>> rose: welcome to the program. we begin this evening with an analysis of what happened on supertuesday. we talk to dan balt, reverend al sharpton, dan senor and maggie haberman. >> because of what trump is saying, imagine people of color, imagine people that are poor that need their social security and other things that are facing the reality, wait a minute, this goi can be in the white house my build a wall, or really take these things from me. and that fear and anger is going to be just as real as what trump is tapping into. >> we conclude this evening with the continuation of our conversation with tim cook of apple and our question, what makes apple apple. >> our goal is customer experience. and so the profit ability is the

end result. it's a side benefit. but the important thing is to put the customer front and center. and to make the apple store a place to explore and discover new product. a place to go get help when you need help. and so that the genius part came out of that. a place to go in and maybe you want to sit through a seminar. maybe you want to know how a movie is made. maybe you're curious. maybe you want to learn how to write an app. and so it's a place to go learn. >> rose: a review of supertuesday, and a conversation with tim cook recorded in september of 2015. funding for charlie rose is provided by the following. >> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide.

from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. we begin this evening with politics, donald trump and hillary clinton came closer to securing their party's nominations yesterday. supertuesday saw both candidates win victories in seven states. in speeches last night the two contenders look towards november. >> and we know we've got work to do. but that work, that work is not to make america great again. america never stopped being great. (cheers and applause) >> we have make america whole. we have to fill in. >> we are going to make america great again, folks. we're going to make it great again. and you know, i watched hillary's speech and she's talking about wages have been poor, and everything is poor,

and everything is doing badly. but we're going to make it. >> she's been there for so long. i mean if she hasn't straightened out by now, she's not going to straighten it out in the next four years, it's just going to become worse and worse. she wants to make whole again, i'm trying to figure out what that is all about. make america great again. it's going to be much better than make america whole again. >> rose: ted cruz managed to beat trump in texas, oklahoma, a alaska. marco rubio won in minnesota fueling doubts about his candidacy as he marchs to florida. last night senator lindsay graham discussed the dilemma facing the republican party. >> so there is no way you seem to be suggesting at the convention or before the convention to stop donald trump from being the nominee? >> short of a major scandal probably not. if marco doesn't win florida, i done know how he goes forward. if kasich doesn't win-- we may in be a position we have to

rally around ted cruz is the only way around donald trump and i'm not so sure that would work. >> rose: but you would recommend in order to stop donald trump, rally behind ted cruz. >> i can't believe i would say yes, but yes. >> rose: joining me from washington is dan bald, reverend al sharpton of the national action network, dan senor is a former advisor to mitt romney and maggie haberman is from "the new york times" and cnn you recall i'm pleased to have all of them on this program. let me begin with you in washington. so where is the republican party after supertuesday? >> it's in total disarray right now. it is-- by factionalism. the establish sment desperate to try to find a way to stop donald trump. they don't have an agreed upon strategy. they don't have an agreed upon candidate to do it and they're clearly running out of time. they have about two wokes to begin to put a stop trump operation into place. and i don't think there's any single person or small group that can do it i mean

this-- this is the market place of democracy. and it's hard to coral that if you are the establishment right now. >> dan, "the new york times" said today the democrats are falling in line. and the republicans are falling apart. >> yeah, i agree. but i don't-- i disagree partly with dan that i don't think it's just the establishment that is spooked. i done even know what the establishment is at this point on the republican side. voters, on average about 65% of republican primary and caucus voters on average are voting for someone other than donald trump. so it is true that donald trump is winning. but there seems to be major resistance in many of these states against trump. now if there were any other candidate, we would all ignore that and say he's winning, he's the momentum, he's going to be the nominee it is only because there is so much resistance which i think exists at the grass roots and among elites, conservative elites that people are pulling their hair out trying to find an alternative. which means if trump continues on the path that he is and can't get in a more upward tra

jectory, i think will have a long slog to the convention and we could have a mesesy convention this summer-- summer. trump will be there, i can't tell you with confidence that he will be the nominee. >> rose: there's also this. do we know that you will a those voters who are scroating against with another candidate might not impart go-to donald trump? >> they might. i think it's unlikely i think at this point if are you not with donald trump t is hard to see why you would go to him. i think it is like leer you could see ted cruz get out and have his votes split into various camps, either to rubio or donald trump but this argument that you know exactly where somebody's votes are going to go has never made much sense. >> rose: donald trump came in first or second in almost every race he ran. >> he did, there were a couple of points last night there is no question he had a very strong night but there is also no question as dan says that it looks like this is going to be a slog. counting on john kasich winning ohio and counting on marco rubio winning florida both on march 159. if you looked at oklahoma and

