captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc >> woodri'f: good evening judy woodruff. on the newshour tonight, former director of national intelligence james clapper-- the latest target of president trump's attacks on then intellig community on russia's role in the 2016 election. >> to me it just exceeds logic and credulity that they didn't affect the election and its my belief they actually turned it. >> woodruff: then, the n.f.l.'s new policy on taing a knee-- after a firestorm over national anthem demonstrations, the league enacts a new rule punishing players for protesting on the field. and, remembering a literary giant, how philip roth captured american life through history and controversy.h >> i don'tink about the reader. i think about the book. i think about the setence, i think about the paragraph, i think

about the page. i go ove it and over it and over it. the book begins to make its demands. >> woodruff: all that and more on tonight's pbs newshour. m >>or funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> supporting urcial entrepre and their solutions to the world's most pressing problems-- skollfoundation.org. >> the lemelson foundation. committed to improving lives trrough invention, in the u.s. and developing cos. on the web at lemelson.org.

>> supported by the john d. and catherine t. macarthur foundation. eammitted to building a more just, verdant andful world. more information at macfound.org >> and with the ongoing support of these institutions: >> this program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by con station from viewers like you. thank you. >> woodruff: from president trump today, tha new demand o russia investigation. he says he wants "total transparency" from the justice department and the f.b.i. about whether an informanmpspied on his gn. at the same time, former intelligence chief james clapper says he now believes russianli me won mr. trump the white house. we'll talk to clapper after the newsummary.

secretary of state mike pompeo insisted today the trum administration will not tolerate russian interference in the 2018 elections. he told the house foreign affairs committee that there will be "appropriate counter- measures"-- but gave no details. >> we have not been able to achieve deterrence, effective deterrence, with some of these efforts with tthe russians, this administration has taken enormous efforts to push back against russia that haven't been done in an awfully long time, either here in the united states or, frankltn from our ps, who are more threatened by russia than we are in europe and elsewhere. >> woodruff: democrats voiced a doubut the trump team's efforts on election interference. new york congressman eliot engel said the administration is "ging russia a pass". a string of southern and border states held primaries on tuesday, and voters made some history. lisa desjardins as our report. >> desjardins: in georgia, an historic primary night. >> let's get done!

>> desjardinems: ...as drats picked stacey abrams, a former state house leader, as the country's first female african- american nominee for governor from either major party. chapter of georgia's future >> desjardins: abrams's strategy notably is not about the middle, and more aut the base, increasing registration and voting among minorities and the poor. meanwhile, georgia republicans are moving toig the, with a runoff between two candidates pushing hard on immigration lieutenantovernor casey cagle and secretary of state brian kemp. >> criminal illegal aliens are spreading across the country. >> i got a big truck, just in case i need to round up criminas illega and take them home myself. >> desjardins: another first last night in texas lupe valdez ecame the first latina and first openly-gay person to win a partgonomination fornor. overall, it was another banner ght for democratic women including two first-time candidates winning key

congressional races in texas and one pulling off an upset in a kentucky three seen as potentials t take over republican seats. >> the mid-terms, ans d n agenda, were clearly on president trump's mind as he addressed abortion rights opponents in washington lt night. >> but if democrats gain power, they will try to reverse these incredible gain these are hitoric gains. they will try and reverse many of them. so your vote in 2018 is every bit as important as your vote in 2016, although i'm not sure i really believe that, but you know. >> desjains: for the pbs newshour, i'm lisa desjardins. >> woodruff: we'll talk to one of tuesday's big winners, later in the program. as the 2018 campaign heats up, president trump is calling for radical changes in foreign aid, to curb illegal immigration. in bethpage, new york today, he talked of slashing aid to countries whose citizens enter the u.s. illegall

he did not say which nations he had in mind. there's word that presidential son-in-law jared kushner has now obtained a permanent security clearance. that was widely reported today. kushner is serving as senior adviser on the middle east, but he was temporarily barred from access to secrets as his f.b.i. background check dragged on. the president is promising a decision soon on whethe kthe u.s./norrea summit takes place as planned. for now, mr. ump is set to meet with north korean leader kim jong-un on june 12th in singapore. he suggested yesterday that the summit might be postponed, and he was asked about it again today. >> it could happen, could very well happen, whatever it is we will know next week about singapore, and if we go i think it will be great thing for north korea. someday a date will happen, it could very well be june 12. >> woodruff: meanwhile, foreign journalists headed to north korea's remote nuclear today.e

pyongyang has invited them to watch as it dolishes the underground facility. the u.s. state department sys a diplomataffer in china has reported what it calls "abnormal nsations of sound and pressure." it happened at the u.s. consulate in ythe southern c of guangzhou. the department says the symptoms were similar to a mild concussion. the same, unexplained ailment affected a number of americans in cuba last year. on the china trade talks, president trump said today negotiations are "moving along nicely."gg but, he ted the two sides need a different structure to govern trade relations. otherwise, he said, in an early morning tweet: "this will be to hardt done and to verify results." for now, the u.s. and china have suspended plans for new tariffs. a federal judge inew york ruled today the president violates his critics' free speech rights when he bars them from h twitter account.

