ngcaptioniponsored by newshour productions, llc >> woodruff: good evening, i'm jy odruff. on the newshour tonight, kirstjen nielsen is out as ecsecretary of homeland surity. what this means for the department and the trump administration's actions on immigration. then, we are on the ground in israel, as prime minister be record fifth term in the face of legal troubles. and, one of america's leading historians, robert caro, on the four decades of work he's done on the multi-volume biography "the years of lyndon johon." >> you know, when i was a newspaper man, i rememi hated having to write an article while there was still questions i wanted to ask. when i started to do books, ita just sed to say, i don't want to start writing until i've got all my questions answered,

and it takes a long time. >> woodruff: all that and more on tonight's pbs newshour. >> ma >> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ moving our earnomy for 160 bnsf, the engine that connects us. >> babbel. a language app that teaches real-life conversations in a new language, like spanish, french, german, italian, and more. babbel's 10-15 minute lessons are available as an app, or online. more information on babbel.com. babbel.com.

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>> woodruff: the shakeup in the esump administration conti with the latest departure of a cabinet member, leaving a number of key as with acting leers. amna nawaz reports. >> nawaz: with president trump increasingly frustrated at growing numbers of families and children crossg the border, homeland security secretary kirstjen nielsen, department of often on the receiving end of that frustration, resigned from her role sunday evening. today, she spoke briefly outside her virginia home. >> i just want to thank the president agaifor the tremendous opportunity. >> nawaz: in a state yesterday, nielsen said she hopes her successor "will have the supporongress and the courts in fixing laws which have impe secure america's borders..." nielsen had helm some of the trump administration's most

aggressive immigration efforts, like separating migrant children from their families under the "zero tolerance" policy. an estimated 2700 children were ted between october 2017 and may 2018. the president ended zero tolerance by executive order that june. but it was nielsen who fielded fiestions about the policy in a december 2018 housjudiciary hearing. >> i'm not a liar. we've never had a policy for family separation. the policy of family separation would mean that any family tret i encounin the interior i would separate. it would mean any family i encountered at a port of entry i would separate. it wean every single family i would have found illegally crossing the border we would separate. we did none of those. >> nawaz: three months later, before a house homeland security hearing, nielsen's answer had olved. >> it's not a policy, it's the law. we enforce the law. >> nawaza number of legal challenges, including one federal judge ordering and overseeing family reunifications, are still unfolding, and the full scope of

separations is still unknown. nielsen's d.h.s. tenure al comprised a "hardening" of the thousands of national guardsting troops as back-up in 2018, and billions in emgency funds for e border wall, also forcing legal asylum seekers to it in mexico while their cases unfold in the u.s., and limiting the number who can legally enter in the first place, leaving g ndreds of families sleep the streets as they wait their turns outside ports of entry. also on her watch? november 2018 incident i which border patrol agents fired tear gas into a group of migrants in mexico just last week, president trump ielsen as she capped off a three-day border tour still pushing the administration's hardline immigration policies. after her sunday resignation, the president announced sunday that customs and border protection commissioner kevin mcaleenan will become th sacting d.h.retary. mcaleenan spent years on the ational side of america' immigration debates.

his selection to run the entire agency now putarper focus on a key priority for president trump. >> woodruff: and amna nawaz joins house correspondent yamiche alcindor. hello to both of you. so, am, we just got news, a federal district judge in californiaas ruled that the president's asylum policy, which you referred to in that piece, is not g to issue an injunction friday. what does this mean? >> it means the prt's policy called the migrant protection protocol forces lega in mexico while their case unfolds in the u.s. they wanted to roll it out athacross the rest of the border in addition to the three points entry. >> woodruff: one more legal wrirchg fortunately them. yamiche, it is clear, the resignation of the homeland security secretary comes at a time with a lot of turmoil, legachallenges. what does her forced leaving mean for immigration policy?

