tonight on kqed. as protests continue we incont the impact of every day and racism in our institutionings and our relationships and at work. easing restrictions on restaurants and retailers in san francisco. we will discuss the obstacles shand opportunities ing economic recovery. >> plus schools get guidance on how to reopen in the fall and will students d parentfeel safe? d clemons a da welcome.in the midst of a healt we as a nation are reckoning with the choices of our past and the racist systems of our

present. we condition the presence of racism and not as individual acts of discrimination but as social force. one that has brought us to this particular point in history. joining me now by skype is stanford establishment e ofessor of psychology st roberts professor roberts thank you for joining us. ro>> thank you. >>ssor roberts myself included would say we are not racist but you say onthe co use of the term racism is too narrow. how do you and other acemics define racism. >> we define racism as a system of advantage based on race. we commonly think of racism as mistreating or dicaiking others e of the color of their skin but we define racism as a system and hierarchy and pandemic that we are embedded in. >> you authored a paper with a white colleague that you outlined seven factors that contribute to racism. we won't get into them but ca you list them for us and talk

abt this in detail. >> we listed the seven factors and many to choose from be clear but we spoke the categories and segregation and hierarchy and power and fascism. >> let's take passism first. what does that mean>> it means the stage at we live in a nation ha has been plagued by ivcial hierarchy. wein a very racist country but we often don't do anything. we are passive and we sit idly by and let the hierarchy in place and that's one of e biggest problemsthat we need to stop being passive and ivnee to ay be more anti racist. i want to dive in fact shuns different groups and a lot of people don't feel that way in their regular lives. >> thatis how people el but

let me walk you through a quick classic psychology experience. you take four-year-olds in a lab and flip a coin and randomly assign them to groups. right after being assigned to those groups they think th group is like a team and coalition that they have to trust the group meers and support their group members and they can't trust out group members. after a lifetime of being in a racial categorywe are in many ways ready to treat those groups as if they are coalitions. >> how do you move out of that? >> that's a tough question. the factions, the groups in and of themselves are not bad peopleetting great meaning out of group membership and that's great in many ways but ce he teams, once that factor is coupled with her things like hierarchy and status and thmedia and how does it portray your group,

those factors combined make that factor. not any one single factor is the solution. there's this broader system that we need to grapple with. >> u use proactive and reactive anti racism. what does that look like in every day situations? >> i think one clear piece of evidence for reactive anti racism is what we have been seeing in the past few weeks. people are protesting and taking to the streets and fed up by the horrific events that have happened recently so people are reacting to that and choosing to be anti racist. proactive racism is takithat momentum and reactions and the feelings that many of us have and implementing that to some long future oriented change. let's make sure we are not here again. how can we be proactive to save our future so to speak. that would be ive to right now advocate for? >> that is a tough one.

we can be proactive in many ways. one that is most important as developmental and social psychologist is parents can be proactive and having explicit conversation with your children about race and racism. a lot of research shown that white parents don't abtalk t racism and that sets the kids up to not have an understanding of those things l but if we instill a standard o anti racism with children these will be the futureleaders of our future generations and we create that norm now, hopefully we will have a proactive anti racist society going forward. >> you write that we are in a time of "increasing racial enequality" but the protests and the changes in the law that occurred inthpast few decades evidence that america is moving towards equality? >> there is a lot scientific data to make sure that is not the indication. economic inequality between white and african-americans is

increasing residential segregation against micro levels and increasing in e nation. on the surface it may seem like we are progressing s towaa post racial society but the actual data suggests that we are in many ways going back. it doesn't mean that everything is bad. there is a lot of good that is come but we arfar removed from an equal society. you point to medias one of influence american racism. how does the media perpetuate racism? >> i will give a concrete barn. there's data to choose from if you compare how often the media portrays white people and black people as criminals or victims, mpared to actual crime reports black people are overrepresented as criminals and under represented as victims and in contrast white teamericans are overrepres as victims and under represented as criminals and these kinds of distorted images

affect our psyche and how society is structured. >> in recent days we have examples of spts addressing racial wrongs. scar is not displaying confederate flags at races and the nfl commissioner says it was wrong for taking a knee. how are the actions impacting a public perception of racism in society. >> there is a huge impact and i think that they are rtvery imt. they are great instances of racismchnd political ge so we don't end up here again. i think knthat you the more examples we see of that the rved. our society will be in the paper we talk about the importance of power. now that people in positions of power set the norm and set a standard that people that follow them will follow. yeah? take that stto be proactive hat

