loss al tonight on kqed newsroom, how a small city has kicked off a wave of resistance to the state's sanctuary city policies. and carl pope lays out a vision for how every fern, city ands busin can fight climate change plus political analysis n of goveor brown's decision to deploy national guard troops at the border. hello a welcome to kqed newsroom, i'm thuy vu. we begin with immigration battles. this week the city of los alamedos in declared itself exempt from a state-wi law that's drawing criticism from president trump. that law sb-5 alsoknown as the california values act prohibits state and local policg encies from helping federal

authorities with immigration enforcement in many cases. sincethe los alamedos action, a wave ofther counties have also voiced opposition to sb-54. they have voided to join the trump administration in suing edcalifornia over laws at protecting undocumented immigrants. and joining me nowpe via s to discuss all of this, troy edgar. mr. edgar, thank you for joining us. >> thank you. thanks for having me on. >> the vote was 4-1 in favor of exempting los alamedos from the state sanctuary laws. you voted in support. why? >> well, for me personally, it was a constitutional issue. as a u.s. navy veteran and city council member and mayor for the city over 12, yea took an oath to support and defend the u.s. constitution. and for me, i just really felt this law basically i could noty comwith and had a like-minded city council member and we put it on the we ended up voting 34-1 to

exempt ourselv from sb-54. >> your wife is an immigrant from iran. what is your personal stand on mmigration policy? >> i think for me a little bit of a misnomer is it's absolutely not about immigration. my wife being from iran basically at 18, the shah was overthrown, she was a chrireian. tas a minority and really their family lost all of her prrpty. she ended up get going to paris and waiting for two years to get into the united stat. you'll find that in a lot of persian community in the asyrian community is a lot of folks who went that way. i have a lot of hispanic friends, same type of thing. they waited their turn. from my perspective, when i say i love immigrants, i absolutely an it. it's because my wife is an immikant. if you l at our city council, probably 4/5 of our council area married to imms or immigrants themselves. again, this has nothing to do with that.

immigrants just have to do with basicallycriminals that are illegally in this country and whether our city should be working with the ice authorities or the federal governments to be able to take ca of this issue. >> according to the los alamedos police chief, there hasn't been ara federal immon raid in your city in over ten years, how many undocumented immigrants are in los alamedos? >> i'm not too surehat so of accounting of the illegal or undocumented workers there are in the city. but this goes back to a bigger picture. our city is one of the n fest citiesange county. half of our budget goes towards we're known for being very proactive and making sure that we make the right decisions to have the highest -- or the best response time for police, the lowest crime rate. so being proaoive, you when we go through this process, we just want to make sure as policymakers to our city,

whether it's the police chief or anybody in this organization is from the top of our city, we want our folks working with u.s. federal officials when it comes to immigration. we don w know there would be any other reason why the state would compel us to do otherwise. >> the american civil liberties union and several other immigrants rights groups are basially suing and asking the courts to declare what you did, the newce ordin illegal. your reaction to that? >> well, obvious from being able to comment specifically on a case, i can't, because it's pending litigation. but the reality is the aclu from the very beginning has been trying to bully us through the process. they sent is two demand letters in, one before oe first vote march 19th. the second one for the april 16th vote just threatening us. from my perspective, i'm representing the people of my comnity. half o our base is military -- or half of our city is a military base.a , you oknow, being a councilmember for 12 years, i feel like i fairly represent our community and the types of

actions that we should be taking. i'm unphased by the aclu lawsuit. i thinkver time we'll have to engage that more when we bond out more it. >> how do you feel about immigration communities who feel this could make los alamedos less sfe to make imgrants feel less safe to come forwardd a report crimes? >> if you talk to the police chief, that really is not the there would be cases of unintended consequences. if somebody is a criminal and they'undocumented and they actually do get released out in the community, of the biggest issues is those people go back to the community where they victimize peop in the pas if those people are people that are actually undocumented and the situation goes down around them, that is a chance that something like that could happen. but i think for the most part,

tothis is not about tryinut a fear factor into people who are undocumented. i tell people the example is look, if toou have a party at your house and you invite people and some people a come th uninvited and they start doing bad stuff,do yout want them there, they need to g. and that really -- what we're trying to do, this is something that'scal issue. it's about local control for us. and it really is a u.s. constitutional issue is that we should not have to make a choice for our police whether they have to work with u.s. custom officials -- or immigration officials or whether they're going to work wit the state. >> we have about 20 seconds remaining. have you gotten calls from other california cits now interested n doing the same thing that los alamedos has done? >> absolutely. since we' done the first vote, we sent off over 500 letters to mayors and councilmembers to every city in californi t i spend t three hours a day talking to mayors and councilmembers interested in moving this forward in our city.