>> well, for months, president trump was signaling that he was not happy with the leadership of secretary neilson. shdwas seen as someone who not have a lot of allies in the white house. former head of d.h.s. general john kelly is the person who reded her for the job. but a top aide to the president said shet forcibly talking about the president's administrationenough and someone as not seen nding the alarm of this law as a national emergency. i a larger pictuthis trump administration, sources tell me, is pushing the limits on what's legal for immigration policy. so a source within d.h.s. told me today the president wants do thint are simply illegal, that's why he's having the courtroobavjts there is the family separation of immigrant, the denying of asylum entrance at ports of entry and

niying you can't come, ret asylum seekers to mexico and sometimes native countries. not all of these policies have been rolle at the table when secretary nielsen and vice president pence have talked about these things and think these are the best ways to protect america. the white house says these are legal but that's not what the courts are saying. >> woodruff: with secretary nielsen gone, how doeshat affect the administration's ability to do what the president wants? >> i think it will come down to whether or not the person who takes secretary nielsen's job will go farther. nielsen became the face of all sorts of controversial immigration policies. we'll see if her replacement is ell liked than she was. >> woodruff: back to you, amnapresident is saying things like the country is full, that we don' any more immigrants. what kind of policy are we talking about? >> yeah, look, there's a number of policies the administration could still legally puf they wanted.

they could go back to family separation. theyere still separating wit a lower bar than prosecuted for immigratioviolations. they keep ringing the bell, saying something has to change because it's so bad, the situation going to get worse and worse. it'sdy very bad. we have to remember detention ,facilities are overcrowd conditions are bad for vulnerable families and children. we haven't been too far away from the date when two migrant children died in u.sgovernment custody. we have women giving birth in u.s. government custody. the number of miscarriages have gone up. the situation is actually still very bad and if we continue to push some of these policies, if the administration says we're ing to push back some of the vulnerable communities, the argument is you're making them more vulnerable in the process. >> woodruff: i want to ask you about the man the president says he wants ttake over for the time being as the head of homeland security.

there's a question about whether that can happen, kevin mcaleenan. at do we know? >> so kevin mcaleenan is a 47-yd, came up through the r border agency, worked une obama administration, highly decorated, respected, well liked, all my sosay he knows what he's talking about. he has operationalarxperience. i he phrase "he's a good guy" a lot. but this good guy, let's not forget, was basically the tip of the spheres when it came to a lot of the policies we saw kirstjen nielsen as the face of. family separation, those were agents doing the spraight. paso last week, he held press conference with a group of families and children behind a razor wire fence and sleeping on rocks under an overpass. saying i can be tougher when i need to be. the question is can he be tough enough the president continues to like him.uf >> woo we'll see whether that nomination or appointment

goes forward, i should say. amna nawaz, yamiche alcindor, the story keeps going. thank you both. there still another major departure in the trump administration today: u.s. secret service director randolph "tex" alles is leaving his post. alles is a former marine general who previously served in customs and border protection. president trump has picked career secret service ofcial james murray as his replacement. the white hoe said alles will th leaving shortly, though the agency said later he would leave trin may. thp administration has designated iran's revolutionary guard asreign terrorist organization." he's the firstthe u.s. has branded part of another government in that way. the i.r.g.c.paramilitary group formed after iran's 1979 revo to defend the government. but u.s. secretary of state mike pompeo said it has a long history of terror.

>> for 40 years the islamic republic's revolutionary gua corps has actively engaged in terrorism and created, supported and directed other terrorist groups. the i.r.g.c. masquerades as a legitimate military organization, but none of us should be fooled. >> woodruff: the classification includ. sanctions that will take effect in one week. in turn, iran's securityouncil today put u.s. forces on iran's list of terrorist groups. we'll take a deeper look at the significance of today's move later in the program. three u.s. service members and an amecan contractor died today in afghanistan. pentagon officials said they were killed by an improvised explosive device near bagram air base, north of kabul. three other u.s. serviceembers were wounded. the taliban claimed sponsibility. activists in sudan say attempts byity forces to quash a

sit-in protest set off widespread violence today. protesters were demanding president omar al-bashir step down. a soldier was killed trying to protect them. it happened in khartoum, where at least six people have died in clashes since saturday. online video from the weekend showed thousands massed outside the defe largest rallies since they began in december. in libya, the deh toll from fighting between rival libyan factio topped 50 people, as eastern libyan forces struck tripoli's only functioning airport. they're battling troops aligned with the u.n.-backed government to take control of the capital city. the ppealed for an "immediate truce", while the european union's top diplomat admitted the situation was deteriorating: >> definitely not going in the right direction. the responsibility tha on our shoulders on showing unity

