captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc >> woodruff: good evening, i'm judy woodruff. on the newshour tonight, a boeing 737 crashes in ethiopia. it's the second in under a year for the jetliner, raising concerns over the safety of the airplane., thesident trump unveils his 2020 budget, including an waditional $8.6 billion for a southern border . we talk with mr. trump's top economic advisor. plus, we are on the at the u.s. southern border, with h report oconditions that migrants face and the strained resources of border patrol. >> we can't arrest our way out of the problem. that's not going to solve the problem. and this is not a border patrol solve. this is, this comes from legislation, updated l >> woodruff: all that and more on tight's pbs newshour.

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>> woodruff: the ripple effects of an african air disaster have reached around the globe tonight. the ethiopian airlines crash on sunday killed all 157 people onr now, several countes and a number of airlines have grounded their models of the boeing 737 max-8. neil connery of independent adlevision news reports from ethiopia's capitals ababa. >> reporter: scattered across e e field, the sorry wreck a plane that was the pride of its fleet and the heartbreaking e.minders of 157 people entrusted to its c there are clothes. rieces of the cabin's inte. even a book marked with notes for a conference that s never reached. the emergey teams are digging down because part of the fuselage is buri in the earth.

from the air it's clear there is a huge crater. possibly an indication that the plane ca down almost vertically and at great speed. but why an aircraft just a few months old, should fail so catastrophically just minutes after leaving addis ababa is a question the aviation world needs answering. wh remains of flight e-t 3 lies strewn over a wide area. six minutes after taking off, the boeing 737 max 8 aircraft fell from the skies above. investig piece together exactly what happened. the safety of this particularno aircraft is w under intenseru sctiny. last october, a similarop passenger planated by lion air crashed off the coast of indonesia. many of those on board yesterday's ethiopian airlines h flight been u.n. officials,

environmentalists, and charity workers heading for a conference in kenya. today at that conference, delegates observed a minute'sr silence for thlleagues who never arrived to join them. ethiopian airlines' staff also r held a vigil remember thst crew. >> woodruff:nvestigators in ethiopia did find the plane's two black box recorders today. there are now many questions being asked about the engineering of this plane and its software. our miles o'brien, who watches the aviation business, joins us from boston. miles, hello. so from what we know about this airplane and what we know about not only this crash but the one of a very milar model, the same model that occurred last october, wha what does it pointn erms of possible causes? >> well, you have to be carefulle connecting the dots is early, of course, judy, but

a modern airliner such as the 737 max 8 doesn't fall from out of the sky. you've had two o thse aircraft doing exactly that inhe same phase of flight in the last months. that rais b alarmells. until the black boxes and the flightdata recorder are analyzed, we can't say for certain. in the meantime, there's a prudent response to ground these aircraft until it is knwn one way tore the other if there's an endemic flaw in the design. >> woodruff: we know boeing changed thdesign to a degree when they designed this max 8. what was changed? >> the key was they wanted to make it longer range and more fficient. so it meant putting a bigger engine on it, heavier and wider in diameter. so to fit under the wings and

they hadund clearance to move the engine up and forward. what that did was every time the aircraft in particular was in full thrust scenario which would be the case on takeoff, it tended to make the nose point a little higher and faster tha 737 pilots were used to. so instead of redesigning the thwing and increasinheight of the landing gear as you might expect, what boeing did was change the computer, which is in between the flight controls and the human and the controls themselves, and put in some software which detected this nose-high attitude, and the computer commands the aircraft to go down if the etlotit too high. if it goes too high, the plane will fall out of they. that was the intent. but the theory many are worried abre is somehow that software is either overreacting or the s tnsorshemselves gave baddata to the computer. >> woodruff: and is there an issue, potentially, miles, with regard to the training of pilots

to fly this aircraft? >> reporter: well, pilots were not fully briefed on this system, did not know exactly what was going on in the computers. thal is where you get int kinds of discussions about where the line is drawn between human antrol andutomation in all kinds of complex systems. so now they know, and th f.a.a. has issued an airworthiness directive that came after thest rash, the lion air crash in november, which mandates the look at the computer software,ns s and additional training so pilots can understand how to disconnect the syste now, any pilot flying this aircraft would have known about the lion air crash and known how to disconnect the system. the question, is in a situation where you are nose down very quickly and going very fast tord the ground at relatively low altitude, is there enough ti s. >> woodrufas you pointed out, miles, the f.a.a. is saying these planeare airworthy and,

