>> rose: welcome to the program. we begin this evening with a terrible air crash in the alps. here's the latest from cbs "cbs evening news" with scott pelley. >> investigators investigating the home of andreas lubitz found several doctors notes including one excusing him from work on the day of the crash but that had been torn up. the note supports the current preliminary assessment that lubitz hid his ailment from employers and colleagues. prosecutors would not say what the medical condition was other than he had been treated by a doctor. they also did not find a suicide note or anything indicating a religious or political motive. now they are combing through the co-pilot's background examining financial and personal details including the possibility he was

suffering from depression. the federal aviation authority in germany said there was a medical condition attached to lubitz' file due did not specify. the clinic said he had been a patient as late as march 10. they did not provide details based on con phi detentionality. the records are sent to the government's office. on wednesday, lufthansa said he pass the checks with flying colors. german pilots undergo annual physicals but not specific psychological testing. that's limited mostly to a questionnaire filled out by the pilot themselves. europe's aviation safety agency is recommending airlines always have two people in the cockpit of a flying aircraft and

lufthansa said they will offer $50,000 assistance to each victim. >> rose: our thanks to "cbs evening news" with scott pelley. we turn to anthony cordesman of the center for strategic and international studies, with a look at what's happening in yemen. >> the c.i.a. puts the shiite population in yemen at about 35% of the population, and it has been houthi dominated. the sunni part has been divided almost since the formation of yemen, almost constantly fighting, at least at some kind of level. it's a country which has never had the ability since it was unified and before that it was the source of fighting between the two halves south of yemen. >> rose: my conversation recorded this week in damascus by bashar al-assad.

there is a number alarming to me is that 90% of the civilian casualties come from the syrian army. >> how did you get that? >> rose: that was a report issued in the last six months. >> as i said earlier the war is not the traditional war. it's not about capturing and gaining land. it's about winning the heart and miebdz of the syrians. we can not sustain that position as a government and me as president while the rest of the world, the great powers and regional powers are against me and my people are against me. that's impossible. this has no leg to stand on so this is not realistic and is against our interest as government is to kill the people. what do we get? what's the benefit of killing the people? >> rose: the argument is you -- there are weapons of war that have been used that most

people look down on, one is chlorine gas. they believe it has been used here. there is evidence to that and they would like to have the right to inspect to see where it's coming from. as you know barrel bombs have been used and come from helicopters and the only people with helicopters are the syrian army, so those two acts of war which society looks down on -- >> let me fully answer this. >> rose: -- barbaric acts. this is very important. this is part of the malicious propaganda. it's is not military gas. there is evidence. traditional arms is more important and if it was very effective, the terrorists would have used it on a larger scale. because it's not effective, it's

not used. >> rose: why not let somebody come in and inspect to see whether it's been used or not. you would be happy with that? >> of course, we ask the delegation to come and investigate. but logically and realistically, it cannot be used as military. this is part of the propaganda because in the media when it bleeds it leads and they always look for something that leads. >> rose: that's on "60 minutes." then on cbs this morning on monday. monday evening on this program the full hour of that conversation. next here, al hunt on the story with barney frank. >> people say to me what happened to bipartisanship? it died when obama became president and no republican would give him the cooperation that harry reid and nancy pelosi and me and chris gave to him. 2008, six or seven weeks before the presidential election, the tensest period in american politics.

ben bernankey three times appointed by bush, hank paulson came to the democratic congress and said the economy is about to fall apart and we've got to do something that the public isn't going to like and we respond by helping them pass the tarp which goes down in history as the most unpopular successful thing the government ever did. >> rose: we conclude with benjamin scheuer who wrote and stars in a one-man musical called the lion. he reflects on cancer and his father. >> we get dealt those cards. wanting one thing and getting another and how we deal with that is the kind of person we are. i've had the unfortunate circumstance of losing a parent at an early age and being diagnosed with a very serious illness at an early age and i felt the way that i could get through it was to make art. >> rose: when we continue, anthony cordesman, al hunt on the story with barney frank

benjamin scheuer all of that when we continue. >> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> rose: we begin tonight with the latest from yemen, saudi-led forces have launched air strikes against the country's shia-houthi rebels. meanwhile iran which many believe is backing the rebels warn any military action would