-- especially in a privileged powerful pition will pay dividends in the long run. >> professor roberts what would a post racial america look like? is that possible. or a utopian pipe dream? >> i don't itthins a pipe dream. i think racism and racial hierarchy is so deeply woven society that if we want to be in a post racial society we have to think what our nation would look like. i do think that u.s. society would be one in which one's race is not takes place or e race is not determining your position. and all of the data shows based on the color your skin and racial identity your life chances and opportunities are deeply affected and i think that an injustice and i hope that we all move towards a nation that is nolonger the case. >> professor steven roberts an stanford. your time.

>> thank you. >> this week san francisco mayor london reed announced that restaurants could reopen starting today for outdoor dining. on monday san francisco retailers will be allowed to reopen for indoor shopping for the first time in three nths. the city is also providing free temporary permits to allow businesses to use public kearea sidewalks and parking spaces for outdoor dining and shping. joining me by skype is jay change the public policy director of the chamber of commerce and also with us buy skype is jeremy owens the san francisco pure chief and tech editoror market watch. hello and thank you for being with us. >> thanks for having us. >> jay, let's start with you. what are you hearing about op restauranting to patrons and the outdoor seating area. how helpful is this to them? >> we have a lot of restaurant owners excited to open for outdoor dining and a t of challenges facing with the model. for one it is summer in san

francisco and so for a t of folks it is freezing cold outside. so there is a qution about how many customers are going to want to do outdoor dining during this time. that means for rsrestaurant owhow many seats should they put out and waiters should they hire and ma chefs should they bring back and a stronger question for the economics. since march, we have seen 84% drop in restaurant sa s. so even restaurants have pivoted the take out or ordinin ood trucks and very innovative in how they approached us the damage to the restaurant industris in calculatable. many challenges remain. so many it will help and not take us all the way there. jeemy let's talk about te companies in the bay. how are they weathering this storm. it seems like some are layoffs and others are record highs with earnings. and some at the same time.

record high revenuand profits but there is still ifrrows. if you looe layoffs in large tech companies. ins laying off 2700 and fewer than 300 from the bay area according to notices with the state that they haveto file. yelp announced a thousand permanent layoffs an1100 temporary layoffs. about 250 of those, i'm were temporary layoffs in san francisco and that was it for the local. and meanwhile the company's stocks have resumed and at record high and earnings at records. tech is not affected by this. if it is affected it is positive. >> interesting. why do you think tech dng so much better than other sectors of the economy? >> it was set up to be remote already. most of the tech companies had people working from home part of the time. issue as it might have been for other industries. and then you have thfact that

it is just set up. they have the peopleand they have to cut back beyond their core and focus on the core and that works fine and what the ceos e saying and their big talking point, they have been saying that theris digital transformation and people will work remotely and doing things from wherever and this isonly accelerating it. this may be a boost to what they were already looking to do. >> jay, the chamber of commer is putting together a play book for reopening. can you talk us through the highlights? >> some of the highlights that jeremy is talking about. we are pivoting from work at home environment. many of the larger employers and tech firms are going to allow or encourage employees to work from home for the next hs several mond maybe next several years. our neighborhoods don't have what it takes to sustain this. viewers have trouble signing on to zoom at the same time a

the entire network crashes. we need to build up more bandwith in the neighborhood and allow fiber and close th digital divide as people work at home we can sustain that kind of growth. >> jeremy can you talk about how the changes consum spending will be impacting the economy long term, what are the consequences? >> wel it is going to be tough to know until we see us come back, right? there is completely different consumer behavios in the last three months than what welysaw previoand people are expecting us to go back and behaviors from three months ago. but how much is permanently changed? we don't know until we open these back up. opening back up and trying to get people to come out and spark this economy anew could spark a second d wave. l of the money is betting on this being over in the next few months and returning to normal but we don't know if we will return to normal and if we return anywhere close to normal we could spark another wave of

