captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc >> woodruff: good evening, i'm judy woodruff. on the newshour tonight, democratic divide-- president biden's domestic agenda exposes a deep rift within his own party, as negotiations intensify ahead of another congressional deadline. then, former secretary of state colin powell dies from covid complitions after battling cancer. we remember his life, trailblazing career and complicated legacy. and, the whitest paint-- how its application to exterior surfaces could combat the world's rising temperatures. >> you only need to paint less than 1% of the earth's surface. we should be able to total reverse global warming. >> woodruff: all that and more on tonight's pbs newshour.

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thank you. >> woodruff: covid-19 has climbed two more rungs in its long, deadly ascent. naonwide, the virus has sickened 45 million people and killed 725,000. at the same time, the latest surge has slackened, and daily averages are down roughly 20% in the last two weeks. one of the latest deaths came today. his family announced that colin powell has succumbed to complications from covid. he was the first black chair of the joint chiefs o he was the first black chair of the joint chiefs of staff, the first black secretary of state and one time a potential presidential candidate. his family says he'd been battling a type of blood cancer as well as parkinson's disease. colin powell was 84 years old. we'll look at his life, later in the program. jury selection has begun in the

murder of ahmaud arbery. three white men confronted him as he ran through their neighborhood in brunswick, georgia in 2020. the defendants watched today as lawyers began questioning up to 1,000 tential jurors. the process could take two weeks or more. russia suspended its diplomatic mission to nato today. it was retaliation after the western alliance expelled eight members of the russian mission over alleged spying. foreign minister sergey lavrov also announced that nato offices in moscow will be shuttered. >> ( translated ): nato is not interested in equitable dialog and joint work. if that's the case, then we don't see the need to keep pretending that changes in the foreseeable future are possible. because nato has already shown the impossibility of such changes. >> woodruff: meanwhile, a russian-led security bloc began major military drills near tajikistan's border with afghanistan. they are the largest in years,

involving more than 5,000 troops. russia is concerned that taliban control of afghanistan might destabilize central asia. human rights activists disrupted the olympic torch lighting today in greece, for the beijing winter olympics. three people sneaked into the ancient olympia site, with a banner that read "no genocide games." they were quickly arrested. activists want the games moved because of china's treatment of tibet and of uighur muslims. former president trump filed suit today to block release of his white house records about the january assault on the u.s. capitol. a special congressional committee asked for the documents, and president biden agreed last week to release them. the trump suit argues they are protected by executive privilege. mr. trump also gave a videotaped deposition today over allegations that his security guards assaulted protesters in

2015. it stemmed from the day he announced for president, and claimed that mexican migrants were criminals and rapists. he now faces a civil lawsuit in new york. the u.s. environmental protection agency is moving to limit so-called "forever chemicals" that linger in the environment. the toxic compounds are known as p.f.a.s and are used in everything from carpets to cookware. but, they're also getting into water systems and food. e.p.a. said today it wants to set new drinking water standards, among other things. and in economic news, china's growth slowed more than expected in the third quarter, amid energy shortages and fears of a giant realtor's default. and on wall street, the dow jones industrial average lost 36 points to close at 35,258. the nasdaq rose 124 points. the s&p 500 added 15. still to come on the newshour:

american missionaries are kidnapped in haiti, as the country descends into further chaos. hollywood avoids a shutdown, but new questions mount over the strength of workers in this labor market. why democrats are struggling to unite behind president biden's legislative agenda. and much more. >> woodruff: on capitol hill, negotiations over democrats' multi-trillion-dollar work and family bill continue. our congressional correspondent lisa desjardins is here to update us on the state of play. >> woodruff: so, lisa, you've been reporting all day long, give us the latest. >> congress is back this week from a recess, and

talks are beginning in earnest, and especially around the white house. president biden is meeting one-on-one with democrats who are critical. today with camilla jaypal, but a lot of focus remains on the u.s. senate. there is, in particular, one aspect of what biden wants and what many progressives want that seems to be in jeopardy, and that involves the climate change portion of this reconciliation bill, the build back better bill. it involves senator joe manchin and some of the objections he has. it is the clean energy performance program, that essentially a program that would make it so that utility companies would either be rewarded or penalized based on how much renewable energy they use, trying to move them towards 100% renewable energy ultimately. they would be penalized if they don't go there. it is essentially a creative way to try to put a cost on carbon.

