. >> rose: welcome to the program. we begin tonight with coverage of the aftermath of the terror attack nses london am we talk to most, is he in london and john micklethwait with me in new york. >> one of at sailment is known to security forces, someone who had been on their radar for a few years. he was someone who was known in the neighborhood as an extremist. and people locally had reported him to authorities. but he had dropped off the authorities radar screen just in the last year. they concluded after investigating him that he was not planning an attack so they decided to stop investigating him. that is really a major issue today with this whole question of police having so many people to keep track of, so many people on thary radar screens. >> rose: we continue with a conversation of the polit when qatar and other arab states with

anne barnard from the ny times. >> qatar is always punting above its weight in the region in a way that really wrangled with saudi arabia which thinks of itself as the leader and doesn't want to have rivals for regional influence. qatar is always trying to play all sides of every issue. that's one of the ways that it sort of increased its infliens and survival skills as a small country. >> rose: also this evening a conversation with patrick collison, the c.e.o. and cofounder of stripe. >> we wanted you to be able to come to a website, enter basic details like you would in signing up for any other service and start charging customers from all around the world some revenue and money and go get paid. >> that process at that time took weeks in some cases, even months and was very restrictive in terms of the kind of business models you could implement. >> and we con crude with gerard araud, the former french ambassador to the united states. >> in a sense the message of

emmanuel macron is to say i am really pro-- but at the same time it would be dangerous or counterproductive to say that everything is perfect in the kingdom of the european union. and especially in the euro gloarng the eurozone as we say in french, we are in the middle of the stream. because on one side you have the monetary union. on the other side you don't have the instruments of a federal government of europe, an economic government of europe. >> rose: give white, john micklethwait anne barnard and gerard a araud when we continue. >> .

>> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> rose: we begin this evening with a look at terror in london. on saturday night a van crossing london bridge veered into a crowd of pedestrians. the van's occupants then exited the vehicle and began stabbing patrons at nearby bars an restaurants. seven people including the three assailants killed by police were also killed and dozens more were injured. 12 people have been arrested in connection with the attack. they have subsequently been released. it is britain's third terror incident since march. late today officials named kharou butt and rachidredouane as two of the people that carried out the attack. >> today londoners were

struggling to take in the kreelt and madness of saturday's attack. eight minutes after it began t was over the the three terrorists wearing fake suicide belts shot dead by place. >> but in their wake, they left mayhem an a trail of victims maimed in their stabbing spree. >> you keep going, you keep going. >> other victims were crushed by the attackers van on london bridge. imagine the shock and the terror of people walking across this bridge on saturday night when they realized the van was hurtling toward them at 50 miles an hour. the driver determined to hurt or kill as many people as he could. >> brad meyers on vacation from florida in a narrow escape, after taking a selfie on the bridge he walked away and then heard the varn mount the sidewalk. here is the photo he took afterwards, bodies strewn across the road. >> i do think that everyone needs to see, you know, what is

going on. and what we're up against. >> reporter: all those who gathered at a vigil today know they're probably up against even more terrorists with london in their sights. but lead by the city's muslim mayor sadiq khan they stand determined to face them down. >> i want to send a clear message to the sick and evil extremists who commit these hideous crimes. we will defeat you. you will not win. >> today the british police named two of the three attackers and anna werner went to their neighborhood in east london. >> 30 year old rachidredauane complaim claimed to be more octoberan an libyan and was not known to police but the police knew the other man, khuram butt, a naturalized british citizen born in pakistan. he was even seen in this 2016

documentary that to us canned on home groan jihadism here praying with an isis style flag. on sunday police raided this apartment complex on london's east side arresting a dozen people. some residents told us they recognized butt. they knew him by the nik naim ib. the neighbor said she reported him to police for recruiting children. >> he say to me, because the kids to keep them safe, safe from what, what this world, this world of what? >> on saturday neighbor ken chigbo said he approached him asking about a renting moving van he was using. asked questions, how much, this that and the other. yeah, but it wasn't until now that i is sinking in, really. >> and michael mimbo said after the attack he realized the possible significants of a white van he had seen speeding away from their apartment complex on saturday. >> was it upsetting, distshing,

troubling. >> yeah, especially if it is someone that you knew, someone that, you know, you commonly said hello to, it was really hard to believe. but then all the evidence are there. >> rose: joining me from london give white from "the washington post" and in jork john micklethwait. from bloomberg news, what happened today. >> we had the disclosure the two names of at sail ants. so we know for a fact now that these were locals, these were people who lived in london. they lived in the east london neighborhood of barking, about a half hour journey by either tube or by car from where the attack took place. one is a pakistani origin, the other is of arab origin. he was either from morocco or libya. he told people different things. one of the assailants was someone who was known to security forces. he was someone who had been on their radar for a few years. he was someone who was known in the neighborhood as an extremist and people locally had reported

