>> rose: welcome to the program. we begin with politics and mark halperin, to question where do we go from here now that there are two presump tiff nominees. >> i joke all the time that there are a lot of reasons why trump has succeeded. but one reason he succeeded is because people like plea said for two years running up to this election that the nominees would be hillary clinton and jeb bush. and at the time when the country was still looking for fundamentals change, nothing looks like fum change like a clinton bush fundamental election. trump stepped into that. if he wins, history will say this. he couldn't have bb luckier. >> rose: we continue this morning with marc maron. he has one of the most popular pop casts wtf. >> he lost everything. now we have a completely different show. marq has nothing, is he on drugs, we have to get him cleaned up, transitioned back into life and get him to make a big decision about his future. >> rose: we conclude with sara

blakely, the founder of spanx. >> it allows you to just wear yo clothes. like think of this, if you have a great piece of art, the paint is your clothing and spanx is the canvas. you have to have the right can vast for the artwork and the painting to come together. >> rose: mark halperin, marq maron, sara blakely when we condition. >> funding for charlie rose is provided by the following: captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> rose: we begin tonight with

politics. after a landslide victory in last night's indiana primary, donald trump has become the pretumptive republican nominee. trump's win forced his main opponent senator ted cruz to ens bid for the nomination. in his victory speech trump praised cruz and vowed to go after hillary clinton. >> just so you understand, ted cruz, i don't know if he likes me or doesn't like me, but he is one pel of-- hell of a competitor. he is a tough, smart guy. and he has got an amazing future. he's got an amazing future. so i want to congrat lace-- congratulate ted. we're going after hillary clinton. she will not be a great president. she will not be a good president. she will be a poor president. >> rose: on the democratic side bernie sanders defeated hillary clinton in indiana. despite the upset she maintains

a significant lead in delegates needed to secure the nomination. joining me is mark halperin, managing editor of bloomberg news and koas host of "all due respect" and "the circus" which is on hiatus with showtime. welcome. >> thank you. >> rose: i want to bring you up to 30,000 feet, in a sense to look at this. because you start early. you do it every day. you talk to everybody. the process of writing the book and doing stuff. what does it look like, this political season to you? >> well, i like and respect hillary clinton. i like and respect donald trump and i think either of them could win. and while that doesn't make me a unicorn, for people who are thinking about this race, covering it, participating in politics, it makes me very unusual. we are in a polarized country. we now have two very polarizing candidates in the case of donald trump, dividing his own party, his adopted party. in the case of hillary clinton who is still fighting bernie

sanders, she's also dealing with some what of a divided party although i suspect her party will be more united. first time since the founding of the republic, three straight two-term presidents, and the country is still fundamentalically unhappy with the direction. and the country is now facing a choice between in some ways two very different people. but in some ways, foo people who are both new yorkers, and i won't say evenly matched, but two world famous people, not just famous in the united states, world famous people. both of whom are extraordinarily competitive. and both of whom believe the other would be not just a worse president but a disastrous president. >> rose: does one have more support from her party than he has from his party. >> well, she does today statisticically. although she still has an opponent now, bern que sanders where surprisingly to some donald trump doesn't. he can't win without achieving a lot of things. >> rose: we see some of it by praising ted cruz, standing with three women, prominently shot. his wife and his daughter in law

and daughter. you know, it is very hard to find any one in the clinton camp who's worried about losing this race except for bill and hill c.e.o. clinton and that is probably because they are wore year-- woriers. they look down on donald trump. they think he's a joke. they think he's unqualified. they think when the voters make a serious choice they will vote for her. >> rose: does most of the political community feel that way? >> well, some-- . >> rose: donald. >> they look down on him, don't think he's qualified, that is what jeb bush thought. >> rose: right. >> right? so there are a lot of republicans, and we're seeing it today who are saying they won't vote for him. they may not vote for her but they won't vote for him. and they think that he say disgrace, that he is a bad person, will be a president president and bad for the republican brand. a lot of people like that. >> rose: bad for politics, chooses language not accustomed to politics. >> i'm asking everybody, republicans and democrats involved in politics in the last

week, what is it about trump that you think is disquawling to be the president of the united states. have i heard 15 girch answers there is some overlap but there are a lot of things he said and done that smart people, people that care about the country say disqualify him. he is not going to be able to erase those things. if he going to win and make this competitive, he has to convince people to overlook those things. i haven't met a trump supporter this year who would say he is perfect. a lot of them don't like the crude things he says. a lot of them don't like some of his positions. >> rose: but. >> but they see him as someone who will change things, fundamentally change things. now i-- i joke all the time that a lot of reasons why trump has succeeded but one reason he has succeeded is because people like me said for two years rung up t this election that the nominees would be hillary clinton and jeb bush. at the time when the country is still looking for fundamental change, nothing says fundamental change as much as a clinton-bush general election. trump has stepped into that. if he wins, hisry will say this, he-- history will say this, he couldn't have been luckie.

