captioning sponsored by macneil/lehrer productions >> woodruff: the nation's >> woodruff: the nation's unemployment rate fell to 8.2% last month, but job growth was lower than economists expected. good evening. i'm judy woodruff. >> brown: and i'm jeffrey brown. on the newshour tonight, we analyze what's behind those jobs numbers with greg ip of "the economist" magazine. >> woodruff: paul solman looks at the disconnect between job seekers and employers, when so many are looking for work, but many jobs remain unfilled. >> brown: then, we have the latest on a recording of an nfl coach calling on his players to hurt opponents, further stirring the league's bounty scandal.

>> we want him running sideways. we want his head sideways. >> woodruff: newshour regular mark shields, and ramesh ponnuru of "the national review" analyze the week's news. ♪ ♪ >> brown: plus, legendary guitarist buddy guy reflects on living, playing, and shaking up the chicago blues. >> well, i'm going to prove myself, because everybody was sitting down, and i said i'm going to stand up and somebody going to pay attention to me. >> woodruff: that's all ahead on tonight's newshour. major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> citi turns 200 this year. in that time, there have been some good days and some difficult ones. but through it all, we persevered. supporting some of the biggest ideas in modern history. so why should our anniversary matter to you?

because for 200 years, we've been helping ideas move from ambition to achievement. and the next great idea could be yours. >> bnsf railway. >> the william and flora hewlett foundation, working to solve social and environmental problems at home and around the world. >> and with the ongoing support of these institutions and foundations. and... >> this program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. >> woodruff: u.s. employers added jobs in march, but not as many as they have in recent months. the labor department report raised questions about the strength of the economic

recovery, the number one issue in the presidential campaign. ( applause ) president obama was quick today to put the best face on the weaker-than-expected jobs report. >> we welcome today's news that our businesses created another 121,000 jobs last month and the unemployment rate ticked down. >> woodruff: in fact, the increase in jobs was the smallest since october, and well below what was forecast. the economy had added more than 200,000 new jobs in each of the previous three months. but in march, the retail sector shed nearly 34,000 positions. and construction companies cut back on hiring. that could be because the mild winter allowed them to do more work in january and february, rather than waiting till spring. the unemployment rate did fall to 8.2%, the lowest since january of 2009, as many people

stopped searching for work. at a white house forum on women and the economy, the president pointed to recent progress, while conceding he'd like it to come faster. >> our economy's now created more than four million private sector jobs over the past two years, and more than 600,000 in the past three months alone. but it's clear to every american that there will still be ups and downs along the way, and that we've got a lot more work to do. >> woodruff: but with more than five million people out of work for six months or longer, the man who wants mr. obama's job called the report "weak and very troubling." republican front-runner mitt romney issued a statement saying: "millions of americans are paying a high price for president obama's economic policies. it is increasingly clear the obama economy is not working, and that after three years in office, the president's excuses

have run out." reaction from u.s. financial markets will have to wait till next week. they were closed for the good friday holiday. and for more on the jobs picture, we're joined by greg ip of "the economist" magazine. thank you for being back with us, greg. >> pleasure to be here. >> woodruff: so what would you add to flesh out the story of what happened with job, by the way, we should point out most markets were closed. the stock markets were closed. the bond markets were open. >> the bond markets were open, and as you may know bond investors love bad news so bond prices were up a lot because the employment news was quite a bit worse than expected. i think there is this troubling feeling of deja vu. both last year and the year before, the year began with very strong job growth. and then by the summertime it had petered out. now it seemed to have been just bad luck. we had the problems in europe. we had high oil prices because of the libya uprise. and people thought well, we're passed that now. and the fact that we seem to be going through that cycle

again is very troubling. however there are some reasons i think to expect that this was not the sign of an economy that is about to flat line. first of all, 120,000 is not a bad number. it is just bad because we were expecting so much better. second of all, we do have some other data about how the economy is doing such as the weekly number of people looking for unemployment insurance benefits. those numbers are dropping. we have some survey data from factory managers. those numbers suggest that things are getting better. so i think it is probably the case the economy is still on track. possibly what we have seen is a number that is a bit of a payback for employment growth that was stronger than we could sustain for a little while. >> woodruff: so i was reading one analyst today who said yes, it's disappointing. but he said when you look under the hood, the numbers are a little bit better. so is that the kind of thing are you talking about then? >> a little bit. so for example, if you look at sector by sector, manufacturing was up quite a lot. since manufacture was so hard hit it is encouraging to see that that sector continues to make

progressment if you look at the number of hours people worked, they did to the go down. why does that matter? well, because if firms really thought business was slowing down they would cut back on the hours of their employees. so it is little things like that that suggest this is not a really bad report. >> woodruff: so again, on the comparisons people have made that you just brought up to last area and the year before, you're saying you see something materially different this year? >> i do think it's a little bit better. now there are still risks out there like petroleum, like the possibility of an attack on iran that drives the price of oil. and europe still is stumbling through its problems as europe tends to do. however, at least so far, gasoline is not up as much in percentage terms as it was a area ago. and it does look like although europe is still in recession, they have sort of eliminated the worse possible scenario for this year. >> woodruff: what about the fact the unemployment rate did drop, it was a 1/10 of a percent, is there any significance to that. >> there is a little bit of significance. the unemployment rate has been dropping faster than we can explain for the last five or six months. you know, economists will