only result in a deepening crisis. joining us from washington, anthony cordesman of the center for strategic and international studies. anthony, thank you for doing this and taking time from your busy schedule. let me begin with what's happening on the ground. where are which? >> where we are seems to be that the hoot is moved the edge, they've taken over some key air bases near there. they now occupy ports along yemen's western coast as well as the capital. but we need to be careful about this term because the houthi are allied with the former deck tater sala. they split the forces which are largely sunni dominated so this isn't a sort of shiite takeover with iranian backing, it is a shiite-led mixture of sunni and shiites and an odd combination of a religious tribal movement and a former dictator. >> rose: what are the stakes

for saudi arabia that led them to be engaged? >> well they're immense. first, there are 4 million yem#$ en])qq saudi arabia's foreign labor. that's a massive potential source of instability. quite aside from the houthi, the main terrorist threat to saudi arabia is al quaida in the arabian peninsula. that was largely driven out of saudi arabia but into yemen and it still operates and conducts regular strikes inside saudi arabia. you have a border that has always been a source of contention, of smuggling, of illegal immigration. it is one of the longest borders saudi arabia has, around it is an area -- and it is an area where many of the factions have been a problem for saudi arabia for decades. you have the need for some kind of stability in yemen, but you

also have saudi concerns that if iran should ever acquire air bases or any kind of naval bases either in the indian ocean area yemen has -- there's an island -- or inside the red sea they control potentially one of the critical choke points into the red sea affecting the suez canal and oil exports in the red sea area, so for all these reasons, yemen is critical to saudi arabia. >> rose: what are the stakes and the the risk for the united states? >> well, the risk is, first al quaida in the arabian peninsula has been the group that's planned more direct attacks on the u.s. than any to have the other extreme estor terrorist groups in the area. another is we, too, are critically dependent on the

stable flow of exports out of the gulf and and through the red sea. the suez canal is critical to move combat ships and critical in terms of the global economy. while we have been reduced dependence on oil imports, our dependence on other imports from countries like asia, countries who are dependent on gulf oil, and our dependence on europe keeps increasing. so are we achieving energy independence? no not at all. we're actually steadily increasing our dependence on the global economy. >> rose: what happened to yemen? because it was a place that the president and others suggested go look at yemen, that's a good place to see where things might be. >> well it's sometimes very difficult to know because none of the data that were being collected by the national counterterrorism center showed we scored any kind of major

victories in yemen. none of the saudi reporting on the activity coming out of yemen showed that we were achieving stability. the houthi have been a very serious problem since 2009. this is not something new. the previous government, the dictator had essentially falon apart between 2011 and 2012, and the new central government was elected without any real opposition and without any real support as the military had split. i think part of the problem is we sometimes spin things almost in defiance of the facts. >> rose: could we be suggesting there's more iranian influence than there actually is? >> i think there is certainly that risk. there were a lot of reports initially that the houthi were only succeeding because of iran.

there are no precise estimates here but the c.i.a. puts the shiite population of yemen at about 35% of the population and it has been houthi dominated. the soon is part has been divided almost since the formation of yemen almost constantly fighting, at least at some kind of level. it's a country which has never had stability since it was unified and before that it was the source of fighting within its two halves, south and north yemen. >> rose: as you know as well as anyone, there has been some degree of split between the united states and saudi arabia that took place after the so-called red line in syria and the failure to attack there, witnessed the fact that the president went quickly from india to saudi arabia or to talk to the new king burks now -- king -- but now with a common enemy,

i.s.i.s. and terrorism, is this strike a cooperation? could there have been united states involvement with the saudis in terms of some way making it easier for them to do what they were doing? >> there are some reports that we did not get large amounts of strategic warning that the saudis are going to act but then the saudis had no warning that the prime minister would suddenly be dealing with houthi virtually on the edge of aden and have to leave. we are providing logistic support to the saudis, intelligence support and targeting capabilities that they don't have. i think it is fairly clear we may be flying unmanned aerial vehicles as well as providing other kinds of intelligence so there's a close relationship and has been in yemen for a long time. this is not like the problems we face in syria or iraq. ever since 2011 and, in fact, long before then, the united

