♪ tonight on kqed newsroom, president trump agreed to end the practice that separated thousands of immigrant children from their families at the iorder. but big que and legal challenges .remain we get reaction from san jose congresswoman zoe lofgren. she's co-authored a bill to protect imgrant familiew. plus aocumentary reveals the toll factory farming takes on the environment andhe humanth. hello and welcome to "kqed newsroom." i'm tuy vu. we begin with immigration. trumpnesday preside signed an executive order ending the practice of separatimi ant children from their families at the border. the new order would allow families to be detained together. in april attorney general jeff sessions announced a, quote, zero tolerance policy toal crly prosecute all illegal border crossings even for those

traveling with children and g claimsiel ing ing asielum. ennce then more than 2300 immigrant childrave been separated from their paren and held in government-run shelterse backlash to ractice has been intense among both republicans and democrats. on monday during a press briefing department of ndhomel security chief kirstjen nielsen pushed back. she blamed congress for the separation and said that detainted children were well taken care of. joining m now is discuss this is san jose congresswoman zoe lofgren. she joins me via skype from washington, d.c. congresswoman, nice to have you with us. >> good to be here. >>the pentago is now saying it's preparing to house as many as 20,000 migrant children on four american military bases in texas and in arkansas. are you getting any details on who would be housed there, for example, would the parents of the children also there? >>no, they've shared no information with me, which is alarming since i am the senior democrat on the immigration co suittee and we have

jurisdiction over this issue. >> what do you think, though, about that prospect, of having these migrant family camps housing lots of people on litary bases? >> i think it's a terrible id and it's completely unnecessary. if someone comes to the united states and seeks asylum that's permitted under american law, you need to administer th l in an orderly fashion. you'll need you don't need to lock people up in order to have them show up at their immigration hearing. in fact, we had a program in existence during the obama administration called the fa case management program where 100% of the families in the casr managemenram showed up to their hearing. and then when they do either prevail, in which case they get asylum, or they don't prevail, in which case they have to leave. >> what have you you been feeling personally asou look at the images of children and

families in detention krrcenter? have you had a chance to see the audio tape of children crying? >> it's just so upsettinok you can't at this and listen to this and notthink about how your own children were that age. and i have grwdchildren. -- i just identify with what would happen to them. it's so --'ve had members tell me they're having a hard time sleeping and living with really this trauma has been inflicted on thousands of children. this is not the american way. this is not the country that i know and love. i am so ashamed of what ournt governs doing. >> what do you think is the intent of the trump administration, then, by separating these families in the first place by having thised so-cal zero tolerance policy on prosecuting people who cross the border? >> i take them at their work.

john kelly, the chiefof staff, indicated that the intent was to deter others from coming to the united states to seek asylum, which is their right under amecan immigration law and treatiesr right under that we have ratified. so that's an impermissible rean, but it is apparently the reason. >> and congresswoman lofgren, there a also conflicting reports about whether the border patrol will stop sending immigration cases to the justice department for prosecution in order to comply with the president's latest executive order. ca clarify any of that? is there indeed a halt to criminal prosecutions? >> well, i wish i could. we received the same press reports you did, that the prosecutions would be halted. then the administration stepped forward to say that was incorrect. but we are getting reports from courtrooms across the united states that the department of justice is dismissing cases e

masse. so i don't know the answers. i do think it's unprecedented to prosecute a misdemeanor ind eac every case. it's never happened with any president. republican or democrat. and it will overwhelm the system completely. >> some have argued, though, including president trump, that as heartbreaking as these scenes are of families being separated, the u.s. is a nation of laws and that there should be consequences for thosbr whok the law by entering this country illeullly. what w you say to people who feel that way? >> we are aon naf laws. and we ought to skrin administer them in an orderly fashion. if y enter the united states, make plea for asylum as the law provides, that should be we reviand a judge will make a decision, and if you prevail you'll get asylum.f u don't, you'll have to leave. if you don't make a claim for asylum and merely enter without