his main opponent to win the nomination is a bush and his general election foe was a clinton. and the country was just not interesteds as barbara bush herself said when asked before bush got into the race, aren't there enough families in america. there is a certain irony if trump wins the country will have turned away from two political brand names to a business brand name. not some new person on the national stage but someone new to pom particular-- politics. >> rose: hillary clinton, tell me about this campaign and about her and about what we saw as a result of the challenge from bernie sanders. >> well, it highlighted the lack of enthusiasm for her in some parts of the party. younger people, people on the far left, some more classically liberal white voters. and i think it highlighted her inability to define what she stands for, you know. you and i both know in private she is not only a more engaging and interesting and funny person but a person who conveys her

passion for helping people in the world. not just in america but in the world. there is no doubt that for her, i i i maybe it is the case that the gap between the public and private even wider for al gore and mitt romney who famously frustrated their aids by failing to convey what they are really like in public the way they are in private. i think that she has done what the clinton family playbook says to do. focus on the election in front of you. don't look past it. she now is confident she is going to be the nominee. she is a little annoyed with what bernie sanders is putting her through at this point. but she's starting to think a lot about the general election. and she's got a fair degree of confidence that she will win this. and i believe she s although she doesn't want to let on, she is thinking a lot about what it will mean to be president. and the challenge, if her team is right. >> rose: meaning she doesn't want do tg, say something, that will impede her. >> john-- and i reported in game change that she began pretty early in the process to think about who would be in her

cabinet, her vice president, plan her transition. so as a matter of superstition and worrying about leaking, i don't think she wants to do that again. but i do think she's thinking about it. again, if her team is right, that one of these two people will be president barring some unfore seen president. if sher team is right this will be relatively easy thark she will be the next president, she does have to worry about what this process will do. what do the next five months do to her ability of not just win but govern and get the job done and make the job worth all the effort. >> rose: the argument goases that they are prepared unlike his republican opponents in the primaries. they are prepared to do him-- to give as good as they receive. >> they are armed to-- and ready. >> they're way more prepared. they have opposition research, they have thoughts about how to do it. they put out a very compelling video today, web video showing basically a montage of trump's republican rivals and mitt romney saying very negative things about him. very defendantly done an will you see a fair amount of that. i think that the thing that they

claim they're ready for but we'll see if they are, is they don't want to let trump dominate the opposition. we saw what they did to the republicans, the dialogue, the news coverage was about trump's agenda, point of view, not the other republicans am i will be interested to see if they succeed. >> rose: on the other hand i have heard people say that the general election would determine on whether it is a referendum on him or a referendum on her. if it is a referendum on her, he wins. if st a referendum on him, she wins. >> that would be right if either of those were possible am but it won't be that clean t is a simultaneous thing, neither san incumbent. it's not a clean referendum. i think she will try to disqualify him as unacceptable. and he is try to guess qualify her as corrupt and won't make change. >> crooked. >> but also won't make change. another career politician won't change anything. >> could trump with his argument have won this without the spectacle of trump? >> clearly if you could, if you

could micromanage trump and say do the 80% of stuff that helped you but quut out the other 20rbgs he would be in a better position and could have still won. >> he doesn't because that's who he is? >> i have to tell you, and i know you know him too and i will see if you agree. he's one of the most interesting and hard to understand people i have ever met. he wants the narrative to be that he is a giant who is a great winner. >> yeah. 100 percent. >> rose: he convinced everybody. >> i agree with everything you said. what would be great is if he could be sitting here with us and run through the ten biggest mistakes he made in the campaign and ask him why he made them and does he think they were mistakes. i don't know what he would say. >> rose: here is what would happen, if he was sitting here, what would happening, it would be an interesting conversation. and he would be a conversationalist. he wouldn't be dealing in spectacle, he wouldn't be dealing in even these sort of self-described characterizations of candidates. >> yeah. >> rose: he would say ted cruz made this mistake. you know, i might have not done this but in the end it didn't bother me because something else

happened. it's a kind of analysis. well, look paragraph. >> take his fight with megyn kelley. said the thing about her that people interpreted in a way that he said was misinterpreted about blood coming out of here, whatever. i think picking a fight with megyn kelley as a matter of political reality helped him quite a bit. >> rose: do you really. you think he did it on purpose. >> i do. but-- . >> rose: to what end. >> he stood up to fox news. and he proved that he was the biggest kid on the block. that he was willing to make roger ailes and rupert murdoch dance to his tune. and it showed-- . >> rose: you have heard him talk like that, i am gonna make rupert murdoch and roger ailes who think they've got all the power in the worlds, they don't have any power over me. that's what i am going to do. that is my intent and here's the means of doing it. >> based on the totality of what i know, i'm confident that was his thinking. and extraordinary spectacle. he has created so many moments in this campaign already that

are unprecedented and extraordinary, to go to a rally, a hugely attended rally of the republican frontrunner, have him attack fox news and have people boo fox news. >> rose: because he was part of something that they believed in which is that the government and the establishment had let them down. >> the big institutions like fox news are against the people and part of the problem. >> yeah. and i think that his general, if he had to pick a single trait that has helped him so far, it's strength. and standing up to fox news, conveys strength. and i'm confident that he saw that part of it. >> rose: and belittling his opponents conveyed strength? >> sure, sure. >> the arc is made that he has got a long way to go and democrats are really confident. because women, latinos, young, that that burden is too much. and whatever he gains in terms of white males, is not enough. now i'm recognizing the later

primaries where it is one-on-one he did better with women and did better in places like gren itch. >> yeah. so there's the demographics and there std electoral college. and obviously they relate, mitt romney won 206 electoral votes, trump has 271. he's got to do belter than that. so on the demographic side, there is can he do better than romney did with quote unquote republican groups, white men, married women, white married women. can he do better there, and therefore he wouldn't need to improve as much as otherwise. with these other groups. and can he reach out to these other groups. it is the strongest anchor, strongest foundation of the clinton world's belief that trump can't win, that he cannot improve with owes other grows and cannot win with latinos, in particular, but also single women, younger women. i'm hoping to the notion that he could improve. i think it's silly to underestimate trump and just say where he is today is where he will be.