him to authorities. but he had dropped off the authorities radar screen just in the last year. they concluded after investigating him that he was not planning an attack. and so they decided to stop investigating him. that is really become a major issue today with this whole question of police having so many people to keep track of so many people who are on their radar screens, and yet again we have an attack carried out by one of the people who was on security services radar but had been dropped off, had dropped off. >> rose: one of the interesting things when you talk to security officials they all say part of key to being able to resist these kinds of terror attacks is more intelligence about what is going on. and that's putting a huge demand on the resources of all security forces, correct? >> it is. so this has become a major issue in the british parliamentary campaign which of course we have an election coming up just in three day's time on thursday. and so there was a brief pause, a very brief pause in the campaigning yesterday as everyone declared a truce and

said it was time to pay respects to the dead that didn't last long. as of last evening, as of today, you have both sides coming out, jeremy corbin the challenger and theresa may the prime minister are coming out and really, essentially going after each other on the security front. theresa may saying that there needs to be less tolerance for extremism, words that are clearly directed at a corbin who she hit out at as someone that is too sim pathetic to anti-western militants. she also said that the police and authorities in general need to have more powers than they do at the moment. and she argues that corbin has blocked government stability to give police and security services those powers. on the other side of the debate you have corbin saying may has been a top official in government for the past seven years, now the prime minister of course for the past year. and she has overseen an austerity program that has resulted in pretty deep cuts for

police and for security services. and minister corbin saying that the services need to be funded again, that there needs to be money that is put back into place from security services so that they can deal with this very serious threat that seems to be growing in scale and in tempo. >> corbin's numbers have been rising in this election. >> they have. there is now a third party in the campaign which is one surprise over here which is donald trump. trump initially sent-- tweeted against sadiq chan, the muslim mayor of london who is generating popular and liked in britain and he originally criticized a message khan put out saying that there would be more police on the streets, telling people not to worry. trump criticized that, sayt stayed calm. >> rose: chump trump said this is crazy without really reading properly what khan said. he then reentered having been condemned by lots of people

yesterday. he reentered it today. the reason why this matters is because may have been put in an incredibly awkward position. and eventually she came out and defended khan saying khan is doing a good job. why is anyone attacking him. the way it looked is that she has been reluctant to criticize donald trump and that comes on top of both the climate change thing where she was reluctant to criticize trump and the rather weird hand holding thing in washington. and all those things are giving if not corbin, they are giving surrogates of him some room to attack. >> rose: because they like corbin or because they simply are unhappy with her? >> i think it is more people, it goes to that bit that she sold herself to the british people and said let's have an election because i want to you become me as this strong woman, this determined woman. she embraced the idea that somebody called her a bloody difficult woman. she said that is me, i will be somebody that will be able to go to brexit and deliver the best deal. she is now under fire on sort of several couldn'ts. one is doing this thing to do with the dementia attack as it is known where she seems to say

to old people to begin with, if you get ill over a long period of time, then you will have to spend all your money until you have $100,000 pounds left, and then the government will step in. and then that and she went back on that, so she didn't look either strong or willful. and on this particular thing about not seeming to sort of stand up to trump on behalf of the british security forces, that is also causing her, i think, some degree of deficit. and corbin has proved despite a fairly lunatic left wing past, he looked completely unelectable. he proved very popular with young people. >> rose: what about the other 12 people, back to what happened in the attacks. they have also arrested or have under questioning 12 other people. what do we know about them, give. >> we don't know much but we do know that they have actually just in the last few minutes been released. so police are not holding any additional suspects. the police unlike with the manchester bombing two weeks ago where they said initially there

was a concern that it was, that the attacker was part of a much broader network and that he had had a lot of help in that, they ended up saying ultimately that they thought he acted largely alone. but in this case, from the beginning, they have said, they have been very clear in saying they think these three individuals acted pretty much alone. they were concerned that perhaps there was some kind of help from accomplices or some who might have known more about the attack before it was carried out. but they don't have enough to charge the people this they took in custody. so those people have now been released. but up until this morning, you saw the police were continuing to carry outed raids. they were going into people's homes and barking in another area of east london and rounding people up. and obviously wanting to be as thorough as possible to make sure that there isn't a followup attack being planned. >> there seems to be two deficits for the intelligence community. one has always been that you follow, you have say 10,000 people, you think could be show involved. to follow each one of those all