tell you that the 1 percentage point drop we had in that rate in the last four or five month was normally be soibted with an economy growing at a five percent rate. and in fact at best we are only growing around half that rate. they don't really understand why it's dropping so fast. part of it is that people are dropping out of the labor force and they're not looking for work. but we don't know why they are dropping out. they are not actually seeing that they are just discouraged. they're just not lacking any longerment some have gone back to school. some have retired. some may have been unemployed so long they have gone on disability and will never work again. and if that's true then we have lost a big chunk of our labor force, possibly foreof. and that is a real tragedy. >> woodruff: and in fact, i was going to ask you about that, because you look at these people and it's a large percentage of those folks who are out of work. on the horizon for them is what? >> it is very hard to tell. i mean economists really debate why is it that so many of the unemploy ready unemployed for so long. is it because they just don't have the skills necessary for the jobs that are out there, is it because they can't sell their houses

and move to the cities where there are jobs. i think probably the best explanation is just that the economy has been so sluggish. and by the way, we know that that is normal after a financial crisis. and it is so sluggish that the sales have not been there for businesses to hire a lot. and so the people that they don't hire spend longer unemployed. >> woodruff: now there is one other thing i want-- and i should say that we have a report coming up shortly on the program, paul solomon who will lack at this disconnect between employers looking and people looking for work. but one of the things is the federal reserve. the open -- >> yes. >> woodruff: the open markets committee. >> sure. >> woodruff: what is the name of it. >> the federal open market committee. >> woodruff: thank you. has met. the feeling seems to be coming out of there that the economy doesn't need stimulus right now. but with jobs numbers like these, could that change? >> if we have a few more months like this, yes, it could change. i mean just in the last few days we got a report on what they talked about at their

last meeting three weeks ago. and what surprised the markets was that there was almost no support from the membership of the federal open market committee for another round of so-called quantitative easing. is this when the fed prints a lot of money and uses it to buy bonds. when they bay bonds they push down long-term interest rates and that is supposed to stimulate the economy. why so little support in well, partly because the numbers had been quite good as we were talking about. three or four months of very strong job growth. that said, ben bernanke the fed chairman last week did warn that he thought that the numbers would not stay that good for so long. if the numbers are as weak as they were in march for a sustained period of time we will start to see the fed talk about perhaps firing up the printing presses again. >> woodruff: so in a way these numbers, these job numbers we see today bear out what ben bernanke was saying. >> they really do. >> woodruff: greg ip, thank you very much. >> thanks for having me. >> brown: and still to come, paul solomon on the job disconnect, tough hits in the nfl.

the the analysis of mark shields and romesh ponnuru; and buddy guy and the chicago blues. but first, the other news of the day. here's hari sreenivasan. >> sreenivasan: a looming cease- fire in syria did nothing to halt heavy assaults on rebellious cities today. government forces blasted away at homs and rastan, and tanks and snipers widened an offensive in the suburbs of damascus. the attack on homs sent smoke high over the city, as buildings burned and gunfire echoed in the streets. doctors in rastan had to treat the wounded in a makeshift hospital. and in the north, new waves of refugees streamed into turkey with stories of massacres and mass graves. by the millions, christians worldwide today marked good friday. the observances ranged from church services to actual re-enactments of the crucifixion of jesus. dozens of filipinos marched barefoot through the village of san pedro cutud today, using bamboo sticks to beat themselves in penitence. others volunteered to be nailed to crosses for a few minutes, including one man who's taken part for 26 years.

crowds of spectators looked on, including foreign tourists. >> even as a non-christian, it's something that touches you. even though it's not my faith, it makes me feel something inside. >> sreenivasan: there were similar acts in mexico, where masked women in taxco walked with feet chained and carrying heavy crosses. in sydney, australia, an actor dressed as jesus dragged a large cross, as police and security guards replaced roman soldiers. >> make way for t king of the jews. make way for the son of god. crucify him! >> sreenivasan: communist cuba honored a request that pope benedict the xvi made there last week and declared good friday an official holiday for the first time in 50 years. and in jerusalem, thousands of pilgrims flocked to the old city to walk the route they believe jesus took to his death.

>> so it's a sense of feeling, a feeling belonging and identity. >> sreenivasan: this year, good friday also coincided with the jewish celebration of passover. israeli troops closed off the west bank to guard against attacks by palestinian militants. a u.s. navy fighter plane crashed into an apartment complex in virginia beach, virginia, today, leaving a building in flames. the pilots ejected, and officials were still accounting for everyone on the ground. but black smoke billowed from the building after the plane's impact, as firefighters worked to douse the flames. there was no immediate word on the cause of the crash. those are some of the day's major stories. now, back to jeff. >> brown: and we continue our look at the job market with a seeming paradox: unemployed workers who say they're desperate for a job; employers who say they can't fill open positions with the workers they need. newshour economics correspondent paul solman looks into the disconnect, part of his ongoing reporting, "making sense of financial news." >> we have jobs in this county

that go unfilled for years now. >> reporter: annie carter of galion, ohio, makes and repairs industrial cylinders, says she pays upwards of $20 an hour for work that didn't seem that hard to master. >> and we're willing to hire anybody, train anybody to do anything, they just have to show us some... some work ethic, some motivation. >> reporter: carter's comments came as a real surprise when we visited her last march. nationally, official unemployment was 9%; locally, 12.3%. our own more inclusive monthly reckoning of un- and under- employed americans put it at nearly 18%. that provoked us to ask other employers we met last year, did they too have job openings they couldn't fill? and if so, why? drew greenblatt runs marlin steel in baltimore. >> we've actually had people tell us that they won't accept a $16- and $18-an-hour job because they're making $15 an hour on unemployment.