yet, flight attendants associations are saying their tendant are trying to ask questions perhaps to say they won't fly these airline how significant is that? >> i think it's reasonable to ask the questions, as should passengers. the f.a.a. just this arch issued something i never heard of before, continued airworthiness notification. that is not an official legal document. it's more on the order of a memo to the world saying here's what we did in november. we introduced this airwo hiness directive, we gave the airlines until april to do this, to figure out the problem and fix it. in the meantime, we're just going to wait and watch. i think all the options remain on the table but they're watching cloly to see what the ckpitt data recorder and voice recorders hold in store for them. >> woodruff: as you are sayi, a number of questions, very much top of mind. miles o'brn, thank you very

much. >> you're welcome, judy. >> woodruff: in the day's othere news, u.s.-bacforces advanced slowly against the last pocket of islamic state territory in eastern syria. rocket fire and air assault continued into the night on baghouz. some 500 i.s. fighters are believed holed up there, along with several thousand women and children. an iranian court has reportedly issued a verdict in the case of a detained american, michael white. n an iranis agency says a verdict has been iss but there is no word on what it is, or even what the charges are. u white is. navy veteran, arrested in iran last july. in all, five americans are being ld there. in malaysia, a court released siti aisyah , who had been accuseof killing the half- brother of north korean leader kim jong un. she flew home tondonesia, and was reunited with her parents after prosecutors dropped the murder charge. her lawyer said they gave no reason.

>> siti aiysah has been discharged from the court today. and we are grateful that the public prosecutor has in fact come to this conclusion because we still truly believe that she is merely a scapegoat and she is innocent. ac woodruff: a second defendant remains on trialsed of using a nerve agent to kill kim jong nam, in 2017. the defense says the two women thought they were part of a prank that was actually organized by north korean intelligence. the longtime president of algeria has announced he will not seek a fifth term, in the face of widespread protests. abdel-aziz bouteflika had initially said he would run again. that prompted widespreadde nstrations in recent weeks, as crowds demanded he give up power after 20 years in office. today's announcement delays the april election, and calls for ay special o write a new constitution. osschools and businesses a venezuela were forced to close

again today, as much of the utcountry remained blacked a power station explosion inde caracas to the misery for people who have been living without electrical power since thursday. >> ( translat ): friday, saturday and sunday was horrible. i was going crazy with no water, electricity. for god's sake, how long are we s ing to continue like this? the government dt want to accept that it's their fault yecause they have to carry out maintenance and fos, they have not done this. >> woodruff: the opposition and the venezuelan government have british prime minister theresa may traveled to strasbourg, france tonight, in a bid to lvage her brexit plan. she is hoping for concessions from the european union before the house of commons votes on a plan it rejected once already. the vote is tomorrow. the scheduled date for brexit is march 29th.

back in this country, democrats announced milwaukee will host their presidential nominating convention next year. the city won out over houston and miami. republicans have already picked ioarlotte, north carolina for their 2020 conve and, on wall street, a tech rally pushed the broader market higher. the dow jones industrial averagt gained 177 pto close at 25,650. the nasdaq rose 136 points, and the s&p 500 added 34. c ste on the newshour: president trump's top economic advisor on the latest white house budget an on-the-ground report from the u.s. southerborder. we break down the weekend's 2020 tydemocratic campaign acti a conversation with author marl james on his new novel, "black leopard, red wolf," and much more.

>> woodruff: the white house today released president trump's budget for 2020. the record $4.7 trillion plan calls for increased military spending, and big cuts to domestic programs. it also includes an additional $8.6 billion forhe president's controversial border wall. we turn to the president's chief economic advisor, larry kudlow.w larry kuwelcome to the "newshour". it's good to see you. >> thank you, judy. >> woodruff: so the president is asking congress to approve the largest budget ever, as we said, 4.7 there will. does it achieve balance for another 15 or so years? trillion-dollar defirets for the of his term, and, yet, he ran promising to get rid of the deficits. he's going in the opposite direction. >> well, i think, actually, if you look at those numbers as a share of g.d.p., which is the real burden, speing and borrowing comes down every yeari de from a peak of about 5% this year, and then it will go

down a steady glide path in the out years, and i think the key ints are very simple. number one, this is an economic owth budget. we maintain our tax rate reduction, our rollback of regulations and red tape, our opening of energy and our trade reforms. the growth in 2018 came in at 3.1%. that was our view. we think there are more rore 3%ers out there. that's probably the best way to get the budgetown. we'll to to limit spending. the president will be tough o spending programs, roughly about a 5% reduction this year. >> woodruff: i want to ask you about aending cuts in a minute. as you know, respect independent folks, the referendum reserve is prospecting 20%, sliding -- ward. the ngressional budgets ofice is protecting under 2%. the senator for resnsible budget are saying your both