i also believe that he can win this election with the country viewing him unfavorably. >> rose: she's 15 ahead in some polls, down to ten in others. >> again electoral college matters more. i think she will run up a big score in a lot of liberal states and that will make it-- . >> rose: including california. >> yes, although i said the other day, on cable television, that i thought trump could make her have to compete to win california. i didn't say i thought he would win. i didn't even say he would. >> rose: why did you say that. >> because i look at arnold schwarzenegger. look at all the things. >> rose: who was similar in terms of. >> lots of things. said insensitive things about women, seemed unqualified to do it. had another appeal to younger people and african americans because of strengths that trump shares, strengths are, celebrity, success, and he won. he was elected governor. >> rose: you never said arnold schwarzenegger was one of the best politicians you had ever seen. you have said that about trump. in fact you said trump is second only to bill clinton.

in your judgement of the skills of a master poll. >> first time candidate, running in a big field, just joined the republican party, tiny staff of a dozen people, wins the republican nomination, you know. i talked to one of the smartest republican i know today. and i said do you ksh ksh. >> rose: who a is that. >> kensy, where do you rank that achieve nment our careers, last 30 years, where do you rank that achievement in president politics, he agreed with me, with the possible thing of barack obama's fundraising, that was the most remarkable thing that has ever happened. >> rose: winning the republican nomination is the most remarkable thing that you have seen in. >> that trump became the republican nominee it is unfathomable. >> given the way the republican party has chosen their nominees, from three categories, vice president, person who finished second the preefer time or somebody named bush, you know. and you had two of those three

categories represented this time. you had santorum second last time, huckabee second two times ago and you had a bush. and trufer, you know, again i reason i say such an incredible achievement, of a dozen people, none had top level presidential campaign experience. >> rose: that is the kind of campaign he ran. >> it is. but to win-- i understand but to win the nomination like that, and again, you could be-- you could be the most anti-trump person in the world, you cannot deny what skill he exhibited. >> rose: i hear you saying and tell me if i'm wrong, in the end you can't quite explain it. why he has been able to do this. >> well. >> rose: you know the general sense of unease in the country about the direction of the country. >> and regular politicians can't change it. >> rose: and the establishment, institutions can't change. >> yeah. that was there, that it was-- that whole politicians. >> rose:hat is interesting about it is whether someone else could have tapped into it the way he has tapped into it. i mean everybody looked-- this

is not a new ideal. we understand that there say great feeling, that is what is happening to the middle clas. we understand there say great idea that people are very much upset about gridlock. and we understand that there is after 2008 a real disenchantment with enough feeling that the economic future of the country las been in a sense in some cases fixed. >> yeah. all true, but it took a man about extraordinary media skills, and it also, again, a very weak field. this republican field was just so weak. >> rose: who might have beaten him. >> no one who ran. >> rose: no, forget who ran. who might have beaten him? >> you guys were saying, you guys were saying at the beginning, this is a strong republican field. >> not me. >> rose: a lot of people were. >> go back. >> rose: you j have john kasich. >> check the videotape. >> you have a popular governor, a senator who is young and had a vision on paper very strong. >> i said from the beginning most overrated field. >> rose: did you really.

>> from the beginning. because each of them was not-- was not a titan. they had a lot of flaws. and the thing about trump is, he pointed them out. he pointed them out and he was not encumbered by what encumbers these guys. he didn't go to fund fundraisers he didn't have a voting record. >> rose: a lot of republicans i know believe this will be a disaster for them, a disaster, john boehner, another. >> yeah. could be. >> rose: don't count donald out is the theme of this conversation. >> i believe that if you were betting on any democrat because of the demographics, you bet on almost any democrat, i believe that she's way ahead today. i believe that she drg-- trump will have to be really almost flawless to win. she will have to make mistakes. but those who say he can't win i think are wrong. i think it's too soon to say what kind of general election candidate he's going to be. there is no doubt that trump will try to make this campaign

personal about her, and make people want nothing to do with her. and i don't rule out that he can do it, as much strength as she brings. >> rose: on the other hand, you will not be surprised if she wins by ten points. >> yes, i would not be surprised if she won in a landslide, if he won, and as i said in the beginning, i like her, i respect him, i like him, i respect him. i think either of them could win. >> rose: thank you for coming. mark halperin, with all due respect and bloomberg politics. back in a moment, stay with us. >> rose: marc mron is here, host of the popular podcast wtf with marc maron. he recently celebrated its 700th episode and star of the ifc series maron, season four, the comedy premiers this wednesday, may 4th. here is a look at the new season .

>> all right, everybody, before we get to today's interview, i think it's time to address the pink elegant-- elephant in the room. many of you have read or seen stuff about me on the internet, on reddit, on twitter, or in the blogoschfear. time to set the record straight. several months ago i experienced an injury and i started using prescription pain medication and as some of you know, if you are a recovering addict, pharmaceuticals can be a slippery slope. and i slipped, all right. 16 years of sobriety down the drain. i will say this, i nipped it in the bud, it's water under the bridge, no harm, no foul. if you want to tweet me other cliches feel free, but i think i covered them all, okay. but you know, marc maron is doing just fine.