>> reporter: farmer kim haynes in northern alabama. >> if the work's too hard or too hot or too sweaty, they're not going to do it. >> reporter: bill brittain, a tree specialist in rural maryland. >> i'd rather hire anyone who had the right attitude, and was trainable and dependable. but a lot of those people just don't seem to come along much anymore. >> it's putting all us out of business! >> reporter: the most caustic was bobby joslin, a sign maker in nashville, tennessee. >> they cannot fill out an application from the top to the bottom without misspelling half the words. it's pitiful. >> reporter: employers like joslin blamed, first and foremost, the government for providing and extending unemployment insurance, allegedly allowing workers to refuse jobs they don't like. that was annie carter's main gripe last year. >> we've offered people jobs and they say, "no, thank you, i'm going to wait until my unemployment runs out." >> reporter: how many of you

have maxed out on your unemployment insurance benefits? of course, to get the benefits, you have to be looking for a job. so at the workplace, a connecticut nonprofit that helps the long-term unemployed get back into the job market, we recently asked workers who had used up all their benefits: any of you ever applied for a job just to stay on unemployment insurance? >> hell, no. >> reporter: hell, no? >> hell, no! did you hear it that time? hell, no. we didn't do that! >> we want to work. >> we didn't volunteer to quit our jobs; we were volunteered. >> i was at my job for 28 years. >> and i would still be at my company, because i loved where i was working and i loved my job. where do people get this idea from that everyone is a crook? >> reporter: not a crook, just... >> taking advantage of the system. >> reporter: lorraine dowdy lost her job as a commodities analyst in 2008. >> i've applied for so many jobs

to the point where it just got very, very depressing. there was no response, whatsoever. >> reporter: so, how are you surviving? >> it has been tough. i've had to move out of my apartment, i've run totally out of resources. i'm actually homeless right now and living with friends. >> reporter: the stories in this room did square with what we've been hearing the last three years from workers. robert sorrells lost his manufacturing job in 2009. >> i went back to college and got a... for computer, you know, word, excel and all that stuff, and i got a b+ average in that. and i still haven't found a job. >> reporter: marge welch spent 38 years in mortgage banking. >> you apply for the little jobs-- because you're overqualified, you don't hear anything. and then you go and look and see what they hire, and its like,

how did they get hired and i didn't? >> reporter: sharon moore worked in software customer support. what's the lowliest job you've applied for? >> i applied in a warehouse. they told me, whatever they needed me to do, they would expect me to do it, and i said fine. >> reporter: and how much was that an hour? >> they didn't tell me how much it was an hour. >> reporter: and they didn't hire you, either. >> and they did not hire me. >> reporter: would you work at a factory in ohio? >> i have my grandmother and my parents are retired, so i am the only daughter and they rely on me a lot, so i wouldn't want to move and leave them. >> reporter: in fact, even though some in this group said they were desperate enough to take a job at $10 an hour, half of what annie carter said she was paying, the idea of migrating to an ohio region that's been hemorrhaging factory jobs for decades seemed downright ludicrous to most everyone. as former cable company employee earl schoolfield put it...

>> why relocate across the country when i may have the same risk of getting laid off out there, and then be away from all of my contacts, friends and family? >> reporter: so what about young local people? perhaps they could fill the jobs in places like annie carter's factory? would any of you take a job in a machine shop around here? >> no, i wouldn't. >> reporter: why not? >> because my parents have worked in a machine shop, and i see how much struggle they go through because sometimes... my dad just last year got laid off. >> reporter: bethany, would you? >> i would never choose factory as a long-term career for myself. >> reporter: why not? >> it's a very insecure business. >> reporter: small wonder the young people who do come to annie carter's factory are the town's less motivated. >> one of the biggest issues that we have currently is people will come to an interview looking sloppy, having... being dirty, those kinds of things. >> reporter: they didn't really want a factory job, carter said. and that's another common employer complaint we've kept hearing-- that american workers

have become "entitled." many just won't take hard jobs at modest pay. last june, we did a story at werecycle, an electronics recycling firm in mount vernon, new york, that hires ex-cons who've graduated from a college- behind-bars program, will work any hours, do anything. by contrast, says one of them, anthony cardenales... >> i have a lot of family and friends who are offered positions that they think do not pay enough for them. >> reporter: and they turn them down. >> and they turn them down. >> reporter: and you say to them? >> i say to them, "why are you not washing dishes here for $7.25 an hour?" and they say, "i'm not doing that." and i'm saying, "okay, so, on friday, you're going to be broke, like you are today, as opposed to, if you were working here, you will have $100 or $200 in your pocket that's yours, that you earned." and then, you're still looking for better employment, but you're employed. >> reporter: cardenales' first