reou that could shut us all down. >> i want to put numbers for you to comment on. in e past three months since the pandemic started in california five million people have filed for unemployment. that's about 26% of the state's work force. what do these numbert thchallen economic recovery in the bay area? >> absolutely. those numbers speak to the gr ing income equality that the pandemic has brought. there are many employees able to work from home. they tend to be higher paid employees already. there are many employees that are not given the option to work from home. restaurant workers and hourly workers and retail workers, they need to be on the site. those are the unemployment ai that have been filed. we have seeing growing inequality from the pandemic. a huge estion for as we begin the economic recovery. how do we bring them back and make them feel confident that they have discretionary income to spend. a ge part of the work force. one of the things that the

chamber is pushing for is opening up large commissary kitchens that allow restaurants to pivot from food trucks or delivery or takeout and bring the workers back earlier and allow th to woin a remote site that is safe and sanitary and allows them to come back to work. >> jeremy what are the signs that you are looking for? what are the signals that market will send at we are in a sustained recovery? >> we will get the numbers from back. d see how many will come there is that big jump in the national umployment or national employment. we improved in may unexpectedly. a lot of that was because the temporary -- the workers temporarily laid off in april or march were getting the ppe payments. a classification thing. it will be tough to even say if those numbers will really show we are back. i think what we need todo is continue to focus on the

infection numbers and the deatha ra the people in hospitals, right? we have not seen that improve in al a unalameda but it has improved in san francisco county. we will look to see if we can do insome we are asking those that are disadvantaged versus the higher clasd tech workers to service those people. we can't do that if they are in danger of getting infected and potentially dying and that is horrible to do and exacerbating the service d tech workers and need to look out for those people and make sure we arnot putting them in danger. >> are icere specific me to look for to say this is the point where we have sustained economic growth and we are in recovery? >> yes. the numbers we look at is how many small businesses in san francisco or how many businesses period are operationaioand remain operl. i think jeremy brings us a

great point. businesses thaare open right now, small businesses but bleeding out cash and the reason ey are opened maintain the customer base and maintain the fan loyalty and maintain the brand and it is fo not sustainablthem. how long will the businesses be able to survive and si new sses relaunch, how long will they stay in business or get shut down after a second wave of infectio or outbreaks. we track the daily numbers to see whether an economy isoing to be sustainable over the long term. >> jay change, public policy director at the amsan francisco r of commerce jeremy owens san francisco chief and tech edor for market watch. gentlemen thank you for joining us today. >> thanks r having us. >> this week the california departmeof education unveiled guidelines on what school districts should do to prepare for students returng to classes in the fallmm among the redations, face coverings worn by teachers at all times and hand washing

stations and, of course, social distancing. students could alternate attendance for in person instruction with other days of the week being observed forb distance learning and big challenges rnsain including concabout another spike of the pandemic in the fall that cod keep kids home once again. joining me from skype s from richmondnior editor of education and equity julia mcal voy and dr. dan cooper a professor of pediatrics the uc irvine and joins us from yp from irvine. thank you for joining us. >> good to be here. >> jewel yang can you run through what administrators need to accomplish to get schools ready to reopen in the fall? >> i would say it is pretty challenging. logistical, one hurdle after esother. boarding bsafely and sanitation in the school and who will take temperatures at the door when they come in and screen them and how to keep them from removing their masks

ring the day. who is watching this and the ultimate question is what do we do if a child or staff member does present ill? how do we isolate them and then mat sure they picked up and how do we contact tracing and testing after that? we are t really quite set up robustly to take that on. perhaps by august when some schools reopen that will be t i place basically prea it is very detailed. these are not mandates r schools to reopen. thse are guidelines. these are suggestions and each t dists told by the state department of education basically to work with its local public health department reto make that when is the what exact circumstances they are allowed to reopen as well. >> dr. cooper is it realistic to think that students and teachers won'be sectors of the disease consider how they mingle and play? >> that's a tough question. we don't know the answer to that yet. idea has ming up because the

children are relatively asymptomat, that they mainly have the infection and may be carriers. the data suggestso far that may not be the caseut we really haven't seen large scale studies where the children are back in school. we have seen some studies for example, from holland. that demonstrated that the mosti common traion pathway is from adult to child but that was during a time in holland when the shelter in place rules were therdo sue we know from looking at schools around the world that there are examples of successes and there are examples where there's outbreaks in thdo schools. wet know yet whether those outbreaks appeared from the kids to the adults or from the l to the children. this is really important and yet unanswered question. >> but you are in favor of sending kids back to school in the fall despite the risk of infection? >> yes. this among many of my

