♪ ♪ welcome to "amanpour on pbs." we're looking back at some of our favorite interviews this year. tonight, the mega star matt damon on a surprising location, indonesia, not shooting a movie, but trying to solve the global clean water crisis one microloan at a time. he joined me with his co-founder of water.org gary white. plus, music is the food of love. my conversation with venezuela's prodigy and superstar conductor at the l.a. philharmonic gustavo duramel. ♪ ♪

♪ ♪ welcome to the program, everyone. i'm christiane amanpour in london. listen to this shocking statistic. as many as 100 million people in india won't have adequate access to groundwater in just two years' time. that shocker comes from a recent government-sponsored study and it is just one sign of a growing global crisis. in iran, protests have recently broken out over water shortages. in argentina, a drought caused the economy to shrink for the first time in more tan a year. in south africa, a severe water shortage has led to rationing in the picturesque city of cape town. one of the efforts to tackle this crisis comes from an unlikely source, the hollywood mega star matt damon. he's been dedicated to this vital matter since 2009, working with the longtime water policy pioneer gary white and together, they started water.org.

it's no typical charity as damon and white explained from jakarta, indonesia, where much of their efforts are concentrated now. matt damon, gary white, welcome to the program. >> thank you. >> we're reaching you all of the way over in jakarta, in indonesia. matt just start out by telling me what a hollywood mega star is doing on location with water in jakarta. well, we're here checking up on some of our programs and actually, when you talked to us about our work in 2011, i think it was, we -- actually we were at about, i think we hadn't reached our first million people at that point in new york when we sat down and talked and as of last month, we're at 12.5 million people that we've reached and oddly enough, at that same event that you came to

in new york and we talked, we got a check that night from the caterpillar foundation just to expand our work into indonesia and so it's wonderfully ironic that we're talking to you from there as we talk about this again and revisit this six and a half years later. >> so, listen, it's great to hear some good news where progress is being made. just sum up for me what you're trying to do. you're reaching 12.5 million people. matt, what is it that you're trying to do? well, what we've been trying to do for the last decade or so is a model that involves loaning, giving small loans to people who are living in poverty and gary had this incredible insight from having done this for 30 years and he had this hypothesis that living -- and being in these communities he knew people were paying for water and he speculated that if we could get people access to a microloan to

connect to existing infrastructure they could actually pay that loan back and -- and buy their time back essentially. so rather than having to spend all of this time collecting water away from perhaps a paying job, they could actually have a water connection directly to their house and -- and what actually came to pass was the kind of -- something better than we could have hoped. these loans pay off at more than 99% and it's a success story. >> so, gary, these are microloans. we've heard a lot about microcredit since the early days of muhammad eunice and the gramin bank so that you're encouraging investment and in a way, equity. >> that's it exactly. the challenge was it wasn't making these loans for water and sanitation. it would make a loan for somebody to start a business,

but the microfinance d so what we did was kind of or give them a nudge and derisk it for them so we said we'll cover your costs to start up these types of loans and if you find the market then you can go to scale with this and that's exactly what's happened. we had around 90 partners around the world now that are delivering these microloans to people in need of water and sanitation. more than 90% of them are women and they paid back at a 99% rate and one way to drive it home is a woman who i met in manila not long ago and she was going to water vendors and sending her kids to these water vendors to buy their water and carry it back home. they were paying about $60 each month for that water. she got a small loan and got connected to the water utility and she couldn't afford the $200 it cost to connect to the utility and once she got the

loan she could do that and her water payments are only $10. there's another $50 in her pocket every month to pay for her kids to go to school, to pay for the medicines that they need and the kids aren't spending this time. so they can be in school learning instead of continuing on this cycle of poverty. >> according to the u.n., 27 million indonesians lack access to safe drinking water. so just explain, both of you, how you internalize that and how you observe that affecting the everyday man, woman and child. we just saw it first hand, right? we saw the villages that we were in, where people before they were able to get access to the loans they were sitting hours every day trying to secure their water. >> there are some situations that are more dire than that where girls aren't in school because their job for the family is to collect the water and so they're completely robbed -- leaving aside the fact that a million children die every year totally unnecessarily because of lack of safe water and

sanitation. you have this whole other swath of millions upon millions of girls whose lives are just stamped out and they're just not allowed to live to their full potential because their daily grind is just finding the water for their family. we just went to the school here in indonesia and there were 150 girls there and we had the best afternoon with them and talking to them and you just see how their lives have transformed and so when you see that kind of transformational effect that getting this access has, it really does -- it just really lights the fire under us to keep this going and to get around and talk about this and the success that -- that this model has because the world bank has identified 500 million people around the world who could be reached with this model. that is a real chunk of the problem right there that can be -- that can be fixed if woo

c we can get the capital into the right places. i wonder what you think when we introduce this segment we talk about protesting iran and chronic drought in afghanistan that could get worse. we talked about cape town, south africa where people are lining up in this tourist city just to get water. in the united states, you see in the epa there are big crises with protections for clean water being rolled back under the current administration and there are those who believe that the water crisis could be the progenitor even more for conflict and war and the like. i wonder your reflections on the bigger issue of water. >> as you said, this is a massive geopolitical issue and the poorest of the poor are always affected the most by these things. so if you -- if you imagine, you know, you extrapolate that out to the next 20 to the next 40 years, what does that look like for them if this kind of dystopia you're talking about