job out of prison was putting up cable wire for $200 a week, which barely paid his commuting costs. two and a half years later, he's a manager at werecycle, earning close to six figures. so we put the question to his boss, virgil fisher. is the american workforce, for the most part or to some significant extent, entitled? >> i would think so. we've gotten used to a certain lifestyle and a certain concept of what our job should look like. >> reporter: we heard that repeatedly. significantly, though, many employers, like maryland contractor jonathan herman, put it comparatively. >> nowadays, there's an opportunity to hire people of hispanic descent and they're much harder workers. >> reporter: same refrain in alabama last october from farmers, upset by a new state law that chased undocumented workers from the fields. >> they're here on time. they work all day.

they work extra hours. they work in the heat. they work in the cold. >> reporter: and, of course, they come from a country, mexico, where the median standard of living is something like one sixth what it is here. now, given their ages, these connecticut folks might not last long in the sweltering fields of alabama. but to the charge is that many of the unemployed just won't work hard enough, folks like 59- year-old earl schoolfield said "nonsense." >> this past november, i had three part-time jobs during the holidays, the christmas holidays. >> reporter: what were you doing? >> with the fedex, it was lifting and loading packages onto from the conveyor belt, onto the truck. >> reporter: at a fast pace. >> at a very fast pace. and going into work at 3:00 a.m. and then getting off that job at, say 7:00, and then going into an 8:00 to 5:00 job. >> reporter: really?

>> yes. and then leaving the gas company and going to work at telemarketing over the phone from 6:00 to 9:00. >> reporter: okay, what's going on? 27 million un- or under-employed americans, yet jobs that go begging. union economist thea lee has a simple answer. >> you can interview workers and you can interview employers. and the employers may tell you they can't find the kind of workers they want at a certain wage. but there's at least four job seekers for every job opening, and american employers, i think, have sort of convinced themselves that they can offer a low wage, and then sit back and complain that there aren't workers out there willing to work for those wages. pay a higher wage, you'll attract all sorts of folks. >> reporter: joe carbone, president of the workplace, agrees. >> it's a buyers' market. this is a market made for business. they can get more for less. and i think there's more of that going on than there is anything else. >> reporter: so, jobs or no jobs?

in a complex economy like ours, there's no simple answer. >> woodruff: check out paul's own measure of unemployment on our "making sense" page at newshour.pbs.org. >> brown: violent talk and a violent but hugely popular sport. >> there may be better athletes, but not defensive football players that have to go into war tomorrow. >> brown: that's new orleans saints defensive coordinator gregg williams last january, firing up players to face the san francisco 49ers in a playoff game the next day. documentary filmmaker sean pamphilon recorded williams, demanding the "get tough" approach that might be heard in many locker rooms. but williams has now admitted he oversaw cash "bounties" for players who knocked opponents out of games.

and in parts of the tape, he clearly targets key san francisco players, including number ten, kyle williams, who'd already had four concussions. >> we need to find out in the first two series of the game, that little wide receiver, number ten, about his concussion. we need to ( bleep ) put a lick on him right now. >> brown: san francisco's wide receiver michael crabtree was a target, as well. he'd been nursing a damaged ligament, an "a.c.l.", in his knee. >> we need to decide whether crabtree wants to be a ( bleep ) prima donna or he wants to be a tough guy. we need to find that out, and he becomes human when you ( bleep ) take out that outside acl. >> brown: williams also zeroed in on 49er tailback frank gore. >> we've got to do everything in the world to make sure we kill frank gore's head. we want him running sideways. we want his head sideways.

>> brown: the saints ultimately lost the game, and williams left new orleans. then, the bounty scandal erupted into full view, and nfl commissioner roger goodell suspended him from the league indefinitely. saints head coach sean payton was banned for the coming season. the williams audio appeared online, hours before payton's appeal hearing yesterday. filmmaker pamphilon says he released it as a warning amid growing concern about head injuries in football at all levels. more now on the tape and larger questions it raises from dan lebowitz, executive director of the center on sports in society at northeastern university. and mike wise, sports columnist for "the washington post," and also hosts a sports radio talk show. analysis dan lobe wits, i will start with you, what strikes you most about this tape. >> what strikes me most about it is that it goes against everything that roger goodell's sort of

tenure at the nfl. he has come in, looked at concussion issues, been responsive to the concussion issues, has tried to establish a code of conduct for that league as if they were in many respects what they are. a major brand like ibm. he's leveled fines for excessive hits. he's told people that he was going to establish this code of conduct. and he's held strong to it. so i think in many respects it's a rogue and reprehensible act by certain people in contrast to what the overall leadership of the league, whether it's from goodell or owners like kraft and the rooney there say strong leadership in the nfl and it's a great brand and i think that brand has worked hard to make sure that people respect it and see that that brand is carrying a roll of responsibility. >> all right, well mike wise, you've been in a lot of locker rooms at the same time and must have heard these kinds of pumping up is what coaches do, especially in a violent sport like