the way around the day, that requires, depending how you pressure measure it, 100,000, more than that agents trying to follow people properly throughout the day. so you have to zero in on some. the deficit with these sort of people is they go hot and cold very quickly. that seems to be some evidence that some people can rapidly go from being on the fringe of that to being someone who will go and let their lives be taken for that. that has always been one problem and sometimes they get it right, sometimes they get it wrong. the other thing is the fact that before syria, people had a pretty good hold on who they thought, at least in britain, who they thought were radicals. and a lot of people left to go to syria. so there seems to be a new group of people who are much wider, much more dispercented who it is much harder to identify. >> they are already there. >> exactly. they went there, they took spliet to turkey. they weren't part of existing networks. before then trk was a bit like dealing with the ira. they thought they knew where people were roughly, at least. >> the question also is why is isis claiming credit for this if, in fact, it seems that they

acted alone? >> well, i think that the isis claim is very suspect. the group came out on sunday and said yes, we did this, these were our guys. but there was no spessity in that-- specificity in that announce. in the past when they claimed an a attack and it has been an isis attack, they provided details about the attacker or about the plot that only people involved in the plot could have known. that wasn't the case with this claim. and in fact they actually even got the date wrong of the attack. they put the wrong date in their announcement. isis has been claiming a lot of things lately. they used to be fairly reliable in terms of only claiming attacks that they actually had something to do with. that is not the case any more. they seem to be claiming any kind of attack that is out there. what is fairly clear is that these individuals were likely inspired by isis. and so that is something that i think even more than collaboration with isis or direction by isis, i think that

that is very much on the mind of british security forces, that there are a lot of people out there who are being inspired by the islamic state. >> the same question arises in america and they look to some of the companies insecurities. that they talk to that leff in silicon valley and say we have a prb here and how do we cooperate to find an answer to it, it is online, where the danger is being done. >> you are already seeing a bit of that in britain. you are seeing may talking about it, being unacceptable, that so much stuff is being hit en. you might see a tougher at ud from the british, perhaps more similar to am is of the things people have begun to talk here about, being able to break into people's inches phones, having back channels into big sites, may already is slightly authoritarian figure, seems to have jinked that as well. i suspect there will be, two verges of it. one will be going to silicon valley on the quiet, and there will probably also be some degree of a kind of public reckoning between that line, between privacy and security that always comes up every

single time when every one of these things happens. >> what are we looking for next, griff. >> we done know still the name of the third attacker. the police have not, they said they are still trying to confirm that name. they haven't released the name yet. we expect that that will happen sometime perhaps later tonight or tomorrow. but really the question is one of the big questions at this point is how does this play politically that is very uncertain. we have very small amount of time left before the election. brits go to the poles on thursday so you have impeckically two days left in which corbin and may can make their cases. obviously a campaign that has been overtaken by security concerned, security issues. you had this campaign interrupted now twice, first by the manchester bombing, now by the london attacks. and what we really don't know is what did voters think of all this? are they taken in by the arguments of corbin that police cuts are a major problem, people are seeing fewer police out on the beat, and they're concerned

by that and secretary of austerity and want to try something else or are they per intaided by theresa may that it would be two risky to elect jun like corbin when the country is being attacked in this way and you need a strong, as john says, some what authoritarian leader. you see someone who can give police and security services the powers that they ned. >> just that line which seems so convincing in the first when they look very resolute and together and she seemed, is at this time, because of some of the stuff she doesn't look quite so resolute and clear. that would worry me from that point of view, and the truth is the polls are all over the place. the some showed the tourist-- poll tories one, ta% lead, when you start applying that to how seats get divided. s one thing that is pretty clear, whereas three, four weeks ago, we all thought of this is just how much was she increase the majority, it now looks as if

even if everything works out well for her, she will have people who will come back to her and say you know, this election campaign was not a success. you should have done better. it is possible that jeremy corbin who people, most people expected him to be sacked after the the campaign, that he may hang on to the labor body. >> grif, thank you very much for joining us. i know it's late there, we thank you for joining us. we lack forward to seeing you later this weak. >> thanks, charlie. >> thanks, charlie. >> we'll be right back. stay with us. arab nations severed ties on qatar, saudi arabia and egypt were among the first to suspend diplomatic relations in a move orchestrated to isolate and pressure qatar. the small gulf nation has been criticized for maintaining relations with iran and financing terrorism throughout the region. qatar is also home to an american military base overseeing the u.s. campaign against the islamic state. coming soon after president trump's trip to the middle east, the diplomatic break may complicate the president's plan to build a broad sunni arab

coalition to counter iran and regional terrorist groups. joining me from bay route is anne bernard barnard of "the new york times," i'm pleased to have her on this program. let me begin with two questions. why, and why now? >> the why is because quatd ar has been always punting bofer its weight in the region in a way that has really wrangled with saudi arabia which thinks of itself as the leader, and wants, doesn't want to have rivals for regional influence. qatar is always trying to play all sides of every issue, that is one of the ways that it is sort of increased its insurance fleuns and survival skills as a small country. that is gee graphically vulnerable although very wealthy. so qatar is on the one hand in syria, for example, they're supporting insurgents against president bashar al-assad. and at the same time they have