states and saudi arabia cooperated in trying to stabilize yemen and ever since about 2003-2004, we've had a strong cooperative effort to try to deal with al quaida in the arabian peninsula. >> rose: what's the risk for a larger war that could go from yemen to the rest of the middle east? >> i think you probably will not get any kind of unified explosion. iran is a very weak military power in terms of air power. it has very serious reasons not to start a war inside the gulf. but iran can certainly stoke the flames inside yemen. it can make this into a very difficult insurgency. it can create a climate where there is more support for terrorism. iran already is playing a role in iraq and it is an ambiguous

one because it sometimes seems to be pressing for iraqi unity and yet is directly arming and supporting shiite militias which are attacking iraqier sunnis and been a problem for the kurds. they are watching iran's back the assad regime strongly inside sir. i can't you see iran playing lower level games in bahrain lebanon and to some extent supporting or at least offit did in the past hamas and gaza. it is explosive. it's clear tensions between sunni and shiite are rising. at the same time we're watching power struggles between sunni islamists extremist groups and most of the governments inside the middle east, and it's this interaction of different non-state actors with outside

states supporting them and feuding with other states that can sort of create this long-term almost unquenchable series of violent sort of hot spots throughout the region. >> rose: what's the status in syria? >> i'm afraid the status is that the last rebel movement that we tried to back first had very serious problems last november and then was decisively defeated a month ago by not the islamic state but another sunni extremist group called the el nusra front. the fighting against assad is very mixed. from day to day it's hard to know exactly who's winning. at time assad seems to be gaining, and he certainly seems to gradually be taking back some cities, but he doesn't seem to be creating any kind of lasting ability to hold the more populated areas of syria.

as we've seen inside iraq, tikrit didn't produce this quit, sudden victory by the shiite militias and the shiite portions of the iraqi army, so now we're in the business of supporting the iraqi army. the shiite militia said that they will stand down. it is far from clear who inside any of this is achieving some kind of unity between arab sunni and shiite or between arab and kurds. so this is an area where the islamic state is a problem. the el nusra front is a problem the assad regime is a problem and you have this constant battle between factions in iraq. >> rose: anthony cordesman, thank you very much for joining us. >> my pleasure. >> rose: anthony cordesman

c.i.s. in warrant washington. >> hunt: barney frank achieved a first dream in his 20s starting as top aid to boston mayor kevin white, serving in the massachusetts general court and 32 years in congress culminating as chairman of the financial services committee during the financial crisis. during that time he proudly paraded as a progressive a liberal champion of affective government but hid the fact that he was gay. he has written a memoir aptly entitled "frank" by barney frank in which he tells about these experiences. barney it's great to have you here. >> thank you. >> hunt: barney, how much of your public year in the first 20 years was affected by the fact that you were gay and couldn't disclose it? >> i now know retroactively more than i thought. there was one way it didn't

affect me. that is, i never let that keep me back from being an advocate for gay rights. so that was a decision i made earlier on. i can't be honest about who i am so i'm going to be a coward, but i won't be a hypocrite. i'm not going to hold back from the fight, so i did that. but you know this takes a lot out of your personally. >> hunt: you talked about the emotional damage. >> no question. you are repressing -- repressing is a good word -- you have physical and emotional needs, needs to relate to other people as who you are. especially when i became a legislator. legislation, as you know, is a personal business. legislators have to interact with each other. we don't have a formal hierarchy. nobody can order anybody else. when your interpersonal skills are somewhat impeded by your own inner turmoil you don't do it as well. when i did acknowledge being gay

publicly a number of my colleagues including a number who advised me not to do it because they thought it would damage me said we're glad you did it because you're easier to work with you're better at your job because i put all my energy into my work and not bottling it up. >> hunt: you suffered a lot of emotional damage but in some ways the most painful must have been after you came out, when you were sanctioned by the house for relations with a male prostitute. >> the relationship was my bad decision. that was one of the things, realizing i was behaving irresponsibly because i was feeling the need for emotional and physical companion ship is

what helped me come out. because i said, this is crazy you're acting irresponsibly. so when i came out in '87 the public and colleagues responded better than i thought and i got reelected. i thought oh well, there's this big thing i did and hasn't hurt me. so almost two and a half years later this guy comes back and i had broken off with him, we weren't dating at the time when i came out. so yeah, i was humiliated, i thought i hurt the cause is cared about and i thought i was free of all this and i found myself pulled back. so it was a very low moment. >> hunt: you've certainly bounced back from it. in all my years of current politics, i don't think i've ever seen an issue where it changed so ropey. as recently as 2004, karl rove was using anti-gay stuff as a we believe issue and now it's changed and it's republicans who