and responsibility in this moment in support to the u.n. efforts is extreme. >> woodruff: the u.n. estimates at least 2,800 peoplhave been forced to flee the violence in tripoli. the u.s. also temporarily withdrew some american troops amidbahe fighting. in this country, 13 parents ensnared in a nationwide college admi bribery case have agreed to atead guilty. ncludes former "desperate housewives" actress felicity huffman. she's accused of paying a consultant $15,000 to boost her daughter's s.a.t. score. 33 parents are charged in the multi-million dollar scheme to get their children into selective universities. stocks were mixed on wall street today. the nes industrial average lost 84 points to close at 26,341. the nasdaq rose 15 pois, and

the s&p 500 added three. and the baylor lady bears are celebrating their n.c.a.a. women's basketball championship win. they narrowly beat out defending champions notre dame last night, in an 82 to 81 victory. baylor's chloe jacksonve the game-winning layup with just 3.9 seconds left on ine clock, earnthe team its first onship title in seven years. still to comon the newshour: the chairman of the u.s. house homeland security committee on kirstjen nielsen's resignation. the u.s. designates a branch of iran's military as a terrorist organizaon. a report from israel ahead of tomorrow's election, and much more.

>> woodruff: we return now to our top story: secretary kirstjen nielsen's resignation and the fallout. psrepresentative bennie th of mississippi is the chairman of the.s. house homeland security committee and he joins us now. chairman, welcome. what is your reaction to her departure? >> well, it was not totally unexpected. a lot of us had lost confidence inecretary nielsen's leadership. we understand. it's a difficult job. but she asked for it, she had an opportunity, and she failed. >> woodruff: youinaid yesterda tweet that her tenure aland security had been a disaster. what would you you add to that no >> well, i would say, if you consider putting children in cages, if you consider separating children from families, if you consider not recognizing the asylum laws that

congress has passed here in the united states, and a lot of other things that go against the values of who we are as americans, then i would say that it was time for her to go. you know, it's not sole secretary nielsen. this has to go to the white house. president trump's administration has picked on immigrants fro day one. he continues to do that. we can't tell peopare full, go back. that's not who we are as americans. >> woodruff:ow do you think is move, bringing someone else, whoever it is, in to be the permanent replacement, or as long as they'll stay, for her is going to change administration policy? and i want to ask you that, chairman thompson, in the context of this federal judge ruling late today out of california that the asylum policy that the trump administration wanted, wherein people seeking asylum had to wait in mexico, the judge is

saying that's not going to take place. >> well -- >> woodruff: go ahead. >> thank you very much. well, this is antrump interpretation of the law. the law is very clear with respect to how we treat people who get to our borders. our law mexico and wait.ack in our laws say we have to acknowledge you when you get here, and we put you in a process to make sure we examine, within the fullest extent of the law, exactly what is being considered. 'm not surprised at the judgcision, in america, the three branches of government are co-e anytime there is a dispute, we take them to the courts. it just appears that every time we go to court, challenges some of these policies, the people win, and that's why we are a

democracy. this is not trumpville. this is the ited states of america. >> woodruff: well, the president continues, as you know, he tougher immigration policies. he says the country is full. he said, over the last few day, he's calling on congress to tighten laws further. what's going to happen? i mean, if the democratic majority in the use is where you are, the president is where he is, what's going to happen? ell, my invitation to the president is, if you genuinely want to work out a bipartisan soluti problem, let's sit down and talk. we shouldn't be tweeting to each other, you shouldn't be firing your leaders because they won't do what you say, even if it's tainst the law. let's sit down ak. as a democratic chair of homeland security, i'm ready to talk. but we can talk together. but if he thinks he can just

come and lecture democrats and go home, that's not how a bill becomes law. you have to engage each other. we have to share our differences. we have to share what our beliefs are, and theork together on that. so i encourage the president to come forward with whatever issues he might have, and we'll work on that. >> woodruff: as eru know, now are a number of vacancies, people in acting positions. the president is moving the head of customs and boarder patrol over into the short term that adds to the vacancies there. is all this going to have an effect on the policies of the >> not only will it have impact on the policies of the country, but can you imagine, from a leadershipective, those 220,000 employees of the department of homeland security, they don't know from one day to the next, now, who's in charge.