he was sued last july by seveee people who'dblocked from viewing the site. the justice itdepartment sai disagrees with the court's ruling, and is considering an appeal.ll and, o street, the dow jones industrial average gained 52 points to close at 24,886. the nasdaq rose 47 poind the s&p 500 added eight. hostill to come on the neur: i sit down with former national intelligence directorames clapper after the president calls him out. new n.f.l. palties for kneeling during the national anthem. why many patients can't get the cure for hepititis c, and much more. >> woodruff: first, president trump's stepped-up campaign to discredit the russia investigation. ims newest focus is on cla that the f.b.i. spied on his

campaign-- something he's now calling "spygate." >> so what i want from rod, fro the f.b.i., from everybody, we want transrency. >> woodruff: leaving the white osuse, the president pressed again for full disure by the justice department and deputy attorney general rod rosenstein, hine is oveg special counsel robert mueller's russia probe. the president has already demanded justice investigate whether the f.b.i. illegally infiltrated his 2016 campaign. >> all you have to do is csok at the band you'll see. it looks like a very serious event. but we'll find out. this issue did n come up this afternoon, as the president anmerosenstein sat ieet from each other, at an a roundtable onigration in new york. but earlier, mr. trump twted that elements of the justice department are part of the "criminal deep state...ajaught in a m spy scandal."

secretary of state and former c.i.a. director mike pompeo, contradicted the president's long-rning "deep state" accusations today, while testifying on capitol hill. >> you know this term deep state has been thrown around. i'll say this. the employees who worked with me at the c.i.a. nearly uniformly were aimed at achieving the president's objectives and america'objectives. >> that's your experience also when you interact with colleagues at the f.b.i. and the department of justice as well? >> yes. there are always exceptions to every rule.er i've ned an organization that didn't have bad actok , i don't thny government organization is exempt from having malfeasance as well. >> woodruff: all of this, after reports that an f.b.i. informant named stefan halper did meet with three trummpp gn officials in 2016. at least two, carter page and george papadopoulos, were already on the f.b.i.'s radar for contacts with russians.

tomorrow, republican leaders of the house intelligence and oversight committees receive a rare, classifieied ng on the issue, from justice department and intelligence officials. >> when ey look at the documents i think people are going to see a lot of bad things happened. i hope it's not so because if it is, there's never been anything like it in the history of our country. >> woodruff: but democrats, including congressman joaquin castro on the house intelligence committee, pushed back today, after no democrats were invited to the briefing. >> so this very much is a departure from standard operating procedure and it makes it seem more like a trump legal defense team meeting than anything else. >> woodruff: the president today also went aft james clapper, former director of national intelligence, for saying any informant would have likelyl beking for russian interference in the 2016 election. >> i mean you look at clapper, he sort of admitted that they had spies in the

campaign yesterday, inadvertently. but i hope it's not true. but it looks like it is. w druff: for his part, clapper disputes that, defenr his long car, and offers a tough assessment of president trump in his new book"facts and fears: hard truths from a life in intelligence." and with me now is former director of national intelligence, and retired air force lieutenant general, james clapper. general clapper, welcome to the program. >> thanks for having me. >> woodruff: so i want to ask b you about thk, but i also want to start with the news of the day because you're right in the middle of it, as we just mentioned. president trump said this morning, regarding allegati that the f.b.i. used an informant during the 2016 campgn, he said, i hope it's not so, but, if it is, there's it inbeen anything like the history of our country. he went on to say, if you look at clapper, he sort of admitted that theyhad spies in the campaign inadvertently. i hope it's not true, but it

looks like it is. >> well, i think he's kind of distorted what i was trying to say, which was aually took aversion to the term "spy" which i don't like anyway butic paarly it's inappropriate in this context. big gulf between a spy in tradition sense implying spy craft or trade craft and an informant who's open about who he was and the qstions he was asking. the intent, though, is thean impo thing, was not to spy on the campaign but, rather,o determine what the russians were up to. were they trying to penetrate the campaign, gain access, gain leverage, gain influence? and that was the concern that the f.b.i. had and i think they were just doing their job and trying to protect our political system. >> woodruff: the president, as ou know, has been just constantly critic the intelligence community since he's been in office. today, among other things, he's saying elements of the justice

