captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc >> i know more about isis than the generals do. believe me. >> i have sat at that table in the situation room. >> nobody knows the system better than me.e i alone can fix it. >> close my campaign focused on opportunities for kids and fairness for families. >> hillary fails on the economy. everything she touched. >> even if you're totally -- yoy may still have some questions about me.

>> woodruff: good evening. >> ifill: welcome to this pbs "newshour" special coverage of the firstou debate between the o major party presidential candidates. hillary clinton and donald trump. the stage is set at hofstra university on long island, new york, where the election is 43 days away the race tightening a lot is on the line tonight, judy. >> woodruff: it is, gwen.we given first time this is the first time they faced each other one on one. lester holt of nbc news will be moderating joining us are our regular contributors syndicated columnist, mark shields, "new york times" columnist, david brooks and from the "cook a political report" amy walter. we welcome all you have here for the next two hours. amy, start with you, what are you looking for? >> each has enthusiasm gapp problem, they got to get their partisans fired up for hillary clinton it's youngan people.o for donald trump he's got to get those white college educated

voters back to the republican b fold where they have been. get those voters, both of them who are torn, don't like either choice they have to pick them. geep what would you surprise you the most of what these candidates might or might not d tonight? >> donald trump dare to be boring? does he come out sedated? /president call and can hillary clinton who is a superior deliverer of information, make an emotional connection to the american voters. v >> woodruff: david, what are you on the edge of your seat? >> i wrote emotional connection. this is not philosophy or strategy that's moment ofte intimacy, that one unscripted moment when unconscious reveals that will be played on youtube over and over again and so it's just -- is he commanding or cruel? is she relatable and is she seem calmly smart. and it's whether people get that vibe the first vibe that will determine. >> is this what they know or who

they some are. >> i think it's mostly about who they are.. for voters at this stage of the game, they are looking on the dias who they can spend the nex four years with, who they want to invite into their home. many say i don't want either one of them. >> ifill: a lot of voters. this is the one, maybe thatay they're not going to like but feel comfortable enough.fo >> woodruff: mark, people are going to be fact checking this debate. they're going to be raising questions about whether what either one said. >> s you're right, judy. what they know, it will be a short evening if we ask the republicans whose knowledge bank has been over drawn. d and i think it's about eachac case, what does he know, is i command of it, comfortable with it. who she s. and i think that is really the question. >> this is agenda politics. >> ifill: we're turning to lester holt. >> sponsored by the commission c

on presidential debates a nonpartisan, nonprofit organization. commission drafted tonight'sofco format and the rules have been agreed to by the campaigns. the 90-minute debate is divided into six segments each 15 minutes long.ng we'll explore three topic areas tonight, achieving prosperity, america's direction and securing america.g at the start of each segmentm i'll ask the same lead-off question to both candidates they will each have up to two minutem to respond. from that point until the end of the segment there will be open discussion. the questions are mine have note been shared with the commission or the campaigns. the audience here in the room has agreed to remain silence so that we can focus on what the candidates are saying.yi i will invite to you applaud, however, at this moment, as we welcome the candidates. democratic nominee for president of the united states, hillary clinton.of and republican nominee for president of the united states, donald j. trump.

[ cheering and applause ] >> good luck to you, thank you. >> thank you. >> i don't expect us to coverus all the issues of this campaign tonight but i remind everyone there are two more presidential debates scheduled.ba we are going to focus on many on the issues that voters tell us are most important and we're going to press for specifics. i am honored to have this role this evening belongs to the candidates, just as important to the american people.or candidates, we look forward to hearing you articulate your policies and positions as welll as your visions and your values. let's begin. we're calling this openingpe segment achieving prosperity. and central to that is jobs.

there are two economic realitiea in america today, there's been a record six or eight years of job growth and new census numbers show incomes increased atd recovered rate after years of stagnation. however, income inequality remains significant, nearly half of americans are living paychecn to paycheck. beginning with you, secretary clinton, why are you a betterin choice than your opponent toon create the kinds of jobs that will put more money into the pockets of american workers? >> well, thank you, lester, thanks to hofstra for hosting us. the central question in this election is really what kind of country we want to be and whatbe kind of future we'll build together. today is my granddaughter's second birthday so iy think abt this a lot. first, we have to build an economy that works for everyone, not just those at the top. that means, we need new jobs, good jobs with rising incomes. i want us to invest in you, i, want us to invest in your future. that means jobs in

infrastructure, in advanced manufacturing. innovation and technology, clean renewallable energy and small business, because most of the new jobs will come from smallco business. we also have to make the economy fairer. that starts with raising the national minimum wage and also guarantee finally equal way for women's work. say also want to see morere companies do profit sharing, if you help create the profit you p should be able to share in them not just the executives at theut top. and i want us to do more to support people who are struggling to balance family and work. i've heard from so many of you about the difficult choices you face and the stresses that you're under.u' so let's have paid family leave. earned sick days, let's be sure we have affordable child care and debt-free college.re how are we going to do it? by everything the wealthy pay their fair share and close the corporate loopholes.at