now, there's a question about the president's appointment to be the temporary head of the department, whor not that's consistent with our law. so we still might have somebody else in charge on wednesday. so, clearly, the president has to exhibit real leadership and not just throwing fits because h he's not getti way. that's notou govern. >> woodruff: representative bennie thompson, chairman of the house homeland security committee, thank you very much. >> thank you. >> woodruff: we return to the designation by the u.s. of oran's revolutionary guard as a foreign terrorisnization. as nick schifrin reports, it's

one more step in the administration's ongoing pressure campaign agait the islamic republic. >> schifrin: the islamic revolutionary guard corps is iran's most elite and influential military for. it describes itself as the custodian of the islamic revolution, and has strong connections with iran's regime. and today the u.s. did something it's never done before: designate the i.r.g.c., an enf another government, a terrorist organization. >> we're doing it because the iranian regime's use of terrorism as a tool of statecraft makes it fundamy different from any other government. this historic step will deprive the world's leading stere sponsor ofr the financial ndmeans to spread misery aeath around the world. se schifrin: the u.s. accus the i.r.g.c. and its quds force of supporting iranian proxies such as hezbollah, that have launched terrorist attacks across the region, overseeing iran's ballistic missile program, the largest, n the regionand supporting groups at

the height of the iraqmoar that kille than 600 u.s. troops. but the i.r.g.c.ready one of the world's most heavily sanctioned entities. the i.r.g.c. is intertin iran's economy, and today's designation increases the punishment for anyone doing business with thys special representative for iran brian hook. >> we are trying to make the i.r.g.c. and the quds force radioactive for any company around the world that's thinking anybody who is providing r.g.c.al support to the or the quds force faces criminal prosecution and a jail sentence of up to 20 year >> schifrin: today iran responded in kind. its supreme nationality council called the move "illegal" and designated u.s. central command, which oversees all troops in the middle east, a "supporter of terrorism." centcom deploys tens of thousands of troops, including those currently in afghanistan an. and critics of today's declaration say those troops

could be at greater risk. >> both the obama administration as well as the bush administration toward the end were actually trying to find a way to reduce the risk of any confrontation th iran in iraq, or afghanistan. now we've taken a significant st likely. making it more >> schifrin: trita parsi is a georgetown adjunct profeor and s the president of the national iranian america council. he argues that in iraq since 2011, iranian troos. worked near roops, against a mutual enemy: isis. he fears todeclaration reduces chances for cooperation, and increases the chof conflict in the present and future. >> whatrump is doing now, which will have long-term national interests, is that he's for diplomacy with iran, that future administrationsill then suffer from, because when th

>> schifrin: but the trump administration blames iranian has pursued a maximum pressure campaign, puing out of the iran nuclear deal, and sanctioning nearly 1000 iranian people and corporations. >> there's already conflict. this regime, for 40 years, has been in conflict with the united states. we are not changything in that equation. we are hoping to get a new and better deal to replace the iran nuclear deal. >> schifrin: the appeal for iran negotiate under u.s. pre-condition digsrdgs becomes to swallow. >> an action like today makes next to impossible to pursue acy with iran at least b the administration that puts this decision into place. thinking that one can go at it using this path an making

it possible to diplomacy is somewhat ludicrous. >> in iran, the hard liners are gaining strength. u.s. vows pore pressure. the two sides face a cycle of escalation and tension. for the "pbs for the pbs newshour, i'm nick schifrin. >> woodruff: israel and iran are long-time foes, and netanyahu tweeted to president trump in hebrew, thank you for responding to another important request of mine which serves the interests of our countries and countries of the region. as it happens, israel holds hotly contested elections tomorrow that will decide whether netanyahu wins another term as we sent john yang to find out what's at stake for the nation, and for the political and personal fortunes of netanyahu himself.

>> yang: less than 24 hours before israeli polls open, prime minister benjamin netanyahu ted voters in jerusalem's main market. in the campaign's closing days, he has made full use of the stature and perks of office, meeting with russian president vladimir putin in moscow, lay to rest the returned remains of an israeli soldier killed in lebanon in 1982, and, just this weekend, reversing course to say that the time is right for israel to annex parts of the west bank. israelis have a term for netanyahu's last-minute pre- election surprises: they call it his "gevalt campaign," using the yiddish expression of alarm. netanyahu and his center-right likud party have dominated israeli politics during his te straight years in office. now he faces his toughest re- election challenger yet. he's benny gantz, who led

supporters on motorcycles on his final day of campaigning. gantz is a retired israeli army general and served as army chief of staff under netanyahu during the 2014 gaza war. >> after ten years, there is ddenly an alternative. >> yang: dana weiss is chief politial correspdent for israel's channel 12. >> when people are asking approval rates, who is fit to be ime minister, for the first time there is a tie between prime minister netanyahu and the person who is standi against him. >> yang: gantz leads a center- right coalition that includes other former army chiefs of staff: gabi ashkenazi and moshe ya'alon, who also served as netanys defense minister. they hope thcombined military experience offsets netanyahu's reputation as israel's "miecurity." >> on my watch, iranenill not thresrael by taking over sryia, lebanon or the gaza strip. nor will it undermine pragmatic regi in the middle east.

