everybody's kind of looking at me as i started tolap. they said there's a sign. he's going to be gone. i said mark, that is great visibility. and they had an actuator on the tailgate was an issue so mar

did the right thing, he stopped production and got everybody turned to fix theñr problem because we weren't going to work on a vehicle until it was ready. so within 12 seconds, they had a manufacturer, i think i've seen that issue on such and such. they had a product development. i think i've seen that, i'll get you some information. and in manufacturing, joe henry said you need manufacturing engineers to rework the vehicles. maybe 10, 12 seconds on we go to the rest of the meeting. the next week i think it was still red. the next week it was yellow. they solved the problem, had it fixed. the next week it's green and 2000 start moving around the world. charlie, the next week the entire deck of 262 charts looked like a rainbow. because we needed a break through that really did need to know. >> charl: pt of this called change in the culture of a company. what else did you do? i mean culture is important. it's how people relate to each other, it's how transparent they are and it's how bold they are.

>> well, exactly. and i think what really got us started was pulling everybody together and decided what we re really there for. that'socusing on ford, full family of vehicles, best in class. and this working together to pull everybody around the world to use all of our intellectual capability around th world. the next big decision was to include everybody on the team. the business units were on the team like engineering and nufacturing female. we have 17 people that are together around a round table just like this every week, 7:00 in the morning, all the time zones are connected and then they expected behaviors. we actually, if i might reach into my pocket, the two things i carry is the plan of people working together and global enterprise, progressive restructure, make the price people want and work effectively

as a am. charlie, i wrote down expected behaviors that we expected out of each other. when a presenter was presenting, no side conversations, no cell phones. if you need to go, get up and go outside. but we had to have a laser focus the person that was talking. be able to help each other. i find a way, keeping your emotion resilience. professional and technical excellence of a skill position. i think by having this agreement we're going to do this it allowed everybody to help each other fine tune. >> charlie: and competence matters. >> oh, it does. oh charlie, absolutely. i mean, you know, ford was losing a lot of money for a lot of years. they were losing market share. i've never seen suc talted people. mcnamara. i me over the years, ford hasñi brightest.=/hó épind they wereñi losing.

what they needed was justñi a really clear strategic plan. >> charlie: let me go back to the financing for a second. becauseçó you had that financin, along come the economic collapse inñi this countryñiçó and the recession. they say save general motors, save chrysler. we don't need to. money they need.çóçó was that a good thing forñi youy that youñrçó raised allçó that . >> well absolutely. and i remember, this is 2006. so thisisçó two years beforeçó 2008. the reason that we went to the banks was this is going to be one of the biggest transformations in business history because we had to restructure ourselves, go back to profitability. we had over capacity, we had all the brands that we needed to move on. we had to get ourselves right sized to theñi lower demand, but we also had to change all the

factors because there were smaller vehicles in addition to the larger ones. so bigñi invtment for that. big investment for investing in new products and investing for profitabily later. so we went to the banks with this an and w raised 23.5 billion dollars in 26. so we had the financing to go forward. >> charlie: my question in terms is it all an advantage because your people have said, have been quoted as saying it was a huge bonanza of a marketing advantage for us. it gave us an image at a time that we needed it. >> well i'll just give you one example. >> charlie: ford didn't neat tarp money that saysomething to the world. ford's doing something right. >> how that unfolds, in fact your point, clearly general motors and chrysler were completely bankrupt. they couldn't raise any money from anybody based on the

strength of the plan. so they went to the u.s. government and asked for money for temporaryñi hf÷ . and remember we actually went with them and i testified on their behalf that for the good of the indtry and the good ofñi the u.s. economy, it was the right thing to do. >> charlie: people who worked fothese companies. >> exactly. and that was a big decision w made because we did not need the money at the time. now,ou remember the hearings. >> charlie: yes. >> everybodyñi was watching the hearings. and within a couple weeks, 97% of all the peopleçóñi in the und states knew tt chrysler was bankrupt and ford was not and ford was not asking for money and ford had alan. you can imagine everybody going to the ford websites and checking how the ford. it was a strong business doing the right thing but they started checking out all these new vehicles. that's right to your point. the themes that people had throughout the united states for it for taxpayer money was a real