maintained an active back chan toll iran. they have brokered some deals that have been tactically important along the way but that also has been a difficult balance to maintain. qatar has a lot of these contradictory and complicated relationships in the region. and it is really seen as an upstart by saudi arabia and its allies. >> so all these nations have cut diplomatic relations. what other things have they done to make it difficult for the qataris? >> so what has happened today is that saudi arabia along with the united arab em brat -- emirates and bahrain and yemen and egypt have declared that they're cutting diplomatic relations with qatar as well as certainly in the case of saudi and the emirates and bahrain, they're blocking all travel to the country, they're not allowing qatar airways to use their airspace, they are ordering their citizens to return from qatar, in one indication of the

complexity of all this, egypt has not done that because equip has $250,000 of its citizens working in qatar which is an important economic lifeline. but this action was surprise fog qatar and it puts qatar in a position of really having to choose between the gulf countries which has relied on many issues, and its other ambitions which have lead it to form these alliances with partnerships with ryan and other countries as well as islamic movements throughout the region that saudi arabia may see as-- that saudi saudi arabia sees as a domestic threat. >> there are also reports of a food shortage because of this. >> qatar imports almost all of its food and 40% of that comes directly from saudi arabia. so while it is a very wealthy country and might eventually be able to find ways to import it from elsewhere, there is not

much back log of supplies and people have been rushing to stores to buy food as well as getting cash from banks because no one is exactly sure what will happen or how long this crisis will last. >> how much of it is keyed off of what happened between president trump and the arab gulf states when he visitedded ree ad? >> as we try to figure out the more puzzling question of why now, the most logical explanation is that it is related to trump's visit to rhiyad. at that visit he gave the impression that saudi a yaib-- arabia would now be his main partner in the region. and i think the message that the saudis took away from that was that they could deal with things as they liked. whether that was countering iranian influence, countering isis or countering other islamic movements or the muslim brotherhood that the saudis see as a threat and that qatar supports. all that saudi seems to have decided that they can take the gloves off now. and that trump gave a general

direction of how he wanted things in the region to go and he wasn't going to be too much bothered about the details. the interesting thing about that is that it doesn't seem that the u.s. was very prepared for this either. and there is a question of how of the trump administration even knew that this was going to happen, whether they gamed it out, whether they quite understood what they were unleashing when they gave saudi arabia the impression that it had a green light to act as it wanted. >> another interesting fact is the united states has a very, very big military base in qatar, and u.s. military said quote it has no plans to change our posture to qatar despite whatever diplomatic crisis there might be. >> that's a key point, charlie. because that base is, the headquarters for the u.s. aerial campaign against islamic states in both iraq and syria. and of course it complicates that alliance and also the question of whether qatar and the other gulf countries can

continue to cooperate. regional cooperation against the threat of isis and other extremists is the number, one of the main priorities outlined by trump for his plans in the region. >> one of the other things that meak this interesting is that it was because of the amir's father that al jazeera was started and it always became an irritant to other gulf states because of what it broadcast. what impact might it have on al jazeera. >> it could have a huge impact. i think the max malice view of how much might be demanded of qatar in order to avert this problem and maybe to assert furthered more threatening escalation is that they would have to really renounce many of their ambitions in the region which as you point out include media influence as well as throwing its money around and supporting different groups. al jazeera has been a major part of qatar's influence.

and as you said, it has really riled the entire region at times. it's been a boon in a way to arab media, it completely revolutionized the media. and it allowed a greater degree of freedom in covering first the israeli-palestinian conflict, later the u.s. invasion in the occupation of iraq and now in recent years with the arab revolt. during this period, critics of al jazeera have said it has become much more sectarian and taking sides and caused division in the region in that sense. and of course it also covers domestic issues in other gulf countries. of course never in qatar, in ways that are not always comfortable for their rulers. >> there is also this, not withstanding what we said about the military base that's there. some are saying that it began a series of qatar-bashing articles

after qatar's imir suggested that qatar had a tense relationship with president trump. >> yes, well, there was one particular report that the leader was talking about, the idea that trump might not much longer be in power and that was complaining about the u.s.' increased hostility to iran under trump. this really outraged people on the other side of this divide and the saudi arabian camp. now we understand that the fbi has determined that that worp rass a fake which is what they said all along thark they were hacked and that these remarks were not actually made. now we just have learned today that the fbi believes that that is not the case. that it was faked. >> is there a sense among the people that you talked to in the middle east that they will solve this, that somebody show will

