>> rose: welcome to the program. we begin this evening with harrison ford, who stars in the movie "42". >> you have to have a movie like this every once in a while that reminds you of where the gap is between the high ideals of america and its behavior. and we now need are for kids to understand that there's a job left to be done. this is not a-- rights can't-- are not just granted and -- >> you can't pass a law necessarily-- >> been there, done that. it's ongoing. it's something that has to continue to be done, work that has to be done, and kids growing up need to understand it's their

responsibility, their opportunity and their responsibility. >> rose: we continue with shahid khan, the owner of the jacksonville jaguars football team. >> charlie, you make your own look, too. here you get a chance to make your own luck, and that's what's a game. you focus on 1% of the glass that's full, not on the 99% that's empty. and that perspective, you're only going to get, frankly, if you are born someplace else and you come out and you discover this and you say oh, my god. what an amazing, amazing opportunity i've just been given. >> rose: harrison ford and shahid khan when we continue. ñi

captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york >> people aren't going to like this. they're going to do anything to get you to react-- echo a curse with a curse, and they'll hear own yours. follow a blow with a blow, and they'll say, the negro lost his

temper. your enemy will be out in force and you cannot meet himñr on his own low ground. we win with hitting, running, fielding, only that. we win if the world is convinced of two things-- that you are a fine gentleman, and a great baseball player. >> rose: this movie is the jackie robinson story, but it's also the branch rickey story, but it's more than baseball. >> yeah. it's a whole-- you know, people forget that there wasn't any football, really. there wasn't any basketball. baseball was america's game, and a metaphor for america. so the integration of baseball is huge social effect.

>> rose: and the decision made by one man to do it, the man that you play. >> against-- against the wishes of all the other club managers and ownerss. branch rickey did have the support of his board to do what he did. >> rose: but he didn't seem to do it out of wanting to intintegrate for the purpose of integration. we did it because he wanted to win. >> well, he was a baseball businessman, and there was a great pool of talent in the negro leagues. a lot of our audience won't remember that there was white baseball and then there was the negro league. >> rose:ite after world two this is set, '47. >> '47, yeah. i think also there's more to it than that. i think it wasn't just wanting to win. i think he honestly did think it was unseamly of baseball.

he's a very religious man, branch rickey. he was a-- grew up in rural oh ohio. he was a school teacher at 17. he was a lay preacher. he never went to a baseball game on sunday. he was home for dinner with mrs rickey every night. he didn't travel with the team. and he-- at one point in the movie, he relates a story of when he was a player-coach at ohio wesleyan university. and the story of a-- of a black catcher, negro catcher named charlie thomas who was denied accommodations with the ohio wesleyan team, and branch rickey

felt bad enough about it to yell and scream and get a cot put in his room and insist that the guy stayed in his room. but-- but he-- he-- the story he tells about charlie thomas brought low by the color of his skin, i think that had a big-- i think he was an emotional guy. i think branch rickey is an emotional guy. >> rose: he seems like a good guy as you portray him. tell me about you and deciding to do this. >> i didn't decide to do it. i had to get the job because -- >> harrison ford had to get the job. >> well, you wouldn't want harrison ford. >> rose: ahhh! >> in a movie about jackie robinson. i thought-- you know, i quite understood the-- the script isçó

written by brian helgeland and i understood his resistance to seeing me. >> rose: you wanted to see him and he resisted seeing you playing the role of branch rickey. >> h he wants a character actor. and i said i want to be -- >> that's what you wanted to be. >> i saed i always wanted to be a character actor, anyway. >> rose: exactly. so know-- but we spoke and i had done a bit of research and i knew what branch rickey looked like. >> rose: glasses. every picture i had ever seen he wore glass. >> glasses and cigar and different vocal characterration than mine, and fat suit and shaved hairl and harrison ford was gone. >> rose: that was the challenge. you had to make him forget harrison ford. this was a character role. >> it wasn't a challenge.

