robert: where ds the gun debate go from here? president trump is open to anges but the n.r.a. balks at restrictions and lashes out at the aedia democrats. i'm robert costa. the president's next steps en masse shootings and newve lopments in the russia probe. ghtonit on "washington week." >> there are no words. the families lost their chilen. we lost coaches. rebert: pdent trump says schools should do more to protect students and throws his support behind the n.r.a.'s long-standing propal to arm teachers. president trump: it's time to make our schools a much harder target for attackers. robert: the n.r. asues so -- accuses democrats for

using it for political gain. and studears,ts, and survivors of last week's rampagenite to demand lawmakers fake action. >> my daughter, running down the hallway at marjory stoneman douglas was shot in the back with an assault weapon, a weaponf war. why do we have to march on washington just to save innocent lives? robert: the uniquely american problem of school shootings and how the national dialogue about gun violence could be shifting. plus, special counsel robert muelr files new charges against former trampe campaign their paul man form. we scust its all with julie hirschfeld davis of "the new york times." michael scherer of the "washington post."al is simendinger of "the

ll," and jim vanderhei of axios. >> this is "washington sek." funding provided by -- >> their leadership is instinctive. they understanth challenges of today. and research the technologies of tomorrow. some call them veterans. c l them part of our team. >> on a cruise with american cruise lines, travelers experience the maritime heritage a culture of new england. our fleet of smallruise ships explores american landscapes, seaside villages

and historic harbors, where you canc experlocal customs and cuisine. american cruiselines. proud sponsor of "washington week." >> desirable -- additional funding povided by newman's own foundation. donating all profits to charity and nourishing the common good. the ethics and excellence in journalism fun to day. koo and patricia yuen through theue foundation, committed to bridging cultural differences in ou communities. the corporation for public broadcasting and by contributions from --yo to pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. once again from washington, moderator robert costa. robert: good evening. the debate over guns has been charged. emotionally, socially, and politically. e players are both old and new.

the national rifleso ation and gun control activist lawmakers and law enforcement. this time students and survivors in particular have been at the fore. during a white house meeting with family and friends of victims and students, president trump announced this week that he supports raising the legal age to purchase certain guns and stricter background checks. many ent trump: for years where people sitting in my position did not take action. they didn't take proper action, they took no action. robert: the president also endorlsed the n.r.a.'s position that there could be more guns in school. julie wrote today on the frontagof "the new york times" about the president calling for training and army of teachersnd paying them a bonus foraring a weapon. how much of this is talk and how much of it could actually lead to action on capitol hill?

>> it's really going to be up to thehe presidenter he's willing to really lead on this issue, whether he can get it past the points of what he called today all talk and no substantive moving ahead. he hasdu intd this idea, which he seems very enmored of, of training certain teachers who are trained to use firearms to protect they were -- eir students to turn schools into basically fortress protected by educators who are trained to do that. it's a very controversial idea, not just with democrats but with a lot o republicans who support gun rights and want to see safer schools b think this is a problematic issue. one of the big questions is going to be will the president insist that ncealed carry permits f teamers be a part of the solution. there ibroad support for better background checks

which. i think there is support for raising thege of carrying a well. y robert're down in florida, michael in tallahassee. arming teachers, that may be more of a local, state issue? >> in florida the house and senate republican leaders introduced a bill that would allow sheriffs to deptiles teamers to have a gun on campus. other states like texas and south dakota are already doing this. places where teachers have gun in schools. in florida, there's been a a change in how republicans are dealing with in issue. this state has led the country in gun righ education for decades. after the nightclub shooting and the fort lauderdal shootings, nothing happened. and now the reinstate and vernor are comingut saying they want to do things the n.r.a. is actively opposing. it's not what the students

wants. they want a ban on assault welons back in pe but it is a huge shift in the conversation and i think it shows what coul happen on the federal level. florida is going to move quicker than the federal debate because they only have three weeks left in their legislative session. robert: so there's a shift in florida and you wonder, jim, is there a shift nationally? is in a national pivot point? there were big gun bills in 1968 after all the assassinations that year with assault weapons. idn't happen after sandy hook sit happening now? in florida where you have a governor wh an a-plus n.r.a. wait a rate somethingul jim: it be different but most likely isne. back to 1984 elections, since then the n.r.a. has won every debate before congress and often won it

