>> rose: welcome to the program. we begin this evening with a recap of the democratic national convention which made history by nominating the first woman to be president of the united states. we talk about hillary clinton and more with john heilemann, katy tur, megan murphy and jonathan karl. >> michelle obama's speech in talking about how important toifts her daughter to have a woman as president, i thought that was one of the most powerful and gavel niegz moments for hillary clinton's campaign. yes it was about a progressive optimistic image in contrast to trump but it was also this is symbolic, a day of reckoning and a choice of ages for where we're going on the pathway. they did a good job. this is a serious moment for our future. >> rose: also this week some of the speeches and the best lines from those speeches.

(cheering) >> standing here as my mother's daughter and my daughter's mother, i'm so happy this day has come. i'm happy for grandmothers and little girls and everyone in between. i'm happy for boys and men because, when any barrier falls in america, it clears the way for everyone! >> rose: we conclude with andrew solomon whose book is "far and away: reporting from the brink of change, seven continents, twenty-five years." >> i believe that travel is really a moral imperative and that we live in a globalized world. some people don't like that but it's true. and that when we close ourself off from other places and don't encounter and experience them, we don't understand the world we're living in and we have a lot of unnecessary fear and ultimately serious dysfunction as a result. >> rose: the democratic convention and andrew solomon, when we continue.

>> rose: funding for "charlie rose" has been provided by the following: >> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. we begin this evening with politics, the democratic national convention came to an end on thursday. hllary clinton became the first female candidate for political . in her acceptance speech, she criticized her opponent donald trump's temperament and called for unity. >> he loses his cool at the slightest provocation. when he's gotten a tough question from a reporter, when

he's challenged in a debate, when he sees a protester at a rally. imagine, if you dare, imagine -- imagine him in the oval office facing a real crisis, a man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons. (cheering) none of us ever have or can do it alone. i know that at a time when so much seems to be pulling us apart, it can be hard to imagine how we'll ever pull together. >> rose: we've got th to do it together. joining me is katy tur, meg mealing and jonathan karl and -- megan murphy, jonathan karl and john heilemann. i am pleased to have all of them on this program. i begin with john heilemann.

hid hillary clinton add -- did hillary clinton advance her cause and do what she needed to do at this convention and how will it benefiter? >> i think the big answer is yes. by common consensus among people who are interested in image and that is what conventions largely are in addition to unifying the party, their a television production, there was a well-crafted convection. we talk about how one big speech is what people remember, usually the nominee's. this convention is received more holistically. they put together four nights, strong speakers from michelle obama, hillary clinton, joe biden, barack obama. all of those people are huge, political talents. but the convention advanced an argument in toto and it was an argument about the d. j. party and hillary clinton are the optimistic, patriotic party, and that the republican party under

donald trump is the pes pessimic party. the sum total argument that this convention made and the way people saw it at home, i think that will do a lot of good for hillary clinton. whether that translates into a large bump in the polls, i don't know. but in terms of advancing the kind of case she wants to make against this particular republican nominee, i think it laid it out in a very rigorous and powerful way. >> rose: katy? i think what the co convention did a relatively good job of doing was try to humanize hillary clinton. what we've seen on the campaign trail is a more robotic politician and that's been the knock against her that she's not herself and saying it like, is what donald trump has been doing the entire time, and in the configuration you had speech after speech showing who hillary clinton was behind the scenes, what she was like as a wife and mother, how she played into this political world we live in now

for the bass 3040 years, and i think they did a good job of that. the question is does it translate to voters. i was speaking to republican operatives today who believe it's ultimately a question of her trustworthiness. they didn't get to that point last night. of course the democrats would disagree. >> the devils advocate, one of the issues with hillary clinton is we're talking so much about how we had to humanize her, even though we've known her for more than three decades in the public eye. i think in some way, it only brings back the point she seems such an elusive figure. >> rose: i i thought they did humanize her and i also thought they raised this question that she'd been caricatured as a cartoon figure and that you were seeing the real hillary clinton for the first time. >> that's exactly the dynamic they set up by branding her "the real one" and calling him a cartoon-style character, bill clinton in saying that. i thought chelsea's speech in introducing her mother could

