captioning sponsored by newshour productionsllc >> woodruff: good evening, i judy woodruff. on the newshour tonight, following the money-- conflicting stories from president trump and his personal attorney about payments to adult film actress, stephanie clifford. den, i sit down with former c.i.ector michael hayden to discuss what's at stake in this new era for the nion's intelligence community, and president trump's inaugural pastor talks about the role of faith at the trump white house. plus, ontario's income experiment: a look at canada's pilot program offering a less bureaucratic way to break the cycle of poverty. >> you don't have to show that you're sick, you don't have to show that you can't work. you get it as a right. >> woodruff: all that and more on tonight's pbs newshour.

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at carnegie.org. >> and with the ongoing support ofhese institutions: and individuals. pr >> thiram was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. >> woodruff: the white house finds itself tonight, fending off new qutions about stormy daniels, and who paid for her silence. they erupted after a swirl of statements by a member of president trump's own legal team. >> prayer has always beeat the

center of american life. >> woodruff: the president marked the "national day of prayer" this morning, amid new disclosures about a payment to an adult film star. >> mr. president, why are you changing your story on stormy daniels? >> shame on you! >> woodruff: one of mr. trump's hrsonal attorneys, michael cohen, long said he used his rdn money to pay $130,000 to stephanie cliffoknown as "stormy daniels," just before the 2016 election. clifford says it wasmoney, to buy her silence about an alleged sexual affair with mr. trump in 2006. the president has denied any hsrelationship, and for mohe denied knowing about a payment. eyen last night, newly hired attorudy giuliani, acknowledged president trump repaid cohen. >> that was money that was paid by his lawyer, t, way i would t of his law firm funds or

whatever funds it doesn't matter edand the president reimbu that over the period of several months. >> woodruff: app"hring on fox's nity," giuliani maintained the president was unaware of details of the stormy s matter, until recently. >> he didn'tnow about the specifics of it, as far as i know. but he did know abt the general arrangement, that michael would take care of things like this. >> woodruff: giuliani told "the new york times" that mr. trump made a series of payments to cohen of $35,000 each, totaling as much as $460,000, for what he called "incidental expenses." he rejected any notion that the payments might have violated campaign funding lawha >>money was not campaign money, sorry. i'm giving you a fact now that you don't know. it's not campaign money. no campaign finance violation. >> they funneled it through a law firm. >> they funneled throud a law firm, the president repaid >>. oodruff: the president reinforced the point on twitter this morning.

heaid that: "mr. cohen, an attorney, received a monthly retainer, not from the campaign and having nothing to do wit the campaign s ese agreements are very common among celebritd people of nialth." giulas back on fox again early this morning, saying the initial payment to clifford s made to protect the trumps from being personally hurt by false allegations. but he also suggested the looming election was a factor. t >> imagine if that came october 15 in the middle of the last debate with hillary clinton. cohen didn even ask. cohen made it go away. >> woodruff: still these latest revelations call into question the president's own words aboard air force one last month. >> mr. president, did you know about the $130,000 payment to stormy daniels? >> no, no, what else? >> then why did mr. cohen make those if there was no truth to

>> do you know where he got the money to make that payment? >> no, i don't know. no. st woodruff: cohen said in a ement in february that: "neither the trump organization tr the trump campaign was a party to tnsaction with ms. clifford, and neither reimbursed me for the payment, either directly or indirectly." at the time, white house press secretary sarah sanders echoed that denial from the white house briefing podium. >> there was no knowledge of any payments from the president, and he's died all of these allegations. >> woodruff: today, sanders faced a new barrage of questions. as giuliani stated, this was something that wasn't initially inown but was later learned, we give the besrmation we have at the time. >> woodruff: cohen is now the target of an f.b.i. investigation. agents raided his home andnt r fice last mo reportedly searching fodocuments on the clifford payment, among other things. civil suit against president own trump, for defamation.

we'll examine the implications of the giuliani disclosures, after the news summary. in the day's other news, the white house has a new reason for mey president trump fired james as f.b.i. director. re his "fox news" interview last night,dential lawyer rudy giuliani said it was "because comey would not say that he-- trump-- wasn't a target" in the ruia investigation. it's at least the third explanation that the president and his aides have given for irring comey. 's foreign minister insisted today that his government will not agree to any changes in the 2015 nuclear deal. in a youtube video, javad zarif dismissed president trump's demands that european leaders "fix" the agreement. >> let me make it abso clear once and for all: we will neither outsource our security, nor will we renegotiate or add on to a deal we have already