don't want to bring up the issue. what caused it to change? >> i agree with you. as late as 2004, if i said i plan to get married but i'm still a member of song, people would say that's controversial. so when i got married in 2012 to jim and somebody said that's controversial, i said very. a lot of my colleagues were mad because i didn't invite them. here's the deal it's no question it's the most ram id major social and political change in american history. we started out having hidden from everybody. so the prejudice ran the show because there was no counter to the prejudice and what happened was more and more of us decided to be honest about who we are. i was late than many others. as we became honest about who we were, reality defeated the prejudice. particularly on same-sex marriage. i'm convinced this is the dynamic -- there were people who were against the marriage mainly because they disapproved of us and didn't want us happy.

they didn't want to give any kind of sense that we should be treated normal but they couldn't come out and say that. instead, that's why it was called the defense of marriage act. what do you mean? >> hunt: you married jim. i married jim, what's that do to you? in a debate, i said, whose marriage will we be hurting? steve from oklahoma said you're hurting the institution of the marriage. i said sounds like somebody in the institution made the argument. how can i hurt anybody's marriage? here's the deal they had to come up with an argument saying we were causing social damage by marriage, and once massachusetts started it and others did, they lost the fight because there were obviously no negative social consequences and as more and more states did it the argument that this is going to cause a problem just disappeared. >> hunt: let's turn to government and politics. you don't agree with some liberals and some others who say that liberalism is in decline and may be dead the era of big

government as bill clinton said is over. you think that's wrong? >> well, in the first place as i said to the clinton people, i want to know when the era of big government was. i must have slept through it. maybe 1935, '36 '34. i was a great admirer of clinton and a friend when he was unfairly attacked but i thought that was a mistake. the liberals said we concede government is not a good thing and work to expand this and that program but the whole can't smaller than the parts. i think it's a paradox. some people are philosophically opposed to government. some rich people want to keep their money and don't want to share. but there are working people who were for f.d.r. and johnson and kennedy and they believe in government but are disappointed because as their economic

position has eroded in the past couple of decades the government hasn't done anything. they're mad at government not because they disagree with it but it hasn't done anything for them. so i believe if we can free up resources and do things in theiary of healthcare and education -- obama-clinton want to do more for healthcare. the perception was he's going to take this away from me and give it to the poor. >> hunt: let's talk about the financial crisis. 2008-2009, the first part of 2009, part of the key was you working with two stalwart republicans, hank paulson and ben bernanke. >> yes, and i'm very proud of that. people said what happened to bipartisanship? it died when obama became president and no republican would give him the cooperation that harry reid and nancy pelosi asked me and chris dodd to give

to him. 2008, six or seven weeks before the presidential election, the tensest period in politics. ben bernanke three times appointed, hank paulson head of treasury, former head of goldman sachs come to the democratic congress and says the economy is going to fall apart and we have to do something the public won't like and we responded by enacting the tarp which will go down as the most unpopular successful thing the government did. even when we went by the way in doing financial reform, ben bernanke is the fed, hank paulson the treasury and the bob dole protege worked with us. much of the legislation that passed was their idea.

even the legislation, it was bipartisan in that the bush officials who knew about the crisis worked with us even though all the fellow republicans voted no. >> hunt: it was dodd frank, of course, and complicated. in retrospect, can it be made less complex now? >> no, part of the problem is people said why is it so big? in the new deal they passed two bills in the securities industry, one bill dealing with banking, one bill dealing with housing. opinion had originally thought we would have seven or eight separate bills and chris dodd says, do you know what it's like to pass a bill in the senate? i have to get 60 votes. i think i can get that once. eight times? no way. they'll be holding me up, they'll find this and that. theout thing -- the other thing was the financial system was more complicated (in the '30s there were no collateralized loan and debt obligations.

