>> the country is on fire and their anger is directed at law enforcement officers. >> narrar: a national outcry.e >> geooyd! >> narrator: and one police force trying to change. >> can this done in a way that still respects people'? righ >> narrator: new yorker writer jelani cobb investigates. >> the war on our police must end... >> what people really want is they don't want be murdered running from, at a traffic stop or their kneck stood on because of a twenty dollar bill. they don't want to be murdered. >> narrator: now on frontline, "policing the police 2020". >> frontline is made possible by contributions to your pbsie station fromrs like you. thank you. and by the corporation forad

public bsting. major support is provided by the john d. and catherine t. macarthur foundation, committed to building a more just, verdant and peaceful wor. the ford foundation: working with visionaries on the frontlines of social change worldwide.ti adal support is provided by the abrams foundation, committed to excellence injo nalism. the park foundation, dedicated to heightening public awaren critical issues. and by the frontline journalism fund, with major support from jon and jo ann hagler. and additional support fro ura debonis and scott nathan. "policing the police 2020" is supported by chasing the dream, a public media iniative from the wnet group in new york that examines poverty, justi, and economic opportunity in america, with funding by the jpb fountion. >> please... please! please, i can't breathe!

>> get up, get in the car! >> i can't move!itin' the whole! >> (wailing) >> just get up and get in the car! >> mama... >> get up and get in the car ght! >> mama... i can't! (video continues on comput) >> jelani cobb: the minneapolis lllice had responded to a that a man had tried to use a fake $20 bill at a cornestore. >> you're stopping his breathing right now, bro, you think that's cool? >> cobb: they pulled him from his car. put a knee on his ck. >> hs not even resisting arrest right now, bro. >>obb: some eight minutes later, george floyd was dead. >> is he breathing right now? check hipulse! >> i'm not gonna have this conversation. >> check his pulse! ♪ >> cobb: i watched the video at home in new york. >> george floyd! george floyd! >> cobb: i watched the unrest in the streets... (people screaming) ...t. outbursts of violence.. (people shouting) ...and the president send in federal officers. >> i am your president of law

and order. ♪ >> cobb: all in e midst of a pandemic in which blk people have died at more than twice the rate of whites. >>lackives matter! black lives matter! >> cobb: the angry tabn the streets is a reckoning with the fact that, in this country, race is a shorthand for a set of life probabilities. >> what's his name? >> george floyd! >> what's his name? >> george floyd! ♪ >> cobb: the odds are different in black america. of dying of covid. ofeing poor. >> no justice! >> no peace! >> cobb: of being incarcerated. of being abused-- or even killed-- by the police >> don't shoot! >> hands up! >> don't shoot! >> hands up! >> don't shoot! (people shouting) >> cobb: six years ago, when i was covering theast uproar over police brutality for "the new yorker"...

people have been out here w for, you know, ten nights, 11 nights in a row. ...in fergus and baltire... i've talked withoung people here, there seemed to have been, you know, rely entrenched distrust for the police before. ...and at the dawn of the blacki s matter movement. if you're simply relying on the mechanisms of kind of behalf, it's not going ton your happen. i teamed up with frontline to report on what it take for policing to ever be different.a i went to ace with a history of deep distrust betweea polind african americans: newar new jersey-- a city that still bore the scars of a violent rebellion in 1967, after white cop beat up a black cab driver. >> race riots rocked new jersey's largest cit newark, nights.e consecutive days and at least 24 persons are killed. >> cobb: five decades later, the problems persisted. when i arrived, the ci had just been singled out by the department of justice for

abusive and discriminatory policing-- for routinely violating people's civil rights. >> racial profiling... >> unconstitutional stops... >> stop and frisk, excessive force... >> cobb: particularly blackle peop. ♪ but newark was also becoming a laboratory for ways to improve licing. the justice department had begun to mandatehanges, and residents had recently elect a mayor who was a longtime advocate for police reform. he was also an old friend of mine-- ras baraka. we'd gone to college together. we'd been activists together. i wanted to know howe planned hi, mrs. baraka, how are you?e. so good to see you. his mother, amina, answered thes door on this v in november of 2015. i've been coming over here, and sitting around and reading y'all's books, and eating your food and allhat. i had visited the baraka house ny times over the years, first as a friend and classmate, and then later as a young

historian to interview his father, amiri baraka, who was a legendary poet and leader in the black power movement. >> here comes the mayor, on me. >> cobb: that is amazing! >> isn't it?ob >> c mayor baraka. we'd seen each other occasionally over the years... we can sit down and start talking. ...but decades had passed since college. you came in '86. >> '86. >> cobb: it was the start of a series of conversations we had about transforming policing. (laughter) we began with a shared memory. i'm pretty sure you remember this. in 1991, youme, four other people, we were in cortlandt, new york, to have an activist retreat. re we decided we oing to go hike up this mountain.d, an um, six of us walking down this road, and there's a police car for each of us. they want us up against th cars, and that experience, in some ways, it waformative. like, this is the function... >> of the police. o >> cobthe police. >> yea yeah.