implemented in gthd faith. eds. has consistently violhe agreement, especially by bullying others from doing business with iran. woodruff: president trump is weighing whether to re-certify an's compliance with the agreement, or end u.s. sanctions relief by may 12th. the trump administration stayed mum today on whether u.s special forces are helping saudi arabia btle rebels in yemen. "the new york times" reported about a dozen of green berets are helping to locate and destroy rebel missiles being fired at saudi cities. the report said there is no indication the commandos have actually crossed into yemen. a fierce rainstorm roared through northern and western india ernight, killing more than 90 people. some 160 others were injured. the deluge brought winds of 80 miles an hour that blew down trees and destroyed homes. most of the deaths a t the worst

of destruction came in the northern city of agra. the famed taj majal is located there, but it was undamaged. meanwhile, there's word the 10 cities with the most polluted air are all in india. the "world heath organization" released its findings today, based on data from 2016. according to the w.h.o., roughly 7 million deaths a year, worldwide, are caused by air pollution. talks are underway in beijing, as china and the u.s. y to avert a trade war. treasury secretary steve mnuchin and the u.s. delegation arrive today, as china's foreign ministry said any agreement a st benefit ch well. e >> ( translated ):lcome negotiation and consultation, but it must be on the basis of equal footing and mutual respect, and the result should be mutually beneficial. let's wait and see. >> woodruff: the talks will continue through tomorrow, wh

the focus on technology trade ntd tariffs. back in this c, the u.s. military is now investigating the crash of a puerto rican national guard plane that killed nine airmen. the aging c-130 hercules nose- dived onto a highway near savannah, georgia yesterday, just after taking off for arizona. it was making its final flight. officials say the plane was at heast 40 years old, and possibly arizona te are set to end their six-day strike after scoring a major victory. the governor signed a budget bill today, including a 20% salary hike for teachers, over three years. it did not meet their demands fomore school funding. schools are expected to reopen tomorrow. the motion picture academy today copelled bill cosby, after his iction for drugging and sexually assaulting a woman. za the same time, the orgaon expelled director roman polanski.

he fled the united states 40 years ago, after pleading guilty to drugg a 13-year-old girl.th tand, on wall street, upb ksonomic data rescued stoc from an early swoon. the dow jones industrial average dropped nearly 4ll points init but ended up five and closed at 23,9. the nasdaq fell 12 points, and the s&p 500 slipped six. still to come on the nshour: the former c.i.a. director trchael hayden on the agency under thp administration. on this national day of prayer, what's behind evangelicals strong support for the president, and much more. >> woodruff: as we repord earlier, rudy giuliani's hmments to various media

outlets last nige created a new legal headache for his top client, president trump. ga take a closer look at the questions the statements raise, with john carlin. he was a longtime justice department official and federal prosecutor, and now works in private practice. and rick hasen, election law expert and professor at the university of cafornia irvine school of law. and, gentlemen, we welcome both of you back to the program. rick hasen, i'm going to start withou. we just heard a few minutes ago in that piece we put together rudy giuliani tell the anchors at fox news, he said there was no campaign violation, everything was done proper. how do you see it? >> well, i think it's a really open queriion. t now, what it looks like is that michael cohen gave a loan to donald trump, and if that was a campaign-related loan, then that had to be reported on campaign finance forms and each time the loan was paid back, the

payment had to be put in there. it's all going to turn on what did trp foe, whe did he know it and was this campaign related, was the motive to he the campaign or to help trump so while we don't know enough to know whether or not there's a campaign finance olation, there's certainly enough to investigate here and giuliani has made things much worser donald trump right now. >> woodruff: in terms of a reason, we heard rudy giuliani say at one point it was connected to the campaign date t another point in the interview he said it was to spare president trumand his wife embarrassment. >> well it could have been both those things, coming just before the election, just before stormy daniels was supposed to be on television talking about the affair, that's some circumstantial evidence campaign related and might be when the u.s. attorneys seized evidence from cohen's offices, they were looking for evidence of motive -- was this more about wisconsin or melania? i think we don't know that yet.

>> woodruff: john carlin, there were so many parts of what rudy giuliani had to say, but i want to ask you about the comment he said, this is a private contract between two parties known as nondisclosure, an nda, he said these are common among celebrities and people of wealth. is that true? are these kinds of payments done all the time? >> well, there are so many atnspectors of this current investigation eem unusual, to say the least, one of which is the public discussion and disarray and chaos if the legal team in the way that the legal wam often does not seem to be matching up wit the client is saying which is never ideal when you're in a defe situation and you contrast that with the mueller and his prosecution team. they never speak on the record, they never speak to the press. when they do speak, it's through official court filings and bycuments and running this