plus for us. >> charlie: but you were saying and you testifi what the obama administration did to bail out general motors and chrysler was better than letting them go interrupt which would have been the consequence. >> absolutely. 'llever know in hindsight but clearly two presidents and their economic advisors, b)wd of them came to the conclusujñ that this was nearly 10 toñi 15% of e usgdp. and if chrysler and their suppliers were going to default we could have taken the united states fromñi a recession into a depression. that's why we deded even though we didn't need the money. >> charlie: to support the idea. >> to support the idea. >> charlie: in order for the larger economy. >> for the larger economy because we could have really set >> charlie: what's the consequence today for geral motors and chrysler? >> well clearly there's som real advantages going into bankruptcy because they go restructured where they weren't able to do it before. and including the biggest was the debt, that their debt was

essentially removed. >> are they atn advantageous position vis-a-vis you. >> they are. and our plan is to remove that disadvantage by repaying our debt based on the strength of our products and our profitability. charlie this is the most exciting things about the earningsçó yesterday. it's the most exciting part. we announce that we repaid another $2.6 billion of our loans, we reduce our debt to $14 billion now on the way to our capital structure of 10 billion. which means in the last year and-a-half, we have repaid 20ñi billionçó of $20.5 milln we borrowed.i we're very close to now investment grade and beingn our way. so even though we were disadvantaged over the last two years, we clearly are removing that disadvantage. >> charlie: what about the union negotiations you have come up with the uaw? >> we're looking forward to it.

>> charlie: you're looking forward to it. >> absolutely. because it's all mpetitiveness. and charlie you think, just think about what we have done over the last five years in our agreement with uaw in 2007 and also in 2009, we have gone from being uncompetitive. not being able to compete in thi whatñr we are now competitive fr chrysler, including wages and benefits are competitive with the best of the people in the united states. >> charlie: europe and asia. >> yes, absolutely. when i say looking forward to it, everybody now knows we have created a profitably growing factually. we're converting truck plants to car plants, making car plants in the united states profit me. we just announced over the next two years we'll be adding 7,000 new jobs. that's what everybody cares about. they were worried about the united states or worried about us competing. and so negotiations now are all focused on competitiveness. what more can we continue to do

to make ford even more competitive soe can grew the business for the good of all of us. >> charlie: you don't foresee it in your future. >> is not even in the conversation. the conversations are about how we continue to improve ford because what everybody wants is they want for us to grow and maker great products and provide great jobs and great careers. that's what everybody's aligned about. >> charlie: i want to talk about your new five year plan in a moment but we're staying with the negotiations and where you are. it is said in t question of competitiveness in american competitiveness with the rest of the world in the 201 that we need t make sure that we do not lose our manufacturing base. >> absolutely. >> charlie: so what do wedo as a nation to be able to be coetitive and manufacture products that the world wants to buy and export them to the world or build them in their country. >> absolutely. and in ford's case, it's important that we design the makings everywhere we operate

around the world because we use all of that intellectual capability and all of that knowledge about the customer in the world. it wasn't very long ago where there was a sense maybe we didn't need to have manufacturing as a fundamental piece of the foundation of our economy. well i think over the last few years especially, we appreciate that manufacturing and design and making things and all of the amazing technology and the research and development that goes with that which is nearly 70% of development in the united states is manufacturing -- >> charlie: 70% of research and development in america is manufacturing. >> you would think the manufacturing was just the making of the components for the assembly. buit isn't designed when you're creating the products. >> charlie: let me make sure i understand. what is all the science research and allof that fit in. is that the remaining rcentage. >> everything associated even in that area with the manufacturing

is the 70%. this is big part of the fabric of the united states. to your question the most important thing is that we look at the u.s. economy and manufacturing with all the policies that we have to make sure we have appropriate tax structur we have appropriate educion but we have a eye towards manufacturing. >> charlie: do we have the propriate tax structure, the appropriate talent level and the appropriate education. >> we are making progress. now clearly we all know the issues but the fact we have moved manufacturing up on the agenda, the fact that the president has the manufacturing task force. he also has a task force for export, real positive signs. for example we are now making the new export, fabulous vehicle that's going to be made in chicago. we're adding 1200 new jobs, another 800 with suppliers recognized states, and charlie we're going to expt that new store to 93 countries around the world. there's no reason we can't do that if our cost structure and