football. >> yeah, i think there's a segment of society today saying just this is how the sausage is made. and why should we be surprised. but i think it's important to make a clear distinction between metaphorically speak. you need to go knock that guy's head off which we have all heard in locker rooms and you have to test somebody's acl. you have to hit him in the head. apparently from the audio, the visual involved pointing at a chin saying you need to get alex smith under the chin. these are-- these are clear malicious intent to injures. and if you get to that point, i think you step over some lines, some boundaries that all of a sudden are crossed. >> brown: but-- i will stay with you, mike, is the line clear? i means that's the question. >> well, and that's a good question. because having talked to richard, dr. richard allen bogin, one the top neurologists in the country on the nfl's concussion committee, he says that there is a culture change going on. the problem is it's to the

going on on the sidelinient. it's in the owners' offices. it's in roger goodell's office. he can't have his offensive stars being hurt because it hurts his bottom line. but if it's not happening on the sidelines, it doesn't matter. it has to happen on the sidelines. >> dan lebowitz, you were talking about seeing it in the commissioner's office wa, about the sideline what about criticism even in the commissioner's office, that yeah, they understand it now but they came late to this concussion problem. and you know, are responding more out of fear at this point than out of real health concern. >> well, i think that, you know, people generally sometimes have to respond in a reactive fashion given sort of the way society moves and issues that are raised as society moves. i think goodell's credit, you can look at that time as reactive. but i think that his policies in that reaction have been very proactive. and i think that he has set a clear tennor for the league during his tenure. and i think that it's going

to filter down either through fine or through suspensions as he's been leveeing. >> mike wise, a lot of money is on the line, either way, right? i mean this is an incredibly profitable sport. >> and i don't want to demean roger goodell and say he doesn't care about the safety of players. i do think he does. i also think this also happens to be at a time when there are 55 concussion related lawsuits now filed against the nfl. class-action suits that represent over a thousand players, jeff. that's millions and millions of dollars. he cannot have his defensive coordinators asking his players to take out other players in the game. it's not healthy for his game's future economically or morally. the fans will tune off if this keeps happening. >> what are you hearing from other players. first, you know, from a week ago and now after this tape? >> it's really shocking. there's such a wide variance.

some like the punter from minnesota is so bothered by this idea that people are outable-- outing snitches and the idea that somehow the people who told on them are not looked at as good samaritans but people who broke football's code. he's angry about those people. >> brown: not about what happened but about the way it got out. >> the way it got out. that's the sad part there are people more concerned in the nfl, players that are more concerned with the fact who told than who actually is trying to maliciously injure me. that to me is a warped culture. >> brown: now dan lebowitz, speaking of larger culture here, what of fans? how do fans respond to this? do you see it having any repercussions? >> well, i think that the spotlight of sport creates such a great platform for discussion about right and wrong, about ethics and a number of other things. so in many respects the concussion issue, the league's response in terms of leveling fines for hits, hopefully will engage in

larger, national discussion where people will start thinking about ethics in general. like what is ethical and why aren't we more ethical. and so you know, i mean these questions could be asked in the political realm. could be asked in the financial realm. could be asked elsewhere. but i think it's that great spotlight of sport that allows for a discussion on a much wider audience. >> you were nodding your head, you think there is some hope there. >> yeah, i think there is-- and not to be utopian about it, but i think at some point if people do want their children to play football they allow them to play football. you want to know that it's not about hurting the other guy. that it is about something other than that. and that there is values maintained and that there are things that happen that go to transend just knocking another guy out. and if-- we understand that violence is oxygen to football in some ways that will never get away. >> and to the fans. >> and to the fans. you're not going to have a league without big hits. but i think we need to get

to a point, and i don't know if dan agrees with this, that where we celebrate the hard hitters but we condemn the headhunters. and i know that those lines are very iffy and it's not clear when you obliterate them. but greg williams did. and i think he should be condemned. >> brown: brief last word dan lebowitz. >> i just think that you know, in general, mike's rate on point there a line was crossed and i think that greg williams should be condemned. and i think that that condemnation will reserb rate through-- reverberate throughout society in ways that will be positive. >> brown: dan lebowitz, mike wise, thank you both very much. >> thanks, jeff. >> thank you. >> woodruff: and to the analysis of shields and ponnuru-- syndicated columnist mark shields and "national review" senior editor ramesh ponnuru, who is sitting in for david brooks this week. good to you have with us. >> thank. >> woodruff: both of you. >> thank you.

