♪ judy: good evening. i'judy woodruff. on the "newshour" tonight, a cascading crisis. india locks down 1.3 million the olymps on hold and the. rate of infections in new york skyrockets. the latest in the covid-19 pandemic. then debating a rescue plan. with the country watching, the u.s. senate pushes to pass an aid package to blunt the economic fallout of coronavirus. , plusside the epicenter. the pandemice with could be a warning sign of what's to come for the u.s. >> with the experiencee have italy, you really need to do -- bring the place to a standstill. nobody moves for tee to four weeks and test as many as possible where the cluster has

appeared. there's no other way. judy: all that and more on tonight's p "newshour." announcer: major funding for the pbs "newshour" has been provided by. >> on an american cruise line'jo urney, along the columbia and snake rivers, travelers retraced the route forged by lewis and clark or an 200 years ago. american cruiseines' fleet of victorian paddleboat and triverboatsveled through american landscapes to historic landmarks where you can experience local customs and cuisine. eraman cruise lines, proud sponsor of pbs "newshour." >>onmer cellular offers no contract wireless plans designed to help you do more of the things you enjoy. whether you are a talker texter, browser, our u.s.-based

team is helping you. announcer: bnsf railway. fidelity investments. >> the john s and james l knight foundation, fostering an informed and engaged communities. more at kf.org. announcer: and with the ongoing support of these institutions. this programas made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. judy: president trump is talking tonight about reopening the couny for business soon. that comes as coronavirus inctions in the united states exceed 50,000, with more than 600 deaths.

meanwhile, new york state warned of increasingly desperate conditions today. but in financial markets, the dow jones industrial average that's the most since 1933, as an economic rescue bill quote -- pr:ressed. repo in the city that never ssleeps, empty street as yoking it the new surged in new epicenter for the united states. new york governor andrew cuomo s rned today of dire consequences in ate and the rest of the country. >> as the number of cases go up, the number of people in hospital beds goes up, the number of people who need an icu bed ands ventilator g up, and we cannot address that increasing curve. where we are today, you will be, in three weeks or four weeks or five weeks, or six weeks.

we are your future. reporter: the world health organization issued a milar caution, saying the u.s. now responsible for 40% of new cothd-19 cases could become e global epicenter of the pandemic around the worldextraordinary steps in some countries to contain further virus spread. in thet world's second m populous nation, a 21 day locked for india's 1.3 billion residents announced day by prime minister narendra modi. >> from 12:00 midnight and day, the entire to save india, there will be a total ban on venturing outside your homere spirirter: the summer olympic games, which have historically only been canceled in wartime, are postponed today by host japan. >> for the athletes, for the athletes of the world, for them to be able toompete in the best environment, and also for safe and worry free for

spectators, i asked if it would possible to consider postponing the gameselor approximaty a year. reporter: and in spain, among the hardest hit countr europe, the death has so overwhelmed the system, a madrid ice rink is being used to house e dead. here in the united states as cases continue to rise, over a dozen states have imposed additional stay-at-home restrictions, even as health officials urge continued social distancing, president trump today at a fox news town hl said he would like to see those restrictions these by easter, less than three weeksway. >> we've had bad epidemics. i'm sure they could have beecs called pande but we never did anything like this before. it's been very painful for our country and very destabilizing we have to go back to work. much sooner than people thought. people canwo go back t and they can also practice good judgment. reporter: lawmakers looking to mitigate the economic impact with a stimulus deal pressed on with negotiations today,

expressing confidence for the first time in days. >> now unless, ielve, we are on the five ya line, the american peoplneed our democratic friends to take yes for an answer. >> we all know that not everyone is going to want every provision. we all know there are many things so many of us want are left out. tbu we all know we must do these things. reporter: at the white house reporter: reporter: this morning, national economic council director larry kudlow said the deal will speed up recovery. >> public health includes economic health that's the key point. it is not either or. for an even greater impact,aces signs of recovery in china. in hubei province, ground zero for the virus, main street came ck to life and officials set outbound travel restrictions will be lifted tomorrow. health officials s vigilance will remain high. >> if the communitys