de psively. thsident has been able to take a republican party that seemeel tove one thing and got it to believe something else. you've seen it v with thew of the fibble, you've seen it with how they think about deficits. a trillion-dollar deficit now to pay a tax bill iatn prhe talks about i want to help the kids. but also always look at what the president talks about in public. he oftenimics what he muses in private and if you look at the totally of his words, almost all of them have been allocated to arming teamers. the topic that's fronts and center is that so even if hedo the other things, raise the age limit to 21, have tougher backgroundhecks, maybe he would do those but even if you did all of ithose, thata drop in the bucket in terms of what it would take to ep somebody who decides they want tomas kerr people from getting a

well that would with actual massacre. so we're a long way away.be : on capitol hill how close are we to any action? when you look at the house of representatives, controled by i -- controlled byn, recommendat they seem unreluctant to any of this. pat toomey said he's going to try and revive the bill with senator mans of west virginia. erepublicans know they h to get their base voters out this year. just a few weeks befe the midterm election. >> remember, congressou lab of town during this. the political leverage may be more about where they feel they'll be injured more than they think they're going to be helped. president trump is not to be on the ballot. in the house, as you point out, many of the conservatives feel the pain they would suffer for goingns agthe national rifle

association on anything would be greater than thef idea pressuring for action. but we've seen the migration and discussion evene white house. this isn't the first time that the president has been dealing wit in crisis. his first reaction, though, earlier in his presidency was to say it's tootaarly to about that. now the pace of this, thees re is much more intense and that's the change we've seen in the rs last six y after sandy hook. many more mobilized and well-funded organizations that are moving fast. that was the criticism of six years ago. they weren't fast enough. >> until tis happened, the recommendation were really excited to get a concealed carry reciprocity bill later is summer that would basically state that -- that any state that has a conceale carry law, other states would have to honor it. they thought it would be a winning issue going into the fall for the n.r.a. and

republicans. the question i think here is whether this anger and frustration and conrn ays on voters' minds in a news cycle that spins incredibly fast a month from now, two months from now, six months from now and whether then gusue could swing the other way and help democrats. >> there's a recipe for a inge moment. if young people vote or get their parents to vote or if o so these indicators where you see a surge in democratic voting in some off-year election carries into the midterm election and republicans le lot of seats and it's attributed to this. that's how you have a dramatic break. that's what happened in94 the politics of guns were different unti people felt, no, you pay a price on this issue. the incentive is victory. robert: we talked to

political analys out there and nonpartisan analysts. they say if you wants to ban an ar-15 in this country, you'llave to have some kind of wave election. but julie, the president isut talking aump stocks, which was part of the las vegas shooting. 's talked about some more modest things. wait for maybe the big stuff to see what happens in the midtermles and do the big stuff in the ne fewonths? >> that's possible but the key thing is whether there's going to be a real generational movement on this you see a lot of young ople, a lot of organic actinism hap after the shooting in florida. this republicans feel they're going to be held to account by young voters and people who are influenced by young voters and that this issue is going r tolly be harmful to them, then we might get to a place where they'll be willing to accept some of these murals. but as alexis said, there's

not a lot o enthusiasm for even some modest changes in the house. i think it might take the dterms to see something, even the modest changes much less potentially bang certain weapons or even the apple in addition issue. >> one other thing i think is interesting about the messaging and i'm listening to the president uses. t we've gone in nothing will we this problem to have to do something and if that momentum continues ande you he economic pressure on the n.r.a. you can see that from companies today that are trying to sever their relationships because they understand their consumers don't want to see that. if you see that continuing, that bomes part o a narrative that can be politicallyoet ement. >> we'll see in the nexfew -- potent.

