♪ good evening, and welcome to kqed "newsroom." i'm thuy vu. there is new video of a san francisco police shooting that killed a man last week. several officers fired at 26-year-old mario woods who the police department says was carrying a knife and was the suspect in a stabbing earlier in the day. we're going to show the new video. first, we want to warn you, it is disturbing. [ sirens ] [ bleep ] >> oh, my god! drop it! drop it! [ sirens ] >> drop it! just drop it! just drop it! just drop it, please!

[ gunfire ] >> oh, my god! oh, my god! oh, my god! oh, my god! >> what -- [ bleep ] >> did you shoot him? are you [ bleep ] serious? are you [ bleep ] serious? >> can i get off -- >> stay there! >> are you [ bleep ] serious? >> oh, my [ bleep ] god. >> oh, my god. [ sirens ] >> did you have to shoot him down [ bleep ] times? >> that video was released earlier today by john burris, the attorney representing woods' family. he filed a federal civil rights lawsuit against the police department this morning. joining me to discuss the shooting is dr. joel marshall, a member of the san francisco police commission. thank you for coming here. >> thank you. >> what is your reaction to the video? >> that is hard to watch. i'm telling you. wow. the other was hard to watch.

that one was even harder to watch. >> because -- >> it really hurts. well, i mean, it's -- to me, it's pretty evident, you know, he had a knife. he's closed off. he gets shot, gunned down. there's a bunch of other fire. my reaction from watching it, i think most people's reaction, doesn't make any sense. just doesn't make any sense the way that happened. >> is it excessive use of force? >> i feel all along -- the tough thing here is that -- even if it's in policy, it probably didn't have to happen that way. even if it's policy. that's the whole thing, it makes sense. probably to most people would say it's excessive.

i think clearly -- >> do you think it's excessive, though? >> i don't see -- well, there's a whole lot of things i think about it. maybe the whole thing is when one officer fired, the other officers had to fire on somebody with a knife, it doesn't make sense to me. i said that from the beginning, it doesn't make sense to me. everybody saying it, it didn't make sense to them. it looked excessive, it seemed excessive. my big issue is could something else have been done differently? should -- probably looking at it, something else should have been done differently. and if anything else couldn't be done differently under the way we currently operate, we have to change the way we operate. pretty straightforward to me. >> the police commission is reviewing the use of force policy. what changes do you think are needed? >> well, we've got to review what we -- we have to review what we do. shouting out. do things differently, do things

differently. i think the two things for me obviously -- for me, this is a knife, right? these are guns trained on a guy with a knife. not just one gun, many guns trained on a guy with a knife. why are we using gun tactics with somebody with a knife? that's the first thing. the second is, when one officer fires, all the other officers fire. to me, that's support fire. why are we using support fire on somebody who has a knife? he can't do anything to you. so he doesn't have a gun. he can't shoot you back. those are the two glaring things that need to be looked at. overall, our whole way we approach incidents. we need more of a deescalation mindset. we need a crisis intervention mindset. most folks who have seen this said the young man appeared under -- in stress, under duress, maybe some mental thing. why couldn't we bring -- my

thing is that crisis intervention trained offices available. could we not have used them more? it's a deescalation piece that we've got to get into. we've got to look at our training. we've got to look at everything. we've got to look at -- this begs to say, san francisco, you got to do things differently when it comes to use of force. >> and it's being said by a lot of people, at this week's police commission meeting, a lot of people were clearly angry at the police department. >> yeah. yeah. they should be. >> black people are still here. we may be less than 6%, but we're still here. and it's time for you guys to treat us with dignity and respect. you should not be leading this police department, you should be fired, chief, sir. [ applause ] >> should he be fired? >> i support the chief. i stead all along. >> you support him even now? >> yeah -- i do. well, this is a good chief,

