>> rose: welcome to our program, tonight after a busy week on wall street we take a look at the financia market, economic growth, and governments, with gillia gilliaf ththe financialimes and greg ip of the finae magazine >> it would actually reflect well in history, it would tell us our policy makers thrernd lessons of the great depressio office the 1930s and responded aggressively and creatively to the crisis, i think the period since then will go in history where we repeated the mistakes of the 1930s, unfortunately. >> we continue this rise of e planet of the aims with frieda pinto. >> i read the script, met with rupert and i realized h how he s going to do it and i thought that is great. actually, you know what? this is a movie that continues the tradition of the early films, use as loft to the, lots of the

concepts and themes that are very strong and resonate 30 years later but found a key and way to do it by using the can cutting ed technology of our time. >> rose: and finally this evening we end with a personal note, it is something we called if you knewosie, like we know josie. >> iouldn't possibly have imagined that i would learn as much as i did, go to davos and brazil and a of these incredible places and meet all of these incredible people that i hope i can remember for the rest of my life. >> rose: a look at the global economy, talking about a new film starring james franco and a personal note when we continue. >> funding for charlie rose was provided by the following. >> every story needs a hero we can all root for, who beats the

odds, who comes out on top, but this isn't just a storyline, it is happening every day all across america. every time a storefront opens, or the midnight oil is burned, or when someone chase as dream, not just a dollar. they are small business owners, so if you want to root for a real hero, support small business, shop small. >> rose: additional funding provided by these funders. >> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. >> from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. captioning sponsoredy rose communications

>> rose: fear and volatility were back on wall stre this week, yesterday the dow jones industrial average lost 513 points, today, the ind was down as much as 245 points, it closed up 60 on news that european central bank would like to begin purchasing italian and spanish bonds. the s&p 500 lost its gains for 2011 and down four percent for the year, the slump erased more than $4 trillion from the value of equities worldwide since july 26, this morning, there was a glimmer of hope for the u.s. economy, the labor department announced 117,000 jobs were added last month. president obama noted that further improvement is needed. >> while this marks the 17th month in a row of job growth in the private sector, nearly two and a half million new private sector jobs in all, we have to create more jobs than that each month to make up for the more than 8 million jobs that the recession claimed. we need to create a

self-sustaining cycle where people are spending and companies are hiring and our economy is growing. >> rose: to talk about all of this joining me now in new york is gillian tet, the editor of the financial times, fro washgton, d.c., greg ip, the editor for the economist magazine, i am pleased to have both of them here on this friday. >> i have general and specific questions. first, where are we? >> very specifically, are we headed for another recession? >> we are at the moment of tremendous fear, what is going on in the markets right now is noquite so much happened in autumn of 2008,nvestors are losing confidence, not only in the ability to tell what is safe and what is not safe, this is talking about the sovereign nations, before it was amongst the bakes banks, but also whether they have confidence in the ability of the governments to actually fix this problem, over, they are losing faith in the idea that the european governments will come together and do the right things to really quell the crisis, and

here in the u.s., there is a real concern about the willingness and ability of washington to essentially quell what is looking like a bit of a soft patch in the u.s. economy. >> rose: those two things are driving great fear about where the market might go. >> there is a collision of these two very nasty bouts of wobbles. >> beyond that, the health of the economy? >> the health of the economy is interesting, and it is not yet falling off a cliff, thankfully, but it is not yet recovering strongly. and what is really worrying the investors right now is th the government seems to pretty much out of bullets to deal with it. essentially the feds have already used up a lot of its ammunition on the monetary policy side. people are talking about q e-3, but the chance of doing that rightow, in my mind, is relatively low, given you have bubbling inflation and at the same tim we have been thrgh the negotiions on the u.s. debt ceiling and there is a chance washiton rushing to anymore fiscal stinl lsu would look small too, so i they are

short of ammunition right now. >> rose: greg. >> what you are seeing in the markets this week is two concerns, one is the fear, especially of crisis of events in europe jill kran was referring and the other is changing perception on how healthy is the economy? the voir they have beenrunning with for the last few month, yes we had a soft patch in the spring, because gasoline was like up a buck a gallon and the problems in japan related to the earthquake and tsunami which interrupted supply chains so the feeling was when we get to june and july those factors will no longer be an issue and the economy will rebound nightsly in the second half and what we saw over the last few weeks is aver irs of data, whether on manufacturing or retail sales that suggested that story was falling apart, the economy was not coming back, now today's job numbers think changed the perception once again, it is the firstbig solid economic report we have for the month of july, and much to our relief, jobs rieu, we had like 117,000 jobs, that was better than wall street