arkansas, this is something the club for growth, the antitax group made a big thing about last night, but they have a point. those are the two states where they spent money on aads against donald trump and those are the two states where he came in noticeably below 35%. >> and late decides went for rubio. >> that's right. >> the exit pollk shows that republican primary voters including the ones that voted for trump and definitely the ones that didn't know very little about trump university, very little about trump mortgage, the now de funk trump mortgage. know little about what he said about kkk and david duke. what you are about to see in the next couple of weeks is tens of millions of dollars will be spent by independent groups educating the republican electorate in key states about these things, about these issues. it will be interesting to see how trump holds up when he's getting under a barrage of attacks that he has not been subjected to yet. he's the only republican in moderate history who has got then far without having gone through the cruisable of tens of millions of dollars of attack ads waged against him. >> not just against him but

without spending any money on his own message in a concerted way. he has done the bare minimum of advertise on his own. >> democrats are looking and hillary clinton has already turned to a national campaign in turns of the way she is reactingment what can you say about, from your perspective, would be a tougher candidate to face, donald trump or some of the other republicans? >> i think that donald trump would probably energize a huge turnout for mrs. clinton. i think we shouldn't understiments though the impact of her win. because the whole rumor about she could not make certain the fields including young voters was put to rest. she won young black voters. she won turnout in the black community, latino community. and i think the media got carried away with saying that sanders had all of this with

young voters it didn't happen in states of color. there is only one there it is almost all white state. and i like a lot of what is said, but it has not resonated across-the-board. you have to give hillary credit for that in both south carolina, nevada and then last night. but i think what trump does is drive that boat out even more. because the turnout among democrats has been lower than the republicans. the fear of what trump represents and the fact that he is so graphicically offensive to many of the interests that many of us believe in, i think would bring obama-like numbers out, lines to the polls if he is the nominee. >> why didn't you endorse her? >> i haven't endorsed anyone because what i wanted to do is what i have been doing. advocate on issues rather than be a sur gat for a candidate. at some point i may choose to do that. >> would you urge bernie sanders to drop out now? >> i would urge people to

exercise-- i ran in '04. nobody could tell me when to drop out. i would never urge anyone to drop out but i would say that he has a longer road now. ve him credit.at you have got to that if he had not been in the race, we would not be discussing a lot of the things we're discussing. and i think he's made an impact in terms of the whole american political process. so i. >> he is not going negative. he's not going personal. he's not going-- on these important issues. i would give policywises, i think he an mrs. clinton have given a lesson to dance party on how to have a dignified campaign. >> john said an interesting thing last night or early in which he said people in the civil rights movement didn't really know him, hadn't seen him at meetings. >> you know, i'm all about a generation or half a generation behind john louis. and i'm from new york. i have not seen him in new york. when i had breakfast with him in harlem, the big publicized breakfast, what i said is if you

marched 50 years woog dr. king, that's great. but i was nine years older. and when he did what he did with reverend jackson's campaign, that was po years ago. let's talk about from this century, senator sanders. let's talk about all of the issues that we have fought from police brutality in new york, where you were born, all of these issues, where have you been. so i'm not even going with john louis. i'm saying let's just talk about this century. and i think that he's been right on the issues but i can't say that i've seen him out there marching or doing the things that we're talking about in the last 15 to 20 years. >> how much pressure is there from whatever corridor to get in line and support, to say to your fellow republicans, it's over. we cannot stop donald trump. he's demonstrated appeal, we might as well try to make an accommodation. >> none. >> none? >> very little. i-- what you are seeing is pressure on other candidates to get out so that it will be

koition of the anti-trump vote. >> rose: nobody wants to follow what chris christie did and said. >> i think chris christie is the exception. i'm supporting rubioment i see people pressures case-- kasich to get out. i see cruz supporters telling rubio he should get out. there is a sense if we consolidated behind one candidate we could have a one-on-one race and the majority of that 65% voting against trump could get behind one person. i think a key point being made in these discussion sses that on principle we should be-- republicans should be against trump for all the obvious reasons. but also electorally, he would be a disaster. >> rose: are the things that reporters know and talk about but have not been made public with respect to donald trump? >> i think that there is lots of back history about donald trump that has not necessarily been written about recently. >> rose: why? >> a, because the volume of time we would spend at-- that everyone would spend in terms of he has an enormous business record. he has an enormous record in public life, of things he has

said. i think "the new york times" has done a pretty good job at looking at his history. and i think that a lot of other people are starting to as well. i do think that you are going to start seeing his opponents talking about that a lot more. i think there say difference between, the media has been doing reporting in terms of his background. >> rose: atlantic stirks everything else. >> sure, lots of it and his voters have not cared. there has been a difference between what the media has been doing and what other can the das were doing. >> dan, why has he been so successful? >> for the reasons we've been talking about for several months. there is a dissatisfaction and alienation among a part of the electorate. some of it is the dissatisfaction with republican leaders in washington for not carrying out the promises. some of it is grounded in the economic realities of our time. and the degree to which there are a lot of people who have been left behind by globalization. and he has struck a cord on that, whether it's on issues of immigration or trade or just in