finally, we, tonight, are on the stage together, donald trump ann i. donald, it's good to be with you. we're going to have a debate where we are talking about the important issuesab facing our country. you have to judge us, who can shoulder the immense, awesome responsibilities of the presidency. who can put into action the plan that will make your life better. i hope that i will be able to earn your vote on nor 8th. is. >> secretary clinton, thank you. mr. trump same question. q putting more money into thehe pockets of american workers, you have up to two minutes. >> thank you, lester. our jobs are fleeing the country, they're going to mexico, they're going to many other countries. you look what china is doing ton our country in terms of makingak our product. they're devaluing their currencc and there's nobody in our i government to fight them. and we have a very good fight and we have a winning fight because they are using our

country as a piggy bank to rebuild china and many other countries are doing the same thing. so, we're losing our good jobs, so many of them.th when you look at what's happening in mexico, a friend of mine who builds plants said the 8th wonder of the world, anywhere in the world, some of sophisticated, some of the best plants.la with the united states, as you said, not so much. ford is leaving. you see small car division leaving. thousands of jobs leaving michigan, leaving ohio. as far as child compare is concerned hillary and i agree on that we probably disagree a little bit as to numbers and amounts and what we're going tot do but perhaps will be talking about that later. but we have to stop our jobs from being stolen from us, we have to stop our companies from leaving the united states and

with it, firing all of their people. all you have to do is stay a a look at carrier air conditioning in indianapolis, they left 1400 people, they're going to mexico. i'll be reducing taxes tremendously from 35% to 15% for companies. small and big businesses. that's going to be a job creatoe like we haven't seen sincee ronald reagan. it's going to be a beautiful thing to watch. companies will come, they will build, they will expand, new companies will start and i look very, very much forward to doing it we have to renegotiate ourre trade deals and have to stop these countries from stealing our companies and our jobs. >> would you like to respond? >> i that i trade is an important issue, of course we are 5% of the world's population, we have to trade with the other 95%. and we need to have smart, fairt

trade deals. we also, though, need to have a tax system that rewards work and not just financial transaction. and the kind of plan that donald has put forth would be trickle down economics, all over again.n in fact it would be the most extreme version, the biggest tax cuts for the top percent of the people in this country thaty we've ever had. i call it trumped up trickle down, because that's exactly what it would be. that is not how we grow the economy. we just have a different view about what's best for growinggr the economy. how we make investments thatts will actually produce jobs and rising income. i think we come at it from somewhat different perspectivesc i understand that. donald was very fortunate in his life and that's all to his benefit. he started his business with $14 million borrowed from his father he really believed that the more youhe have help wealthy people,l the better off we'll be and tha

everything will work out from there. i don't buy that. i have a different experience, my father was a small businessman, he worked really hard.rd he printed drapery fabric onbr long tables where he pulled out those fabrics and went down with a silk screen and dumped the paint in took the squeegee keptu going. so i whate i believe is more we can do for the middle class, the more we can invest in you, your education, your skills, your future. the better we will be off and the better we'll grow, that'st' the kind of economy i want us tt see again. >> let me follow up with mr. trump you've talked about creating 25 million jobs you y promise to bring back millions of jobs for americans. how are we going to bring backac the industries that have left this country for cheaper labor overseas? how specifically are you going to tell american manufacturers that you have to come back? >> well, for one thing, before we start on behalf of my father gave me small loan in 1975 i built into a company that'spa worth many billions of dollars with some of the greatest assets

in the world and i say that only because that's the kind of o thinking that our country needs our country is in deep trouble, we don't know what we're doing when it comes to devaluations and all of these countries allal over the world especially china, they're the best, the best ever at it. what they're doing to us is a very, very sad thing. so, we have to do that, we havea to renegotiate our trade deals. they are taking our jobs, giving incentives, they're doing things thativ frankly we don't do. let me give you the example of mexico. they have a tax in a different system, we sell in to mexico, there's a tax when they sell -- automatic, 16% approximately.au when they sell into us, there's no tax. it's a defective agreement. it's been defective for a long time, many years. but the politician haven't done anything about it. i in all fairness to secretary clinton, yes, is that okay, good, i want you to be very happy. very important to me. but in all fair tons secretary

clinton, when she started talking about this it was really very recently, should she's beeh doing this for 30 years. and why hasn't she made the agreements better? after -- nafta agreement is defective because of the tax and many other reasons but just because -- >> let me interrupt -- secretary clinton and others, politicians should have been doing thispo for years. not right now.no because of the fact that we'vet created a movement.ea they should have been doing this for years. what's happened to our jobs and our country and our economy, generally, is, look, we owe $20 trillion. we cannot do it any longer. >> cow r how do you bring back manufacturing jobs? >> first thing do you don't let the jobs leave. i could name, there are thousands of them, they're leaving. they're leaving in bigger numbers than ever. and what you do is you say, fine, you want to go to mexico with some pore country, good luck, we wish you a lot of luck.

but if you think you're going tg make your air conditioners oror cars or your cookies or whatever you make and bring them into our country without a tax, you're wrong. and once you say you're going to have to tax them coming in our politicians never do this, t because they have special interests and it is special interests want those companies to leave because in many cases they own it is companies. so, what i'm saying is, we can stop them from leaving, we have to stop them from leaving and that's a big, big factor. >> let me let secretary clintonc in. >> let's stop for a second remember where we were. eight years ago. we had the worst financial crisis, the great recession, worst since the 1930s. that was in large part because of tax policies that slashed tax on the wealthy, failed to invest in the middle class, took their eyes off of wall street. and created a perfect storm. in fact donald was one of the people who rooted for ther housing crisis.