expected. now don't get me wrong, that is not a great, spectacular number, in fact, at this stage of the business cle we should be growing by 200,000 to 300,000 jobs per month. but it is not a number that would tell you we are at all back into recession, so in other words, if you thought the odds of reception two days ago were say 50 percent, today mayb you think th were only, they are only 30 peent, there is a big caveat to the story, which is what you are seeing going on in the market speakso a broader loss of confidence which can be a sel self-fulfilling prophecy s stocks fall and watch that they shut their wallets and don't buy the car or house, businesses that were thinking of hiring or investing they wait another month or two and dealing with things all compounded with a sense that washington, whether it is congress, whether it is the president, whether it is the federal reserve, simply doesn't either have the means or the inclination to step in and help. >> if everybody believes that growth is what we need, that will take care of unemployment over the long-term, growth is dependent on demand and there is

no demand. >> this is a unique cycle from the point of view of the postwar period. it always has been the case before now that no matter how weak demand was, the federal reserve can get interest rates down to some level, that would push that demand bag up, but they have had interest rates, short-term interest rates at zero now for almost three years and it hasn't been must have, now if they could they would push them to negative territories but they can't, that lees you with a fewools like exotic quantitative easing which is just buying bonds with newly created money and leaves fiscal policy. >> what is at rk right now both sides of the atlantic u have games of political brink man ship and this is really the e.a. of brink man ship, in washington you have the tea party involved in brink man ship with the administrion and with the markets, and over in the euro zone today you have thecb trying to bully countriesinto unveiling more awe search at this measures, whether it would continue to finance finance on a large scale. the problem with brink man ship approach is not only is it

leaving markets very nervous and very confused about what is going on, it is making many ordinary people pretty nervous and confused as well about the ability and willingness of governments to act. of course it is making it that much harder for politicians to actually produce proper forward looking policies, and so you are constantly getting these kind of half measures, these band-aid solutions that highlight the problems in everyone's mind but don'actually offer an answer. >> rose: what is happening in the rest of th world? i mean, that is the condition the united states an that is the ndition in europe, i mean, what does this mean four the rest of the world and what is their attitude about us? >> greg? >> well, one of the interesting things is that notwithstanding all of the panic and turmoil you have seen in the markets this week we actually have not had signicant down braids in t economic numbers, for example, spain and italy both has gdp numbers out today and owing slow rothe but not markedly slower than we expected, japan is back, coming back from its problems related to the earthquake, more quickly than

people had anticipated, as we were talking about earlier, the numbers in the united states while poor, they are certainly not at this point, suggesting we are back into a recession, it is all about what you think comes next, whetherthe psychological impact worsens, it is possible that if we get a few more good numbers, for example, it turns out that car sales cars sales were a bit better, that could restore a bit of confidence to investors and having said, you know, it is the case of policy makers are all dysfunctional and not doing the right thing right thousand but the economy is okay anyway. >> rose: is this unemployment situation different from others and are people looking at the expectation that they will not have a job over the next several years? >> very much so. i mean, if you were to compare what has happened since the recession ended a little over two years ago, it i utterly unlike what we have seen in any of the other dozen of business cycles we had since the second world war, no decline in the unemployment rate, what that tells you have the growth we had

since the end of the recession has only been must have to keep up the force of theabor force, not the 8 million people or so who lost their jobs that,ed is rtually unique in the united states postwar history, i would say, however, there are precedents in other countries for it, because we have a lot of evidence now that this is the kind of rothe you typically see after a crisis, there is so much debt that needs to be paid down that you simply do not get the surge of spending that you typically have. >> to my mind, one of the most interesting comparisons is not just what is happening in the u.s. job marke compared to historical periods but what is happening elsewhere in the world, because certainly, until recently, america is much better at generating jobs but if you look right now, america was nine percent unemployment, is actually away way above part of the euro, euro zone, it is hovering around six percent,.