investigatiohe book. and remember, outsidee daily news is a serious inoustigation a foreign power trying to undermine our democracy, and's ll the more important we get to the bottom of that as we head towards another election cycle today. h we jusrd news today that a state election might be attacked through a cyber attack. we've got to get prepared. woodruff: again, back t what rudy giuliani was saying thd the on the heels of a few weeks ago f.b.i. raid going into the office and home of the president's former lawyer, michael cohen, does it look the you as if -- inmean, a, we're speculating here -- what rudy giuliani was trying to do was clean up some of this because they know the f.b.i. has taken material from cohen's office? >> well, trying to avoid speculation t, at times, they've attacked the search warrant on cohen's offices as

something that was inappropriate or done through the mueller special counsel investigation, and ey'rdifferent. what we're learned to date is in the special counsel investigation, they apparently uncovered evidenowing there were crimes committed, and those crimes were sufficiently serious that the acting attorney general rod rosenstein said they feed to be investigated by an independent -- need to be anvestigated by an independent prosecutor's officsouthern district of new york which is legendarily independent, hard-charging prosecutors and it looks like they found serious evence of crimes that ledo not only a search warrant of attorneys' offices and easier of materials but as they put in their filing easier of his email. that's not app easy standa to meet. so it does seem like, because of erat, there's a lot of con that, as they uncover the crimes that were -- that they a investigating there that it's somehow going to lead back to the president and is legal team.

>> woodruff: so many strands. "the washington post" was reporting today theen presid had been advised by rudy giuliani and perhaps others not to have any contact with ichael cohen and then, of course, nbc ths reporting earlier in the day the f.b.i. was eavesdropping and modified it ter to say the f.b.i. w monitoring phone calls going into cohen's office d there may have been a call with the white house. back to you, rick hasen. w wiare trying to understand here whether laws might he been broken or not. so as somebody who understands election law, what more information do you need to know? you mentioned a minute ago edtive. what more do you o know to understand whether the law was violated or not? >> well, so once we know when trump knew what he knew, if it cas during the campaign period or even now e he's running the 2020 campaign, the main

queson is going to be was this iampaign related, and that's a motive que. this came up in the john edwards prosecion, senator john edwards also receiving payments for a mistress and he argued they were persoal, not campaign related. how do you get evidence of motive? you can infer it from the timing toming just before the election, but there mi well be communications between trump and cohen or communatns with others which would indicate the payments were made to stop daniels from going on tv just before the election. if that evidence is in what the u.s. attorneys ged, that would be good evidence it's campaign related and might be a haolation, and that would be a civil probleled by the federal election commission to pontially a criminal problm, and enough at stake and the motive potentialail time is something that's at least on the table if not something that's likely to happen.

>> woodruff: john carlin, how much does it matter when the payments made by the president to michael cohen and the fact they we done in installments? >> there are a lot of questions still to answer and one which would be were people trying to intentionalle deceiv the manner in which they made payments? the languagefunneling" was very odd to hear. >> woodruff: rudy giuliani used that wordwa >> tha very surprising because it sounds like it might have beebrought in, in order to hide the source of the funds, might be something they look into. but as you said, this is one strand of many, many elements now, of evidence of different types of criminal activity by people surrounding the campaign person of the president. more to come. >> woodruff: so many questionte but at the cof this, this contradiction between what thepr ident had said himself and now what his lead personal attorney rudy giulia is saying. john carlin, rick hasen, we

thank you both. >> thank you. >> woodruff: president trump was elected at least in rt, on a promise to upend the way washington and its bureaucracies work. that gave pause to some in the nation's intelligence community, including retired air force general michael hayden, who, during the george w. bush administration, served nansecutively as director of the onal security agency and the c.i.a. in his new book "the assault on intelligence, american national crcurity in the age of lies," he iques the president's ylmpaign tactics, his behavior, and his governing especially as it relates to the nation's secrets and its spies. general hayden, welcome back to the newshour. general hayden, welcome back to the "newshour". >> thank you. >> woodruff: so you worked in ican administration but you're pretty tough on

president trump. >> yeah, actually, i try to apolitical.e i was a clinton appointee to n.s.a. but indeed i am fairly tough on the president. judy, i look at the as kind of a three-layer cake and, so, let me begin at the base layer which is not donald trump. the base layer is us, all right? we have entered whathe oxford dictionary calls a post-truth world, a world in which decision-making is less dependent on data and facts and more dependent on the emotion preference, grievances, loyalty, tribalism,nd what president trump did as a candidate he identified that. he exploited that. frankly, and hers the cruof the book, as president, he seems to worsen that. veen you've got those two layers, ot a third layer of the cake that's somewhat troubling as well, and that's a foreign power, the russians, coming in through themeter