projections are unrealisticsec on accounting gimmicks and fantasy assumptions. how do you prove them wrong? >> the proof will be in the eating. everybody disagreed s in 018, said we couldn't get 3% economic growth after tax cut were passed, and we did. again, the view here is we are promoting incentives in the economy. we have ha tremendous inreases in business investment. we've also had 100% expensing for new equipment. that has spurred business investment. there's oney coming in offshore, we're the hottest econy in the world. e president's trade policies i think are contributing to confidence. we're on the verge ofhat i hope will be an historic deal with china. perhaps we'll talk about that. o er words, people have doubted our supy side tax cuts. we've won round one. i'm going to roll the dice again and take the over and sug wst that l be right again this year, and many of our critics

will not be. >> woodruff: well,ou are hanging a lot on the tax cuts, but we now have a number of experts who are watching the tax receipt numbers that come iny regulad they are saying they do not add up to what is anything like the kind of grothh the administration had projected on these taxes. >> actenlly, overall revs are up about 10%, so that's a pretty good number. let me say, one of the people who are skeptical of us, the congressional budget offe, nonetheless, their estimates before taxes and most recently after the taxes, th have argued and said there's roughly $7 trillion of higher nominal g.d.p. andfrom that, comes about 1.2 trillion in extraes reveso that the tax tuts are about 80% paid for overall, that includes thde ividuals. the corporate tax cuts are completely paid for. so we're alrdy seeing the results here. and, again, what matters, you know, we've had record

blue-dollar employment, raises arthrising frolatest reports, 3.4%, the unemployment rate is all the way down to 3.8%. across the board, low unemployment. women, i'm proud of this because we've made efforts, 65-some-odd% of the new jobs crated in th last year have come from women, so i think we are striking everywre and we are succeeding. >> woodruff: let me ask you, there are other viws, but l me come to the larger picture here on spending cuts, increasing spending in defense, cutting part of the mujts budget that are non-defense, scalled discretionary, much of it domestic. there's been kind after al between the two political parties in this last decade of this partisan era, for every dollar of spending on defense, there will be an equal movement in defense. you have a 5% increase in

defense and a huge cut on theth rest ofe budget. how do you explain that? >> well, i think it's a question of priorities, and i think we would like to break this nexus where everybody gets more spending. on the military side, where we have added, we think we've got oo have the greatest military in therld, we have to have the best technology regardingry miliwe have commitments overseas that we have to keep, and, so, we're honoring all on the domestic side, i think spending has been too rapid.e the a number of programs, and i can't go through every darn one of them, but there afe a number programs that we think are not efficient, and tha countrdo without. some cases -- >> woodruff: let me be specific. you're cutting the environmental protection 31%. you're cutting the education you're cutting elements ofe medicaidments of welfare, raising work requirements, the question coming out of this ise are erican people going to

be better off with this budget? >> well, look, food stamps ve come way down. i mean, we've lost 5 million people on foompd sta that's a terrific thing. other poveerty aas, homeless vets, for example, that number has dropped by 5%. we have added in ox ta plan tremendous assistance through low income wokers, chi credits, earned income tax credits. we think the essential sefety net isg preserved, and then some. but, i want to say, growth solves a lot of problems, so more ara more fespending is not a recipe for growth, will not lp the people as some people think it will help, and, so, why should we continue to spld in an imited way? >> woodru: we' have another conversation about growth next time. the border wall, you are asking 8.6 billion. you only had 1.6 billion last year when you had a republican

majority in the congress. in this congress republicans are expressing doubts about that much. is the president looking for another showdown or another potential governmenth sutdown potentially? >> the president is looking foro er security and that means building a wall. we've brought in experts frm i.c.e., customs, d.h.s., and that's what we decid we needed. my view, it's essential we have this border security, because we have an economic crisis, ata humaan crisis, illegals flooding over the border, this has to be stopped for thean safy the security of the united states. so i think the president has made a very effective case. if there is going to be a battle with congress, then so be it, but the experts that we've nulked to believe that this is exactly the rightmber. >> woodruff: but so be it, you're saying if that's what comes the president is prepared to fight for it?