>> well, they have very different systems, i mean, germany has a whole system of micromeasures, which they have been using to try and encourage the jobless to go back into jobs, companies tend to hang on to their workers much longer, the down side of that is productivity levels have fallen during the recent downturn, whereas in the u.s. they have been flat or rising, but the measures are trying to keep workers. i am not trying to suggest you can import the german system into the u.s., america has traditionally used a very flexible labor market approach, the packet people move around between companies and regions, to actually tackle unemployment. what is tough right now is the flexible approach of pele moving is not working because similar my people are not moving enough because they have debt with their houses, o companies are focused on either shedding jobs that become more productive

or moving operations overseas, that is, that you are not sing the u.s. economy generate the normal pattern of job creation, as greg said,. >> rose: they are now going to pivot and focus on jobs what tools does the president have? as you suggest willed is no stimulus to have. >> the fed can't do anything with monetary policy, so where are those jobs going to be developed? >> it is difficult, because you don't have, say, the german work councils, you don't have a condition of companyuffers, seeing some kind of moral obligation to keep them on for the long-term, so there might be a measure in europe cannot be imported. so frankly the best thing the government can do is to hope they find a y to spot more competence in the business community and use some of the vast cash piles that businesses are sitting on right now to actually invest and hir the problem, though, and this is really why it is a vicious circle is that unless businesses start to believe thathere is going to be more stable moo and

more stable environment going forward, they won't have that confidence, and right now we don't have tha >> rose: okay. so when the economic history of th period, from 2007 to let's say 2012 is written, will it probably say that what happened to the u.s. economy as it became obsessed by the deficit and, erefore, lost their focus on job creation, and growth, and that was a serious mistake? >> i think it should be divided in two segments. i think 2007, 2009 period would actually reflect well in history, and tell us that our policy makers learned the lesson of the great depression of the mean 30s and responded gressively and creatively to the crisis, sadly i think the period since then, we will go down in history as one where we repeated the mistakes of the 30s. what has been fascinating to me, is the extent here in the united states, you see this debate between whether or not the deficits are -- and the stimulus that we have had are helping the

problem or hurting the problem, and with the debt deal we saw this week, we actually saw the view that the way to create jobs is to have awe search at this now, and that flies in the face of the most economic theory and evidence we have, at least in the case of the united states. it is a little bit .. different in europe and i find that somewhat troubling, going back to this last question you were asking about i find it ironic the president says now is the time to go into job creation when he just signed off on a bill that actually makes job eation harder because of the amp down on discretionary spending that it is going to have. now, the story is not competely written yet, obama was very much would like to have a few more things done in the next month. one would be for a example, extending the payrl tax cut we had st december. it is supposed toexpire in december of this year. he would like it t continue for one more year and that would safe guard the economy a little bit. and finally, the one that he would like the least likely

to bet is a big burst in infrastructure spend something all of those things, there is a consensus on the first two certainly among everybody from the center to the left to me, in terms of the unemployment benefits, but the question about investment spending seems to be of a different, as you suggested. even though those who argue about american competitiveness argue that if we don't do that, then we are paying a price that will, that will see it tolls take place ten, 15 years from now. >> this goes back to the point we were saying earlier, that one of the things weighing on the economy is the profound differences and polarization we had, in exactly what the economy needs. you see it at the macro big picture level where democrats and republicans profoundly on how we need to solve our fiscal problems now, right dow to the microlevel, in the last few months there has been this fight going on in the congress to pass this free trade agreements have already been signed with columbia, panama and korea. both sides want these agreements

to pass, obama wants them to pass, the republican congress wants them to pass. they were hung up because .. wanted as a condition of their ratification a renewal of some features of trade adjustment assistance, that sat longstanding program we have to retrain people whose lives and jobs have been wiped out by trade, and republicans disagree with that as a useful program and didn't want the two things tied together. only this ek was there an agreement reached in the senate to move those free trade agreements forward, whe when it comes back in september but the fact it took so long to agree to something that previously was not really the source of much disagreement in either party speaks to how much division there is in the a as to what the u.s. economy needs. >> what is going to happen to the u.s. stocks? >> there is growing alarm amongst a number of investors about the debt outlooks, the broad economic olook, and

about -- and that would normally depress ea other. and -- over the last year. but at the same time, wn you look an the rest of the world d say where else do people want to put their money? do they want to go to the euro zone anand/or go to the yen, the othr shadow currencies like australia and canada and switzerland, they are already rising fast. >> i will go to you in a minute. with respect to that, where are people putting their money they do not believe that today's news is more accurate reflection of wre we are than yesterday's news >> they are indeed putting it in cash, that's why treasury bills are basically yiding zero and it is actually negative interest rates, think about that r a moment, some people are actually paying the government for the privilege of lending it money. we had an interesting monument from the bank of new york this, announcement, certain depositors if they have -- we have big

problems about political governments in america.