permission, you're going to be sent back across the border. that's nothing new.at so s new is the president trying to terrorize small chil cen and createaos at the border. that is unfortunate. >> have you asked or will you ask to visit the detention centers where the children are being held or where the mothers are being held? >> absolutely. a number of members o congress are going on monday. other members went last weekend. unfortunately, i think this trump-created crisis is going to be with us for a while, and i intend and many other memrs of congress intend to go and see with our own eyes how these children are being treated. >> house republican leaders have delayed until next week a vote on a bill that would not only fund a border wall, provide a path to citizenship for dreamers, but also keep migrant families together. where do you stand that bill? >> ll, the bill is really much

worse than you just described. it would repeal existing areas of law that allow families to -- american families to be reunied with their sons and daughters. would create long-term or detentions immigrant families. and i don't think the solution to the crisis is to throw the mother in the cage with the oddler and to throw away the key. and for the dreamers it provides such an attenuated process. if you were 27 years old and a years old ou'd be 55 before you were able to get your u.s. citizenship. i think that's absurd. >> congresswoman zoe lofgren, thank you for joining us from washington, d.c. >> you bet. >> as you just heard congress mom lofgrsay, many questions remain about the president's executive order to stop separating families at the border. it's unclear if those separated will be ited and if so when.

the president's order also calls for indefinite etention. but that contradicts a 1997 federal court settlement barring children from being detained for morthan 40 days. meanwhile, advocates have been raising concerns about the damaging effects of forced separation on children. the president of merican academy of pediatrics said ditions in detention facilities are, quote, traumatizing and that alternatives to detention exist. and joining meow for a deeper look at these issues are juliana ag immigration and border security reporter with the "texas tribune." he joins us via skype from texas. also attorney spencer ander with the aclu immigrant rights project. and chandra gauche ippin, child psycht and associate director of the child trauma research program at ucsf. welcome to all of you. chandra, i'd like to begin with you. as a child psychologist, what are your concerns aut separating children from their parents in this manner? >> so i want to take us all t that moment when that child is crying on the tape and think about how ha it is --

>> the propublica tape you're talking about. >>an mm-hmm. how hard it is for us to listen to that. then take those sounds and imagine that they continue. they continue for way longer than seven minutes. and they're inside this child. and you'll feel that child's sense of alarm and desperation. and you'll see that there is nobody who is able to comfort this child. and let's all thinkbout the long-term damage that does to that child. there's the short-term damage anderthen there's the long damage in terms of fears that other people will leave them even after they're reunited with their loved ones. in terms of symptoms of ptsd, depression, anxiety. as they grow older, even as they're parents worrying that their own children might be them.ated from this is long-term damage, and this is something that we've caused. we did work with one cwald who separated at the border because when he arrived at the border he had spiked a high fever. and so immigration wouldn't let. he was sent -- and this is one of the best possi things. his grandmother came to lovingly take care of him. he experienced symptoms foraf yearsr that. actually, that's why his parents ended up coming.

because he didn't understand why would you leave me? so in this moment when you're so stressed out you most want your parent there. and if you're very little youn' understand why they can't be there. also, if you've seen scenes of people like border police saying no, you can't be there, then they've really kiyo of showed in some ways that your parent is not worthy of ecre that your parent can be damaged. maybe you've seen something even worse. and you're left alone stranded all by themselves to deal with those memories. >> and do those memories and the tauma cause regression later on? ey stop speaking, for example? >> it can. hat ink it really depends follows. so what you would really want is for the child to have loving adults. right? because children can recover with the help of loving adults who help th makemeaning. if, however, the grown-ups are traumatized, if there are no grown-ups, if nobody really sits with the child and says it makes sense that you're scared, that you've been through this. and what we see is like children communicate through play. they'll just play scenes out where they'll put ahild out all by themselves, stranded and they're sort of saying why did

