captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc >> woodruff: good evening. i'm judy woodruff. on the newshour tonight: thousands march in hong kong, to protest a new law that stokes fear that it will silence critics of china's government. then, investigators determine an electsmrical trsion line was the cause of the deadliest fire in california history. omplus, democratic congres tulsi gabbard discusses her run for the white house, whilehi markds and david brooks analyze the latest in the e and more.l r and, game over. the smash hit hbo show "game of thrones" comes to an end this weekend. we examine what made the shchow sensation. all that and more, on tonight's pbs newshour.

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aluminum tariffs on canada and mexicobi in to ease trade tensions with its north american neighbors. president trump made the announcement this afternoon. canada and mexico will, in turn, scrap planned retaliatory tariffs on the u.s. in washington, mr. trump said he hope roadblock to passing the u.s.- mexico-canada trade agreement. >> that deal is going to be a fantastic deal for our country, and hopefully congress will approve the u.s.m.c.a. quickly, en the great farmers, and manufacturers, and steel plants will make our economy even more successful than it alrea is. >> woodruff: canadian prime minister justin trudeau called the move "terrife,." meanwhresident trump also said that he is delaying for simonths a decision on imposing tariffs on imported cars and auto parts. that will buy more time for trade negotiations withhe

european union and with japan. missouri has become the latest state to approve a restrictive abortion bill. its republican-led state house passed the ban on thedure at eight weeks of pregnancy. it allows exceptions for medical s ergencies, but not in caof rape or incest. the state's republican governor has pledged to sign it. od an investigative report released today o state university has found that a former team doctor sex abused at least 177 male students over nearly two racades. richard s abused athletes from at least 16 of the school's r orts teams, along with students at otalth facilities, between 1979 and 1997. he took his own life in 2005. the report also said that school officials were aware of the allegations, but did little to stop him. we will have more on the findings later in the program. taiwan has become the first place in asia to legalize

same-sex marriage. the self-ruled island's legislature voted overwhelmingly today to approve the measure. thousands of people gathered outside the parliament in taipei to await the vote. they waved rainbow flags and celebrated in the streets after the bill passed.no >> jus a law passed saying we won't be using the term "same-sex marriage," but just "marriage," which means that we can get married. this means that wh we get married, we use the method of marriage and not civil union, so there is no hostility. i think this is very important. >> woodruff: mainland china, which claims taiwan as its own territory, is under communst rule and far more conservative. back in the u.s., the house of representatives toy passed sweeping legislation to extend civil rights protections for l.g.b.t.q. peopl it bans discrimination based on gender identity and on sexual ientation. the bill passed largely along party lines, with every democrat anting in favor, along with

eight republ a similar bill faces long odds in the republican-led senate. president trump is expected to veto the legislation if itat arriveis desk. former white house national security adviser michael flynn has told the special counsel's office that people connected to the white house and congress tried to influence his cooperation with the russia probe. that is according to a court filing that was made public thursday. meanwhile, in an interview with fox news today, attorney general william barr vowed to get tohe bottom of the russia investigation's origins, and said that so far the ufplanations have been "icient." the treasury department defied today's subpoena deadlinto hand over president trump's tax returns to the house ways and means committee. meanwhile, the democratic chairman of that committee, richard neal, said today he'd rather appeal to the courts for mr. trump's returns than pursue contempt charg.

weeks-long talks between britain's governing conservative party and opposition labour party collsed today, adding more uncertainty to the country's exit from the european union.re labour leader corbyn and prime minister theresa may both said the discussio were frank, but fell short of finding agreement on a withdrawal deal. >> we've negotiated in good faith and very seriously and put forward a lot of very detailed arguments on trade relations, on customs, on gulations, all those issues, and i think that's the responsible thing to do. >> these talks have been constructive, and we'v progress. there have been areas where we have been able to find common ground, but other issues h me proved to e difficult. >> woodruff: the new deadline for britain's exit from the e.u. is octob 31. and stocks fell on wall street today, amid reportthe u.s.- china trade talks have stalled. the dow jones industrial averag9 lost more thpoints to

close at 25,764. the nasdaq fell 82 points, and the s&p 500 slipped 17.jo tractor make deere pulled the s&p's industrial sector down, after reporting weak sales from farmers worried about exports. that triggered fears the u.s. trade wa a toll on other major u.s. manufacturers. still to come on the newshour: thousands march to protest a new extradition law in hong kong. bestselling authored herman wouk has died. his literary agent said he passed at h home in palm springs, california. wouk won the pulitzer prize in 195 for the "cain mutiny." herman wouk was 103 years old. still to come on the newsour, w long was the ohio stat university leadership aware