new movie, it is a prequel to the original planet of the apes which debuted in 1968 charles, charlton heston, set in san train sisco, a scientist who experiments on apes and srches for a cure for alzheimer's, rodman discovers his drug boosts intelligence, this sets the scene for a simian revolution. here is the trailer for the film. >> why don't we begin. >> meet chimp 9. we gave him gene therapy that allows the brain to create its own cells in order to repair itself. we call it the cure to

alzheimer's. >> oh, she a smart one, isn't he? >> you want him to sign? >> just a handful of things. >> caesar continues to show cognive skills that far exceed that of the human counterpart, the drug in his system has radically boosted healthy brain funconing. >> the drug works. >> this testing needs to be contained. >> is that a chimp? >> are you okay, pal? >> no. you are not a pet. >> >> you are not going nowhere, mr >> he hasn't spent any time with

other chimps. >> you are going to stay here now. you are not going home right now. >> that monkey will learn who is boss sn enough. >> you have no idea what you are dealing with.

>> caesar! >> joining me now the film's director rupert wyatt, franco and frieda pinto, i am pleased to have all of them at this table to talk about this trailer we just saw. welcome. >> thank you. thank you. >> rose: good to see you again. a nice experience at brown university about may of 2011, and to you. >> thank you very much. rose: how did this come into being, this idea to do this? >> well, i think, i mean everybody knows the mythology so well and it is one of those franchises that is so timeless, i suppose, and that's why we are making this movie in this day and age and it is coming up to 50 years since the first novela was written. so i mean for me to, the simple logic i guess is when i fir saw the original film, the first time you see an ape, he is on a horseback, and it that idea of seeing beast harnessing beast in a way that turns the world

upside down and it was shocking to the audience at the time and still is, and wsort of looked to restart the mythology and i guess reboot it, is what they call it, but in a way with an original origin story because it is about origin of the species >> and you hired the actors? >> yes, and they hired me, yes. >> rose: and who is your character. >> will rodman is a scienti who is looking for the cure to alzheimer's. >> rose: is he -- >> he is -- sea little more emotionally invested tn maybe he should be because his father has alzheimer's and the father played by the great john lithgow, and so because of that, he ds, yo you know, a few ethically questionable things and it is sort of like a surgeon who is operating on a family member, you ow, becomes a little too emotionally involved, but overall, you know, he is a

noble guy looking for a cure to a disease, and then things get out of hand. >> rose: and how did it go from thinking about his father and developing the drug so that it delivers extraordinary intelligence to -- i mean a couple of things -- i mean a couple of things go wrong, he starts bringing the drugs home, un-- experimental drugs home and testing on his father. i mean that is a huge plopoint but, you know, probably shldn't do that kind of thing, anthen there are people that, you know, start hearing about this drug and seeing dollar signs and so they start doing some things they shouldn't and things go a little wrong but that is part of the story. it is one of those things for me i hate films which, or stories that always say careful what you wish for or don't open that box there or medicine is wrong because we know that is not the case. our civilization, civilization the great thing about our species we look to evolve and

progress and do that through invention and discovery and medicine and so everybody, i think, it is safe to say we would love to find a cure for alzheimer's but the face of ose decisions lie with the individual and that is what our movie is about is individuals who make fateful decision displootion your character makes a fateful decision. >> picks the simeon is the voice of reason for the apes, and the moral cscience and i feel through her character, she can show will, for the way he is bringing up caesar, when she first suggested maybe he should be given open space instead of being taken care of at home. and i guess in in that sense it is kind of like a mini dedication to people who really work tirelessly in thi field, like jack niece the primetologist has been doing for a while so very lucky to play this character.

