after two days of lengthy testimony by facebook ceo mark zuckerberg, calls intensify f greater regulation of tech companies. as tensions over sanctuary policies remain high, we tked to oakland mayor libby schaaf about the challenges and opportunities facing her city. plus, planned parenthood president is stepping down after more than a decade at the helm. she talks about her new book and the fight ove women's health. i'm thuy vu. we begin wit facebooknd its of rts to regain the trust not only its users, but also lawmakers. this week facebook ceo mark zuckerberg began two days of congressional testimoe before do of skeptical lawmakers, appearings for 44 senaton a joint hearing of the judiciary and commerce committees,

mockerberg began his tes with an apology. >> but it's clear now that we didn't do enough to prevent these tools from being used for harm as well, that goesor fake news, foreign interference in elections and hate speech as well as developers and data privacy. we didn't take a broad enough viewi of our respolity, and that was a big mistake. and it was my mistake. and i'm sorry. facebookd i run it. and i'm responsible for what happens here. >> facebook admittd that as many as 87 million use may have been had their datacc ssed by cambridge analytica. despite zuckerberg's explanation of the steps they're taking t stop misinformation campaigns, doubts remain about the company's commitment on those issues. some senators r sed the possibility of regulating facebook, including louisiana republican john kennedy.

>> our promised digital utopia we hav discovered has mine fields. here's what's going o happen. there's going to be a whole bunch of bills introduced to regulate facebook. it's up to you whether they pass or not. you can o backhome, spend $10 million on lobbyists and, fight or you can go back home and help us solve this problem. >> to discuss all of this now, i'm joined by kqed silicon valley reporter sam har net. mary ross, the coauthor of the california consumer privacy act. welcome to you all. >> thank you. >> nate, what struck you the most during the congressional hearings? >> well, one of the things that struck me the most was the way that zuckerberg was very goodt not answering the question asked. as an example, the senators

asked repeatedly something along the lines of,an i delete my data off facebook, or can i see what o facebook has me, and he answered yes, of course, you can dee delll the data. it doesn't count data that facebook gathered on you in other ways, bought from data brokers, g tthered fromacking you around the internet, gathered on you from your friends or from yourdevice. and that silence spoke volumes to me. >> so it wasn't an inaccurate answer, it was just an incomplete answer? >> it was an icomplete answer and the senators and congresspeople glarj didn't catch that. they didn't understand the qualification. >> the amount of d they have is tremendous because, sam, i tow you went on facebook, downloaded ay information they had on you. what did you find? >> if you bove fa, i would encourage you to do this. go to the website and your whole file. it's got everything i ever

posted in my tiline. >> for 13 years? >>rs 13 1/2 yeevery did you mean comment i made, every stupid photo i took. >> what did you think when you saw all that formation? >> the reaction was that yeah, r they can gee a pretty good profile. back when i was in college i wasn't thinking ahat when i was putting those things on. it was to quantify what that was worth to facebook. we did a breakdown basedn their revenue. we found the average u.s. profile according to a coupe analysts is around 250 bucks a year, which facebook monoties from the work that i've done uploading all this stuff. >> and a lot of the focus that's been on facebook, there are a lot of organitions, a t of other companies that are collecting data as well, right, mary? >> that'sbsolutely true. what we found is there's a whole industry of data broker including evite. i get an evite every week for a

different birthday party. they're taking that information and then selling the presence of children in t household, your religious affinity, if you use alcohol. >> i think a lot of the people i interview are sayclg a little che that if it's free, you're the product. so if you're using an internet service and you're not paying a subscription fee or making a donation, then they are monotizing yound your data. >> except when you go on evite, you seeadvertisements, so you're still paying with your eyeofalls but on top hat they're selling personal information. >> you were with the group californians for consumer privacy, but you were part of the house intelligence committee, you have studied surveillance issues for a long time. >> absolutely. >> and now you're helping to work on a ballot measure that uld give consumers mor control over the privacy of their data in california. what would that measure do? >> the measure does three