general the idea that the country hasn't done what it ought to have done for a long period of time, democrat or republican. and you know, i am sure maggie gets the same kind of e-mails i get from people who are supporting trump and who talk about how dissatisfied they are with all, you know, with all institutions, with establishment, however you want to de fine it. and that's what he's been able to tap into. >> and to your question, dan is exactly right. to your question about sort of the impact of our looking at his background or reviewing his business record and so forth, a lot of his supporters believe that every institution is corrupt including the media. so the e-mails i get are you're lying, that's not true. whatever you are saying is dishonest. trump is happening, you're just trying to stop it his spoforters are-- many of them, enormously disaffected. i think there has been a tremendous sort of psychic break within the country, with voters on both sides. you're seeing it a lot in the

republican base who feel that after the fiscal crisis, after a number of erosions of trust with your government, with your elected officials, with politicians, and that is reflected, a lot, in trump supporters. and there is no sort of union fying ideology which is one of the things that is interesting about his supporters. it's not breaking down along these lines but there are these unifying themes of anxiety. >> if there is a philosophy it is an being an outside irof institutions. >> my defense of the trump voters, not for trump. have i been on the seeferring enin the last couple of days when i said i wouldn't vote for trump. i know the intensity of some of these activists but most of his voters, he is a vessel for them am when he says i'm going to keep muslims out, i actually don't think a majority of his supporters really want to keep muslims out. i think it is a vessel for saying darn t i'm scared. do something about security. we're worried about the security of the homelandment when he says i'm going to build a wall, i'm not convinced people tallly think will build a wall, but it's like we kant competent

tense in government, in our institutions, so he becomes a vessel to address these issues that are broader than the he very specific anecdotes to these problems that he is proposing. so i think what creative leaders, creative policy making, i think you can win over a lot of his voters. and i think they will be more open to that once they start getting educated about some of the things in his history that i think people are going to start learning about. >> i think that is the flaw. i think what the republicans should not have done and the democrats should not do in the fall is try to turn his voters around. they should be going to the electorate saying this is what this man is saying, what it would do to you. and bring out your voters. cuz i don't think you're going to turn around a lot of the trump voters. but i think you bring out your crowd. i think if they had concentrated, rather than than underestimate the impact that he was making, address the issue

that he was touching upon, which were resonating but say but he can't deliver on this, i can. and here's why. and i think if they had run that way, they may have been more successful. i personally think the best thing for many of us, that believe that government has a responsibility to protect people is to run against trump. you wouldn't have a greater contrast on how to govern america than to have someone like miss clinton or sanders facing trump. >> you're not that thrilled about the american establishment yourself. >> according to who, who de fines the establishment. because according to trump, a barack obama is the establishment but according to many of us that supported him, he was able to take the establishment and establish something different. so we first have to de fine who is going to de fine what the establishment is. in his mind the establishment was barack obama who he says wasn't born here. so i mean i think that we've got to really wrestle with the power of definition. because his idea of

establishment and mine is two different things. a guy with a gold plated building on fifth avenue that has his kind of background is much more establishment to me than i am. >> you met him in that gold plated building on fifth avenue. >> yes, i have and i marched on that gold plated building on fifth avenue. >> have you ever been on that yacht? >> no, i was never invited. >> so dan-- . >> rose: me either. >> and i bet you won't northbound the future either, chances are slim. >> i would be afraid to go in the water with him at this point. >> rose: i mean dan, in the end, are the republicans get the candidate that he they deserve because the republican, they is have sort of said it will take care of it sevment and it didn't take care of itself. it grew and grew and grew. >> it did. everybody underestimated him or almost everybody underestimated him. charlie, i continue to have faith that the democratic process produces what people

want. >> rose: me too. >> and it is a messy process and we are heading toward a very, what i would call nasty and ugly general election. you know, almost no matter who the nominees are but if it is a trump-clinton general election, it's going to be one for the ages in terms of the brackishness that we see coming forward. but-- people get an understanding of these candidates. i know that television ads can make a difference but i think that the way the media operates today, people get a better understanding and draw their conclusions more from how they respond to a candidate. as new information is introduced on donald trump, it may have an effect on some voters and perhaps enough to deny him the nomination. but a lot of people proand con have made a judgement about him and about the message he's offering. and if he ends up as the republican nominee, i think the republican party will have to say what was wrong with the rest of the party. >> rose: that's the point i