thousands march to pro a new extradition law in hong kong. investigators blame an electrical line for causing california's deadliest fire. and, much more. >> woodruff: we are learning new, disturbing details about the scope of another college athletics sex abuse scandal. as john yang tells us, this one at ohio state university. and a warning: the story contains explicit language. >> yang: judy, the school says the abuse took place in the 1970s, '80s and '90s by aph ician who was both a team doctor and worked in the studen. health cen the university also found that school officials knew ofti alles as early as 1979, and for nearly two decades, did nothing about them. the physician, richard strauss, left o.s.u. in 1998. he committed suicide in 2005. in an email to students, faculty

and staff, university president sechael drake apologized to those who were a and said: "the findings are shocking and painful to comprehend. our institution's fundamental isilure at the time to prevent buse was unacceptable, as were the inadequate efforts to thoroughly investigatin compla raised by students and staff members." this is the foth major investigation of an o.s.u. coach or advisor in recent years.bu from col we are joined by mike thompson, news director ata wosu public me. it is independent of the university.ks mike, thor joining us. the report says this abuse took place in the guise of medical exams. at more can you tell us about what the report found? >> the report found that the abuse started right after richard strauss began his tenre at ohio state. he started in 1978 and the abuse started right after ived. he would examine student-athletes. he would examine students on campus.

all of his victims, according to report, are male. and they would be under the guise of a physical exam, of a routine physical to make sure they could play the sport they i were playing othe patient came in, the athlete came in complaining of an injury and the abuse allegations include excessive fondling or asking athletes to strip come pollutely naked for unrelated conditions, like there would be allegations of excessive fondling of the genitals even though the athlete was being treated for ayuliflower ear. >> yang: and it these complaints, officials knew about allegations of complaint in 1979, but what happened to them? why was nothing done? >> the report says at first coaches and administrators in the athletic department and the student health services were first aware of the complaints about richard strauss in 1979, but theyeally didn't do anything about it. they changed some of his work conditions over the course of years, but the report found that these complaints occurred

regularly for the next 20 years. d the report says that some in the athletics department justis did these as unfounded rumors. but ielwasknown according to his accusers and according to the report that dr. strauss was unusual in his examinations and some athletes were even urged t stear of him. so it was well-known according to the accusers and the report that d strauss was doing inappropriate things with athletes andtudents in the health services. >> yang: what does the report say about what they found abohe wh or not coaches or assistant coaches knew? i ask because this is getting some attention in the political world because an assistant a wrestling coacthe time from 1987 to 1995 is now representative jim jordan, a republican from ohio, founder of freedom caucus, ranking republican in the house oversight committee. >> yes, the report says the coaches knew. the report does not name any coaches by name. they say the head coh of this

team, the head coach of that team. an assistant coach with this team or cope a or coach b. oddly none of the coaches are named in thetheport eveugh congressman jordan has told the "washington post" that this completely exonerates him, he's not namch. no c are named in the report. in favorable or negativeight. so the report says that coaches were well aware of at least abnormal behavior on the part of richard strauss. >> yang: and he -- strauss was suspended from his role as team physician and from working in the student health center in 1996. what was that it finally driggered that? >> a st who went to the student health center complained of inappropriate fondling and he complained about that, and that went to the university officials, it went to o.s.u. human relations and r, and theyn took actio they quickly suspended him. they lost his ro as a team physician and also with a student health services. aftir a quick invetion, he still remained on the faculty of

ohio state university. but then he celt up a men's clinic just off campus and continued to treat o.s.u. students. port found that the o.s.u. officials did not stand in the way of himng setp this men's clinic despite the allegations against him that dated back to the lates. >> yang: mike, what's been the reaction on campus today? >> well, as bad as the report is, the investigators' report, is i don't think it's surprising to folks who have been following this story for the past these are all things we have heard from accusers over the past year. it's now in block and white. we hear the university calling it inexplicable and inexcusable. now it stets the stage for a hepossible legal sem down road. >> yang: mike thompson from columbus, thank you. >> thank you. >> woodruff: tensions are rising in hong kong, as protesters take

w the streets. at issue, a new at allows extradition of suspected criminals to china. nick schifrin reports on fears that it might lead to silencing itics of beijing. >> schifrin: in downtown honges kong, the protrs, and the umbrellas they hold to symbolize resistance, fill a city street. last month, more than 100,000 demonstrated peacefully. in a city that's long valued independence, they say a new extradition law can be used to shackle them to mainlana. >> ( translated ): once this law has been passed, it won't tter if you are an average person or a foreigner coming through hong kong, there ll be a real possibility you'll be taken and sent off to the mainland. ( marching and chanting ) >> schifrin: they demonstrated in march outside the local government headquarters. they describe the law as n endition," allowing china to kidnap and imprisoy hong kong residents or visitors accused of a significant crime--