>> rose: marc maron is doing just fine and he's back at this table, welcome. >> doesn't look good. doesn't look like he's doing fine there. this one is. don't want anyone to panic. >> rose: there are two things here, one is what happened. >> yeah. >> rose: number two, the telling of it. >> well, what happened was at the end of the last season for some reason i decided to relapse on pain killers. seemed like a nice story. >> rose: were you in pain. >> no, i didn't really-- i didn't really do it, charlie. i'm okay. i just want to let all my fans know that this is not based on real life. >> rose: okay. >> well, in the show i was in pain. and we didn't know really how to end the season. and then when i do television you don't know when it's going to be your last season. so each season should have a fairly clear ending. and for some reason i thought that having me on the floor babbling during the big opportunity that i have just blown, hosting a talk show because i'm high on oxycodone,

that seemed like a reasonable place to end the series for me. but we're back. >> rose: and you know enough people that have been through that. >> i do. you know, it was-- the real challenge became when we got renewed and they wanted to do more shows. i didn't know what we were going to do. i did not want to go back to the world we established. because we had done t done my whole life in that way, i don't want to be redundant it hit me all at once, we just leave him where we left him, out using octobery for a year, lost everything. we come back, we have a completely different show. marc has nothing, he's on grugs and we have to get him cleaned up, transitionzed back into life and get him to make a big decision about his future. so it has a nice narrative arc. >> rose: what do you think the listeners are buying floo? do you think they are buying into, this is, in fact, a reflection of his life or are they simply saying he has created this character, it has nothing to do with him at this stage. >> i think what they know about me and if they've been watching the show and listening to the podcast is there are a lot of

stories that are based on reality. they're executed differently, it's television. >> rose: and the professional life is a little bit of the same. >> sure, exactly. but this season is a complete departure. and i think that because of the last see three sons and people knowing me, know that i am soaber, that i am in recovery. and that you know, this can happen. this is-- as a soaber guy, you know, this is happen has. you see this happen. you see dudes who have got 20 years or 25 years. and they get an injury. and they get prescribed pain killers and they slip. and they go out. or else there's the other way which is someone who has got 25 years soaber, said i'm probably not an alcoholic any more and then they're gone. but-- . >> rose: and they know. they know the danger there and think it can't happen to me and all of a sudden they need it. >> very quickly. so it's sort of a kaitionary tale. it was nice that i was able to live it out fictionally. >> rose: is it a good time for you? because you had this character, you, without you could build on in the beginning and now you're

free, you have poetic license to do anything you want. >> it was great. it was great. i mean it was fun for the requires, they were all a little nervous at first because we have a nice little system going and then you're like no, that's gone. and it was ambitious for the budget that we were afforded, from ifc without gave us almost creative freedom within the realms of money, you have to think that way. we're shooting two shows a week and it's all out in the world. and it was ambitious. there was a lot of locations and stuff. but i think everyone is very proud of the season. we did something that is unique and different for our show and for any show. and the comedy works and some of it-- . >>ose: what else can you tell us about it without giving it away. >> well, that-- there's some interesting back stories around the show. you know, when i go into rehab, the joke in rehab was that i would be the oldest one there. i got a good friend, who is also my sponsor, actually, who works at a rehab. he said that's very common. that everyone is 20, 25 years old. i'm a 52 year old man and

surrounded by kids in a rehab. we just had this idea for a character. we wanted him to be like sort of a spoiled, you know, white rap kid. you know, like hanks, tom hank's son, chet hanks, there was some controversy about him because he had a little drug issue and he was a white rapper. we thought like that, like chet hanks. and then we thought like do you think he would do it. and we hired him. so he hadn't done a lot of acting recently. and this is probably his biggest acting part. and he is basically playing himself. and also, you know, i'm in recovery. he was just new to recovery. so there was a lot of real stuff going on. and he played this character for three episodes. and it was really kind of exciting. >> rose: describe your style of interview. >> yeah, i just need to know some things. i like it to go as freely as possible. i have a general sense of who the person is. and then i don't have any real-- i don't want to dismiss major achievements if i'm talking to somebody who cured cancer, it would be good if i covered that. >> rose: yes, it would. or at least recognize it.

>> so i try not to miss-- . >> rose: in the introduction, by the way, he cured cancer. >> yeah. if i forget to talk about that during the talk. but i am not too hard on where it goes. i would like to follow the-- wherever it happens. >> rose: the reason i ask, that is exactly-- i once helped prepare someone who is very good, but i would say to him, here is what i want you to do. you read all this stuff. forget all that. remember all that, but here's what you do. sit at your own computer. and think about who this is. and what do you want to know. >> right. >> rose: that's where you start. >> right. >> rose: start with some intuitive sense of who is this guy. >> exactly. >> rose: and what do i want to know about him. >> in a broad sense. >> rose: rather than somebody putting out questions saying there was this conflict and this thing and this thing. all of which is simply regurnlg stating previous stories. what i want to know. >> what do i want to know. >> 700 episodes and also you know, you don't want to-- if you do too much research, you already know the answer. and i think that's an old

journalistic sort of trick that like i've been told in the past before i did my podcast, you want to know what you are looking for in the answer. and i can't stand that. >> but i think there are two points of view on that, personally it is number one, you do want to know enough. >> right. >> there is something, larry king, he and i have talked about this. larry used to always say i don't want to read anything. i want to sit down and don't know the guy. and i never sorlt of-- i need to know something. >> you are a talker. larry is a guy that goes why, when? really? >> yes. >> he actually wants to have a little bit of a conversation. >> it would help, wouldn't it. >> you are more like me. >> yes. >> definitely. >> you really want to know, what make this person tick. >> and when you can hear the cus, when you are in the middle of a conversation, when it goes somewhere you don't know where it's going to go, wait, why? then is goes this other way, that is exciting because no one knows what will happen. >> and always seize the moment. don't let the moment go by. >> or get back to it. have i done-- that is the only notes i make in an interview is