raised. >> right. if he is the nominee, i think this will be over before it began. i just think, he will guarantee the obama coalition basically is there for hillary clinton. because you know, so romney, romney, obama got of 5 million votes last time, romney got 61. romney starts in the hole, 4 million. where is he going to get votes, this is going to be like mondaydale in 84y or goldwater in '64. it will be a complete wipeout and i think it will be obvious before labor day. >> rose: there say big piece in your paper about how the clirch ton campaign is gearing up with a lot of negative stuff on him. but it quoted or someone said that bill and hillary think it's going to go right down to the end, a battle against trump if he is the nominee. >> uh-huh. >> that they're not so quick to say this will be a cake walk. >> i think that they are mindful of the fact-- i think there are two things. number one i think they are both, particularly bill clinton are mindful of the fact that he

is tapping into a lot of, number one, organic anger and number two that he has enormous support among white working class voters who have been a problem for democrats recently. number one. number two, he is totally unpredictable. he will say anything. so remember, when she was attacking him and using him as a punch line at one point, late last year, donald trump started saying things that republicans sort of stayed away from for years and years and years, behavior about sex gait, monica lewinsky and so forth. and other women. and she stopped talking about donald trump after that. so hillary clinton is sort of a con sum at color within the line player as a politician and that is not what donald trump. is so i think that is an x factor. >> rose: will hillary's campaign be about competent tense and experience. >> i think it will be about some competent tense and experience, i'm not speaking for them, but from what i observed. and i also think it is going to

be about some serious policies and about the role of government. i think that, i agree with all of the panel tonight that trump has tapped into a real anger. but i think what hillary clinton, if she is the nominee will tap into is people that will be afraid that government will be taken out of my life to protect me, and to really make sure that my kids are educated. because of what trump is saying, imagine people of color, imagine people that are poor, that need their social security and other things, that are facing the reality. wait a minute, this guy can be in the white house, and really de port me or really build a wall, or really take these things from me. and that fear and anger is going to be just as real as what trump is tapping into. >> in the end, do you think the republican party could come out of this split in a significant way so that like it did after the republican convention in san

francisco in 1964, it's a very different party? >> i think that's possible, charlie. i'm not quite clear there yetment but i think that there are enough elements sitting out there that has to be something that people consider. you know, we thought that this was going to be a war between really in a sense what cruz represents and what rubio represents. two very different views of what the republican party in the future ought to be. donald trump's candidacy has scrambled that in ways that very few people would have anticipated. and yet as you look at it, it creates an instability within that coalition that it is going to last beyond the convention. it could last beyond the election depending on how it comes out. so i think the question about the future of the republican party is one of the very overriding questions of this election. >> thank you, dan. thank you, maggie, thank you, dan. thank you, al. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> we'll be right back. stay with us.

>> rose: we conclude this evening with part two of our conversation about apple. what makes apple apple. tonight a conversation with tim cook, the c.e.o. about new products including the apple watch. >> the apple watch. >> yes. >> it's on your wrist. >> yes. >> rose: is that your baby? >> is it my baby? you know, there were lots of people that had a lot to do with this. i absolutely love the product. and i am all in on it. i think, you know, i talked to a kid a few weeks ago. a senior in high school that got a watch, wearing it during football practice, noticed that his heart was elevated. you know, most of us don't wear heart moniters because you put a strap across your chest, nobody wants to do that. and so very few people moniter their heart rhythm. he happened to see that his was a bit high, 140.

he happened to mention it to the trainer. who sent him to a doctor who tells him he would have died the following day on the football field, yes, if it hadn't been discovered. so you begin to see the power of what wearing something. >> rose: wearable devices. >> can do. and this is not just one person that i know that found this. it is now many. and so between that and the motivation of stapping you every hour so that you become more active, of measuring whether you've got your 30 minutes of exercise, or whether you are achieving your active calories for the day, these things are incredibly motivating. and you don't to-- you don't really want to let yourself down, so to speak, and not close these rings. and so i love that-- i love the health and fitness portion of it. i think it's a game changer. >> rose: a game changer. >> a game changer for people's

health. i think that the idea of you taking more responsibility for your own health, so many of us when we get sick we go to the doctor. the doctor writes some prescription. you go take a pill, hopefully you get better. this psych sell not a great cycle. we're all going to be better off if we take our own responsibility for our health. and this device helps you do that. by doing some of the things that are most critical of getting you to move and become more active. >> rose: but it's not easy one said this is a piece of hardware spoiled by complicated software. >> i think the health and fitness piece is really simple. it's really simple. hopefully you are using it yourself. i think it's really simple. i think paying with a watch is so simple. with two clicks you can see my credit card right there. and if i were near a register right now, i would do this and i