on my watch, iran will not have nuclear weapons. >> yang: netanyahu trumpets his close alliance with president tr the president has boosted his israeli counterpart's standi by moving the u.s. embassy to jerusalem, cutting aid to the palestinians. and, during a white house visit just two weeks before the election, recognizing israeli sovereignty over the golan heights, which israel seized from syria in the 1967 war. the white house even agreed to release it's likely controversial middle east peace plan after the election so it would not become an ise. >> mr. president, over the years israel has been blessed to have many friends who sat in the oval office, but israelas never had a better friend than you. >> yang: but analysts say row's vote could be ald be referendum on the effect on the referendum on the effect on the

nation of netanyahu's policies and politiich some call divisive. >> it' international relationship, it's not even the economy. it's what he is doing to society inside israel-- us against them, against the elites, against the left, against the liberals, againsarabs-- in order to stay in power. >> yang: listen to anti- netanyahu voters at jerusalem's main market. rachel ben-schlomo is a physical therapist, and undecided, except about netanyahu. >> i want a change and wanting tomething that will contribute to the society living. not only the security all the time. >> yang: rochali kashivitsky says she will vote for the once powerful left-wing labor party. she used netanyahukname >> no, no, no, no, not bibi. i want somebody that think about the people, that take care about the people >> yang: netanyahu supporters

say they before he was prime minister, when the economy was slumping and palestinian suicide bombers were attacking israeli buses-- the issue responsible for his firsrow 1996 election as prime minister. >> ( translated ): i don't believe that someone else can come in and improve. in my opin bibi is the right man in the right place. >> yang: in this campaign season, the market sees some good-natured debates. dozens of rties are fielding candidates for the 120-seat ature, called the knesset. some are very small and very extreme. itamar ben-gvir, leader of the far-right, anti-arab party caed "jewish power," did a little retail politicking at the market. the minor parties' results could be very important. polls show voters closely divided between gantneand nyahu. both parties could end up with

roughly the same number of seats in the knesset, which would give small parties an outsized influence in forming a coalition government. analysts say netanyahu's task of coalition building could be complicated by looming corruption indictments. in february, torney general, a netanyahu appointee, said he trading official favors for positive news coveragend for hundreds of thousands of dollars of cigars, jewelry and champagne. >> ( translated ): i intend to serve you and the country as prime minister for many re years. don't believe all the spin. >> yang: netanyahu denies the charges and says it's a left- wing "political persecution." while the announcement did not move netanyahu's poll numbers, gantz is trying to make it an issue. >> ( translated ): the mere notion that in israel a prime minister c remain in office while under indictment is ridiculous in my view - it won't happen.

>> yang: re-election could be netanyahu's stt protection from prosecution and he would demand that coalitioners help him, suggests dana weiss >> this coalition is what we nll the indictment coalit because prime minister netanyahu is going to make sure, "you want to join my party? please give me your promise that you're going to give me what it takes to make sure don't have go through my legal procedures." >> yang: and netyahu refuses to rule out seeking legislation that would outlaw the indictment of a sitting prime minister. >> this is going to be very complicated. >> yang: ronen b writes for israel's largest newspaper and is author of "rise and kill first," about the country's ofstory of targeting killings. >> not all of these parties, maybe not even one of them, would agree to go for something that would be even by their base, by their constituency, as a break kind of lawful legal persecution of the law.

>> yang: while the campaign is the subject of intense interest in israel, just a short drive away, it is largely ignored. in the past, iaeli elections were closely watched on the s of the palestinian wes bank for clues about the future of the peace process. t this time. >> there is no partner for the peace process with the palest in israel. nt yang: ghassan khatib is a political sct at birzeit university in the west bank and a former palestinian peace negotiator. >> the issue of the palestinian- israeli relations is not a major issue in this election at all because the major parties in this election are in agreement over the need to continue the israeli occupation over the paian territories, west bank. it's wise to expect that the current status quo is going to continue for a long while.

and i think the palestinians are learning that there is no solution in the horizon. >> yang: in israel, despite netanyahu's standing in the polls, few are counting him out. >> he's the best campaigner and the best spier and the best politician in israel by far. he understands the system. he understsraeli electorate. he understands the publi he understands israeli psyche and israeli mindset. he understands what he needs to do in the last few weeks, the last few day in order to get these small fractions of votes that will give him the next ion. >> yang: and he may need all those skills in order to fend off benny gantz and win a fourth consecutive term leading israel. r the pbs newshour, i'm john yang in jerusalem.