find the middle ground so that qatar may stop doing some things that offend the saudis and others at the same time not everything that they are intending to do will reach freuician? >> well there are really two camps among the analysts and observers of the region. one is quite dooms day toned saying that they believe this could even lead to recall add conflict, that the ultimate goal is regime change in qatar either to persuade members of powerful family there to side with saudi arabia and oust the current im, r. others even think it could go farther to direct military intervention. and as i mentioned, that qatar could be forced in order to avert that, to give up many aspecteds of its regional ambitions. then there is another camp that says you know this has happened before, in 2014, many of these countries also cut diplomatic relations with qatar and that

was eventually resolved. there is a belief that maybe now the u.s. will manage to step in and mediate, you never know. the state department and the administration isn't very well staffed and people are asking whether they are prepared for this. at the same time, jordan and you can wait who are also usually allies of saudi saudi arabia have not immediately signed on and the king of jordan, abdullah is flying to you can wait tomorrow to discuss the situation, so there could be an oping there to kind of back down from this. so there is another group of analysts who say you know, let's not panic. this probably will, someone will find a way for everyone to climb down. >> anne, thank you so much for joining us. >> thank you. >> rose: we'll be right back, stay with us. >> patrick collison is here, the c.e.o. of stripe. they founded the company in 2011 to provide a solution for businesses to process and accept online payment.

today its mission is to quote grow the gdp of the internet with operations in 25 countries, stripe is valued at 9.2 billion dollars, nearly doubling since 2015. forbs notes that stripe's success at making digital payments easy to process is only a step towards its larger ambition of becoming the-- new forms of commerce are created. i'm pleased to have patrick collison at this table for the first time, welcome. >> charlie, thank you for having me. >> rose: how old were you when you dreamed up this idea? >> god, i guess john and i were both in our early 20s. and so we were in college at the time. >> rose: and was it a joibt creation? >> yes, entirely. >> rose: and the idea was what, simply to do what i suggested? >> well, what we had seen was that-- we knew a lot of people who were sort of in the early stages of trying to build technology businesses and you know, this is back in maybe 2008, 2009, 2010. a lot of things were getting easier, so generally speakk the barrier to entry for starting a business on the internet has

been getting lower. that is a really good thing, we collectively are benefiting from the 23r50u9s of all of that. one thing that had not gotten easier was the basic mechanic of accepting a payment over the internet. 2 is the kind of thing you would think wab pretty straight forward. you build the product, you build the service, a whole lot of work goes floo that. you think that the last step of all itly collecting the money, you would think that that what be easy but for various reasons it was not it often tack weeks to get that last part set up. and so as john and i sort of spent time with and got to know folks encountering these issues we were kind of mystified we it and had to do something about it. >> in a world in which pay pal exists. >> pay pal had really focused on the consumer side of things, especially back at a time where people didn't necessarily have trust in this new fangled internet thing, right. so pay pal was all about sort of this intermediary between the credit card and this big scary internet out there. what they had not focused on was building great intrastructure and tools for the businesses and figuring out that as the internet makes new things

possible, how these can be executed. >> so there is your opportunity. >> exactly. >> yeah. >> and how difficult was it to get money and-- put it together? >> because you had a lot of people without came in, michael moretz, for example. >> that's right, so we first built a really basic prototype of what we hoped stripe could become. the problem we were solvek initially was straight forward. we wanted you to come to a website, enter some basic details like would you signing up for any other service, and start charging customers all around the world some revenue, some money and then go get paid out. and that process at that time took weeks in some kaitions, even months and was very restrictive in terms of the kind of business mod elevators you could implement. so we built a bake prototype that nainls to you do that sort of essentially instantly but then it took us a year and a half, two years to go and line up the funding and get the partnerships and so on in place with financial institutions because this is not just another social service, this is, you know, real infrastructure and

requires real support behind it. a lot of investors initially thought it was impossible to go and take on the legacy incumbents because of regulatory barriers, partnership barriers, so the first couple of years, they took awhile. and so i think the stripe from the outside world standpoint looks a little more like an overnight success than it actually was. >> when you talk about growing the gdp of the internet what do you mean? >> well, i think we sort of mean we sort of mean two things by it, right? the first is we're just generally very optimistic about the internet and what it makes possible and what is entailed with it and the wonderful things that are happening now that weren't happening 20 years ago that sort of enrich our lives or make things easier or create opportunity for people who sort of didn't previously have them, enabling new kinds of economic opportunities, global opportunity, and sort of integration and coordination that didn't exist before.