comes to be? so i think that's my kind of first take away from your question. >> and gary? >> most of the world that's going to be facing that type of issue is going have the resources to deal with it and that's going to happen. it won't be easy, but it will happen. when we look at it, we had conversations with dr. jim kim at the world bank and he said we have a really hard time finding how to reach those last 10% to 15% of the poor, and that's why we're working with the bank and the ifc to bring these types of solutions that helpedet gus to the poorest people. >> it is important. i just want to ask a hollywood question to you, matt. you are the face of this thing and you're able to bring so much to it, to gary's work and the whole me too women's empowerment started with hollywood to an extent and obviously your career took off with support from harvey weinstein. i just wonder in the six or so

months, eight months since all of this broke, how do you think hollywood is coping, reacting and stepping up when it comes to women's rights and equal treatment under fair play in hollywood? >> yeah. i guess i am all for women's empowerment in hollywood and at the village level in indonesia. that's a big part of this work that we did. you know, i've certainly learned that, you know, just because somebody asks me a question and gives me a microphone doesn't mean it's my turn to talk, and so, you know, i've been trying to listen a lot and i support those movements and think they're doing wonderful things and if we talk about our work at water.org that is something that i do want to talk about and i'm deeply -- we've been doing this for -- i've been doing it for over a decade and he's been

doing it for over three and -- and it's a great story because it's about women who really have less than we can imagine in the west who are doing these really amazing and heroic things. >> what was it that caused you all of the way over in hollywood to be energized by this water crisis? what is it that made you think this was where you wanted to put your philanthropy and your social entrepreneurship? >> you know, we saw this in the west a hundred years ago. imagine if we cured cancer tomorrow and people were dying by this thing that was totally preventable. that's what gets us energized and also the success that we're having. >> what i take heart is the poor is its own solution, if we can nudge the system a little bit so people can access to affordable

themselves. i think that's's important message at too time especially when you say this is a good message. thank you so much for joining us from jakarta. >> thank you. >> so in a world of turmoil, music can often be a welcome relief from politics, an antidote, if you like. this is the core belief of my next guest, the classical music gustavo dudamel, leader of the philharmonic orchestra and selling concerts out around the world. ♪ ♪ ♪ >> he is also the product of an incredible experiment called el sistema, venezuela's famous orchestra program for

disadvantaged youth. for years he walked a fine line refusing to get political about the authoritarian regime, but recently with mass protests, deaths and venezuelans on the brink of humanitarian catastrophe, he has said that enough is enough. i sat down with him during a break in rehearsals here in london to discuss politics, prodigies and the redechltive power of music. >> gustavo dudamel, welcome to the program. >> thank you very much, christiane. >> i want to start at the beginning. both of your parents were musical and that was sort of a part of your dna growing up. >> yes. listening to latin music at home was the genesis of my love due to music. i was listening mostly salsa. >> mostly salsa, yes because my

father played in a salsa band and my mother was singing in a choir and i had that kind of combination. >> i heard -- i read that you used to line up your toys and pretend conduct. >> yes. it was a very good orchestra. >> it didn't hold you back. >> no, and it was such a serious and fun game for me because i took and put my orchestra and i put their recordings and i was stopping, rehearsing, and i did my concerts for the family. it was serious. >> practicing with your toys. >> practicing with my toys. >> all lined up. >> all lined up. a beautiful orchestra. i was playing with my toys and i was playing baseball. i was playing soccer and i was swimming. i did everything. i was doing karate and at the same time i had the music, but music was something very important for me.

i remember telling my grandmother, and i said grandma, i want to do music. thp is what you want to do. have done everything and immediately i became director of the youth orchestra of my town and i was 11 years old and that was a big position. that was a position desired by conductors and an 11-year-old comes to see the conductor and the director, and it was -- everything had been developing in a very natural way. so that is why i don't see the dimension of this. i don't see, you know, if i'm famous or i'm important for this, it's what i have been doing since i was 11 years old so it was very natural.

>> describe how you came up in the system, obviously el sistema the orc of theehestra for disad children and the maestro who recently died created something unique. what did it do for you? >> everything. everything. you know, i started in the sistema because my father was founder of the sistema in our town and he was one of the first musicians and young musicians that play in the orchestra. and el sistema is a family, you know? it's this kind of educational system where you enjoy, and you go and you have a discipline, and it's the discipline of joy, and you are creating, and you are touching beauty. ♪ ♪ >> i cannot see myself right now

being an individual conducting, even if it looks very individual because you are on the podium and it looks like you are the boss, but no. i grew up with my pleasures with my friends playing music and having fun doing that because that is the truth, and that is why the connection that i have with orchestras is so natural because i understand what they think, but also i -- we inspire each other and that is what is el sistema about, when you go to a place where, you know, with problems can be whatever. my case in venezuela saved my life, you know? >> what is the philosophy behind it? is it to raise the kids up? is it to make them musicians for life? is it to give them the idea of belonging? family? what is the philosophy behind