and any hong kong leading activists critical of the chinese government, like joshu wong. >> perhaps in the worst scenario, activists might be jailed in mainland chien though they are permanent hong kong residents. >> schifrin: but the people republic of china is fighting back. one weekgo, pro-beijing lawmakers brawled with pro- democracy lawmakers, and u-year-old gary fan endedp on the floor and on a stretcher. other activists were convicted last month of public nuisance charges. several of them ended up beingbu ed to jail. the new hong kong law could also have implications for the united states. a grp that advises congress on china said the law could "allow beijing to pressure the hong kong govt to extradite u.s. citizens under false pretenses." cha is urging the united states to stay out of it. >> ( translated ): it is wrong to tr and interfere in hong kong's affairs in y way. >> schifrin: the hong kong streets haven't been this full of protesters since 2014. the umbr started in response to beijing's

decision to vet candidates for hong kg's elections. thousands of demonstrators gathered in the streets, brandishing their namesake umbrellas to protect from pepper spray. those were heady days for the student activists leading the protests. >> the ongoing occupy movement will for sure generate sufficient pressure in the government. >> schifrin: sibut many have given up. on a busy street in hong kong, a door that once led to a bookstore of resistance, is covered by a paper sign indicating it's closed. owner lam wing-kee fled to taiwan, fearing he could not avoid forced extradition. >> ( translated ): it is making hong kong into a very dangerous place. anyone could be extradited. there is no longer any protection, no sense of personal security. >> schifrin:or his part, joshua wong is defiant, urging his fellow activists to remember the optimism they felt duringon the 2014 drations. >> no matter what happens, i hope that people will have, will never forget the spirit of the

umbrella movement, and we will continue to fight for free election. >> schifrin: this week, a delegation of pro-democracy leaders visited washington, d.c. "ey met with secretary of state mike pompeo, wpressed concern" that proposed law changes "threaten hof kong's rulew." and one of those people who met withompeo is martin lee, the founding chairman of the firstrt pro-democracy in hong kong, and a leading attorney in the democracy movement. thank you so much. welcome to the news hour. >> tnk you. >> schifrin: what is your message this week you've been meeting with u.s. officials here in washington? >> it's ag urgent methat unless the u.s. government comes to our assistance, hong kong will be passing a very draconian law wch doesn only affect hong kong citizens. things are going terribly long and our legislature is about the ram through a piece of legislation which, in fact, hurts the welfare and the

well-being of a lot of yourns citi85,000 of them, living or working in hong kong. because once the law is pasd, any one of them could be transferreback the china for trial, on trusmed -- trumped up charges of corruption or whatever wegch they will alle you have committed many years ago. >>chifrin: why the whites? why are you asking for the unitedtates' help >> i believe the u.s. government is the only government who will take the lead. i don't believe thbritish government will take the lead. so hong kong of course will continue to fight against it. this is dreadful. because if we cannot even protect the safety of people livingko in hong or visiting hong kong as a tourist, how can hong kong continue to b an international city? >> schifrin: the chief executiv of hong kong who has backed these changes to the

laws, of course, says that look, there are loopholes in the law at prevents the extradition of criminals, real criminals, and that this legislion is required. what's your response to that? >> it's not a loophole at all. it's a fire wall separating ou system from the mainland system. >> schifrin: mainlandhina, hong kong versus mainland china? >> indeed.at s china's own policy regarding hong kong. they iy roduced a polic one country, two systems. our system is separate from them. >> schifrin: let's go through other arguments the chief executive makes. she ys she has reduced the number of people who can be dragged into this and she's raised the bar, that only peop who have committed offenses punishable by three years rather than one year as it originally was. does that reassure you at all? >> she can increase it to sevn years, because if the concoct a case in mainland china, it can be murder. there is no safetat all.

if you can believe the chinese system, judicial and legal system, fine, but we don't. that is why evenoday there is no arrangement between hong kong and mainlandhina for transfer of fugitives from justice. >> schifrin: the last argument that the hong kong chief executive makes is this law would o ty be us prosecute real criminals and not to osecute anyone for race, religion, nationali to the point, political opinion. that does not reassure you? >> of course. if they want you, they will bring you back on a trumped-up charge of murder or rape or corruption. >> schifrin: we just heard the spokesman for the forign ministry in beijing discussing how the u.s. should stay out of this, as he put it. by coming here,o you fear that you're allowing him to make that argument, that you are coming here asking for the u.s. and allowing the argument to be made that the u.s. is meddling? >> wel, in fact, back in 1984,

when the btish government entered into this joint declaration with the chinese government, under which hong kong and the new territories would all return to china, the chinese governmentrorked very to lobby for international support, and they lobbied the u.s. government to support that agreement. so how can they ask you to stop? interfer they asked you to support the one country two system, and your government still does support it some how can they tell the u.s. goowrnment, mind youn business. >> schifrin: what do you want the u.s. to do? what can the u.s. rea against beijing's push? >> i would like the u.s. governnmnt and other govts and indeed the hong kong government to support us, to support hong kong people, an the legislative auncil. it's alaw. if it passed, nobody is safe. honk conditioning cannot be the safe harbor again.