>> you have to fht for your principles and security on the uthern boarder is esential. we won't have pro -- prosperityd law and order as long as we leave that problem unsolved. i understand there are disagreements. we would love to be a bipartisan agreement on this as time goes on, no question about that, there are other areas of bipartisanship we may seek but border security is essential and the president has made the case. >> woodruff: it's the subject of enormous debate, larry kudlow, thank you for being here. >> thank you, judy. >> woodruff: though crossings at the southern border are athi oric lows, the number of families and unaccompanied minors entering the u.s. has been increasing. amna nawaz was granted access to border patrol's yuma sector operations in arizona.

this is the first of two oports, starting with a view from the u.s. sithe border. and a warning:iewers may find some images disturbing. >> nawaz: under the hot arizona sun, with few belongings and well-worn shoes, these migrants have just crossed onto american soil after the nearly 4,000 milo ney from guatemala.ur theyndered to border patrol agents from the u.s. customs and border protection agen, or c.b.p. the groups they're encountering in recent years changed dramatically. a a decadego, 90% ofra immignts caught crossing illegally were single adult men from mexico.

today nearly 90% are families and unaccompanied children fromm central erica. it's a population the border patrol says they were not prepared to take on. inside here is what they call a processing center, where the families are held for about three days. they won't let us shoot any picture inside, but we can tell you what we saw. it's basically a giant cement room, with a processsk in the middle, and around the perimeter are a number of cells where the families are held. they're broken up by populations, so mothers and daughters, fathers and sons. but the single most crowded room was for unaccompanied males. dozens and dozens of teenagers, lying like sardines in this one cement roo but what really strikes you about the room is how many chil toddlers running around; infants in their mother's arms. the one thing border officials can tell you is, everyone can agree: this is nplace for demilies and children. we could record in what they call their "costco"-- a room once filled with office, suppliw packed with diapers, formula, and family

essentials, unpacked by some of the 90 national guard troops sent to backfill staffing. >> this isenhat we call an rcement zone, so this is triple layer fencing here. >> nawaz: yuma sector chief anthony porvaznid says he's asr more agents. he already has funding from last year topdate 25 miles of border fencing. >> this will all be replaced. >> nawaz: into what? >> it will be 30 feet bollard- style fence. >> nawaz: his resources, he ys, haven't changed sinc 2012, but the job has.ma porvaznik ess 35% to 40% of his current manpower goes to processing and caring for themi es and children in custody. > we just had a lady last week who delivered twins, two months- - two mohs premature. and they see, they see sick kids in our custody. last year alone, we took 550 kids to the hospital here, over 1,700 total here, just in the yuma area. that's a huge strain on our resources, because they're doin things te not enforcement- related. >> nawaz: but agents concede,

no barrier is 100% effective.us they providehis video, showing families ducking under the 14-year-old girl in this clip broke her vertebrae from the fall. injuries, they say, are common, and further stretch theirso ces. >> this dates back to about 1990. >> nchief porvaznik believes updating older wall yill dissuade people from to cross illegally. when you see people wh dare willing under this and climb over a barbed wireifnd build makeladders to climb over additional fencing, do you thinthat's enough to deter people to try to breach it in some way? >> the majority of the population, yes. it will deter the majority. and what we're trying to do, is impede and deny entry into this area. and so, 87% of our, of the people we apprehend right now, are fami units and unaccompanied children. they won't go over a 30-foot bollard. is it going to push somewhere else? likely, yes. ( helicopter ) >> nawaz: later in the day,

border patrol encountered a second group of migrants. these 12 guatemalans waded across the colorado river to get into the u.s.hi >> these are ts we have to interact with here on the ground. >> nawaz: deputy chi carl landrum walked us through the dense brush and steep terrain they hiked. it does tell you that what people are willing to go through to cross.an >> it does. we would like for everybody to be a part of that legally to be a part of it. >> reporter: immigration attorney lawyer a lealo says >> nawaz: but immigration attorney laura belous of the arizona-based florence project ys resources should go t immigration courts, not physical barriers. >> if you look at the historyrd the over the last 20 years: increased walls within cities then pushed people into deserts. so if there'walls and deserts, it is going to push people into canyons and rivers, where people

are likely to have even more dangerous crossing. smuggling will be even more expensive. that then makes everyone along the border ls safe. >> nawaz: chief porvaznik says, whatever the solutn, the current situation is unsustainable. >> at some point, look, we can't arrest our way out of the problem. that's not going to get us-- t that's not goisolve the problem. so we have to figure out, and this is not a border patrol solve; this is-- this cos from legislation, updated laws. >> nawaz: as the policy debate in washington drags on, there's little relief in sight for both those patrolling this border, and those seeking to cross it.y officials e vast majority of those crossing are families seeking stability or safety. though they also say background checks sometimes reveal someone with a criminal history. judy, it's worth noting that "criminal history" often means an immigration violation, not a violent crime. but border patrol's bigger rencern is who they might be missing, while theusy caring for families. that's why they're asking people