and i get calls frizm active cs and folks in the community who want to try to figure out how to work with their city council to get this item on ta.ir agen you would be surprised in the cities up in northern california that are ry interested in being a part of this. >> mayor troy edga you for your time. >> thank you. appreciate it. staying with politics, this week governor jerry brown announced that up to 400 national guard troops wilthbe sent t u.s./mexico border. the governor says the troops will fight criminalng ga human traffickers and drug and gun smugglers. they will not, however, help with iigration forcement or building a new border wall. i announcement sparked criticism from president trump. he called the deployment, quote, a sha rcharade. republican political consultant

sean walsh and senior poartical ryan garifoli. doctor, let me begin with you. we just got done talking the mayor of los alamedos. it certainly isn't the only city to be going against the state sanctuary laws. we've seen orange county itself and san diego county have voted to join the federal lawsuit against the law. where do you see all of this going from here? >> it may not go much than here because orange county, especially in the south and san diego county are probably the hot be of resistance to is this state sanctuari law. do think it's a very big issue there. it'sr a mobilizing issue republicans that could affect house races and turnout. it's attracted the attention of president trump.i hink you'll see other cities around the state and counties. but i think this is the most significant area where this is going on.n especially this is where the big house races are in november.

thuld decide control of the house of representatives. >> jo, do you agree with that kristen ga dar, a sgo supervisor who voted for this, some have accused her of exploiting the sanctuary law controversy to help boost her profile ina her for darrel iss a's seat in san diego county. >> this issue gives republicans some voice. they found their voice. call it the resistance to the resistance. i believe i came with that term. >> that's where i first heard it. >> i'mlaiming credit for that. but what it does is it allows folks, republicans, to sort of embrace trump's agenda witho embracing trump. trump in california is toxic. they don't want to do this. but t s is one of trump's co issues. this is something that appeals to the law and order suburban crowd, which is the orange county districts. they're largely that.so and it a -- it allows republicans to sort of gin up and get out the vote.

they're not going to have a senate candidate and they may r.t have a candidate on the ballot for gover >> you're raising your eyebrows. >> i am. time after time, nancy pelosi anticipate some of the activists in thc democraarty run into walls. they think that their values and their approach is what the rest of the country shares. and i think almost 2,500 people nmonstrate that it's just san diego, it's not just orange county, it's not just los alamedos. but all over the state, people have very serious concerns aboug il immigration. it's an issue not just for republicans but it's also an sue for democrats. >> swing voters, too. >> the study that you just referred to, the haas study, you found that nearly half of the people surveyed support president trump's travel ban and more deportation of undocumented immigrants. but i know that you have some concerns about how that study was conducted. >> oh, it's a good study.r i guess my con are how it's portrayed. i made some calls to look at

some of the data. i don't think the study shows quite wh sean is sayin.i think it shows overwhelming support for more of a progressive position on immigration. and then on some ambiguously worded questions about things like the muslim ban and deportation that's gotten highlighted in the news coverage. one of them asked, howimportant is the goal of deporting undocumented residents. and that got support. then the next question gets over 70%. it's kind of t hard deport people and give them citizenship at the same time. i think it's a good survey, but i think it's getting a little overestimated. even though i do think shaup is right, there is base of opposition on the democratic postion on immigratio i don't think it's coming from democrats, though. >> i disagree. you're showing 50% of bople in th area actually have these positions. i think there's ge old say there's a right way to come to

the country and a wrong way. the country and particularly california embraces legal immigration and legal immigrants. e t they have a problem with people who have cre illegally. andft they have a pot in their heart for daca kids. that's completely understandable. but when you see mayor libb libby schaff who s we're going to alert people when they're trying to deport criminals in oakland and other parts of eople rnia, it makes angry. they think that's a wrong approach from the federal government. the it doesn't surprise me at all that thisey su you see the link between legal immigration and right versus wrong. >> talking toepublican pollsters in southern california who are tabbed into these races, the intensity of these issues is off the charts. for republicans and to nonpartisanwing voters in the suburbs. this appeals to them, if you cast it -- if the republicans can cast it as supporting law enforcement.