senator joe manchin of west virginia objects to this. no surprise why his state, west virginia, is powered 91% by coal and would stand to lose something as this deal stands right now. environmentalists say, however, this particular aspect, this way of trying to charge a cost for coal and other fossil fuels, it is a third of the climate impact, sort of the reduction in emissions they want. they say it is a critical part of helping to deal with this planet. essentially what you see is a fight between short-term job needs in places like west virginia, and long-term health of the planet that is playing out right flow. >> woodruff: you have a number of democratic senators pushing back, including senator bernie sanders. >> that's correct. i want to start with another senator -- this is one of the problems, while joe manchin says he can't support the bill with this idea of a carbon cost, here is what other democrats are saying, senator tina smith of

minnesota, she tweeted out on friday that she can't support a bill that won't get to where they need to be on emissions. so this is a problem for democrats to solve. there are people who think it hasn't too much, others think it doesn't have enough. and bernie sanders wants an aggressive climate bill, writing in joe manchin's newspaper in the gazette mail, saying "we now have a supportive opportunity to help the working families of west virginia, vermont, and the entire country." he has been going on conservative airwaves, in places like indiana, trying to clear this bill. he is clearly targeting senator manchin's state. he wrote on saturday: "this is not the first time an out of stater is trying to tell west virginians what is best for them, despite having no relationship to our state." sometimes these opinions or political, and people need to vent.

i think this is personal for senator manchin, and it will be part of the dynamics that will play out in the coming weeks. >> woodruff: you could almost see that one coming. then you have speaker pelosi saying she wants to get this legislation moving by the end of the month. today is october 18th. >> that's still the goal, technically, talking to democrats on both sides of the aisle. the reason october 31st is significant is that is when the highway authorization bill, those programs, expire. right now they're temporarily extended for a month. they end on the 31st. those would be renewed in the large structure infrastructe bill. nothing can pass if both bills aren't passed. we have seven weeks left, which is the end date for this congress, and it seems like a lot, but congress only meets three days a week in general, so we're talking about maybe two dozen days in the session left for them to

figure this out. i think we're talking about november, december, for getting deals done. >> woodruff: we will see. lisa desjardins, thanks very much. >> you're welcome >> woodruff: since their kidnapping over the weekend, a group of mainly american missionaries has not been heard from, nor has the gang believed to have kidnapped them. as yamiche alcindor reports, there has been a growing number of abductions in haiti, amid a number of crises there. >> alcindor: the 17 kidnap victims had just visited this orphanage on saturday when they were seized, a sign of mounting dangers in the island nation. >> ( translated ): when we hear there is a kidnapping, the effect of the kidnapping, we know it's not going to be good for drivers, motorcycle drivers. people do not go out in the streets. >> alcindor: the ohio-based“ christian aid ministries” says those abducted on saturday included 16 americans and one canadian.

five were children, one just two years old. haitian authorities say they were taken by the “400 mawozo” gang-- notorious for kidnappings, killings and extortion. the missionaries were snatched in ganthier, a community east of port-au-prince, within the gang's known territory. u.s. officials, including the f.b.i., are consulting with haiti to find the kidnapped 17 and bring them home. >> our embassy team in haiti has been in constant contact with the haitian national police, with the missionary group christian aid ministries, and family members of the victims. this is something that we have treated as-- with the utmost priority. >> alcindor: haiti has been experiencing hardship on many fronts. kidnapngs have spiked since president jovenel moïse was assassinated in july. in august, a massive earthquake devastated what was already the western hemisphere's poorest

nation, killing 2,200 people. and last month, thousands of haitian migrants were expelled from the united states, after crossing the border at del rio, texas, and sent back to haiti. against that backdrop, haiti's gangs have grown in power, even marching in the streets. with me now is gary pierre- pierre, founder of the "haitian times," an english-language publication serving the haitian diaspora. gary, welcome back to the newshour. gary, welcome back to the newshour. thanks for being here. what do these most recent kidnappings say about the current state of haiti and the insecurity there? >> thank you for having me. what it means is that the country is plunged into chaos. and it has reached a depth that we wouldn't even dream of just a few months ago. these gangs have been operating with impunity, and they have gotten emboldened as we go alone. >> yamiche: this was

carried out by a gang, mawozo. in the english, it is 400 mile zone. >>es. this gang has been among the most violent, the most brazen of the gangs that have been operating in haiti. they are based in the northeast corridor of the capitol, port-au-prince. the m.o. is to abduct buses, taxis. and so to maximize the ransom opportunity they get from abducting a large number of people as posed to individuals. >> yamiche: the other thing is in haiti, kidnappings have spiked, 200%, 300%, and people have gotten so scared. talk a bit about sort of what makes this kidnapping of these 17 missionaries, 16 americans, one canadian, different than the kidnappings we've seen in the past.