>> woodruff: let's start out talking about the jobs report. 120 some thousand-- 120,000 jobs created this past month, mark. but fewer than what economists were expecting. the republicans have already jumped all over it. we heard mitt romney saying, earlier, another example of the president's failed policy. does this affect the presidential race? >> not for one month. i mean there have been 25 months of private sector job growth, and an increase of 4.1 million jobs in that period of time. and you know, it's been good. the problem is one of expectations. they were not met. this is disappointing news. and as far as politically is concerned, judy, basically you need a quarter, that is three consecutive months before economic attitudes begin to change. that's what happened to george herbert walker bush. first president bush when he was seeking re-election in 1992. the economy had improved. and it was better. but the perception had knot

because there hadn't been three months passed. and i think that is where it is right now. there still is a sense that it's fragile but it's moving in the right direction. what you can't use is a couple more months of news of this nature. >> so still early, ramesh to make a difference? >> i think that's right, you know. and i think that part of what is going on with the public is there have been so many, sort of, false dawns in this economy that people i think are going to take a little bit long tore trust that there is a real economic recovery that they can feel. if there are some more months like this where you have disappointing jobs numbers, i think that is very bad news for president obama. if it picks up on the other hand then this is just going to be a memory. >> we also saw the president and governor romney get into a sparring contest, if you will, when the president took on the republican budget plan in the house, mark. he used some very strong language, called it a trojan horse. he said it is so far right if makes the contract with

america look like the new deal. smart for the president to be doing this and smart for governor romney to be so closely allied with this budget. >> i would say it's tactically smart for the president. mitt romney comes through this on the cusp of the nomination now by consensus, more damaged than any presidential nominee in the history of modern polling. his unfavourable numbers are higher than anybody who has ever about to be nominated. only less popular than romney is the republican party. and only less popular than the republican party are republicans in congress. so what the move by president obama was to make romney the candidate of the republican party, the candidate of the republicans in congress. that was the smart part tactically. what the president convincing or persuasive, no. social darwinism is not a term that goes easley on a bumper sticker, one of the lines that he uses. let's go to the rampants, take on the social darwin. >> you don't think that will -- >> i don't think it weighs

very evocativically. >> woodruff: governor romney had used the word marvelous which the president mocked to the newspaper editors. is it smart for him to be so closely allying himself with the ryan budget? >> you know, i'm in the really sure that governor romney has a choice. if he had been away from tried to keep his distance from the ryan budget i think it would have created a very damaging rift between the congressional and presidential wings of the party and you just can't go into a big election that way. you know what, i think in a way what president obama has done is immensely clarifying. this is a serious disagreement between the parties. it a very important set of issues and we need a political debate on these questions. i think the problem with obama's strategy right now is you have got the negative part, the critique of the republican. what he doesn't have is his own administration's plan for dealing with our long-term debt problem, tim

geithner, treasury secretary said so, on capitol hill. and until he fills that in, i think that there is a hole in his strategy. >> woodruff: you see it that way? >> yeah, i think that the president want its this-- he would love to have this be about budgets and deficits and tax cuts. what you don't want is the economy with bad economic news to be the center piece. i think governor romney is paying a price for the betterness of the fight to win this nomination. he has taken positions, for example, on immigration. he got to the right of both rick perry who was a formidable threat, and newt gingrich who emerged as a threat, by taking a more right leaning position, more stridently anti-immigrant. promised to veto the dream act. he did the same thing with rick santorum on the planned parenthood. he got to the right of him on contraception. he embraced the ryan plan, you will recall, a year ago. why? because newt gingrich branded it right wing social engineering.

so it was a tactical move and now he's married to that move. i don't thinking about closely aligned with republicans in congress, president obama being aligned with democrats in congress is particularly helpful going into a campaign. >> woodruff: ramesh, we should point out full disclosure, you have endorsed governor romney. >> that's correct. i made the case that he was the strongest the of the republican candidates. >> woodruff: so do you see it as park does, that this is a risky strategy? >> well, absolutely, taking on entitlement reform is risky. everybody knows that. i think, though, that it's sort of fundamentally something that a lot of republicans and i think governor romney is one of them, view as a responsibility. if the republican party actually wants to keep taxes down over the long run there is no way to do that without a kind of medicare and social security reform. and in the case of medicare reform i think he has come up with a pretty intelligent one that has democratic advocates like senator ron widen. >> woodruff: one-story that did come out today about governor romney was about

how he, mark, how he has decided to keep, i guess, from disclosing a large chunk of his wealth. i mean a lot of it is in many different investments and there is-- it's legal. he's apparently using a law that is available. but it means that he will not have to disclose. is that shall did --. >> he's got to get it out. >> woodruff: can he hang on that? >> no, i mean it's painful if are you in the campaign. because the candidate obviously doesn't want his privacy violated. for all kinds of reasons. but mitt romney's problem is that he's not seen as connecting with ode people. he's got to get all discussion of estates and taxes and everything else, get that out. i mean just get it all out, now. and don't let it-- because it's going drip out and it's opening up, there are a hundred journalists working on it right now to find out what exactly bain's money was and how many jobs overseas he created. >> you can see this playing

out, the way, the debate over whether reallyny would release his tax returns played out. which is the candidate resist disclosure there say steady drumbeat from reporters and from democrats and republican ravels that he has to disclose. eventually some republican backers of him will say, you know, look this is not going to be sustainable. and will cave in. but having resisted that long will just make it a bigger story. >> woodruff: okay, meanwhile we've been talking about mitt romney. meanwhile rick santorum still is in the race. he says he's going to compete for his home state, mark, of pennsylvania. he says he is talking about texas in the month of may. what is his path? >> well, judy, the enoughest thing is not being in desaiding to run, the toughest thing is withdrawing from the race. and especially after he has tasted some glorious moments. i mean rick santorum looks at a state like louisiana where neither candidate, either he nor mitt romney spent any real money. and he won 2 to 1. every place else he has lost he has been outspent 4 or 5 to 1. so he is saying if i could