tolnter legally, and that w be our focus in tomorrow night's report. >> woodruff: democratic presidential hopefuls fanned our this weekend, ng voters from iowa to austin. john yang has the story. >> yang: in keene, new hampshe, vermont senator beorie sanders made the case his presidential candidacy. >> i don't have to tell anyone in this room we're living in an unprecedented moment in american history. and when you live in an unprecedented moment, yoneed to have an unprecedented response, which is what this campaign is about. >> yang: a self-proclaimed democratic socialist, sanders' positions were labeled t "impractical" 2016 campaign. now, he seems to be setting the

standard his democratic competitors are meased against.ac masetts senator elizabeth warren on cbs news' "face the nation." >> can-- do we describe you as a capitalist? what's the best... >> yes, i believe in markets, markets that work, markets that >> so if you get labeled aa socialist? >> well, it's just wrong. >> yang: ...and former colorado governor john hickenlooper, a moderate. >> i'm happy to say i'm a capitalist, but i think at a certain point the labels do nothing but divide us. >> yang: a new "des moines register"/cnn poll finds 56% of likely iowa democratic caucus- goers say they would be "satisfied" with a nominee who wants the country to be "more socialist." 49% back medicare-for-all 36% support egition-free co this weekend, some candidates shed winter coats of iowa and neohampshire for sunglasses appear at the south-by-southwest conferen in austin, texas. 37-year-old south bend, indiana mayor pete butgieg took a

swipe at vice president mike pence for his steadfast supporru of president. >> how would he allow himsf to become the cheerleader for the porn star presidency? is it that he stopped believing in scripture when he started believing donald trump? yang: a republican presidential longshot: former massachusetts governor bill weld also made the rounds'sn austin. hexploring a primary challenge to the president. and that brings us to politics monday. i'm join by stuart rothenberg, senior editor of inside elections, and susan page, "usa today's" washington bureau chief. susan, let me start with something that speaker pelosith toldwashington post" magazine last week, she was asked whether she supported impeaching president trump she said impeachment is so divisive to the country that unless there is something compelling, overwhelming and't bipartisan i dhink we should go down that path because

it divides the country and he's just not worth it. >> this is consistent with what she's been saying in the last though a little blunter and goes further. it's consistenta to wht jerry adler is saying. but it wilmake democrats unhappy who believe the right thing is to move ahead with impeachment proceedings. nancy pelosi lived through the bill cli won impeachmeere the housem ipeachment and the party that bore the backlash was the party that tried to impeach the president. so that's the perspective. but the democrats will be divided on this issue. >> yang: andembers of her caucus will be unhappy. >> i agree, john. basically what she's saying is the democrats want to feel good or win? manyf the younger democrats, insurgents, anti-establishment democrats just can't resis

themselves. they really want to take on the president immediately, and impeachment is the most immediate way. they just don't have any patience. the speaker has history on her side, and i think she's right. >> but, you know,ist not only a matter of being impatient. if you believe the president'sng done somet impeachable, you may feel even if we don't succeed you have a reason to impeach him. with nixon it ws evidence built over time. >> the republicans in the senate are not going along with the conviction, so impeachment would make demrats feel good, but i don't think it would patricia anything. >> yang: susan this morning "the washington post" had a look inside the relection campaign, bag rallies, data mining, and demonizing the opposition. we heard in that taped piece of what the democrats are talking

aabout, medicare for all, free college tuition. are they helping in any way,de this ate about are you a socialist or capitalist, areyi they p into that? >> the democrats will have to figure out what kind ofn coalitll defeat donald trump and they're not in agreement. some democrats like stacey abrams camepretty close to winning governor of georgia who thinks you d that by persuading and energizing core supporters. you get young people and minorities excited about your candidacy and polled proposals and get th to the polls. but the other democrats say the y we made big inroads last november is by swinging districts that are purple, who you have to swing independents or vote president sometimes. i think one ofhe thing this whatn will sort out is kind of democrats will make the best case to defeat donald trump. one thing democrats are not divided on i their fervent

desire to deny donald trump a second t >> i think democrats need swing voters and need to turn out core voters, younger voters, 18 to 29, sinificant constituencies entering the electorate that is strongly democratic, nonwhites. they need to get more of the voters but need to still hold on to suburban voters and swing voters, white women with a college degree.h so i don'tnk they have to choose one path or the other. they have to do bothih. >>is a time when a lot of cratic candidates are introducing themselves to the country. onhi kirsten gillibrand, hat a little bit of a bump. one of her biggest issues has been dealing with sexual assault and sexual harassment in the military. been pointed out by politico that a young woman on her staff unhappy about they wa her sexual harassment was