talk about the evolution of the kidnappings here? >> well, the kidnappings started years ago, by the way. it was basically targ targeting malato class. and then t the darker skinned people were targeted. and then after that, secrete vendors were kidnapped. just about anybody could be kidnapped in haiti. we've seen foreigners slowly being targeted. we had a french catholic priests that were kidnapped. and then we saw churches, they had gone inside churches and abducted the pastors and parishioners live on facebook. i was told that everybody is unfit accept white americans, because everybody is afraid of the wrath of the u.s. government. but with this kidnapping on saturday, it shows to

us clearly this is not a concern anymore. in fact, they are telling the americans, okay, come get us if you can. and so they've taken this to another level that, you know, this is the last stop. and every time i think this is the last stop, something else happens that tells me we have a long ways to go down. >> yamiche: the u.s.' position has been they do not negotiate with terrorists, they don't pay ransoms. how do you see this possibly being resolved here? and how does it connect with the way the haitian government and the haitian people see negotiating with terrorists and negotiating with gangs? >> the haitian government has negotiated with these guys. the haitian people have negotiated with these guys. it is very difficult, if you have a loved one in captivity for you not to pay the money for their freedom. the u.s. government has a different position. it is very clear. theyay they don't negotiate with terrorists,

but these guys are terrorists. we call them gangs, but they are terrorists terrorizing the country. it will be interesting to see how the u.s. handles it. i know there are f.b.i. agents on the ground, and perhaps these 400 miles have never dealt with the f.b.i. negotiator, and it will be interesting to see how this is resolved. they're going to demand money. this is all about money. this is not about ideology. it is not anything to do with political. this is: we want money, we want power, and we want control. we're going to attack americans if it means getting more money. >> yamiche: a tough situation in haiti. thank you, gary pierre-pierre, for joining us. >> my pleasure, yamiche. thank you. >> woodruff: this weekend the entertainment workers union i.a.t.s.e. reached an agreement on a new film and tv contract,

averting a strike that would have ground productions across the country to a halt. but it's not the only showdown between workers and businesses. and after over a year of risky and demanding work on the front lines of the pandemic, as stephanie sy reports, many low- wage workers have had enough. >> sy: judy, thousands of american workers are on strike, and thousands more are preparing to walk out in what some on social media have dubbed "striketober." last thursday workers at farm equipment maker john deere walked out over pay, working conditions, and benefits. from kellogg's cereal factories to film sets and hospitals workers'-- dissatisfaction is leading to strikes and threats of work stoppages. 24,000 nurses and other healthcare workers in california and oregon voted to allow a strike after negotiations stalled with private hospital group kaiser permanente. the collection action from workers come in the middle of a tight labor market and in a year

when many companies have posted record profits. we turn to rebecca givan, she is an associate professor of labor studies and employment relations at rutgers university. professor givan, thank you so much for joining the newshour. what are the major forces that have unleashed this discontent among workers in various sectors that we're seeing? >> well, the labor market is tight, but these workers have experienced a lot during the pandemic. many of them continued working, whether in the food supply chain or in health care. memany saw their employers bringing in record profits while they were putting their health and lives on the line, often risking the health and lives of their families. they're really seeing this stark demonstration that their employers don't care much about them. they don't care about their well-being, they don't care about sharing profits with employees, and they're really reaching their limit.

they're absolutely maxed out. >> i'm hearing that you believe this is a by-product of the pandemic, especially for the essential works. what other similarities do you see in what workers are asking for across industries? >> workers are asking for dignity and respect on the job. they're asking for control over their time. many of these strikes are especially focused on mandatory overtime, where workers aren't getting their time off between shifts. they're not getting their weekends. they're being forced to work an inhumannumber of hours because demand is so high. and they're also pushing back against two-tier systems, where newer employees are paid left than long-standing employees. a lot of these two-tier systems were developed when employees were short, but when employers are making money, they're not sharing the good times with their employees, and they're pushing back on that. >> i'm sure that a lot of