i remember i didn't go back ouide, either. that was... it's crazy. that was just a crazy situation. but all of those kinds of in know, growing up as a black boy in newark, you get thrown on the wathe wall, yt searched, you get put on the ground. those kinds of things i weth ugh regularly. as a kid, you think their job is to come and disrupt and cause, um, you know, havoc, almost. and the real dichotomy othat is that we still thought that they should be doing theirob in the community at the same time, right? s ething happened, you call the police. and, um... so it's like you're >> cobb: we've talked about those formative experi that, that we had as young people.om and then youhome and become involved in politics. was there an idea that policing could be different? that this was something th there was a means of changing it?>> hat the police's function is in the community, how they relate to the community. all of those things i can behanged.

it's difficult and it's, like, a heavy lift, but i would rather be involved in a process of doing that than sitting around being the viim of it. ♪ >> cobb: baraka had only been in power for a short time, but he was already taking big steps to transform the relationship between e police and the community. >> no justice! >> no peace! >> no justice! >> no peace!rs >> cobb: for y. >> welcome to the newark municipal council's public meeting. >> cobb: ...people in newark had been calling for civilian oversight of the police.ro >> i been ed by the cops, i done been assaulted by the cops... >> i've been a victim of them more than once. i've been a victim of reliation after reporting police abuses. a >> cob in 2016... >> motion to close the public hearing. >> cobb: ...baraka helped push the idea through the cy council... >> unanimously, yes. (cheers and apause) >> cobb: ...creating a uniquely pordrful civilian review boa with the power to subpoena and recommend discipline. but that vote was just a first and at the time, there was

concern and opposition among the poce rank-and-file. ♪ i wanted to understand their perspective.to ee firsthand what policing looked likin a poor city, long plagued by violence... >> details this morning in a sedouble shooting in new j >> a string of murders in newark. ten of them in as many days. >> al violent crime in genera has risen to more than 3,000 incidents annually. >> cobb: ...and to see for myself what the mayor and justice departnt were trying to change. >> we had a gun robbery at 12:30 hours. 49 fairview avenue. the victim, mr. stokes, previously classified g-shine, blood gang member. fairview homes, we will ride by and monitor that location.ob >> i went out with the gang unit-- back then, one of the department's most problematic divisions. ey were notorious for their aggressive tactics trying to get guns off t street. in newark, most of the victims and perpetrators were black and latino >> good to see you, man.

>> likewise. likewi. >> cobb: so were most of the cops. r eady? come on, slim! c (car alarping) >> all right, son. a cobb: one night, i rode with ricardo reillo, former truck driv, and wilberto rui an air force vet. both from newark. (radio chatter) where's he at, you see him? >> isn't he out right there? come here! come here, man. he cobb: the officers said were out there hunting for guns, drugs, and intelligence about gang rivalries. >> you guys don't know anythingh about shootings going on do here? >> cobb: they were conducting what they called "field inquirs." >> see your hands. see your hands got something in your pants, man? >> no,ir. >> so then why are you shaking like that? >> cobb: basically stopping and frisking. (chatter, radio chatter) ♪ is, how does the decision get

made to say, "okay, we need to stop that person," or "we need to do a field inquiry with that person"? >> you as an officer, you eventually build certain skills. you start learning how to read people, thr body language. if one person doesn't want to take his hands out of his pockets, starts pulling away from you. obviously, if he starts nning, you know. >> you kw more or less, when you pass them and they give you that look, you know. ♪ >> cobb: police are supposed to have what's called reasonable suspicion to stop someone, not just a hunch. there's room for discretion. >> we just wanna make sure you're all right. step off. >> cobb: but in its report on newark, the justice ment wid found that police were stopping people thout legal justification roughly 75% of the time. >> he's only ten years old,t? ri he's my little brother, yo. >> relax, little man. how old are you? >> 13. walking.ght, so what you... keep walking. that's what we have to deal with inhe city of newark. 13-year-olds talking back topo

ce. >> cobb: do you think he was justified to be worried about his brother? a >>olutely. but he sees who we are. we're police. he shouldn't be afraid of police.♪ ♪ >> spread your feet apart. >> cobb: as troubling as all this appeared to me...>> right there, right there. (people shouting) got it, got it. we got the weapon! (bleep) we got the weapon! cuff him! >> cobb: ...almost every night that we were out with the gangey unit, ot a ghe streets. >> welcome to the fbi, pal. (laughter) >> cobb: at the end of one night, i talked to officers ruiz and reillo about what i'd been eing. i'm just going to ask you straight out. is it possible to make the communities that we're talking about safe while respecting >> absolutely.itutional rights? absolutely. without a doubt. >> cobb: but the d.o.j. doesn't feel like that's what'happened

here. >> that's an opinion. spmean, we go out there. it's not any dist to anybody out there. it's not about race, you know, or violating tir rights. it has nothing to do with that. we have a job to do. we live in this city.is we care out ity. this is what we do. >> cobb: i have to tell you so, i grew up in queens, right? and on... my first experience with the police was that i was thrown up against a mailbox just likeis ne. i was coming home from a baseball game, had my uniform on, wacarrying a bat and a glove. the guy said it was a crime that was kind of, like, "i'm coming from a game." the next experience i had was a few years later. i was walking with a group of friends of mine, and a cop pulled a gun on us, and told us to get on the sidewalk. >> you can point your weapon commands to complyve them once you feel like the threat's neutralized, like, you know, they're complying with y, then you put your weapon away, and you know... >> have a normal interaction. >> yeah, have a normal interaction. >> cobb: but can you really have