he said back in 2006, gee, i hope it does collapse, because then i can go in and buy some and make some money. well, it did collapse. >> that's called business. >> nined million people. nine million people lost. and 13 trillion dollars in family wealth was wiped out. now, we have come back from that abyss. and it has not been easy. so, we're now on the precipice of having a potentially much better economy, but the lasts thing we need to do is toe go g back to the policies that failed us in the first place. independent experts have lookedn at what i've proposed, look had donald has proposed, and basically they have said this. that if his tax plan, which w would blow up the debt by over $5 trillion, and would in some instances, disadvantage middle class families compared to the wealthy were to go into effect,

we would lose 3.5 million jobs. and maybe have another recession. they have looked at my plan and they have said, okay, if we can do this, and i intend to get it done, we will have 10 million more new jobs. because we will be making investments where we can grown the economy.on take clean energy, some country to go be the clean energy superp power of the 21st century s.s. donald thinks that climate change is a t hoax perpetrated y the chinese. it's think it's real -- >> did i not -- and i think it's important that we grip this and deal with it both at home and abroad. sheer what we can d. we can deploy half billion more scholar panels, enough clean energy to power every home.en we can build a new modern electric grid.el that's a lot of jobs.f that's a lot of new economic activity. so, i've tried to be very specific about what we can and should do and i am determined

that we're going to get the economy really moving again. building on the progress we've made over the last eight year years, but never go back to what got us in trouble. >> she talks about solar panelsn we invested in the solar compana our country that was a disaster, they lost plenty of money ony that one. now, look, i am a great believer in all forms of energy, bute we're putting lot of people outp of work, our energy policies war disaster. our country is losing so much in terms of energy, in terms of paying off our debt. you can't do what you're looking to do with 20 trillion in debt. the obama administration fromat the time they have come in is over 230 years worth of debt and he's topped it. he's doubled it in course of almost eight years, 7.5 years ty go semi exact i will tell you this. we have to do a much better job at keeping our jobs.s. and we have to do much better job at giving companies

incentive to build new companies or to expand because they're not doing it. all you have to do look at michigan and look at ohio and look at all of these places where so many of their jobs and their companies are just movingo they're gone. i ask you this, you've been doing this for 30 years. why are you just thinking about this solutions right now, for 3r years you've been doing it and now you're just starting to think of solutions? excuse me, i will bring back jobs. you can't bring back globs well, actually, i have thought about a this quite a bit. a >> for 30 years. >> i have -- not quite that long. i think my husband did a pretty good job in the 1990s i thinkth a lot about what worked how we can make it again. >> he -- the single most -- ever approved -- >> income went up for everybody. manufacturing jobs went up also in thefa 1990s if we're actually going to look at the facts.ts

when i was in the senate, i had a number of trade deals thatha came before me. and i held them all to the same test. will they create jobs in america? will they raise incomes in america? are they good for our national security. some of them i voted for, the biggest one a multi-national one known as cafta i voted againstin because i hold the same standards as i look at all of these trade deals. but let's not assume that trade is the only challenge we have in the economy. i think it is a part of it. and i've said what people going to do. d i'm going to have a special prosecutor we're going toor enforce the trade deals we have. and we're going to hold people accountable when i was secretary of state, we actually increased american exports globally 30%. we increased them to china 50%. so, i know how to really work to get new jobs and to get exports that help to create more new jobs.

>> you haven't done it in 300 years or 26 years -- >> i've been a senator -- you haven't done it. >> i have been that secretary of state and i have done it. >> your husband signed nafta which was one of the worsthe things that ever happened -- >> that is your opinion. >> you go to new england, you go ohio, pennsylvania, you go anywhere you want, secretary clinton, you will see devastation where manufacturers down 30, 40, sometimes 50%. nafta is the worst trade deal,ea maybe ever signed anywhere but certainly ever signed in this country. now you want to approve transpacific partnership. you were totally in favor of of it then heard what i was sayingn how bad it is you said i can't win that debate. but you know that if you did win, you would have proved that that will be almost as bad as nafta. nothing will ever top nafta. >> that is just not accurate. i was against it once it was finally negotiated. and the terms were laid out, i wrote about that in -- >> you called it the gold standard. you called it the gold standard

of strayed deals.tr you said finest deal you've ever seen. >> no. >> then you heard what i said about it all of a sudden you were against it. >> donald i know you live in your own reality but that is not the fact the. the facts are i did say i hoped it would be a good deal. but when it was negotiated what i was not responsible for, i concluded it wasn't. i wrote about that -- >> is it president obama's fault? >> even announced -- look -- secretary is, is it president obama's fault? he's pushing it. >> there are different views about what's good for our country, our economy and our leadership in the world. i think it's important to look at what we need to do to get the economy going again. that's why in. said, new jobs wh rising incomes, investments.v not in more tax cuts that would add $5 trillion to the debt. >> but you have no plan -- - oh, i do. >> secretary, you have no plan -- >> a book about it called "stronger together" you can pick it up tomorrow.