>> schifrin: martin lee, fartherring of the democracy par any hong kong, thank you so much. >> my pleasure. >> woodruff: wildfires in california have been brutal these past few years. this week,tate investigators say the camp wildfire-- the deadliest in a century-- was caused by uipment owned by pacific gas and electric. amna nawaz hasur look into the company's role. >> nawaz: the camp fire killed 85 people and burned down most of the town of paradise to the ground before it was eventually brought under control. fire investigators say the utility's 100-year-old transmission lines snapped last november and cated small fires that spread and turned into the camp fire. state officials also say p.g.&ea caused multiple fires in 2017 as well.

the company is facing lawsuits, potentially criminal charges, and filed for bankruptcy protection in january. russell gold is senior energy reporter for the "wall street journal," who's been covering this. he's also the author of a new book on renewables called "superpower." russell gold, welcome to the news hour. 100-year-old transmission lines. what do we know about how pg&e was run, what they were doingh, what failed to do that led to this devastating firewe? >, what we know is this is a transmission line that was built in9 121, and before a recent story in the "wall street journal," we asked, when was the st time it was inspected, when was the last time u had climbed up it, the company was unable to really provide an answer. and basically this is a company ich has had many problems over the years, going back to 2010 with the pipeline explosion in san bruno and then continuing forward.

it seems like every time they have an ise, they get it taken care of, something else pops up. so there almost playing whack-a-mole trying to keep up with all the different problems they're having. >> nawaz: you've seen those problems you just mentioned. state officials saying they're behind multiple other fires, as well is. that unusual for a utility like this? there are actually considerably more fires started than even other california utilities. we looked into that. but one of the biggest problems is that in the past you might have a situation where a utility -- a tree will hate line, the line will go down, and it will start a fire, but nnorthern california rig is so dry and has been through so much drought over the last five yeat the fires are just devastating. and really pg&e is playing catch up. i would venture to say that neither the company the regulators really were prepared iocitiesfrosties -- f of the fires that we're seeing and aretruggling to try to

figure out what to do. >> nawaz: so they have a new head, ght? bill johnson stepped into the role relatively recently. he's already testified before lawmakers about this. what is he saying? what is the company's response to the findings? >> well, so he said pg&e has accepted respoxpibility. theyt to be found responsible for this camp fire. what pg&e is doing right now is they're talking abouty a multi-year plan to harden their syem, to cut down tree to, try to get this situation under control. but in the meantime, one of the things they're talking about sdoing, starting t summer, effectively starting now, and certainly in the fall fire season, is they're talking about turning off power to entire cities or half of counties whetn e conditions are conducive to fires, because they are sayin look, if we cannot guarantee that our equipment is not going to cause ae, firt's not going to have a problem and cause a fire, we're just going to turn the equip off. so what we're going to face this

fall and what the communities i northern california are going to face could be two to five days without power. >> nawaz: so we mentioned there could be potinential cr charges? the district attorney is looking over the repnot. what do wew about accountability for the fir hs the already been linked to? >> well, pg&e... well, info caia there is something called inverse condemnation. what that means veryimply is it does not matter if pg&e was negligent. if their equipment started the fire, they are liable he damages, and that's property damage, that's lawsuits, deaths. so they ar facing billions and billions, $20 billion, $30 billion already. and now with the camp fire, the most deadly of tem all being associated with pg&e, pg&e being blamed r sparking it, just massive liability. that's why they declared bankruptcy earer this year. they're still a profitable company. this is a utility. they can collect rates if you want electricity, but the amount of liabilities they're facing are just so large that

essentially they said we can't go on like this. y> nawaz: you mentioned some of the stuff t will be willing to take, some of the things they're already trying to preparations are under way for the upcoming fire season across the region. are people confident the steps that they're taking now, the things they're doing, will they be able to safeguard people for this upcoming fire season? >> no, there's not a lot of confidce right now. and you hear that from people that you interview who live in rthern california. you hear it from state regulators. you hear it definitely from state politicians. the loss of confidence in pg&e and pg&e'sbility to operate safely is really stu enning. entially when you talk to people in places like napa county, sonoma county, which went threw deadly wildfires around san to rosa in 2017, thek say, does ite sense to you to turn off the power on windy days when the conditions are ripe for fires, they basically say, yeah, we don't have nfidence that pg&e will be

able to -- that their equipment will not spark more fires, it makes sense to deenergize those lines, even though ite will c as a great inconvenience to the public. >> nawaz: troubling findings there. something to watch, russell gold, seniorg joy reporter at the "wall street journal," thank you. >> thank you. >> woodruff: she is the first female combat teran to run for president. hawaii representative tulsi gabbard served two tours of duty in the middle east before being elected to congress in 2012. and she joins me now at the table. and she joins me now at e welcome to the newshour. >> good afternoon. >> woodruff: we should also say you are the second youngest person in this race, 38, only 38 years ole what i want to ask you first is in the last election, you were a big supporter of bernie sanders. >> yes. >> woodruff: he's still running. he running again in 202 but you're not supporting him.