have been stronger in terms of yes she talked about what it was like growing up and reading stories to her grandchildren but there wasn't a momentum and enthusiasm in the crowd for that speech. when you look back at this, michelle obama's speech and talking about how important it was to her daughters to have a woman as president, i thought that was one of the most powerful and galvanizing moments of hillary clinton's campaign. so yes it was about present ago progressive, optimistic image in opposition to donald trump but also this is symbolic and a choice for the ages of the pathway and i think they did a good job. that's serious moment for our future. >> redefining hillary clinton who has been a major figure in american politics for more than a generation is a tall order. i think where they were successful was in this optimistic vision embracing american exceptionalism, american greatness, themes that have been essential to the republican party since ronald

reagan now found their voice at the democratic convention and some republicans accusing them of stealing their message. >> rose: that began with barack obama's speech as well. >> it tid. consider that speech for a moment. we've never seen a speech like that from an outgoing american president. usually, it's a pe a perfunctory passing of the baton. this was a takedown of donald trump by the outgoing president. you didn't having ronald reagan going after michael du michael n 1988. >> rose: they used his words against him. >> the speech by hillary clinton but also a obama speech said

this is not what we thought of as republican. you had hillary clinton invoking morning in america and donald trump midnight in america. >> two republicans after last night's speech made comments, one john goldberg conservative columnist which said democratic national convention was about americans loving america and republican national convention was about republicans loving trump. michael steele said this was the best republican convention he'd been to. it was the rhetoric on substance. the party is left of hillary clinton. there is nothing where hillary clinton challenged democratic orthodoxy. many of the positions bill clinton took in 1992 she drifted far away from the party and the party is a more progressive

party. >> i think the democrats are trying to urge a change in politics and woo over those republicans who are not enthralled by trump or who are not convinced by trump, who don't believe he represents their values or their party and that he is not a republican. so while donald trump is trying to woo over bernie sanders supporters on trade, hillary clinton is hitting international security and american exceptionalism in order to get the republicans who don't feel they are represented by donald trump and there is a significant portion of those republicans out there that could potentially be wooed. >> to your point, charlie, i think the thing trump said at his convention, the moment where he said i know the system better than anyone and i'm the only one qualified to fix it, hillary clinton and obama seized on it. the republican convention, there was so much focus on the black vetting of the speeches,

particularly melania trump's speech which committed plagiarism. the most devastating thing was to let trump say the thing he said. a political vet would have said this line does not need to be in this speech because it is crazily self-involved and ego maniacal. >> rose: and they made suggest hinting of fascism. >> and there is some material to work with there, but to hear that in his own word and throw it back and say this is not -- america is not about one person who can fix things, america is about we, not i. that became a very powerful line and was true in obama and hillary clinton's speech and -- >> rose: she challenged trump and looked in the camera and said, no, no, no, wrong, donald. i thought she had more presence

she'd had than before. mrs. obama seemed to me to be having a conversation with the audience, everybody else was making a speech and she seemed to have a conversation. >> we talked about this out there. i think it was one of the great convention speeches i've ever personally witnessed. it was also one of the shortest. it was beautifully structured and didn't actually attack trump by name but i have to a devastating takedown of donald trump and it wasn't overtly partisan. she was able to do this without offending the people -- or many people who have been attracted to trump. >> rose: do you agree. the line that sticks out, there are so m but when they go low, we go high, to lambast that critique of him without singling him out and trying to remind americans we're an aspirational nation, don't let fear drive your decision-making and seizing that hand of history

and what it meant to her as a black woman to have two black daughters on the lawn of the white house and living in a house built by black slaves. they may not remember much more about the speech, but they will remember that hillary clinton got stronger and more confident as she went along. but that speech will stick in people's minds and what kind of message and themes and what america in the best of times is supposed to be about. >> rose: we have lots to talk about. >> one thing i think is important to john's point, it was not explicitly political but very political. michelle obama's speech. it was a great speech. one of the most powerful ads this cycle says children watching donald trump speak. this argument is what michelle obama was talking about by employing her daughters. she is basically making the argument the they are reinforcin

advertising around the country is this is a president you might be ashamed of, who you would not want to have as a role model for your kids. so her speech dovetailed with what they are doing in a more traditional, political avenues out there in paid media and i think you will hear that all the way through november which is is this really what you want your kids to have as a role model for the next four to eight years? >> rose: katy often said in a presidential election it depends on a referendum on who or what. did the democrats come closer to making donald trump the issue which will be the question of this election, a referendum on donald trump? >> i think they did. we'll have to see what sort of convention bump she gets in the polls but i believe this convention was a cohesive way to say donald trump is not the answer to all your problems. donald trump did not only say i alone can fix this but he said on the campaign trail, i will give you everything.