>> woodruff: stay with coming up on the newshour: amy walter and tamara keith analyze the race for 2020. and historian robert caro on erronicling political power. it was anousy weekend on the campaign trail wh candidates criss-crossing the nation to pitch themselves as the one person who can beat president trump. lijardins brings us up to speed. >> we are going to bring the american people together: >> desjardins: in their effort to push gainst president trump, 2020 democrats are trying out a simple message: all are welcome. including the newest entnt, ohio congressman tim ryan kicked off his presidential bidn home district, also working class, rust belt teitory of youngstown. >> because a divided country is

a weak country and we have politicians and leaders in america today that want to divide us. >> desjardins: for pete buttigieg, the outreach was a challenge to discrimination. at an l.g.b.t.q. community event in washington, d.c., he described coming out as gay while running for reelection as mayor of south bend indiana, and >> i can tell you thme being gay was a choice, it was a that was made far, far above my paygrade. and that's the thing i wish the mike pences of the world would understand. that if you've got a probl y with who i aour problem is not with me. quarrel, sir, is with my creator. >> desjardins: meante, president and candidate trump is reaching out too, to jewish americans. ca touted his pro-israel actions at the republijewish coalition in las vegas saturday. but immigration, and the u.s. asylum laws, were alsoe president's mind.

>> and the asylum program is a scam. some of the roughest people you've ever seen. >> desjardins:r. trump went on to imitate a hypothetical attorney seeking asylum for an imt at the southern border. >> asylum, oh, give him asylum, he's afraid. he's afraid. we don't love the fact that he's got tattoos on his face. that's not a good sign. we don't love the fact that he's carrying the flag of honduras or guatemala or el salvador, only to say he's petrified to be in his country. >> desjardins: combined with the resignation of homeland security secretary kirstj nielsen has proven quick fodder for the democratic hopefuls. massachusetts senator elizabeth tirren said nielsen should be ashamed for sepa families one of the sharpest reactions came from former hud secretary julian castro who wrote that trump wants to illegally end the

asylum system. the dispute at and over the border ces to rise in the fight for the white house itself. for the pbs newshour, i'm lidi desj. >> woodruff: and that brgs us to politics monday. i'm back with our regular duo, amy walter of the cook political report and host of "politics with amy walter" on wnyc radio. and tamara keith of npr, co-host of "npr politics." hello, duo. >> hi. >> woodruff: how do you like that? >> i like it a lot. >> woodruff: let's talk about, interesting what we heard, tam, from pete buttigieg, talking openly for the first time we've seen in this season about his decision to come out as gay as a young person and making th religious connection. what do we make of that? >> he as a candidate has found to a way to present himself as ren-threatening, to present his -ton in a way that comes off

as neatening and to couch his gay marriage with his husband in religious terms, to say that it brought him closer to god. he's not a very well known guy. he is the mayor of south bend, indiana, and he has gotten a lot of attention, though. as i have been traveling around the country, the candidate that people ask me about the most is pete buttigieg. what do you think of this mayor pete guy, again, again i keep hearing it. >> the democrats want to fall in love with someone, be spired by somebody and don't know who, but pete buttigieg is capturing their attention t because, like the speech, the authenticity is palpable. here he is, no discussing coming out, running as an openly gay candidate,n the speech he talks about being a young person and saying if i could have take

an pill to get rid of whatever gay was in there, i would have done it, that's how sort of ashamed i was of who i am. so there is this realness you don't hear from candidates. it also speaks to where we are at this point in politics and what certain voters are looking for on the democratic side, someone not to say i'm a demi god, i'm so impressive, that's why you should elect me, i'm so much bette it's i'm so much about you. the final thing about the values argument, judy, is this is the other piece of the argument he makes, not just in this speech but every other, which is republicans een on the offense of values, democrats ve been on the defense. we need to take the issue back. we have been playing on trump need tthe republicans' groo long, we need to be the party of values. >> w has been brig up.me he >> that's right. >> woodruff: tam, you were with a groupf voters in iowa talking to them about the 2020 democrats. what are y hearing? >> yeah, and these were young voters, sat down with nine of