workers can relate to that two-tier system, but my questi is: are organized strikes and unions still the most affective path for workers to express their grievances? especially since union participation is still at an historic low. >> reporter: for unionized workers, going on strike is the ultimate weapon. but workers are participating in a number of different actions, whether or not they're unionized. we're seeing non-unionized members walk off, whether it is a fix to the air coconditioning in overheated work places. and we're seeing workers who don't have the opportunity to act together by going on strike simply quitting and taking a better job elsewhere, because the labor market is tight and other jobs are available. >> we have seen some head winds against workers and organizing, including from big corporations, such as amazon, which this year successfully defeated

efforts for unionization at its place. how do you think labor unions are viewing this opportunity? >> right now we're in a situation where labor laws are stacked against workers who want to form a union. even though the labor market is tight and workers have the ability to demand a bit more, it is extremely hard to organize a union in the workplace. we saw it at amazon, and in starbucks in buffalo, we're seeing the forces the employers will did. so even though it would seem like it's a good time to organize, it is still extremely difficult for workers who don't have a union to form one. >> and professor givan, i want to ask one question, which is from the corporate point of view: we know that inflation is raising prices for consumers. there are supply issues in

the economy right now. do these work stoppages potentially worsen things? >> work stoppages can lead to higher wages, of course, as workers win their demands by going on strike. but employers are making choices all of the time. they're engaging in stock buy-backs, they're paying dividends, and significant pay to executives. there are many ways they can redistribute their profit or decide to budget in different ways that can allow them to pay workers more without passing that entire increase on to consumers. so we have to understand that corporations are making choices. it is not a simple calculation that increased wages lead to increased consumer prices. >> rebecca givan, professor at rutgers university, you've given us a lot to think about. >> thank you.

>> woodruff: can a special experimental paint that recently made it into the "guinness book of world records" one day help keep the world from heating up? john yang went to west lafayette, indiana to find out. >> yang: the world-famous buildings of the greek isles. some less famous beetles. and the glaciers that, for now at least, dot the globe. their common color-- white-- helps keep them all from heating up. of all the colors, white absorbs the least amount of heat. it's the color that purdue university mechanical engineering professor xiulin ruan thought could help with climate change. ruan and several of his students spent years on a quest to invent a new kind of white paint that could cool the planet. >> you only need to paint less than one percent of the earth's pro.

we should be able to totally reverse global warming and bring the temperature back to where we want it to be. >> yang: commercial white paint is widely used in hotter climates because it reflects 80 to 90% of sunlight, which keeps surfaces from getting too hot. but ruan wanted to take it a step further and figure out something that would actually cool surfaces. >> what our paint does, it reflects as high as a 98.1% of sunlight, which means it only absorbs one point nine percent of sunlight, almost no heat from the sun. the commercial white paints, they still absorb 10 to 20%. so in essence, we cut the heat going from the sun by five to 10 times. that's a big deal. >> yang: and that's enough to make the difference between something that cools itself and something that heats up. >> yeah, exactly. >> yang: one of ruan's students, phd candidate joe peoples, showed us what makes this paint

different: it contains high concentrations of the chemical compound barium sulfate-- used in cosmetics and to brighten photographic paper. >> this is actually the barium and many people think this is very dangerous. it's actually not. it's actually safe to ingest. so when you do chemical medical x-rays of your bowels, you actually take barium sulfate that makes your bowels opaque so that you can see them in the x- ray. >> yang: how much paint are you going to make now? >> this will make about 50 to 100 milliliters of paint. takes around 18 hours and that will cover around a three by three inch square. >> yang: to see one of those small, painstakingly painted copper squares in action, we went up to the rooftop. >> this tile here is actually the brightest commercial white paint we can get, has the most reflectivity of around 88%. and then this is our barium sulfate paint, which has a reflectivity of around 98.1%. >> yang: and just with the naked eye, this looks a brighter white correct. this and actually this is cool

to the touch. >> already, yes. this one is absorbing so much more solar energy. therefore, it's heating up while this one is absorbing a little amount of solar energy, but it's rejecting more to deep space. so therefore we're getting it below ambient temperatures. >> yang: so it's actually cooling. >> it's actually cooling. just sitting here by itself with no electricity, it's cooling down below this outdoor temperature we feel now. >> wow, they're about 10 degrees different right now. >> yang: to give us an idea of the difference theaint makes, ruan and peoples fired up an infrared thermometer. >> what you can see here is this square is ry orange, which means it's very warm compared to our paint which means it's much, much cooler. >> yang: on this sunny, 73 degree fahrenheit day, the tile with their white paint was nearly 15 degrees cooler than the one with commercial paint and more than two degrees cooler than the surrounding air. we were on top of the world's largest air conditioning research lab, something ruan and peoples hope the world will need