part of the problem is there was too little interconnection. then we added things like consumer bureau that was not inherent to this but could have been useful, so no, i don't think you could have made it any smaller. >> hunt: you write that the powerful financial interests, they power was exaggerated as demonstrated by dodd frank, but are you worried dodd frank will be diluted slowly? >> here's the deal, the norm is for the public not to pay attention and when they don't pay attention powerful economic interests have their way. what happened in the financial crisis -- kind of what rahm emanuel talked about, you don't let an opportunity pass that a crisis presents, the public got engaged. i've said big money makes a big impact but when the public gets involved votes will kick money's butt, and that's what happened hear. so we got the bill passed. the fear was, as things went

forward people would forget and big interests would fill the vacuum. >> hunt: did that happen? no. i thought it would. the president signed a bill that had the beginnings of unraveling. the public was unhappy. nancy called me and asked me to jump in. hillary clinton sent out a tweet saying we'll protect the financial front. the public reaction was one weakening, the reaction was so strong that i don't believe it will happen again till the republicans win the election in 2016. we have one of the major issues in the election straintively is what happens to financial reform. it won't be weakened i'm convinced until then with obama standing firm and elizabeth warren safeguarding it but come 2016 if the republicans win that will be the end. >> hunt: barney, over the course of four and a half decades you dealt with powerful and important figures. give a thumbnail portrait of

some of the major figures starting with your first major boss kevin white. >> fascinating man. a brilliant man, undisciplined but a man who basically knew his own strengths and weaknesses very well and was able to play to his strengths and downplay his weaknesses to become very effective. >> hunt: fourth term mayor of boston. edward m. kennedy. >> extraordinary force. i opposed him when he first ran because i thought i wanted a center who would be needling the president and he was the president's brother. but nobody has done more in american history to make this a fairer society and he is the ideal -- he's the role model for how you combine zealous advocacy with pragmatic effectiveness. >> hunt: tip o'neal. much smarter than people realize. what i like about tip is when he died people did the usual oh he never goer phot where he came from.

it's easy to not forget where you came from. it's hard when you were so deeply rooted in a situation to think about where we should go. tip was an extraordinary example of someone who was the best of old school, who benefited from it but was able to do new things and adapt. from technical things in the house, he was an important transitional figure because he could go backwards and forwards. >> hunt: newt newt gingrich. one of the most destructive forces in american politics. gingrich who never had any ideas came to power by saying we can't win if we don't demonize the democrats. he said you can't say democrats are reasonable people with whom we disagree, you have to say they're dishonest and corrupt. at the same time he was a leading exemplar to have the attack, he had a glass jaw and used to complain when anybody said the smallest thing about him. >> hunt: nancy pelosi. very effective leader. sexual stereotyping come in,

she's an attractive soft-spoken woman who is as tough and shrewd and smart as anybody i've ever seen and she has used the power she's had with a kind of a free pass in san francisco to be a very effective force. >> hunt: you're mainly praising democrats here because you were and still are a democrat but there were some republicans that you admired a lot. jim leach. >> i once tried to get jim leach to be appointed head of the world bank and alan simpson who worked with alan greenspan decent man very bright. >> hunt: alan simpson. alan was a tough guy who was -- unlike leach alan simpson was quite conservative but a decent man so on gay

rights and other things he was the opposite of me. so that generosity worked very well. the day after i came out alan simpson called me and said i apologize. i said for what? he said, i know i'm always making jokes about things. i probably made some anti-gay joke in your presence. he said, i'm so proud of you and i'm so glad you did what you did. he's probably one to have the most decent, likable people ever. >> hunt: president bill clinton. >> very bright. very effective. i regretted his -- i think he -- i regretted his wanting to accommodate the anti-government thing. i think he tried to do what you couldn't do. on the whole, though, one of the most talented people i've ever seen. >> hunt: george w. bush? decent. limited, i think, in terms of his approach to things, and i think he goes down his historically with the rap of having committed the worst mistake any president

ever paid which is the war in iraq. >> hunt: how about barack obama? >> again, very bright. clinton was more political. clinton had a better sense of realism about politics. here's the problem with obama, he did too many things too early people told him he couldn't do. when people do things somebody tells them they can't do then they think they can do everything. he began by thinking he could get right-wing republicans to work with him. he couldn't. i give him credit for learning that quickly. once he did, i think he's been very effective. >> hunt: how about hillary clinton looking ahead? >> i'm very impressed with her commitment on the issues. some of my friends on the left, for some reason, they've just got to be dissatisfied. i recommend they treed "new york times" columnist who noted in