you can make your historical comparisons to that. but donald trump is not someone who can go into washington and fix everything and make everything better and give the american public everything they want. this is an image he's portraying that ultimately he's out there for himself like he's accusing the democrats of being. he only cares about his poll numbers, to talk about himself and cares about how he's doing. that message has not gone over with donald trump supporters and those who want change in washington because they see him as someone with faults who can go in and stir things up and throw a theoretical bomb into capitol hill and make the change. they don't want that. they don't care. donald trump isn't a perfect messenger but it's their messenger. the task at hand for the democrats is to find a way to effectively poke holes in his armor and image. who is he as a businessman? is he as great and grand as he claims to be? who is he as a humanitarian if

does he give as much to charity as he says? does he give as much and help other people as much as he says? so far they're starting to do that. some of the republicans in the primary utterly failed at. >> rose: michael bloomberg a successful businessman came out there to make that point. >> he certainly did. yeah, that was a speech that he laid it on the line and said, look, i am a businessman and most importantly in that speech i am an independent and that was the key thing about that speech, too, was an overt appeal to independent people who may be doing the slide rule over to this candidate and are not there with the message of saying this is not a credible position for this man in terms of being a businessman, i'm a businessman and i know. >> hillary clinton has a bigger challenge. making the case against trump is one thing and they did that effectively. convincing people who have doubts about her. they boff have sky-high negatives. what the convention needed to do

is not simply make the case that donald trump is temperamentally unfit or can't be trusted or is not qualified, they need to make the case that hillary clinton can be trusted and now wide swaths of the electorate have serious doubts about that. >> rose: but did she make some progress in that. >> i think she did. >> rose: it can be determined by how well you can reduce your negatives. >> right now we have the extraordinary circumstance where we've never seen where both parties nominees are seen negatively by the majority of the electorate. so i think she did make some progress there. you know, we got the sense earlier before the speech, senior clinton people were saying she was going to expressly acknowledge that people have doubts about her and i didn't quite hear that in her speech. >> the other thing she has to do, i think, is this is overwhelmingly a change election and the truth is -- you know and because of trump's positions on a lot of issues, the left-right

continuum has been scrambled. it's more this is more of an eelection about outside versus inside. we can talk about the bernie sanders moment earlier in the convention where there was a lot of upheaval on first day one and end of day two, there is a lot of energy for change outside. >> rose: that is what bill clinton intended to do, suggest she was a change agent. >> it's a tough case to make. to be clear, the number of times you heard him say that reflects the fact they understand that they have the vulnerability in that area. it's a real problem because again people want change. there is a lot of energy on the populist outside, being the insider candidate who's the candidate of continuity in this cycle is a disadvantage that hillary clinton has to overcome. i'm not sure she made that much progress. she pulled barack obama very close. but there is advantages and disadvantages to that. >> rose: the idea is if this is a third term for barack

obama, that is not change. >> also the case, given the way the electoral college works and the way our elections have been for the last five consecutivive elections is if hillary clinton can hold on to all of barack obama's voters she can hold on to the election. there's a rhetorical downside to being seen as the third term. but if she can get the obama voters to come after her, she will win handily. >> rose: explain. i asked everybody about. this how is it that the right track wrong track poll is so high in terms of america's on the wrong track yet, at the same time, barack obama, the president of the united states is experiencing very good numbers? >> i'll tell you two things about this. four years ago, barack obama's wrong track number is quite high

yet he won the election quite handedly. when people say the country is on the wrong track, you don't know anything about who they're blaming. if you ask pollsters in both parties, a fair number are saying the country is on the wrong track because of republican obstructionism in congress. so it's a really blunt instrument and doesn't tell you that much about it. all it tells you is the coarse reading of people being concerned but not who they blame or why they're concerned about where the country is headed. >> it makes it harderred to run the stay the course campaign if people think we're going in the wrong direction. >> rose: a number of inside political people said this election will turn on turnout, that that's what's crucial and that's what the democrats are most concerned about. they know they have the constituency, they know they've come out of a good convention with no mistakes and in fact very good speeches including by the candidate but they worry about turnout. >> they've got to inspire