it was the fun of it for me. -- >> but i have to remind you 39 movies and $throoet point something billion dollar later. >> i've done that. i've been harrison ford. it would haveñi unhinged the moe so i quite understood. >> rose: do you view this as harrison ford doing something either he is not known for or, b, a leading man role as a way for you to do-- have some fun now? >> yeah, listen, i'll do anything nowñiñi that, you knows ambition. i don't-- i don't have to be a leading man. i've-- i did three movies last year. and they're all character parts. and they're all interesting.

to me. >> rose: is it a good time for you, gitting a chance to play different roles and you don't have to be harrison ford? you can be branch rickey. >> yeah, yeah, yeah, it's a good time. it's a good time. >> rose: can you pretty much act as much as you want to. >> i can't always find what i-- the-- i'm still ambitious, charlie. i'm still ambitious to do only the good stuff. and, you know, i'm-- i'm beginning to understand that there's just not that much good stuff for a guy like me. >> rose: what does "a guy like me "mean? >> a guy like me is a guy who used to know. >> rose: be the highest paid movie star in the world. >> charlie. i was well paid.

>> rose: i didn't mean to make this cheap talking about money. >> well, somebody once told me that money was only important if you didn't have any. >> rose: yes. >> and i liked that. i didn't believe it, but i liked it. ( laughter )ñi i just want to-- i want to work as mucas much as i ever did. i guess there's something in an actor that when he's out of work, he-- it doesn't feel good. >> rose: i've asked you this before-- you don't have any great passion to direct. >> um-- >> last time you stayed no. >> yeah, i always say no. and i say no without thinking about it. and there was a project recently that i wasn't able to pull

together. somebody else got it that i thought maybe i wouldment to direct it if i couldn't find somebody much, much better, which i probably could easily. but it occurs to me from time to time. >> rose: do you turn down stuff because it's just not something you want to do? >> always have. >> rose: i know you have. >> always have. >> rose: of all the directors that you have worked with-- thinking spielberg, for example, and others-- who did you learn the most from? >> you know, it's hard to say because you don't really-- i think as an actor you don't know what you're learning when you're learning it and you think back and reflect on it and it's all contaminated by, you know, whether you had a good time or a bad time. and everybody teaches you

something different. and, you know, i worked with some good guys, wonderful directors. and gosh, i'm so lucky. i mean you look at the list. nichols and peciewla. >> rose: mike nichols. >> sidney pollock. that spielberg guy. >> rose: that spielberg guy. he's still working i hear. >> yeah, he sure is. without me. >> rose: how could he make "lincoln" without you? what happened? >> i don't know. i guess he didn't know i did character parts, i guess. >> rose: why? harrison ford has had such phenomenal success. >> well, take a look at when i came along. i didn't-- i didn't-- i didn't have a career untilñr "star war" and that was a huge success.

and i was tacked on to that success, and i was at the age when i could be useful. and it was the heyday of the movie business, and somebody had to work, might as well be this guy that got famous in "star wars." >> rose: yeah. >> and i was just super lucky guy. >> rose: then indiana jones came along. >> yeah, and then "witness" came along. >> rose: a chance to do something different. >> well, the chance to act for a living. instead of run, jump, and fall down for a living. >> rose: and did you find that really, really-- having done all the rupping and falling down-- just to be know. >> yeah, i found thatñi immensey satisfying. that's what i always wanted to do. i mean, i loved-- not to say that there isn't acting in the running, jumping, and falling

down. but to take seriously and be taken seriously, at least a little bit as an actor, gave me a degree of influence over the things that i did that isn't really allowable to a guy that just runs, jumps, and falls down. >> rose: you wish you had more of those roles? i think i should hmy share. >> rose: you did, fair enough. >> i think i had my share. >> rose: did you also find balance between your passion for the environment, your passion for flying and family? >> and family. i mean, again, i had the opportunity because of-- to get involved in conservation, and

still. it's an organization i'm part of and i've been on the board for almost 25 years. ... yeah. it brings me to the table with the kind of people that you have in the black room, charlie. >> rose: yes. >> you know, really engaged, people with real substance andñi capacity and i love it. i just came from a meeting with the council on foreign relations, richard haas, who is on our board as well. gosh, what a treat it was sit, in that room and listening to all the people that we were able to help convene and talk about -- >> talk about their own experiences and all the things that were possible. >> talk about really the-- the