you're running on your own. why now are you better qualifsed to be p than he is? >> it's the expertise and the rexperience that i bing to this job. the most important job that a president has is to serve as commander-in-chief, to keep the american people and our country safe and secure. and so the experience that i bring of serving as a soldier for over6 1 years, of deploying twice to the middle east and serving in congress now for over six years on both the armed services and foreign aairs committee have brought me that experience and understanding about the issues that face our country and our national security and the cost of war. so i can walk in on day one to do that job as president and commander-in-chief. >> woodruff: so it's an international focus. you're stressing commander-in-chief rather thanth multiple duties of a president. >> there are many different issues that we face here domestically, and you'll hear a t,t of the other candidates talking about thut what is often not addressed is the fact

that our foreign policy, the cost of these cotinued wasteful regime change wars that we have been waging now for so long ha a direct connection to our domestic poly and our ability to invest the resources that we ed to in things like healthcare, education, infrastructure, and so on. >> woodruff: let me quickly ask y aboua couple things. iran, right now there is a lot of attention being paid to whether the trump administration is edging closer to ailitary confrontation with iran. what would you be doing differently? >> a number of things. first, it's important to make sure the person people understand that a war with ira would be far more costly and far more devastating than anything that we experienced inraq. what we would see is a devastating cost on our troops, my brothers and sisters in uniform, a cost on the civilian people, both in iran and across the region, worst refugee criacs ss europe, as well as a strengriening of terrost groups like isis and al-falih,

al-falih, -- and al qaeda,r furtdermining our national security. it would essentially make the wain iraq look le a cake walk.dr >> wf: so you wouldn't have pulled out of the nuclear deal? >> i would not have. i thintrump needs toecognize that his strategy thus far has been counterproductive and a failure. as president i would reenter the iran nuclear deal, negotiate with iran separately on theis othees that we have, and find a diplomatic way to de-escalate these ions that we have. >> woodruff: let me ask you about syria. you were criticized by a numr of democrats two years ago when you met with syria's president, bashar al-assad. as you know, he's seens aa brutal dictator overseeing the redsure and killing of hun of thousands of civilians in that country. if you are elected president, would you sit down with bashar al-assad again?o whatu think it would accomplish? >> i think it's foreign for the sake of oucountry's national security, to keep the american people safe, and the pursuit of

peace for r president and commander-in-chief to have the courage to meet with leaders of other couy ries, whether the adversaries or poten ial adversarie order to achieve that peace and security. i think it's important now for trump to meet with the iranian president, so that we don't face this situati as we are now where we are walking dangerously closer and closer to war with iran. unless we are serious and have the courage to hold these conversations and have theseme ings, the only alternative is war. >> woodruff: russia, wou you be tougher on russia than this administration or not? you talking about oe importance avoiding any sort of nuclear confrontation with russia, which obviously everybody wants, but what wount you do diffe? >> as we look at this threat of nuclear war and ca lear catastrophe, nuclear strategists say we clarer to the potential of a nuclear war now than ever before. so it's important for us make sure that we are de-escalating tensions with nuclear armed

countries like russia and china and build those relationships that are based more on cooperation rather than conflict. deal with the issues that we have, bualso recognize in situations like north korea and our goal of denuclearing the korean peninsula it is in our interest interest to work with countries like ruia and chia to achieve that goal. >> woodruff: quickly, let me ask you about the mueller you have said in estheans you think democrats need to move on, there was no collusion pron and in terms of obstruction of justice, we're now learning that people representg president trump, congress, contacted ed flynn, michael flynn, who was advising the president to, affect hisooperation with investigators are. you confident there was no attempt at obstruction of >> no, no, not at all. i have never said that. my statements and my point has been my support for the mueller investigation was to investigate whether or not the president of our country colluded with

russia, colluded with a foreign country. the mueller report said there was no evidence that tha collusion took place. i think it's important for us. congress will exercise its oversit over the president an the administration. >> woodruff: but obstruction of justice -- >> on obstruction and other issues that are being raised. but i will tell you, out on the road as i'm meeing with peole in different states and different communities, they're not talking about the mueller report or they're notalking about what's happening in washington. what they're saying is why aren'tou guys focused on bringing us quality healthcare, on bringing us quality education, on dealing with the crumbling infrastructure that's threatening so manyeople in this country. of that,uff: speaking we looked today at your website, running for president, and you have been in this campaign since pnuary. there is noce on your website that talks about the issues, that talks about your positions on the issues. just curous about why thais. >> there is a website tulsi tulsigabard.org that people can