would pay for something. you can imagine going through a transity-- . >> rose: but is it depending on whether that store is has. >> they have to have nfc, yes. and however, increasingly people do. you know, we just announced starbucks the other day. huge company with people going there, you know, many times a week, including me. we announced some other companies along with starbucks. and in fact, we've announced walgreen's and cvs and our deeply into many of the online properties as well. so pretty much you can go out to eat. you can go get your pharmaceuticals at the pharmacy, you can go to the grocery store. i pay for whole foods with the watch every week. increasingly more grocery stores are sieng up. and so in the short period of time you will wind up using this

every day. i can't-- i don't know the day that i don't use mine. i mean it's that frequent now. and i live in the valley. so that is a help. but more and more people will add it, in the u.s. because of people-- because the requirement on the merchants to put in chip and pin they're having to change their terminals anyway. so most of those are incorporating nfc as a part of that. >> rose: is this what you thought about when you began to develop it? >> we always thought that paying was a big deal. and the idea of eliminating the wallet always appealed to us because it's something else you have to carry with you. you know, we would like to eliminate your key, your wallet, so that the only things you have to carry are your-- the only thing you really car is he your smart wamp, or excuse me your smartphone and hopefully you're wearing your apple watch. >> no wallet. >> why would you have it, the old days would you have pictures

of your family in the wallet. now they ron the phone. the credit card is on the watch. so we have to get the drivers' license, we're not finished yet on this road. it's a journey. >> okay so that is my point. you know, has the initial reaction in your judgement been a homerun? or has it been mixed. >> i wouldn't describe it as mixed at all. we are ahead of where i thought we would be at this point in time. when you're dealing with millions of merchants, they're all not going to change their terminals overnight. so there is a journey to displace everything. >> it is connected to apple pay. >> yes, absolutely. >> another product. >> another product, another great have it in the u.k. as well. and we'll be rolling it out to other countries in the next several months. >> how long did it take to develop this? and when did you decide we have got it right? >> yeah, you know, it took

years, truth. and my iphone is over here, but you know that touch i.d. >> sure. >> so touch i.d. >> with the iphone close to you. >> touch i.d. was the town daition of apple pay because you needed to authenticate with-- authenticate with your fingerprint. we knew that going in and launching apps, et cetera, is not a great payment kind of experience. so we wanted to make it simple. so if you want to pay with your phone, you just use the phone and touch touch iflt dvment and boom, you're done. and so with the watch it even gets simpler than that. you just hold your hand up like this and you pay for it. so we started working on this really back several years before we launched it. it takes year to do something this shall-- . >> rose: can that can balancize the e phone even though it's depend ent on it now? >> could it can balancize the iphone. >> rose: you've thought about it i can tell when an idea. >> the great thing about-- .

>> rose: has caused to you-- i have to edit myself. >> yeah, we don't worry about can balancization, is the truth. i mean people, when we put out-- . >> rose: no? >> we don't. when we came out with the ipad everybody would say it will can balancize the mac, why are you doing that. when we came out with the iphone people said oh my god t will can balancize the ipod, why are you doing that. so with everything we do, people automatically worry that can balancization. our view is if somebody is going to cani bal iez, i want it to be us. >> it is okay as long as you cannibalize yourself. >> exactly. and if you don't, someone else will. so we're all about making great product. >> rose: think future for me. >> yes. >> rose: this future here, rather than here? >> i think for as long as the eye can see, people will have both. >> cuz you can shall-- you can talk to people on the phone. >> you can. you can.

and i do. i send 08% of my messages from here now using voice. i take phone calls from here. and i think people increasingly do that that even more over time. >> and this opens up a major area for you which is the medical world. >> it does. >> it gives you a connection between patient and censors that information. >> yeah. >> an that's when you look at how much of the american budget has been on health care, about 18%. >> enormous. >> this is your key to getk your part. >> this is us getting into what i would call the wellness piece of this. but it's clear as we start pulling the string, it's leading us to other places. and so i know you're talking to some of the folks, you're talking to jeff about research later in the week, right. research kit was a matter of getting into health, and beginning to pull the strings

and understanding what's missing in this. and honestly, we find that field to be incredibly interesting to be because it's all hosed off. it's perfect for a company like apple to come in and try to make things simple and elegant. and so you know, we'll see where this takes us. >> so as apple looks at the future, one thing it does, it looks at places where simplicity and elegance can make a difference. >> yes. >> that's one of the things you believe you bring to the table. >> yes. >> better than anybody else. >> yes. where we can do something better, that is simple and elegant. >> as long as the technology is under. >> in many cases we develop the technology. and so if you look at the engine that powers the iphone and the i pad, we designed the engine. we don't go out to somebody else and do it. we have thousands of engineers that are working on advanced