things, it gives consumers ar ht to find out what personal sinformation corporatire collecting skpaubt your children, it gives you the right to tell the company to stop selling your personal information and find out what they're sellng. and then if you're going to collect my personal information, just implement reasonable security measures to safeguard it. >> there are critics at the chamber of commerce saying the measure will stifle innovation and openi comp to huge liabilities. it's too broad, treats every piece of information exactly the same. what are your thoughts? >> this is really just common sense regulation. all we're saying is tell me what you're collecting ond me inst of having a privacy policy. i'm a lawyer and i read many of these and they're clearly written to protect these corporations and not the consumer. the pact that was formed to fight us, it was facebook, google, comcast, at&t and

verizon. what they want to do is monoties you. they charge you every month for a service that sometimes is and sometimes isn't, and yet they're still selling your personal information. >> facebook this week where do you its opposition to at measure. >> it did. >> nate, the company has made, you know, a lot out of the fact that it recently cut off the access that advertisers have information from third party data brokers. is that >> no, it's not. they didn't actually cut off their entire relationship with the data they only terminated one program which was called partner ategories which was only one way of microtargeting ceusers. ook admits there are other ways that it uses data brokers to give data to advertisers to microtarget. but what those ot relationships that facebook has ith data brokers, they won't say. >> what else needs to be done? >> we're demanding transparency,

we're demanding fack open up their data practiceso independent third party auditors so that we as the american public can have confidence that facebook is treating our data with the respect it deserves. u.s. is trailing europe in this respect. the gdpr goe into effect next month in europe, and things like the cfornia consumer privacy bill wouldtart t bring back equity to americans. we need something like the california bill that mary's organization doeso >> there has a meaningful enforcementmechanis clearly facebook can't self-police. there's another company that came out last week that was doing the same thing as cambridge analytica and they hing about ito an until the news came and told

them about it. >> two interesting points. as a reporter, a lot of people have said you got t remember that the averageser is tied to the trump election. people are looking at cambridge analytica saying, hey, how did you do that? obama did a similar thing with his campaign.te he had tar ads on social media. so this is part and parcel of what facebook does and advertisers do it every single day. so it's interesting to think we're having outrage now, but this has been part of the business model. as a tech reporter i think a lot about reminding people what these companies are. you have to look at how they generate revenue. gathering data and advertising to you is how facebook makes its money. there's an inherent kind of drive or engine to gather data. even if they say we're going to do better, there's incentive to gather more data because that's their business mode a >> there line between what's acceptable and what's not.

if i'm seeing an advertisement that is -- we're all carrying around phones i might be the only one seeing a particular advertisent. so the incentive there is to membership me, whether it's v political tisement or to buy something i migh not know i want. there's no check on there what they're doing is above board and okay. >> what struck me during the hearings is the lawmakers didn't seemve to unified view of t he problems r. what does this mean in terms of regulation? what do you think congress will do next? >> congress will do they're good at doing nothing. if congress does something like cee honest ads act, looks like it has a d chance of passing. >> go ahead. >> it would require political advertisements to have a disclosure of who pai for it,

essentially. similar to what we have on television these days. yond that, i think the chances of meaningful regulatio coming out of the u.s. congress are enfortunately pretty slim. >> let me concl with this. re we at an inreflection poin do you think? privacy debates they've had in the past, google once collected private wi-fi information to build googlemaps. there was outrage and nothing happened. do you think it's different this >> i sope so. etime? what we need is an enforcement mechanism with teeth. we need the ftc to enforce its 2011 consent decree against e cebook. and eed them to pay a meaningful price for that abuse. >> our initiative will be on the ballot in november so californians will have power to take control over their personal information. >> thank youall, mary ross, sam

har net, kqed's silicon valley reporter and nick car doe zoe, thanks to you all. >> thank you. in local anpoliticis, oakland mayor libby schaaf receives flak over immigration in february. donald trump called her actions an obstruction. meanwhile ty continues to grapple with hanging onto its beloved sports teams and a continuing homelessness crisis. joining me now talk about this icing oakland oakland mayor libby schaaf. welcome. >> thank you, great to be here. >> you continue to be in the cross hairs of the department of justice. yesterday the department ofic ju sent the city of oakland and severals other cit letter demanding that the city turn over documents that could show oakland is breakig federal law by restricting what information police can shareh wmmigration agents. were you surprised to see this