identified as an epidemic free area, residents who need to return to work will be allowed to enter and leave the residency certificate from aployer. reporter: slowly easing restrictions and cautiously adjusting to a new normal. for the pbs "newshour" i'm none of us -- amna nawaz. judy: the world's second most pular country is on lockdown tonight. india stemming th outbreak in a country with a less than reliable health care sysm, widespread poverty and underserved populations. our special correspondent brings us up to date. reporter: in a tel tised address entire nation, prime minister modi said every indian, all 1.3 billion of them, must forget what it's like to step outside their homes for the next 21 days. prime minister modi announced a complete nationwidekd ln, while citing the example of italy and the u.s., saying that

when developed countries with a robust health care unable to stop in mass outbreak, india stands no chance unless every indian stays indoors and self-isolate. essential services will continue to operate in the next three weeks. this includes hospitals, pharmacies, grocery stores, but all air, land, and rl travel has been banned entirely.the prime minister announced a new to billion-dollar investment in the health care infrastructure. this money over the weeks will be used to buy testing kits, hazmat suits, ventilators, and trained medical staff. critics say the biggest ischalleng the fact that the health care set up is overstretched and underfunded, but the government seems to be addressing some of that. the prime minister silent on why india is not testing more ople. the government claim there is no community tnsmission and no ed to trust everyone and it

would only lead to more panic. india contest 10,000 daily b in the last two months has only tested 20,000 people. judy: that is our special correspondent in new delhi. we mentioned, wall street odsoareday on hopes that the economic rescuejo plan. the dos industrial average gained a record 2100 points to close at 20,705. the nasdaq rose 557 points. the s&p 500 added 210. more on the rescue plan and other efforts to battle the pandemic, we turn again to lisa desjardins at the capital and to yamiche alcindor at the white house. first.i will start with you individual americans, in particular, those who may become unemployed as a result of the coronavirus, wh's in this plan for them? lisa: that's important. first, an update. swe all waiting to see the plan in text. looks more likely there will be

a vote tomorrow. absolutely thi is what americans want to know. let's start with those who have sest their jobs or could their job here's what's in this. there woulde up to 600 dollars over usual unemployment benefits for each person. that would mean tlothfull pay cash close to full pay for most americans. not every, but most middle-class neamericans, unemployment t of full pay, for four months. that is an incase over the iginal plan for this bill. judy: and lisa, we know another important piece of thisgi ative plan has to do with small businesses. tell us about what about that. lisa: this is the part they agreed on the earliest here's where we are. $3l billion in loans for sm businesses. those loans will become grants. y,essentia they will be forgiven if the small businesses keep workers on the payroll and the treasury department i'm told

has a provision where they can use tax credits to cut those checks more quickly than usual. get that loan money out more quickly for small businesses small busines 4s making up of the workforce here in america. judy: now t yamiche, another partf this haso do with larger businesses, corporations. we know this is an area where the white house apparently gave ground on. yamie:hthat's rhe president says he's eager to get a bill passed in congrs and in doing so, the white house says made compromises. it is dealing with large corporations. there will be 500 billion dollars going to large business loans. there will be an inspector general and oversight board to look at h secretary mnuchin disperses the loans. and secretary mnuchin himself will havto answer to congress. he will bable to call up to congress to answer questions. we see the white house saying we

innt to make a deal. democrats were s at one point, they said they were trying to add t all sort ngs white house is movoser andut the closer to having the deal done. judy: and we know at the same time, to lisa now, this is a bill that does deal more than just with businesses. it will also have some help for hospitals, for states. tell us about that part of it. lisa: that's right. some important provisions. more than 130 billion dollars for hospitals including rural hospitals, $150 billion for states, comment -- and cities. there's also a freeze on federal student loan payments. the details are important and we e waiting. one big detail, the price type is over $2 trillion. that would make it the largest single bill in american history,

the largest single legislative history.foone-time spending in judy: and quickly, at this point we think w know everything that is in there or not? lisa: we d't. we don't know what's in it, not yet. judy: and again on timing, you said it may not : tonight? li right. it could be tomorrow. judy: finally, with this last question, that is what the president had to say today about getting the country back to business. it is something he raised yesterday and he spre about it today. yamiche: that's right. president trump is making it clear he wants to ease coronavirus guidelines, focusing on social distancing and telling people larger than 10 by april 12. the president said he wants to see churches packed by then. haalth officials have strsed repeatedlythis will last all the way into the summer.