see my issues. on my presidential campaign, we're working on rolling out my vision for where i will take this country on a whole host of issuat. ill be rolling out in the future. >> woodruff: quickly back again on the mueller report. do you think congress should drop itsti investi, its attempts to learn more? >> no. >> woodruff: about what was in nthe mueller? o. i don't. >> woodruff: all right. th will leave it. e congresswoman tulsi gabbard, thank you very much. we appreciate it. and with that,e turn to the analysis of shields and brooks. that is syndicated columnist mark shields, and "new york times" columnist david brooks. gentleman, hello. so you listened to the conversation of congresswoman gabbard, david, to you first, how much of a role is fore tn policy goi play in this election? >> at this moment i don't think a primary will. i was a foreign correspondent in the early '90s covger europe, africa and the middle east. i remember when the clinton campaign started, suddenly all my stories disappeared.

new yorinton cam people said, something is happening right here. right now the focus of the voters' attention is the crisis right here. i think that's the way it is. it could change wite h reign policy crisis. right now this is a domestically focused nation. >> woodruff: congresswoman gaard, you heard her s mark , she's ver oy focusn the world. she said mistakes have been made. is that a wayto capture voters' imagination? >> if david is right and ais crisoes develop, and i think we can see crises brewing at this point. george h.w. bush, i think it's fair to say in 1988, his own military experience were strong credentials in his election. john kerry's nomination in 2004, and barack obama being the only democratic candidate who had opposed e united states war in iraq, that was his calling card that. was his credential.

so if, in fact, it'e, thert becomes central. if it isn't. it wasn't in 1992. >> woodruff: so quickly, david, a lot of comment rightou now abhow the president has handled north korea, veneuela, iran. do we see that being a plus or a minus for the president? >> well, i say they're minuses. he's frayed all of our alliances, which makes o issues harder. his general posture is one of extreme bellicosity with noa convincing i he will do anything about these things some i think we're not very close to a ar in iran. i think he is loathe to do thatw ld be crazy to do that, but he is responding to a situation, which is a tough situation. if the intelligence ports are true that the iranians told their militant armies that they control in the region the target americans, then that's something any american president is goin g pond to. i'm not sure you can respond as well when you have no a you can respond as well as when

you already walked out of the iran deal. lu have sort oft yourself in a hard place, and the thing that worries me ishe administration seems to think iran is on the verge of folding and if they just up the pressure and get more errac that iran will fold. most experts do not think they're close to folding an we could be in a situation where things spiral. >> woodruff: mark, let's turn to a domestic issue that a lot of people are talking about right now. and that is the anti-abortion movement moving essentially through state after state in the last few months time pose even stricter limits on abortion. in the case of alabama, the strictest limits in the country, basically saying all abortions are illegctal. s could go to prison. what do you see is going on her what is this movement say to you? and do you think one political party or another, it's aou seris issue, but setting the issue itself aside, does one political party or another stand to lose

from this? >> yes. yes. i would say that, fst of all, the issue itself is thorny andn unresolvede country and remains so after some 45 year unlike the country's moved considerably to the left on guy riage, and on same-sex mar abortion has been stuck in the gallup polls ask the same question annually. do you csider yourself pro-choice or pro-life. the most recent, 48% of themselves are pro-life. 48% pro-choice. but the gallup poll said there is a consensus on this thorny, difficult issue on three aspects, the life of the mother, abortion should be available and optional in the case e the l of the mother, and 71% of those who identify as pro-life say it should be. so 7 out of 10. and the same thing, by a similar majority, not quite than high

the question of pregnancy as a result of rape or incest. so i would say in answer to your question, judy, that politically this is i don't want to ay suicide pact for republicans, but republicans are very much on the defensive. and if it were to put them in a position where all those democratic house seatat were won in places like pennsylvania and new jersey got a lot tougher, uphill for republicans the win back. >> i'm not sure. new york started this by passing a very liberal abortion law whichent all the way through the pregnancy. virginia had one that was proposed that didn't end up gig the polling that i look at has three positions. one, do you think abortion should always be legal. you get 27%. should never be 1 leg. should be legal, which is the european solution, which is just gal first trimester, harder the second, 50%. that's 50 or 55%, asark says, has been very stable since roe v. wade. but the problem is we took it ouldn'tpolitics, so it