a normal interaction if someone's pointed a gun at you? i don't, i don't... >> you got to look at it our way. s i mean, th there was five or six males, and one of them possly has a weapon. what would you do as a police officer if you encounter a group of males, one supposedly has a weapon on him? w would you confront the situation? >> cob i'm not sure. but that's why i asked the question about, can you do this-- can this, can this be done in a way that still respects people's rights? i think that's the question that everybody is wondering about policing. >> listen, we try to go out there d respect everybody's ghts. >> exactly. >> we're not out he saying, "hey, we're going to violate this person's rights." that's not what we're here for. i ll you, our in objective is to go home at the end of the night. >> cobb: no matt what their critics said-- or what the federal authorities found-- these cops seemed to have no doubts about the way that they did their job. (radio chatter) that was most clear to me in how they handled one particular st. adio chatter) >> yo. yo.

hey, hold on! hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up! >> stop, stop, stop, stop. >> you want to pull away from me, man? you're gng to get hurt. >> stop resisting.no >> sir, i did >> cuff him for safety. >> all right, sir. >> cuff him for safety. >> i dn't do nothing! >> just stop. >> sir, you' not under arrest. this is for your safety and our safety, okay? all right, bring him up to hisf> tand up, man. why are you acting like a jerk, bro? we stopped you (bleep)... >> you can't pull away from a cop. >> yes, you did, sir, because you pulled away from me. >> bro, i said, "don't touch me, please." because y'all pulling up, what the (bleepdo? nothing. i'm walking home. you don't even know what the hell's going... i'm goinho. >> yeah, and that's why we're >> i am going homeo you. >> when you start pulling away, it's on. >> i didn't pull away from nobody! >> shh. look, we ain't going to do tha if you want to do that, we could do that. >> listen.? do you understand the reason why you're cuffed? >> no. all right. now, when we came and approached you, what did you do?

you automatically pushed away from us. >> no, i said, "don't me," and ke walking. >> listen. listen, you're making us think you have a weapon, the way you ran away. >> y'all are worried about me? oh, n. okay? >> listen, just relax. >> relax. you got it. >> you got it? find out who he is. >> my man, it's not wio pull away from usike that, you hear? >> not my fault, man. >> all right? >> you know, the violence from and, and the way y'allnow. approached me, all i was doing was walking home. ifng'all would have said, "y man, what are you doing?" >> what are you doing today? >> going home. i don't care about... >> you see how fast that was? >> do not stereotype, because that's what y'all d to me. >> hav, sir. >> y'all be easy. ♪ >> cobb: theops were supposed stop.ite a report about that >> dinner of champio here. he cobb: but when i later tried to get a copy, tepartment told me they had no record of it. >> that's lunch. >> about to shut it down. ♪ >> cobb: it spoke to a larger

problem in newark. >> i just need you to sign these files out. >> cobb: thank you. according to d.o.j investigators, hundreds of allegations of illegal stops or excessive force-- largely involving black residents-- had igver been propey invested many had not even beenwark pd. documented. ♪ >> what's going on? how you ing? good, good, good, good. >> cobb: i talked to the mayor about what i'd been seeing. how you doing? yeah, yeah. >> i'm visiting the precincts, man, letng them see people in here working, you know. >> cobb: we met up one day while he was touring the cy's police precincts. ♪ we've been out with the gang unit. they're going around and getting guns. getting illegal ns requires you rolling up on folk. >> yeah. >> cobb: how doethat happen without being the same sorts of policinghat people are protesting about? >> intelligence. who is actually somebody you

dshould probably stop, an somebody who's just ms. martha's kid going to the store with his hat to the back, right? i mean, intelligence gets you that information, not just, like, random sps. that's not how you p i mean, that right there is racism. >> cobb: but these are black and brown cops.o >> yeah,at? >> cobb: diverse police officer, police force. >> it's not the who did it thate t racism. to me, it is the fact that, overwhelmingly, it happens to one specif group of people is what makes it racism. it becomes systemic, and most of the problems come from like that. they believe that everybody must be a gang member, i'm going to grab you, and, and it'wrong, it's unconstitutional. >> cobb:ot long after we spoke, the gang unit was disbanded, and one of the officers we rode with, wilberto ruiz, was fired following multiple complaints against him. >> you need the right people t doing the of stuff. >> cobb: at the same time, the mayor wawelcoming the d.o.j.'s help to fix the systemic problems here.