voters to vote for them. donald trump has done a good job of inspiring voters to come out for him. the older white men and women who feel they maybe have been disenfranchised or left behind in the progressive economy and with the last eight years of a progressive president, they wanted to go back to the way things were before when coal mining jobs still existed, when manufacturing jobs still were very beneficial, when there wasn't globalism. so hillary clinton needs to find a way to inspire her voters, progressive voters, bernie sanders voters, but also minority voters and the latino vote will be huge in this election if they come out and vote in the numbers that the democrats hope they do. so far, with the latino vote in the past, it hasn't been as strong as a turnout as the democrats may have hoped. so far it's been okay for them in the past eight years because they were able to beat mitt romney and joh john mccain, but the latino and african-american vote could sway this election entirely if they go to the polls

and that the what the democrats have to work on at the moment. the republicans will do their best to get the turnout on the older white side to be as high as it possible can to mitigate that. when i asked about outreach for african-americans and latinos, the answer from the campaign even for women is don't worry about it, we're going to do it, it's going to be fine, or donald trump saying yesterday he believes the women vote will be a sleeper vote for him. so no real outreach coming from the donald trump campaign. >> rose: i think the democrats' answer to turnout is barack obama. i think that's what he's there to do. undoubtedly. this is the thing that will appeal to you, being the lover of narrative that you are. >> rose: and speeches. one of the great stories of this week is the role barack obama played in this regard. you think about back to four years ago when you had barack obama, an incumbent president facing stiff head winds. he turns to bill clinton, the

husband of the woman whey defeated in 2008 to be the ultimate validator. clinton goes out in charlotte and gives one of the great speeches of his life, moved the needle, validated obama on the economy, people in the obama campaign will say that was one of the most important moments in the entire campaign. four years later, hillary clinton facing head winds, who does she turn to to validate? barack obama, who is able to return the favor to the clinton family by going out and giving the speech which as much as anything buzz not just about taking down trump or testifying for hillary clinton, it was about him saying to his coalition, you've got to be with her the way you were with me. that's one of the big questions, will the barack obama coalition turn out when he's not on the ballot. that was to say to these groups, the stakes are high and you must be with this woman to protect my legacy. >> donald trump's closest advisors believe brexit is a close parallel with this case.

they think it's a movement and they think there is more disruption at stake. if you say the old models don't apply, pennsylvania, ohio, et cetera, that he can't get the votes, they believe that's not true. we're looking at a scenario, even when the math doesn't seem to work with them with hutch horribly low ratings along latinos and african-americans, they still believe this is more of a movement. they're looking at such a close parallel that we could be experiencing a truly disruptive moment where we're not modeling correctly for his base and turnout. >> the minority vote in the u.k. doesn't closely compare to the minority vote in the u.s., so they don't have that in their favor right now. >> rose: one question about hillary clinton. there was much criticism about donald trump because he was never specific in terms of what he would do. she seemed to layout goals but not necessarily the steps to get there. >> they did on her web site.

at's exactly right. she laid out the big goals, many perfectly into with the big goelz of the bernie sanders movement. this is a left platform. >> rose: often criticized by not being specific enough. >> and bernie sanders was certainly criticized for maybe laying out the big goals but how are you going to get there and pay for all, this there weren't a lot of specifics. and whatever happened to the national debt? whatever happened to the budget issue here? >> rose: one thing we haven't touched on is tim kaine as the vice president and his speech and how he helps her. >> i thought that senator kaine -- >> rose: you haven't thought about this, have you? >> no, i've thought about it a lot. the most important thing about that pick is they are super comfortable together. i think he makes her better, she makes him a little better. i think his speech was particularly fantastic. >> rose: believe me -- went on too long. his impression of trump needs

a little work. >> but i think the bottom line is we always come back to the fact that running mates do not matter. if they clear the bar for qualifying to be president, we move on. a debate between mike pence and tim kaine will be like between vanilla ice cream and marshmallow fluff, especially when you have twoigures that are so hugely polerrizing and famous people at the top of the ticket, the bottom of the ticket won't matter much because it's hillary clinton and donald trump. >> but i think pence normalizes him sometimes, although i think it won't matter. he has been quite strong in terms of a presence and mike pence can be someone who can and is looked at as making him seem more on message and can keep him there. i think he helps not so much with voters but with donald and keeping him disciplined. >> the issue is donald trump doesn't necessarily listen to mike pence or anybody on his

team. we saw this in the past few days. mike pence said there will be serious consequences if any foreign intelligence agency, russia, hacks into an american system. saying that repeatedly. donald trump dismissed that. tweeting he's open to russia handing over the e-mails if they have them and saying so in a press conference. governor pence's statement on russian hacking came during donald trump's press conference the other day in which we was saying he welcomed russia to get the e-mails, governor pence are saying there are serious consequences. the issue that the two of them are die metrically opposed when it comes to messaging, pence said there should be no name calling. it's almost blind to the fact his running mate is the chief name caller now. >> it's the greatest odd pairing since mccain and palin.