because that's what people in the suburbs can relate to. they may not relate to an immigration issue, but if they're relating this to i'm supporting my local law enforcement officer, then the republicans might have some traction. the gas tax -- you know, the republics had envisioned th as something to get the voters to come out. it doesn't have the intensity, the emotional connectido as this issu. >> what about from a legal stand poi point? you talked about the emotional connection, joe. is this a case of the state overreaching? going back to t sanctuary laws. is it a case of overreach by the >> i d go to law school. dnnat. so i try to law off those. i'm a political scientist. just speaking politically, i think the state sanctuary law, while it was a very carefully desied law, it was certainly in a political realm, opened the door for local governments where republicans are strong, to become a resistanceto a sta law as opposed to just

another -- i do agree with joe that this is the animating issue in the republican party and it's the reason trump became president. just democrats sometimes dream that everybody agrees. i don't think theic general pub has that same feeling. what helps gin up republican turnout in theseil races also gin up democratic turnout. the gas tax hasn't really gone anywhere. there's not enough repalican cands statewide. this is it, this is the one key. and midterm elections as all of our guests know are not about persuasion, ttiy're about tion and mobilization. and meanwhile, we have the deployment of the national guard troops. governor jerry bown said he

won't do it. but they won't be involved -- he will do it,y but t won't be involved in immigration enforcement of construction. the federal government has agreed to pay for this. the edadministration is staking some issue with that.id >> trump o, we're not going to do it. is then then the same day, believe it was, the national guard said no, we just got pentagon funding to do this. ewe're talking about 400 troops. this is mostly both brown and the president appealing to their bases. you know, we're talking about -- these are not major movements o troops. it's a political thing. and they're both appealing to their base.>> just further poisoning the relationship between california and washingt? >> ll, i think the if the is itching for a fight with california. and not just the fact that this is going to effect those four seats that are targeted by the democra southern california. but this has national salience.

so this is an issue president trp in large partot elected based on his immigration stance. so i think, as he edsaid, you motivation to get your voters out. strong motivation on the democraticide for the women's movement and the pink hat crowd. so now you' got something that makes people equally as passionate to come out on the other side. o and a lot these races are decided by a couple hundred ar votes in manyas. this could be a very, very important political noteth motivator. >> can i jump in about governor brown for just a second? >> absolutely. go ahead. >> give some credit to what jerry brown did it was rather clever. every democratic candidate for governor said absolutely no to the deployment of the national guard. republican governor said absolutely yes. d jerry brown in his

philosophical way found a way to put president trump in a bad spot. he said maybe, let's look at it. he said since i'm the commander of the national guard, unless you federalize it, they're going to do what i want to do. it was ale reason proposal and the pentagon supported it. and the president goes to base and overturns yet another cabinet secretary. previouslit was nikki haley on russian sanctions, leavinethem out thhanging. but what brown did was not for his base. his base wante h to say flat no. and i don't know any democrat who can take that kind of position with the credibility that jerry brown can get away with. >> and meanwhile, making a speech that inflammatory football tt low-life politicians like to exploit. jerry brown gets away swith sayinff like that. but i want to move off immigration for a moment and also ask about this other that just happened today. the democratic national committee filed a muimillion

dollar lawsuit against russia, the trump campaign, and also wikilks, alleging there's a conspiracy to disrupt the 2016 presidential election. what do you make of this? can russia, for example, be sued? don't they have immunity? other nations have immunity from most u.s. lawsuits? >> might as well sue assadri an for all the effects that will do. this is pure politics, nothing more and nothing less. i think tre's some concern that muellerra could up his investigation early and this couldeep it going from the primaries into the election. speak of course e'awsuits, th better standing for bernie sande to sue the democratic national committee forolluding with hillary clinton. it's all politics. it doesn't have any standing. >> the democrats should be careful. don't pin your on being anti-trump. you have to have a message along

wih being anti-trump. the people who are anti-trump are already there with you. you have t get something else to get their voters to come out. traditionally, their voters havt not comen midterm elections. they need to do something rspositive to get their vo out. or else you're not going to do it on bashing trump. that group is already with you. >> on that note we're going to have to end it here. i want to thank alof you. thanks so much for being with us. sean walsh, republican strategist and also saon francisco cle senior political writerli jerry gara thank you, gentlemen. >> turning now to climate change. we talk to the former head of the sierra club, carl .ho his new bhook is titled "climate of hope." he co-authored it with michael bloomberg. pope lays out a vision for how individuals, businesses and

local governments can battle climate change even when state and national governments won't. and carl pope joins me now in the studio. nice to have you here. >> great to be here again. >> in your ok you say it's time for a new conversation about climate change. at do you think is wrong with the way it's being discussed mao? >> we talked about climate change as this enormous problem which requires phenomenal if sae. and the conversation is, who's going to pay for the bill? that use used to be true. it' not true anymore. the question is, who's going to take the lead? that's a different kind ofve coation. >> a lot of it talks about long-term consequences. not something that people can eare late to now.g talkabout how to make money, not sacrifices. polar bears, n asthmatic children. >> that exactly right. people don't realize many of the states who have done the most to reduce their carbon footprint