president trump himself said it could st until august, but the president is making it clear he wants to ease guidelines. he says he believes more people will die if the economy is slow down than if the virus hurts people or kills peopl the president is stressing that, but it's not clear whether he' getting that guidance and data from health officials. the other thing to note is the president is getting pushed still by governors to enact the defense production act the president just now is speaking at the white house this hour at a white house briefing. he is saying he still doesn't need to do that act and set volunteering and ts enough equipment being made to meet the needs of hospitals across the cotry. judy: so still not using the full federal power he has. yamiche: that's right. judy: all right. so much to follow. thanyou both. stephanie:sy i'm stephanit

"newshour" west. . we will return to judy will grow -- woodrf and the full program. lks between democrats and republicans on capitol hill over the $2 trillion rescue bil stretched into the evening with hopes for a vote tonight fading. federal health officials say people who leave new york or other parts of the country should self-quarantine for 14 da. dr. deborah birx, the whiru house coronacoordinator, said about 56% of the cases in e u.s. are coming out of the new york metro area. s also, los angeunty confirmed the death of what ma be the first person under 18 years old to die from the virus in the.s. the los angeles times reported the teen died of septic shock as a result of covid-19. in tokyo wednesday morning, stoxx opened up about 5% higher following wa street gains tuesday. in the u.s. presidential race, democratic front runner joe

biden said he still supports holding the national convention in july amid the coronavirus pandemic. in a tv interview, he was asked about party leaders sticking with it for now. >> i think we ought toe able to conduct our democratic processes as well as to deal with this issue. but that decision we made is the state of the nation at the moment, butk i don't tht should be called off and i don't think we should call if any of the elections. wi thijust have to move forward. stephanie: some of the nation's best-known national parks closed today, citing the pandemic. yellowstone, grand teton, and great smoky mountain national parks joined others in shutting down. interior secretary david bernhardt had let parks stay open, but state and local and renowned playwright terrence mcotlly died today and sar florida of coronavirus complications.

over six decades, he won four tony awards for works that included ragtime and kiss of the spider woman. as an openly gay writer, he helped bring gay characters to the audiences. he was 81 years old. still to come onto "newshour"ud with woodruff, italy's battle with the pandemic could be a warning sign of what's to come for the u.s. the escalating debate about when to return to business as normal. and the torch is passed to next year. what it means that the olympic games are postponed. announcer: this is the pbs "newshour" from weta in washington and in the wes from the walter cronkite school of journalism at arizona state university. judy: we return now to our top story. the economic aid bill on capitol hill. the senate majority whip, senator john thune of south dakota, is thrasecond highest ing republican in the senate

and joins us from capitol hill. thank you very much for being with us. tell us, where do these negotiations stand westmark sen. coons: -- >>he are in the final stages an we have said this for some time, but i' hopeful we are driving to a conclusion. they are still debating a couple of the issues that are not totally resolved yet, but i'm hoping they can wrap it up tonight. there's a possibility i suppose we could vote this evening, but one way or the other, we need to gee.it done as soon as possi i think we are getting a lot closer,at but it's unfort that we are several days into this and in my view it should have been done a fdy days ago. we have been hearing they since yesterday.number o what can you say about what the holdup is? sen. thune: i thi there are several issues that have been -- that are still being negotiated.

one has to do with the fundha is available for businesses to get access to loan capital to help provide liquidity for businesses and what businesses shouldmp beed. i think there's pretty much broad agreement on that. the democrats have asked for grant funding for the airlines. better sething a lot of publicans have issues with, negotiated.ng that how do we keep airlines in business? we have advocated that be done through loans. there mi of that being debated but it's being resolved right now. there's also a question of how you get dollars out to state and local governments. the differences about what the numbers ought to be and some respects on policy. t these are thingshat should not take that long. hospital numbers, it so bds like it hn fairly well resolved ttbut again we have those numbers p well in hand for several days. additional items fordded

consideration and discussion for several days now and thais something we have tried to fight off. if anything is not specifically related to this emergency, we can debate it another day but they keep bringing new issues into it. judy: you are confident it will come tonight or not? sen. thune: i am not confident it will come tonight for sure. tyit's a possibi but there is still a lot of work that has to be done. the text is not final. you have a file, you have to to everybody s they have an opportunity to review it. i think most people are familiar with the major elements of the bill. therees have been a few cha and tweaks. i think for the most part, everybody knows what's in it. lpeople w have an opportunity to look at it and discuss a itlittlend make sure they are comfortable with it before the vote. then we have toxecute on the oor how we get it done. there are some steps ahead of us yet. doubtful it gets done this you never kno around here and i think it's important we get it donas soon