necessity to protect the resources of nature, that there was a direct connection between the health of nature and our national security, our national economic security as well. >> rose: both national security, and national economic security. >> yeah. >> rose: are you optimistic that we will prevail would be the word? >> well, i'm optimistic that nature will prevail. >> rose: but i mean-- >> nature doesn't need people. they'll do fine. you know, if we slough off this human weight, and the planet will be a beautiful place. >> rose: in other words if we didn't contaminate it, it would be much better for the planet. >> if we didn't chew it up. nature doesn't need people. people need nature. >> rose: is there a point, a tipping point where it's too

late? >> i think there-- there is-- there are tipping points, and we-- we lose a lot of battles. and technology, you know, has-- willçó have, you know, some mitigating effect. >> rose: and there are emerging nations with huge populations who are rushing in to the industrial age, and they feel the need, in a sense, and the right to catch up. >> and they have the right because you cannot deny development. development means education. it means health. it means a better life. so you can't deny development. but you have to encourage the kind of development that is sustainable for the people who live in those developing nations. and they are some of the-- as you know, they're some of the

least developed nations are those place where's intact nature still exists. so it is our obligation not to tell them what to do. but it's our obligation to to hp them find a path that is-- to sustainability for themselveses and for us. we're-- it's a world culture. you know this as well as anyone. it's a world culture. what happens there affects us. >> rose: let me go back to the movie. tell me what you learned, first about jackie robinson. all the ability in the world but he had to have a certain personality and temperament. >> yeah, and he didn't. he didn't. he had a temper. he had-- as somebody i think

said in the movie-- if they didn't they should have-- he had a mouth on him. he was-- he was-- i was talking to don newcomb the other day. >> rose: oh, great, don newcomb, right. who probably played with him? >> he did, he did, and, obviously, a good friend. and, you know, he had-- he-- what people don't know is-- what people don't know and they'll find out in the movie, he grew up in pasadena, in california. i mean, jackie did. went to u.c.l.a.. >> rose: right. was a star. >> four-letterman in sports at u.c.l.a. baseball wasn't his best sport. >> rose: football? >> football. but he also-- his brother came in second in the olympic games to jesse owen. and he beat his brother's time in a couple of-- of -- >> so he had athletic ability.

>> he had incredible athletic ability. somebody else said-- and it's not in the movie-- but they said he wasn't the best baseball player they ever saw, but he was the most exciting. >> rose: loved to steal bases. >> he-- he loved to steal bases. yeah. and he had-- he had nerves of steel. the guy was a powerful man. >> rose: but the racial taunt he had to go through, because his deal with branch rickey, the character you played, was that you-- >> that was the deal. >> rose: you've got to be cool. if not, you'll ruin it. >> you'll not only ruin for me. you'll ruin it for you and all the other black players who might have a chance to play white baseball. >> rose: there's a great scene in the movie where-- i've forgotten the manager's name, but he basically said-- and

branch rickey had to convince these people. jackie's coming. i've made a decision. i found the right guy and he's coming. he'll go to montreal and then he's coming to the brooklyn dodgers. >> right. >> rose: and the manager said to some recalcitrant players. he's coming and after him there's something -- >> . >> it's leo durocher. and, guys, he can help you win. if you don't want to play with him yiewrk out of here. >> rose: because we want to win. >> not a problem. not a problem, you're out of here. >> rose: and durocher was the perfect manager for branch rickey and then he got suspended because of his notorious habits of loving women more than one. >> terrible burden. ( laughter ) >> rose: so he gets caught with an actress-- it's in the movie-- he gets caught with an

actress and branch rickey who reminds him on the phone, that adultery-- >> god considers it to be a sin. >> rose: after they talk with how important it is from the bible to treat your fellow person with great dignity and respect. >> and by the way, i can hear her, stupid. i can hear her mumbling in your ear. and god's got a thing or two to say about adultery as well. >> rose: but he need durocher, because he's the kind of guy that can get these-- he's tough enough-- >> and the commissioner of baseball sat him out for the season. because-- because of the embarrassment of the-- that he was, morally speaking. because baseball was america's game. i mean, it's all coming back -- >> there was no super bowl at that time. >> what that means is that the