department are parof the "criminal deep state caught in a scandal." we know secretary of state pompeo somewhat contradicted the presiden today, said he doesn't think there's a deep state, but what is the effect ofhese cumulative comments by the president? >> well, right now, the heat is kind of off the intelligence commuty, i think. the focus for him, of course, the department of justice and the f.b.i., and i absolutely am concerned about the morale impacts on those two organizations, and i'm also concerned from the stapoint of standards and norming of our country that have been followed for decades whereby the independence of the departmentof ustice and the f.b.i. are spected and, in fact, enforced by presidents. and this one is veryfe dnt. and, so, when he starts directing investigaons and making these kind of

allegations, for me, it's not good forhe country. and i said this some time ago that, you know, there's an assault ur institutions both internally from both internal and extern sources. the external source is russia. the internal source is our president, is attacking these institutions that have served this country long and well. you know there's not a whole lot of -- these are actuallyif fragile, andhey're not protected and nurtured over time, we risk losing them, and t all that much different between where we are today and beg a banana republic. >> woodruff: you write in the book about your decades-long caer working in intelligence, you covered the raid on osama bin laden, the benghazi attacks in libya, and then the 2016 election. and at one point, you nmee, clapper, the public history of u.s. intelligence traditionally readas a narrative of failures and

shortcomings certainly dating back to vietnam. when we get it right, though, we almost never discuss it publy ly. i guessestion is, is the college commuty destined to be undermined, misunderstood, not appreciated?l, >> wt appears that, you know, we've had our ups and downs and we've had our failures. i think themportant thi about that is that the intelligence community is a learning orgsoization, hen we've made mistakes, we've tried to learn frompp them and lessons learned so they don't repeat themselves. but intelligence is one of the things that makes it intere ving. it's alsy challenging in that you are attempting to reduce uncertainty with l ess thanfull deck of information, and that's almost always the case withnc intelli without it, i think the nation e less s and secure, and one of the points or themes i tryto

make in the book that it's my belief, not surprisingly, that intelligence is a noble calling, a noble profession that's important, vital to the safety and security of this country and its peop. >> woodruff: you have some very tough questions about the nature of intellince, whether the intelligence community has gone too far in some of its tactics and methods. what did you conclude? >> well, this is a function of the current conditions, and it's also -- it underlines the importance of enlightened oversight. it's one of the features that i lived through church pike in the aftermath of the vietnam war, that was my war, and i iwas in thelligence community then, and i was around one of the two oversightommittees that were established. they have a special burden, in my mind, the membersho of two committees because they have to represent the rest of our

citizens who, understandably, can't know all the details of intelyigence particulith respect to sensitive sources and methods. so the members on those committees havto represent our citizens to make sure that what the intelligence community is doing is legal, ethical and moral. we've had cases where, depending on the situation post-9/11, for example, where the intelligence community did things that, after the fact, people t objected and that sort of thing happens and it's one of the challenges of serving in the intligence community. >> woodruff: one of the things you write or have spoken ashut, ld say, in addition to writing about it very candiy is how you have concluded after what happened in 2016 that the russians n only affected -- tried to affect the election, but you said they actually did

affect the outcome. >> yes. >> woodruff: what did you mean? >> well, first, i need to make clear that, when we did our formal intelligence community assessment in january of 2017, we did not make any cl at all about whether the russians affected t outcome of the election. we didn't have the authority, charteor capability to do that. since i left the government, though, as a private citizen, it's what i would call my informed opinion that, given thh massive effort russians made and the number of citizens that they touched and the variety and the multi-dimensional aspects of what they did to influence inion and affect the election, and given the factha tit turned on less than 80,000 votes in three states, to i me,t just exceeds logic and cre cred dualy

that they turd the election. >> woodruff: that's a stunning conclusion. what does that say about where we are in the med term elections and the next election? >> one omy motivations in speaking out and writing this book is to do my small part ina trying to ed the public on what the russians are up to. they are bent on undermining our fundamental systemere, and when a foreign nation, particularly an adversary nation, gets involved as much as they did in our politicalpr ess, that's a real danger to this country, and i think educating the publiy is proba the toughest thing to do, and i felt i needed to do thatecause i think our institutions are under assail here, those which i've spent about 50 years of mye rying to defend. >> woodruff: you are, when all is said and done, quite critical of president trump. you write toward the end of the