if somebody drops something in the middle of the story that is compelling in and of itself, i will just write get back to that thing about dad. >> and i actually keep a list of things that sort of mainly because you don't want to miss the bit about the doctor. >> sure that. >> that cured cancer. you don't want to forget. you want to make sure you remember that. >> you don't want the guy driving away, oh, i didn't talk about the oscar or you want to know, how did you of all the people do it. >> yeah, cure cancer. >> that should be an important conversation. >> yeah. >> how do you do that. >> i think will probably have that one before me. >> that's the level of the sphere you're operating in. >> how close are you, i asked this when i we sat down to louis c.k. comedic history. >> we're friends. one the big podcasts i did years ago that was big for everybody, myself included was us repairing a very long and deep friendship. we're good friends. he was just on the 700th episode he came by, a couple

weeks ago he stopped by to talk about the creation of horas and pete. we're in touch. i saw him the other night. we talk, we're busy people but i love louis. >> rose: i just did an hour with himment and he was just wonderful. >> oh yeah, he's great. yeah. >> rose: with the sense of story is deeply engrained in how he does it. >> he is one of these people, he picks good role models. louis when we were younger he would always be reading the biography of teddy roosevelt or something like that. we have some practical problem about his car breaking down and we have some how a nal giez of an issue of teddy roose investment he's good like that. >> rose: what would teddy have done if he was in this pinch. >> exactly. he elevates things. he is a very engaged and brilliant guy. >> rose: do you ever think about ending it? >> you mean killing myself? >> rose: is that what it would mean? >> i don't know. >> rose: no, no. no. >> if i was interested in that i would say have you ever thought about killing yourself, precise

is a better way to go. no, no, about the podcast? >> well, i don't know. >> rose: is it your life? is it the thing that brings you sort of mission. >> well, i don't-- i done know how you feel about it. but i get a little twichy if i don't talk to people. >> rose: yeah, me too. >> it's become maybe the same for you, i think it's the deepest relationships i have for an hour. >> rose: i done know if we want to go there. >> wall, no, it's sort of sad. like you know i have a girlfriend and we get along and everything. but i can get real deep with a person i know will leave in an hour, right? >> rose: the great thing, you can get more out of that person than his best frind or his wife or in her case, she's here, her husband. because you have a license. >> right. >> rose: often people will say to me, i heard things about my friends that i never heard before and i've known them for 20 years. it's because we have license. >> right. >> rose: and it's expected. >> i get that too. it's always an amazing feeling. i don't know about you, but sometimes i have conversations

and there's moments where i'm like maybe i should give that guy a call and hang out. and then you're like, i don't know if that's really part of the job. hey, it's marc, remember we did the show. maybe we can just talk off the mikes. >> rose: people ask dot people you have on the air become your friends. some cases they do some cases they don't. it also has a lot to do with prox imity, i think. >> sure. i always wonder that but i kind of leave it be. i would rather just keep a few friends. you don't want to be the pestering guy. i never know what my role is. when you have a big star over, god, we really get aing lo, maybe we will have lunch. gi to text them what am i thinking, you know what i mean. >> rose: or you say he doesn't want to have lunch with me or i don't want to have lunch with him. we've done it. >> exactly. >> rose: i once interviewed charles manson. >> you wanted to have lunch with him? >> rose: no. but i said to him afterawards, he said i have been watching you when i came into the san quentin. he said i have been watching you, rose. i said what do you mean. he said well, you're on tv.

i see you. at the end. broadcast, at the end of the taping i said to him are you going to watch. this he said no, i just did it. >> that's interesting. because i feel that way. >> rose: what is the role of podcast in the future of social media? >> i mean are we going to see a lot more. for example, david axelrod. >> yeah. >> rose: has a popular podcast. not popular in your league but popular. >> well, i think that it gives everybody, it is sort of a wild frontier right now. everybody can really do one. everybody has access to the technology. it's very easy and you can post it fairly easily. but like anything else, i think that there is niche markets, you know, and people will find the good ones or find the things that apply to their lives. but there is also like podcasts that are very niche which is like four listeners. and i don't know how long they will remain. but-- the good ones will find their way. >> rose: yeah. is that what happened, you just found your way. >> yeah. >> rose: word of mouth, somebody said you have to hear this, have you heard this. >> that is sort of what happened. >> rose: watercooler talk. >> we got in at a good time.

there was a little watercooler talk but it was mostly driven by guests i had. i did a fairly significant interview with robin williams, you know, at his home. and during the beginning, we were also timed right it was before the podcast explosion. so there were several pivotal interviews throughout the years that kind of brought people in. >> rose: rob sin one. what are the others? >> well, like earl-- early on, it was interesting, there was an interview with ira glass that brought a lot of people from his world in ben stiller, conan o'brien early on was a pretty big interview, that first louis interview was pretty good. there were two carla mencianas where i talked about him about stealing jokes that was pretty big. it started to build like that. but at that time people were still just recognizing the medium. the biggest problem with podcasting, most people still don't listen to them or know what they are or how to get them. >> rose: that's true, they don't. >> it's crazy. >> rose: but with respect to the president, did somebody on his staff know and was a fan and said to him you ought to do

