is it's time to stand up and do what is necessary to fix this country. we need to be honest with the american people about the problems we face. this is the path to prosperity. >> the chairman of the house budget committee, paul ryan, on april 5th, last week, unveiled his path to prosperity. that's the title of ryan's plan

to drive down the national debt, a national debt that is now more than $14 trillion. the driving force of the ryan plan is reforming medicare and medicaid, which many believe are the biggest debt drivers. reforming medicare, beginning in 2022, roughly 10 years from now, medicare would pay a portion of the premium for private health insurance plans, chosen by seniors themselves. the operative word is private health insurance plan. reforming medicaid, making a bloc grant to the states. projected savings, chairman ryan claims that over 10 years his plan will cut nearly $800 billion. president obama, eight date laser, april 13th, delivered his counter-plan for long-term

debt reduction. that plan is titled shared prosperity and shared fiscal responsibility. >> i will not tell families with children with disabilities they have to fends for themselves. >> here are the obama reforms on medicare and medicaid. reforming medicare beginning in 2018, roughly seven years from now, there will be a hard cap on coverage costs. reforming medicaid, a single rate for all states. projected savings, president obama claims that over 12 years his program will nearly $500 billion. >> let's look at these real clear metrics. taxes obama plan, raises tax $1trillion. by 2023 ryan's plan cuts taxes but 2.3 trillion. by 2021, the defense cuts, obama plan, $400 billion by

2023. ryan plan, $78 billion. by 2021. spending obama plan, 24% of gdp. ryan plan, below 20% of gdp. question, can we conclude that president obama wants to keep the centrally directed, federally controlled, social welfare state intact? ryan, on the other hand, wants to dismantle medicare as a federally controlled system and replace it with "premium support and with medicaid give the 50 states latitude are. those legitimate conclusions? pat? >> they certainly are, john. what we have here is what thomas seoul calls a conflict in visions. it is clear t is dramatic and what it tells us is there will be no big deal. president obama is not going to accept ryan's proposals on medicare or medicaid, which are

at the heart of his proposals. 235 house members have signed the no new taxes pledge of grover norquist. they're not going do sign on to a trillion dollars of new taxes some have this tremendous conflict here. there will be no get bargain. what we're going to get is, however, basically what boehner and obama and reid put together, and so you'll get marginal increases or cuts on various things. it's going to -- anger and enrage the tea party and republican party especially, if they go through revenue enhancement. on the other side you'll get a split in the democratic party because they're already screaming with the cuts that have been made, which have been insignificant some i think you'll get both parties divided. >> is there anything left for to you say now? >> that was such a workish examination of what is going on! two political figures have set down their markers, and they're going to provide the parameters for the debate that will take us into the next presidential

election, and that is the role of government and how much responsibility the federal government is going to take to keep the covenants with the american people in terms of medicare, medicaid and socials social security. it seems to me that if you look at any polling, how people feel about medicare, they are open to some modest reforms. they're not open to turning it into a private insurance scheme. i think it's a highly unpopular idea that paul ryan has put on the table, and it opens up lots of room for the president to set out a very different vision of america. but i disagree with pat. i do think there is room here for accommodation. you have a gang of six working in the senate. they love gangs. it's three very conservative republicans, and you have a rift within the anti-tax community in the republican party, with senator tom coburn fighting with rover norquist saying if you remove subsidies from corporations, you really

can't count that as a dreaded tax increase. and so i think this is room for bargaining here. >> what do you think? >> there's not going to be a bargain. i think ryan's achievement is smoking out the president of the united states and getting the him to implicitly admit his budget, that he released in february, was a bad joke. and he implicitly disavowed it. his speech was dishonest, classless, lowdown, and it probably unfortunately is going to be politically effective because of the point eleanor makes, the medicare is so radioactive politically. there's so much education that has to be on there, and i would disagree with your characterization of it as dismantling medicare. this will still be an enormous federal program, pumping out an enormous amount of money. there's just a more choice with medicare part d, the prescription drug benefit incompetent haven't heard anyone saying it's awful because we're giving seniors premium support to get their or

prescription drug plans it. worked with part d, it's been more efficient than the rest of medicare and makes sense to try to transform medicare if you're going to save it and not do the kind of price controls president obama is talking about. >> you think -- >> you guys wanted to be nor expensive. democrats want it to be more expensive. >> popular program, you're right. [everyone talking at once] we do have a conflict of interest. everything you can just critique obama's speech for, obama two say the same thing about paul ryan's speech if he was being perfectly candid, which presidents can't afford to be. by neither of these plans will get through as proposed. this is the way these things happen. but i think obama has the stronger ground, even though he's battling on conservative grounds, talking about budget cutting. it's not what democrats usually like to talk about. but nevertheless when you start talking about going after medicaid, medicaid, with an ax instead of a scalpel, you're

asking for trouble. so you're right, that hardly want to characterize it. >> the president's speech, but do you agree the president's speech wasn't fundamentally about advancing positive specific solutions. it was getting on slightly better -- better political ground in order to attack. a classic jack lou type -- [everyone talking at once] >> i want to ask a question. do you think the debate is beginning or ending? >> that's the beginning. >> beginning! >> obama gave a very -- >> is time more or the side of the president or is time on the side of ryan? >> don't expect anything to happen before election. >> you don't think that -- more ryan the american public will prefer that? >> no, they're not. >> to the existing state affairs are where -- >> down the road for their couple years. >> the american people are now