>> rose: who is caesar. >> he is a young chimpanzee, se the product of this experiment, in many ways, his mother is one of the test subjects, james' character and he starts off in a way, slightly dehumanized and considers these apes numbers, and -- >> rose: it is kind of a cold and isolated character. >> yes, absolutely. and in so many ways that begins to change, because of caesar, because of this little infant chimp that he chooses to save and bring out of the laboratory and bring home with him. >> rose: what happens between will and caesar? >> well, we are talking, like, gosh, will is a lot, because i was just explaining like who theville lanes are, but for me, that is kind of a device to get to what i see is is like the real meaning behind this film and the preview ape films, where i think they do two things really well. they allow us to examine how we

define ourselves as humans, where for a long time, you know, i guess we thought, we are superior to other species because we have souls or, you knowthat would be the religious reasoning, and then maybe in the past 200 years or so we would say well we are more telligent than animals, so what happens when you take an animal and give it the same amount of intelligence as we have? they are stronger than us, they are probably -- they have the same depth of feeling as we do, so really why are we not animals at that point? or why are they not -- >> rose: the difference between animals and -- i guess the plot line is how caesar receives this drug and what it does to him. >> the he in herritz t gen of the mother, he in hertz the genes ofhe inherits the jeans of the mother to fin this cures and once he is brought home,

this ape possesses this extraordinary intelligence beyond that of a normal chimp and decides to keep him at home and decides in sort of a way to keep him there in order to bring his work home with him and gradually the irony is he starts to to humanize will, although he is a chimp, and he becomes a sort of surrogate son but he then grows u conflicted becae he wants to be like human, he wants to aspire to be all of the things we can be but at the end of the day he is still very much an ape. >> rose: okay. roll the tape. is is a clip where caesar is defending charles as he accidentally crashes the neighbor's car. here it is. >> stop! you stop right now! hey! hey! get out of there! get out of the car! what the hell are you doing? get out of my car. i said get out of my car! >> i didn't mean to -- >> answer the damned question. what were you doing?

>> i have a car -- >> the police can handle this. stay rht there! stay right there! >> rose: wow. tell me about caesar and how you -- how do you go about creating a character like this? and what are the options? >> i guess the simplest way you can describe it is sort of, andy and i, i came to this film knowing nothing. rose:ndy sirkis.

>> i knew so much going into the making of this movie, when i first met andy, he explained to me how capture technology works and if you think about it in terms, you know the elephant man, extraordinary performance, won him an oscar, john hurt. >> rose: a gray play. >> yes. exactly. and -- but there is john hurt, buried beath all of thes layers of amazing prosthetic make-up, but still through all of that shines who wonderful peormance, and performance technology allows you to do is actually perform the role of a whole other creature, a whole other avatar, basically but to do so using digital process at , makeups is not necessary in a fiscal way and create it in post production but at irts heart i an actor wearing this capture camera on its face capturing all of his emotion which is the heart of the performance and that is what has changed everything so i can't

dramatically in terms of cinema we are so used to seeing cgi characters that don't have a is soul. >> and this is more important than having a person in a cam pan see suit? >> yes. >> rose: so you can capture the emotion? >> yes. i think the difference between us and the other movie movies is that we are telling the story of real apes so we couldn't ever put an actor in a prosthetic suit, and make it look real, we have long levels, they have short legs, we have short torsos and they have long torsos, so we feasibly couldn't make that look plausible so only two options live apes or performance capture. >> how do you create a relationship betwe caesar and the human beis that are playing, especially will? >> i mean, that is the other thing you get. not only do you have areature that is not created just from the outside by animate tors that would make look, .. you know, photo realistic, but you have a performance underneath, but admission to that, andy, the

performer, can be onset with the actress playing humans, and it is going back to just the basics of, you know, classical acting, you know, two or more actors opposite each other generating the scene, rather than having, you know, frieda and i act to tennis balls, we can, once again, create the relationships off the other actor and that is how i was trained, to just connect to the other actor and that's how you d a scene, and so when people see the movie, and initially they will think, wow, it looks so real, the apes look so real, i can't believe you didn't use real chimpanzees, but the other thing i hear a lot by the people that have seen it, i couldn't believe how emotionally drawn into the story i was and i have to believe that is because you feel the connection between andy and the other actors, and you just, you know, it is hard to fake that, and that was kind of the key, and that was the new -- that was

really the new element, i mean you have had a lot of cg creatures in a lot of movies but to have, you know, this detail of a relationship between kind of a cg performance capture creature and humans is, to this exnt, i don't think it has been done, so thats what is really cutting edge about this. >> rose: and how was -- how was it for you? >> i feel it made the challenge easier because if it wasn't for andy we wouldn't understand pain or the chill pan' is going through pain right now or the chimpanzee is happy right now, you get some of the emotion of the ape in order for us to react off of it. i think it made it easier. >> rose: you can see as he is watching. will's father. >> yes. >> rose: you can see, before he jumps out, there is a sense of, my god, they are hurting him. >> yes. >> rose: and i mean you look into the eyes and you see the soul. it is really a first. it is a first in terms of real creatures that we know and understand in our world. i mean, the avatar did it very