it's at a book store or at airport near you. >> we're going to move to -- it's because, i see this we need to have strong growth, sustained growth.gr we also have to look at how we help families balance. the responsibilities at home ann the responsibilities at business. we have a very robust set of plans and people have looked at both of our plans, have concluded, that mine would create ten million jobs. yours would lose us three and a half million jobs and -- >> you are going to approve one of the biggest tax cuts -- you are going to approve one of the biggest tax increases in histo history. you are going to drive business out. your regulations are a disaster you're going to increase regulations all over the place, by the way,e my tax cut is the biggest since ronald reagan, i'g very proud of it. it will create tremendous numbers of new jobs. but regulations, you are going tot regulate these businesses t of existence. when i go around, lester i telll

you this, i've been all over. when i go around, despite the tax cut the things that businesi that people like the most is tht fact that i'm cutting regulati regulation. you have regulations on topn of regulations and new companies cannot form and old companies are going out f of business and you want to increase the real guy lakes and make them even worse. i'm going to cut regulations but i'm going to cut taxes big b league you're going to raise taxes big league, end of story. >>f let me get you to matto because we're going to -- >> that's that can't be left to stand -- >> 30 seconds. >> i assumed that there would bb a lot of these charges and claims. >> facts. >> we have taken the home page of my website, hillaryclinton.com turned it in to a fact checker. so, if you want to see in realtime what the facts are, please go and take a look. because -- >> take a look at mine also.

>> i not add penny to the debt your plans would add $5 trillion to the debt.t. i would stream lime then for small businesses. what i have proposed would be paid for by raising taxes on the wealthy, because they have made all the gains in the economy and i think it's time that the wealthy and corporations paid their fair share. >> just opened the next sessionn't. >> could i just finish -- >> if you to go our website you take the look -- going to raise taxes 1.3 trillion -- >> mr. trump -- look at her website.eb no different than this. she's telling us how to fight isis, go to her website she tells how to fight isis on her website. i don't know general douglast mark car this their would like that very much. >> ther next segment -- at least i have a plan toe fight isis. >>o excuse me. >> no, you're telling the enemy everything you want to do.ou >> , no we're not. >> you're telling the enemyen everything you want to do --

>> no wonder you've been fighting isis your entire adult life. >> that's -- please.t' fact checkers. >> you are attacking a lot we're still on the issue of achieving prosperity. i want to talk about taxes, fundamental difference betweenen the two of you concerns the wealthy, secretary clintonin you're calling for tax increasei to the wealthy americans, i'd like you to further defendant that, mr. trump your calling for tax puts i'd like to you defend that. this next two minute answer goes to you. >> i'mers really calling for mar jobs, because the wealthy aree going to create tremendous jobs. they're going to expand their companies, they're going to do o tremendous job. i'm getting rid of the carried interest position, if you look it's not a tax -- not a great thing for the wealthy it's a great thing for middle class. it's a great thing for companies to expand. and when these people are going to put billions and billions of dollars in to companies and when they're going to bring two $2.5w

trillion back from overseas where they captain bring money back because politicians like secretary clinton won't allow them toe bring money backs because taxes are so onerous and bureaucratic red tape. it's so bad.d what they're doing they're leaving our country and they're' believe it or not taxes are too high because some of them have lots of money outside of our country. instead of bringing it backit putting the money to workwo because they can't work out deal toan -- everybody agrees it shoh be brought back, instead of that they are leaving our country to get their money.mo because they can't bring theirir money back into our country. because of bureaucratic red tape. because they can't get togetherg because we have a president tha can't sit them around a table and get them to approvero something. the thing, republicans and democrats agree that thishi should be done. 2.5 trillion. i think it's double that probably $5 trillion that we can't bring into our country, lester, with a little leadership, you'd get it in here

very quickly and it could be put to use on the inner cities, lots of other things. it would be beautiful. we have no leadership. and honestly that starts with secretary clinton. >> you have two minutes on same question to defend tax increases on wealthiest americans. >> i have a w feeling by the end of this evening i'll be -- why not. yeah. just join the debate by sayingay more crazy things. now, let me -- >> nothing crazy -- it is about -- not letting our companies bring their moneye back into -- >> this is secretary clinton's two minutes please. >> let's start the clock again,n lester. we've looked at your tax proposals, i don't see changes in the corporate tax rate or the kinds of proposals you'rels referring to that would cause the repatriation bringing backac of money that is stranded overseas. i happen to -- >> you didn't read it.