wire, taking advantage of all that i just described. >> woouff: what is the problem that you have, the criticism you have of his telationship with the inlligence committee community? he's been very critical at times. >> at times. frankly, though, and the phrase you would use at c.i.a., the intel community right now is a little bit off of the x, the department of justice and the f.b.i. are on the x. >> woodruff: what do you mean? meaning they are the target of the president's criticism of both institutions aeople. but that shouldn't be comfortable to the people in the intelligence community because you have a president here who seems to emphasize loyalty, personal loyalty to him over the norms that have governed these institution for decades if not centuries, so that cod easily be turned to the intelligence community as well. >> woodruff: how do you know thathis president is so very different from other presidents in ho relationship the intelligence community? >> to be very fair, i've never briefed president trump. i've briefed president bush,

president obama, and i go to great pains in the book to point out it's our job to aommodate the president. we've had presidents who have argued with us. we've had presidents, frankly, who may not have told the truth either. this is a president, and this is the distinction, who seams to make some decisions based on something other than a view of objective reality. he's based decisions on some other criteria. orck to that basic layer of a post-truth. >> woodruff: one of the many things you write about, general hayden, is the so-called steele dossier. ht. >> woodruff: the document, the report prepared by the former british telligenceagent christopher steele. you know him. you've looked at that. how credible is it? i'm asking because republicans and the ss have discounted it, they say it was paid for by wthe democrats, it's nth the paper it's written on. >> i don't know chris steele. i know people who have worked

with him. he was a solid officer fo m.i.6. when i read that document, a couple of thoughts when it becamemb public, one, it sounds like us. it has the sound oran intelligence report. it was familiar language to me. but if we had produced that we would have had in bold letters at t top and bottom "this is not finay evaluated intelligence, this is raw information." it would have been the beginning of a process, not the end. >> woodrff: you're saying it wouldn't have been completely discounted? >> oh, no. what we would have done, we would have gone through every particular pro say we would have said who's the source, would the source be expectedo know, has the hours reported reliable pli in the past and do we have information that would sustain or not that data point. frankly, that's what's going on with bob muellr and others. >> speaking of robert mueller, special counsel, smuch to ask you about here. there's a lot, in fact

everything we don't know abou h wh has learned, but we do know there have been an unusual number of commuications, connections, between people around presidt trump and russian officials. is it that unusual? i think people are looking at that and saying is that something we should be paying this much attention to? >> so, yes, an answer is, yes, from my point of view. remember, the mueller investigation has gotten pretty oad now, but its origins are in a counterintelligence investigation. d's what were the russians trying to do ad anyone over here engage in helping them. so we do have, i think, an extraordinary number of contacts tween the trump campaign and the russian security services, e d we know for a fact what the russians wrying to do. diw, the question becomes for ctor mueller, in those connections, is that borne out of naity, out of ignorance or something darker. i >> woodrufit possible, and this emerged from the steele

dossier, that moscow may view president trumcawhen he was a idate as a russian asset. i mean, is that even conceivable? ld not and i have use the word and some supporters of the president think i'm being a little unkind here, i've used a russian word for "the useful idiot," or "the usel tool. it's a soviet term of art. it's a naive individual owploited by the soviets, russians even though they aly hold him in person contempt. >> woodruff: what do you worry most about as the investigation goes on? >> the lack of resolution, the intelligence community report on what the russians did, when you look at what americans think about it, it looks like natial roar shack test.

we can't get out from under this cloud unless most americans say, well, that looks about the way that it happened. >> woodruff: two othng ts taking place in this administration, the possibility of a deal betweni the ud dtates and north korea to potentially get of its nuclear weapons program. does that seem like something thatould happen? >> the broad-based intelligence estimate for the longest time, judy, has been these guys aren't crazy, the koreas, and the would have to be crazy to give up their weapons. when you look at the muamma gadhafis and the saddam husseins and the ukraines of the world, what happens to a country when they don't have uclearization in any way that has meaning for you and me is something that's going to take place attenof a very long process, which does not mean the present shouldn't go meet kim jong un and perhaps f:gin that process. >> woodrinally, a question about iran, should the trump administration stay in the

current deal or should the u.s. pull out? >> my personal view is we should stay in for the time being.no i wa a fan of the deal. i had all my criticisms of the deal, but i think the consensus of folks like me is that iran iw furthe from a weapon with this deal than they would be without it. we know more about the iranian program with this deal than we would know without it. >> woodruff: looks like the president is preparing to -- >> i fear that he is and what i toldnou about further away ad so on, that's actually the metelligence community asse, and we're back to the premise of the book, how much of presiential action is based upon this objective view of reality asd oppose his original instincts and campaign rhetoric. >> woodruff: michael hayden, the boo "k e assault on intelligence, american national security in the age of lies." thank you very much, general. >> thank you.