a lack of resources and expertise-- and the friction of local politics-- have long made it difficult for cities like newark to reform their own police departments. that's why, more than 25 years ago, congress gave the department of justice extraordinary powers to police local police deparents. it happened in the wake of the infamous beating of rodney king by four white cops in l.a. >> not guilty of the crime of assault by force... w >> cobb:n the officers were acquitted... >> you (bleep) piece of (ble) pig!n i hope you bur hell! >> cob ... the city exploded. congress decided to act... >> the crime control and law enforcement act is adopted. >> cobb: ...adding a provision to the 1994 crimbill that gave the department of justice the power to investigate local police dartments and force them to reform. >> congress thought it waspo ant for the justice department to have a way to

really address and engage systemic reform in police departments around the country. >> cobb: vanita gupta ran the civil rights division of the justice department under president obama. >> we are here today to announce a landmark settlement agreement between the justice department and the city of albuquerque. ...an exhaustive revieof the cleveland division of police... ...the challenges related to policing in the city of >> cobb: the office used its power aggressively, opening 25 new investigations into law enforcement agencies for civil rights violations. all but a few ended up in agreements to carry out reforms. many of those were court- enforced consent decrees. how effective have these decrees been? >> so they've been really effective. and look, they're not... the net result of our work in a policeepartment does not result ia perfect police don't think there is such a thing as a perfect police department. but we have seen in police departments over and over again-- small and big-- that even where there's deeply entrenched discriminatory policing, or problems with use

of force, or lack of accountability, that those are changeable over time. ♪ >> cobb: on the day we spoke in 2016, gus in newark to sign the consent decree between the city and the jus department. >> i now stand before you to announce this agreement that holds the potential to make newark a national model. >> cobb: the agreement would force the city to spend millionr of dollars te new policies, train officers, and overhaul the departmens disciplinary system. >> and i know that together, weee going to be able to wr a new chapter for the police officers of newark and the thank you.s that they serve. ♪ >> the city of newark, new jersey, agreed today to reform the way its police treat minorities. >> from now on, officers' actions, their use of force, ans investig will be closely watched. >> ...revise its search and seize policy, in car and bod worn cameras, collect data on all uses of force, and create a civilian oversight entity. >> cobb: as reforms got

underway in newark, and the pushing through an unprecedented number of consent decrees... >> friends... >> cobb: ...an entirely different view of race and policing wbout to take hold in washington. >> ...the war on our police must end and it must end no (cheers and applause) >> cobb: donald trump was on his way to victory.he and fromery beginning of his presidency... >> i, donald john trump, dowe solemnly... >> cobb: ...investigating police departments for civil rights violations was no longer priority. jeff sessions, the new attorney general, spelled it out. >> i made it clear that this department of justice will noton signnt decrees that will cost lives by handcuffing the police rather than handcuffing the criminals. >> cobb: christy, how are you? >> cobb: good.ow are you doing? thank you for taking the time to talk today. i recently spoke-- remotely-- l

with chrisez, who oversaw the d.o.j.'s police investigations during the obama administration. >> there was this narrative that many were trying to paint, that these consent decrees were this radical ing that were happening, and they were not. they really were simply meant to keep police departments fromly systematiciolating people's rights.op >> cobb: left the department right before jeff , jeff sessions sa, "athe end of the previous administration, many of youyou came to believe that some of the nelitical leadership of this country had abanyou," speaking to a police officers group. >> some radicals and politicians began to unfairly malign and blame police as a whe for the crimes and unacceptable deeds of a few. >> cobb: and he then goes on to say, "and let me say this loud anclear..." >> ... long as i am attorney general of the united states, the department of justice will have the back of all honest and honorable law enforcement

officers. (applause) >> cobb: what were you thinking this was happening, as allng this w unfol >> i was tnking, "this man is living in the last century, if not two centuries back, and this policing."noing about because i think he cares about police, but i don't think heal ed how, what he was advocating for actually hurts police, along with black people and latinx people. >> cobb: how so, how does this hurt black people or latinx people? >> if you, iyou tell police that therevious administration was abandoning you because they were insisting that you comport yourself consistently with the constitution, then you are telling police that they have a right to police without comporting themselves to t constitution. >> please don't be too nice. like when you guys put somebody in t car and you're protecting their head, you know, the way

you put their hand over? like, don't hit their head-- and they've just killed somebody-- don't hit their head? i said, "you can take the hand away, okay?" (laughter) >> cobb: since president trump came into offi, he has signed two executive orders aimed at improving policing, but theju ice departmentas initiated only one new investigation of a rilice department, and unsuccessfully ted to end pendg agreements in baltimor and chicago. the justice department and former attorney general sessions clined our repeated requests for an interview. the d.o.j. pointeds to public statements of the current attorney general, william barr. >> i think that there are instces of bad cops. and i think we have to be careful about automatically assuming tt the actions of an individual necessarily mean that their organization is rotten. say that these aremicople who problems, and there are people who say that this is just th work of a few bad apples.

>> yeah, i think the fact that thosobad apples are allowed t remain on police forces, even after th've killed people and after they've been harming people, sometimes for decades, t go to other police departments and same thing, indicates to us that the problem is not just with these "bad apple" ficers. there are systemic diciencies that are allowing them to exist and to persist and to continue erking, and, and to conti harming people, and i have seen that in every department that i. have investiga ♪ >> cobb: and that, as much as tanything else, is what s country on fire this summer. not only that george floyd had been killed, but that the cop who killed him had a history of complaints, yet still was on the job. >> all of us here want justice we want him found guilty! >> no justice!pe >> ne! >> cobb: as people took to the streets... >> jusce! >>n do wwant it? >> now! >> cobb: ...venting their frustration with how many names there are to say...