our processes are competitive. >> charlie: the cost structure became what it is because it used to be said that the cost structure made it impossible to compete. that was certainly t japanese invasion. >> and it was. >> charlie: that was changed. >>ñr the last contract negotiations, everybody at ca to e table, we were moving fromhdmfined benefits to defined contributions, moving them to level entr1d wes. >> charlie: and you get it marked to the unions because they've been productive in this. >> because we did this as a partnership and the only way we could make these changes is both of us decided we're we were going to work together and do what was required based on the competitiveness data so that we can compete with the best in the world. with that commitment that's why we're now making cars and making commitments to making new cars right here in the united states. >> charlie: i did see where the president of the uaw i think it was had some harsh things to say about the compensation packages at ford. >> well i think the most important thing is in all of our

compensation, we are aligning the compensation with the success of ford. so everything about my compensation a all the way through every employ is aligned as a business. we're going to do that and we' been talkingbout aligning the performance and conversation also with our uaw representative employees. >> charlie: that's my next question. in fact they may very well be able in some point participate as you do at the success of the. >> absolutely. the performance of 2010 which was just extraordinary, we didn't have to do thisñi but we decided toçó pay our uaw representative employees nearly $5,000 in a performance bonus that went with the performance of the company. as everything that we have fnd is that the more that all of us, everybody associated with ford is aligned with the performance of the company, then the performance really starts to matter. >> charlie: right. has productivity changed too? absoluly.

u can imagine, the quality, the productivity, because you have everybody working together against those performance criteria which is based on what the customers really want in value. >> chaie: here's the big question then. why couldn't this have happened way long ago before america lost its position in the automobile industry. this is the global conversation obviously in terms of what we do here and it's not the american century but we're tking to the american executive who was head of the global company. could this have been done ten years before. if you and what your strategy and your talents had arrived at ford or general motors or chrysler. i mean, in other words -- the question's obvious. >> chaie, it's a really good question. if you can back up, gm, chrysler, ford dominated the u.s. market. >> charlie: right, exactly. and they lost . >> and the japanese arrived and the koreans arrived and they had

small vehicles. they weren't selling at the time bugetting tter a better and bter, the quality, productivity, the efficiency was better and better. an it just seems like it's taken a crises. you just don't want to let a crises pass you by either. >> charlie: it used to be said general motors wasn't a car company, it was a healthcare company. >> exactly. well in memory. just between uaw -- it's like two people on everyone's agreement to agree to that. what we did differently was that we could see that we were going to gradually go out of business if we didn't change the business model. so our choice was are we going to stand together and take the action required and create a viable growing company for the good of all of us or are we going to continue to go out of business. >> charlie: what's interesting about this is that the guy who did it, you, was an outsider. you were not a guy who lived

your life in the car business. >> charlie, that is -- i'm asked a lot about that. i'll just give you one little fun story, on the day i arrived, ford introduces me andwe're linked up around the world, the employees are there and everybody's asking me these penetrating thoughtful questions. finally one of the gentlemen saidwith all due respect, you've had a great career at boeing but you're clearly, you're clearly not a car guy. i said do you have a qstion about that. he said well, it's a very complicated business. very sophisticated. and you're not a car guy you don't understand that and it starts withthe products. theye very sophisticated. i look at him charlie and i said i think you're absolutely right. cars are sophisticated, t quality is the integration with

safety. i might just point out that a 777has four millio parts and a car has a thousand parts and the 777 stays in the air. i said it in the most respectful way i could and i never got another question. one of the reasons it gave me confidence to come to ford was that the similarities, these are very sophisticated products, large engineering design contribution, big manufacturing, they're global, fuel efficiency, quality safety, all the same design parameters. we sell to the ford stores and dealer networks. we sell to the airlines but we're always looking ahead at e traveling public in both cases. large scale global. i felt very geo political economic cycles around the world that you have to deal with. i felt very comfortable. >> charlie: tell me how ford takes l these products and

creates a one ford which is the ea you guys use. the notion that there was a platform so that a car for a german market and a chinese market and american market a latin american mart all come fromhe same platform. >> exactly. th is a very key element, not only for the product and the performance but also for the affordability in the cost. so i'll give you an example. let's talk about the new focus. if you look at the ford product line we have a complete family of vehicles, small immediate um and large, cars and trucks. we art out with the fiesta going up in size, the taurus, the escape, the edge, the x, the new explore, the expedition, the f series and transit. so that family of vehicles right there now where we had 97 of them before. >> charlie: all fords. >> all fords ght there cover 100% of the market worldwide. let's look at at focus.