>> woodruff: president trump marked the national day of prayer with an event in the rose garden as his support among ptih the annual event was stood in contrast to the other news we've been discussing of mr. trump'so payments adult film actress. william brangham has more. >> brangham: joining me now is a lead amongst american evangelicals, a man who has prayed with, and prayed for, president trump. nverend samuel rodriguez is president of tional hispanic christian leadership ence and has served as a advisor in various capacities to president's bush, obama, and w, trump. welcome to the "newshour". >> thank you for hav me. e president was here for national prayer day, he met with many leaders of the faith community. you are in that inner circle. as we were sing before, the president has enormous support among the evangelical community

and i wonder if you could help me understand where d that support come from? >> public policy. evangelicals experienced or felt in the past number of years, the past ten years, issueso f religious liberty, issues of advancing their judeochristian helue systems stood threatened. sisters ofoor, hobby lobby, supreme court cases that to evangelicals infringed their ability to advance theospel of geds. all of a sudden, we have president trump, and the public policy initiatives as it pertains to faith is much more favorable to the evangelical community indeed. >> brangham: there are many things on one side of the leverager th would alienate him from the evangelical mmunity, three marriages, accusations of adultery, brag.ng about sexual assaul you're arguing the policy side of the ledger is enough to make people think things don't matter that much? >> i don't think it's ever that it doesn't matter.

i think it comes to the point we don't want to write anyone off. you don't want to write off access to a prentho can impact religious liberty and the sanctity of life. so it's a matter of balancing these narratives in a way where we never sacrifice truth on the altar of expediency but likewise support policies that reflect our judeo-christian value system. >> woodruff: r. >> brangham: it's more fundamental to evangelicals, ey felt muchore fundamental was at stake. >> some gued the future of american christianity. >> brangham: is that right? aamolutely. it bthat canopy. rse impetus behind it, putting alities aside, the imperative, what's at stake here. put it in per sperveghtive, religious liberty, sacrificing your conscience on the altar of politics, government obligating you to put away your belief system if you worked in a hospital, whatever that may be.

there are a number of issues that prompted evangelicals to support president trump. >> brangham: how much a role did abortion play? >> significant. arguably in the top two next to religious liberty. even in e latino evangelical community, 28% o latinos supported president trump when asked in the exit polling what drove tinos to support president trump, it was life. >> brangham: there re, as you well know, many people in your own congregation that didn't like your support of the president largely on the issue of immration, i believe, and i know you have differewith the president on some of his stances on immigration what do you y to him? >> i pastor a multi-ethnic congrescongregation, 40% african-american, 40%hi, 20% asian and latino, so i received on a stack of bibles no pushback tpushback.

i disagreed with president obama on a number of issues. i me, really respectfulsa eed with him but i loved the man and respect the man. likewise with george w. bush. so my congregation sees it as continuity in wha they would deem as a prophetic role to speak uth to power, to advance an agenda of love, truth, gracem fogration reform, education equality, preserving life in and out of theomb, to them it's a continuum taking place. >> brangham: one of the issues is daca and the 7 to -- 7,000 o, 0 people brought to america as children. you describe it as morally irreprehensible as how they are treated by our legislators. what would you say to the president about that? >> i am able to speak to the president and his team. the answr has been, reverend, i love these young men and women.

>> brangham: used that language? d absolutely. the president loo me and said i'm a father and a grandfather, reverend, and i get it, and i don't want tdo anything to harm these young men and women, to me. so i heard that from the president of the united states. then you heard him subsequently talk about a love agenda regarding these young pen and women. >> woodruff: how do you reconcile, then, president trump talking about age lovea regards to daca with his other rhetoric about immigicrants many have called toxic rhetoric? >> and on a number of casions i have expressed in a very respectful manner my displ with comments and even wording, phrases that do not lean up with what i believe is a viable, sustainable message of love, hope and compassion. it's a conundrum, and there seems to be not a dichotomy but there seems to behis sort of balancing act that takes place and, at the end of the day, what do i care about public policy?

i care what has the president sign in the rose garden. will these men and women created in tim of god be deported and protected and a pathway for legalization of citizenship? that's what drives me to do what rsdo. so i unnd it, by the grace of god i have had conversations with the presidt where he has celebrated, affirmed, validated the immigrant community in america. >> brangham: reverend rodrigues. ank you very much. >> thank you for having me. >> woodruff: the economy may be doing well by many measus, but for years there have real concerns over wage growth and the overall standard of living, aps it's not so surprisi that at least one recent survey showed growing public support for a new gothrnment program would guarantee some income to citizens. ere are small pilot projects of how it could work.