>> say her name! >> breonna taylor! >> say his name! >> george floyd! >> don't shoot! >> black lives matter! >> cobb: ...calling for defunding or even olishing the police, they were all, in essence, asking the same question: can this ever be different? ♪ that was the very same questio they'd been trying to answer in newark for the past several years. so, this summer, i went back to see how their experiments in police reform had been working out. >> george! >> floyd! >> george! >> floyd! >> george! >> floyd! >> cobb: one thing i noticed right away were the protests. >> black lives matr! black lives matter! >> cobb: unlike in other cities, where the police confronted protesrs with rubber bullets and tear gas... >> i can't breathe! >> i can't breathe! cobb: ...in newark, mayor baraka was leang the march. >> mayor ras baraka, give him a big hand. (cheers and applause) >> cobb: how've you been? >> good. >> cobb: we met up in a city

park. thank you for taking time. can you hear me? >> yeah. >> cob okay. f , in many places in this country-- dozensaces in this country-- there were protests that tipped over into violence. we saw police cars being set on re in salt lake city. >> right. >> cobb: newark as a city, it's almost the opposite. things remained relatively calmo during thests here. i wanted to understand how that happened. >> a lotf prayer, brother. historically, people know what we've been through in newark. r we needed poliorm in 1967, and we burned the city down for three or four days, and we still need police reform. o 50 years latso, so... they, i think, in their heart, and of itself would not give us the results we were looking for. fu cobb: he says the peace protests are partly due to the federal consent decree, which is still in effect in newark. the department of justice has said that they see consent

decrees as unwarranted affairs.intrusion into local i wonder what you, what you make of that.as >> well, if itt for federal intrusion, we'd, we'd i mean, we'd be inhape without federal intrusion. if the state or the municipalities can't provide justice for people who arerm , then the federal government should step in and, and defend people's civil ts. and i think that's important. and, and that's what the federal sgovernment is doing, tha their job. >> cobb: when the justice department came to newark back in 2016, peter harvey, a former new jersey attorney general, was appointed to monitor compliance with the mandated reforms and report to a federal judge every quarter about the city's progress. so it's been four years sincet the conscree began. how is the city doing overall? >> much better. i think that newark is anof examplhat can happen when a police agency decides to

reform. >> cobb: he says over the past four years, the police department has toughened its policies on everything from body camerato use of force. >> anyone else? questions? >> cobb: and implemented extensive training to help officers understand the new standards. >> do you understand? that would be a plain touch >> they absolutelyt know the law in certain aspects. stops, searches with or without a warrant. arrests with or without a warrant. there's no questiothat many officers did not know it. >> cobb: do you think that aining in itself works? >> if it's the right kind of training, yes, it works. now, the question is, what kind and part of what we've done with use of force is, we took videos mefrom other cities where e was killed, and asked them questions. "what should the officer do at this point?" "what were the alternatives that the officer could have employed here to de-escalate the situation?" so we're using these videos to help newark officers understand

that when you're in this moment, you had more tools than simply pulling the gun and shooting someone. >> newark's consent decree is about all of the things that people complain about as beingth wrong olicing in the united states today, right? like, it's about search ane, seizse of force, bias in policing. community engagement, oversight, l those kinds of things. >> cobb: deputy chief brian o'hara is newark pd's poinman for the consent decree. he reports to anthony ambrose, the director of public safety in newark, whinitially expressed some concern about federal oversight.id you hat it's every executive's worst nightmare. what did you mean then, and do w?u still see it that way >> well, i, i think when i say it's every ecutive's nightmare, is that, that you have a monitor. and now you have someone every day or every minute looking at your policies, looking at your practices, looking at it. years later, i think that, that

we've done some great things we've been able to train people that, that we, we wouldn't have been a train years ago because of budgetary issues. that it was mandatory that we had to train. if that's what it takes to get it done, then i'm for it. >> cobb: so far, surveys conducted by the federal monitor show a slight rise in trust in the police. but the data ao shows that the frequency of cops using force against newa's residentss en going up. based on the data that we've seen, it appears that incidents involving use of force are up. does that concern you any? >> i'm gonna have him answer , u. >> reporting is which is what you want. >> cobb: mm-hmm. >> reporting is up. so i think a lot of officersid not derstand that the lowest levels of force must be reported, even in situations no one got that beot arrested. then on top of it, after that, every month, we have a review board that meets here, and they determine, okay, do we have a a disciplinary issue here? do we have a training issue?

is there anything elseut this situation? was there an opportuty to de-escalate and they did not properly de-escalate? and from those, i mean, we've seen great success. >> no justice, no peace! >> prosecute pice! >> cobb: but that's not how many in newark, and around the cos.try, continue to see thi >> (chanting) >> cobb: after the recent r ootings of breonna taylod jacob blak the calls for civilian oversight of thepo lice have grown louder. >> it's against your code, bro! >> cobb: newark's own civili review board, hailed four years ago as a step forward, has actually been tied up in lawsuits. and this summer, the new jersey supreme court severely limited s power, striking down its >> what do we want?bpoenas. >> justice! >> cobb:t was a bitter hedisappointment to one of leading community activists, larry hamm. p >> tice review board is a mechanism to give civilians some power over the pond how the policearry out their