successfully with alien creatures but i think this is a first in the terms of pullg something off that is a very high bar to hit because you have a very sophisticated modern audience that know exactly what a chimpanzee looks and acts like and you act them to believe a cg renderedersion of that. >> rose: tell me about the caesar and this arc he takes. >> it is a huge one, i guess you could sort of compare it to a spartacus storye is sort of starts off as the film is broken into three clear acts, the first act of the story story which is how he grows up in our world and es the world for what it could be in tech color, all of that kind of very positive and learns from us and wants to be like us .. and then this key moment which we just saw, turns everything on its head, he is chucked out of our society. >> rose: and put back in a cage. >>es he is a freak and doesn't belong, he is neitr one thing or the other in many ways because when he is throw thrown

in with his own kind they don't want to know him, he wants to shake their hahn, he eats with a knife d fork and all of these humanistic things they kind of detest, and so he is stuck in this sort of netherworld and very much alone and he then gradually begin to realize he can't realize on human kind to save him, even his own surrogate father. >> and he knows where he should belong. >> rose: and that is the conflict. >> that is exactly the conflict and takes him to the revolution. >> rose: the revolution? what do you mean by t revolution? >> i mean -- >> rose: and so we see them everywhere? >> well, we saw that in the -- >> well, a lot of people have sort of criticized us or questioned how on earth can you actually have 150 aims, they don't know how many apes there are in our movie but say, a lot of people don't seem to understand that actually in this country, there are, i think,

nearly 6,000 chimpanzees and that is an extraordinary number of apes, and that is because they have been cast out from laboratory testing, a lot of circus chimps and all live in these different sanctuaries or homes or laboratories, still, and we are just telling the story of a small number of th, but actually there is a primate facility in santa bruno that has close to 100 apes. >> rose: so you have a l of choices. why did you choose this? >> i think painly because i thought it was -- i went first, when i heard they were going to make another planet of the apes, i thought, well, it would be maybe fun because, you know, 1968 film ud actors in masks, at that time, that was cutting edge technology, and i have heard people that saw it in the theatre and they said, yeah, at that time we had never seen anything like that, it was so realistic, how did they do that. overtime, as technology

develops, there was masks started to look less realistic, but they start to take on a different nd of appeal, like a camp appeal, and so i think most people thatsay, oh, i am a huge fan of the originals, are kind of nerds in the sense that they like the campiness of great tors like tim hunter and roddy mcdowell in these crazy masks having these intellectual conversations and that is kind of cool but you can't repeat that, you can't kind of go back and say we are going to use lesser technology unless you want to make kind of a comedy or a camp thing. so i was like, i don't know if this is -- if this can wor and i read the script and i met with rupert and i realized how he was going to do it and i thought, well, that is great. actually, you know what? this is a movie that continues the tradition of the early films, use as lot of the concepts and themes that are still very stng and resonate, you know, 40 years later.

but they found a key and a way to do it by making it -- by using the cutting edge technology of our time, and guess i thought, i was such a huge fan of lord of the rings and both the eects and what andy serkis had done with the character gollum with that and the same cinematographer and how he was talking about this being a character people in a lot of ways and i thought, well, i am open to new acting experiences, and if i can do something with all of those people i have looked up to and try this new kind of acting instead of, you know, it is like maybe five, ten years ago oh i would say that is easy work, i am going to run away from that because actors had to like subject themselves to the needs of the technology. now, the thnology kind of is coming to the actors once again and i thought, well, this actually will be a cutting edge annew kind of acting experience, and so i embraced. >> rose: how many films do you have between slum dog millionaire and this?

>> two. three. >> re: and the attraction for you was? >> well, taking from what james said, yes the technology and all, but i had been in a cgi film before that, we shot in 3-d, so the whole technology part, yes, it was very fascinating but i think the main reason why i took the film on was the relevance of the original, of the script, the fact it came, it was talking about thconflict of our times, you know, it is not a preach economy film that says, animal testing is i don't think the apes are going to revolt, it is not as simple as that, we are talking about something .. that is very much kind of grounded in reality and talking about something that is very current. so i like the idea of doing something that is big budget, that had planet of the apes backing it and soul to it and a combination of all of these factors. >> rose: human emotion. take a look at this, this is a clip where will and caroline are at the ape sanctuary, saying good-bye.