i don't think it will be very influential in terms of trump. may be some of that impact. won't be out there as much as kaine is out with clinton but i think that pick may be more because it reassured republicans what are we doing. pence is a known quantity, well liked among conservatives and evangelicals. >> trump apparently gave him a plane and pence was talking last night about how much he enjoys the plane, even though it's small than trump's plain. i don't think they'll see those two in the same room very often between now and november. >> rose: national security issues, including the issue of suggesting that russia go in and ask for the email she deleted. will there be an investigation of that or is it over. >> no doubt there will be an investigation by the f.b.i. over the d.n.c. email hack.

i think the bigger issue is tissue katy was talking about which is -- >> rose: trump is suggesting they go hacking. >> but even the bigger question which is the relationship between trump and putin which is now an issue journalists are interested in knowing about. you've got a situation where you have a republican nominee who praised vladimir putin as being a better leader than the current united states president. you have a russian president who praised donald trump and prefer to see trump than hillary clinton win and the huge possibility that everyone now believes is almost certainly true that russia is actively trying to interfere in a u.s. election, so what are trump's ties to russia? what are the links in terms of business and financing? >> rose: why is it almost certain they're trying to interfere in an american election? because it's one thing to hack the d.n.c. and the other thing to have a favorite, if you think by hacking and releasing e-mails that you will get your guy

elected. >> i think the fact that trump and putin publicly praise each other, that we have almost conclusive evidence that it was russia in the d.n.c. email hack to disrupt the democratic national convention, the timing, it's circle but on a primafacia basis -- >> rose: the premiere leader who fled to russia was one of his client. >> exactly. and this is an issue journalists, are delving into, including trump's statement. they're looking at the d.c.c.c. in terms of the hack and the timing of the things was it held by intentionally, but it's all circle but points in that direction. >> putin thinks the united states is constantly interfering with russian politics. every nonprofit -- >> rose: putin is convinced the c.i.a. was behind the

dismissal and the streets in kiev that led to the light of annyanukovich. >> in terms of national security, i thought one of the really remarkable moments was general allen giving that speech and seeing very loud bernie sanders supporters out there basically booing and heckling almost any mention of the u.s. military. >> rose: leon panetta as well. panetta had that as well. >> rose: i think kazir khan, a muslim-american whose son was killed, that was an emotional moment. >> and when he was talking about his son, donald trump was at a rally and he was talking about bringing back water boarding and saying it should happen because i.s.i.s. cuts off heads.

sand he said he would renegotiae the geneva convention. it was a marked contrast between what was going on the stage between donald trump bringing out the u.s. constitution and then talking about waterboarding. even though he's been criticize bid nearly even on that. >> rose: if donald trump is elected president you get the impression the first hundred days are going to be spent renegotiating all of america's agreements. >> and you have the reality that both these nominees are about to start receiving their classified intelligence briefings next week and people in the intelligence community are concerned about doing the briefings for trump because they're afraid he'll go out -- >> rose: they're worried he will inadvertently disclose.

>> or advertently. >> rose: or vertentli (laughter) >> or his inability to control his impulses that he will blurt it out and it's been thought he should be given fake intelligence tests to see if he can hold his tongue. >> hillary clinton is said to not to be given briefings because she gave out information in her e-mails. >> we have two people who have had serious problems with the truth. they both -- you know, trump often stretches, bends, breaks, disregards what is fact, and hillary clinton obviously has a history and reputation with voters for being someone who is also not throw it -- not exhibiting a particularly

affinity to the truth. >> the irony is the public wants washington to start working again and that's why they say they're frustrated. but we have two politicians and a spectrum that's nor divided than ever. so saying donald trump will be able to reach across the aisle is harder to understand by the minute, and given the amount of vitriol against hillary clinton with paul ryan saying she shouldn't be given classified information and the ongoing is a dpa of her e-mails, you wonder how anything will get done if these are the two politicians we have to put up at the moment. >> rose: thank you all for coming here after a long, long week. >> we need a collective nap. >> rose: we do. i intend to get mine. we'll be right back. stay with us. >> rose: over the past two weeks, we have witnessed