less of with their paint. could this really could eliminate the need for air conditioning? >> i mean, you could eliminate air conditioning for certain sort of locations and i would say a certain time of the year. if you if you use this in phoenix, arizona or reno, nevada, it could save up to 75% of a cooling during the summer months. >> yang: large-scale production would mean increased mining for barite, but ruan says their paint is more environmentally friendly than current commercial white paint. it took the researchers more than seven years to test over 100 different materials before landing on this winning formula. tell me what it was like that moment or that day you realized you had succeeded, that this was actually cooling below ambient temperature. >> my research was literally watching paint dry. so when we actually finally got something that was successful

and what we theorized for so many years, it was extremely validating. >> i start to realize when we got so much interest from people all over the globe, we came to realize that many people need cooling, you know, affordable way and many places. aside from cooling, we need to address climate change. so that kind of make us even realize that, you know, our work can have a far reaching impact than we thought. >> yang: they've applied for a patent for the formula and partnered with a major paint company in hopes of bringing it to the wider public. for the pbs newshour, i'm john yang in west lafayette, indiana. >> woodruff: colin powell, the first black chairman of the joint chiefs of staff and first black secretary of state died today from complications of covid, but his family says he

also suffered from multiple myeloma, which compromised his immune system. nick schifrin has this look back at his life and career. >> schifrin: as statesman-- >> we will defend our interests from a position of strength. >> schifrin: and soldier-- >> our strategy to go after this army is very, very simple. first we'll cut it off. then we'll kill it. >> schifrin: colin powell, first generation american, became one of the country's most popular public figures, and an american success story. >> we have moved from denying a black man service at a lunch counter to elevating one to the highest military office in the nation and to being a serious contender for the presidency. this is a gnificent country, and i am proud to be one of its sons. >> schifrin: he was the son of jamaican immigrants and grew up in hunt's point, a diverse neighborhood in the bronx. his 35-year army career began in the reserve officers training corps program, or r.o.t.c., at the city college university of in new york. he became a platoon leader in cold war germany, then served

twice in vietnam. he rose quickly, to become the country's only fourth black four star general. and by the end of the reagan administration, the first black national security advisor. >> the next chairman of the joint chief of staff, colin l. powell. >> schifrin: under president h.w. bush, he was the first and still only black chairman of the joint chiefs. one of theost influential chiefs in modern times, the first to serve as principal military advisor to the president. >> it is most important that the chairman of joint chief staff be a person of breath, judgement, experience, and total integrity. colin powell has all those qualities and more. >> schifrin: by then he was a proudly reluctant warrior who created the powell doctrine. if force were used, it needed to be deployed overwhelmingly with clearly defined goals. in december 1989 25,000 troops invaded panama to overthrow manuel noriega.

and in january 1991, desert storm, to evict iraqi oops who'd entered kuwait. in days, the campaign eviscerated the iraqi army, and powell held regular, popular news conferences. >> we are assembling a very sizable ground force, to finh off the job, should that be necessary. >> schifrin: throughout his care, powell was a mentor and inspiration to countless black officers, including four-star army general lloyd austi the first black officer to command a division in combat, and the country's first black secretary of defense, who spoke today in georgia: >> i lost a tremendous personal friend and mentor. he has been my mentor for a number of years. he always made time for me. and i could always go to him with, with tough issues-- he always had great, great counsel. we will certainly miss him. i feel as if i have a hole in my heart. >> schifrin: by e '90s, powell was so popular, both parties courtehim as a presidential

candidate. >> ask him to become the 65th secretary of state of the united states of america. >> schifrin: he announced himself as a republican, and in 2001 became the first black secretary of state. he was a popular secretary inside the department, known for modernization, empowerment, and promoting diplomacy, >> schifrin: but on policy, despite internal clashes, and personal reservations about the invasion of iraq, he made the case for war, using what proved to be false intelligence. >> the facts in iraqi behavior-- iraq's behavior, that saddam hussein and his regime have made no effort-- no effort-- to disarm as required by the international community. >> schifrin: he later called the speech a “blot” on his record, and he left the administration in 2004. he returned to public eye in 2008 to call barack obama a“ transformational leader.” >> i think senator obama has captured the feelings of young people and is reaching out in a more diverse inclusive way across our society. >> schifrin: in the last few years, powell was the one