and in that vein, as part of that trend we see it as part of the sort of much longer arc of just increasing trade and coordination. so this is obviously been happening for hundreds of years and the internet is kind of a new mechanism for it,nd the second thing is the internet should be sort of integrated into our lives, it shouldn't be the computer in the corner, it should be sort of properly connected. and mobile devices are kind of the way by which the internet is part of our daily lives. we use the interfet back 15 years ago, it was unto itself, it sat in the corner. but with mobile devices, the internet is per fet shall-- per spet allly with us. the internet is becoming this new economic sub straight, rit? and so when we talk about increasing the gdp of the internet we mean kind of helping the economic side of the internet reach the potential to rethink, it is sort of always had to some degree it is realizing later than people would expect. >> let's talk about the business model. you get what, 2.9% plus 30 cents

of every transaction. >> that is the basic business model in essence we want to focus on sort of only making money when the business is built in stripe, in turn make money. there are a lot of companies that have these kind of likely kind of diverging business models where their interest its don't perfectly align with those of their customers so what we really like about ours is that not only is it the main way we make money but essentially the only way we can make money is from the businesses building on stripe, they become more successful. that is why we focus on things trying to expand a market or serve countries they hbility previous served twns is often said in silicon valley you want to be the first 20 hired of a company that will be really successful. and you guys offered to the first 10 percent, the first ten hires, you built into a compensation package. >> well, generally speaking, well, actually, okay, as a basic matter i think people focus a

bit too much on the founders of silicon valley companies. it is kind of a human aspect to it where you need to kind of have some personification of the company, some natural reason. >> amazon bezos. >> you kind of need the short hand but it is a little bit unfortunate in the sense that the enormous edi fis behind these companies is a little bit glossed over and delighted. so from our standpoint with stripe we always wanted to make sure that at least in terms of the ensuing success of the company is broadly shared as possible. and hopefully we can tilt that balance a little in the other direction. >> the following companies and organizations utilize your process payment, facebook. >> that's right. >> lyft. >> yes. >> the nfl. >> that's right. >> so what do you do for the nfl. >> so the details are a bit intricate but sorted of generally speaking what we are seeing more and more, this kind of gets to a large part of the stripe story, we started out

serving early stage technology companies, developers and sort of people sort of like us in some sense. people starting out. and what will happen over the ensuing couple of years, stripe has been around for six or seven years now is that sort of companies that weren't ten years ago technology companies are realizing how integral technology is to their future success and sort of their challenges today are sort of how do they learn the lessons of the technology companies, how do they learn. >> it is often say-- so we're then seeing all these kind of, these companies have been around long before the internet, like the nfl that they are realizing the possibilities of mobile and social technologies and of addressing a global market and so on, that is an imperative for them and then they come to stripe. >> listen this one, stripe's success at making digital payments easy to process is only a step towards its larger ambition, becoming the ed i fis upon which new forms of commerce are created. explain that. >> well, that is their line, not

ours. >> i know. >> well, look. >> but it does meet up with what you basically said is part of your ambition. >> we do think is so cool about the internet is it not just things previously happening offline sort of moving on to the interfet but things are made possible, only because of the internet exists, so you mentioned lyft, if you think about what lyft is doing trk is enabling a coordination of people with cars and people who want sort of the kind of income that occasional driving enables and people who want to get from a to b. that service can't exist without the sort of fill i gree of coordination, that intricate network that the internet makes possible. so when we talk about these new kinds of commerce, we're talking about those market places, that coordination, we're talking about virtual businesses, subscription businesses that again couldn't exist before the internet, here in new york there is, a kick starter or square space or where we park our businesses looked it, each in their own way they are sort of

fundamentally enabled by the internet, there can be no square space without it, and so it's not just taking the offline to the online you can making new kind possible. >> let's talk about technology in general and where it's going. you heard a lot about machine learning. >> that's right. >> tell us how you see that. >> well, for sort of the entire history of the technology industry, and for as long as computers have been around people of course have been interested in the sort of statistical learning and decision making that computers make possible, or even before say the internet existed, people from hosting ai summits and meetings and so on. people expect us to make faster progress than we actually have. i think the term knowledge changes but machine learning is the term we give today to i think the thing we've always been interested in technology, and how does it augment us. how does it help us make better decisions. and you know, humans have their

strengths but computers do too, in terms of their ability to aggregate over enormous amounts of data, how can it enable thing possible. it is always a trend for as long as computessers have been around, and it is a technology shift a little. >> and everywhere you see ai coming? >> well, i think it is not yet the case that ai sort of-- ai means something different in terms of what is actually happening in the world, than machine learning. that could come to pass in the future but right now it remains nearly incipient. >> so what excites you about the future, not just in terms of stripe but in terms of the way it will enhance our ability to maximize our living? >> well, i think marty felledstein had the line. >> economic professor at harvard. >> with regard to policy that he doesn't need to know what the optimal policy is or would be,