letter? >> i wasn't because it's similar to a letter that's been sent to many jurisdictions across thun y looking for proof that the city is in compliance with federal law. e are researching the letter right now and intend to respond to it. >> will u turn over documents? >> again, they're looking for proofne're not violation of federal law. we cannot turn over information that we don't, in fact, collect. we have been very careful and california has been careful to assert our sanctuary status, which we believ our absolute right, but to do it within the confines of federal law. >> the press release that the doj sent out cites you specifically, names you pecifically. what was your reaction when you saw that? >> will, it cerly has been a surreal experience to be mentioned by name by the president, by the attorney general. but i cannot tell y grateful i am to live in a

community where i am supported to defend my community, every member of it regard of where they came from and to really try and raise the consciousness that there is something wrong with our policies when we are ripping families apart, particularly law-abiding res ents that give so much to our communities. >> you certainly have your supports, but so many say as you do this works are you concerned at all about federal funding? in this latest letter, the justice department is tloengt take back funding who those cities that don't comply. do you feel that you are for having grants revoked? >> i do not. i have faith in our different branches of government thathe judicial system is protecting us from overreach of executives.

we have been unfade to assertu our v and stand up to bullying. that's what this administration has been doing. they have been picking on our vulnerable population since the day they got into office, and we willanot s for that in the city of oakland. >> did you have concerns about that prior to putting out your public alert? v >> i way careful to not give any specificnformation that may have caused any threat. and the evidence is that there were no injuries or any problems during that operation. i remain confident that what i did was within myl le rights, and informing your residents of eir legal rights, of their obligations under the law, and the resources in the communiy, ou legal defense operation, our rapid response telephone number, i do not see how ian be

illegal to inform people of the law. if you were to receive the same type of information again today, would you do the exact same thing again? >> turned exact same circumstances, yes, i do not regret what i did. >> let's move on and talk about the a's as well. that has very mucheen in th headlines also this week. alameda county supervisors negotiating theirhare of the coliseum to the city of how much closer does this bring you? >> th nothing but good news for us and the a's. i am veryed commit to keeping our beloved oakland a's rooted in oakland, but in a way that is rponsible tot taxpayers and is going to add vitality to whichever neighborhood they choose. the idea that we can now have parallelxclusive negotiating agreements for two sites doubles our chances that we'll have a

eat project that not only benefits the a's with a privately financed papballpark,t also makesheense for community. >> the team is offering to pay off the $137 million in debt owed by the city and the county on the coliseum. that's in exchange for full control of the site. are you happy with that offer? >> it's a great place to begin our negotiations, but we will have very complex negotiations that we have to engage in. >> what would it tke for you to say "yes"? >> this is public land. we have to think about all the interests of our residents, our need for affordable housing, our need for community benefits and good jobs. what they need right now is thaa exclusivity, promise that we aren't going to be entertaining conversations with other interested buyers. as you know there have been other interested buyers, but i

do believe strongly that the a's have given so much to o community, and they deserve the right to have the first chance to show us what they can do with that land. >> we're running short on time, but i have t ask you about homelessness. like many other cities, the issue is approaching crisis levels in oakland. there's a 25% increase over the ast two years are so. what are you doing about it? >> it is the issue of our time. we are really focusing first o addressing these street encampments.th y are not healthy for anyone. our community and least of all, the unsheltered residents living in them. so we ve been having some very successful innovative interventions, our tough shed shelters are proving extremely successful where we're able to relocate an entire community as

whole onto a temporary outdoor organized, managed encampment. the first one has gone and we are starting our second one at north gate and 27th for anyone who gets off the west grand exit on the freeway, they know what i'm speaking off. we're building permanent supportive housing as well as to prevent homelessns by helping with emergency assistance in back rent and back utility payment. s we a whole a lot of thi have to do to address this crisis, and we're doing it with focus and with aggression. >> all right. oakland mayor libby schaaf, thank you. alway nice to have you here. turning to the politics of health care. for more than a decade is he seal riches that be ceo of planet planned parenthood, the organization offers low cost reproductive health care services to millions of people country.he one of those services is abortion, making the nonprofit a

frequent target of conservative lawmakers who have threatened to cut o federal funding. richards announced in january this year will be her lastt the helm of planned parenthood, and she has a new book out, "make trouble" that chroniheles fights with the system. >> nice to have you here? >> great tbe back, thank you. >> in the introduction in your book, you write rght off the top, for the first time in my life ionder whether my daughters will have less rights than i had. whyo you feel that way? >> i'm obviously concerned under this administration and this congress that the effort to repeal women's reproductcee rights, a to birth control, really basic health care rights is at risk.' ththe work we've been doing at planned parenthood this entire year,nd we' been successful so far. and we've seen an outpouring of young women running for office and doing thingso we needdo.