economics correspondent paul solman traveled to canada to see that, part of s weekly series, "making sense." >> reporter: cheerios, it says "sans gluten." "without gluten." >> i may not speak french, but i've been in a bilingual country, so gluten means.s >> reporter: a tuesday trudge to the hamilton, ontario.in >> love the organic vegetablesep ld rorter: this is the first time 29-year-o alana baltzer has been able to afford the healthy food here at the mustard seed co-op. because, she says, when you're poor... ca>> it's buy the stuff yo afford, which is generally quick, easy and all processed fad high in sugar and tran and all the other unhealthy stuff. >> reporter: that's all that baltzer could afford on her $575 nth welfare disability check. but ontario will now give her $1130 u.s. a mon, no questions

asked, as part of a three-year basic income pot launched late last year. >> around the world, people believe that basic income could provide a mpler and more effective income support. >> reporter: the idea's so being piloted in finland and california. now it's ontario too. >> how are people's lives changed, how are they able to do better in their lives, prevent illness, stay in school, get jobs and keep jobs. >> repter: ontario premier kathleen wynne. >> we should be looking at ppfferent ways of providing t, ways that actually don't punish people, but actually support people in getting on with their lives and produce better outcomes. reporter: 4,000 randomly selected ontarians in three communities will get about $13,000 a year, u.s., for a single person, $19,000 for a couple. in exchange, recipients give up ntme social supports and the governets back 50 cents of y ery dollar they earn.

>> it is definitelthe biggest basic income study in north america. th>> you don't have to sho you're sick, you don't have to show that yocan't work. you get it as a right. >> reporter: research director kwame mckenzie and his team will analyze the results. >> we' going to see if it increases your chance of coming out of pover. we're trying to see if it makes your housing stable. we're trying to see ether it improves your mental health. whether it basically decases your use of other services, such as hospital beds. >> reporter: turns out manitoba launched a basic income experiment in 1974 that the provincial government later pulled the plug on. >> it was an incomplete study. >> reporter: but long after, researchers studying the data found... >> we've got less health service use, we've gotental health improving, we've got people going back to college and they're getting better, getting

better skills to move forward. this is a great thing. right? >> reporter: but was it a fluke? and could the same policy produce like results 40+ years later? well, for jodi dean and family >> seems, yes. ee you tomorrow! >> reporter: 10-year-old daughter madison has suffered from both brittle bone disease and epilepsy since toddlerhood. >> jodi, how was your day? >> it was okay. >> reporter: yes, canada has universal healthcare, bur.not for the ommute. >> as far as parking goes, we're not covered for that. that's $25 an emergency visit. >> reporter: how many times has she broken a bone? >> she's probably had at least 70 breaks. >> how many times a month you have to pay for parking? >> two to three times a week. >> reporter: basic iome now covers, in effect, half parking the bill, a huge relief for someone who never dreameshe'd be poor, used to volunteer at the food bank, then couldn't

live without it. >> how do you go back to where you just gave that time and tell them now you're in need? >> reporter: jodi dean, like alana baltzer, lives in hamilton, a once-thriving steel city of 750,000 within an hour of toronto. >> we used to have 40,000 people working directly in steel, and today, it's probably closer to 7,000. >> reporter: t cooper, who directs an anti-poverty project, claims he's already seen benefits from the program. >> many of the individuals i've talked to who are on the basic income pilot are going back to school, wanting to improve their opportun job.to get a better >> reporter: moreover, he says: >> there's not the oversight we ste in traditional social asce systems that requires r ople to report monthly on their incomeeir housing status or their relationship leatus. >> reporter: w most poor ntontarians didn't make it the pilot, balzer did, and no .onger has to deal with the welfare syst

>> you do not have the bureaucracy involved with weare or disability. if you get a job, you simply sll and let them know, submit your paytubs, bit a boom, bada bang, done. >> reporter: your mom made it into the program. has it had positive effects for her? >> oh, god, yeah. she's more ecstatic about t having to deal with ontario works, the welfare workers. >> reporter: the pilot hasven induced baltzer to lose five r; moresince novem exercise, more confidence. >> the first time in years i've been able to wear high heels without groaning in absolute pain and sheer agony >> reporter: as for the depression she has long struggleto fend off... >> it's nice to not have a full- blown episode because i'm worried about whether or not i'm going to be able to eat tonight or be able to pay my rent or do something as simple as laundry. >> reporter: other pluses? well, from the government's point of view, it no longer has to subsidize baltzer's housing,