silicon. >> you talked about how. and with the iphone it got better. how is the watch going to get better? >> that i will keep to myself. cuz i don't want to tell anybody else about it. >> rose: listen, here is the great yvmentd you don't want to tell anybody else, you say. about my idea. >> yeah. >> i'm going to keep it secret. >> yeah. >> in the next breathe you say nobody can do it like we can do it. nobody can do it like we can do it, you don't have to keep it secret. >> wellness . >> rose: cuz they can't compete, in your own words. >> yeah, yeah. people try to get as close as possiblement you can draw your own conclusions whether-- . >> rose: you're trying to talk your way out of this. >> i'm making a point that if i give you the road map for the watch, and what we have planned for that, it tells, it fires the starting gun for everybody else

earlier, that if i keep it a secret and then come out with it. >> in other words you have a longer lead time. >> i have a longer lead time. and i would like to protect that >> you're trying to get me on every turn. i love you, charlie. >> rose: i mean, i paid money for this watch. i want to know what i can expect. >> it's going to get better. just last month we released the new os that reanies-- the apps actually run to from your wrist, they don't depend on your phone. and that will unleash significant invasion of the developer community. that was-- honestly one of the key drivers of the whole ecosystem for iphone was when we did that. so we think that's huge.

even. >> to program it from your iphone. >> you still depend on the sell lar connection from the iphone, yes. but the apple actually runs on the watch. it's taking advantage of the system on a chip that we designed that is in the watch. >> does this iphone, i mean apple watch, does it have the potential in your judgement to be as significant a contributor to apple as the iphone? >> i think it has the potential to be huge. i'm not going to forcast, you know. >> but it's of that dimension. >> it's huge. >> if it's not 60% of revenue, maybe. >> it's huge. it has the potential to be huge. >> that's the big bet. >> it ised big bet on the part of apple that this can deliver way yondz what we might have imagined from a smart watch. >> sure. because we, when we place our emphasis on something, we not only decide what we're working on, but it means we didn't work

on something else. and so there's an opportunity cost of doing that. so we are a big believer in wearable technology and the risk in particular and apple watch in particular. >> when you fail, i'm not sure this say failure, but some thought it was. apple maps, how do you look at a failure? >> it was a learning experience. we did fail. it was a failure. we put out a product that didn't meet our own expectations and our own standards. >> why? how? >> it was a mistake. >> it was a mistake. i'm not going to come up with an excuse. >> okay. >> it was just-- it was a mistake. >> but did it cause you to question the process? >> it causes you to be deeply

introspective about why. >> it causes you to ask all those questions and try to make sure it never happens again. it is not the first time we failed. it won't be the last. i'm not naive enough to think we're never going to screw up again. >> if you don't fail you're not growing. >> yeah, that's-- and so i think you have to take it in context. but we disappointed our customers and we do not like that. >> did you disappoint yourself? >> we disappointed ourselves immensely. and it was not up to our standards. and now since then that product got really great. and i'm really proud of it. but we did shoot off our legs. >> rose: people said how fast can i get back to google maps. >> what we actually suggested they use other products. we suggest it ourselves.

and because we-- we are honest. we are intellectually honest. we could look in the mirror and say we screwed up. let's go do the right thing by our customers and help them. >> i bet this was a big topic at a monday morning meetingk want it. >> it was more than one monday morning. that one lasted for awhile. >> rose: then there is apple music which is also something new. itunes changed the face of music. >> yes. >> rose: apple music can't do that, because you've already got spotify and everything else. all you can do is find a place or not. >> i think music, is sort of deep in apple's history. >> you changed it. >> we did. >> and you had a founder who loved music. >> and we still have many people here who love it.

and we view-- music has really moved culture. you know, it has pushed culture. and we would like it to push it again. >> rose: it you were approximates politics and revolution. >> it does. it does great things. and it also inspires us into action or maybe inspires us to go workout or whatever our thing may be. so music does a lot of things. and what we saw was people's purchasing on music is going down. and people are-- some people are getting music free. and you know, some of those things will probably continue. but there's also people that want a wide variety of music, a broad rang. and they won't cureation, human cureation. not cureation by zeros and ones. and this was something that we saw in beat. it was sort of the-- they had

the idea, and they were putting it into practice, that human curation was very important. that the next song was a very important thing in terms of how you feel. that the sequencing. and so there are things that computers can do. and things that humans can do. this is something that requires both. and if you only do it with machines, i think you wind up not with the feeling that you do if it's human curated. and dj vs known this for a long time. that is-- they're thinking about their sequencing of songs, et cetera. >> they get paid a lot of money. >> they get paid money to do it, clearly. but you do feel different and you should feel great when someone is really putting. >> curating it. and so we're doing that on a broad basis. >> will it have the same impact at itunes? >> i think it will over time, over the arc of time it will have a broader impact than itunes.