>> i happen to support that in way that will actually work toll our benefit. but when i look at what you have freethrow posed, you have -- proposed, you have what is called now the trump loophole. because it would so advantaged you and the business you do. you've proposed -- >> who gave us that -- dash. this is secretary clinton's two minutes. >> tax benefit for your family.m when you look at -- >> how much for my family? >> as i said, trumped up trickle down. trickle down did not work, it got us into the mess we were in in 2008 and 20089. slashing taxes on the wealthy hasn't worked and a lot of really smart, wealthy peopleea know that. and they are saying, hey, we need to do more to make contributions we should be making to rebuild the middle class. i don't think top down works in america. i think building the middle class, investing in the middle

class, making college debt free for more young people can get g their education. helping people refinance their debt from college at a lower rate. those are the kinds of thingsng that we're really boost the economy. broad based, inclusive growth is what we need in america. not more advantages for peoplent at the very top. >> mr. trump -- typical politics. all talk, no action. sounds good. doesn't work. never going to happen. our country is suffering because people like secretary clinton have made such bad decisions in terms of our jobs and in terms of what is going on. now, look, we have the worst revival of an economy since the great depression and, believe me, we're in a bubble right now. and the only thing that looksks good is the stock market but if you raise interest rates even as little bit that's going to comea crashing down.ng we are in a big, fat, ugly bubble.

we better be awfully careful, we have a fed that is doingng political things, this janet yellen of the fed, they are doing political, keeping interest rates at this level,hi the day obama goes off, he leaves, he goes out to the golf course for the rest of his lifes to play golf, when they raise interest rates, you're going tot see some very bad things happen. because the fed is not doingo their job, the fed is being more political than secretaryan clinton. >> mr. trump we're talking abou the burden on americans have too pay yet you have not released your tax returns. the reason nominees have released their returns for decades is that voters will know if their potential president owes money to, who he owes it to and any business conflicts.co don't americans have a right to know if there are any conflicts of interest? >> i don't mind releasing. r i'm under routine audit it will be released as soon as you'd sit finished it will be released. you will learn more about donald trump is by going down to the

federal elections where i filed a 104 page essentially financial statement of sorts, forms that they have.th it shows income, in fact the income i just looked today, the income is filed at $694 million for this past year. 694 million. would you have told me i wasve going to make that 15 or 20 years ago i would have been very surprised built that's the kindu of thinking that our country needs. when we have a country that isis so badly that is being ripped off by every single country in the world, it's the kind of thinking that our country needs. because everybody, lester, we have a trade deficit with all oo the countries that we do business with, of almost $800 billion a year. you know what that is? that means who is negotiatingeg these trade deals? we have people that are political hacks negotiating ourg trade deals. >> the i.r.s. has audit of your taxes perfect ly free to release

your taxes during an audit. a so the question, does the public have right to know outweigh your -- >> i fold you i will release them as soon as audit -- look, i've been under audit almost for 15 years. i know a lot of wealthy peopleeo that have never been audited.. i said you get audited, i get ought it almost every year. in a way shy be complaining, i' not even complaining i don't mind it. i almost become a way of life.i i get todd it by i.r.s. but other people don't. i will say this. we have a situation in this country that has to be taken care of. i will release my tax returns against my lawyers' wishes. when she releases her 33,000 e-mails that have been deleted,l as soon as she releases them i will release -- i will release my tax returns and that's against my lawyers' they say t don't do it. i will tell you this, in fact, watching shows, reading the papers, almost every lawyerst says, you don't release your returns until the audit is

complete. when the you'd sit complete i'll do it. i would go against them if she releases her -- >> it's negotiable? >> it's not negotiable. no. let her. release e-mails. why did she elite 33,000. >> i'll let -- let me admonish audience one more time we did ask you to be silent it would be helpful for us, secretaryfo clinton. >> i think you've just seen another example of bait and a switch here. so 40 years everyone run for president has released their tax return. you can go see nearly i think 39, 40 years of our tax returns. but everyone has done it. we know the i.r.s. has made clear there's no prohibition on releasing it when you're under audit. you have to ask yourself, why won't he release his tax returns? i think there may be couple of reasons. first, maybe he's not as rich as he says he is. second, maybe he's not as charitable as he claims to be. third, we don't know all of his business dealings, but we have

been told through investigative reporting that he owes about $650 million to wall street and foreign banks. or maybe he doesn't want the american people. you watching tonight, to know that he's paid nothing in federal taxes because the only years thatus anybody has ever sn were couple of years when he had to turn them over to state authorities when he was trying get that casino license they showed he didn't pay any federal income tax. so. >> that makes me smart. >> that means zero for troops, zero for vets. zero for schools.o or health. and i think probably he's not all that enthusiastic about is having the rest of our country see what the real reasons ares because it must be something really important. even tear table he's trying to hide.ta and the financial disclosure statement, they don't give you the tax rate. they don't give you all the details that tax returns would.

and it just seems to me that this is something that the american people deserve to see and i have no reason to believe that he's ever going to release his tax returns. because there is something he's hiding. and we'll get, we'll keep'l guessing what it might be that he's hiding, but i think the question is, were he ever to get near the white house, what would be those conflicts?se who does he owe money to? well, he owes you, the answersrs to that she provide them. >> he also raised issue of your e-mails, you want to respond to that? >> i do. i made a mistake using a private e-mail. and if i had to do it over again i would obviously do it differently. but i'm not going to make anyan excuses, it was a mistake, i take responsibility for that. >> mr. trump? >> that was more than a mistake. that was done purposely, okay., that was not a mistake, that was