political oratory by family members, politicians and candidates. this week in philadelphia, here are some of the things that were said that caught our eye and our ear. >> now we are here tonight because america faces a choice. the choice of a new president. on one side is a man who inherited a fortune from his father and kept it going by cheating people, by skipping out on debts. a man who has never sacrificed anything for anyone. a man who cares only for himself every minute of every day. on the other side is one of the smartest, toughest, most tenacious people on this planet, a woman who fights for children, for women, for healthcare, for human rights, a woman who fights for all of us and who is strong enough to win those fights.

>> one day, i was driving her to the airport to fly back to chicago, when we passed h this little brick house that had a for sale sign on it, and she said, boy, that's a pretty house. it had 1,100 square feet, an at tick fan and no air condition -- an attic fan and no air conditioner in hot arkansas and a screened-in porch. hillary commented on what a uniquely designed and beautiful house it was. so i took a big chance -- i bought the house. my mortgage was $175 a month. when she came back, i picked her up and i said, you remember that house you liked? she said, yeah. i said, while you were gone, i bought it. you have to marry me now. the third time was the charm. (cheering)

we were married -- we were married in that little house on october 11, 1975. i married my best friend. i was still in awe, after more than four years of being around her, at how smart and strong and loving and caring she was, and i really hoped that her choosing me and rejecting my advice to pursue her own career was a decision she would never regret. >> hillary clinton understands that if someone in this country works 40 hours a week, that person should not be living in poverty. she understands that we must

raise the minimum wage to a living wage, and she is determined to create millions of new jobs by rebuilding our crumbling infrastructure, our roads, bridges, water systems and waste water plants. >> hillary understands that the president is about one thing and one thing only, it's about leaving something better for our kids. that's how we've always moved this country forward by all of us coming together on behalf of our children. folks who volunteer to coach the team or teach is sunday school class because they know it takes a village. heros of every color and creed who wear the uniform and risk their lives to keep passing down those blessings of liberty. police officers and the protesters in dallas who all desperately want to keep our

children safe. people who lined up in orlando to donate blood because it could have been their son, that daughter in that club. (cheers and applause) leaders like tim kaine. (cheers and applause) who show our kids what decency and devotion look like. leaders like hillary clinton, who has the guts and the grace to keep coming back and putting those cracks in that highest and hardest glass ceiling until she finally breaks through, lifting all of us along with her. that is the story of this country. the story that has brought me to the stage tonight, the story of generations of people.

who the lash of bondage, the shame of servitude, the sting of segregation, but who kept on striving and hoping and doing what needed to be done so that, today, i wake up every morning in a house that was built by slaves. (cheers and applause) and i watch my daughter, two beautiful, intelligent black young women playing with their dogs on the white house lawn. (cheers and applause) >> we all understand what it will mean for our daughters and granddaughters when hillary clinton walks into the oval office as president of the united states of america! (cheers and applause) it will change their lives! my daughters and granddaughters can do anything any son or grandson can do! think about that.

think about everything you learned as a child, no matter where you were raised, how can there be pleasure in saying "you're fired"? he's trying to tell us he cares about the middle class? give me a break! that's a bunch of malarkey! >> there are times when i disagree with hillary clinton, but let me tell you, whatever our disagreements may be, i've come here to say we must put them aside for the good of our country. (applause) and we must unit around the candidate who can defeat a dangerous demagogue. (cheering) i believe it's the duty of all american citizens to make our

voices heard by voting in this election, and if you're not yet registered to vote, go online and do it now. this is just too important to sit out. >> standing here -- standing here as my mother's daughter and my daughter's mother, i'm so happy this day has come. i'm happy for grandmothers and little girls and everyone in between. i'm happy for boys and men because, when any barrier falls in america, it clears the way for everyone! (cheers and applause) after all, when there are no ceilings, the sky is the limit. (cheers and applause) >> rose: andrew solomon is here, author and lecturer on