the 2008 el election that she was more likable than barack obama. she was put in a very difficult position and carried it out with dignity. >> hunt: barney frank, i thank you for being with us. the book is "frank" by barney frank and it's as interesting as his conversation. thank you. >> thank you i appreciate it. >> hunt: back in a moment. >> rose: benjamin scheuer is here, a singer/songwriter wrote and stars in a one-man musical called "the lion," based on his life including his lapse with his father and a battle with cancer in his 20s. the "new york times" writes a natural appealing her former with a soft touch. mr. scheuer seems to have found consolation by channeling his troubles into his art. pleased to have ben scheuer at

the table for the first time. welcome. >> a pleasure, charlie. >> rose: how did this play that you have created and you're performing throughout from now through the end of 2016 come about? >> i made a record of autobiographical songs with a band of mine called the scapist capers. as i was performing in coffee shops in new york city, i wanted to know what i would say in between the songs to better connect them and frame the song clearly. i wrote a script. i memorized it. i wanted to play the best gig possible. i didn't want people to be bored in between the songs. so i had a script and a score and ostensibly theater and that's where it began. >> rose: when did you know it could be performed as a credible and worthy project? >> i was invited to the good speed theater in connecticut as a writer and resident there in january 2013. they asked me do you have a

piece of theater on which you're working now? i had written other pieces of theater for the stage. i told them, yes, i do. it's a show called "the bridge." now, "the bridge" is the title of the record i recently made. so i thought i'll pull a fast one on these guys and go up and wo on the in-between song banter. so i went to good speed in january 2013. mark holman and greg codis was living next to me and their director sean daniels. i became friends with mark and greg and sean. we'd hang out in the evening play songs for each other and got to know each other well. when i got invited to the weston place in 2013, they said we want you to work on this piece but we feel you need a new pair of eyes and earso help you out why don't you bring a director. so i called sean daniel and asked if he had any recommendations for young directors because i thought

correctly sean was out of my league. he made the recommendation for three young directors. he said for what it's worth, kid, i'll direct the show. >> rose: you knew you had a director then. >> i said how would you direct it sean? he said, you don't have a show yet. you have four songs that maybe you will cut two of. i'll help you outline the piece you want to make, the story you want to tell and guide you to write the new show. we wrote 16 new tunes and a whole lot of new scenes. >> rose: what was the story he said you wanted to tell? >> he asked me to tell it out loud. it was about my relationship with my dad and my relationship with a woman called julia that went well and then went bad and then my diagnosis with advanced stage cancer when i was 28 years old and what it was like to endure that. and then what is it that i learned from all these things. >> rose: which was? i learned family was the most important thing in my life and

the last song in the show, "the lion," answers the first question the show asks which is what makes a lion a lion? and the lion says, though i had to learn once more to be a lion without a roar, it's not the roar that makes the lion, it's the pride, the family. >> rose: you're close to your father. he gave you your first guitar. >> my father gave me when i was two and a half years old a toy banjo. he knew i loved the guitar more than anything because my father played. he built me a toy banjo and my father taught me to play the guitar. >> rose: he died early? he died when he was 48 a week before i turned 14 of a brain aneurysm. >> rose: talk about your phat around how you put that into song as well as conversation. >> when hi father died, he and i had been in a big fight and we hadn't resolved it. >> rose: about?

about -- ning i was an annoying teenager and he was frustrated from some work of his and i don't know quite what it was and he was suffering from depression as well and, in the show, what i present as this big fight is i wanted to go on a school band trip and my father said your school work isn't good enough, you can't go. in the show, i use that to be indctive of what was a larger tension between me and my dad. so i don't remember exactly what it was that we were fighting about. needless to say, we never resolved it, and he died. he had a brain aneurysm. i watched it happen. i went into my parents' bedroom. >> rose: did you write this down or have a terrific memory? >> it was seared into my memory. >> rose: this is a clip from the show. this is en titled "the lion." ♪ you taught me what it is to be

open ♪ ♪ sometimes being brave is being scared ♪ ♪ i tried to guide the pride to learn ♪ ♪ to find their own ideas of fire and fan the flames ♪ ♪ other stuff to do and see ♪ ♪ left the music to me ♪ ♪ the things that make us lions are not the same ♪ ♪ and i always show my teeth when i am smiling ♪ ♪ i only say i love you when i'm sure ♪ ♪ in my gentle paws i have devastating claws and i'm learning what it means to really roar ♪ >> rose: autobiographical stuff... once you began to be honest with it, it comes easier. >> it does get easier. >> rose: it was the hardert -- was the hardest part the cancer or the fights with your father? >> writing about? >> rose: yeah. or the girlfriend? >> actually, the hardest part was writing the love songs for my girlfriend because we'd broken up many many years before and, so, while writing