themn extended conversation, to really understand where their minds are. in iowa, they've already met numerous presidential candidates, alof them, because at's what happens when you're a voter in iowa. and, you know, the fascinating haing was that five of the said that, in 2016, they gave money to bernie sanders. now, some of that was wanted to get a sticker, they were too young to vote, but they were bernie fans. this time, thearen't planning to caucus for bernie at this point. only one person said that she planned to caucus for nders. they were excited aboubeto o'rourke, they were excited about buttigieg. the other thing that was fascinating is most of the ople we were talking to were young women, yet, the female candidates were not getting attention in this conversation. only one was saying she was thinking of caucuses for harris. >> woodruff: a desiesh for something new and something male. >> and this is the challenge for

bernie sanders going forward. he was contrast between he and hillary clinton was so in 2016. >> woodruff: with just the two he them. >> just the two of now many people are trying to get that mantle. the one fference between bernie sanders and everybody else in thfield, maybe with the exception of elizabeth warren, is he is runng as a revolutionary, and the others are runng really sort of as restorative candidates. you hear this fromiden, buttigieg, others, the stale of talking ab place where we could care about each other, where we are willing to look beyond our differences, versuse want to upend the entire system which is the warren, bernie sanders, the system in itself is corrupted and must be replaced, and that tension, i think, is a

significant one, but i do think that part of the party that wants a real revolution, they're going to stick with bernie sanders. the question is how big of a universe is that, and if that core that he has sticks with him, that he has right now in polling sticks with him enough so that he builds up enough delegates especially early in the game that he remai a factor. >> woodruff: and interesting contrast in their approach tp president trd his own kind is revolutionary. >> exactly. woodruff: do you want t emulate that or go in a kinder, gentler direction. >> do you want to knock the house down or gut it and keep the frame or do dou want to just he bathroom. >> woodruff: or something. yes. >> woodruff: tam, quickly, to the president and speaking of ing things up, immigration policy, the president's on a tear, he wants a tougher immigration policy, he's getting rid ofhe second homeland security secretary in a row.

clearly, this appeals to, he thinks, his base of supporters, but is it going tol to anybody else? >> not necessarily, but i don't think he's worried anybody else. he's worried about a bad number coming out from march that says something ke 100,000 border crossers occurred, and the trend not going in the direction that he wants to go. he ran on i'm going to fix this thing and, at the moment, it doesn't look fixed. so he's doing a lot of things where he's signaling, yes, the numbers do not look od but i'm on it. he shut the government down over it, did the emergency claration over the wall, and now we don't know her it was a firing or resignation under fire or whatever you want to call it, but his homeland security secretary is gone and hets shaking things up in t department signaling, yes, he knows he made the promise anng it's not looike it's going to be kept but he can run on it anyway. >> woodruff: smart

politically? >> what democrats will argue is, you know, we would be happy to make the case in 2020 that his immigration policies, especially separating families, are a topic, right. it's the president wants to talk ab is fulfilling his promises or he won in 2016 because heves in immigration, he is going to lose 2020 by the way he has gone about trying to implement his policies. >> woodruff: we don't want to wait to find out what the answer is. you want the answer now, to know whether it's going to work or not. so much time. so much time. we do, amy walteamera keith, the duo. thank you. >> thank you. >> woodruff: now jeffrey brown sits down with one of the nation's preeminent biographers, robert caro. the fifth and final volume of his massive series, "the years

of lyndon johnson," focuses on l.b.j.'s presidency and the vietnam war. but it's publication is not expected for at least another year. in the meantime, caro has written a memoir about what he does. it's simply titled, "working." part of our ongoing arts and culture series, canvas. >> brown: "power reveals"-- two words on the wall of an office in midtown manhattan. >> you do all the research aer then you sitand you say, what is this book about? is is the inner sanctum of one of the nation's leading historns, robert caro, now sharing some of the lessons he's learned over a more than x decade career. >> i learned it book by book as i went a said, well, i think i've learned some stuff, and i just want to pass it along, not as advice, but as one reporters, you know, people who are trying to find out the truth about things. >>kirown: caro began his wor life in the 1950s and '60s as a