this, take a listen, this is great. >> that's right, that's what happened. a staffer enjoyed it. called us up, started pursuing it. we thought that was-- yeah, of course we'll do it. it seems like a long shot to us. and he said elise inned to a couple. but it was a staff person. and a lot of people in the worlds that you and i run in whether it's entertainment or news, it's very interesting with a podcast how far the reach is and who lessens to it. because i get a lot of people that come up from all different areas of life, i love your podcast. really, you listen to it. >> and then they'll refer to guests, except they might come along and say man, i love your show, watch it all the time. what was the last thing you saw. >> well, jeez, the thing you did, you know, i said that was five years ago. five years ago. >> like what exactly-- i don't get pbs. >> rose: we get it every five years what channel. >> one show every five years. >> rose: how long ago did you interview manson. >> that was aong time when i

first started out. like 1984, 5. >> i wonder how he is doing. go back for a secretary one. >> rose: all these things are happening to people around him. a story every year there is some development. >> someone was just up for parole. >> rose: that's right. >> lesley van hauteen. >> rose: i don't think they released her, did they. >> i don't think so. >> rose: yeah. >> but that would be an interesting interview, it would be intense. >> rose: why don't you go to san quentin and talk to him. >> i would. i mean who do i talk to. you can put me in touch with manson? z. >> rose: would you do it, would you like to do it, does that interest you? >> yeah. he's an old witch. >> rose: more than that. >> yeah. >> rose: i would be trying to do that if i were you. in other words, maybe you and i are different. if there is somebody i really want to talk to, i want to reach out to them and find them and say how about let's do this. not just i might. are you so casual about it. >> manson is sort of a difficult get, charlie. i am more focused on albert brooks. >> rose: i do too. >> he might be more difficult to

get than charlie manson, albertment and he knows i want to talk to him. >> rose: are you serious now, you want to talk to him and you haven't been able to. >> i think he doesn't want to dot hour interview. >> rose: when they say that, i get a little bit of that too. >> sure. >> rose: oh, 15 minutes, that is fine. an hour. i can't carry an hour. there's not that much interesting stuff in an hour. and you say to them, let me, trust me. >> yeah, yeah, let's do that. >> rose: let me make that decision. >> the next phase in their head is maybe there are some things i don't want to talk about, charlie. >> rose: that's right. and then you say to them, you are in control. just say i don't want to talk about it. perfectly good answer. i i do not want to talk about this. >> yeah. i don't think you or i are are going to sit there and say come on. >> rose: not for 15 minutes. >> you're not trying to trap anything. >> rose: or try to look at it like are you the world's toughest interviewer. >> do you ever get people that say i don't want that in there. >> rose: well no, no, no, no. they don't say to me i don't want to talk about this, then

they say-- they may say it's boring. you know, you can talk about whatever you want to but i think this is really boring. >> has anyone after you got it in the can called up and said could you not run that part. >> rose: sure. and i would make a decision based on if i thought it was an interesting part. if i thought it was relevant and interesting, i would say no, it's in. >> do you have to negotiate with them. >> rose: no. >> your decision. >> rose: it's your decision. >> because they already do it. >> rose: may name is on the door. >> and so is yours. oddly when people ask tor that, it's never anything. it's always about what they said about somebody else. >> rose: that's right. you look at it, you know, my wife's mother is going to really be bothered by this. and you say, you know. >> tough luck. >> rose: well, no, but this they said look, when i was a kid i did all these terrible things, you know, and i got away with them, you're not going to say no it's really whether they are

hurting some innocent person. >> i think that's right. we always comply. there was one-- . >> rose: but if it was journalisticically relevant, you would say no, it's in. >> right, watch your mouth next time. >> rose: don't be so stupid next time. take a look at this, this is when you are trying to con vinsz your agent to get you work. here it is from maron. >> there she is. i got some sp good news for you. i know what you are thinking but you're wrong. >> you got stacey again. >> i'm ready, okay. >> i feel excited. i feel funny. i feel talented. don't i seem better? >> huh-uh. >> okay, i am not going to be picky any more. i'll take anything. get me on one of those dumb shows where i talk about other dumb shows or maybe get me on one of those ones where i just say snackery. >> we're not going to do this again, we're not going do it again. >> what. >> this thing you do every few weeks. you come in here, stacey. and your eyes are glassy. >> my eyes aren't glassy.

>> i don't present any momplet i fired you. >> you can't fire me. i'm the client. i fire you. you don't fire me. >> rose: really? is that 100 percent scripted? >> that was a little loose but yeah, we do work from-- it's mostly scripted. it's all scripted. >> rose: by you or other writers. >> well, we have a writing staff, and the process is we break st ry together like breaking bread, you know. i had the ideas for the arc of the season and come up with the 13 stories and get in a room and flesh those stories out into a three act structure. an writers are assigned to outline and script them. and then at each phase we bring it back in. it is collaborative but it's written by the writers. and michael and dave anthony, jerry, bob and myself. >> rose: thank god you remembered all the names. >> i'm very good at that. they all did a great job. it has been a very exciting process. >> rose: the writing process.

sits around the table. >> there is a lot of signature. what happens is sometimes about 20 minutes of you know five guys, six guys just sitting and i go come on! that's got toking something. and then we just get movement. and it's a weird and kind of one brain kind of thing that happens. >> rose: an how much, what has been the most painful place for you to go that became part of the show. >> last season. >> rose: was it really? >> last season when i fictionalized having-- dying podcast with my ex-wife who i haven't talked to in years. and you know, just sort of bringing up, because there were flash banks in the episode where i shaved off my mustache to play the scenes that sort of ended the relationship of the marriage. and it got pretty hairy. i felt like i did something good. i fell like i got closure. i'm sure she sees it differently. i'm sure she sees. >> i feel like i got closure.