to caesar. he will be a little skittish at first but we will integrate him. you will probably miss him more than he will miss you. you will be surprised how quickly they adapt. we provide a stimulating environment. he will thrive here. >> caesar. it will be okay. everything is going to be okay. >> you are going to stay here now.

we are not going home right now. >> my experience is the longer you drag out the good-bye, the harder it is. >> rose: one thing about the effects in this movie is after we do the main shoot it does take quite a while to, you know, get all of the final effects and rendered so i didn't really get to see the film, the final version until a week and a half ago, but i did bring a couple of friends, and i was amazed to see how wrapped up emotionally they got when, you know, the cg creature -- rose: the story. >> yes, you buy into it, you go with it as if it was a real chimpanzee. >> and has a of those emotions. all of that sort of -- >> yes. especially it was one of those challenges we had when facing it, how will we get the audience to root for a species other than us. >> rose: and you accomplished it by using -- >> i think we accomplished it by

appealing, i would like to think, i mean, they are the underdog, they are the ones who in a way, are the oppressed and they are the ones who rise up against us, but for me it was always about appealing to this audience, that hopefully is going to see this film, our best nature if you know what i mean, compassion, our empathy, all of the things that make us great, and i kind of think the best block below, blockbusters do that, if you think of et and close encounters. >> rose: the humanity of their character. >> no matter how big or a grand of scale you need a very human story at its heart to actually engage people. >> rose: tell us more about caroline and the character. >> well, what was interesting about caroline is for me to kind of work on the otheride, both character and you know we have the other characters in the film, not working on, the man side of the aims and what was interesting for me through my research that rupert put me on to, i learned so much about

the commonality between human behavior and ape behavior, and i was completely surprised, the fact tha they could emote feelings of loss, and the biggest feeling they could emote which surprised me was betrayal, you know, and i saw that would be an emotion that was going to be used in the fil as well in a way, especially in the scene where will comes back to take caesar and caesar kind of, in a way, it is a difficult decision for him to make and stays back and it is almost like the other chimpanzees do not feel betrayed by this new leader that is going to be. so all of these feelings and the feeling of, i learned about the -- in the film which are the only peace making apes in the film, and they use the same gesture of, you know, not the handshake, necessarily, they us sex in order to resolve conflict but it is the kind of the touch and all of these things are so interesting for me to learn from the point of view of my character, caroline, and to in fuse that into my relationship with will as well.

what i am trying to understand what he is doing, which comes as a big shock five years later, yway, trying to understand what he does for a living and trying to strike that balance between what i do for a living as well. so i guess the whole conflict and a lot of people asked me during my interviews why wasn't she more aggressive andhen i thought about it and ihought, wh would she gain b being more aggressive at that point in time, the only way she could put it across is agent her way of saying this is wrong and needs to be changed. >> what happens to will? >> i would sa goes -- we talked about how he is emotionally isolated person at the beginning but he is not a bad rson, he is just someone that is a little too focused on his work, and so he d absolutely no social life. and then. >> rose: that can warp you. >> yes. and then rupert -- i met with are yorupert, you know, in the y days, he said, maybe the studio doesn't want to hear this

reference, but it is sort of like cramer versus cramer, in that circumstances force this young chimpanzee on my character, and he has to take care of it. and. >> rose: caesar changes will? >> certainly. and -- but also because it is a chimpanzee with extraordinary intelligence, it is more like taking care of a child than just a pet, and so will does become a dad, and despite himself he does start caring for it, but he has conflicted intentions where not only does he care about this -- it is like, you know, the missing link. it is incredibly intelligent ape living with him so he can't help but study it. and then only, you know, when, you know, some things go wrong and caesar is taken from him does he reale how much he cares about him. so he does go from a scientist

with very little kind of connection, emotiona coections to anyone else and to someone that cares deeply. and the other thing is, i guess, you know, we talk about like animal testing, actually when we made the film, i didn't know all of this stuff but now like these groups have reached out to me and talked about like the u.s. i guess is the only place that still tests on apes; is that right? >> animal testing -- mandate -- >> animal testing on cosmetic products by 2,013 so -- >> sadly i think great apes are not used in animal experimentation i think even in the u.s. anymore, maybe they are, but i think sadly it has to do with the expense more than anything else, but yet still a vast number in this country that are -- that are housed. >> feel guilty because all of the medicines, the prechemical