number one. i've seen him do things, all the jobs he's gotten for young people. he developed a program this summer and paid interns, paid young people just to study the police department. that's all he's done. he paid them to do that. there's an officer in the bayview, bayview station, he wanted to take up to africa. he sanctioned that, and has helped with that. there have been a lot of things that he has done reaching out, trying to mend the breach between the community and the department. the issue is, this happened on his watch. >> and the issue also is -- >> all the good work that he's done is being undone by this incident. >> but the other issue also is this is not the only incident. this is the sixth officer-involved shooting this year. at least two incidents, the police department's accounts have come under scrutiny. we have the case of perez-lopez, who police said was lunging at

officers in february when they opened fire. two autopsies found that he was actually shot in the back. now this video and this newly released video today that -- sort of that you will contradicts what chief suhr said when he said mario wood was coming at one of the officers. you don't see that in this video. how concerned are you about these -- these inconsistencies that the chief is putting forth? >> i'm concerned -- this investigation's got to take place. they've got to decide if all these things are in policy. i'm concerned about the whole thing. i'm a community person. i work with young people. i bury young people. i don't like community violence, police violence. so i'm concerned. what the commission can do is change the policies. that's what we're trying to do is change the policies. we want to work hard at changing the policies. folks, when you lose a chief, you got to put another in. it takes six months to get a new

chief. all our efforts will be there. they need to be in -- developing these policies and procedures. what i know about this particular chief and all the work that he has done, i'm not advocating that. >> you've been on the police commission for 11 years. >> yeah. >> is this the worst crisis you've ever seen? we've seen lots of different crises in this city. we've seen problems with the crime lab. we've seen problems with racists and homophobic texts. is there a problem within the culture of the police department? is it the worst crisis you've seen? >> well, there's definitely problems. there's definitely problems. and as we find out there's problems, we address them. when i got on the commission, there was a backlog of cases. we've been able to address that backlog and get it down -- get it way, way down. we fired -- actually, dismissed several officers that we found -- the problem with the commission is we get things on the back end. there's a lot of things we need

to do. the policy is a big thing that we can address. this points out that we definitely have a problem with our policies, our procedures, and our training, and we're going to try and address that, absolutely. >> and i know that you're going to try to put out a document by january 3rd with recommendations. dr. joe marshall, thank you very much for coming in. >> thank you. in a primetime address to the nation this week, president obama once again calls for tougher restrictions on the sale of assault weapons. >> to begin with, congress should act to make sure no one on a no-fly list is able to buy a gun. what could possibly be the argument for allowing a terror suspect to buy a semiautomatic weapon? this is a matter of nurtd. we also need to make it harder for people to buy powerful assault weapons like the ones that were used in san bernardino. >> in the wake of that shooting, gun control is once again an issue in the presidential campaign with republican

candidates vowing to block any new legislation. here to discuss how the san bernardino attacks are affecting the political debate are kqed politics reporter teresa lagos, and editor for kqed's government and politics desk. welcome to you both. scott, to what extent is the control discussion affecting presidential politics? >> well, it is. we've had in the past few weeks through big events -- paris shootings, also the clinic, the planned parenthood shooting in colorado, and then most recently san bernardino. gunser, of course, a common thread. in the democratic primary, hillary clinton is using the gun control issue against bernie sanders really. he's been a little inconsistent on that issue. she did a tv ad about it although it didn't run a lot. she's gotten a lot of attention on that. she thinks it distinguishes her from bernie sanders on the democratic side. on the republican side, they're very much about supporting the first responders, wishing well the victims and families. but i think the big issue, the

overriding issue is terrorism. that's what's really affecting the presidential campaign. as these events have unfolded, you're seeing in the polls a decrease in support for gun control. at least nationwide and in places like new hampshire. so the candidates, donald trump in particular, are adjusting to that reality. >> it seems to be giving him a boost. trump in this case. there was a new "new york times" poll that came up. it says that lots of republicans favor him based on what they believe is strong leadership, even more so than honesty, electability, empathy, experience. >> yeah. i not as these things happen, people become afraid. they're worried about themselves and their families. they can see themselves in some of these situations -- at an office party, at a clinic, shopping at a mall or at a concert. it does make people more, in some cases, receptive to extreme things. we've seen it in france recently with the election there. so it's -- and it's playing out