colleagues o are expertin the transmission and experts in social andbehavioral that the risk of keeping children at home suggest that you can keep them in a bubble that they te won't ct with anybody. we know that is not the case. so my thought is that at least with the schools and with all ug of the ts of the work going to it we have some ability to control teract and the fact that kids themselves are not getting that sick, now thure are exceptions of , the fact that the kids themselves are not getting so sick suggests to me that this is the probably the most best way to go to try to reopen the schools carefully. >> julia you are following a fascinating case in morin where one school district reopening and bringing students back. how are theyoing that? >> yeah. it began with the county deciding that she wanted to bring small groups of special education students in at three different schools and doing tspiwith them.

classes no longer than ten students. then it went into a school called bay side lmarther king academy that is in sausalito morin area and they have been schoolin27 students now since around may 20th and i was there yesterday and soi of saw how they done it and what they do they have kids being dropped off in different stages. o they line upcourse six feet apart and then they come in to a door and a temperature check. they ask the kids if ckthey fel the night before, did they have any diarrhea or thvomiting an wash their hands for 20 seconds and they go in the classroom. inside the classrooms the desks were spaced apart one teacher had a mask on and another did

not. partment says they could have children who were under twelve not wear a mask but he is trying to make sure that every child keepthe mask on but the county public health department is indicating that the school has some leeway here and he's trying to go above and beyond e to mre that it remains as safe as possible. re you know theon they did this is because those chilen, there were 35 kids that were falling behind. they weren't pa turning in homework and they felt that kids would fall behind in this situation and they felt really badly about that. they said, look arif you not going to turn your homework in maybe you would like to come to school and teachers volunteered.they saw what was g the special ed classes. we know you are in wether would like to come in and we will hold virtual classes for in everybodthe school room and those five kids that i know are falling behind in class can join in and i can in person help them ile they are in

there and doing this virtual classroom for everybody else. >> dr. cooper i would ke to get your take on this. does that sound like a model to work for other schools and is they're one more important than another say masks versus social distancing? >> so let's start withthe latter question. i think the social distancing is probably looking at all of the evidence although there's nothing absolutely firm. i think the social ngdistan is probably the most important and for most schools as julie pointed out keeping class size down and manageable and hand washing is very important. mask wearing i think the data suggests that it helps. it is really important to not politicize this. unfortunately in my own region in orange county one of our outstanding health care officers actually resigned beuse her me and address were put out there because she advocated masks. people gathered at her home and it was a very frightening and intidating experience for her. the idea of suggesting that we

should do everything we can and something as simple as using masks is a good shidea and ld not be politicized and try to do it. the other children were studied in other nzepidemics. inflyounger children do have a hard time wearing masks. the downside ofwearing masks it can sometimes produce the opposite effect. younger kids touch their faau and nose b of the masks and the whole point of the mask isto keep the droplets from spreading and two keepinyour hands away from the droplets. dividualized. s should be >> julia can you talk to us about how the pandemicand this question of education and distance learning versus at the school has widened the equity gap and the equity questio >> yeah, the pandemic has revealed the digital divide and parents thhave means that have educational backgrounds and stayome with the kids and

supervise the learning and internet wi-fi that ishigh eed. a lot of parents can't afford to stay home with their children and have to go to work and their children at home and they may not have a computer or wi-fi and those kids are falling behind in the discipline of learning in many regards. when sools reopen i think you will have parents making the same choices in the same positions of y.equity in soci parents can say that is too risky i won't send my kit and others will say i got to go to work thank god the school are opening and i will send the kids to school. the schools may do a fantastic job and safely implemented but at the end of the day the parents don't haveuch of a choice don't think personally and if those kidsod forbid do contract something in school and go home they end up in families where more people in a household and somebody with an underlying condition and it is possible we may see more people

of cloud covering suffering disproportionatal deathsas a result of schools opening up. thank you both. you can find your on covege on our website. you can reach me through our edsocial handle. thank you for watching. good night.

captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org >> can washington heal, the nation's racial wounds? reconciliation. ave >> this country has not reconciled its differences with us. >> the uperror over the killing of george floyd andew sparks debate in washington over the nation's confederate past. >> and our bill and the white house. robert: just months before the election, president trump says it is all about law and order. president trump: we have to take the police and they will do a great job.