but merely in which direction policy should go, right. so i definitely do not pretend to know where the future ends up. i think the best we can hope to do is to know in which direction it's going or which dreksz we should hope further enable it. generally speaking i think that the things that excite me are the way this which the internet makes true global opportunity possible and that i think we sort of forget how you know, how restricted the gree graphic bases, the kind of opportunities that you or i have had, so how that, so, statisticically enormously unusual the general expense of most people in the world, so i think there is still, the mission of going and solving that is still an enormous challenge and quickly the second one is, i think so much of the story of human civilization is the progress in science and technology. and so i hope we can accelerate that as much as we can. >> what percentage of people have access to the internet s it

about $2 billion? >> that's right, what kind of internet, access to smartphones, broadband, and so on. but i think it is a very rough order of magnitude, could you say maybe half the world's population. >> so where do you want stripe to be in ten years. >> well, the way we think about what we do is we're helping more technology companies get started in the first place, right. then we want to help those ensuing technology companies become more successful, do things that weren't previously possible and sorlt of generally build much larger and more fruitful businesses, right? >> in ten years t is not like this is ever sort of a spisk concrete destination. do i hope we're available to people and businesses in every country in the world. i hope we've made enormous strides in helping those businesses be more successful instead of generally, in some sense, increasing the exponent, the ratio of this technological

ratio in the w0r8. >> thank you. >> rose: we'll be right back, stay with us. gerard araud is her, after three years as france's ambassador to the united states, he will resign that position in the coming weeks. he also servegd as france's permanent representative to the united nations and director general for political security affairs at the french ministry. on may 8th he manuel macron was elected france's new president after a victory over his rival marine lepenn, he must prove whether he can unite the divided republic. i'm pleased to have him here to talk about france and what the french election may mean for europe and the world. welcome. >> thank you. >> why did macron win? >> i think that-- you know, first, we are facing the same rebellion of some of our citizens against the political system, against the right, again the left, basically saying to the elites, are you not-- there

for us. so like in this country, we had populists from the left, populists from the right, which was different from the american elections was that in a sense macron was a populist also but running on the-- platform, a populist because he had never run for office. you know in france, to run for president elections, you need to have been around for 30 years, it was the first time in his life that he was running for any office. is he 39 years old, which is very young for french politics. so he has appeared in a sense as also against the system. >> rose: people look at this as two things. one, as a vote against the populism of le pen and the populism of brexit and the populism of donald trump, hear in france and the nether larns you saw a victory against that kind of populism. >> yes. but-- . >> rose: and a vote also for europe. >> exactly. and you know, there is a

difference between the u.k. and france about europe. in a sense, the u.k. as opposed to the creation of the your mean community in the '50s and eventually they joined the european community because if they couldn't beat it, they wanted to join it. >> rose: right. >> but it has always been a sort of transactional decision. in 20s and 30 year olds maybe because the continent has been devastated by the world war, there is also something emotional about europe. so it is very difficult in a sengs to win an election by running a sort of anti-europe. and marine le pen, the opponent wanted france out of the european union, out of the euro, and that was something which was touching a nerve in the french public opinion, even if the french are critical about the european union. >> rose: because of chancellor angela merkel in germany who is up for re-election, but polls are more favorable than they have been for her, and the success of macron, might this be

also the development of a better relationship between germany and france who have always lead yawrp. >> the message of emmanuel macron was to say i am really proeurope, but at the same time it would be dangerous or counterproductive to say that everything is perfect in the kingdom of the your mean union. and especially in the eurozone. you know, the eurozone is, as we say in french, we are in the middle of the stream. because on one side you have the monetary union. on the other side you don't have the instruments of a federal government of europe, an economic government of europe. so i guess that after the german elections, there will be a debate, an emmanuel macron will raise the question with in france about what should we do to move fooferred on the eurozone structures. >> because if we don't do it at some moment, there will be a member of the eurozone ho will say enough is enough, i'm leaving. >> you also have said that france and america's political

lives are complicated, what did you mean? >> well, as i was saying in the beginning, you know, we have some of our citizens who basically we are not happy with the system. the system has not delivered for us. and i really do believe that in a sense emmanuel macron maybe the alaska opportunity of the system, really, two preservers from populism, from the adventures of populism. so i think-- and emmanuel macron is aware of it he really said it publicly. he knows really the challenge he's facing. he has to respond to the anxieties, to the sufferings of this citizens who have voted. they are not morons, they are not fascists, they are really deeply dissatisfied citizens. >> rose: you said general mattis told you that the french were the best allies in the u.s.