handled. >> we've had democrats and bernie sanders talk about complaints of sexual harassment but i think is hurts kien gillibrand because it's been her significant issue. for her to compaint about sexual harassment about staffer and moving the staffer to be fired only after becoming public makes her look critical. she will have to address it a forthright way to get over it. >> i agree but you only have one chance to make a first impression, and we know the senator, you know te seator, but most voters don't know the senator, and this couldbe a stumble that she could recover from eaily. elizabeth warren has recovered from her native american stumble partially or this could sink joe brand's campaign. we'll see, new polling out of

iowa, democrats have to talk about what they want. it's interesting the top two candidates are joe biden and bernie sanders, and they're the ficond choice for eacrst choice. you can't think of two candidates who are more different in a lot of ways on >> i would just say we're almost a year away from the iowa caucuses. so i don't take the line of the horse race que tstions onhe iowa poll so seriously. what struck me ant tt was the policy questions and how liberac the detic coalition is. in iowa, there is majority support for thee gren new deal which a lot couldn't define, for medicare which is a far reaching proposal. that surprised me andn idicated maybe stacey abrams' view you want to take bold positions resonates the iowa. >> you pick sanders and binds, backup choice, if you pick biden

and sanders >> yag: stu rothenberg, susan page.er >> thank youmuch. >> woodruff: now, a new fantasy novel, the first in a proposed trilogy set in a mythic africa. jeffrey brown brings us the latest entry on the newshour bookshelf, part of canvas our iegular arts and culture s >> brown: in the writer marlon james' brooklyn apartment: african masks he's collected over the years. superhero toys, and lots of books, including the comics ande fantasy sthe's long loved.ic the jamaan-born james is best isown for his literary fiction, including "a briefry of seven killings," winner of the prestigious man booker award. now comes "black leopard, red

wolf," a tale of magic, shape- shifting characters, bloody battles anfantastic adventures familiar in some ways, but through a less familiar lens >> i've also said it's almost like an afrin arabian nights, in that it's a story about stories. what happened? this man is telling you what happened and he gets very digressive along the way telling you other sorts of stories, other sorts of folktales. because if you read stke arabian nights, a story leads iny a story leads into a st leads into a story, and that's >> brown: i've seen you describe yourself as a fantasy nerd. what did that mean? >> it means i read everything. even my vocabulary of sci-fi cinema, i realized wasn't even cinema. first time i saw "return of the jedi," i was like, "oh, my god, i have never seen this and i know everything about that film ticause i've read the books! i've read the moviins and i read the comics." so, even my cinematic language was books. it was reading whatever i could

get my hands on and usuall that's stuff like comics or, again, dragon slayer, which again, was a movie tie-in. a lot of the crucial books like lord of the rings and dune i read as an adult. kitchen sink. whatever had words and i could get, i would grab it and read it. >> brown: but what was it and i whit about the fantasy genre that grabbed you and made you want to write one? >> i never took kindly to the idea that u outgrow the magical and the surreal and the fairytale and i still don't. i've always founit weird thatto you're supposeet the point where you mature beyond brothers grimm. i never did that! i never-- >> brown: yogrre supposed to up, right? >> yeah! >> brown: grow out of it? >> i never had that literary puberty and i don't want it, either! and i think because of that, i never lego of that always wanting that fantastical. i mean, i'll watch even bad fantasy lms. i don't care! just give me a sword and some

sorcery and i'll wat i think at some point, though, i did start to react to people that may being not included or erased. >> brown: people like you? >> you know, black people, people of color, being erased from those narrative or not even being in them in the first place and there's part of me that always wanted, always wished to see just one. somebody like me in a story with dragons and elves and so on. but i think there is a thrill, particularly when you are young, to see somebody like yourself in a story. >> brown: so, the stories that went into this book from african mythology, from history, where did you find it all? >> everywhere, including online. thank god for the internet! old folktales.