before we had always argue to ourselves that cars had to be different because the customers what they value was different all the way around the world. well what has happened over the last f years is the requirements are really coalesced. people, no matter what size vehicle they want, they're making a life-style choice. if it's a focus or an f50 they want the finest quality the best efficiencyn that size, they want the most fety features and they want the smart design. so we have a poin of view that the vast majority of the vehicle that contributes to that does not have to be different around the world. that's where the platform came in. we put top hats on that fit what customers want around the world. so on this new focus, we have ten different top hats, sedans, four doors, five doors, hatch back petro, diesel, hybrid, hybrid all electric, suv.

charlie are exactly the same and yet the top and t interior and everything that you touch and feel is stomizedo the unique tastes around the world. >> charlie: where do you think you'll be in five years. >> i think that 80% of all our ford vehicles in volume will be off of five platforms serving all the customers worldwide. >> charlie: what would be the mix between international contribution and domestic contributions. >> i think it will be almost spt a third a third a third. because remember in -- >> charlie: what's a third. >> a third is america, a third is europe. >> charlie: oh, americas. >> yes. >> charlie: so the third is americas. tell me about the car business in china. how much domestic product is serving that market and how competitive are they going to be. and once they're competitive in china where they meet domestic demand how competitive will they be around the world. >> exactly. in china, like russia, part of the requirement of operati there is you do it with a

chinese partner. so -- >> charlie: part of operating. >>ight. and it's nin and we know how to do that and boeing did the same thing around the world. >> charlie: is it 50/50. >> 50/50. and we have a great partner, so we have a joint venture. all of our ford vehicles come out of that jointenture and the majority are for domestic chinese consumption. within the next couple years, nearly 28% of a total market worldwide will be china itself. >> charlie: say that again. >> in the next four years, 28%. >> charlie: of cars sold in the world will be sold in china or through chinese. >> exactly. so having a partner there and seeing operations there, we make the vehicles there. we have our design teams at operate worldwide. >>harlie: do they want differentcars than say very

similar, they want the same kind of car now, small fuel efficient. >> fuel efficiencythe quality, the safety features and the smart design. those reqrements are almost idtical arou the world. everybody values the same parameters. >> charlie: when you look at the do you have of internal combustion engine. >> i think there's going to be a look future for the internal combustion engine. right now we have five, six, seven eight speed transmissions, direct fuel injection, turbo charging. right now we have a lot of room to have a turbo combustion engine. we're going to see more diesels. we'll have biomass. we'll see more use of natural gas. >> charlie: is that a real big future for natural in cars.

>> yes, especially with the trks. when you get to the smaller vehicles, the tank and packaging will be more problematic. >> charlie: because we have natural gas. >> exactly. you'll see more electrification, so you'll see more plug-in hybrids and more electric vehicles and eventually we'll see more hydrogen vehicles. a couple words about how we make that happen. clearly not only the amazing technology in the vehicle but with a need to generate the energy clean so we need really smart electrogrids. we're going to have re natural gas, we're going to have the electrification, we have an infrastructure to charge it. >> charlie: the same thing with wind andolar >> there'sot be system. that's why ihink that the debate and discuion side of the united states about having the system solution is really really important. >> charlie: here's the interesting thing too. we have a debate about a deficit in washington and about people who want to cut spending. not people that want to invest

in these issues that you care about. which is talented, education and which is the infrastructure that served for our future. it's much for on our country. >> and havinkúude united states strong having that intra structure as a base which allows businesses to grow. it's always going to be a public private partnership do that because no one business can do that. that's what made the innovation over time so strong. >> charlie: when did the -- whdidn't the electric car take off. >> one on the vehicle itself and also on the infrastructure. on the vehicle itself you have to make significance improvements on the batteriesñi themselves. they are large and expensive and they take a long timeo charge. >> charlie: are there other companies other than ford and general motors are doing that. >> all of us are working on electric vehicles. we've got -- >> arlie: the's someone