i'm sure she sees it like why does he have to keep bringing this up. >> rose: it was over. it was a long time ago. we have gone on in our lives. don't you understand this? >> yeah, right. that is what you would be saying. she wants nothing more than when you google her name, i'm very far, maybe perhaps three or four pages away. >> rose: earlier in her life she was peculiaried to. >> she would like to plof that down the google search. >> probably would prefer that we not talk about it too. >> she's doing wonderful things. she's a writer and you know, she's a mother and i am-- i'm sure she's doing great, charlie. >> rose: what's the best thing that could happen to you? >> that is an interesting question. the best thing that could happen to me. >> rose: uh-huh. >> that i actually feel content and happy enough to not do anything. >> rose: that's interestk you say that. because somebody you know died

and there was a good friends of his. my friend talked to him when he was dying. you know, and he said what do you regret. he said i regret not just being quiet. the word he used was quiet. >> yeah. >> rose: you know. >> yeah. learning how to do that. >> rose: yeah. >> inside. >> rose: being quiet, silence and all of that. absence of frenzie and doing that kind-of-stuff. you think there is something to that. >> i don't feel that yet. i don't feel a scengsz-- because i-- i ask you what is it you most want to do. >> a peabody would be nice too. >> they are nice. i'm felling you, this they are nice to have. >> they are never going give me one. >> rose: why. >> i don't know. >> rose: are you lobbying? >> do i have to lobby? >> rose: no, i think if you lobby you won't get it. >> i think it's the language. we sort of gave up on the whole idea. i don't know what i have got to do. >> rose: i don't think, i won one a couple of years ago and i

didn't even know. >> i don't want to hear. this hi the president at my house. the president came over to my house. >> rose: it is what comes out at the president. >> did you hear that interview. >> rose: yes, i did. it was damn good. >> thank you. >> rose: by the way. >> i think because it's called wtft is the kurszing that is offensing. >> rose: you may get the wrestling show. >> i don't know what it is, i have given up. peace of mind and a peabody. >> rose: yeah. well, how about a being very rich. would that make a difference. >> it's not really about money for me. i feel like i'm earning an honest living. i'm not earning a show business living. i think that my business partner and myself work hard on the podcast and we earn a decent living from that. and the tv thing is not so huge that it's ridiculous. and you know i'm saving money. i feel pretty good. i don't spend money. i live in a two bedroom house. i get anxiety just think being having more bedrooms. i don't know what to do with the second bedroom in the two bedroom. >> rose: are you in a good

relationship? >> yeah, i'm dating a painter. an abstract painter. >> rose: that's great. >> it's a whole different world than mine. >> rose: season four of maron premiers wednesday may 4th at -9d p.m. >> rose: i feel like i should say her name, sarah kane, a great painter. >> rose: like kane. >> caine. >> rose: so everybody now will be googling sarah to see what her art. >> crash her site. >> rose: all right, maron premiers on wednesday, ifc. thank you for coming. >> great to see you again. >> rose: you too. back in a moment. stay with us. sara blakely, is here, the founder of spanx. the company has become synonymous with shapewear, an a market stimed at $670 million. she came up with the idea at age 29 and built a company while selling fax machines door to door. oprah winfrey endorsement of

spanx in 2 thousand sealed her way to success. she became one of the youngest female self--made billionaires in the world. she remains the sole owner of the company and has never used traditional advertising or sought outside investments. her net worth is estimated all 1.6 billion, an also part of the giving pledge and i'm pleased to have her at this table for the first time, although we have talked many times before. welcome to the table. >> thank you so much. >> rose: i'm thrilled to just remind you at the table that you are home growing up. >> the minute i sat down, it's my dining room table, in my childhood. i fell like i am prepared for my dad to ask me about my homework. you know. just brought back memories of him interviewing me at the table. >> rose: let's talk about you first. the idea, i didn't know what spanx was until i met you. >> you know why i keep giving you man-- one of these days will opens show in just your spanx, charlie. >> rose: thank you. but my colleagues, both men and

women but certainly the two women i work with in the morning, they just would dumb founded that i didn't know about spanx because of what it meant to them. >> yeah. >> rose: how did this happen? >> honestly it all happened with me as a frustrated consumer. i had never taken a business class. i had never worked in fashion or retail. i just simply couldn't figure out what to wear under my own white pants. and i stumbled upon a solution and cut the feet out of my own control top pantee hose, put them on under my white pants. was able to wear a great tile open towed shoe with it. and literally that night, i only did it one time, charlie, and i went home and i said this should exist for women. i've got to figure out a way to keep this product comfortably just below the knee and i will fill this void between traditional underwear and gird el thation were too heavy duty and traditional underwear left panty lines and it wasn't a great canvas for women in clothes. so spanx kind of filled this

lane that became the perfect can vaps under everybody's wardrobe. >> rose: was it immediately successful? >> you know what, it was. but it took me two word years of hearing its word no to get it made. the tough part of my journey was in cold calling all the manufacturing plants and begging them to help me maked product. >> rose: many said no, we can't do this. >> yes, pretty of all of them said no. i kept asking. and the thing is, i really disrupted this industry that had been seeing products one way which was hossiery is meant to be seen on the leg. and i showed up with my red back pag and $5,000 in savings and said i just want your material. i'm going to make a new type of undergarm out of your material and people aren't even going to see the hossiery. and it was so-- it was like well no one will buy that or we don't understand that. the one thing i thought was so interesting was that i wasn't talking to any women, charlie, in the journey. everybody i was talking to. >> rose: was a man and what would they know. >> well, then it kind of dawned