as possible. judy: to a different subject president trump has been saying for the last couple days that he thks it's very important the country get back as much as possible to businesssual. and he has talked abou early apl, easter, he has thrown out other dates. you know that this goes against the guidance of most of the scientists,xp medicalts out there who know something about this virus. they are saying this is a dangerous thing to do at any soon than is absolutely safe. what is your view of this? sen. thune: i think that you haveo liste to the medical experts on an issue like this. that has to be driveny data and science, evidence. i know we are trackeg every day numbers in south dakota, where they are, whether there has been since -- community

spread. the likelihood is we will be dealing with significant issues in the hospitals in the near distant future. so those are all questions i think y that are asking when you are looking at when it will be safe to go outside again. i think right now, we need to consult with and listen to the medical professionals, the health care experts out there who have been flowing this, tracking it, and looking at the data, coming to conclusions, analyzing every aspect of it, but we certainly don't want to put anybody in peril or at risk until we get this thing completely dealt wh before we declare it is all clear. judy: i'm asking because the president s priority for him. just late this afternoon and minutes ago, i saw dr. deborah birx, who is the coordinator of the white house task force on

coronavirus, is saying that anybody who has been in new york incity needs to self-quara for the next 14 days. there is still serious concern about spread. my question to you is, is this a priority right now? vebusiness health? sen. thune: tnk you always err on protecting life. obviously, people come to different interpretaons about th data, but i can tell you for example that in the state of south dakota, what we are looking at is aer very dit situation simply because of the population base. arther a number of people who come in from all around the world who carry the virus. we are looking at in our state differently than they might in new york. dr. fauci, and thealdr. birx, experts in my state of south dakota should give advice and i think political leaders should listenarefully because itre comes with a deal of study of the evidence, the data, in the sense that should inform all of our decisions about hhi we

approachgoing forward. ju: there seems to be a lot of coern about spread, even if you say south dakota is different from nit york people move around. sen. thune: absolutely. there's a lot of spread and that's what you have to look out for. judy: senator john thune, thank you veryuch. ♪ judy: this pandemic has changed virtually every aspect of american life, including the race for the white house, where the campaigns of the two leading democratic candidates have moved from rallies wh big crowds to virtual messages to supporters. it has brought one of them back to washington to focus on the stimulus package we have been discussing. independent senator bernie sandows of vermont joined me from the capital. senator sanders, what is your view at th point of what you effort to aid hospitals, buts

mainly to help american workers and small and large businesses? sen. sanders: what i believe will be the case is there will be a massive anded unprecede expansion of unemployment compensation, which includes workers who today are not covered by unemployment. over half the workers in america today are not covered. people whori uber cars, people in the gig economy. and we have a problem, a lot of tipped employees, making $2.50 minimum wage. this is unprecedented, my understanding is 100% of people's salaries for four months. fat is something we fought very hard to make sure we make workers whole. the small business provision will also be very expensive. what we are sayi is that if

small businesses retain their employees even when they are at home, there will sm loans to the l businesses which will be forgiven, as i understand it, if they retain their workers. also, what we are talk about, it's a start, $1200 for everyt adult in this country earning less than $75,500. obviously a major concern is hospitals all over the country, especial washington elsewhere, are being inundated with coronavirus patients. n thd help. at believe there' t$130 billion way to help them. clearly, d unbelievably, w't have enough masks or gloves or gowns or doctors n andses who

are putting their lives on the this money available to make sure that as soon as possible to get the equipment they need to protect themselves a patients. judy: so senator at this point, is this something t?u would supp sen. sanders: i haveo see the details and the details are not out yet. at the end of the day given we have an unprecedented economic crisis, some suggesting -- igunemployment be at 25% by the end of june and we have an unecedented health care crisis, it's clear we have to move as aggressively as we possibly can to protect working families in this country. one of the areas where i do ve concerns, i have not seen all the details yet -- i don't know they have been negotiated -- i'm very uncomfortable with giving donald trump and his ministration $500 billion to use in any way they want. that worries me a whole lot. we will see if there has been

so improvement in that situation in the last few hours. judy: and we were told that there has been serious conversation negotiations wi this -- the inspector general anoversight board. we are waiting as you say to see the details. r anotece of this is one of your campaign cochairs, congressman ro khanna of california, is called on the president to issue essentially a national shelter-in-place ord for the next few weeks. is this something you agree with? sen. sanders: i will tell you what i d think. what i do think is i'm very worried about a president who is ignoring medical advice and the leading scientific experts in this country. he talks about trying to open the economy and bring peoplwh back to wormay be sick.