reporter inclung for "newsday." his first book, "the power broker", published in 1974, chronicled how an unelected oftcial, master builder rob moses, became the most powerful re in new york and shape the city's destiny. since 1977, caro has been writing "the years of lyndon johnson," four books have en published and the fifth and final volume has been his labor of love for 10 years. along the way, he's won two pulitzer prizes and two national book awards, and gained a reputa for dogged research, brilliant analysis, ore than 40 years into the johnson project, giving his workheall the timeneed. >> you know, when i was a newspaper man, i remember i hated having to write an article while there was still questions i wanted to ask. when i started to do books, i just started t i don't want to start writing until i've got all my questions answered,

and it takes a long time. >> but do you ever have all your questions answered? >> no. (laughs) >> brown: w, at 83, caro is out with something different, a book of new essays and earlier pieces that take us bend the scenes of his work. it's called "working: reseg, interviewing, writing." one insight: the man considered a leading biographer doesn't think he's writing biographies at all. >> i never had any interest in telling the life of a great man. i think of them as studies in political power. >> brown: and what does power mean to you? >> it's got such an influence on all our lives that people don't think about, from social security ancare, to where is a bridge located or a ghway located, what happened it's what government can do for , both for good and for ill.

>> brownso: the unelected but hugely powerful robert moses. ing the nation's largest city for more than 40 years without any public accountability. and lyndon johnson, rising from dirt-poor ranching country in texas,irst elected to the house of representatives, congress in what caro shows was a rigged election, a 'master of the senate' asity leader and president who forged major civil rights and other legislation before being brought down by the catastrophe of canowledges his author vietnam. wife, ina, the only person who helped research his books. and the coprooted life in new york to live in the hill country of texas to bett understand the place and people who shaped johnson. >> i said to ina, my wife, 'you know, i'm not understanding these people, and therefore i'm not understanding lyndon johnson. we're going to have to move here'.

ina said, she loves ance, she said, 'why can't you do a biography of napoleon?' but we moved there. >> brown: in the l.b.j. library in austin, caro did, as muchs humanly possible, what an earlier editor had told him: "turn every page"-- that is, look at evcument, even if it seems irrelevant. only years later does the writing begin. >> i write a lot of drafts by hand on this white legal pad, and write a lorafts on the typewriter. >> brown: an old smith corona. >> they stopped making that smith corona 25 years ago. >> brown: on the walls of his office: pages of the latt chapter he's working on for the fifth and final volume on johnson. >> this is, right now he's appointing thurgood marshall to the supreme court, so i'm writing a line where i'm going to say, 'thurgood maighall said it, you didn't wait for the times, mister president, you made the times.' >> brown: in an adjacem, just some of the hundreds of files of interviews, clippings

and notes gathered over the years. and more i into how caro works. >> i take the interviews in a stenographer's notebook, and my rule is that i type it up every night before i go to bed, no matter how tired i am, because i want to remember the eression on the face. >> brown: the exprsion on the face? so, that kind of detail. ea yeah, yeah, i think you a lot. >> brown: all together: a kind of master class in interviewing, reporting, researching, writg. and, perhaps most relevant to todas how to think about fact and truth. >> there is no truth. it's just ridiculous. but there are, let's say you ed to find out how lyndon johnson ran the senate as a majority leader. f the mots about that, the more you finwhat did he do with the unanimous consent agreements, who did he put on

committees, how did he change the seniority system, and a thousand facts. the more of those facts you get, if you just describe the facts, oser you're coming to whatever truth there is. rown: are you concerned today watching what's happening with facts being contest everywhere you go? >> yes. i don't think there's anything more serious for a demracy than what's happening right no where, for many reasons, we're losing belief in facts and truth. >> brown: what's lost? >> well, if you have no confidence that anything is true or correct, what does a democracy base its actions on? >> brown: robert caro's book, "working" is out now. as to volume five of his epic l.b.j. biography?

we saw the final pages, but only at a distance. caro told us we too will have to wait. for the pbs newshour, i'm jeffrey brown in new york. >> woodruff: tonight on pbs, independent lens presents a mentary about rural heal care in america. "the providers" explores the relationship between dedicated medical professionals and rural americans that would otherwise be left bey the u.s. health care system. "the providers" airs later s stations.most and that's the newshour for tonight. i'm judy woodruff. join us online and a tomorrow evening. for all of us at the pbs newshour, thank you and see you soon. >> major funding for the pbs newshour has bovided by:

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