done purposely. when you have your staff taking the fifth amendment, taking the fifth, so they're not prosecut prosecuted. when you have man that set up the illegald e server taking te fifth, i think it's disgraceful. and believe me, this country thinks it's dis-- really think it'shi disgraceful also.o as far as my tax returns, you don't learn that much from tax returns, that i can tell you. you learn a lot from financial disclosure. you should go down takem a look at that.. the other thing, i'm extremely under leveraged. they report that said 650, a lot of friends of mine that know mym business that's not a lot of o money, it's not a lot of money relative to what i had. buildings that were in question they said in the samee report, which was actually wasn't even a bad story to be honest with youy but the buildings are wort $3.9 billion. and the 650 isn't even on that. but it's not 650. it's much less than that.t. but i could give you a list of o banks, if that would help you

would give you list of banks, these are very fine institutions, very fine banks if could do that very quickly. i am very underleveraged i have a great company, a tremendousou income. the reason i say that, is not any braggadocious way, it's because it's it's about time that this country had somebody running it that has an idea about money. we have $20 trillion in debt and our country is a mess, it's oneo thing to have 20 trillion inri debt and our roads are good, our bridges are good and everything is in great shape, our airports are from a third world country.o you land in laguardia, kennedy, lacks, newark, you come in from dubai and qatar she incredible,n come in from china, see incredible airports, you land, we've become a third world country. the worst of all things have happened. we owe $20 trillion and we're a mess. we haven't even started. we've spent $6 trillion in the

middle east, according to a report that i just saw.t whether it's six or five, but it looks likes it's six.. $6 trillion in the middle eastas we could have rebuilt pour country twice. it's really a shame, it's politicss like secretary clinton that have caused this problem. our country has tremendous problems. we're a debtors nation, we're serious debtor nation, we have a country that needs new roads, new tunnels, new bridges, new airports, new schools, new hospitals. we don't have the money becausec it's been squandered on so many of your ideas. >> maybe because you haven't paid any federal income tax for a lot of years. >> it would be squandered, too. >> if your main claim to be president of the united statesid is your business, then i think t we should talk about that. your campaign manager said that you built a lot of businesses on the back of little guys. and indeed, i have met a lot of

the people who were stiffed by you and your businesses, donaldl i have met dishwashers, painte painters, architects, glass installers, marble installers, drapery installers, like my dad was.er who you refused to pay when they finished the work that you asked them to d. we have an architect in the audience who designed one of your club houses at one of your golf courses. it's a beautiful facility. it immediately was put to use. and you wouldn't pay what the man needed to be paid what hed was charging -- >> maybe he didn't do a good job i was unsatisfied with his work. which our country should do, too. >> for the thousands of people that you have stiffed over the courseve of your business, notin deserve some kind of apology, k from someone who has taken their labor, taken the goods that they

produced and then refused to pay them. i can only say that i'm certainly relieved that my late father never did business with you. he provided a good middle class life for us. but the people he worked for, he expected the bargain to be kept on both sides. and when we talk about your business, you've taken business bankruptcies six times. there are lot of great business people that have never taken bankruptcy once.ru you call yourself the king of debt. you talk about leverage, you even at one time suggested that you would try to negotiate down the -- >> wrong. >> thee national debt of the united states. well, sometimes there's not a direct transfer of skills from business to government. but sometimes what happened in business would be really bad fod government. >> i do think it's -- look, it's all words.al it's all sound bites. i built unbelievable company.

some of the greatest assets anywhere in the world, real w estate assets anywhere in the world beyond a the united statee in europe, lots of different places. unbelievable company. but on occasion, four times, we used certain laws that are there and when secretary clinton talks about people that didn't get paid, first of all, they did ged paid a lot. but taking advantage of the laws of the nation, if you want to change the laws, you've been there along time, change the laws. but i take advantage of the lawt of the nation. because i'm running a company, my obligation right now is to do well for myself, my family, my employees. and my companies. i do. what but what she doesn't say is that tens of thousands of people that are unbelievably happy, that love me.ve i'll give you an example. we just opening up on o pennsylvania avenue right nextne to the white house, so if i

don't get there one way i'mt going to get to pennsylvania avenue another. but we're opening the old post office. underbudget, ahead of schedule,l save tremendous money, i'm a year ahead of schedule that's what this country should be doing. we build roads they cause two and three and four times whatim they are supposed to cost. we buy products for military costs that are so far above what they are supposed to be because we don'tre have people that knoa what they're doing.oi when we look at the budget, the budge set bad to a large extent because we have people that have no idea as to what to do and how to buy. the trump international is wayy under budget and way ahead of schedule. and we should be able to do that for our country. >> we're well behind schedule i want to move to our next segment. we move into our next segment talking about america's direction. let's start by talking about race. the share of americans who say race relations are bad in this

country, highest it's been in decades. much of it amplified by shootings of african americans by police. as we've seen recently in charlotte and actual virginia race has been a big issue, one of you is going to have to bridge a very wide and bitter gap. how do you heal the divide? secretary clinton you get two minutes on this. >> well, you're right. race remains a significant challenge in our country. unfortunately race stille determines too much. often determines where peopleeo live, determines what kind of education in their public schools they can get and, yes, it determines how they're treated in the criminal justice system s.te we just seen those o tragic examples in both tulsa and charlotte. and we've got to do several things at s the same time. we have to restore trust betweet communities and the police.. we have to work to make sure s

that our police are using the best training, the best techniques that they're well prepared to use force only when necessary.or everyone should be respected by the law and everyone should e respect the law. light now that's not the case in a lot of our neighborhoods. so, i have every since the first day of my campaign, called for criminal justice reform. i've laid out a platform that i think would begin to remedy some of the problems we have in the criminal justice system. but we also have to recognize ii addition to the challenges that we face with policing, there are so many good, brave police officers who equally want reform. so we have to bring communities together in order to begin working on that as a mutual goal. and we've got to get guns out ot the hands of people who should s not have them.