this happen, why did you leave me alone? and to the degree that a grown can help them to understand then they can recover. but otherwise, it would be really nmal for them to have sleep problems, for them to have difficcoty entrating. and they often would say oh, this child can't focus. but what we'd say really is they're focusing on danger. right? t focusing on the fact edat this could happen. they're worri that you could leave them at any moment. so we'd see heightened separationy. anxi and the long term without help we'd see depression, we would see continued symptoms of post-traumatic stress disorder, recurrent fears. and we s couldn ee -- we could imagine as they're aging, as they're growing, and one day they become parents, loving ld parents tie c well, it would make sense that even asth parent would worry bad things could happen. they would think wow, when i was this child's age i was not wit my parents. >> spencer, take us through what happens at these ports of entry at the border. what is the process that kids go through when they're separated from their parents?

>> yeah. so when kids have been separated over the last few weeks and months they're typically shipped across the country very quickly. so we'r seeing parents who come in. they sit in a detention center for a day, two days, three days with their child. and then border guards come in sometimes in the middle of the night. sometimes they'll tell the parent i'm just going to take your kid to get a bath, they'll be right back. and then only hours later does it become clear that the child actually isn't coming back. they've left. and so children are being taken, you know, to chicago, to washington state, to new york state, and they're put in detention centers specifically for chd ldren. >> ahe parents have no idea where they are. are they told where they're ing? >> they often aren't. we're hearing that there are hundreds and hundreds of parents who have noei idea where t children are. i think that's really important to emphasize now that we're i wa place wherhave these 2,000 children to reunite with their

parents is that the trump administration separated these chilen so carelessly that the parents have no idea where they are but sometimes the government doesn't even have any idea where the kid isen and who their p is. >> julian, i want to bring you in at this point. you've interviewed families who he been separated. are there some commonalities you're seeing as to why they're leaving their home countries and their experiences once they're separated? >> the majority of them tell us that they're leaving because of violence, whetherhey're from michoacan in mexico, whether rom honduras or el salvador. that's the commtheme, that kingss were too horrible, they didn't feel like police able to protect them, so they came to the united states. p we're now getting into this legal realm wheresident trump is trying to get a judge to modify an order that says basically children who are kepto in detention c be kept for more than 20 days. the obama administration challenged that, tried to get

modified, 2016. the jge said no. what are the chances the judge would take a different stand this time around? >> i think wh t's important underscore first of all is that there's no law that actually compels family separation. so even wen this was litigated under the obama administration parents weren't being routinely separatm their kids. and that's because there's a very easy way to comply with this pre-existing court order when a family comes together, which is to let them apply for asylum from the outside. theydon't have to be detained while they pursue their asylum applications. and in fact, it's perfectly gal to come here an apply for asylum. so that's one thing to say. the other thing to y is that urt's orderut the forces the government to inflict this terrible trauma on il en. the whole point of the flores settlement is to protect children from bad conditions of confinement and to make sure

that they can be with their families and they can be safe. and so in a situation where for whatever reason they absolutely can't be released or they can't be releas yet nothing about the flores settlement compels family separation. >> and so chandra, i'm also io c. there have been reports that as these families are detained, children are detained, border patrol agents and other personnel are apparently being told not to try to console the children. sehy would that be the >> i think what they can think about is people are worried of beingof accused perhaps molesting the children. and that whunfortunately we all know is what children need, especially young children, is physical comfort. in particular om their loved es. so having a stranger comfort you may actually not be comforting. but if you do gain the trusf the children and you can be in a place where you're in public, where it makes sense,e being a to just touch someone simply 'reng age to say that looking for your parent, to provide some reassurance, vocal

tone, a littlhug, that's really what's going to help the children to feel like we are, to feel safe again. and also to help them at a neurobiological level. what we're hearing is some children are being medicated. and to tink about i that an alternative to human touch? which one is really more damaging? d again, though, what we would say is really the number one intervention would be to connect them to their parents. >> and julian, i'mlso curious, on the texas border towns that you've been visiting what has been the reaction? is there sympathy for the s? migrant famil or are people simply saying you know, what they broke the laha and this isneeds to happen? ? you bring up a question that i think has been passed around for years, and i think it's not an even yosplit. have a lot of folks that say hey, there's a legal process and i'm sorry but look at what mexico does to central americans and they useat examples of happens in other countries when immigration laws, even if they're just civil infractions, are violated. but i think in this case there'e