reaching out, especially to young people of color. his alma mater started a school for civic and global leadership in his name. and in its students, he saw himself, the kid from the south bronx with the big dreams, as he said just two weeks ago, in an online conversation with his daughter linda. >> each of you tell me, where are you from, where are your parents from, and what's your future? each one of them-- there were 12, i think-- each of one of them did that. and... >> they reminded you of yourself. >> but i said, my god. this is me. that's when i decided to do more than just show up every now and then. >> schifrin: for decades, powell did much more than show up. he died a national security trailblazer, at 84 years old. for the pbs newshour, i'm nick schifrin. >> woodruff: for more on the

legacy of colin powell, we talk to two men who knew him well. richard haass has known him since the carter administration. haass was the director of policy planning at the state department when powell was secretary of state during the george w. bush administration. he's now president of the council on foreign relations. and michael gordon is a long time reporter covering the defense department, and author of several books about u.s. military operations in the middle east. he is now a reporter for the "wall street journal." >> woodruff: welcome to both of you. richard, i want to start with you. as we said, you knew colin powell going back to the 1970s. what made him who he was? what made him so successful? >> well, he began with a tremendous advantage, which was extraordinary intelligence. he also had great curiosity and open-mindedness. he would spend time every

day absorbing information, integrating it with the information he already had, and putting together a new understanding of things. on top of that, he had people skills that most of us could only dream of. and he would invest in relationships. again, i remember when he worked at the pentagon, he would reach out to dozens of people regularly, not because he necessarily had something to say or ask for, but because he didn't. and it was his way of making sure these relationships were good, that if and when he needed to call on them, had he could. and so he worked the system better than anybody else i knew. >> woodruff: worked the system. and, michael gordon, he was the first black to serve as national security advisor, as chairman of the joint chiefs, secretary of state. what was it about his approach to the military? how did you see him from that perspective? >> he was really among the most powerful chairmans of

the joint chiefs of staff. he came to the position at a time when they just had done nichols, which enhanced the stature of that position. he had a charismatic personality, who knew how to maneuver in washington, including with the media, and he took office at a time when there were momentous events, the persian gulf war, when the u.s. r reversed saddam hussein invasion of kuwait, and in panama, and in somalia, and the end of the cold war. he was at the nexus of all these events, and he was the face of the pentagon for a lot of reporters like me. >> woodruff: the face of the pentagon. and then, richard haas, as we said, you served with him at the state department when he was secretary of state. i mean, there aren't many individuals who would serve both at the highest level of the military and then go on to be secretary of state. what was it about his

approach to foreign policy? >> well, it's a very short list. you have people -- soldiers and statesmen, people like george marshall, dwight eisenhower, it is a very short list. like lots of military people, he had a caution about the use of military force. he understood it was not an abstraction, judy. it was all too real in terms of its consequences on people's lives. and he had a real appreciation of diplomacy. he saw these two tools, the military and diplomacy, not in juxtaposition, but rather to be used in tandem. he had people skills, was comfortable in conversation, was comfortable trying to persuade people. was comfortable rethinking his own positions. and the fact that he had a military uniform on for so much of his life actually lent him great

credibility. if he was going to argue for compromise, it was hard to say about this combat veteran, this person who had risen to the chairmanship of the joint chiefs of staff, that somehow he was soft because he was anything but. >> woodruff: and michael gordon, you were talking to us about what came to be known as the powell doctrine. what was that? >> powell is a formidable figure that he was, his views were not without some controversy today, even in military circles. but he became known very much for the powell doctrine, which was the view that it really grew out of the war in vietnam, and basically a determination not to go to war in that way again. and it was essentially held that if the u.s. were to use military force in the future in a conflict, it had to have very clear goals. it -- the force needed to be decisive. very often that was interpreted as overwhelming, but at a minimum it had to be

decisive and have public support. so it was a very good model for the persian gulf war, where you're fighting saddam hussein's troops, and trying to roll back the invasion of kuwait or for the panama invasion. but it proved to be a less useful device when the u.s. had to approach what to do in bosnia and the balkans. it was not the choice of using overwhelming or decisive force, but trying to send a signal to avert ethnic cleansing. and it was an opportunity about the powell doctrine in the post-cold war era. >> woodruff: you were speaking to us how affective he was in communicating at being a later, and yet when you served with him at the state department in the george w. bush administration, he was the odd man out when it came to not being on board with the rest of the team in