about cancer felt incredibly cathartic to be able to go back where cancer had control of me, i could control cancer i could speak as cancer and that gave me great agency and that's incredible alce my to take a bad thing and turn it into a good thing so song writing becomes this cathartic technique. when write about my father i was able to write about him more. >> rose: two things. when people come and say you're singing my song. >> it's lovely to connect with people. >> rose: even though they didn't have cancer it's just their own state of mind. >> sure because i suppose, charlie, it's not that the same things happen to us but that we pretty much feel the same way as the stuff that does -- we feel lost misunderstood loved, connected to other people to ourselves. >> rose: and what have you learned about the connection between suffering and creating art? >> that art can be magical and take suffering and turn it into

something good even if it doesn't feel valuable at the time. even by writing down what it's like to suffer while that might feel stupid or useless or pointless, it's a worthy thing to do. write it down. write it down. >> rose: here is an animated video made from your song about the banjo ♪ ♪ my father has an old dpi tar andúpways me folk songs ♪ ♪ my father has an old guitar and he plays me folk songs ♪ ♪ there is nothing i want more than to play like him ♪ ♪ he goes to the basement and builds me a cookie tin banjo ♪ ♪ he builds me a cookie tin banjo ♪ ♪ the strings are made of rubber bands ♪ ♪ the strap is an old redneck

tie ♪ ♪ the body is a big round lid of a metal cookie tin ♪ ♪ when he plays his old guitar, i play my cookie tin banjo ♪ ♪ i play my cookie tin banjo right along with him ♪ ♪ the more we play together the more i fall in love with music ♪ ♪ and i realize that my banjo is a toy that i've outgrown ♪ ♪ i want something new and something real ♪ ♪ so he gets me a guitar to call my own ♪ ♪ then dad says to me on this fine afternoon ♪ ♪ let's sit on the stairs ♪ ♪ i'll teach you a tune ♪ ♪ he hands me a pick ♪ ♪ one that's little and black ♪

♪ he shows me the g chord ♪ ♪ i've never looked back ♪ ♪ now buried somewhere in the closet is my cookie tin banjo ♪ ♪ in my arms is my guitar, my greatest source of joy ♪ ♪ for the life that i have now, i'm grateful to my father ♪ ♪ who gave the gift of music to his boy ♪ ♪ and started with a simple homemade toy ♪ >> rose: animation. when you had cancer. i want to talk about two things other than your father. when you had the cancer, it gave you a sense of mortality and therefore a sense of urgency? >> i thought i was going to die. >> rose: yeah. even though i was told my odds were not bad at all. hodgkin's lymphoma even stage 4

is 85% curable. but i thought how likely is it to get cancer at all? of course i will be in the 15% that dies. so the first thing i did was go to the recording studio. i called my record producer and dear friend and started working on the record "the bridge" harder than ever because i wanted to leave something behind. >> rose: what is the ambition that you have, now that you have gotten rave reviews the london great reviews here for a personal story only you could tell and you've married music and storytelling what's next? >> one thing really important to me is to take the two loves i have which are making records and making theater and blending them. up until really recently, musical theater recordings, the recordings of a show have been done as a souvenir, inasmuch as they'll take the band and cast and record the whole show in one day and the hoe show is to tell the

record. there's a better way to do it. i think the record is there to sell the show, that the record can reach millions of people. you make a single of your song and music videos. any ten-year-old will tell us how do you listen to music? on youtube, online, with our ears and eyes. so i work to make the video for "the lion" and "the cookie banjo" and we're making a video for two other songs. i want to keep making records. >> rose: are they biographical. >> yes. >> rose: is there any part of you that says i'm glad i went through these trials of the relationship with my father, my girlfriend, with cancer because i've come out as a more