it? >> it's the access to it. you know, imagine, classical music is a very elitist. >> it is very elitist. and art. >> this has to be part of the evolution of a child. you have to be a part of their life, as normal as it is to eat or to go to the school or to breathe. so when you go to the orchestra, you have a chance to grow up, together with other children creating beauty and having access to that. and you can't imagine how powerful it is because, and playing the first notes. pa, pa, pa, pum. nobody was telling us how to do that only we were re-creating or

creating that moemth a creating that moment, and that is the power of music. sometimes you don't have to say anything and you only play and the message is there. >> you just mentioned your country and it's been through many ups and downs. it's in a serious down right now. there's so much political upheaval. people have been killed and there are protests and electricity, water, medicine, and everything and in fact, in one of the recent protests someone that had come up in the el kistema person was kill period. was that a bit of a turning point? >> it is always difficult to talk about politics especially in my country because it is so polarized that sometimes when you bring that to the table you're bringing a family and it gets really difficult and, yes,

violence is unacceptable. that is something that for me, growing up, as i'm tell young in an environment that created beauty for me it's not possible that outside on the streets it's happening the opposite. even if el sistema is a country and have become the symbol of the world because el sestema it touched my life because i'm a father it is or how beautiful at the same and then he get it is kelled you know? the first contact that i had with family was -- i don't know. it was very difficult. it was very difficult, but at the same time it was a moment to say, look, it is enough. it's enough, this fight.

this is not taking us to anywhere. >> you were very clear in the beginning because clearly chavistas, and hugo chavez promoted el sistema and it did a lot of good and your position was i don't need to be political. i work through my music and the music talks for itself, and now you've beany more physical against the violence and maduro has canceled his trips and how did this affected with the venezuelan musicians? >> my relationship with the musicians is still the same, last saturday and tomorrow i would -- i had a rehearsal with them through face time and yes, for two hours we were working with the national youth orchestra and tomorrow when we

have another one with the national choir and the national youth orchestra. i keep and i have meetings every week. we have the people working there, so my connection is still the same. ♪ ♪ >> that's incredible. so you're conducting the l.a. phil harmonic, you're touring and you were still training the musicians through facetime, because you had to. i've made the commitment from the be finning and from the middle i've s.t.a.r.t.ed in the el sistema and when i -- when i did the statement about all of these situation it was as a citizen. i have the right to say what is. i have the right to say what i think. and not being political.

talking about politicians, yes, but not being political. i didn't want to get in a fight. i was only making my opinion and you know, i have the freedom to do that, you know? that's it, and i said what i thought, what i think and i think that the situation is unsustainable, but i think also that the main -- the main key to get out of this situation is to unite the people, you know, that is my goal. if you ask me what to do, what you will do to do something to help, you know? we have to breathe -- we have to build bridges because, you know, people keep building borders between us all the time, all the time. >> you are right in the middle of a major border wall fight in the united states. how do you build your bridges when there's so much wall building?

>> we have this beautiful project to inspire like the systema that is the youth orchestra of los angeles where most of the children, they are latinos and americans, and leading in los angeles and the disadvantaged areas and is very successful, but at the same time i will give you an example and we started our season with the festival called cdmx, celebrating mexico. we celebrate mexico and invite pop singers like cafe tacuba and natalya lafourcade and we have organizers from mexico and it was our way to say no, it doesn't exist these borders. >> let me ask you a final question because you talked about soul, family, beauty and there's something else that a lot of people are talking about, as well that music, perhaps more

than any other art form is really restorative for mental health issues and all sorts of issues. do you agree with that, and why do you think that is? >> music has the power. is this inchrisible beauty. it's the sound and you see the musicians playing and you don't see the music. it's the vibration and energy. that harmony creates something. you know, i'm the most privileged guy in the world because i do music, but when i see another that doesn't have, you know, that same ability and say they're all the same circumstance and not ability, circumstance and they developed better abilities to be a musician and that is the most beautiful thing, because you know when music encourage people to be better and that is what el

sistema does. you know, as a citizen, as a member of an orchestra and as a member of this world that we live, you know, we make this because we want to share beauty with the people and we believe in the power of the music, you know? >> gustavo dudamel, thank you for bringing the joy. >> thank you, christiane. ♪ ♪ gustavo dudamel who has played on the super bowl, sesame street and inspired. that is it for our program tonight. thanks for watching amanpour on pbs and join us again tomorrow night.

♪ katty: you are watching "beyond 100 days" on pbs. a no good, very bad, terrible day for donald trump as his legal problems explode. christian: he tries to shrug it off with a tweet, but this is the most tumultuous moment in his presidency so far. katty: after his former lawyer pleads guilty to campaign finance charges, mr. trump for the first time is implicated in a crime, and uncle: could have more damaging information to spill -- michael cohen could have more damaging information to spill. christian: also, the white house strategy is to cast cohen