else to provide in the battery or are you worng on that yourself. >>e're notçó working on the batteries. because the batteries will support a lot of oems that's why we encourage tñi countries around the world t have a private partnership on the r&d ïvestment so that well move fo. >> charlier  is that a huge number in order to create a kind of battery. >> henry ford, he had electric vehicles, 1905. and we've been working onh.j-ele but we've got to make a break through on the batteries on their size, capability being able to charge them in hot and cold temperatures. >> charlie: you know there's a criticism of the industry in america that in fact they block the development of the electric car. we'd have been there much further if we had been more interested. and if we had been more urgent. >> wl i wasn't there thenut i'll tell you now charlie, that fuel efficiency is a reason to buy the car. when you look at the reasons

that people consider for buying a car, it's quality, fuel efficiency, it's safety, smart design and very best value, it has to be affordable. fuel efficiency now especially forward. it's going to continue to be a a reason to buy. we're not doing this to be electric, we're doing this because it's absolutely the right thing to do. by say 20/50. fiveñi yearsut is 20. that's tenears out is 20. >> it's really hard to place a specific number. we have said anywhere bween 10 and 20% over the next ten years would be some portion of being electrified. i think the ones that make economic sense as well as our fuel efficient will be hybrids. >> charlie: it's a better way to go than electric. >> for now because of the size of the battery and cost and

infrastructure. everything you do on hybrid vehicle is taking you one step closer to hybrids and all electric vehicles that are all electric. >> charlie: you support a mission standard that would reduce our dependence on cars now. >> absolutely. and we had been right there. >> charlie: wherethe president is. >> from 2007 in the energy independence, ford is right there beg a part of the solution because again it's a reason to buy in addition to a national issue. so us being part of the solution and bringing the naval technology in a way that makes sense, we absolutely believe that's the right way to go. >> charlie: what is the biggest challenge for you. is it to make sure that you serve as global market in the most effective and productive and rewarding way? >> well that an interesting question because i think the most important thing is weñi maintain this laser focus on ford brand and business.

some people they go to experience and they start to get well and they start branching out and doing other things with their money. i think the most important thing we do is stay laser focused on making the best cars and trucks in the world and serving all those customers around the world and doing it and providing more affordable solutions. >> charlie: do you know what's interesting about this whole conversation to me and this seems beyond view but if effective. leadership sets the culture, it sets the sense of mission. it really is about that. and secondly, this is my little soap box. it is the sense of making sure that everybody is part of the same team down to the dealer. and i told you this story when you sat down. the ford dealer -- was my

father friend. father said to me you're either aford family or a chevrolet family. in this case we were a ford family because my father respected and liked bill clinton. th was his friend and so we always drove fords. >> so your point -- >> charlie: and he was proud to be a ford dealer this man. he had served him well but he was proud to be a ford dealer, he had greatride when the new come out. >> we are the fabric of the united states, the fabric of it. we contribute economic development, we're there as a family of safety and that ford store owner is a key member of the community and provides the ford's distribution channel throughout the united states because of the experiences every day there. >> charlie: thank you for coming. >> thank you >> charlie: it's a pleasure to have you. >> it's an important subject for all of us. >> charlie: thank you very much. alan mulally is the ceo of ford

port company. rachel weisz and kathy bolkovac are here. "the whistleblower" tells an importt store. she worked in the created nations as a peace keeper in because know. she discovered their world of six trafficking. the ory's considered one of the biggist cover ups in un history. here's a trailer for the film. >> you've been hired to represent the u.s. as a beacon of hope. as representatives of our highest aspirations, where lawe1 lowns is running rampant. >> what are you doing in here. >> i heard the food was really great. >> what's going on here? >> pardon me? >> you know what's been happening to you.

you promise. >> itçóñr involves all kinds of international and#â%qyñr officers. >> all theñiñiñ.'çó internationi personnel have immunityñr to hae meñi prosecuted. >> you have no police reports, say whatever you want, they're not listening.çó you're onñi your own. >> what happened. >> we're watching you. you better shut your mouth. >> internal affairs. >> trust me. >> we need an armored security vehicle. >> what did they do. >> none of your business. >> why do you want to kill -- i want to protect this organization. >> it doesn't matter who i work for, i wouldn't let anybody get away with it. >> top level military comman are pulling your file. >> we have a system that works here.