on the bat will field right now. what did he mean? >> well, you know right now what when you look at what we are doing, for instance n north africa, in the sa harrah region, where macron is going to go today or tomorrow to salute our forces, we have 4,000 soldiers fighting jihadists in the most really trying circumstances. we are also the main ally of the u.s. on the battle field in the-- and soo i guess right now it is a fact that our military cooperation between the u.s. and france has never been so intense. >> are you the ambassador to former ambassador to the united states and 230r78er ambassador to the united nations, not the minister of france, however, tell me how you see what is possible in syria? >> you know, the problem again as a diplomat, you see what is possible. and again the reality is that

the russians have sent us a clear message and the iranians also that assad is going to stay. we don't like it. but that is the one message. >> and with their support he's winning on the battle field. >> and in the battle field is really moving forward. on the other side, as a french, i should consider that the main threat against my country is coming from daesh from isis in terms of terrorism and also in terms of migrations. so what we should do and i guess with the russians and the iranians, really, is trying to reach an understanding first on the defeat of isis. but the deficit of ice sis not enough. because when isis is defeated there is a question of the governance of the arena. so willing to convince the russians and iranians that assad can't come back to this region. this region are really pop lated by sunnies who are really

adversaries of assad. so at some moment the fighting has to stop. and you know, let's try to work on the political transition in the arrear controlled by assad and on the other side let's find an acceptable governance. >> rose: so you are talking about a divided syria. >> not 4r50e8ly but in fact on the ground, i guess that for transtore period, will you need really to cool down the conflict, you know, really we shouldn't fight-- really this country has suffered so much, 400,000 dead that maybe let's try first to appease really the conflict and after that we'll come to reunification, political transition. >> did the west make a mistake not to do more earlier. >> i think so yes, hns history

will judge partially? >> you know, i let history decide, i let history decide. >> we consider that shall it. >> we lost, the west lost its leverage on the ground. >> yeah. >> after the russians came in. >> exactly. >> and that is the reason why, when there was the strike divided by the trump administration, actual leigh we could have considered that it was acquiring this leverage, you know, really, but you need after the strike you need a political strategy. >> what do the french, how do they perceive president trump? >> i think 65 million french-- i think they have a lot of different, really and again, i think as a foreigner, i was an outsider in the domestic politics. what matters is what the administration is doing. and for the moment, what i see is that the trump administration has expressed its support to

nato, president trump has expressed its support to the european union, so really as an outsider, for the moment, we have no reason, in a sense to complain. you know. >> isn't it interesting that you feel good because the president of the united states has expressed his support for nato and for europe, the fact that you might even doubt that the president of the united states would support europe. >> well, actually, you know-- . >> rose: even though president obama had thought, had argued that france and other countries in nato should pick up two percent of the gnp as part of the support for nato. >> you know, the debate about the 2% has been an ongoing debate it is-- the american side to tell us, you know, spend more on defense. actually most of the countries are increasing their budget, and president macron has taken the commitment of two percent, two percent of the gdp. but we have also to face the reality after the end of the

cold war, for a lot of americans there is a real question on the table saying in a sense where are we still in europe. really, for the young guy in wisconsin, you know, really there could be a real question. why for this european countries 6789 i always believe that instead of not having a conversation, it's always better to have a conversation. and it was more or less started by president obama and it's really going on now. i think the europeans and the americans have to sit around the table and to have this conversation. why a transatlantic relationship. >> rose: i'm sorry why? >> a transatlantic relationship. >> rose: you know, the trans. >> really it's routed in 1945. soviet union now has disappeared. and russia is not an exist tension threat. russia is a political problem. so in a sense, why.

the and i really do believe we should have this conversation. >> what do you miss most about being the ambassador of the republic of france 209 united states? >> well, actually, i could say, as if i were totally unusual diplomat, i would say you know, i missed. >> i should miss my-- you know, my frankness. i tried to be as frank as possible, because i do believe in this country it's possible. >> are you an up and country, it is possible to have a real discussions, really why on my side i have always tried to be really usually aggressive, really, that we should face the problems and we should talk it frankly, i think i have done it. >> thank you for coming. and much success. >> thank you very much. >> thank you for joining us. see you next time. >> for more about this program and earlier episodes visit us

online at pbs.org and charlie rose.com. captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org

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>> announcer: this is "nightly business report" with tyler mathisen and flashing yellow. investors appear cautious but business leaders are the most confident they've been in years about the direction of the u.s. economy. gold rush. the precious metal hits its highest level in months. but does it belong in your portfolio? big deal. amazon is offering a discount to some and it's taking on walmart in the process. that's on "nightly business report" tonight, tuesday, june 6th. hall lower everyone, i'm sue herera. >> i'm bill griffeth in for tyler mathisen. investors seem to have struck a cautious tone as they