jobs. and specifically to deal with olation of constitutional rights, racist policing tactics, a use of excessive force, and unjust murder of civilians. when you saw chauvin. >> cobb: you mean derek chauvin, the officer... >> cobb: yes, derek chauvin, the officer that killed. k >> cobeling on... >> yes, that had his knee on george floyd's neck. when you look at that video, you know what the most disturbing thing was for me? w n't the knee on the neck. it was the look on chauvin's face. >> cobb: what did that look say to you >> it said that this was a man that had no worries about what he was doing. >> cobb: mm-hmm. >> he lookedtraight at the cameras-- he wasn't worried abouno cameras. you know why? becae they know that 99% of police brutality cases don't end in a conviction. see, when it's clear to them methat there will be an imdiate price to pay for unjustly

taking the lives of human begs, and unjustly brutalizing people, that you're going lose your badge, you're going to lose your gun, you're gointo lose your job, you're going to lose your pension, and yoifmight lose your freedom you're convicted, when they understand that, i guarantee you that there will be a precipitous decline in police brutality cases in the united states. ♪ >> cobb: no one fought harder against the civian reviewbo ard than the city's police union.av >> ia disciplinary process here for our members. nowhere in it does it say the members are subject to discipline by an outside, youeo know, group ofe. here in the city, we got body- worn cameras. something like 50% of the complaints made against lice officersre exonerated as soon as the body cam is viewed by internal affai. if there is a problematic cop

out there, he's not going to be out there for long, okay? you know, this notion thatis therust, you know, this army of police across the country that are just out thereu just aing people is not factual. >> cobb: well, if talking about use of violence, there are about 1,200, 1,100, 1,200 people who are killed each year in interactions with the police. a significant number of those people are unarmed. it's not just kind of peopleki it up. >> okay, um, last night, there was a million interactions with the police and nothing happened. you make it seem likthere are, you know, these ysical encounters with police are unjustified. you know, i think the vast majority of investigationsal rehey are justified. >> cobb: but i think that that's people would say is the oblem. that if you have an interactn with police, a sysm is set up that wl generally exonerate the police officer irrespective of what happens. >> you know, thaob that... >> i think thas the criticism people are making. >> i'm, i'm glad you mentioned it. but the investigation revealshe whatfficer is allowed to do, right?

you know, that's the beauty and the curse of social media. you see a video, everyone loses their mind.do "he can'hat, he can't do this." well, maybe he actually can. you know, maybe the la maybe why so many cops are not convicted-- which is, you know, part of the uproar-- is because they actually acted within their rights and within the law basedu on what ed at that time. >> cobb: the u.s. supreme court fihas established that an r can use force if they believe there's a that to their own life or to the lives of others. >> please, please... please, let me talk to him... >> cobb: but still, it'sften a murky question whether a cop using force against a civilian is justified.tc >> you're a bih, too. straight up. >> oh! >> cobb: take this incident caught on camera in newark in may, when officers were responding to a disturbance. c (vidtinues) >> get the (bleep)... ♪ >> give me your (bleep) hands! (indistinct chatter) >> i'm not even resisting.

>> so, put your handnd your back. >> i'm not resisting. >> cobb: it's currently under investigation. >> oh! >> stop punching him in the face like that! y >> pour hands behind your back! >> but you punching him, it's not that serious!al gonna break his (bleep) arm! >> cobb: is that a justifiable? use of for >> certainly. >> cobb: how is that justifiable? >> the suspect came at the police officer, he doesn't havei toto be struck by the suspect. he took the first action. then, trying to get him to comply, he not complying. that's why the officers are grappling with him on the ground. is, you know, is that st place to be? no. does it look goo no. it's not in the movies, put your hands hind your back and... it happens. sometimes it's a struggle. we're required to use the force nessary to get him under control. >> cb: should you be allowed to do that? >> okay, well, what's the option? oui'll go back to that, if if you wanna play that.

>> cobb: no, i'm asking you should you be allowed to do that? ow could we not? >> cobb: so i think th debate that we're having here is that many people would say that the fact that it's legal doesn't an that it's right. >> okay. you know, i, i can't dispute everybody's opinn. you know, is there an opportunity to maybe take a stea ? yeah, maybe. like you said, i were to break down every video that weer aw, you know, maybe you come up with something. fe police aren't going out there just looki violent encounters or looking to, you know, physicallympose their will on people. we want to come to work, do our job, and go home. we want a positive interaction with the community. but, you know, everybody's piling on, everybody's against u. there's protests or rallies all the time, anti-police this, anti-police th. you know it's a different-- difficult atmosphere to, uh, to want to be a part of in 2020. >> cobb: in the past few months, there haveeen proposals in

congress to create more clearly defined standards for the use o. force nationwi >> ranking senators are butting heads over the issue... >> we've asked that there would be a meaningful discussion of the justice in picing act. >> they don't want a debate. tey don't want amendments. >> cobb: thus fa bills have stalled, and a stubborn fact remains: police use force against black people at a far higherate than against whites. but newark's public safety director says that that is jt the reality of figting cri in his city. you said, "blacks are 1.6 times re likely to be stopped than to be arrested, and that police use force in those arrests 3.7 times more often but you also said those numbersf could createse impression that the police disproportionately target black people. what did you mean by that? >> okay, so, our homicides are 20, i think i read 22 homicides this year. about 94% are african