on me am i was like well maybe this is why your undergarmts have been so uncomfortable. >> rose: a perfect example of that. >> it really is. is there a woman in this planlt. >> rose: what does it do for women. >> well, for one-- . >> rose: it's form fitting. >> but it allows you to just wear your clothes am think of this. if you have a great piece of art, the paint is your clothing and spanx is the canvas. you have to have a great can vast for-- canvas forth artwork and painting to come together. and as women a we have had really uncomfortable options. i mean i joke and say there was the traditional underwear that left the pantie line and ssh invented the thong which just put underwear exactly where we have been trying to get it out of, charlie. this is not working. so spanx really just provided comfortable solutions for women that let the clothes really work, certain fabric, silqs, certain injuriesies and lighter colors, women had just been trained that we couldn't wear them. i mean the models in the

magazines were alleing air brushed and it was all kinds of smoke and pir rohrs. and then you get home with the pair of white pants and stare at them in their white closet and go i don't know what i am supposed to wear under this. >> rose: what did oprah do. >> she told the world about mee. hi no plun to advertise. in the back of my apartment in atlanta georgia. i sent her a gift basket of them with the note and i get a call a few leaks later that said oprah choice spanx of her favorite product of the year. >> rose: wow. >> i know. unbelievable. >> rose: so you went to chicago. >> actually, my product was on ow they don't usually havegs guests, it's all product. oprah likes what you are doing takes on these big guys and doing this product. can we film you in atlanta. i said sure. charlie, they all showed up at my apartment in atlanta. there were like ten of them, clip boards, very official looking and said we want to film you in your headquarters. >> rose: this is it. >> you're here. and you know, then they said

okay. we also want to film you having a staff meeting. i was like hold on a minute. and i called all my friends and also called this woman. >> rose: because there is no staff. >> i called this woman connie that i had met at mail boxes et cetera down the street because hi been fedexing panty hose and she came to my parm. we sat in a circle and there was my staff meeting for the oprah show. >> rose: so now you have 200, how many people working for you. >> over 200 people. >> rose: 27 are male. >> oh, yes, okay. >> rose: so that was a huge success. people who have spoken outwardly who have spoken about the president's, the first lady, michelle obama, beyonce, kim kardashian, gwyneth paltrow, eva long or yarks gayle king have all talked proudly about wearing them and what it means to them. there is an emotional part, that is what made you. where are you going now? >> where i'm going now is i first of all i understand fit.

and i understand how to deliver comfort plus results in an industry that is really been mainly focused on just how we look and now how we feel. and i am completely inspired to take the brands spanx and invent and keep inventing bet solutions for women. and i've got a long list of them, charl qulee. >> rose: give me an example. >> heels, shoes are so uncomfortable. >> rose: that's true. >> we've been wearing high heels an we're miserable. >> rose: how do you know that, have i had that many conversations with women about it. >> so it's like that son my list. i've got a long list. >> rose: of product areas. >> yes. >> rose: now what kinds of international distribution do you have now? >> we're in 60 countries. we do the bullk of our business in, you know, five or six main, you know, countries. but we're widely distributed and women everywhere have the same reaction to its brand. >> rose: are most of the people who work for you sales

people or organizational people who make sure that the products are made right, and delivered rather than all these designers and people like that, because it seems to me that is what you do. >> yeah, you know, it's interesting. i read a quote from elan musq the other day that said building a company is like bake the cake. you have to have all of right ingredients in the right place. i think it's a balance of how much talent you have in what part of the organization. but i would say that which are very heavy on the product develop. side. and the marketing side. >> rose: warren buffett. >> yes. >> rose: is also a friend. >> yes. >> rose: of yours. >> yes. >> he, he likes people like you, entrepreneur y'alls, start your own business. >> yeah. >> rose: they also suggest that you join the giving fledge. >> yes. >> rose: which you have done. >> i have. >> rose: what does that mean for you? >> it is a great honor and i have so much gratitude for being a woman born in this moment in

time in this country. an i feel that the world will be a better place if women are better utilized on the planet and have the opportunity to fulfill their potential. and so you know, my success if it can pay it forward in some small way to help further that just the best feeling. >> rose: is it possible. you were-- a young woman. happily married, family. >> four children, charlie. four ngd the age of six. >> rose: is it possible at some point to not-- in the near or interimmediate atfuture you would like to sort of sell this business and do something else or is this the only thing that turns you on at this stage of your life. >> it's a great question. i operate so much from my gut, i feel like i'll know when i know. and it will be what's in the best interest for the brand,ed company, myself. but have i no intention of it at the moment. and the funny thing is right after i started the company, all

these people started asking me what my exit strategy was. and i didn't know what they were talking about because i had never taken a business class. i just remember thinking one day i just said my exit strategy is i want to exit a room and look good while i'm doing it. there is my exit strategy. >> rose: thank you for coming. >> thank you so much for having me. great to be here. >> rose: thank you for joining us. see you next time. >> for more about this program and earlier episodes visit us online at pbs.org and charlie rose.com. 7 captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org

>> rose: funding for "charlie rose" has been provided by: >> on tomorrow's pbs newshour making sense of great vacation deals using budget a

this is it nightly business report. politics and money, the race for the white house comes in to focus, but what a trump/clinton contest means for the market remains foggy. a new ride, a man and his tesla. looking for growth why the next big battle ground for two of the nearest tech companies is half bay around the world. all that and more tonight on nightly business report for wednesday may 4th. good evening and welcome. well, and then there was one. billionaire businessman donald trump is now the probably even the