especially on the republican side in the primary now. >> i think in general, the issue really is whatever hillary clinton says or the republican candidates say, there's little support in congress for gun control measures. i don't think whoever the next president is that we're going to see national action on this issue. not only because of the polls but because you have people across the nation booing -- very diverse districts where their constituents are saying we don't support this in certain places. and republicans control congress. >> in 2000, bill clinton said that al gore was hurt by the nra and the opposition to gun control. this time around, though, the pro-gun control groups are much better organized. so it's a little more nuanced. i think it's emboldened hillary clinton perhaps to step forward on this issue. and locally -- i know we'll talk about this, as well, but gavin newsom, too. >> that's a great point. what we've seen is some groups -- specifically the ones who are funded by former mayor bloomberg from new york, saying we're going to basically take a

page from the nra and organize more, in smaller sort of on the city level, on the state level. and i think so maybe in two years again when we're looking at congressional elections there could be a shift. i don't see in the near term that that's going to happen. >> even at the state level, for example, california where democrats control the state legislature, it's been a mixed bag. democrats tend to control -- tend to support gun control, and yet a few measures failed to pass. quite a few failed to pass. >> it is. and i looked at legislative records since twhec2011 when je brown took office. according to groups like the brady campaign gain gun violence that we have some of the strongest gun control laws in the nation. since 2011, there's been almost 100 gun measures introduced, some of those aren't necessarily gun control measures. governor jerry brown signed 28 of them. he's vetoed 13. and the legislature itself has killed another 28. and so it really is a mixed bag

there. and you know, there doesn't always seem to be a method to the madness in terms of the types of legislation that's getting through the legislature or not. >> no pattern to the democrats who are opposing certain measures? >> there is when you look at individual votes. i think that it's pretty common to see moderate democrats from more rural areas where there might be more gun owners join with republicans to vote against these bills. there's also been a number killed quietly by legislative leadership. whether that's because they're looking out for their members in tight races, because maybe it's not the year they see as taking that on as the issue, it's hard to say. those are sort of quietly pushed aside and not discussed about why they're killed. >> quickly, i think the top-two primary system we have has enabled more moderate democrats in particular to kind of get to that runoff in november. some of them are getting elected. i think that's where the fear of being challenged in a primary by somebody to the right who could do well in the general election in november. so you're seeing some of the decisions made in the legislature reflecting that, as

well. >> would any of the measures that failed have prevented the san bernardino attacks? >> i mean, i don't think anybody can say what something would prevent it. but there is a measure that's being talked about a lot that's being discussed as being revived next year. that would have potentially impacted some of this -- this was senate bill 347. it was by former pro tempore in the senate, gerald steinberg. tried to go after assault weapons, semiautomatic weapons that could be easily reloaded. we're talking about detachable magazines, bullet buttons. that was vetoed by governor brown. and you know, there's still a lot developing in the san bernardino case. we do know that several of the weapons that were acquired by the shooters through another party who had bought them legally were originally these types of semiautomatic weapons. they -- we think they were altered. but i think that that's something we're going to see in 2016 brought up in the legislature. i'm not sure it will get through there. the governor has been pretty lukewarm this week and last two week any new gun control. >> i think of gun control

sometimes as a little like campaign finance reform where as you plug one hole, the money or guns, they find their way around the loopholes. and you'll see efforts i think to plug some of these loopholes that do exist in california's laws which are pretty strict, at least relative to other states. >> it does feel a little piecemeal. the u.s. supreme court let stand a ruling, a chicago local government's ban on assault weapons. do you think this will encourage more cities to implement such bans, and how much of a difference would it make given that you can always drive to another state? >> exactly. and in fact, jerry brown from paris said that the la x gun control laws in states like arizona and nevada were a back door into california in talking about san bernardino and how difficult it is. unless you have nationwide rules, and each that, paris, it's tough to get guns in france, as well, the borders there are very easy now with the e.u. to get from one country to another. >> on the flip side of that, we have seen gun mortality rates