get to the moderate position. now the extremists have taken over both sides. and everybody is speaking from these extreme positions. >> yang: >> woodruff: right now it is the restrictive side that's having success in sli after legislature. >> well in the red states. >> iin david, both in virginia and new york, the democrs were seen unfavorably and unfortunately and thk wrong as a party of infantsidee. theylly were. ralph northam, that's what got him -- >> woodruff: the proposal that was put forwardut >> now i think it's no question that it's the republican dominant position. that's whymc kevirthy, the republican house leader, has tried to distance himself.hi he realizes,is a killer in suburban america. america remains pro-choice an anti-abortion. >> what the n.r.a. did to the gun issue they're doing to

abortion. >> woodruff: i want to come back to av20. we did a couple of new people jump into the race this week, including the mayor of new york. we now have 23 democrats and maybe i'm forgetting somebody. >> david is about to announce. >> with mark as my running mate. >> woodruff: but for all the numbers in there, the polls are showing an granted they're early, joe biden is pulling away. that came out last night or today, and it shows when you ask candidates who can beat prident tump, joe biden is way out there. 49 to 38. you e these oer numbers, bernie sanders 46 to 41. but it seems to be the who can beat trump that is the questione and in anotpoll, people who are asked top qualities for the democratic nominee, 73%, beating every other quality that matters. >> new ideas was down to 47%. so for a lot of voters --

>> that's a new idea. >> trump has been a daily nightmare. they just want him to go away for the sake of the country some biden seems like the most stable who can do that. the thing that strikes me about the polling data is how the decratic party, how the democratic voters break down. there's no divide on gender nes, which is surprising to me. there's in divide on race or economic lines, education lines. those divides don't matter. so biden does extremely well among voters over 45. moderately well among middle-age votts and not so well a all among younger voters some that age divide, the youngeoters want systematic change, and the older voters who don't want the party to get too far left and who want some stability and restraint. >> judy, i hate to rain on anybody's parade at this point, judy, in the 1992 when it was a open seat e democratic presidential nomination, bill clinton was at 6% and running in fifth place. at thatoint in 2004, joe

liebman was leading. >> woodruff: i realize there a anger in bringing up polls. >> the thing i would be concerned about if i was donald trump, donald trump is consistently at 40%, 41% in those polls? if the democrats nominate someone who isn't under indictment detox or suspicion dealing with foreign dynasties, i mean, you know, the in a position of strength. >> the generatiol thing will last. we saw that with bernie against hillary. there is a generational divide on the left these days. you seet in yourorkplace. somehow there will be an ole person who is a young person's candidate. we don't know who that will be. but that divide i t permanent future of the democratic party. >> i'm not so sure. >> woouff: you're not so sure about the divide? >> i'm sure about the division. i'm eot sure that each sill have a candidate. i think that's what i mean. >> 60% of voters over 45. >> that's right. >> woodruff: but ise a message that's coming through to

the younger generation? i'm not sure what the cut-off point, is whether it's 30 or 35, as we said, but is one of these or more of these candidates making an open appeal to young people? >> bernie and elizabeth warren. war when has had a good week. >> woodruff: and bernie sanders is in his 70s>>. it doesn't matter the age of the candidate. it's the emotional tone, theag meof anger and fed upness, the systems have failed us. th's the warren sanders message. >> anybody who watched bernie sanders in 2016 was just overimpressed. i was, by the youth of his audience. it was a young, in many cases idealistic, passionate, but also scornful of the polalit establishment. so i think that's a truth of our politics right now.

>> woodruff: including the htndidate we talked to ton she was a huge bernie supporter in 2016 pete buttigieg is 37. she's 38. i guess my question is are we going toee just a sort of naked appeal to young people or re sayi-- david, you' we're already seeing it. we're seeing it in bernie sanders' mesage. >> you've is idealism. youth is a framed. it's a state of mind. it'hs a perspective onworld of what's possible. i think that's the themes you'll be hear rather than just, oh, boy, you and have the same birthday. >> it's angrier, though. in '68 h, i don't know i was playing to idealism or anger. this is -- we have lived through iraq. we've learned through a fi.ncial cris we've lived through trump. this is not working for us. it's an imimpatience.

let's have some steadiness and let's con wwe're doing in an obama era. >> woodruff: it says joe biden is the one who can expect some slings and arrows ng his way. >> abslewly. no all right. david brooks, mark selds. thank you. >> thank you, judy. >> woodruff: finally tonight, for e millions of viewers around the world addicted to "game of thrones," winter is ming this weekend. jeffrey brown is here to look at the television phenomenon ludes its long run on sunday night. it is part of our regular arts lture series, "canvas." >> brown: dragons, white walkers, and ravens. targaryens and lannisters. seven kingdoms, and one iron throne to le over them. to follow every refere te, you'd

havebe tuning in regularly to the vast ntasy world of hbo's "game of thrones." ot the thing is, millionsf people have. npr television critic eric deggans: >> this is a modern blockbuster, so 17, 18, 19 million people watching on a single night is a lot for our modern tystem. >> brown: add many more through streaming and online services, and this "game" became an international phenomenon, turning its cast, many of whom have grown up before audience's eyes, into celebrities, and inspiring board games and product placement; tourist sites around the world where the show was filmed; ton-made artificial intelligence prediction models gauge possible endings; and enough viral buzz on social media-- including from the white hou