terms of the decision to go into iraq. how did he handle that situation? >> i think in some ways being secretary of state was his most difficult position. he was more comfortable in some ways as chairman. he was more comfortable as national security advisor because there he was integrating the inputs from other people. it was more of a coordinating role. as secretary of state, you have to be more of an independent advocate. and what he was advocating, most of the other people senior in the administration didn't want to hear. he was not enthusiastic about the war with iraq. he was not enthusiastic about acting unilaterally. he was, in general, much more enthusiastic about using d diplomacy. he was against going to baghdad during the gulf war, so he was not naturally inclined to do a second war, whereby definition, we would be going to baghdad. so it was a difficult four years for him. >> woodruff: to sum it

up, if that is possible, michael, what would you say colin powell's legacy is? >> the way i think he would like to see his legacy is as a person who sought to transcend ideological prescriptions for how to go about the world, who tried to secure a kind of internationalist agenda. he was very much in the mainstream. he was a general who became a diplomat. and an admirable figure who i think republicans and democrats all respected, even when they had differences with him. >> woodruff: richard haas, would you add anything about this legacy? >> it is the legacy of example. he was a moderate man, a man of the center, in a time now where such people are increasingly an endangered species. and that might be, in some ways, his most important legacy, a kind of decency he brought to public service and what he did both in government and

after leaving government, the idea of king the american dream a reality for a greater number of americans. >> woodruff: remembering colin powell. thank you so much to both of you, richard haas and michael gordon. we appreciate it. ♪♪ >> woodruff: president biden is again spending the week selling his infrastructure and "build back better" agenda to the american people and to members of his own party in congress. joining me to break down the status of the talks and more are amy walter of the "cook political report with amy walter." and tamara keith of npr. >> woodruff: hello to both of you. it is time for politics monday, amy and tam, welcome back. so, tam, let's start with where we think we are.

i see you wincing already. we heard lisa reporting that they're back at it, and there has just been a report i think from cnn that senator sanders and senator manchin met today. they said afterwards to reporters they're going to keep meeting, keep talking. but at this point, how worried ould president biden be? >> tamara: and i think you've asked that question maybe three weeks ago -- >> woodruff: sorry about that. so sorry. >> tamara: i think that there is, from outside, certainly a perception there is not a lot of movement. and senator sanders complained there is so much focus on the fight and not enough focus on the content and what's in the legislation. but part of the problem is that the fight is about what is going to be in the legislation. and they simply haven't agreed yet on what will be in it. so will child care be for everyone?

ll paid family leave be for everyone? will universal pre-"k" be truly universal? will senior citizens get their medicare expanded to cover dentures and i glasses? we don't know. they don't know -- or if they do know, they haven't told us. >> woodruff: amy, i feel like i'm asking this question every monday, tam pointed out i've been asking this question every monday, but we want -- some tib people will say it is just the drama they go through -- >> amy: well, it is the drama. i feel like i said this before, but it is important to say this every time: what the biden administration is attempting to do with this humongous package, trillions of dollars, we have never seen anything like this pass through a senate that is 50/50, and where the democratic speaker of the house has three votes. we're talking about threading the eye of the needle. and that has never been

done before. so it is -- >> woodruff: a massive package -- >> amy: a massive package with very small majorities. big reconciliation bills, big packages that only one party was supporting, and there were more membersf the party trying to push it forward could afford to lose, 30 or 40 house members. maybe a senator or two. this is zero room. what i'm seeing now, too, for all of the focus that is on this legislation, when you talk to some democratic voters, especially younger voters, younger voters of color, their frustration is not what is going to happen in this bill; it's, well, we voted in 2020 because we were told this was going to matter -- this is a existential threat, the republicans, donald trump, we were going to pass -- the democrats were going to pass voting rights legislation. we were

going to tackle police reform. we were going to tackle immigration. all of those issues that were central to so many of those voters coming and turning out for biden in 2020 and for democrats in 2018, and they haven't seen any progress on that. and so this is, i think, the other challenge that the biden administration is having, which is they want to get this passed, but for many even democratic voters, while they don't dislike this package, they have priorities that raise higher than what they're seeing here. >> woodruff: high expectations. and even though the package, we keep hearing it will not be $3.5 trillion, but it will be $1.5 trillion. amy mentions -- tam, you've been out on the road in the last several days talking to voters, including republicans who are finding some success in trying to, shall we say, stir up local