americans. i don't condone racial profiling. i don't condone police officers locking anybody up for their race or their gender or their creed or religion, anything like that, but the numbers are the numbers. >> cobb: newark's federal monitor is currently investigating whether the police are disproportionately targeting black people or whether, as brose says, they're simply responding to crime. but, regardless, crime statsha long been cited as justification for an aggressive type of policing tt critics see as an unreleing knee on the neck of entire comnities. >> i can't breathe! i can't breathe! >> cobb: it's why, right now, momentum is gathering not justto eforpolice, but to defund them and invest in alternative ways to addresscrims like newark. so, one of the things that came to prominence after the, the protests started, relating to f

georyd, was this national conversation about defunding the police. >> you know, as, as the mayor of, of a major city like wark, man, we, we always have to be clear ancareful about how we organize and what we say. for example, i think defunding'r nece right? i think it's necessary to begin to divert funding from policeti organis to social services, other kind of things like that. cobb: mm-hmm. >> we've been thinking about that in newark for some time now. uh, so...b: >> ce's publicly opposed calls to abolish police. he wants to keep them,tart aeating violence as a public health crisis, nroblem to be solved with policing alone. >> in public health, some people are sick. and because there's some people sick, you have to address them with doctors, right?yo have to address sickness. if the data says that if my father was involved in violent crime, i'm more likely to be

volved in violent crime, if that's what the data is telling us, then we have to intervene so that the n and the grandson is not targeted by the police, but is now targeted by people who are trying to give them cial servis to pull them out of a condition that they are almost guaranteed to become a victim of olence and a perprator of violence. and treat it as a public health crisis as opposed to the police response. ♪ c b: one way the mayor has been doing that is through a program he started several years ago, the newark community reet team, which enlists former gang members to defuse conflicts and work as mentors. >> you know, all of the conversations that are happening up here is positioning us, you know, to be e ones that reduce violence and crime in our neighborhood.>> cobb: he brought in aqeela sherrills, who had led successful violence reduction programs in other cities, including l.a., where he helped organize a peace treaty between the crips and the bloods. >> because, you know, we talker about gressive policing,

and police kling our kids with imputy. i'm, like, how do we deal with it? our own neighborhoods. crime in then that way, there's no need fo you know, 20 cops, you know? because if we making the neighborhood safe, then maybe we only nd five, and we need to deploy them strategically. and then we can have better relationships with them because we're not putting all of thisr pressure on ps to do things. ♪ >> wgonna start splitting up this side of the street and the other side of the street. >> cobb: the newk street team has grown to a 50-person organization. >> this is our 1-800 number. if you see something transpiring... >> cobb: it's become an important part of the city's overall approach to use community interventions, instead of police, to reduce violence. in july, we met up with street teamorkers in the south ward >> missed you this morning. >> we're starting here and just walking straight down. >> cobb: talk to me a little bit about what's happening here and down brookdale street. walking

>> yeah, so july 4 weekend, we had a double homicide on this bloc >> cobb: wow. >> you know, we're talking directly to the family members who've bn impacted, and ife th plans for retaliation, that we convince them not to retaliate. always say that we cannot stop the first blet, but we sure can stop the second, theou third, andrth one. >> we coming to you live mandating with newark community street team. >> this is one of the arease ars that's called a hot spot. >> we just want to touch everybody, if you need any farvices, we here. >> find us on oubook, like our page... >> cobb: the street team is also trained to answer distress calls. they're stationed outside of the city's schools. >> what me you going home, man? >> cobb: and they're embedded in the hospital to help victims ano perpet of violence with social, legal, and psychological services. >> we're trying toduce more alternative ways for people to actually address their you've got all of the violence that has happened over the years, multi-generational trauma. i'm, like, you know, you have young guys here, man, i'm, like,

it was astounding, brother, that most of the people on my team had been shot. you know, male and femal >> cobb: wow. >> and their parents were shot. shot.heir parents' parents were you know? >> cobb: trauma has been a constant in sherrills' life. growing up in l.a., t more than a dozen friends toen vi, and 16 years ago, his own son was shot and killed. he's devoted himself to conflict resolution. so how receptive has the newark pd been to your work? >> you know, it started out as a tense relationship, you know? but i think that over, you know, the past four or five years, we've really gained a lot of traction. doing in the city is the same,re it's to create public safetym. and reduce h and we have a different approach. we're not looking to arrest, we're looking to heal. >> cobb: you can say that reblic safety and policing not the same thing. >> that's right.

>> cobb: but in a lot of people's minds, they are. so how are you defining public safety? >> well, you know, first, you know, safety is, is dierent from, for, for black people and white people in is country, right?lk you o most black folks, and most black folks ain't never felt safe. and so public safety is not just the, the absence of violence and crime. we gotta increase that, thatin sense of well- where people feel okay about walking >> cobb: that invo night. trust-building with the cops, as well. >> this unorm is not a signn. of oppress >> cobb: the city holds regular eretings where police officers and community meshare their aumatic experiences with each other. >> part of the reason i'llever be able to see beyond you being a police officer is because you're not my neighbor. >> growing up in newark, you've experienced some level of trauma. i've seen my father beaten by the police, arrest by the police, you know. i've been arrested, stopped by the police, i've seele shot, all kind of stuff. so, ve been traumatized. and police a traumatized, because they were indoctrinated that the community don't like