so the pilot is cost less than $700 a month more. >> it's important to measure that and measure use of orvernment services. >> repr: but if balzer attends college in the fall, as planned, and then gets a job, government would be off the hook entirely. >> it's also important to g asure whether people are actually generatalth. because everybody's thinking often about the cost, but people hedon't always think about possible economic benefits. >> reporter: but look, say skeptics, bac income will cost a pretty, albeit canadian, penny going out, while benefits may never actual flow in. >> i don't think the savings are actually going to be there. so, i think at's misleading. >> reporter: that's local lawyer david wakely, who says if the ogram is extended universally, it would cost ontario two-thirds of its annual revenue. and he doubts recipients will go to school or get a job. >> where someone can stay home

and get a basic income guarantee. this just serves as a safety blanket, a security blanket for them, because they've always got this income to rely on. >> reporter: and, as i asked former u.s. union leader andy stern, isn't that the time- honored objeion to a basic pcome? if you pple to do nothing, isn't that an incentive for them to continue to do nothing? >> there are always people going to stay at home and take advantage of government programs. there are a lot of wealthy people and children who are paid se do nothing, and it doesn't to affect them being vital and involved in society. >> reporter: john clf the ontario coalition against adverty doesn't worry about poor people takinntage of a basiheincome. but does worry that the program is a move to take advantage of them, by laying the groundwork for the elimination of government-provided social worker health care, the eventual privatization of social services.

>> so you're shopping for healthcare, you're shopping for housing, you're shopping for public transportation, childcare, all these things and this is the prevailing agenda at the moment and a basic income system takes us in that direction. >> reporter: moreover, says esarke, a basic income cre downward wage pressure on the working poor. >> if you create a situation where low wa workers are receiving a significant portion of their wages out of the tax revenues, then the pressure on employers to increase wages is reduced, the pressure on governments to increase minimum wages is reduced. >> reporter: so how to know, then, if the costs outweigh the benefits? >> we can have all these theoretical discussions. or we can say let's do a test and see what actually happens. what are the costs? ed it a more efficient way of giving people who t, support? t at are the benefits? doesow the economy or not? and then we can have a rational discussion based on evidence rather than just based on

theory. eporter: and rather than based on promises of breaking the cycle of poverty which might nd might not, in the end, be mainly smoke airrors. for the pbs newshour, this is economics corresponden solman reporting, mainly from ontario. >> woodruff: now, new allegations of sexual harassment and a longtime abuse opower by a former top anchor, and this time, as john yang explains, claims about just how much the network management knew. >> yang: judy, it was more than five months ago that charlie rose lost both his pbs interview show and his job as anchor of "cbs this morning." it came after the "washington post" reported complaints about his behavior toward women at the pbs program. today, the post reports that the

incidents of rose's sexual misconduct were far more numerous than previously reported, and that cbs managers were told about them as early 1986. late today, cbs news told its employees it had hired a law firm to investigate the allegations in the post report. we're joined by one of the two "washington post" reporters who wrote both stories: amy brittain, who is on per's investigative team.y, anks for being with us. >> of course. thank you for having me. thisng: your story says was more pervasive and widespread, the complaints. how widespread? >> 27 new allegations against charlie rose, spanning 42 years ago, the oldest from 1976 and the most rec from 2017. >> yang: sexual misconduct is a fuzzy term. what are we talking about? >> there's a range of behavior included in the total. i would say the most serious incidents involved exposure of his gent also to woman working in the nbc washington bureau in

the research library in 1976. some of the behavior later involved pulling women into his lap, making lewd sexual remarks, late night sexual phone calls, asking them about their sex lives, dproaping them in some >> yang: originally cbs news said they knew nothing about this before your story in november. but you foundwh instancee cbs managers had been told about this. >> right. after our first story we were kind of flooded with tips and voice mailspl and pe reaching out saying we had just kind of hit the tip of the iceberg with our first story, that this, in fact, had been going on at cbs and peoplenew about it. my co-reporter and i set out to find out what did they know a when did they find out. >> yang: what did you find? we found thearliest instance of mebody reporting this to a manager charlie rose was making lewd sexual remark to a young clerk.