>> oh really. >> there's no going back. >> i don't want a scandal, i'm just doing my job.çó >> charlie: i'm pleasedñr to talk about this movie. goodñi to haveçó you rachel. the you've been here before. >> thank you very much. >> charlie: when they want to tell your story, what do you tell them. >> i tell them the truth, the facts and evidence that i found while i washere. and i think that's probably the most compelling and t most credible thing about my story and the fact i won my tribunal in the uk is important. >> charlie: you think they captured it. >> the movie? yes. i think they've done an excellent job of not only capturing bits and pieces of the my story but several really great messages that need to be

given toñi the world.d&>-about t corruptionñi andñi aboutçó many individuals, organizations and corporations who wereqinvolved in the facilitation of that. for me they've done a great job of that. >> charlie: do you think this film will make a difference. >> i think it already is actually. i think there's been so muchçó attention now put on the film and my story that it's forcing a lot of organizations and government organizations to take a second look what happened to me back then and wha me can be done to hopefully make that right. >> charlie: ñi if rachel could capture one thing, what would it be for you? in terms of you, in terms of and your courage. >> if you can captñr one thing, i hope it's theñi attention of e general public arou the world. i think that there's not focus on education for the general public. i thk people still remove themselves from the situation and think it could never happen here. and i thi rachel and the film, the director will definitely bring it home. not onlyçó to the united states, where i think it needs the

motion attention because it was ignored there for many years because my2-e was actually tried in the uk. a lot of the initial publicity was ignored in the u.s. >> charlie: how did they bringñi this project to you? you're sitting the in awe of her. >> i am in awe of kathy. i was thinking the other day, i love the story of an ordinary woman and an ordinary thing and she's like i'm not ordinary. >> charlie: she's right. >> she's very right. >> charlie: how did they get you attached to this. >> attached to the hip. i read it actually in 2007,he producer gave it to me and i was pregnant. five years ago. i was pregnant at the time. i read it and i thought this is one of the most remarkable story and remarkle scrip i eve read. but it was t harrowing because of my physical state. i couldn't engage wh it but i was willing to buy the story.

it never left my mind, which is every couple week it would drift into my mind and i would push it away. two years later i called the producer and i head hey remember th script, is it still available. i don't know the details, it was embroiled somewhere some way but they got it back for me. so it was something that i just couldn't get out of my mind. >> charlie: you like these kinds of stories. >> it does fall into, i would like to say genre, i don't know if it is a genre i can't think of any two movies but for instance it felt good. kind of a david and goliath story, a human being that goes up against a huge organization or a corporation to do what they think is right. i love those kinds of movies, i love them. so they kind of fell into that sort of spac

>> charlie: did i have any -- >> i think it did because i played a beding heart activist, and i had to say kathy would you call yourself an actist. she sa absolutely not. >>harlie: iwasn't so much you acted for a political cause, but i mean a firm believer in wanting to see things changed and willing to put yourself on the line to do that. >> i was just going to do my job and my job was to be a police officer and to train and monitor and focus on rebuilding a nation and bringing democracy. to me that was my job. to me that's not being an activist, far from it. >> the thing that kathy just said when i met her and talked that most struck me, she was the going in there to try to do some extraordinary thing and try to save the world. she felt this was her job to investigate crime. there was a crime and she did

that thing. >> charlie: i found that to be true often with people who do things beyond what we might respect and it's heroic in the sense. they alws say it was my job. whyçó wouldn't i do this. >> it's very moving. >> charlie: exactly. when were you the most fright upped? >> well to be nest, i think i was pbably the most frightened after got out of bosnia. i thin my colleagues, my friends, my current husband were very frighned for me athe time. i was warned, u need to be careful, you need toget out. the time has come to go. but for me i think i was so focused. i think i was so focused on actually making sure that if i was going to bringçó this to the publ and if indeed i was goi to pursue this, i had to remain vigilant, yet i did break down after i left the cntry and i think excellent for about a