book, he set a new lowar for ethics and morality, he's caused damage to our societal and f politicaric that will be difficult to repair, and you go . are you concerned, james clapper, that by taking him on so dectly that you may cause people to think, well, the intelligence community just has al in for d trump anyway, therefore, why should we have confidence in any investigation, in any of the special counsel investigations? >> well, it's a good question and one i've thought about. i mean,lt thenative, and some people feel i should just dance offstage quietly into the night, and i thought a lot about that, and i thought about poential blowback on the active intelligence community, which i am no longer a part of. i'm now a private citizen, and haverst amendment rights like everyone else, but i decided that, because i am so concerned about the health and strength of our institutions and

our valuest t i spent a lot of time defending, that i had to speak out. at>> woouff: and you are comfortable with ou've written? >> yes. >> woodruff: james clapper, the book is "facts and fears, hard truths from a life in intelligence. thank you very much. >> thanks for having me. >> woodruff: after two seasons of protests during the national anthem, and a debate that's been fueled by esident trump, the n.f.l. took a stand today against taking a knee on e field. amna nawaz looks at the reaction and what may be behind the decision. >> nawaz: judy, somelayers began taking a knee call attention to police brutaliqu and racial iity in america. the silent pro quarterback colin kaepernick, who hasn't been signed by an n.f.l. team for two seasons now. today, n.f.l. owners voted for a

new policy, requiring an players or team personnelonho arhe field, to "stand and show respect for the flag and the anthem." players who don't wish to do sot ca in the locker room during the national anthem. but if they choose to kneel or sit on the field, their teams will be fined, and the teams can penalize their players. the policy comes after months of public criticism of players who kneel from president trump. here's how nflgeommissioner goodell explained the ctanges today. clearly, our obe as a league and to all 32 clubs which was unanimous is tt we want people to be respectful to the national anthem, we want pple to stand. we think that we've come up with a balanced process here and a procedure and policy that willlo those players who feel that they can't stand for the anthem to stay the locker room, and there's no penalty for that, but we are going to

encoure all of them be on the field, we'd like for them all to be on the field and stand at attention. >> nawaz: the n.f.l. player's union said it was not consulted by the owners about the newd policy, alled it contradictory to "the principles, values and patriotism of our league." we asked the union to appear tonight, as well as s players. they declined our invitation as did the n.f.l. some perspective on this from l.z. granderson, who is a co- host for espn's sports nation and a commentator for cnn and abc. l.z., thanks for being here. let me ask you now the time line. colin kaepernick first took aee n to 16. president trump started first criticizing the protests in 2017. why now, in may o 2018, are the n.f.l. owners in the league taking this decision? >> because they believe there is some correlation between t criticism of colin kaepernick and the protesting and their bottom line. 1/2 is still the juggernaut when

it comes to american sports, both financially and as well in terms of visibility, but it has dipped a little bit, and owner t feat the protest isn't milping them from a business perspective, neve the fact that the n.f.l. was already tipping prior to the protest, this allows them to point all the issues the league has been having with fans on this one particular player and issue. >> we know there was concern about the attacks from president trump as well. was this political or a business issue? >> i believe it was purely business. many of the oers are multi-billionaires and most of the owner owners financially dr. many of them give donations to both parties, have suppoed candidates of both parties, so they aren't necessarily married to the republican party but they definitely seem to be married to money. >> there are folks who will say ss're not saying the issues the

players want add aren't worth addressing, we're glad the owners meeet privately and a to donate tens of millions of dollars to those causes, we just don't want politics on the field. what do you say to those folks?n >> stop pl the national anthem. that's simple. the national anthem is politicizing sports, and, oh,y the way, if you really are concerned about respecting or disrespecting the flag, then perhaps you shod probably refamiliarize yourself with the u.s. flag code because you will see multiple violations that the n.f.l. and other leagues do in terms of how tflag is to be treated. we aren't supposed to be having football ulaforms with on them. we aren't supposed to be having a flag laid down flat, or have the flag on tickets and beer cans and things of that nature, all things you can find in an n.f.l. stadium. so if you want to stick to the rule of law ant disrespecting the flag, then let's be authentic wit i think it's more about what the players are protesting than the

actual protest itself. >> what would have been a better solution or step in your mindan for the owner the league to take? >> be honest. you know, stop trying to pretend as if you truly care about the issues that the players are protesting and tell the truth that we believe these protests are hurting our bottom line, we're a private business and, so, we're making a busess policy to make sure our bottom line doesn't suffer anymore. but certainly don't tell us you're doing this out of some respect for the flag or that you're doing this but we still support what the players are concerned with because you don't issue a ban like this in the same week we're bracing ourselves to see video of an n.b.a. player tased in milwauk reportedly for no reason. those two things don't seem to add up to me. >> l.z., it's trd to see attentions will go down from this. we've seen vice president pence weigh in on twitter with #winning and a headline about