are states like oklahoma and texas which did it not bethuse have governors who cared about climate change. they didn't. tibut because they hadty customers who wanted cheaper power and wind is cheaper than coal. i >> sowas a money-making incentive there. >> and it was mediate. e utility rates of texas have been coming down. rates in texas have been coming down significantly because we're retiring coal and replacing it with national gas, wind and solar. >> much of the climate changer centersnd doom and gloom scenarios. you point out in the book that those sharing ta-- scaringt tacs do really work with people why not? >> if you're ag rock climb coach and trying to get somebody to do a pitch they've never done , you don't do that by saying oh, my gosh, it's going i don't know if you can do it.

the person you're coaching, you say hey, this is ke something you've done before, and i know you can do it and you're goingtr to have toch and you're going to have to work and be on. and that's what we need o tell people about climate change. not that it's a catastrophic awful thing. the numbers are so bad. you say wait a minute, we got rid of a class of refrigeration chemical that was dstroying the ozone layer. w to replace them with better stuff. we replaced the first set, wive can replace this set. >> so let's expand on that. you also write in the he major contributors to global warming are buildings, the electricity we use in our homes and offices. also transportation and the stuff we make, steel, toys, furniture. there are so many complex layers here, so what can i, as an al individdo? what are the top two things i can do to help fight climate

change? >> it depends on who you are. everybody has a different set of institutional connections.dy everys -- people are part of family, they're part of communities, they vote for school boards, they work for companies. they may teach students. and in all o thoseroles, you have an opportunity to focus tha conveon on how can we simultaneously make tomorrow better an better today? and everybody has those opportunities. you just have to look around you ander say do i have connections to other people and how can i work with thosether people to speed up the rate of progress towardsbeer outcomes for the climate, which are also going to be better outcomes for making us healthy or unhealthier. >> we have several things going on right now. the american lung association report that came out this week that said out of the top ten u.s. cities with the most ozone pollution, 8 of them are in california, inclutding los

angeles, sacramento, and fresno. and at the same time, we have a f government that is rolling back quite a few provisions of the clean air act. what do you see the trump administration having on federal pmaicies regarding c change. >> the trump administration is making federal policies horrible. durns out, that doesn't have to matter that much. let's talk about air pollution in colorado. i've been work on this problem for 40 years. for 40 years, california has be trying to clean up the internal combustion engine. we've done a remarkable job. and for most of those 40 years, washington wso resistant. most of the progress california made in cleaning up the car, which is no translated into national progress, was made by california, not we now recognize we can't do the job with gas power. ws.need to electrify vehicl and that's how we're going to solve california collusion

oblem and california can take the lead and is taking the lead on getting that done, even though donald trump wants to pretend that electric cs aren better than internal combustion cars. they are. >> must be some impact, right? how do the administration's viewpoints affect the way that environmentalists are doing their work? >> what really matters is, is it affecting the way an electricity consumers behave? is it afbting the way american drivers behey? or american manufacturers behave? not so much. they all look at the trump administration and say he's going to be there for a while, he's going to be gone. we're investing in the future. when tmpnnounced i'm going to bring out coal. aun one of the consulting firms said is this changing in what you're investing in. and only one compy out of 42 said that it would change their

investment strategies. the rest sa we're not investing for the next three years. we're investing for the next 20 years and the next 20 years is solar. >> just quickly, in terms of strategies, local governments, ven colorado this week are n taking the strategy of suing oil and gas companies over the cost of climate change. good or bad strategy? >> that's a good strategy. that has now been joined by a conservative libertarian think tank in washington. we're beginning to see ople coming in from the other side and saying well, if the government is not going to hold the ndustry accountable, individual citizens can. >> nice to have you here. >> nice to be here with you. >> that's going to do it for us. you can find more of our coverage on kqed/newsroom. i'm thuy vu. thanks for joining us.

ptioning sponsored by wnet >> sreenivasan: on this edition for sunday, april 22: on earth day, the focus turns to plastic pollution as e.p.a. administrator scott pruitt faces new scrutiny. and in our signature segment, a growing number of african americans turn to homeschooling. next on pbs newshour weekend. "pbs newshour weekend" i made possible by: bernard and ire schwartz. the cheryl and philip milstein family. sue and edgar wachenheim, iii. ndr. p. roy vagelosiana t. vagelos. the j.p.b. foundation. the anderson family fund. rosalind p. walter barbara hope zuckerberg. corporate funding is provided by mutual of america-- designing customized individual and group re