she laughed it off and said you don't have to be alone with him. he became a franchise player for cbs news, on "60 minutes" and "cbs this morning," an some of the recent incidents involved women going to executive producers at "cbs this morning" where he was a co-anchor. one case he forcibly kissed a cbs employee and another woman went to the manager saying i'm uncomfortable about charlie's attention toward another young feman on the show. something doesn'l right. he was taking her to lunches outside the office. >> yang: what wass the news alicy about managers being told these thin whether they should report it up. >> i want to be clear and to the best of my knowledge there are no known cases of actu human resource complaints against charlie rose. so ne non of these incidents mae their way into human resources

complaints in. no instances are we aware of any of the managers actually elevating the concerns about b their heads. >> yang: should they, under the cbs news policy, should they have? w well, i think the case of the empl was forcibly kiss is rn interesting case because when she went to manager the executive roader of "cbs this morning," this woman asked him not to elvate ito h.r. and he did not. he told us he spoke to charlie, he has not told us what he told charlie, but now cbs said they have changed that policy and made it a requirement f managers to immediately report instances of sexual harassment to human resources. >> yang: so thiss changed? they changed in 2016. it's unclear what provrptd the change or if they realized the policy was outdated. they haven't said exactly why they changed it. >> yang: some women you talked to are preparing to file a lawsuit? >> that is correct. we expect the lawsuit to b filed by the end of the week. ehere are three young women,

some of most recent allegations we have against charlie. two worked at "cbs this morning," one is one that raed concerns to an executive producer about charlis attention toward one of the other young women, and one of the we believe r women wt on to work for his show on "charlie it's an interesting case because it's against charlie se,nk and cbs, and if it gets to discore or depositions taken, there can be a lot more questions asked about what managers knew. to the post when you presented them with your reporting? >> cbs news president david forum,said in a public in a very broad statement, he said we add no knowle that's kind of a sweeping statement, at least it sounds scweeping to me, and i thinkur reporting shows there was knowledge. we're not saying every person knew but certainly some people knew and i think the question is how pervasive was it, how widespread was it, how much

collective knowledge was there at cbs. >> yang: you cited a manager of someone trying to talk someone out of taking a job at charlie rose. >> a woman came in and interviewed for a position to be charlie rose's assistant and a cbs news executive pulled this woman aside and said i wt you to think long and hard before you take this job. do you really want to be a with this man? >> yang: amy brittain of "the washington post," thank you so much. >> thank you. >> woodruff: next, another installment of our weekly brief but spectacular series where we ask people about their passion. .etonight, dana mortenson,. of "world savvy," talks about how the organization is reimagining k through twelve education to prepare students for a more globally connected world. >> the demacraphic changes ss this country are

phenomenal. in 1970, the population of the u.s. was 88% white. by 2010, that had dropped to 75% white, and it's estimated that by 2050, it will be 47%, so for the first time we will be a collective majority. no single ethnicity or culture will be inajority in this untry and that's already true for the population under 18. students definitely find international affairs intimidating. most of the studies that you see over the last several decades is that americans, paicularly young americans, don't know a lot about the rest of e world. and so a natural byproduct of n'at is fear of things that we don't know and we understand. so world savvy's a national moveme that's reimagining k through 12 education. and the way we work is by focusing on student engement. to take complex issues in the world and learn about them and createnowledge to action

projects that help them take action, so that you can leverage diversity in the classroom as an asset. a lot of our methodology is around saying we don't believe young people have potential to lead in the future, but that you have that in the present. the way that international affairs was taught for so many years, was sort of food flag festival. e u know we made a bû noël, we celebrated cinco de mayo, we had a black history month. shifting that and allowing young onople to kind of do two things. to explore themselves, their history and their identity in that place and space and then also allowing then to kind of move towards the issues they're o ssionate about is a really critical waynd of get them hooked on wanting to know something outside themselves. the reality is we are not preparing young people for a standardized world. the only sort of common thread with what young people will ter after they graduate change, particularly when you think about the kinds of problems that this next generati will inherit. we're looking at climate change,

migration, poverap, war. ing with how technology will advance. the other way we're rt of falling short with k through 12 education is that that focus on achievement and how we defined what it is leaves very little room to measure what matters. if you ask most parents what they want for their young people in addition to just graduating from school, they want them to be good people, to be able to work well with others. those are things that get lost in translation because people think they can't be embedded into educational discourse or that they lack rigor, when truly it can be done. it can be done and it can be measured. my name is dana mortenson, and this is my brief but spectacular take on being world savvy. >> woodruff: and that's the newshour for tonight. i'm judy woo uuff. joonline and again here tomorrow evening with mark shields and david brooks. fo newshour, thank you and see you soon.

>> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> knowledge, it's where innovation begins. it's what leads us to discovery and motivates us to succeed. it's why we ask the tough questions and what leads us to the answers. at leido we're standing behind those working to improve the world's health, safety, and efficiency. leidos. >> kevin. >> kevin! >> kevin. >> advice for life. life well-planned. learn more at raymondjames.com. babbel. a language app that teaches real-life conversations in a new language, like spanish, french, german, italian, and more. babbel's 10-15 minutailessons are ble as an app, or line.

more information on babbel.com. >> and with the ongoing support of these institutions >> this program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewe like you. thank you. ctaptioning sponsored by newshour produions, llc captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org

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