e ere are some folktales that i mean, i'll read ip logs. i'll read the tax records. i want to read the original information and then form my own story. my lilt care sensitivities are influenced by tulle as well as charles dickens. that's who i am and how i write. at the same time, i'm writing a novel that is trying, at least attempting to put forward a vision that is not european and is not influenced by european values, not even by european counting system. so the dilemma is: how do i use this language i atow, english, what i write in, that's what i speak, but try to come up

with something that is very foreign? if anything, the novel has to read almost like an english translation than english so, for example, some characters speak only in the present tense, even when they're talking about the past, which is also very jamaican. all our verbs in jamaican english stay present tense, regardless of tense. i thought that was just bad english.d ntasy does give me the freedom, the kind of playground, to play with all of that but also to be true to the structure ofanguages. >> brown: did you think much about how this is intendeddior, who the ce is? i mean, you've mostly had aol literarywing, i think, right? so, is this fantasy for the literary lovers? and what about the fantasy lovers? will they think it's too literary? >> you know what?

i still think i write for everybody. i put a lot of trust in the reader. i'll say, "yeah, there are parts where you might feel you're out without a paddle. don't worry, the curre coming." r, i still think i write everybody. you think people still have the attention span to read it, stay with it? >> my theory is that all thoha kids who reay potter are grown up now, so they've already read 900 page novels. i think they're ready. and if nothing else, there are good battle scenes! >> brown: all right, "black leopard, red wolf." marlon james, thanks very much! >> thank you for having me. >> woodruff: and we'll be back shortly with a look at how to

best handle moments when you fail. but first, take a moment to hear from your local pbs station. it's a chance to offer your support, which helps keep programs like ours on the air. >> woodruff: for those stationsa staying with uook at people who are saving early, living frugally and retiring young. our economics correspondent, paul solman has this encore report. >> reporter: pete adeney almost always leaves his longmont, colorado home on two wheels instead of four. it's a lot cheaper.r foven years pete, a.k.a. mr. money mustache, has been preaching parsimony on his popular blog. and he sure practicewhat he preaches. how much do you spend a year? un we don't budget but it seems to always end up a$25 to

$27,000 per year for a family of three. >> reporter: plus health insurance, in the low 30s. eney and his followers, known as mustachians, are key players in the f.i.r.e. or "fire" movement: "financial independence retire early." and we do mean early. adeney and his wife left their engineering jobs in 2005. >> so we wer30 at the time. >> reporter: mark and sina ebersole no longer have to work either. and how old are you? >> 37. >> 35. >> reporter: michael and ellen robinson, both 38, stopped agrking full-time two year >> i had this concept that saving as much as we could as early as we could would allow compound interest more time to do the work. >> reporter: how do they all do it? adeney saved 50 to 75% of his o incor nine years as an engineer. >> how much did you wind up saving? >> today would be about $1.1 million or a little bi. that was what we decided was enough to live on forever.

>> reporter: adene so-called "4% rule" on his blog: if you salt away and invest 25 times your annual spending in stocks you can then withdraw 4% of your savings each year of retirement. but isn't the market risky? >> put the money in the broad economy through index funds nsere you own thousands of companies, very covative and it's gonna fluctuate just because the stock market fluctuates, but if you're just taking a small amount each year you don't care at all about that like the stock market crashes you're still taking thur little 4%stock market goes up, you're still only taking 4%, soa that as out over time. >> reporter: don't spend money on things you don't actually need, he says. and don't drive so much. >> that's my biggest winni secret to a wealthy life, is just get out of the car a little bit.

>> this is from the loft, and you can buy that for closer t $8 instead of buying it for $50. >> as for the furniture in the home ellen shares with michael and children. >> pretty much had-me-downs. one common feature to have the fire movement, credit cards used strategically. >> so we get 6% on grocery if we use this >> so we get 6on groceries if use this card. 6% back, 3% on gas and 3% on department stores. >> reporter: restaurant visits are rare. instead, the retired robinsons spend their ample free cooking and eating at home with their kids. but wait a second, aren't there many americans who simply don't earn enough to save anything, let alone the amounts pete adeney promote >> i'm sure there are, but i ay that almost everybody can do better and the lower your income level, the greater the benefit is of figuring out where your money is going.so he median income is $60,000

or whatever in the u.s. for a household and what's the besg sellinhicle? it's a 30,000-pl f-150 pickup truck. that's the proem is we all scale everything up just a bit more than we can afford. >> reporter: but clearly not everyonean do what adeney has done. even in "retirement" adeney has earned enough from his blog that he doesn't need to stick to his $25,000 a year budget. but he doe because, he argues,co cutting umption isn't just about cost-saving. >> i would say it's immoral to drive a six-wheel esel pickup truck compared to riding a bike or just picking the most practical car for whater your needs are. >> reporter: immoral because it's polluting the atmosphere? >> yeah, it's because of your effect on other people and other living things. so like you're gonna consume a lot more metalnd a lot more fossil fuels just to carry your tiny self around. >> reporter: adeney does have followers who can't afford to stash away at mustachian levels. jackson turned out for a pop-up business school held at