this decision and players wraiging in, chris long among them, saying he will continue to use his platform to cal attention to the things he thinks is important. the pre-season sarts this summer. do you think players will protest? tat do you think the fall from this will be? >> well, amna, two fundamentalfl s in the policy. one, there's no clear definition of what it means toiolate or disrespect the flag. two, there's an option for the player to not come to the field during the national anthem. dew, if you are a reporter looking on the ne and you happen to notice several players are missing, you're still aoing the same varied questions being asked the past tw seasons about why aren't you there, why are you protesting, and the issue doesn't go away. this is the reason the n.f.l.'s cowardice bites them in the butt, if you will,he because didn't solve the problem, they just made a bigger problem. >> granderson, thanks for your time.o >> thanku for having me. ruff: s,

coming up on the newshour: the woman trying to become the nation's first african american, female governor. and remembering the revolutionary writer, philip roth. now, the latest on a medical breakthrough that's starting to have an impact on a hidden, deadly epidemic in this country ugs can cure up to 95% of patients with hes pati a virus that often leads to debilitating or deadly results. the drugs can save lives, prevent expensive spitalizations and liver transfers. but some states are feeling the squeeze of the costs of this special correspondent cat wise has our report for our weekly series on the leading edge of science.o >> rrter: 3.5 million americans are living with a potentially deadly virus and

half don't even know it. it's hepatitis c, a blood-borne pathogen which attacks the liver and can eventually cause serious liver problems including cirrhosis and liver cancer. three qseuarters of tith the virus are baby boomers, exposed dom unscreened blood transfusions, i.v.g use, and other blood to blood contact prior to the early '90's. but now the opioid epidemic has led to a 20% rise new infections from 2015 to 2016. one state where the young and have been hit hard by the disease is oregon. oregon has the highest hepatitis c mortality rate, per capita, in the country. it's estimated about 100,000 oregonians have b tn infected wie virus and 500 die each year. it's bedien a vericult disease to treat, but over the last four years there's been are lution in hep c drugs. orw, many around the country are being cured and ion many

are coming here to the oregon clinic r those treatments. >> we never talked about cure of hep c until and now we're all talking about cure of hep c. >> reporter: dr. kent benner is a gastroenterologist and hepatologist at the clinic in portland. he says people are still dying from the disease, often because they haven't been testeand aren't aware they have virus until they are quite sick. but benner says much has changed since he first started treating patients several decades ago. >> tre interferon.t time was this required injections, shots several times week. quite a few side effects. we felt we were doing well if we could cure 15 or 20% of patients. since late 2013, there's been a remarkaomble development number of different companies. they've developed drug combinations that provide 95% cure rates in patients we treat. >> reporter: costly liver transplants are often the only option when the liver becomes too badly damaged.

but at earlier disease stages, the liver often starts to heal once the medicines have cleared virus from theody. >> not only are we seeing liver function with more advanced liver disease occasionally can come off e transplant list. >> reporter: 64-year-old rob shinneyly, who recead knee surgery, is one of those cured by the n new hep c drugs knowas direct acting antivirals or d.a.a.'s. like many others of his ion, he doesn't really know how he contracted the virus. under e care of dr. benner, shinney began a three mth treatment in late 2016 after his liver showed signs of moderatear scrin tests later confirmed he was virus-free. >> i had a serious, chronic illness hanging over my head that i knew could kill me. and that's gone now. >> repolorter: we spoke at l pub he visits now and again with

his choir friends, something he never did when he had the virus. >> i swear i felt like i was 20 years younger. i haenergy, i could do things. it's great just to be able to sit around and have a beer with everybody and, you know, just enjoy life. >> reporter: the cost of the drugs used to cure shinney, who has private insurance, aren't cheap.i since sovarst hit the market in late 2013 at a whopping $84,000 dollars for a course of therapy, competitors have steadily lowered the costs and edst year a new mication called mavyret was released for around $26,000. still, the drugs are expensive, and they aren't a vaccine. if someone is cured, they can become reinfected. access to drugs varies widely around the country. a report last year by two national advocacy organizations found, "many public and private