phases of animal testing anyway so we are kindf all guilty of it but i guess we arrived at a time where technology has advanced and kind of proved it in a way we don't need apes anymore, so i am hoping we can find that solution asell. yes. the whole moving forwar and being able taddress some of these issues, we have not used live apes which we could easily have done, i don' i don't know e would be sitting around this table if we had. >> we had a chat with danny about it, danny boyle. >> yes. and he put me straight in many ways and really enlightened me, and going into it, i was always adverse to the idea of telling the story of the oppressed and the exploited using performing apes to do that, i mean apes are very diffent to a l of performing animals we had a dog on the set and he was very happy, fulfilled dog who loved his owner and train sore that is a different thing to basically an animal that is alpha dominat and needs to be kind of in a way, i

guess, told and dictated to what and how to do things in order to actually perform is a big difference. >> rose: what i your life like today when yo when you hadg and all of this attention today? >> i am in a very, very happy place. >> rose: you said you are going to take time off? >> i am taking time off between the work and work comes up anywhere and i kind of enjoyed have enjoyed doing that as well. i know aot of people would kill to be where i am today so i won't abuse the opportunity by just saying i don't need this anore. feel with slum d i got this amazing gift literally to go out there and choose the kind of projects that i could -- that i wanted to do, and make people, a groupware of myxistence so i guess it did help in every possible way, and who doesn't want a life like tt, especially if you have that passion about acting and that passion about being, you know, in front of a camera and performing and entertaining. >> rose: how is school? >> school is in summer so i am not in school.

>> rose: we spent an hour together on a stage in brown university talking about one of the best hours of my life. [ laughter ] >> rose: they loved it. >> yes. things are going well. i am filming -- i am doing a movie in detroit right now, a prequel to the wizard of oz. >> so it takes a long time, so i am doing independent study next semester, but i am also. >> rose: teaching -- >> teach at nyu and already have my students, anit is a production class that will result in a feature length film based on a collection of contemporary poetry by a man named ck williams and a book called tar. and unlike, you know, an interesting film like -- you get a bunch of directors who have,

you know, loose parameters like everody needs to shoot in paris, but, you know, you can go and tell your own stories. the aim of this collaboration will be everyone gets their own section, but we want the final product to feel somewhat unified, so if a charact, you know, traverses multiple sections we will use the same actor and be a unified kind of look to all of the pieces, and i can't -- i don't know. i can't think of something, a movie that has quite been done like that. maybe there are examples, but certainly not something that is based on a book of poetry, and so -- but for me, it is nice. i mean i have done some films based on poetry and it is nice becausit gives the film maker a little more license to, yes, tell a marive, but not be so dependent on story beats that you can focu on other things,

focus on atmosphere or character in ways that you can do if you are telling a short story but it is just -- it just gives you a little more permission. so i am very excitedbout that. >> rose: gre to see you. >> very good to see you. >> rose: pleasure to meet you. >> thank you so much. >> rose: congratulations. >> thank you very much. thank you. >> rose: we conclude this evening with a personal note. josie sh has beeny assistant, he is a proud graduate of brown university. this is her last day. she leaves usow to go to work for her parents who own an art gallery in new york city. i am sure she will run her parents like she ran me, with high spirits, discipline, charm, presence and great intelligence. they have a distinct advantage. i start work at 5:00 a.m., galleries open at 11:00. she will like that. she has been wonderful for us in handling one of the world's toughest jobs, we are now trying to do the impossible, finding a replacement for josie, if you

think you can handle that job or would like that job, e-mail us at response 1917 at gm.com. for josie, we say again, good-bye, great love, and here she is, in this video. >> for me one of the high points in terms of watching the interviews has been to the interview with david brooks when he was talng about the brain and if god exists it where chemicals turn into emotions, like that. the low point is coming back from paris, wn we went to paris and back to paris all in a week and i got a stomach bug on the plane coming back and i was throwing up for like 12 urs, including in line at passport control and in the backseat of a u-haul with charlie. definitely a low point. my mom said to imagine yourself in his shoes and think about what you would need as charlie,

which was really helpful. and that said, and then said just roll with it. >> never compromise. you know, he is a perfectionist and it works. >> rose: thank you for watching. and good luck to josie. see you on monday.

captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.or >> rose: funding for charl rose has been provided by the coca-cola company, supporting this program since 2002. and american express. additional funding provided by these funders. >> and by bloomberg. a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. >> be more.