>> because-- says what you are doing there is bringing it all together. >> we are. , you know, we're bringing-- we're artists can interact with their fans, and where they can release things that are not in the formal sense of the whole song, fans can go there and listen to those things. they can go listen to music. they can get these incredible play lists. you should really listen to it. they're really, really great. you can get all the music in the world there, essentially. and we're seeing-- we're seeing people being really satisfied with it. we've had, as you know, we started the energy. we've gave people 90 days for a free trial. and we're just seeing now the first people coming off of that free trial into the paid service and feel really great about how things are going. >> so they the returns from the free trial are pretty good.

>> they're exceptional. we are just a week into it. >> and the test is their commitment. >> exactly. exactly. >> you know, think about the problems of music today. it's very hard to discover new artists. and for-- we, before itunes, we were driving around in our cars and we were listening to the same five cd thas were in our cd changer over and over and over again. would you never replace a cd. i am not sure why we wouldn't but none of us did, hardly. you just listened to the same songs. before that it was the walkman and it was one cd. well, now over time what occurred was with itunes and purchase music, is that most people begin to just listen the same music over and over again. it is sort of like if you were in your industry, it's like watching the same news and participating in the ecochamber of things you already think.

instead of listening to some of your interviews and getting challenged by thinking about them in such a way. music is like that too. and so you really want to go to a music service in my view apple music is the best, that gets you to broaden what you are listening to. >> introduce you to new horizons. >> absolutely. and you want new artists to do fantastic. we need new artists. >> rose: turning to video and apple tv. >> yeah. >> rose: there are those who believe that video is a new battleground. you talk about television as being locked in the '70s. you made an announcement about apple tv, essentially giving new powers to siri and changing the set box a little bit people raise interesting questions as to when is apple going to start

creating more content. they worry about getting the netflix online, tell me how you an apple see the future of television and your roll in it. >> we see that the future of television is apps. and specifically we think that people want to watch their content when they want to, on the device they want to, and where they want to, not be a slave to the tv guide. and so we think that linear tv over time will erode. and so when people want to watch charlie rose interview, they will just ask siri, show me the charlie rose interview. several pay come up. yoursyours from pbs. you may have something on 60, you ma have something on

bloomberg, on cbs, on the morning show. all of those might pop up and i will select the one i want but the point is i may have been told at work about a great charlie rose interview but i don't know which one of those you are on all for, right sometimes the same one is on but sometimes they're unique as well. so i would like it to come back and show me those. search has to be incredibly easy and at a different level of detail then what is commonly thought of today. today i might need to know the show name but i might not know. i might know it by you instead of the show. and so we've made discovery on apple trk v incredibly easy. we've made input go from moving around really crazy on-- picking letters from the alphabet to making it by boy, an we're down into the metadata to be able to search the metadata. i might want-- i might want to

watch films by my favorite actress. i might want to watch a comedy one night. i might be in the mood for comedy. i will say show me the latest comedies. and so you know, today we have an enormous amount of content. we only have 700 channels. but we don't have anything to watch. because we don't have the time to go through 700 channels on channel search. >> sounds look a great bruce spring steen song, dnt it. >> it does. but it's so true though. you think about it. and so we're trying to take all of that clutter away and make it simple. >> and how long will it take to you do that. >> well, i think in the beginning we've got netflix, hulu, showtime, hbo. >> rose: today. >> that will be searchable when we start shipping in a couple of weeks. they will be on there. i think others will rapidly come. and if we can do something to be a cat list for that, we'll do

it. and. >> rose: what does that mean, if we can be a cat list for that, we'll do it. >> meaning if we can see a way to get the world to move in this direction faster by playing more of a role, we will do it. and in particular, charlie charlie, think about today the presidential de baits is tomorrow night. it would be great instead of having a focus group of a hundred people, come and eared in a room somewhere telling us what they thought t would be great to source the whole american people on it. and so if you have a convergeance of tv and apps, you can do that. instantly. you can crowd source the whole american public. 20 million people that are watching it, 25 million people watching it. if i'm watching mlb. >> you can tell what the american public saw. >> while it's happening. >> because what is happening today is i'll be sitting watching that debate and i will