metaphorical relationship between baseball and america was something we need to remind ourselves about. so when baseball changed, it accelerated the opportunity for the civil rights movement in a really meaningful way. >> rose: i mean, what's important to realize is that the march towards racial equality has been-- has been long. hahas been definitely and it's t over. >> no, it ain't over. and that's what our kids don't understand. i think, you know, black history is-- it's a big subject in america. and it's not being taught as much as it was a little bit ago. kids need to be reminded of the

struggle. kids need to be emotionally exposed to what it felt like, and that's the-- some of the most powerful scenes in this film are of jackie robinson suffering publicly the kind of racial epithets and taunts that are no longer tolerable but they were then. >> rose: using the "n"word all the time, call him-- >> monkey. >> rose: all kinds of everything else. >> terrible. you have to have a movie like this every once in a while to remind you of where the gap is between the high ideals of america and its behavior. and we now need for kids to understand that there's a job left to be done. this is not a-- rights are not

just dprantd. >> rose: and walk away. you can't pass a law necessarily to change minds. >> it's ongoing. it's something thats had to continue to be done, and kids growing up need to understand. it's their responsibility, their opportunity and their responsibility. >> rose: what's interesting about the movie, though, for me, we que the story of jackie robinson. but we need to be reminded, as you suggested, and we need to understand the depth of resistance. >> but you know-- look, when i get a script and people start talking about the story, i write in the markin "talk story." that's bad. that's not good film making. you need to feel it. you need to be there. you need to have an emotional connection. >> rose: you almost feel like what would i do or feel if this was being denied to me or said to me.

>> you can-- you feel that empathetic, emotional response, and there's-- there's where you're moved to consider. >> rose: but this also, this movie is a reminder that history is changed by different people, different kinds of people playing different roles. you know, you need people in the streets in terms of civil rights. but you also need people in the courts arguing the case. >> and you need people in the front office. >> rose: and you need people like branch rickey because i think it's the right thing to do and it will benefit my team. how did you find him, in a sense? what did you go and read and that gave you an insight as-- >> there is a great book by jimmy bless lin. >> rose: really, bless lin? >> bless lin. >> rose: because he lived in brooklyn. >> because he was fascinate by the guy and found fascinating stories about him.

i went to the internet and found film clips and old television kinescopes of him on "what's my line, "and was able to get audio recordings of his voice and saw the pictures of what he looked like and how he held himself. and there was plenty of research material available. >> rose: that was easier than daniel day lewis trying to get link onon's voice, and there was no audio recording. >> i think so. >> rose: so you red breslin's book. >> shaved back my hairm. >> you wore these big, fat suits. >> i wore a fat suit. >> rose: and you had glasses. >> bushy eyebrows, a piece on my nose, got rild of the scar on my chin. an-- you know, i was talking to

ben kingsley. >> rose: oh, yeah. >> sir ben. i was making a film with him. and he said, "what are you going to do next?" and i said i'm going to do this thing, blah, blah, blah, the jackie robinson story. >> he said who are you going to play? i said i'm going to play branch rickey. he said i don't know the name branch rickey. and i said he's this guy. and i said i'm going to do the thing, the character actor thing. i'm going to shave my hairline back, and he said give a man a mask and he'll tell you the truth. >> rose: wow. >> and i remember when i first started and it reminded me that when i first started, i told you the first time i was on same i was mr. anterks rbus with a pillow under my jacket andital

compowder in my hair to look like i had gray hair, and it freed me, freed me. i was a very-- i was very nervous about being onstage, b but, you know, with a. -- and i sang from the "fantastics, "and all of that was immensely aided by disguise. the truth is a hard thing to tell. either you get accused of being pedantic or being a know-it-all, or having a point of view. so the truth is not so easy to tell oft times, but you give a man a mask, and he'll tell you the truth. >> rose: what drove branch rickey? >> the idea of god.

the idea of a perfectible humanity, relationships between people. i think he-- i think he truly was motivated by-- driven-- and probably, you know, by the-- a very conservative view of the bible. >> rose: but what is impressive about him is what is often said to be a really wonderful quality, he knows himself. he knows who he is. and, therefore, he believes in what he can do. he announces he's going to bring in to the big leagues the first african american, and everybody around him said, "you can't do that." i mean "are you going to ruin it?" >> don't do that. >> don't do that.