the gun epidemic is the leadinga cause of death of young african american men. more than the next nine clauses put together. we to restore trust, work withru the police, make sure they t respect the communities and the communities respect them. and we have to tackle the plague of gun violence which is a big contributor to a lot of the problems that we're seeing today. >> mr. trump you have twotw minutes, how do you heal the divide? >> first of all secretary clinton doesn't want to use a couple of words. that's law and order. we need law and order. if we don't have it, we're not going to have a country. and when i look at what's going on in charlotte, a city i love, a city where i have investments when i look at what is going ono throughout various parts of our country, whether it's -- i canhe just keep naming them all day long. we need law and order in our country. and i just got today the, as you know endorsement of the

fraternal order of police, whicl just came in. we have endorsements from i think almost every police group, a large percentage in the united states. we have a situation where were have our inner cities african american, hispanics, are living in hell because it's so dangerous. you walk down is the, you getis shot. in chicago, they have had thousands of shootings, thousands since january 1st. thousands of shootings. where is this? is this a war-torn country, where are we doing? d we have to stop the violence, we have to bring back law and order in a place like chicago wherer thousands of people have been killed. thousands, over the last number of years. in fact almost 4,000 have beenen killed since barack obama became president, almost 4,000 peoplelm in chicago have been killed.

we have to bring back law and order. now, whether or not in a place like chicago you do stop and frisk which worked very well, mayor guiliani is here, worked very well in new york, brought the crime rate way down. d you take the gun away from criminals that shouldn't be everything it. we have gangs roaming the streets, in many cases they're illegally here, illegal immigrants they have guns.un they shoot people. we have to be very strong. and we have to be very vigilant. we have to know what we're doing. right now our police in many cases are afraid to do anything. we have to protect our inner cities, because african american communities are being decimated. >> your two minutes expired. i do want to follow up. stop and frisk was ruled unconstitutional in new york becauseon largely singled outle black and hispanic young men. >> no, you're wrong. it went before a judge who was a

very against police judge. it was taken away from her and our mayor, new mayor, refused t go forward with the case. it would have won our appeal. throughout the country. >> argument is that it's a form of racial profiling. >>ia argument is that we have to take guns away from these people that have them and that are bad people that shouldn't have them. these are felons people that are bad people that shouldn't be -- when you have 3,000 shootings in chicago, from january 1st, when you have 4,000 people killed in chicago by guns from the beginning of the presidency of the barack obama his hometown, you have to have -- stop and frisk. you need-- more police. you need a better community relations, you don't have good community relations in chicago. it's terrible. i have property there, it's terrible what is going on in chicago. chicago is not the only -- you go to ferguson, so many

different places, you need better relationships, i agreeat with secretary clinton on this. you need better relationshipsl between the communities and the police. because in some cases, it's a nt good. but you look at dallas where the relationships were really studied, the relationships were really a beautiful thing and then five police officers werepo killed. one night, very violently. so, there's some bad thingss going on.on some really bad things. >> secretary clinton -- we need law and order in the inner cities because the people that are most affected by what's happening are african americanme and hispanic people. and it's very unfair to them t what our politicians are allowing to happen. >> secretary clinton. >>en well, i've heard donald say this at his rallies and it's really unfortunate that he paid such a dire, negative picture of

black communities in our country.co the vibrant see of the black church, the black businessesus that employ so many people. the opportunities that so many families are working to provide for their kids, there's a lot that we should be proud of and we should be supporting and lifting up. but we do always have to make sure we keep people safe. there are the right ways of o doing it and then there are ways that are ineffective. stop and frisk was found to be unconstitutional. and in part because it was ineffective. it did not do what it needed to do. now, i believe in community policing and in fact violent crime is one half of what it was in 1991. property crime is down 40%. we just don't want to see it i creep back up. we've had 25 years of very good

cooperation, but there were some problems. some unintended consequences.nc too many young african americanc and latino men ended up in jail for nonviolent offenses and it'n just a fact.st that if you're a young africanc american man, and you do the same thing as a young white man, you are more likely to be arrested, charged, convicted and incarcerated. so, we've got to address the systemic racism in our criminal justice system. we cannot just say, law and order. we have to say, we have to come forward with a plan that is going to divert people from the criminal justice system, deal with mandatory minimum sentencen which have put too many people away for too long for doing too little. need to have more second chance programs. i'm glad that we're ending private prisons in the federal system. i want to see themde ended inmet state system. shouldn't have a profit