mr. mustache's co-working space to learn how to earn more so she could save more and retire early-ish. >> there are many people who would like to attain that, but maybe they have to pay off debt first in order to get to the point to invest and on those kinds of things. >> reporter: and even for debt- free higher earners like mark and sina ebefiole, becoming nancially independent began as a heavy lift. >> it was pretty hard at the beginning fome. >> reporter: did you like it? a it felt a little bit li we wasting away our good years? >> reporter: tenears later the former dance instructor is grateful that she and mark, an engineer, work only when they want to. >> we're working on opening a ballroom dance hall. >> reporter: ellen robinson relishes the reward of scrimping that drives the "fire" men and women seekinpefinancial inence. >> it's not necessarily about not working, but it's the freedom that comes with not having to work.

right now my kids are four and two and i'm home with them all day, everyday annot worrying about whether or not we can buy our groceries. >> reporter: as for mr. money mustache himself... >> the goal is just to live a happy existence and maybe leave the world better than when you started. so i've done small businesses like carpentry and a lot of dad work has been my biggest occupation, a bit of writing, some music. i still have another 55 years oe rent to go and i'll let you know how that turns out. >> reporter: and for as long as i can, i'll be all ears. this is economics correspondent paul solman at mr. money mustache headquarters in longmont, colorado. >> woodruff: do you want to retire sooner than expected? we asked more folks who have done it before age 40 for their advice. you can find that on our "making

sense" page, our web site s.org/newshour. >> woodruff: new coke. the fire phone. g mistakes for coca cola and amazon, but their c.e.o.'s, and those of many other companies ve worked the concept of failure into their corporate culture. letting employees fail is seen as a way of finding the next big thing that works. novelist and professor elizabeth mccracken also sees the value, but in her humble opinion. it's the darker side of failure that ends up pushing you to success. >> lately i've been thinking about failure. for instance: it's a pet peeve of mine when people say that anh honor habled them." it hasn't. by what definition could that happen?u ght mean that you think you should remain humble in the face of an honor, and sure, why not, but it doesn't actually humble you.

failure, on the other hand, tends to humble people. which is right and also good. because only when you fail can eyou stand up and assess damage and then get re furious, and then vow revenge. creative writing, and i always tell my students that revenge is greatwrotivation for ing. like, the problem is i'm harder on myself than anyone else is. this is never true. or else: my problem is that i'm a perfectionist. to which i always say, oh, you don't like failing in public, unlike the rest of us? sometimes we forget failure is actually good for you. your immune system needs a bit of if you recall in orbedder to be inoculated against further failure. the antibodies fairlureduces

aren't pretty but they are motivating -- ngeance, lieu brings. my most successful students have already failed. maybe they didt get into graduate school the first time. maybe they were rejected by a bunch of agents. auybe they started a completely different career b their parents didn't want them to be writers. and failure instilled in them a particular feeling: no commitment to their art, or a sense of peace about their fate, "i thought," one student of mine said, just before she sold her novel, "i'll show them." we often think that the best work comes from a place ofeq librium and support, but the thing is: equilibrium is pretty statereas a well- nourished, very private feeling of revenge has enough heat and light to power city, never mind a novel. it's almost heartwarmi: sometimes, when you think, i'll show them, the them you end up showing is yourself.

>> woodruff: and that's the newshour for tonight i'm judy woodruff. join us online and again here tomorrow evening. for all of us at the pbs newshour, thank you and see you soon. >> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> babbel. a language app that teaches real-life conversations in a new language, like spanish, french, german, italian, a's more. babb0-15 minute lessons are available as an app, or online. more information on babbel.com. b >> athe alfred p. sloan foundation. supporting science, technology, and improved economic performance and financial literacy in the 21st century. >> supported by the john d. and catherine t. macarthur

foundation. committed to building a more just, verdant and peaceful world. more information at macfound.org >> and with the ongoing support of these institutions >> this program was maib po by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. captioning sponsored by newshour productions, ll captioned by media access group at wgbh acce.wgbh.org

hello, everyone, and welcome to "amanpour & company." here's wt's coming up. it's international women's day and these are our guests. congresswomen paul and debbie dingell tell me why the time is now for universal health care in america. "game of thrones" actress lena headey takes on a new chalnge, the fragile mental health of refugees. and harvard's first female president drew faust tells our lter isaacson how she overcame this warning. >> my mother said to, it's a man's world, sweetie, and the sooner you learn that, the better off you'll be.