and he knows he's right. and he knows that it'sin it's go be hard-- >> and heñi knows it's time. >> rose: they're worried today, as you know, about young american americans not going to baseball come. >> right, they are very worried about it.ñi yeah. >> rose: playing basketball. >> yup. >> rose: football. and other sports. a lot of dominicans come to play baseball, and a lot of people from central and latin america. >> and japan. >> rose: and japan, yeah. >> yeah, and i don't know what the solution is. maybe this will be a small aid to baseball. >> maybe. >> i hope so. >> rose: thank you for coming. >> my great pleasure, sir. >> rose: mine, too. harrison ford. >> charlesy rose.

>> rose: shahid khan is here. he has lived the american dream. he came from pakistan with $500 in his poact and he was only 16 years old. today he is one of the world's richest people. his company, flex-n-gate, is a leading manufacturer of auto parts with nearly $4 billion in sales. in 2011 he bought the nfl's jacksonville jaguars. that, also, is an american dream for many people. i am pleased to have shahid khan at this table for the first time. and welcome. >> thank you so much, charlie. what a privilege to be here. >> rose: thank you. so just help us understand-- put us in your shoes-- and shoes is an important element of this story because it's snowing when you arrive. >> absolutely. you know, when i-- i had never seen snow before. and i landed in illinois when they had a record snow b27 inches. >> rose: now why illinois?

>> i think fate, destiny, i think kismet. because my dad of helping me. i ended up applying there. it had a reputation as a great engineering school. >> rose: your parents were reasonably well off in pakistan. >> i would say middle class by pack taken standards. my mother was a math professor. she retired, and my dad was an entrepreneur. >> rose: but 16 years old, to get on a plane to a country you've never been to, alone, that seems to me to be a challenge. >> yes. but, you know, you go out seeking your fame and fortune. and so, you know, my father, who was-- he passed away, but he had really thought about, dreamt about, and was never able to do. obviously, pakistan was a british colon, or ex-british

colony, and he dreamt about going to, and he was never able to do it and he made it possible for me. >> rose: your shoes are soaked, you feel the wettest snow. you come in on a greyhound business bus. two orñi three days before you begin school. you had to find a place to sleep. >> absolutely. they dropped me off at the atlanta union, and i checked, and it was, like, nine bucks that night. i seed, oh, geez, this is too much. i asked him, "is there someplace cheaper?"÷zand they said y.m.c.u go down the streets. "i think it's $2." and i said that's very easy. it was maybe a thirmd of a mile or something. but it was ite a memorable experience for me, obviously. you have your one suitcase with you. you walk, obviously, in shoes that are not used to water or

snow and they kind of start melting away. it's an experience you never forget. a very life affirming where they soak right through your socks. >> rose: and then you get a job paying, what, $1.20 an hour? >> that was probably-- it really change mied life. because it was a sense of empowerment. here you see two bucks are now gone, i'm down to less than 500. and then you get a job and you can work a couple of hours and make all that up. and it really, i think, it's something so unique about america. the empowerment and the fact you control your own destiny. most of the countries in the world you can't do that. >> rose: and that enables you to live your dream. >> absolutely. >> rose: if you can control your own destiny. >> absolutely. >> rose: if you have a shot. >> absolutely. >> rose: people with the right circumstance, timing, energy, obsession. >> but, charlie, you make your own luck, too.

here you get a chance to make your own luck. and that's what's-- again, you focus on 1% of the glass that's full not on the 99% that's empty. and that perspective, you're only going to get, frankly, if you are born someplace else and you come out and you discover this and you say, "oh, my god. what an amazing, amazing opportunity i've just been given." >> rose: how did you find your way to the origin flex-n-gate? >> door-tho-door calling. >> rose: really? >> i finish mied engineering study -- >> university of-- will, our public television, we watch ow that, pbs. it-- so i had an engineering agree. i'd finish all my course work and looking for a job. you have to remember. this was 1970.