>> we'll see if inou movement continues. in the crowd they were rculating voter register administration and from the podium, the kidslk were g about you have to register to vote. these kids are coming to washington in the next few weeks. they'll be in washington. they are walkouts planned in the next few weeks around the country. that kind of momentum if it continues could matter. robert: so the activists, the students are out there in force. to watch them this week, eey are in the mid of this political debate but the n.r.a. remains defiant. wayne lapierre, the presidt of n.r.a. was in washington, the cpac. not backing down in this even as he sees the president move a bit. >> you have to pause for a

moment. there were somegseautiful thhat happened this week. i think both what we saw on ag at cnn and the white house, where you're bringing tother politicians who have much different views with victims ofor these dowels massacres. at least have a dialogue. that was a moment. for someone like marco rubio to go on stage with 7,000 ople who want to boo y and show some openness on gun control was interestin the n.r.a. is really powerful and i would caution anyone- there are several cautionary tales in how reactive republicans t might public pressure. we saw this on global warming andra immon. areas where we have all of these protests, whether it's from business leaders or different groups and you say oh, republicans will buckle under this no, they won't. they're responding to a very small set of voters who turn out in -- up in off

elections, which tend to be white older voters. robert: we saw these same forces happen before but there are glimmers of action that are notable. on friday, republican governor rick scott rolled occupant this $450 million proposal. it would raise the minim age from buying any kind of gun in florida from 18 to 21, require a law enforcement officer at every public school and mandatory active shooter training. it would restrict anyone who has mental problems from buying a gun and ban the sale and purchase of bumpoc . michael, when you were in tallahassee, we were talking about this rick scott seemed like the last person who would budge. he budndd. >> i think the reason is because he's going to be running for re-electi most likely later this year -- or foelection for the u.s.

senate against bill nelson. it's going to be a difficults. ra today he showed he can distance himself from the n.r.a. and from president trump on the question of whether teachers should have guns in the classroom or school. he was building a sort of prottive wall around himself against the charges coming this year andstill it's going to be difficult. those kids are going to stay on his tail pushing for an assault rifle ban all through the coming campaign ason and it's clear that the democrats in that state are hopefulis at point that guns can be a big issue going into november. robert: watching the president at cpac, the honoring, hour-us speech, very much to the base, full of red mout. then compare it to that quiet meeting with the pants and survivors at the white house. what version of president trump should we expect in the coming weeks? >> like every issue with president trump, you never w

knch one you're going to get. this is a lot like imvegration. you he president trump who talks about these incredible kids and and we need to do something about it. and the next day he turned around and recited the snake, that poem that basically comparesll immigrants to a poisonous snake that's going touill in return for your hospitality. there is a big quest'sn and probably a question in the minds of his staff as well as in his own mindab t what he's going to do tomorrow, next week on this issue. and it' an open question to me what will influence him i do think those kids and that session in the state dining room this week rlly had an impact on him. he use it would words i grieve for you and seemed like he was really moved but -- bye what h heard and wants to be the person who breaks the impasse on guns and takes action but it's going to be difficult.

robert: a lot of moving parts on guns. we'll keep following that detective. let's turn to the russia probe. president trump's former campaign chairman was hit with new charges on friday, just hours after anoer campaign advisor struck a plea deal with special robert mueller. the new charges against the 68-year-old manafort include conspiracy against thes, united staonspiracy to launcheder money and failing to register as an agent of a foreign principal. hours earlier, rick gates pled guilty to conspirac to defraud the u.s. and fki mang false statements. tes has struck a plea deal and has agrew -- agreed toop coate with mull early. antorian, the son of a ssian ol' garble ork ol' pled guilty about his communicatns with gates. is this more about what bob mueller wants to learn about

pault manaf more about what he wants to learn about president trump and the administration that rick gates is part of. >> it's hard to answer that question because icould be both. . in the case of looking at the financialses that manafo and gates were involved in, you can see that special counsel has a whole very come mention -- complex avenue they've been pursuing and obviously coming up wit evidence. but rick games is someone now who can cooperate over a period of timen which he was very close to the campaign and the campaign's chair and the idea that programs a special counsel is putting the squeeze on rick gates to then provide information about manafort and then present. the squeeze on manafort, as you point out, at 68 years old, if he's found guilty and goes to prison, held be there potentially for the rest of his life. robert: all of us onth t