just a tremendous outpouring of support that sort overwhelmed the negative. we set up a little story that had link where people can go and donate whatever it is that they can. legal services. and that's been the most viewed or clicked on site for the last three or fou days. you have people e-mailing reporters, calling rrs saying i read this, i want to help, i'll get down to texas as soon as i can. so i think that is, for the people that have been really affected by this in a negative way, that's sort of the glass half full situation there. >> and spencer, i know the aclu has filed a lawsuit asking a omdge to bar the trump administration separating families. how does this new executive ord affect your lawsuit? >> sohe lawsuit is still going forward because there are now over 2,000 children who areed stra in detention centers by themselves away from their so what we've asked the judge to

do is to expand the lawsuit to a natindwide class action to order the government to reunify all these parents with their children. the judge hasn't ruled on that request y. ut he did rule about two weeks ago thatat to sep children from their parents in the circumstances of our clients ia said it tears at the sacred bond between parent and child. he ma clearhis is legal and we actually have a conference with him later today in which we're goi to discuss what the next stage in the case is now executive order has come down. >> chandra, i know you have written books for kids to helpp them with traumatic disasters such as earthquakes, wildfires. if you were now to write another children's book for these children in these migrant detention centers, what would

you say to the children? >> i have started a book. it's called "we have one world." and it would be a free coloring book for kids. and it's really the idea of our world and countries, what's a border, why people cross it,e kind of eauty of their story. and really helping parents and chnnldren to t. i think the challenge that i'm having is when i've written the other disaster books i've been able to say things like the grown-reps are t the grown-ups are protective, the grwn-ups are coming together, we're all pulling for you, that we believe the childrenare the most important special thing, that it's our responsibility. and right now i haven't been able to write the ending because i can't say that. and that's the hardest thinhas in a natural disaster we pull together and we support all the children. and this is a manmade disaster. and we haven't done that yet. and that's what i think we're all here fighting for. >> okay. i see the heartbreak on your face as you talk about this. wanted to thank you all for your time. julian aguilar with the "teas tribune," thank you for joining us. and also spencer ander with the

aclu and chandra h-ghpin, child psychologist. it's been nice to have all of you here. thank you. >> thank you. a new documentary offers a sobering look at factory farming, where animals live in cramped conditions and are pumped with antibiotics to grow quigley and uniformly. a gro of farmers is fighting this trend to raise livestock nor sustainably and elhum reviving so-called herltage breeds ofchickens and pigs. joining me now are director and producer christopher quinn and the founder of good chef or foultry ranch. good to have you both. >> tnk you. do you have a problem with eating meat or is it just where that meat comes frim and how the ls are raised? >> well, one of the things i learnedng makthis film is that commodity birds, or birds that come from factory farming are hybridized in such a way that their growth is so accelerated that they ultimately, you know,

are ready to go to market in 30 short o days so. so they're bio-engineered from th t time they are born t time they go to market, it's just 30 days? >> yeah. sought issue i have is als that these animals from the waking oment that they're born, they'reffering mightily because they've be hibernized to grow at such an accelerated rate. >> frank, what are are thoughts on that? >> this is the real welfare issue to me. me 90 of all suffering, turkeys, chickens, hogs, whatever, has do with not so much how they're raised, that is important, but it's wha done to these animals to increase productivity. we have increased tir rate of growth so much that we have hanged their skeletal structure, that we have changed their muscle structure, to the point when you select for these certain characteristtss it aff other things. and so i just can't support that type of farming. what are your thoughts on how the meat and poultry industry