psychology, politics and culture. his personal account of depression in the "noon day demon" won the national book awar in 2001. in 2012 he won the national book critic circle award for the book "far from the tree." his latest book, "far and away: reporting from the brink of change, seven continents, twenty-five years." i am pleased to welcome andrew solomon back to this table, welcome. >> what a pleasure to be here. >> rose: basically, what you're arguing is we would all be a lot better off if we traveled far more from adolescence, on. >> i believe that travel is really a moral imperative and that we live in a globalized world. some people don't like that, but it's true, and that when we close ourselves off from other places and don't encounter them and don't experience them, we don't understand the world we're living in and we have a lot of unnecessary fear and a lot of ultimately serious dysfunction as a result. >> rose: that's almost an essential truth about relationships, whether they are

racial or whether they are cultural or political not to clearly understand or to say in the expression once that, you know, never criticize somebody until you've walked a mile in their moccasins. >> and young said, if you do not know someone, you are likely to regard him as a fool. i think if you don't know a place, you're likely to regard it as ridiculous. when you start encountering places, suddenly the world opens up to you. >> rose: what has it done for you? >> i think it's made me more aware of what is american and what is universal. i have an ability to distinguish between those. it's also given me a sense that a lot of the places that we see as sinister and threatening are actually places where people are full of hope for making things better and that when we talk about our enemies and we talk about the chaos in the world and we talk about building walls to keep immigrants out of our country and so on, it's based on a real misunderstanding of what the gentleness is and the kindness that can be found as

you encounter other places. >> rose: with all of the wisdom you have acquired, how do you travel today? what's a journey for you about? >> there is a distinction between tourism and travel. tourism involves going and looking at something and then leaving. travel involves going and engaging with it. i think the most overrated virtue of our time is journalistic neutrality and that when you go someplace you change it in some small way and part of your job is to engage and change it in order to recount it. >> rose: tell me what that means. >> well, to meet people, to look at what's working in their system, to look at what isn't working, to stand with them shoulder to shoulder. i stood in line protesting against tanks and moscow at the soviet union. i helped bring artists together in afghanistan when i was reporting there. it's to bring together people who might not otherwise be brought together and to amplify their voices.

it was said please use your liberty to enhance ours. >ours. the muslim problem in myanmar is i was struck by tin credible stow simple of the people i -- stostoiickism. this woman took a job and could be sent to jail and she did it. she spent years in prison. i said what was that experience like for you? she said i had the most marvelous time. i said, in a burmese prison? she said the objective of our captors was to make us as miserable as possible and i knew if i walked in there if i could

have a good time in prison their punishment failed and i would have won. i had a bunch of prison friends, and some were prostitutes and thieves, we'll still get together and have lunch once a month, they are still some of my favorite people in the world. >> rose: what's your most favorite place? >> bolivia and mongolia. i have the biggest connection with england and russia. the place that i didn't expect to like and then loved was afghanistan. i thought afghanistan would be a hardship posting and i would come back with an interesting story after an awful week. i never went anywhere where i felt more welcomed, celebrated or embraced or where people were thinking more deeply about questions of what freedom is and how it could unfold. >> rose: you found people who read your books? >> yes, which is gratifying and people who watched me on your

show which is also gratifying. >> you were kidnapped in ecuador. >> i was when i was quite young. we went there to see ruins. the guide said there's been unrest in the area but i guess we could go. we went up and saw them, no one was there. we were coming back and suddenly arrived on a mountainous road and there was an enormous boulder, couldn't go forward. we stopped, not sure what happened. then suddenly a group of people jumped out from behind bushes and smashed the windshield and slashed the tires and we were taken and put in a hut and told the people in that area were in revolt against the central government of ecuador because they didn't like paying taxes. i said i wasn't so crazy about paying taxes either and we had actually four or five hours where we were held before let go. >> rose: you were brought in for questioning in libya? travel can be adventurous. >> i wanted to go to libya.

i went. i told by people at the libya representation at the u.n. they would help me get in. i couldn't get in. i filled out my form, admitted to being an american journalist. i had a british passport and went instead as a british christian archeologist. i got my visa. i arrived in tripoli and assigned to the head of an international press office an organization devoted to keeping the international press at bay. ca gadhafi's was the most dreary police states. >> rose: you visited north korea? >> i haven't visited there. but grimmer than the soviet union and places in china and other places that are repressive. i was called in everyday to meet with people in the international