communities around some of the issues that they believe can work to their benefit in these coming up mid-term elections? >> tamara: i was in ohio, and "stirred up" is exactly what is happening in many of these communities particularly focused around school boards, where school board meetings have become raucous and places of protest, in essence. and police have had to be there. they've been sut down. they've had to go virtual because people showed up without masks. and it is something that we're alsoeeing in the virginia governor's race. we're seeing it around the country, an effort by republicans to really stoke the base, to get their base excited. now, the question is: could they also win over suburban voters who strayed from the republican party when donald trump was on the buballot but now he is not on the ballot? it is not clear they will succeed at doing that. certainly some of the voters i spoke to in ohio were just, like,

frustrated and angry and did not want their town to be the center of, you know, a polarized fight, and they certainly didn't want their school board to be in another one of these culture wars. >> woodruff: you're looking at polling a lot, you watched american politics for a couple of years, are these the kinds of things that have legs? could this end up something -- you know, doing damage to the democrats? >> amy: i think that tam is right, as an issue that energizes the republican base is really important. there is not something on the other side energizing democrats. which is why you're seeing in virginia terry mcauliffe, the democratic candidate, is talking about trump pretty much non-stop. i went and looked at the ad spending, the amount of money he spent on advertising to the voters in the state, and he spent about $3 million on ads

that include the word trump. so about a third of his ad budget is going to say my republican opponent equals donald trump. they want to nationalize a race in a state that is democratic as virginia. and if you're a republican, you want to localize it as much as you can. >> woodruff: trump was in the state last week -- >> amy: he called into the state last week. he had a presence. >> woodruff: so, tam, coming back to these -- to what democrats are trying. how do they counter something like that, what you saw in ohio? >> tamara: you know, it is not clear yet. there is a question of whether there might be a backlash to some of the fighting that is happening at school boards, where they -- you know, democrats can end up galvanizing voters to protect their school boards. but it is not clear that that is happening either. in the case of terry mcauliffe, who is running for governor as a democrat, again, in

virginia, he is basically begging congress to pass this infrastructure package that we've been talking about, to try to get democratic voters excited or engaged. >> amy: but trump is the one, that is the ansr to every question you're asking about what do democrats do? what is the counterbalance? one is trump will get our base excited, and then they would say passing this big bill, giving our voters and swing voters -- basically saying we've gotten this list of accomplishments done, but is that enough if on the other side of it we're still not doing well economically. >> woodruff: going back to what you described a minute ago. and what about imigration and voting rights. it is not that these issues haven't come up and aren't being looked at and worked on, but we're not seeing progress. >> in part because you can't pass -- this week

there will be a vote on voting rights bill. it will not succeed because democrats were unable to get enough republicans to go along with this. now, that's how it works. those are the rules. but if you are a voter and you say, i voted to give democrats power and they're not using it, that feels very frustrating. >> woodruff: and the same thing with police reform. there were efforts month after month, gun control -- any number of issues. so democrats at this point looking, tam, for something. maybe it is called infrastructure -- >> tamara: that's right. the old build back better. and independent voters are still frustrated with the polarization. and that was other one of president biden's campaign promises, that he could somehow heal america. if he could pass a bipartisan infrastructure bill, that could go towards soothing the concerns, but certainly

polarization is very present. >> woodruff: lisa desjardins was reporting earlier, maybe not in october, but we'll see in november, december. amy walter and tamara keith, thank you both. and that is the newshour for tonight. and that's the newshour for tonight. i'm judy woodruff. join us online and again here tomorrow evening. for all of us at the pbs newshour, thank you, please stay safe, and we'll see you soon. >> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> the landscape has changed, and not for the last time. the rules of business are being reinvented, with a more flexible workforce, by embracing innovation, by looking not only at current opportunities, but ahead to future ones. resilience is the ability to pivot again and again, for whatever happens next. >> people who know, know b.d.o.

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♪ hello, everyone. welcome to "amanpour & company," here's what's coming up. >> shock and reaction as a british member of parliament is stabbed to death while meeting with constituents. the second murder of a sitting british lawmaker in five years. then on. >> there is virtually not a challenge that we are not working on together. >> smoothing relations to tackle the world's pressing issues. eu forgn policy chief joseph burrell joins me from washington on what's front and center. plus, you want to make our country more reasonable again, you should join the party. >> he ran for president and then new york city mayor and now he's launching his own political party. michelle martin talks with andrew yang about