this could be enormous lee dangerous for the country worry about that very much. i think in terms of a national set -- shut down, you have to look at various states. new york city is now in crisis. washington state is in crisis. other states may be not so much, but clearly the goal right now is to do everything possible to stop the spread of the edemic, to have the resources to treat those people who are ill to be prepared for what may happen in the fall, because there is a fear that even if we are able to significantly loweghthe epidemic now, it may resurface in the fall. there is an enormous amount of work to be done. judy: and i'm sure you know their argument is that if the economy is completely decimating people's lives, their livelihoods will be ruined,nd it will have to be weighed in the balance. at the least they are talking abt looking at geographic

areas thatca are not sed hotspots and lifting some restrictions. sen. sanders: well, that gets into the whole issue of why we don' i think what the experts are telling uhat if the day comes when there that is tested every day and nobody is positive, that's ok. orpeople can go to but right now, we are woefully inadequate in terms of testing. i uld also add that in this unprecedend moment as we fight our way out of this crisis, and i kind of believbecongress will the not-too-dista future after this bill is passed, because there will continue to be enormous unmet needs out ther we have to ask hd questions. hore did we get to where we why are so many people in the

country desperate? what people arewh afraid of and i am afraid of his half of the country is living paycheck-to-paycheck. what happens when those paychecks stop? $1200 for an adult, that's fine for a few weeks. it iodnot fine for a long pe of time. how do we make everybody in the country whole?how do we give confidence to the american people that the government will be by their side? ump talks about the fact that a bad economy is bad, people will be hurt, ocourse that's but at the end of the day, our job is to keep peoe healthy, keep people alive and do everything we can to get t economic resources to people. money is money. pelife is life. le die. that's not what we want. thfirst priority has to be protect the health of the american people, and then we meve to rebuilthe economy. short-term, gove has to do everything it can to make working people whole in the process. judy: senator bernie sanders,

candidate for president or the democratic nomination for president, thank you very much. sen. sanders: thank you, judy. judy: with close to 7000 deaths, italy is the nation hardest hit by this coronavirus pandemic. asick schifrin reports, italy's doctors are urging the united states to learn from their naonal tragedy. a warning, these scenes are difficult to watch. reporter: in northern italy, the patients are gasping for air. in hospitals across the region, the horror is relentless. the doctors and nurs who don't ve enough protective equipment, don't have enough beds or machines, don't have enough hours in the day to save the sick, say they are losing a war. >> we are at the end of our strength. this i amall hospital and we are taking and a lot of people.

i would say the capacity is finished. porter: this doctor was called out of retirement to help treat covid-19 patients. ctors are pulling 12 hou shifts and they are starting t get sick. six of them had to leave work after contracting covid-19. >> psychologically, it's very difficult. reporter: this nurse struggles >> it will be at the end of this emergency that we will see how we stand up, but at the moment, we have the right spirit even if we are tired. reporter: doctotm call the trt for covid-19 intense and lengthy. patients need weeks to heal, if they heal. there are only so many ventilators and they are prioritized for those most likely to survive, so doctors are forced to survive who lives and who dies. when patients die, they day -- die alone. funerals are illegal. ffins sit for days. . and crematorium, -- in this

apel and crematorium, there are three times the normal. >> in theory, we are used to this because our job deals with coffins, but now we understand the exceptional nature of the crisis. reporter:he cemetery is full, so army trucks brought coffins to a i cemeterya different region far from families. th is one of europe's best health care systems, but this hospital admits covid-19 is overwhelming. there are so many patients awaiting the covid-19 testsai, theyin cots in the hospital laundry room. >> what is really shocking, something had not been able to forecast that u broughts to our knees, is how quickly the echo -- epidemic spreads. reporter: elsewhere, the streets and italy's mostaramous sites empty. rome, the internal city seems frozen ine, t but critics say isolation came too late. >> this wasun missed oppoy. reporter: this doctor has been

watching the virus ravage italy from the first death favorite 21st. local officials locked the city down and the team tested all 3300 residents, battling out authorities to curtail infection at the earliest signs. >> now with the end -- experience in italy, you really need to bring the place to a standstill. nobody moves for three to four weeks until weheest everyone the cluster has appeared. reporter: he brought the infection rate t t town to zero, but he said italian authorities did not learn the most urgent lesson. >> nobody has ever built a war hby building mopital. you have to win by building weapons. theay to win epidemics is measure, containment, surveillance. you use a scientific approach to challenge and consolidate. as you know, i am a scientist.