motivation to fill prison cells with young americans. so, there are some positive ways we can work on this. and i believe strongly that common sense gun safety measures would assist us. right now, this is something donald has supported along withn the gun lobby, right now we've got too many military-style weapons on the streets in a lot of places, our police are outgunned. we need comprehensive background checks. and we need to keep guns out of the hands of those who will do harm and we finally need to pass a prohibition on anyone who iso on the terrorist watch list from being able to buy a gun in our country f. you're too dangerousn to fly, you are too dangerous to buy a gun. there are things we can do and we ought to do it in a bipartisan say. >> secretary clintonbi you saido we've got to do everythingve possible to improve policing to go right at implicit bias. do you believe that police are

implicitly biased against black people? >> lester, i think implicit biab is problem for everyone not just police. i think unfortunately, too manyn of us in our great country jump to conclusions about each other. and therefore, i think we need all of us to be asking hard questions about, you know, why am i feeling this way. but when it comes to policing, since it can have literally fatal consequences, i have said in my first budget, we would put money into that budget to help us deal with implicit bias by retraining a lot of our police officers, i met with a group of very distinguished, experienced police chiefs a few beaks ago. they admit it's an issue, theyue got a lot of concerns. mental health is one of the h biggest concerns, because now police are having to handle a lot of really difficult mentalen health problems on the streets. they want support, they want more training, they want more

assistance. and i think the federal f government could be in a position where we would offerer and provide that. >> i'd like to reglommed please. >> first of all, i agree and lot of people even within my own party want to give certain rights to people on watch lists and no fly lists. i agree with you. when a person ish on a watch lt or no fly list, have endorsement of the nra which i'm very proud of these are very, very good people. they are protecting the second amendment. but i think we have to look very strongly at no fly lists and watch lists and when people are on there, we'll help them legally, help them get off. but i tend to agree with that. t quite strongly. i do want to bring up the factg you were the one that brought up the word super predator about young black youth. and that's a term that i think was -- it's ha horribly met, you've apologized for it.it but i think it was a terribleer thing to say. and when it comes to stop andt

frisk you talk about taking guns away, i'm talking about taking guns away from gangs and people that use them and i don't think -- i really don't thinknk you disagree with me on this if you want to know the truth. maybe there's political reason why you can't say it. but i really don't believe. in new york city, stop and frisk, we had 2,200 murders and stop and frisk brought it down to 500 murders. that's a lot of murders. hard to believe, 500 is like supposed to be good? but we went from 2,200 to 500 and it was continued on by mayor bloomberg and it was terminated by current mayor. but stop and frisk had a tremendous impact on the safety of new york city. tremendous beyond belief.en so when you say it has no impact, it really d. it had aa very, very big impact. >> well, it's also fair to say if we're going to talk about mayor, is that under the current mayor, crime is continued to drop including murders. >> you're wrong. >> no, i'm not. >> murders are up.

>> new york has -- i give credit across the board going back two mayors, two police chiefs, becausers it has worked. and other communities need to come together to do what will w work as well. one murder is too many. but it is important that we learn about what has been effective and not go to thingsth that sound good, that really did not have the kind of impact that we would want. who disagrees with keeping neighborhoods safe? but let's also add, no one should disagree about respecting the right of young men who live in those neighborhoods. and so we need to do a better job of working again with the communities, safe communities, business communities as wellm as the police to try to deal with this problem. >> this conversation about race, mr. trump i have to --ha >> i'd like to just respond if i

might. >> 20 seconds. >> then i've got to -- i will. the african american communityri has been let down by a politicians, they talk good arounds, election time like rigt now.me after the election they say, sey you later, see you in four years. the african american community -- the community within the inner cities has been sowi badly treated, they have bn abused and used in order to get votes by democrat politicians because that's what it is.. they have controlled these communities -- >> mr. trump -- i disagree. >> i will tell you, you look ata the inner cities i just left detroit, i just left philadelphia, i just -- you'ves seen me i've been all over the place. you decided to stay home. that's okay. but i will tell you, i've been all over. i've met some of the greatestes people i'll ever meet withint these communities and they are very, very upset with what their politicians have told them what

happened their politicians have done. >>av mr. trump -- i think that -- donald just criticized me for preparing for this debate. and yes, i did. you know what else i prepared for? i prepared to be president. i think that's a good thing. [ applause ] >> mr. trump for five years you perpetuated a false claim that t the president was not a naturalr born citizen, you questioned his legitimacy, in the last couplein of weeks you acknowledge what most americans have accepted fo years that president was born in the united states. can you tell us what took you so long? >> i -- just very simple to say. sidney blumenthal works for the campaign, very close friend of secretary clinton. and her campaign manager, patty doyle went to her campaign against president obama, fought very hard and you can go look it up, you can check it out, if you

look at cnn this past week, patty doyle was on wolf blitzer, saying that this respected reporter to kenya to find out about it. they were pressing it very hardr she failed to get the birth certificate. when in got involved i didn't fail.wh i got him to give the birth certificate. so, i'm satisfied with it.it i'll tell you why i'm satisfied with it -- >> that was a -- because i want to get on to defeating isis, to get on to create jobs, to get on to having strong border.st because i want to get on to things that are very importantry to me and that are very important to the country. >>to i'll let you respond. it's important.s i just want to get the answer here. birth certificate was producede in 2011 you continued to telll the story and question the president's legitimacy in 2012, '13, '14, '15 as recently as january. the questi