ek afterward. it was all exhausting. i never thought of writing a book until the producers and directors and writers came to me and interview about my story. that's really the first time i ever thought about writing and book. they asked me why haven't you written a book. >> charlie: maybe that's a good question. >> it was an unfed missile. the that's what was on the trial. >> that's what it was about, because the corporation o did this to me fired me for blowing the whistle, for saying what i did and for sending an e-mail while i was there. >> charlie: what did you say. >> it was a rather lengthy, what some people would describe as a rather preachy e-mail at the time but it was really an educational e-mail that i directed to un officials to state dent officials to monitors in the field. really educated them on what was happening to these women. it was kind of instigated after 37 women were quote, unquote rescued by the u.n. at a brothel. women has been abused and raped

and psychologically traumatized. it's so clear to me that the people working the mission had no idea really what these women were in store for. and they also really were looking at these women as just prostitutes. in fact thatphrase they're just prostitutes were being bounced around the mission so often that it just really made me sick to hear it. >> charlie: this sce where you first meetyan. >> ty need you, come on. >> hurry. >> take this end. hurry. >> she was talking but i couldn't understand. she's not local.

>> what is it? >> could you call a medic. somebody call an ambulance. >> further back. >> calm down take a breath, take a breath. >> nine girls, nine girls are

there. >> where are they. >> florida bar. >> what is that florida bar. >> there's a florida bar in the hills. i can take them where we usually take them. >> usually? hey, hey hey. where is the bar. how do i get there. >> charlie: tell me about that, these. >> well, it's the last time that kathy meets -- she doesn't really know anything, she doesn't know what's happening. there's a girl who is beaten up, traumatized and someone is saying we normal here take them to a shelter. he's been blaze. he's been there for a long tile. >> charlie: we normally take them to the shelter. >> yes. kathy aligned with the audience don't know what's happenin e mystified what these people are talking about. they're talking about rai they're talking about nine girls escaped and sheoesn't know at's happened. that's kind of the beginning of the thriller. >> crlie: was this the beginning of your own sense of i

have to do something? >> yes. i mean in this particular scene in the movie, it definitely is. and there wereimilar cases througho my work while i was inosnia whesimilar instances like this occurred several months apart. where for me the tension built. and then prior to me going to bosnia someone mentioned to me at our training from the company that hired me that he knew where to find really nice 12-15 year olds. so i had a sense before i got to because know something wasn't quite right. there wasn't anybody doing investigations. >> charlie: how b an ternational problem is this? >> well i believe it's all around the planet. i mean in my own country in england which is n a developing country, it's a huge problem. and this isn't the only time the u.n.'s been accused of being involved in trafficking in the congo in 2004 and liberia and more recently it'something

th's prevalent. >> charlie: what about the u.n.? >> i think it's not so much about the u.n. but the fact that the u.n. had no control over what many of the keepers and what many of the contractors are doing whil they're in these countrs. there's no realechanism for investigating and prosecuting these individuals and there's accountability that takes place. so for the u.n.,it's a matter of when tuble arises, you send these people home to be basically disciplined in their home countriesnd that rarely happens because tre's never been any proper investigation done or evidence that's been collected. there's no body or authority to do that. >> charlie: so, what happened? >> well, ultimately after about a year and-a-half doing these investigations and having them pretty much thrown in the trash can by not only the u.n. investigators, the u.n. internal affairs office, the company that i work for. basically i was fired on the grounds of falsified a time sheet for an instance that had occurred a year prior to them

firing me. i took the case to the tribunal in the uk and that's how i was able to then bring all of this that was happening out into the public eye. the company that terminated me basically lost and then they appealed and then they dropped the lawsuit in order to ga contracts in iraq. so for me it wasn't a lot of justice and actually never came forward with any kind of misstatement at that time where things were actually changing from their end either. so there have been alot of, there's a lot of progress made and for the past ten years a lot of different policies, a lot of code ethics and conducts have been looked at. a lot of people have interviewed and i've gone on speaking engagements. in my opinion it's a lot of diplomatic lip service and it's time for actual laws to be changed and for action to be taken. >> charlie: is that the focus of your life now. >> yes, it really is. i work in a full time job as a private managerand my weekends and evenings are taken upnot by

act viz actual but advocacy. >> charlie: do all the people you saw fear in your memory. >> in because know you mean? a lot of them are. i terviewed over 100 women in less than a year's time that came to my office and took pictures of them when they came through my office and sat with them at hospitals and went to court with them. so there are a lot of specific incidents. the trouble is they were so similar, all the incidents but they do blend together over the years. >> charlie: thankou for coming. >> thank you. >> thank you. captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org