i probably should have been more aggressive. reporter: despite all the fear, italians have tried to maintain their hope despite their edparation and have mainta connections. in a lombardi hospital, this doctor used a megaphone to play the italian national ahem. doctorsgh singing along thr their exhaustion. >> iantedo tell you that in all of italy, thinking -- people are thinking of you. they are hoping we will win this tough battle. i'm sure that's how it will be. reporter: outside another hospital, there is a mural. a nurse holds italy in her arms. they want the u.s. to avoid italy's mistakes. >> i think they have to take this ver they have to be ruthless in their effort to block the spread of the disease. ruthless in terms of measure and

in terms of resource. reporter: for now, italy's doctors have a warning -- get y ready, your country next. from the pbs nshour, i'm nick schifrin. ♪ judy:ra thedies we see playing out in italy and around the world are why most oblic healicials say it is far too soon to plan when people can return to work, but president trump today said he hos to see many parts of the country reopened by easter. other voices in busine have made a similar but lesaltime specificto provide the economy. we will examine those qstions with a pair of conversations. first, they look at the genera case for easing the shutdowns soon.

>> dr. david katz wrote an op-ed piece for the new york times last friday that received enormous attention arguing we may be shutting down too much of the economy too soon. he joins me from his house in connecticut. welcome. >> thank you. >> what is the basic argument? >> ihe think best way to explain what i'm concerned about here is to talk about my parents. my parents are both 80 years old , generally in good health, bte clearly no m how we stratify for preventing the h-read of coronavirus, they are in the hsk gro. when i talk to the two of them about at they are mo worried about, my dad is a cardiologist patients at 80, his primary worry is the loss of his life savings and his legacy. everything he has worked all these decades to build for his mi, he's watching it evaporate and vanish. yes, he doesn't want to get coronavirus andie, but frankly the loss of his life's work is his greatest concern. >> more than his health? >> i would say what is the thing

that worries you most? i don't want to get coronavirus, but honestly i'mly preoccupied with the loss of everything i worked my whole life for. my point is simply this. we must do everything possible to minimize the direct harm of the coronavirus. that means right now protecting everybody. what i argue for is can we use this initial period to identify high and low risk groups so that the longer-term interdiction is limiting high risk osevere infection and we potentially can d.r. so late a major portion of the population relatively soon. >> you are not telling me, not telling us tt we shouldn't be social distancing, are you? >> i am not. what'm saying is by all means we take full advantage of this initial periodanf social

ding to the goal is to minimize harms directly attributable to this pathogen but also minimize harms of distributing life savings. iswhen you think of socialrb -- determinants of health, you really can't un-bundle what happens to the economy at large >> we don'teally know the numbers, right? as>> iust looking at this issue of how bad this is relative to people killed every day. how bad is it in italy? it is 50 million people in italy and about 1%ie a year. that's about 500 thousand deaths a year, 1500 a day.we are just riveted on coronavirus in a way that is not on the other segments of the population. in germany, the data says 99% of

all infections are mild. we have no reason so far to think it's any different here in the unitedtates. so can we ramp up our assessment of cases in the populatown, figure outany people have this, not just severe infection, differentiate on the basis of risk, and can we say two or three weeks from now, we have beeny able to idente 75%, 80%, 90% that actually is at no higher risk of severe infection from the coronavirus than from the seasonal flu and we don't shut down our society every year for seasonal flu, so those folks can go back to school and go back to work and reboot the economy, and we are now going to be able to essentially concentrate our protective resources to that smaller seent of theopulation most prone to severewe infection, s do an even better job of providing them services they need. >> risk stratification means

testing everybody. >> yes, wideread testing. everybody. >> but america is nowhere near >> but we are ramping up fast. new york was testing about 1000 people a day, in a short period of time, is now testing 15 times as many, above 15,000. the same.viously can do think we can massively improve detection. >> one of the things you said in your article was that yot worried abllege kids being brought back home. >> i will confess something to you. i don't feel great right now. test ordered. arrange to get a i have been achy for several days. kni don' if i've had fever, i feltike it has been termittent. if you feel like you have ain viral illneshe middle of a pandemic, it >> like a duck, it o flies,ybe i have this thing.