have my i pad in my lap and monitoring different social networks to see what is going on. but i'm not really participating. i might want to vote on something. i might want to say who i thought made the best point in that part of the debate. >> rose: here is my idea, does anybody agree. >> exactly. or if i'm watching a baseball game, i would like to see the stats. i don't want to just watch the game, i want to know the stats. and so mlb has done a great job of this of overlaying content in the stats because they know that is their customer. but the point is that tv i think will become not a one-way communication, but it will become much more social. and there will be much more information wrapped around the con tent whereby people are participatek with it, not just listening one quai. so take a kid's show. take, when i was growk up, "sesame street," it's still

great today, i think. the truth is, i loved my nephew to watch that as long as he's participating in it. as long as he's learning something. but today those environments are two different things. there's the tv and then there's the app. these things should come together. >> people have been expecting something big. >> yup. >> is what you have just described something big? >> i think it changes your living experience totally. >> so if we are looking for apple to change television, what we have just described, the-- of apps. >> this is what are you talking about. >> this lays the foundation. >> there is no greater vision of television. >> it lays the foundation but the walls, when the walls are put in and the art is hung on the wall, it will be just like when we created the ecosystem for the iphone. and we created the app so that people didn't have a clear view of what the app store was. an then all of a sudden these

apps started coming. if you remember everybody was going around saying there is an app for that, there is an app for that. >> this is happening. this will happen to your tv. and so today instead of setting, going to your dvr, having to know you want to watch this show, you go in and record it, maybe it's a game, and oh my god, the game lasted a little longer so you lost the most important two minutes of the game. all of that is gone. everything is on demand. and it's interactive. i mean this is a whole change in the way you do. >> i am asking the question, and it is a notion that show in the apple watches of the world, of which there are millions and they have their own-- and they have their own everything, you know, it is how you learn about what the rumors about apple. so having said that. >> it's great to have people that care. >> they do. >> but i'm asking, again, they thought that there was something

coming out at the most recent meeting leading into it in september. and you did come out. but they thought it was just a little bit it was just a sampling of what is to come. is there something big in the laboratory that's going to. >> there is always something next. always something next. >> so this son the route to what is next. >> this is the foundation. >> and what's next though? >> that parent i'm not going to answer. >> you know. >> i do know. >> there is a goal. >> i do know. >> and this is building to the goal. >> yesment and just stop and think about it just for a minute. a group of drunken sailors would not vin vented the tv experience. you have to know what you are going to watch or you are a slave to the time. i don't know about you but i don't want my tv to be my boss. i also don't want to know what i have to watch or what i want to watch. i want to, if you tell me the next day at work that you saw something really cool the night before, i want to go watch it. i am paying that bill.

i just want to see the show. but today i have got to go in and record it and then buy the-- by the way, because there's so many ads in it, some people are sitting there, fast forwarding through it. right? and so you are think about all of this heavy infrastructure that is built around making the experience better, you know we're developing technology to change the process, instead of relooking at the whole thing. and so i think it's actually a sea change. i don't think your living really has changed very much in decades other than going to. >> a flat screen tv. >> what is i asea change. >> i think it is a sea change, yes, absolutely. >> i think it's a sea change. >> every apple product can be bought at a retail store. >> you have more profit ability per square foot i'm told than

anybody. 4,700 per square foot that may be wrong. but more, the point is, what is the magic of that? because i know you labored over the design of the store, the feeling of the store, the display of the products, what was the connection between purchaser and seller. >> the key is that profit ability is not our goal. >> what's your goal. >> our goal is customer experience. and so the profit ability is the end result. t the important thing is to put the customer front and center. and to make the apple store a place to explore, and discover new products. a place to go get help when you need help. and so that, the genius part came out of that. a place to go in and maybe you want to sit through a seminar.

maybe you want to know how a movie is made. maybe you're curious. maybe you want to learn how to write an app. so it's a place to go learn. and angela is. >> can you do that all in the store. >> you can do it in the store. angela is increasingly making it a big piece of the community that it resides in. and so these things, the store probably isn't the way it works for them. because there's so much more, yes, there is some business that takes place in there as well. but that is actually a small percentage of the activity in the store. >> so what do you want to call it other than store. >> i don't know. we haven't come up with a good name. >> for more about this program and earlier episodes visit us online at pbs.org and charlie rose.com. captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh

access.wgbh.org >> rose: funding for "charlie rose" has been provided by: >> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. this is "nightly business

report," with tyler mathisen and sue herera. shocking death. the controversial former ceo of chesapeake energy dies in a car crash one day after being indicted by a federal grand jury. market reset. now that the presidential front-runners have strengthened their lead, should investors shift their focus? message to investors. what the ceo of exxonmobil wants long-term shareholders to know. all that and more tonight on "nightly business report" for tonight. good evening, everyone. a controversial figure in the shale boom. a man many considered a visionary pioneer and others an incautious renegade is dead. the former chesapeake energy ceo, aubrey mcclendon,