to make this the water-cooler discussion show of the ag deggans says the timing was just ight. >>t came along at a time when geek cultu.re rules pop culture shows that are about sword and sorcery or about zombies ors- about superherhave now become huge mainstream tertainment staples. so you take a high quality tv show in a genre that's very popur now, based on a book that had a wide constituency, and you pour in millions all millions of s in production to make it look amazing, and you wind up with an enon like "game of thrones." >> brown: the best-selling book series was george r.r. mtin's" a song of ice and fire," five volumes to date, brimming with detail and storylines that grabbed readers. michelle hope, a fantasy book editor, has worked with martin and other award-winning authors. >> the author makes it seem believable and visceral with these sensory details. and so as we move through this story, we kind of trust the

author to tell us believable details about this new world, so that when dragons are introduced, or zombies, or a face-swapping assassin, we're like, yeah, i can picture that. >> brown: beginning in 2011, show-runners david benioff and dan weiss brought "game of thrones" to the screen, filming in northern ireland and locations around the world, with an enormous budget that allowed them to create mini-movies in every episode, and give daenerys, the moth of dragons, jon snow, and a zillion other characters a new life. >> we knew that there would be some resistance at first to the idea that a show set in thi genre, as opposed to a genre like a crime drama or a western or what have you, could b serious drama and could be worthy othe same kind of attention as those other dramas. >> bro along with the critical acclaim, an astoundinti128 emmy nomis and 47 wins,

including three years as outstanding drama series. sachelle hope thinks peoplw something more than the her- worldly. >> that's something that's powerful about fantasy, because we can see these really familiar problems in our own world, in a sort of slight detached fantastical setting. and so we then have this shared world, the shared vernacular, to talk a these sort of fake characters, and we can talk about problems in relationships and problems in society using the shared context of "game of thrones" and have actual conversations about things that make us angry, or things that make us feel something. >> brown: fans did get angry along the w. the show was criticized early on for its gratusuieeling sex, and brutality against women, including rape. eric deggans thinks the prodanucers listenedchanged their portrayal of women, who, l the last seasons, emerged as

among the strongeders. but he and others noted another blind spot, in the lack of diversity and fully-realized char made-up world.in this >> you have a fictional place, you know, given that this is a made-up ntinent, why couldn't there have been more people of color that were society, in the same way that people of color are now a part of societies all over britain and rope and america? they might have had more courage, given the success of movies like "black panther" and franchises like the "avengers," that have lots of people of color involved in them now. >> brown: this final season has also brought a new round of bewilderment and even anger from many fans, as slowly-developed storylines and characters come rushing to their end. the television version moved yond george martin's novels two seasons back, and not everyone is happy with where the producers have taken it. fantasy editor michelle hope, though, is very happy that

millions of potential readers and viewers have now discovered her world, where she says they'll find plenty of other fresh and diverse voices and visions. and i think there's room for tons and tons of diversity in fantasy, because we can imagine whatever world we want. and i'm excited to see, because of the popularity of the genre, like, lots of authors coming to it and taking a stab at it, and telling us what their world is like, and how their characters navite through it. >> brown: in the meantime, on a sunday night in may, winter will have come and gone, and, perhaps, we'll find out at long last whoits on the iron throne. for the pbs newshour, i'm jeffrey brown. >> woodruff: was that really jeffrey brown? i think it was. you never know. and that's the newshour for tonight. don't fort, "washington week"

later this even on pbs. i'm judy woodruff. i'm judy woodruff. have a great weekend. thank you, and good night. >> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> kevin. >> kevin! >> kevin? >> advice for life. life well-planned. learn more at raymondjames.com. >> bnsf railway. >> consumer cellular. >> home advisor. >> babbel. a language program tteaches spanish, freh, italian, german, and more. >> supporting social entrepreneurs and their solutions to the world's most pressing problemsat-- skollfoundn.org. >> the william and flora hewlett foundation.ha for more t50 years, advancing ideas and supporting institutions to promote a better world.

at www.hewlett.org. >> and with the ongoing support of the institutions and friends of the newshour. >> ts program was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. ni capt sponsored by newshour productions, llc captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org >> you're watching pbs.

tonight on kqed newsroom, ale flout from pg&e now that they've been ofilgszy found at fault for the deadly camp fewer. and the first major city to ban law enforcement from coing facial gnition technology. and playoffns forry the bay area as theol gn state quariers and the san jose shar talken their rivals in the western conference finals. we begin with more turmoil from pg&e. they teined their equipment caused the camp fire. pg&ed admit months ago that was probably the c