>> the donald trump administration rolled back contraception coverage ace s to defund planneden parood, what else is coming down pipeline that has you concerned? >> i'm concernedll with ahose things because they do take away preventative health care for millns of people. we've been successful at fighting back, but this is going to be ongoing. one of the biggest frncerns, nkly, that we have is the judges that are being put up into the federal judiciary now,o some of th extreme judges, some of them not qualified. and i think everyone's anxious e about if th a supreme court vacancy, the kind of nominee that this president would put. >> up and the biggest fight seems to be over the nomination of wendy vitter.wh are your concerns about her and what do you think her nomination means for other bench openings across the country? >> the concern about wendy itter is, yes, planned

parenthood is opposing her senomination bec she has some of the most extreme issues, even on birthcontrol, comparing it to violent deaths among women. she has not been rated qualified by the american bar she has no experience in the federal judicial system that would make her qualified. qualifications is she on the far right of the republican party. >> she supporwasn't willing to where she was on brown versus board of this is a fundamental issue in this country.re and so w concerned this administration is putting very, very politic nominees in the federal bench that are going to be there for a lifetime. i want to talk about the stories that you recount in your book. you'ad quite a life. your mother was the governor of texas, the fire brand that she

was. f yoher is a civil rights attorney. and you write that your dinner table was never real about eating, it was for sorting precinct lists. what was your earliest memory? >> my parents were into every movent tha came through town, the farm workers, the women'sm ement. the most important moment for us was when my mom ran her first campaign ever for the state house. as kids we got to be involad i saw firsthand both how hard it was for women to run for office and how mportant it was and how exciting it was because she won that race. and mom wen on to have her owna politicaler. >> one of the most notable moments of your career, we all watched it nationally in 2015 was when congress investigated videos about planned parenthood's collection of

aborted fetal tissue. s that one of the toughest challenges there? >> absolutely. fake videotapes that were used to try to damage the reputation of the organization. we have five congressional committees investigating planned parenthood, more than investigated enron. but we got through. it ended up being an opportunity to educate millions ofe peo in this country about the incredible health care that plannede phood provides every single day to thousands of women in america. what do you think are the biggest challenges ahead for anned parenthood? >> the administration. that's why i'm so focused on not only supporting reproductive rights and health care, but tking sure we get every single person we can ovote this november because this is an opportunity to change the direction of the country. >> and yet you're stepping down at a time when many women would argue that planned parenthood needs someone with your

experience at the helm. >> i'm really proud of what we've done to invest in a whole new generation of leaders across the count i wouldn't be stepping down if i felt like we were at risk. we are stronger todayhan we've ever been in our 100-year history. we have now more than 12 million supporters, which is twice the membership otheational rifle association. we're making a difference in states across the country. i'll be an avid supporter of planned parenthood myti en life but it's time for someone new. >> the election has energized younger women. they're becoming more politically active. you've had a long history in yr life of being politically active. you protested the vietnam war in the seventh grade and you were a union organizer for a long tim

afterduating from college so what would be the biggest piece of advice you have for wom who are now becoming politically ac sve? >> as in my book, which is onmemory war and a call to action, just't wait for someone to ask you to do it. just jump in right now. so many women wait until they think they have the perfect resume, whether it'sor to run office or run for an organization. but this is the moment. i've never seen women this l activeterally shaking the foundation of this country in every possible y. and i think if we support each other, help women running for office, we really ask "k" make an enormous impact, n only i this november but two years from now as well. >> and yet whethe job came up for planned parenthood to head it, you almost didn't te it. why? >> i thought i've never done anything thatig, it's so hard and i don't have the skills. and a lot of women hold backus bethey think they're not ready. my motto now is starbefore

you' ready. don't overthink it. whatevenew opportunity come your way, jump at it. >> those are good words to end parenthood, so here, and e you congrat nions on your>>hat ll d. you will find more of our overage o kqed.org/newsroom. i'm thuy vu. thank you for joining us.

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