press office. they would question me, they knew everything i was doing. they were monitoring everything i was doing and i kept trying to get an appointment to go to the gadhafi compound which is a great goal and then i went to a meeting, a meeting of what were called the basic people's congresses. i had gone there to observe. but halfway through somebody said, and now we have with us an american who will stand up and address us on the future of the u.s.-libyan relationship and i stood up in the audience of 5,000 people and tried to make my way through discourse about what a wonderful thing lay ahead of us. the next day i was on the cover of the biggest newspaper and got my invitation from gadhafi. >> rose: what did it say? i had said the fact that gadhafi called immediately after 9/11 meant something to americans and said american journalist says gadhafi's response to 9/11 shows he is friend to the united states and

future is hopeful. >> rose: that was the interpretation at the time. >> yes. >> rose: he was one of the early people to respond? >> early people to respond. he was one of the early people to give up his nuclear arsenal. there wasn't much of one but he gave that up. >> rose: he gave it up after the response. >> later. >> rose: he really gave it up after the u.s. had attacked iraq. >> but he was very frightened by al quaida and he was very trying tanned by islamic creamism altogether. and his son safe who was seen as a savior was put in prison for crimes. >> rose: he'll never stand charge in the hague or anywhere else. >> does not appear so. >> rose: did they store away a lot of money. >> an enormous amount. some of it has been found unfrozen but there is a great deal that's very shady. >> rose: what are the numbers they ascribe to him having

stolen? >> i've heard a variety of figures. i've heard between $10 billion and billion is what eheard -- $10 billion and $15 billion is what i heard. >> rose: why didn't they kill him at the building? because there was no scral government to speak of and those who got him first -- >> those who got him first thought he would be a good bargaining chip and thought they could exchange him for favors they wanted with people in power. it became clear holding him wasn't doing them good. i think libya was a humbling situation. i wrote at the time it would be great if we could get rid of gadhafi. >> rose: do you still believe that? >> no, i believe gadhafi was terrible but what followed was worse. people don't revert to democracy, when you take away supervision they revert to chaos. >> rose: do you feel same about iraq?

>> i do. if we had rebuilt afghanistan instead of invading iraq, we could have spent the money differently and had an ally where we need one. i think the martial plan is the most successful piece of diplomacy and over and over again we don't narrowly it. >> rose: afghanistan is interesting because, at the time, assuming they had stayed and everybody seems to argue at this table that the war in afghanistan suffered because of the focus on iraq, and now you look at the taliban have come roaring back and there is some hope for negotiation but it looks -- >> there is end less hope for negotiation but the situation degenerated terribly. many in afghanistan most committed to rebuilding the country had to flee. they have children and have gone to other country and become refugees. if we rebill it not only would we have established a real alliance, we would have established also a base for

people not to be running away from their own ecountry and their own place and that would you have affected all of the issues of immigration we are facing. >> rose: "far and away: reporting from the brink of change, seven continents, twenty-five years," a collection of essays about his life on the road dedicated for olivia, lucy, blaine and george, who have given me a reason to stay home. >> those are my children. >> rose: four. four. and i've written a bit in the book about traveling with children. when i started traveling with them, people said but they're much too young, they'll never remember the places you're taking them. i said, in the first place, i'll remember it, so there is validity in that, but i also feel like they'll grow up with the knowledge that there are different ways to live and different places to be and different attitudes to take, and recently i asked pi son george the -- my son george, if you could go anywhere in the world -- george is seven -- i

said, where would you like to go? he thought for a second and said, syria. i said, syria? george, why would you want to go to syria? >> rose: they're killing people there. >> he said, somebody has to tell those people about unacceptable behavior. >> rose: very good. good for george. he has a bright future. this is what you said in the dedication -- think of the long trip home. should we have stayed home and thought of here? where should we be today? continent, city, country, society? the choke is never wide and never free, and here or there, no, should we have stayed at home? wherever that may be. elizabeth bishop, questions of travel. >> thank you. >> rose: see you next time. for more about this program and earlier episodes, join us online

at charlierose.com. >> rose: funding for "charlie rose" has been provided by: captioning sponsored by rose communications >> rose: funding for "charlie rose" has been provided by: >> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. captioned by captioned by media access group at wgbh

man: it's like holy mother of comfort food.ion. kastner: throw it down. it's noodle crack. patel: you have to be ready for the heart attack on a platter. crowell: okay, i'm the bacon guy. man: oh, i just did a jig every time i dipped into it. man #2: it just completely blew my mind. woman: it felt like i had a mouthful of raw vegetables and dry dough. sbrocco: oh, please. i want the dessert first! [ laughs ] i told him he had to wait.