just hang in there i thought the southern baptist leader who has been a supporter and admirer urged him to withdraw before pennsylvania, that he had had a remarkable run, that he altered the debate. he had improved his own standing in the party. but he can't leave having lost his own state, especially after the defeat at bobby casey's hands. >> woodruff: ramesh, excuse me, mark. is there any sign that he would drop out before pennsylvania? >> well, he keeps saying that he is absolutely committed to the race and he's not going to drop out. but of course that is something the politicians will say until the minute that they decide to say, well, actually i'm dropping out. and i think that mark is right. that if he were to lose pennsylvania, that would erase all of the gains else's made. he's made a real comeback since his humiliating defeat in 2006, and that would all be wiped away. >> woodruff: one other thing we see when you compare rick santorum's approval rating compared to the president, there is a big gap among women. there's also a gap, not as large, with governor romney

but it's so significant. there was a poll out this week that showed an 18 point so-called gender gap. >> uh-huh. >> woodruff: in support for the president ahead of governor romney. is this the part, the republicans traditionally have done a little worse among women but is it worse this year. >> republicans have traditionally done better among men and worse among women. particularly women who are employed outside the home. and especially among women who are either sole support of their household or on their own, whether in fact there is-- they want a government that's activist and interventionist, some sense of session and economic justice. but there is no question, that there has been an inclination there. this is bad. these numbers are unsustainable for romney. he has to turn romney-- anne romney loose. she is his best ambassador and a far better salesman than he is of mitt romney. >> woodruff: is that the way he helps himself, with women voters? >> you know, i'm sure that

the romney strategists are very worried about this. i mean i think most republicans understand, you can lose the women's vote and still win an election. george w bus, bush did it in 2004, women went narrowly for john kerry. but the kinds of numbers that we have seen in this week's poll, that can't sustained if you are going to win a national election. >> woodruff: and as mark said, we want to point this out, that governor romney is doing better among men in some polls. >> the women, and obviously the white house by coincidence had a conference today on american-- . >> woodruff: by complete coincidence. >> absolutely. totally divorced from the campaign. >> woodruff: one last thing. and that is what the president had to say in two different speeches or remarks this week about the supreme court. in effect challenging the members of the court not to overturn the affordable care act, health care reform. is this, how smart is this to be going there? >> well, i think that the

president's initial comments were sort of surprisingly clumsy for former lecturer and constitutional law an he had to walk them back because he had seen to be suggesting that there was something wrong with the idea of a court striking down a law that had been passed by what he called strong majority of congress. which of course wasn't even the case with obama care. but he walked it back. he's made his argument. and i don't think the supreme court is going to pay much more attention to what he is saying than to what the solicitor general said and to their own views about the constitution. >> i thought it was unhelpful to the president. especially the phrase uncole sisitious phrase calling them unelected justices. that's sort of the rhetorical territory of traditional anti-court people coming from the right spectrum attacking the court for expanding the civil liberties or individual rights. and i thought he walked back the next day. but i don't think it's where he wants this campaign to be,

going into the fall. >> woodruff: and at one point referring to health-care reform getting a big majority. >> well, big majority. 75 democratic seats in the house when we voted on health care. and it passed-- passed by nine. and it passed by one vote on reconciliation procedure in the senate. it was not-- social security passed 4 out of 5 house republicans, 3 out of 4 senate help cans voted for it. now say the republicans weren't available but it was not a substantial majority. >> woodruff: well, we are delighted to have the two of you, ramesh and mark shields, thank you both. >> thank you, judy, thank you. >> brown: finally tonight, living, playing and preserving the chicago blues. ♪ ♪ >> brown: there he was on a

recent night at the white house- - buddy guy, 75 years "young," he puts it-- tuxedoed and jamming the blues on his electric fender guitar for president and mrs. obama. ♪ ♪ seven decades ago, george "buddy" guy was a world away, growing up in lettsworth, louisiana, his family too poor to purchase a guitar. so he rigged an alternative with window screen wire. >> we didn't have running water, no nothing. naturally, we didn't have electric lights. so i would steal that and tried to pull it tight a little so i could hear. and i remember my dad's friends, they say, "guy, that boy got some fingers. you get a guitar one day, he'll probably be a good one." >> brown: he got the guitar, and became a more-than-good one. today, he owns the appropriately named chicago blues club legends and keeps up a busy performing schedule.

he's told the story of how he got here in a forthcoming memoir titled, "when i left home." >> the first thing i ever learned to play was this. ♪ ♪ my sisters had done run me out of the house and told my mom and dad, "i'm tired of that noise." ( laughter ) >> brown: guy's story is tied to that of the great chicago blues tradition. when he came here in 1957, part of the black migration north, he joined a scene that featured the likes of muddy waters and howlin' wolf, extraordinary musicians and performers creating a new, electrified blues sound. in those days, the music was everywhere. >> if you went walking down 47th street on a summer night, there was a bar here, there was a bar there. on the east side of the street, the doors would open, you hear these local guys, some of them didn't even stay around long enough to get a name. but they was sounding so good. >> brown: so that was your education, in a way.