payers choose to limit access to d.a.a.'s due to their cost as well as other concerns." oregon is among a number of states which cve had restritive medicaid rengirements including denyi coverage to patients in the early stages of disease andw thosho are abusing drugs and alcohol. but some of those restrictions are beginning to ease. >> in january we just started covering individuals with lower ages, or lower levels of fibrosis. >> reporter: dr. dana hargunani is the chief medical officer for the oregon health authority which oversees the state's medicaid program. she says while the state is starting to expand access, costs are still a ignificant issue. oregon has spent more than $94 gsmillion dollars on the d since 2014, covering about 1500 people. >> the newer treatments for hepatitis cave a significant budget impact for our state. we're trying to manage our limited resources to ensure coverage for those who need it

immediately for the hepatitis c treatment, as well as all the other individuals in our medicaid program and the needs >> reporter: hargunani says another reason the state delays nts have until pat mild liver scarring: not everyone needs the medicines. >> one in five individuals who get infected with hepatitis c will spontaneously clear their infecti ton. right nohe data doesn't help us understand how to know which individuals will need to have a high cost drug to treat and cure their infection. >> luckily he doesn't have any evidence of cirrhosis. >> reporter: dr. brianna sustersic is a medical director at central city concern, a federally-funded health center in dowtown portland which serves a large number of homeless individuals, many of whom have substancebuse disorders. 25% to 50% of the patients have hep c. >> the medicaid requirements have limited access to treatmt for many of our patients. from a public health standpoint if we are able to treat the population who contracting

this, and spreading it, then we can move toward eradicating the disease. >> reporter: to prove that point, and to meet a big need, the clinic and a local syringe exchange program began a small drug company sponsored study last year to treat patients who otherwise would not have qualified for the medications. 56-year-o kim trano is now virus free thanks to that trial. she says she's felt a lot of stigma being a recovering drug user and it was hard to learn she had initially been denied drug coverage. to those who would question giving expensive medicines to who might becom reinfected, she says: >> everyone is worthy of a chance. if i were to relapse i would take all precautions not toe reinfecte and that's pretty easy to do, most people know how do that. >> reporter: the new medicines combined with the big surge in those seeking treatment has led

to a unique care model. chris hulstein is not a doctor. he's a clinical pharmacist and part of a new program at portland's providence hospital. over the past year, about 50 patients have been successfully treated by hulstein and his colleagues, another 30 are currently in eatment. >> a lot of the specialists are very buomsy managing veryex patients, and that is their role. having a pharmacist being able to manage the patients gets patients treated faster, and more successfully than we ever have been able to do before. >> reporter: hep c advocates are tate anding with the s private insurers to open up more access to the drugs. for the pbs newshour, cat wise in portland, oregon. >> woodruff: we return now to the historic win in the state of georgia last night. as we reported earlier, the former minority leader of the

georgia house of representative- stacey abrams, became the first african-american woman to be a major party nominee for governor in the u.s. stacey abrams joins us now from atlanta. congratulations on your win yesterday, and do you see this as historyaking? >> i do, and first of all, i want to say thank you. i yes, buts not just history for me, it's history for changing the face o what leadership looks like in america, and i'm excited to be part of ad. vangu but i also am excited about what this means for the people of georgia, having someone who is really rea f to look out their needs and their interests. >> woodruff: why do you think you won? >> because we ran an incredibly concentrated effort where we were on the ground eleven months ago. we really focused on talking to voters, asking them questions, and putting out bold and detailed plans so they knew why voting for me would matter, and we werete very gl to see a

resounding response, . % of the vote. >> woodruff: there's a lot of conversations, stacey abrams, oabout how you were able turn out voters, many of whom had not voted before. what did you say to them? what was the message? >> i talk about three things. one is educating bold and ambitious children. every family wants to know that they have opportunities from cradle to reer for their children, and we have very specific plans about how we canh invest ane access for every family. number two, it's about makinger certain are good jobs in every single county in georgia, and we have a lot of them, 159, and reay focusing on small business investment because we know those are the jobs that pay the best and stay for the long term. the third is making sure government works for everyone, and, at the center of that, is the conversation about expanding medicaid in georgia. medicaid expansion would cover more than 500,000 people, create more than 50,000 jobs, and savet 15 rural hos. >> woodruff: so, as we know,

that all well be what you said, and you did win the primary, georgia is still a very red, a ry conservative state. donald trump won, beat hillary rodham clinton by 5 percentage points two years ago. can youin, stacey abrams, unless you turn back some of those democratic votede, ndent voters who went for donald trump in 2016 but maybe who had voted democratic before? >> i want every voter in the state of georgia, i want every independent-thinking voter, but i do think that georgia is actually a bluer state than people realize. we have an opportunity to turn outs voto haven't voted in recent years. they vote in the presiecntial on but not in the gubernatorial election, and we have more than enoughf those voters to win without compromising our values and pretending to be moderate to conservative appeal to a certain segment. there are places where we differ onoly, but, at the core of being a progressive in georgia,