if i do have ts, my likeliest source of exposure with three of my adult children being sent back home. two om boston where th were attending university, and one from new york city where she was working, and her business later off because it was shutown. healthy young people in college and working in new york city, if notice.tick, they may barely maybe it's not so great tothave infect their nearly 60-year-old parents or 80-year-old grandparents. we can do a better job of separating high-risk from low risk and treating those populations differently. i think a world of good could ensue from that. >> dr. david katz, thank you. judy: and an important note. yesterday evening.onversation this afternoon after the president's press conference, dr. katz said the decision about when to return must be data-driven. he tweetedha "an arbitrary vector business deadline is dangerous folly."

byer officials are alarmed the timeline that the president discussed. now william bryan speaks with a leading public health voice who has warned of a risk of being -- bringing peoe back tckly. >> i'm joined by one of the naons leading epidemiologists. this is mark lipsitz with the horvard th chance of public health and specializes in infectious diseases. thank you very much for being here. i know you heard that prior conversation paul solomon had i want to talk about this argument that seems to be gaining currencyon, that the ic pain of what we are doing to prevent the spread of the coronavirus is too much to spread, too much in comparison to the viruske what do you f it? >> i think what's clear is there will be a lot of economic pain and no responsible epidemiologist, because we care about other kinds of disease and

suffering, would try and minimize that. the issue is that the size of the pain we are feeling from the virus no is growing exponentially. the purpose of social distancing is topr slow thed and ideally turn over the curve of the epidemic so that we don't end up with more cases of disease than the health care system can handle. one tricky part about this is the actions we take now will bear fruit in three weeks or so and reduced caseloads in intensive care units. that's how long it takes for someone to get sick enough to need intensive care with this virus. it's not that we can wait until we feel th pain to take action. if we do what,e have three more weeks of increasing burdens on the health care system, which will crush it. >> katz and others and even the president are arguing today that

the majority of cases thus far appear to relatively mild and y at draconian efforts to stop what are a major mild cases is inappropriate. what do you make o that? >> the majority of people don't die in any war, but we still try to stop wars. this is just not a onlevant compar if some ns of percent of the population, maybe a majority gets it, of course most cases are mild, nobody disputes that. the issue is myes cin terms of absolute numbers, are going to be severe. that's the first problem. the second problem is the numbers of those people, as we've seen in and italy and iran, and e beginning to worry we will see in new york city and elsewhere, there are enough of tse people so the whole health care system is unable to take caref the

patients and the people in the hospital for all the other regions. -- reasons. >> it seems argument you are making isme that on evel we suffer this economic pain now but we don't necessarily see the benefits and reduced cas for quite a few weeks. it is similar to the arguments about climate change. that sacrifices and changes to energy infrastructure need toe made now, but we don'tssee the benerom that until may be years down the road. i think it's a tough pill for people to swallow. >> it may be and i think our political leadership has couraged a feeling that we should privilege the present over the future. . it is just not responsible. leadership means when possible, you encourage people at sacrifice's needed to have a better outcome in th future. it'sot that we are sacrificing now so someone else has a better outcome, it so we have a better

outcome, and we have a health care system month from now. it should not be that complicated to get that message through. >> so we have health care system a month from n. do you see that as this dire? >> in some places it will be in in some, it will be longer than that. but new york city, for example, is taking measures rig now a crificing a lot in order to make c sure there intensie units are functioning as well as they can be in theext few weeks even. some places, it will be more than a month if we do nothing, but not much more th month, because thisia is an exponey growing phenomenon. mp seemed to t indicate today that he pointed out how we do lose ns of thousands to seasol influenza every year and he says we don't the country for

seasonal flu. he sms to be optimand a sense that the death toll, while large, will not be so tragic for covid. does the epidemiology indicate that optimism is right? >> therojections are for much greater toll than from seasonal flu for two reasons. every year, somewhere around 10 or 20% of the population gets seonal flu. the expectation is, especially if uncontrolled, this will infect more than half the population. there are more people at risk. e ath rate from this is somewherin the neighborhoodf 10 times that from seasonal flu per case. it may be more, it may be less. there's a lot of uncertainty arnd that number. it's considerably more than from seasonal flu. it's just not responsible to say this is the same as seasonal flu. it's going to get more people