serum would say we have no clue. e reason is that, when you're reading these stories, all we have access to are the people who are getting interviewed by mueller, the people arounru donald. the mueller investigation, the best i can tell, is leaking to nobody. that was illustrated like the diet where he indiets all -- indictment. where he indicts all these russian ol gas,. we don't nope.af he could gr gates to nail manafort. he could go after gates to cough up more information on the president. in is a extremely methodical investigation by 1 people who know what they're doing and who they're going after. i think it's going to be a while before we know. truly.'s >> what we do know is there's clear aggression in the way he's going outth about . anyone who says something

false, he' bringing charges against you. these are bank loans unrelated to the trump campaign where fraudulenn informatas given, he's going after you. that sends a message to whoever is still a target of theat investn, that they can't mess around with this group of people. robert: paul manafort, furious, issued a statement, i'm going to continue to fight on. >> he made a statement, i don't know why my former partner decided to plea butm not and i'm fighting these charges. as much as mueller might be ying to send a message with in move, man form is trying to push back saying i'm not going to be seezed by this. i'm staying firm. not just for manafort but also the white house andes ent trump himself -- robert: any chance of presidential pardo >> that's again an open question. because we ow so little

and not only we, i think they in the white house know very little about what's achially going on in investigation. we see snippets, thect innts, the pleas but mueller has a complete picture he's pursuing. the white house does not have that without knowing that they're considering, the president's legal where they should talk with mueller. and every stem along this way makes that semifor p allows. robert: rick gates. most people don'tno who he is. he's grown a beard, change his whole appearance. he was aroun at the aginning. whend kushner, the president's son-in-law has meetings with foreign officials, including the russian ambassador andhe . he saw a lot. he matters. >> he was in the white house too in the early days of the administration. he does matters but like jime said,on't know what he

knows. these indictments are not about what happened on the campaign. th guilty pleas not about what happened on the campaign. we haven't gotten tohat stage of the investigation. we don't know what state's evidence he can tur>> the one thing i think everybody is watching is hien you're talking about the relatio with the ukraine and the representation they were doing there, that's leading you back to the discussions that had to do with russia and what their financial interests were. what was the incentive for manafort to want to be ebb gauging with russian contacts? what was the insent active? was it personal for him or a broader situation? we might not know that, as yoor say, months. >> what amazing me for white house officials is how much today loes feele yesterday. robert: every day is yesterday. we'll have to leave it there, jim. today is frida anks, everybody.

our conversation with continue online on the "washington week extra. we'll steel -- tell you about the standoff between the white house chieff staff and the president's son-in-law and senior advisor jared iushner and you miss the show or the extra, watch it online later tonight and all weekend long at pbs.o/"washington ek." thanks for watching and thank you, ed lee, for your 38 years of service here on "washington week"'s production team. enjoy retirement. >> funding for "washington week" is provided by -- ir >> t leadership is instinctive. they understand the challenges of today and research the technogies of tomorrow. some call them veterans.

we call them part of our team. >> american cruise lines, proud sponsor of "washington week." >> additional funding is provided by newman's own foundation, donating all pitches from newman's o food products to charity and four irishing the common good. the event i said and excellence in journism foundation. koo and patricia yuen through the yuen foundation, commit told bridging cultural differences in our communities. the corporation for public oadcasting and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. >> you're watching pbs.

announcer: explorore new worlds and new ids ik through programs le this, made ava for everyone through contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. hello, i'm howard goodl. and i'm a composer of stage musicals, choral music, and film and tv themes. i'm also a music historian, and i've beememaking doaries about music for the past 20 years. i'm standing h london's abbey road studio number 2 where in the 1960s, the beatles madestsome of the greaecords of all time. for the next hour, i'd like to share with you mpassion for one of those records in particular. what f is my answer to the question, why is sgt. pepper's lonely hearts ub band such a bigeal?