huet rotary phone, and basically you printed up resumes and you went out door to door cold calling, which is another absolutely american virtue, the art of cold calling. you know, you get used to rejection, and you have to talk about shoes, use the shoe leather. so i was lrmly going door to door in chicago and in champagne, everywhere, just looking for a job. >> rose: and you could handle rejection. >> you have to. i think that's the key lesson in life, nayou have to be able to handle rejection. it was an amazing day i know when i got this job because i got two jobs after months of trying. and this was, obviously, a blacksmith kind of a job-- dir dirty. and the other one was being a manager of an ice cream store, which was air candidate. you wear a coat and tie and i

kind of thought about it. and i said i think i've spent all this-- going to school, i think i'm going to go this route. >> rose: the manufacturing route. >> absolutely. >> rose: what was it like with the company? what did you do? did you come while you were there with the idea that in a sense this core idea that enabled you to do so well? >> well, charlie, i mean, this was a very small place, okay. it had less than 30 employees, and it was like a blacksmith shop owned by a farmer who basically was running it during the summer-- during the winters and in the summers they were farming. and he hired me, you know, to do everything and basically come out of engineering school, you don't know a lot. so i told him, of course, you i'm going to be able to do all these things for you. and next thing, i realize i didn't know much, so i better go to the engineering library and find out what some of the practices are.

and we would be cutting and welding and grienlding, you know, 13, 14 parting it to make one part, and it was like,un, if you could just do it out the one piece, that would make it so much easier. and make my life easier, too. >> rose: what amazes me about that-- and you have said this yourself-- why nobody had thought about this before. >> absolutely. >> rose: it was stunning to me. >> yup. but look at how many things that are changing your life today that nobody had thought of before. >> rose: or they don't think know-- they might ask the question, but they every think-- they think somebody cels doing that somebody must be taking care of that, so no need for me to go there. and they're not. >> absolutely. but the idea here was that, you know, you take metal. and if you hold on tight to it to make a shape, it tears. and if you let go of it, it

wrinkles. so how do you find the balance to hold steel to stretch it to a shape? that was the whole art or the science of it. >> rose: and how did you learn to do that? >> i went to the engineering library. and then started experimenting on techniques on how to hold the metal. you better remember, this was a shoe string, so there was no money to dor & d. >> rose: this was for flex-n-gate? >> yes. >> rose: this finey little company. >> once we did that we found out the part were lighter. they were more durable because you didn't have all the seams. they looked better, and, obviously, less expensive. but you could charge as much or maybe even more because you were adding more value. so the owner eye mean, the first year we had this out, you know, made more money than he had probably be his whole lifetime. and he told me, look, i'm going to sell the company.

i don't think this is going to last. it was a very small company. we did less than $3 million a year even then. and then the company got sold to the new york stock exchange company which right after that got sold to warren buffet of all places so it's really interest glg so what happened to you? >> well, what happened to me is i worked for them for about six years. and then-- this is about '77-- the second energy crisis hit. and we could really take it to the next level, which was the parts could be even lighter and better. but you could make more money selling to dealers as afterring-market. so it wasn't in sync with-- so i basically-- you know, i just ventured on my own and basically a guy in a garage. got an s.b. alone, had savings. >> rose: this company is

called bumper something? >> bumper work. >> in vanville. >> rose: in danville, illinois. >> in danville, illinois. >> rose: and then huet chance to buy flex-n-gate? >> a couple of years later. they were losing money and the market was changing. the truckses were changing from large tow smaller trucks. for us we were doingu doing-- we sold out and needed capacity and it was the perfect mixture. i knew the employees who were there so it made sense to go back. >> rose: so you have a good business going now? >> yes. >> rose: and then general motors, one of your customers, comes to you and says we don't need you. we don't need you. >> you see, you've got to remember the key principle in automatickive business, whatever you have, you give up the intellectual property to the customer. >> rose: so they own the