fall significantly in california over the past 20 to 25 years as we have enacted stronger gun measures of we have some success in cities like l.a. and san francisco with some of these measures. we are hearing lieutenant governor gavin newsom who did push stronger gun control measures in san francisco coming out with a proposal for a 2016 ballot initiative that would do a lot of the things we just discussed around making some of these semiautomatic weapons harder to turn into fully automatic weapons. he's also focusing on ammunition. so i do think that both the supreme court ruling and what happened in san bernardino and elsewhere in recent months is going to push areas where there is support for this to take their own action -- >> statewide, california has a relatively low gun ownership rate. even gun owners in california according to the field poll in the last couple of years shows that even gun owners have support for some measures that are aimed at limiting access to some of these semiautomatic weapons, for example. and in general, there's just a

lot of support statewide for things like taking guns away from felons who shouldn't have them, and, you know, background checks, and that sort of thing. >> i want to ask about something else, as well. senator dianne feinstein wants to require companies such as facebook, twitter, and youtube to report online activity related to terrorism to federal government officials. how would something like that work? >> well, senator feinstein of course has been very concerned about this issue and also encryption, a separate issue. we can talk about that if you want. senator feinstein has said the particular bill that she's co-sponsoring with republican senator from south carolina would not require these companies to do anything that they don't already do, but it would require them to report things that they see. so she's saying it isn't going require them to start looking for these things. as they come to their attention, that they would need to report them to law enforcement -- >> sort of like what's already in place for child pornography? when they find, they have to transport. >> the companies say they don't

want to be in the headlines about this. they're doing a lot of things quietly. a lot of silicon valley, too, is very libertarian. there's the whole edward snowden revelations resonates a lot in silicon valley among companies and also among users of technology, especially younger people. >> how are they responding? i would imagine they're not thrilled. >> i think they're feeling they're being scapegoated in a way. when you look at -- again, all the facts from san bernardino are still being investigated and rolled out. when we hear about, you know, people talking about immigration issues around this, on the republican side like donald trump, when you hear dianne feinstein introducing these measures because of one facebook post by one of the suspects, i think some people think, well, you're blaming us before all the facts are even here. you know, i think as scott said they don't want to be -- to seem as a problem in this situation. they also don't want to be pointed at as the only solution. >> yeah. yeah. >> obviously this is not the last we'll be hearing on either of these issues.

thank you both for coming in today. >> you're welcome. >> my pleasure. as you no doubt noticed, we got rain this week. any amount of rain is welcomed at this point given california's four-year drought. meteorologists say a lot more is on the way. paul rogers is managing editor for kqed science and environment writer for the "san jose mercury news." he has the latest el nino forecast. hi, paul. >> hello. >> what is that snoirk. >> well, we're not actually receiving el nino storms yet. the good rain that we got this week which, by the way, is going to continue through sunday and is really the beginning of the winter storm season, that was a storm that came from the gulf of alaska. sort of a typical california winter storm where we have cold air and wet weather coming in. el nino storms which are going to begin probably in january, so about a month, are warmer, and they come from hawaii. they're wetter and more frequent than the kind of storms we would get in a typical year.

>> where are the heaviest storms due to hit? is this going to be a long el nino that sticks around? >> yeah. el nino condition have been in the pacific ocean since march. and they don't really make storms come any earlier in the season. but nay sort of beef everything -- they sort of beef everything up. i've heard it described as winter on steroids. >> that does not sound good. >> no, it doesn't. we'll get to that. you get more storms which are wetter and more frequent. and so the meteorologists at noaa and the national weather service are saying based on their models, it looks like january, february, and march are going to be the real wet months. >> we often hear forecasters talk about the storm door is each. what does that mean exactly? >> what is means is the jet stream over the pacific ocean lines up in the right way so that we get a nice conveyor belt of storms moving one after another into california. what's happened as some astute weather watchers may remember, over the last four years of our terrible drought, is that storms have been blocked from coming to