it's abo making surehat we're helping families have the freedom and opportunity toef th and i know from my personal experience as a thatratic leader tha message resonates across the state. >> woodruff: so the "new york times," of course, covered your race and wrote she has signaled she is not likely to spend much whiteseading with rural to return to the democratic party. is that accurate? >> that's a mischaracterization of the state. number one, in the rural communities ogeorgia, it's a very diverse community, a third of georgia -- a third of rural georgia is african-american, but the reality is whether you're rural or urban or suburban, you want your kids to have a good education, you want good jobs and you want your hospitals to stay open. those are all issues that appeal to everyone. what i have said is that i don't intend to pretend conservative values that demanize immis, that say that we have to put a gun in every counter, that say that we can have gun safety laws

t sacrificing the second amendment. i'm not going to pretend to be a conservative to win. i'm going to run the same way have my entire career, with authenticity, honest and clear plans on how to lift up every georgian. >> woo you don't talk about those issues? >> oh, no, i talk about them very aggressively.t i talked abe fact i had only ds and fs from the n.r.a. i'm proud about that. i'm proud to be endorsed by naral and planned parenthood. these are issues that matter to everyone, whether rural georgia or the city of atlanta. the realty is democrats can't win by tending to be republicans, republicans and democrats see through it. i want to win by turning out voters bo want thet lives possible, and that's how i ran this campaign,and that's how we're going to win in november. >> woodruff: another thing, when we were in georgia two years ago to talk to you about the hilla rodha hillary clintonp contest, you said among things

was going to be a challenge to turn out black votersa espey young black voters for the democrat for hillary clinton to get them engaged. it's two years later. have thing changed? >> absolutely. and part of what we were facing when you and i spoke a few years ago is we were nearing the end of the campaign and there hadn't been the investment in voters everywhere, there hadn't been that deep investment in lifting up their voices.at what we've done differently in this campaign, but bev we've not uponly done that for yon african-americans. we've had one of the highest turn out ofin l voters and asian-pacic islanders in history. for democrats in georgia we nely matched republican performance, something that hasn't happened in the last 15 years. those are very strong signals of the energy and enthussm available if we have candidates willing to do the investment of cultivating toters. that's what i have been doing the last eleven months and what i will keep doing theext six

months till we win. >> woodruff: does it help or hurt you if donald trump campaigns in georgia? >> donald trump appeals to a very specific part of th state, and i -- you know, the republican party and then republiectorate is its own beast. my mission is not to beat republicans. my mission is to a galvanize energize democrats and independent-thinking voters who understat our mission and our message are the right ones thateorgia, and i think what we saw happen yesterday across the state of georgia isu that, whether ve in rural north georgia near the border of tennes or down on the coast near savannah, that people heard our message and they turned out in record numbers. my job is t sply scale the message and scale the numbers. >> woodruff: stacey abrams, winner of the democratic primary r governor of the state ofa georgi. congratulations. >> thank you.

>> woodruff: finally tonight, we remember the prolific writer and pulitzer prize-winning novelist, philip roth. he died sterday of congestive heart failure at the age of 85. roth was the author of more than 25 books, and a giant in american literature. his work evolved through several distinct phases and often featured roth'sictional alter egos, including his best-known character, nathan zucrman. the 1969 novel "portnoy's complaint" rocketed him to fame for its raunchy, hilarious depiction of a teenage bos lustful urges and ensuing guilto would later focus more deeply on jewish life, mortality, and american history, often setting his novels in newark, new jersey, where roth grew updu. ng a particularly fruitful period in his 60s, ath returned umber of those themes. the accolad and the novels me quickly, including:

"american pastoral," "i mared a communist" and "the plot against america." in a moment, william brangham talks with a colleague and collabo but first, how roth himself saw his work. jeffreync brown had the cto sit down with him for a rare interview back in 2004. here are some excerpts. what is it you want to do when you start a novel? what are you tryingoo? >> get to work. ? work i'm empty and not very happy, so when i get to work on a novel i begin to do what i'm supposed to do. it's a long process. usually it takes between two and three years to write a novel for me. i don't think about the reader. i think about the book. i think about the -- i think

about the sentence, i think about the paragraph, i think about the page. i go over and over and over it. the booko begins t make its demands. the demands are intellectual, imaginative, they're aesthetic. >> it's interesting because yorire often ded as something of a provok door, sort of thring out literary bomb shells. i mean you get a loof reactn to your work. >> i'm a very bad judge of how thl general reader w respond to my book and i'm always priz e surprised the response a book eless itbkelicits. >> many readers are surprised at