finely-tuned artist? >> i can't say -- >> rose: or you would say otherwise, it's not worth it? i could have been a fine artist without cancer, without having lost my father and girlfriend? >> it's difficult to say because we get the cards we're dealt and only those cards and i think wanting one thing and getting another and how we deal with that is the kind of person we are, and so i've had the unfortunate circumstance of losing a parent at an early age and being diagnosed with a very serious illness at an early age, and i felt the way i could get through it was to make art. i love making art about positive things, too. i don't think we need to have a bad time to make good art. i think the nature of dray pa drama is you want one thing and get another. the greeks knew that. i didn't invent that. but to be able to try and document something. i made a book called "between

two spaces." i was photographed once a week by a famous photographer and made a book for the lymphoma-leukemia society. >> rose: these are about you getting chemotherapy. >> yes, and quite intense images. there are texts from the journals i kept. one of the things i find most funny in a dark way is when i was 30 pounds underweight and gaunt and skinny, right before i started chemotherapy and i was very, very ill people would come up to me and say, you're so thin, you look amazing! this thing about new york. so i like the contradiction. my doctor told me as you get better on the inside you will look worse on the outside. i love that visual contradiction. >> rose: you say i could control to the tiniest detail what i wore, so the worse i felt the more care i put into the shine of my shoes, the knot

in my tie. another point, you said mother hugs me to feel my middle to find how much fat i have on me, it's highly annoying endearing, offputting. there are photographs of you some personal in chemotherapy showing you living with the cancer. >> yeah, the book is called "between two spaces" and it's to raise money for cancer research and on sale at between two spaces.com. >> rose: we asked you to bring your guitar. >> question indeed. >> rose: would you sing us something as we leave this scene? >> i sure will! this is a song from the show called "weather the storm." ♪ gather around children ♪

♪ come here to my side ♪ ♪ sit by the fire where it's warm ♪ ♪ i'll tell you something was once told to me about the way that we weather the storm ♪ ♪ it's not how long the rain falls or how hard the wind blows ♪ ♪ or how deep is the snow in the road ♪ ♪ nor the valance we fake when we feel the ground shake ♪ ♪ and we think our world will explode ♪ ♪ it's the hugs we give, it's the love that we live, it's the pride and the friendships we formed ♪ ♪ it's the courage we show ♪ ♪ facing things we don't know ♪ ♪ it's the way that we weather the storm ♪ ♪ if you try to stand tall but you slip and you fall ♪ ♪ and the earth is the sound of

the stars ♪ ♪ truth gets revealed when you're broken and healed ♪ ♪ every heart is made stronger by scars ♪ ♪ it's not how long the rain falls or how hard the wind blows ♪ ♪ or how deep is the rut in the road ♪ ♪ nor the balance we fake when we feel the ground shake ♪ ♪ and we think our world will explode ♪ ♪ it's the hugs that we give. ♪ ♪ it's the love we give, the friendships we form, the courage we show and the way we weather the storm ♪ ♪ so go on your journey be bold and brave ♪ ♪ be lions my boys and be strong ♪ ♪ and when it is such that it all feels too much ♪ ♪ then remember the words to

this song ♪ ♪ it's not how long the rain falls or how hard the wind blows or how deep is the snow in the road ♪ ♪ nor the balance we fake when we feel the ground shake ♪ ♪ and we think that our world will explode ♪ ♪ it's the help that we give ♪ ♪ it's the love that we give ♪ ♪ it's the pride and the friendships we form ♪ ♪ it's the courage we show facing things we don't know ♪ ♪ it's the way that we weather the storm ♪ ♪ it's the way that we weather the storm ♪ >> rose: benjamin scheuer at the culture project sunday through march 29th in "the lion." thank you for joining us.

visit us online at pbs.org and charlierose.com. captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org

>> rose: funding for "charlie rose" has been provided by: the coca cola company supporting this program since 2002. >> rose: additional funding provided by: >> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide.

this is "nightly business report" with sue herera. ready or not, fed chair janet yellin said a rate hike is likely this year even as economic growth remains cool. profit picture and it's not pretty. just how weak will corporate earnings be and what does it mean for investors? market monitor. a list of stocks he says could deliver double digit returns for you over the next year. all that and more tonight on "nightly business report" for friday, march 27th. good evening. gradual and conscious. that's how federal reserve chair janet yellin described the path ahead for interest rates that's become one of the biggest guessing gapes on wall street. in prepare for a conference call by the feder r