california. they generate on the pacific ocean, and we've had this giant mass of high pressure air off the west coast. think of it as like a big mountain of dense air. four or five miles high. it's been there so long, it's been called the ridiculously resilient ridge. so storms hit that ridge, and like a wall, they don't come ashore. they go up into canada, they get cold air. and then they come back, and they've given places like chicago and new york, boston, tons of snow the last few years. they got our rain in the form of snow. but now, the ridge is gone, which is really -- >> for good? >> we don't know for good. it comes and goes. it's gone now. at least for now conditions are shaping up in ways that are different than the last few winters. not only are we beginning to get a nice, normal winter now with the gulf of alaska storms, but come january, it's going to be turned up to 11 as they said on "spinal tap" when the el nino weather arrives. >> how much rain needs to come

out of the spinal tap, as you said, to end california's severe drought? >> it's a lot. and it's interesting because the term "drought" is like the term "sill son valley." if you ask people where's silicon valley, no one can draw the boundaries on a map. where is big sur? no one knows exactly. it's just down there. droughts are like that. in california there are lots of ways to measure drought. a lot of scientists and water folks disagree, but once the reservoirs are full, the drought is over. you can't tell people to conserve water when we have so much pouring to the ocean we can't stop it. some people believe we have to make up the entire rainfall deficit over the last four years. that would be like a year and a half extra rain on top of a normal year. we're not going to be able to do that in one year. you could have all-time record rainfall and flooding -- which is what we saw in '97, '98? >> right. the last time we saw conditions this strong was '97, '98. san francisco received 47 inches of rain.

most rain since 1861. it was 230% of normal. more than double. los angeles also received more than double. but what's important is the timing of that rain. we didn't have a lot of flooding in 1997/'98. it wasn't the worst flooding year in california history because the rain was spaced out. >> so is that why in '82 when there wasn't as much rainfall and we also had an el nino, the amount of damage was actually greater than '97 and '98? >> yeah. that's one of the reasons. another factor is called atmospheric river storms. we hear people talking about pineapple expresses. these are super most mississippi rivers of water coming in from the tropics. and those hit like a fire hose in specific places. so, if you have one of those, you can literally get ten inches of rain in one day. that happened, you know, in '82 when we had big mudslides in the santa cruz mountains that killed a lot of people. it actually happened in

1994/'95. one of the worst flood years in california history. timing really is everything. what we want is lots of wet weather, maybe two storms a week, three storms a week, with a little breathing room in between. so the creeks can go back down, the ground is k soak some of it up. so we don't overwhelm the storm system. >> and the damage can be pretty devastating. looking back at '82, '83, millions in damage, 36 deaths. who do governments and residents need to do to prepare for this sghelg. >> i think what is important for folks to do is clear the gutters in their homes, trim trees that could fall on your house. get new windshield wiper blades. guess new fires you've got old, bald tires. you don't want to be hyper planing. if you live near a creek, know where to get sandbags. get battery-operated radios, those kind of things. remember, in these jientd storms, we have have power outages that last for a day or two in neighborhoods. we shouldn't panic but should be prepared.

we haven't seen an el nino this strong in 20 years. the last time did, it really rained. >> cities and counties are beefing up shelter plans -- >> clearing storm drains. >> the department of transportation, caltrans is going to have additional stampt i wanted to ask about global warming, as well. is there a connection between el nino and global warming? >> not really. el ninos sort of a natural phenomen phenomenon. all that it is is when the water that is normally warm, the equator by asia, is moved along the equator because the trade winds change direction. when the warm water moves closer to us, it triggers changes in the jet stream and atmosphere. there are theories that as the climate begins to warm, some of the big mac row factors will change. we would have el nino regardless of climate change. >> a reservoir of knowledge. >> fill the reservoirs -- >> pun intended. paul, thank you very much. >> thank you. >> thank you for watching. i'm thuy vu. for all of kqed's news coverage,

please go to kqednews.org. ♪

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