the reaction to the latest books. what happened? >> i don't know, maybe a consuence of age. but id diel energetic and i do feel ambitiousand i did the work. >> reporter was your ambition? >> to write this kind of book. to be able to broaden the subject while, at the same time, keeping it a novel, while having the subject enacted by people. subject?s the en i came back to live in america in 1999 i felt enormously energized by being home. also i realized i had in front of me a new t subjet was an old subject which was this country, that it was brand new

b me in a strange way, yet i knew all about ause i had been brought up here. so being away for ten or twelve years produced a, i think, a burst of running energy. >> and when you thinkut a it now, do you see a different writer, a better writer, a worse writing? >> i like to think a better writer. a different writer, sure. i began with an enormously naive day and rawness, very raw when you begin, and i don't think -- i think i'm only half as naive now and i'm oy raw from the hard work, not the way a youngll w would be raw. >> i know you were involved in eastern european wters at a

time when they were a moral voice against a totalitarian ciety. what do you see as your role or as the role of a writer in our society? >> your role is to write as well as you can. you're not advancing social causes, as far as i'm concerned. you're not addressing social problems. what you're advancing -- there's only one cause you're advancing, the cause of literature, which is one of the great lost human causes. so you do your bit. you do your bit for fiction, for .he nov >> here the talk now about roth's life and work is max itdin, president of library of america a nonpr that preserves, celebrates and accomplishes america's greatest writing. he was the third aviter to his books enshrined in the laboratory. max rudin, i'm sorry for the loss of your friend andob ously sorry for the world

who doesn't get any more of phillip roth's remarkablenorks. ou explain to us what made phim so special? >> i think the first thing to y is just the sheer verbal imaginative power of his work. he is, you know, nearly unique in american letters in the number of differentodes and tones. he could write in. he was an amazing ventriloquist from the "ronic cold ironic comedy totn p's complain to the contemporaryi of the american trilogy books and thete ched elogiac tone of the later books it's amazing one writer could do all that and i think, you know,

looking at his entire career as a whole, 31 books, 51 years, together makes one of the most extraordinary literary journeys in american writing. >> just as you say he really die at time like four or five writers compressed into one. he was so funny, he could write about mortality and sadness so well. he could write about hi faith. he really could seem to do it all. do you have a sense frim working withhat he was aware of all of these different pots that he could dip into? >> everyone who knew him knew of his extraordinary verbal gifts. i mean, you know, he not only had it on the page, he had itg talkn person. he was extremely funny and extremely intele and a warm person. the thing i could say about his work is after portnoy, especially, portnoy is the firtt grreakthrough book. philip has a couple of great breakthrough books during his career but portnoy opens the

flood gates for the first time, and this voice, you know, comes pouring out -- oseems toome pouring out, it's the result of hard work, of course, and it hums with intelligence and, you know, energy andumr on the page, and that's what makes him compulsively readable. that's another reason why people have come back . >> does the evolution of his career make sense to you when you look back on it no because if you look at the younger books, they are largely about a younger man and his coming to terms with his own sexuality, then they move into a middle age phase and then later in his life they sort of deal with a man growing old and h faci ultimate reckoning. does thatct tray make sense to you? >> it does. i mean, you know, fundamentally, you know, philip was on kind of o sides at the same tim he was on the side of vitality,

you know, of libido and liberation, a '60su theme, know, the era where his work really begins,e and yet was also a ruthlessly honest obrver of the forces -- the historical forces arrayed against that liberation and vitality, and i think, as the work goes on, i mean, that darker side gets explored more d more. you know, the forces of, you know,ic pol violence and the war in vietnam, in american pastoral, the mccarthy area ind "i marrcommunist," you know, in a way certain political corrtness could be used as a bludgeon in human stain. he's one of the great ironists in our literature. he was at onn sympathy with the impulses of liberation, yet

understands deeply the forces, as i say, that bloc, the liberations of fate and htory. >> max rudin, thank you very much. >> thank you for asking >> woodru: and that's the wshour for tonight. i'm judy woodruff. join us online and again here tomorrow evening. for al of us at the pbs newshour, thank you and see you soon. >> majoing for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> consumerlar understands that not everyone needs an unlimited wireless plan. our u.s.-based customer service reps can help you choose a plan based on ho much you use your phone, nothing more, nothing less. to learn more, go to consumercellular.tv he >> and withngoing support of these institutions and individuals.

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