have changed over the past several decades in this country? >> well,gh'm old eno to have seen it happen. i've watched it move from being anendent farm situation in which hundreds and thousands of individual farmers raise chickens and turkeys and sold sxegz sold pigs and brought them to their local to'mar where now just two companies in the whole world control it all. >> your documentary spends quite a bit of time talking about impacts on the environment. can you talk about that? >> sure. yeah, raisodg our it's one of the leading causes of greenhouse gases and you know, the methane that comes from raising cattle and it's enormous nd it's one of the top t contributors to global warming. that's another reason i've scaled back on eating meat too. is whenou start to see the impact on the environment, which is enormously significant, and in 50 years we'll be 9p to billion people on the planet,

and if we continue to consume meet on the level and if south asia and east asia start to adopt the so-called western diet we're going to o findrselves in real trouble. >> how are your practices different from factory farming? >> i actually own all my own genetics. i own the parents, the grandparents. collect the eggs. i set the eggs. and i hatch the eggs. and i raise the turkeys. same way with the chickens. so this is very different than the industrial model. >> and do they taste different from e mass produced turkey? >> yes. i've heard this from everybody. even some of the food scientists from the university of arkansas that m kansas universi have done research who have actually t saidre's a direct taste difference. and it's acombination of the biggest thing to me of course is the genetics and how that meat is laid down genetically and slowly in a natural animal. the other is the environment. my birds can run, jum. and fly and are free to do so.

>> so given the system is what it is, is it realistic to expect that a lot of people can give up the cheaper meats that are factory farmed? because yotowill get i this issue of poorer communities can't afford to pay more for their food. >> you know, wh you actually look at a burger, for instance, a so-called expensive meat that anybody can afford, that 99-cent burger actually when you externalize the coith subsidies and health care because this is a diet that's not very good for you, that burger just lands south of $100. in a way we're all paying it. >> the reason it costs more is i don't own the whole system. i don't own the processing plant. i don't own the he'd companies. don't own the shipping and the trucking and refrigeration. tt's where all the cost is. >> and christopher, earlyy in r film you focus a lot on colonel sanders and kentucky fried what role did kfs play in

transforming the meat industry in this country? >> this is really the of us wanting cheap and efficient food. and that really took hold in the i0s and really took shape the '70s. and that came with a price. and we slowly changed our food system to a place where we have mass-produced chicken that might be peinive but in a lot ofys t's really a costly endeavor for all of us. >> so why do you think this film now?eeded what has changed that you think is critical for this film to be out now? >> people are donateng the we diet. fast food is becoming more readily available in india and china. and this is a bigoncern when you think of the billions of people that live there. anis is going to have a real effect on our environment. it's really uhe to us to make decision of how we're going to eat and how we're going to make our way into the future. and scaling back on cheap

commodity meat seems to be a solution that weo all have start to address. >> and frank, what would you like people to know about t meat and poultry that they do consume? >> you know, it's really hard for me because i hate to tell anybody what they can do or can't do. but if you do care about certain things and you wish to try buy withoutry that is higher in nutritn or that is better for the environment or better for the animal, then seek out theb t you can. preferably that which has been certified by the americanc poultry astion as being truly heritage or standard bred poultry. then you'll know you're getting the best of all of these things. but this -- y know, it's so new and it's just gett started and we're hoping to grow that it's not available for a lot of places. >> all righry thank you vuch for that. frank reese with good shepherd turkey ranch in kansas and also filmmaker christopher quinn. nice to have you both he. thank you very much. >> thank you. eating animals opens in bay

area theaters this weekend. and that will do it for us. as always, you can fd more of our coverage at kqed.org/newsrou.m. i'm thuy thank you for joining us. ♪

>> a crisis at the border and in washington. i'm robert costa. we discuss president trump's zero tolerance immigration policy and its cost both political and human. tonight on "washington week." president trump: we're going to keep families together but the border isoing toe just as tough as it's been. [applause] >> president trump insists the administration's hard line immigration stance remains but o does an face on his policy of separating children from parents who enter the country illegally. amid the firestorm, the president blames democrats. presid t trump: democrats don't care abouthe impact of uncontrolled migration on your communities, your schools, your