infect and it will be fatal and severe in a higher fraction of them. the other thing about seasonal flu is we never see intensive care units in multiple countries shut down, multiple advancedou industrializedries, shut down and unable to function because of seasonal flu. 's just not what happens. >> mark lipsitz from the harvard th school of medicine, thank you. >> thank you for having me. ♪ judy: olympic history of a different sort was made today when japan and the international olympic committee decided to postpone this summer's games to 2021. that decision and ramifications. reporter: today's decision affects thousands of athletes around the world and creates

huge logistical headaches for organizers. christine brennan of usa today has covered every olympics game, both summer and winter,in 1984 and joins us by skype from washington, d.c. how much of this decision was driven by the athletes' own concerns about their own health and welfare? >> all of it. this was stunning. when leaders don't lead, the athletes felt the void. the international olympic committee psident, who is actually a former olympic gold medalist, one would t havght he understood the magnitude of the problems. he sat in his ivory tower. he kept saying we are not talking about postponement.k the athletes ter. they started talking. thinterviewed some around world and their voices were heard. they couldn't train. if they could go run or swim, they wondered if they were being good citizens. not just americans, but athletes

around the world. why are they out and no one they are trying to train for the most important part of their life for months away. the athletes drove this decision. was about right now and the here and now really d won t and the athletes where the voices we listened to. reporter: you say thir competition ny of these athletes was really going to be the most important moment of their lives. does this for them, some of themmean their chances of m edalinge ever minished? >> yes. there are athletes who were targeting 2020. they knew that once july or august of 2020 was over, their career is over. some of em will stick around. i spoke to some of them, especially if it is a spring olympics, they will stick arnd. . but spring of 2021 is less time than the summer.

that will knock out some of the big names or the older athletes who were going to hang around for another four years, in case from 2016 to 2020. that's gone. even though it sounds like a short time, the elite athletes, where one fingernail first-place and fourth place in the swimming pool, that is enough to derail careers. reporter: and some of these athletes have delayed college and careers to train? >> they have. for everyone who makes a lot of money like michael phelps or simone biles, there are those who have group -- been creepinga this is their hope. reporter: at the olympic games ever been disrupted in this way? >> this is unprecedented. never before have we seen anything like this. there have been ncellations for world war i and world war ii, but th's it. other than that, there were boycotts that were political in nature. 1976, 1980 olympics were affected by boycotts but they went on as planned.

so the idea of a postponement something the likes of which we have never sn which is why the undertaking isam so ic for the athletes and tokyo und -- organizers. reporter: r the tokyo organizers, how easy is that for this to move a year?there are worries about venues being r available, hotms, other competitions interfering. >> all of the above. if not like postponing the nba season or stopping something. even the ncaa tournaments. this is the biggest regularly scheduled event and gathering of the world. yes, the hotel rooms, obviously venues that are supposed to be10 temporary. once august 9 happens and then the paralympic games, into septemr, they would be moved, taken down. what will happen? and my sense, civic pride will

win the day and we will see tokyo rise just like probably any other big city would to pull this off. reporter: christine brennan of usa today, thank you very much. thank you.sure. judy: and thank you to christine and e hn. that is ewshour" f tonight. i'm judy woodruff. join us online and here tomorrow evening for all of us the pbs "newshour." for all of you, thank you, stay safe and we will seeou soon. announcer: major funding for the pbs "newshour" has been provided by, fidelity investments. american cruise lines. bnsf railway. consumer cellular. carnegie corporation of new york. supporting innovations and education, democratic engagement, and the invariants made of international peace and security at carnegie.org. and with the ongoing support of these individuals and institutions.

this program was made possible by the corration for public broadcasting and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. ♪ announcer: this isbs "newshour" west from ta studios in washington and our bureau at the walter cronkite school of journalism at arizona state university. he[captioning performed by national captioning institute, which is responsible for its cyption content and accura.]

>> jamie: we need to eat more veg, and we need to start now. sme on, you know it makse. it's better for you, and it's better for the planet. i'm going to cook veies in a way that are going to make you so happy. so whether you're a full-blown veggie or just wanting to start eating less meat, i've got some easy and delicious recipes for you. i don't want to compromise on the flavor, no way. i've traveled around the wor meetmag people doing some azing things with veg. wow, look at that. and picked up brilliant tips to create the ultima meat-free meals. no meat, but no compromise. enough talking-- straight in the mouth ♪ coming up: vei'm going to big up the g in the most amazing scruffy aubergine lasagna. look at that! pack a punch with the ultimate bean salad... and make the m dt gorgeous, easy steamplings.