>> oh, i learned so much from that, trust me. ♪ ♪ >> brown: guy made his name as an incendiary performer. while many musicians at the time sat down to play, guy stood and put on a show for the crowd. >> i said, "well, i'm going to prove myself, because everybody was sitting down, and i said "i'm going to stand up and somebody going to pay attention to me. " >> brown: so you proved yourself by getting up on stage and putting on a real show. >> putting on a show, yeah. i used to lay all down, kick it with my feet. >> brown: he had some success, and recorded for chess records, the legendary recording company in chicago. but that was both a blessing and a curse. you write in the book about coming to chess records as sort of an incredible home for the blues, but also a system that didn't work for the musicians in

many ways. >> when i first went in there, they would just put my name on a record i sang and say, "well, we made you." even the disc jockey was saying, "if i play your record, i made you, you got to play for me free." and i did that a lot. and finally i said, "i can't eat that", you know, and i was, like, really hungry. >> brown: you felt like people were taking advantage of you. >> well, they was. ♪ ♪ >> brown: it was in the 1960s that blues became an international phenomenon, as white rock n' rollers, many from england, took up and popularized the music. ♪ ♪ here you are with eric clapton, david bowie. >> yep. ( bleep ) your world opened up then to play with all kinds of rock and roll musicians. >> we didn't have rock. it was all r&b. it's still m-u-s-i-c. >> brown: m-u-s-i-c? >> yeah, all music. ♪ ♪

>> brown: the rock stars borrowed the style. many publicly acknowledged the influence of buddy guy and others, and made lots more money. but guy says it was a win-win. >> somebody gets up, makes more money in one night than i do in ten years. still, they did me a favor, they did us all a favor. the rolling stones, eric clapton, people like that-- for ike and tina turner, b.b. king and myself-- they came back and told the white audience who we were. because a lot of white people weren't listening to no blues 50 years ago. ♪ ♪ >> brown: these days, guy is focused on keeping that tradition alive, and that's where the club comes in. when not on the road performing, guy can be found there signing autographs and sometimes jumping onstage. ♪ ♪ people everywhere, he says, can connect with the blues. there's pain there, sure, but

also so much more. >> i've had people in australia, africa, say "oh, blues, it's sad." and i remember once i was checking into a hotel in new york, receptionist looked at me and said, "oh, blues-- sad". and it was a husband and wife, and i gave them a ticket to my concert, and they come up the next morning and say, "it's not sad." >> brown: what is it? >> it's a part of life. if you pay attention to what some of the great writers write about, it's... how can you say b.b. king's record, "i got a sweet little angel, i love the way she spreads her wings"-- how could that be sad? ( laughter ) ♪ ♪ >> brown: but what about you? you just going to keep going?

>> well, you know, blues musicians don't retire, they drop. ( laughter ) >> brown: you say that with a smile on your face. >> i love what i'm doing. and you know, the world is so mad now, at everybody. if i do something to make them smile, i say: "i got you! for that moment, even if it don't last, i made you forget about the other thing you might have been thinking about." >> brown: all right, buddy guy, nice to talk to you. >> thank you so much. any time. ♪ ♪ ( cheers and applause ) >> brown: again, the major developments of the day: the u.s. economy added 120,000 jobs last month, far below expectations. the unemployment rate fell to 8.2%, as more people stopped looking for work. syrian government forces stepped up assaults on rebellious cities, and refugees reported troops carried out massacres. and millions of christians worldwide marked good friday.

communist cuba made it an official holiday for the first time in 50 years. and to hari sreenivasan for what's on the newshour online. hari. >> sreenivasan: on "art beat," you can watch more with buddy guy, including a performance at his club, legends. we also focus on a henry ossawa tanner exhibition, one of the first african-american painters to gain international success. on our politics page, we have blog posts from judy, who writes about the campaigns' courting of women voters, and from gwen, who looks at potential republican vice presidential candidates. and later tonight on many pbs stations, "need to know" reports on philadelphia's plan to re-engage high school dropouts. find a link to their report, plus the newshour's coverage on the crisis on our homepage. all that and more is on our web site, newshour.pbs.org. judy. >> woodruff: and that's the newshour for tonight. on monday, we'll look at the often-frayed relationship between brazil and the u.s. i'm judy woodruff. >> brown: and i'm jeffrey brown. "washington week" can be seen later this evening on most pbs stations. we'll see you online, and again here monday evening.

have a good holiday weekend. thank you and good night. major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> moving our economy for 160 years. bnsf, the engine that connects us. >> citi. supporting progress for 200 years. >> and by the bill and melinda gates foundation. dedicated to the idea that all people deserve the chance to live a healthy productive life. >> and with the ongoing support

of these institutions and foundations. and... >> this program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. captioning sponsored by macneil/lehrer productions captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org

>> this is bbc world news america. funding for this presentation is made possible by the freeman foundation of new york, stowe, vermont, and honolulu. newman's own foundation, shell, and union bank. >> at union bank our relationship managers work hard to know your business. offering specialized solutions and capital to help you meet your growth objectives. we offer an expertise and tailored solutions for small businesses and major corporations. what can we do for you?