intellectual property. >> they own the intellectual property. >> rose: is that-- you have to do that. >> that is pretty much standard procedure. >> rose: standard procedure. >> and, you know, that's okay. because, frankly, for me it turned out very well. because what i had to do at that point-- and really, you know we were not to the size where we could handle large volume. >> rose: if you wanted to up the scale you needed somebody who had their resources. >> exactly. so, you know, general motors has been everywhere good to me over the years, so i don't begrudge it. because they had a japanese company, which was-- they owned a portion of isuzu, which was coming to the u.s. >> rose: and they said to you or you said to them-- >> i said, basically i'm not going to have a business. and i understand it's your right. so they gave me a name of a

contact at isuzu in japan, and, you know, that's what i did. i just-- you know, got on a plane and -- >> didn't you hire some ph.d.s to translate for you when you were there? >> absolutely. it was great. because you inspector a university town. what is the are resource? we had great japanese students get, ph.d.s so you could hire them for basically giving them a trip back to japan and they could translate federal me, do the cultural thing, and in the late 80s, there weren't very many americans who were going there, going to japan selling product. but for us, it turned out really good. >> rose: so when you went to the company, what did they say? how did you convince them tu were their guy? >> well, they were coming to the u.s., and i could show them-- there were a number of things we could offer them which were everywhere u.s. specific and it would make sense for you -- >> so you were going to make a

component part for them. >> absolutely. >> sphwhr a bumper. >> you have to remember how trucks were shipped was volume. they could pack more in. and they started getting subjectedly to duties in the u.s., as much as 25%. so they didn't have to pay that. wakefield customize the product. was it chrome? and they could decide a day before shipping it to the dealer what options they wanted. so you could add value. >> rose: how did you expand beyond that company? >> because, at that time, other japanese were coming to the u.s. also. there was mazda, there was toyota -- >> toyota was-- when you got toyota you were on your way. >> absolutely. because they were investigate to us with a toyota production system. we learned how to run a plant. everything up till then they knew was self-taught. and they had a profound effect

on us, how you get the waste out, and how you runab efficient plant. >> rose: and you think the automobile industry is back for good? >> i think they're back for good. >> rose: because-- why are they in so much a better place now than they were before the terrible economic recession? >> well, you have to remember, i think five years ago, you know, in what happened was that-- when you get down to any company that's having problems, it's the management. let's face it. it's not-- it's not the labor. it's the management. it's the leadership that's accountable. and they had made commitments, legacy costs that were not sustainable, whether they were pensions, health care costs, whatever. >> rose: right, right. they were almost health care companies making cars. >> you could say that. but that was not sustainable. so what really-- you know, the chance they got to wipe the slate clean basically was to

start fresh. and really put some of those legacy costs aside. >> rose: so you're a strong proponent of the bailout that took place? >> 100%. i think, you know, president obama absolutely did the right thing. i mean, it's one-eighth of our economy. >> rose: so now you find yourself with a lot of money. and there's this sport called football, which can-- which is king in america and the king of all football is the nfl. how do you decide that's what you want to do, to own an nfl franchise? because what's amazing about your story is that you went about this with a strategy, with a plan. you knew how to-- you figured out the inside track. and how you get to know and have other people get to know you so that you are, when they think about a new owner, on the short list, they think about. >> charlie, again, cold calling.

>> rose: hello, jerry jones, this is shahid khan? >> as a matter of fact, i did exactly that. i met jerry, i think in early '07 -- >> he would respect you because you were already a successful businessman and made a lot of money. i mean, he'd take your call. >> you know, i ended up with him so i spent a couple of days, and quite by accident. but, you know, i cold call a lot of the other owners. so the simple fact is, when i cold call these people, they didn't know me from adam, okay. so i wouldue know, i would call them up, and i'd say, "look, this is who i am. this is what i do. i just have an interest. i love to learn. and could i come and see you?" and they would say okay. and then-- i cold called on the nfl. because i had a bank who was also funding them. i got the name of some of the

people at the league edcriewgman. >> and cold called him. and he couldn't be kind tore me. he welcomed me. and he gave me some names. and it was very very profound what he told me. he said some of these guys aren't going to want to talk to you. it's not you, it's them. >> rose: you have to believe that. >> you have to believe that. >> rose: it's their problem, not mine. >> exactly. >> rose: but some of them were rep ceptive. and they'd tell you this is what i know and this is what i think and this is the way-- people, there were two things that i have learned in life is that if you want somebody's opinion so that you're prepared to ask them a question, they're flattered. and most often, they'll respond. >> absolutely. absolutely. i think you have to do it the right way, and you've got to be respectful. >> rose: and so what did they say about your chances? >> well, it's-- it's basically--