them, thathe neighborhood is violent, that the criminals live here, people are gonna murder you, shoot you, they don't ce about you. and so what we try to do is go face to face, the police and the community,ome face to face with those kind of realities. ♪ >> brother damon, newark community street team. i know... i'll give it to you, brother. >> cobb: while it's hard to attribe changes in crime numbers to any one factor... >> just call us, rather than callg law enforcement. >> cobb: the approach in newark does seem to be having some success. c >> you walk in this way, y'all. >> cobb: last year, the city had a 30-year low in violent crime, and in the south ward, where there was a 50% reduction in homicides. >> i think that early on, when the mayor talked about bringing newark community street team in, and bringing people in, it, it had to be explained to the police division, "this is alternative policing. we can't do itll alone." whent first started, i said, "you know, mayor, i don't know how this is gonna work," youow >> cobb: were you a little bit skeptical at the beginning? >> i wasn't skeptical, i was, i

was concerned, like, all right, is there gonna be interference, you know wm saying? and, and i have to say that, that, you know, there's... call, we call them. i call aqeela up, i say, "listen, man, there's something going on here, blah, blah,d lah, cou look into this for ?", and he says, "we'r already on it." >> whoo, watch out for that cious... >> cobb: in july, the mayoron gave $11 milo programs like the street team, money he got by diverting five percen the public safety budget. >> y'all hit thi'all hit this ou >> andil you administer the training, you don't get different behavior on the street. >> cobb: but peter harhe federal monitor overseeing the reforms here, cautions that the push to defund police departments should be weighed against the facthat reforming them costs money, too. so is it fair to say that your perspective is that, you know, we should be increasg funding to police rather than defunding them? y >> i thi have to invest in certain components of police agencies if you want high- quality policing. if you're not going to

police agencies adequate resources for the components that matter-- bias-free policing training, communy engagement, use-of-force training, stop, search, and arrest, internal affairs, data systems-- then you are asking for trouble. ♪ >> cobb: as the country continues to grapple with the fallout of police violence, and thefrustrated calls for cha when it comes to policing, what i see newark gives me hope. >> let us all take a knee. >> cobb: it's an experiment that is trying to move beyond policing, and at least in some measure address problems that have plagued black americaor >> thank you. what people really want is, they don't want to be murdered running from, at a traffic stop, or choked to deathth becaus got a loose cigarette, or, you know, their neck stood on because of a $20 bill, or their kid murdered in front of a rec center for playing with a toy gun.

they don't want to be murdered, and the real crazyhing is, even if you defund the police, it's notoing to stop people from murdering us, or make, make right? see us as human bei that's not the crux of what, what we need to be getting at. and jesse said something powerful, and i don't, i don'tss quote a lot, but he said something powerful. >> cobb: jesse jackson? >> jesse jackson said, "listen,d he said, "n't struggle all these years just to have and kinderentler police force." that's not what we want, right? it wouldlpful, right? (chuckles): but that's not the end. the police represent a larger system that, that they're more african american women dieg giirth than on the streets by police, i because quity in the damn hospital. every institution in america has the same values that the police department has in america. the police just got guns.

♪ >> cobb: what struck me about that was that so much andha so littlchanged. ♪ 50 years ago, a mmission was appointed to investigate the caofe of the newark rebellio 1967. how you doing? >> thank you for coming. >> cobb: i'm here to see the lilley report. >> okay. ♪ >> cobb: the report laid blame with the police, but it also went further than that. rait blamed the violence oal inequities and the failure ofti public edu, as well as housing and employment the authors wrote that the report reflects "a deep failing inur society," and that ma of these problems "should have been solved by now." "theuestion," they said, "is

whether we have the will to act." 50 years later, the question remains the same. >> go to pbs.org/frontline... >> breonna taylor! >> ...for mo on how protests nationwide have impacted efforts at police reform. and listen to our podcast with jelani cobb on race, police, and the pandemic. >> we really neea kind of gigantic systemic overhaul in so mu of the country. connect withhe frontline community on facebook and the pbs video app anytime on pbs.org/frontline. >> we are takingack our country! >> we're in a battor the soul of america... >> narrator: as america faces an historic choice. ...as the coronavirus explodes... >> ...historically bad these unemployment numbers are... >> ...protests against police brutaly...

>> narrator: from frontline's the election year tradition critics have called a fair and humanizing look at both candidates- "the choice 2020". >> frontline is made possible by contributions to your pbsfr statio viewers like you. thank you. and by the corporation foric puroadcasting. major support is provided by the macarthur foundation, committed to building a more just, verdant and peacef world. the ford foundation: working with visionaries on the frontles of social change worldwide. additional support is provided by the aams foundation, committed to excellence in journalism. the pa foundation, dedicated to heightening publicr ess of critical issues. and by the frontline journalism fund, with major support from jon and jo ann hagler. and additional suppo laura debonis and scott nathan. "policing the police 2020" y

is supportedasing the dream, a public media initiative from the wnet group inew york that examines poverty, justice, and economic opportunity in america, with funding by the jpfoundation. captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org >> for more on this and otherne "frontprograms, visit our website at pbs.org/frontline. ♪ frontline' "policing the police 2020" is available on dvd. to order visit shop pbs or call 1-800-play-pbs. this program is also available on azon prime video. ♪

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