you know, i was interested in learning the fundamentals, how it works, how the process works, and how you find out because you never find out what team is going to sell. especially the nfl. very few teams sell. so you somehow have to get into the mix and get to know people when an opportunity might come. and i think more importantly, you've got to have the ability to write a check because there's, you know, no smoke and mirrors in this industry. >> rose: so what are you going to do with the jacksonville jaguars? >> we have to win. obviously, we haven't won in a number of years. we're going through a turnaround and rebuilding process? >> diswhr so you got a new general manager. >> yes. q. you got a new coach.>> right. >> rose: how did you go about decide ago did you ask other owners about who is a great

general manager? >> well, it's like if you look at-- you know, auto parts business. it's-- you've got to get the right people. i wouldn't be sitting here if we didn't have the best group of people in the auto parts business. i mean, absolutely i believe it. so what was the process i used over there? very similar here. when the season started, things weren't going our way. un, i said, well, we might have to make a change. there's only two outcomes. you make a change or you don't make a change. so if you're going to make a change, you have to get ready. you can't wait until the season is over. i mean, that's too late. and you can talk to some people. other people you can't. so i started off talking to the wise old men of the nfl who had gone through a turnaround, a number of them, and talked to, you know, some people who were not working and really made a list of who would be the best fit for us.

and then, you know, when we made the change, the earliest we could-- i mean, you get get on the phone and get permission to interview the people. and the guy, our general manager, david caldwell, he was, from everything i knew, he was the best guy for glus for you. >> for glus why was he the best guy for you? >> because great football mind. great experience in judging talent. understands value. is-- pu know, is a good guy, somebody i can relate to and have good chemistry with. so from every end, this would be a promotion for him. so it's something that, you know, he's aspired to work to all his life. >> rose: it's his opportunity. >> absolutely. >> rose: and then you hired gus bradley as your coach. why him? >> well, because i felt that-- i looked at the teams that had been successful. they've had a culture where the

general manager and the coach both kind of grew together, almost like a double helix, d.n.a. kindef thing. >> rose: here is the other story, too. we have seen more than once owners get too involved in trying to run the team. almost as if they're coaching the team. and some of the names we've mention individual done that, and i think pulled back in some cases, and realized that maybe they should leave running the team to the coach and the general manager. >> and the team president. >> rose: and the team president, exactly, and the team president. i mean, do you have a sort of balance in your own head as to how much meddling should the owner do? >> well, i think -- >> and you wouldn't call it "meddling." >> for me the most important thing is to hire those three people. really, the two key peep, the general manager and the president and really help the general manager get the head

coach. it is three key people. once i'm done with that, my job is to provide them with the resources, and then i think most importantly hold them accountable. so other than that, there's very little i want to do or plan on doing. this is something i've learned over the years what makes a successful organization. >> rose: is to hire the right people and let them do what they are hired to do. >> hired to do, but you have to give them the resources. >> rose: give them the resources and give them freedom to go try and fail. >> yes. >> rose: or not? >> i think you have to, regrettably, give them the thought process is very important. now, that might lead to failure. it happens everywhere. >> rose: sure. >> so then what do you do, obviously, was the thought process or the execution and you learn from that mistake and hopefully you're better off the next time. glt relationship between pakistan and the united states today is-- how would you characterize it? >> well, there are two parts to.

you have the relationship between the governments of pakistan and the u.s. and then you have the relationship with the people. i think the people has, frankly, always been great because, you know, i have friend, relatives in pakistan. they've always looked at america as the land of opportunity, american dream. i mean, their goal is to somehow participate. but, you know, for pakistan, it's within the government-- i think something historic is with to happen where the first freely elected government is now going to hand over power to the next freely elected government. hopefully that will happen. >> rose: thank you. >> thank you so much, charlie, it's my pleasure. >> rose: thank you for joining us. see you next time. time.

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