at a point where they're scared. and you know what is scaring them? the size of the national debt is what is scaring them. >> here's what people are scared of. they will be scared if you say we're going to fool around and something will happen to medicare or social do you think >> the obama portrayed -- the ryan plan as taking us back to rubble. and that's why it was effective. it was effective but left wing. but here's what obama is doing. he appeased his left wing saying they have terrible people but he's got to deal on the turf and the deficit cutting budget. >> does he have time for on his sides or does ryan have time on his side. >> i think time son the side of the gang of 6 and the obama come into the middle. >> exactly. >> where does that end? >> small beer! >> and it's perfectly fair politics to point out that paul ryan's plan gets its cuts from taking money away from two-

thirds of the public, that is poorer, and hands it over in tax cuts to the top class, and to call that classless -- >> is not cut taxes. >> don't you think that -- >> a liss pessimistic. >> excuse me! the savings he gets, he transfers to the upper class. and you call the president's speech classless? what do you mean by that from a party that's -- >> all right, all right. >> to sit in there in front of him and tell him he hates autistic kids, that's classless. there's no other word for that. >> what else -- do you expect -- [everyone talking at once] >> too many talking here. let's hear from buchanan hop is the demagogue? >> in the president's speech there were aspects of demagoguery talking about kids with autism and the rich kids. >> i think the american people can see through that and saw it was demagoguery.

>> no, those -- excuse me! >> they see the size of a hole that medicare and medicaid are blowing into our budget. >> as a search and -- >> they may say -- >> maybe we have too much bureaucracy and maybe it should be on the state level. >> as a speech, it was -- john -- >> there is a big structure [everyone talking at once] >> look at the president of the united states saying he is going to cap the growth of medicare and if it goes over that cap, he will have experts ration it. isn't that an ax? >> he's talking about a budget cutting measure. [everyone talking at once] >> medicaid is. let me tell you his hidden secret. medicaid is 100% it goes to the states. the entire federal bureaucracy, tens every thousands who deal with medicaid, are out of jobs. that's the core constituency of the democratic party. >> we're not done! >> barack obama's vote? >> exactly. >> and that's spread around the can country bus they have all

-- all over the country. >> he doesn't know that. >> my turn! this is not about jobs for bureaucrats. the president correctly pointed out the people who would be hurt under the ryan plan, and it is people with autistic kids who depend on medicaid, and the people on medicare would be hurt because the premium support would give a fixed amount of money and health costs would continue to be up, borne by individuals instead of the government. it's cost shifting. >> and the bureaucrats would be hurt. they lose their job. can't get enough -- >> middle-class, keeps them in nursing homes. that's where most medicaid money goes. >> here's a question, assuming this was the opening salvo of campaign 2012, who won? obama and the democrats, or ryan and the republicans? >> i think quite frankly even though -- he's been hammered -- >> don't fuse it, just state it. >> i think -- i think -- basically the president ran an effective speech with his entire --

>> did he win? >> he's got it on the subject of medicare and frankly, think the democrats are in a stronger position. think he won the opening salvo? >> i think the opening salvo was ryan's. he did well to return was very good though. >> who won it? >> i think obama did. >> the president won it. he's the save orr of the safety net and he wants to raise taxes on millionaires. the other side wants to give tax breaks to millionaires and shred the we won't know until 2 >> oh! >> it will be opening salvo! >> ryan won because he got president obama to come out. obama wanted to duck and pretend this problem didn't exist and he can't do that anymore. >> after the speech, republicans wish he had hidden! >> you think the president gone. >> i was in high school debate and i always wanted to come second because it was easier to -- opposition. and that's what obama can, he came in second, against ryan's

proposal. and ryan walked into it because ryan was so extreme in his proposal. >> so obama? >> obama playing catchup. obama won. g.o.p. 2012 fever! >> america's best days are still ahead. that's why today i'm announcing my exploratory committee for the presidency of the united states. >> former massachusetts republican governor mitt romney announced this week an exploratory committee to assist him in determining whether he should seek to become the official g.o.p. candidate to challenge barack obama for the office of president of the united states. that committee will doubtless focus on romney care. the massachusetts health care reform law enacted five years ago this week. the romney care law says that everyone in massachusetts must have health coverage, and that employers with 10 or more

workers must make it available to those employees and must cover some of the romney care insurance costs. now, romney care closely mirrors obama care. many believe. and this will turn off republican primary voters, which means no g.o.p. official presidential candidate status for romney, maybe. question, in the eyes of the exploratory committee, will romney care, that's his health program in massachusetts, be a plus or a minus for romney as the official candidate of the g.o.p.? eleanor? >> well, it would be a plus for me in assessing governor romney because -- it covers -- [everyone talking at once] >> what do you mean? >> well, because they now cover 98% of the population, in massachusetts. it's a good plan. but i think that politically, romney -- the only way he can

steer through is the olds mack imif you have a problem, hang a lantern on it. don't run away if it. he has to convince people that what he did was right. and he's been saying is this is a plan for massachusetts only, all the states should be allowed to develop their plans and he would never do a one size fits all. that's the theme he'll keep pushing but it's in the republican primaries negative. >> that's what he is saying now. on the campaign. that's a proper word in this tour across the country. >> he is the front front- runner, john. nixon was considered a loser he can't win. and he was a front-runner. but nixon had an enormous base in the republican party that romney does not have. it's hard to see now who bets him bus he's better organized than anyone. he's very strong in new hampshire. he's got legs and can afford to lose a state or two or three, and keep on going down the road. and i don't see anyone who is

that far advanced -- >> you're saying that before he was beaten by huckaby in iowa? >> huckaby weight him in iowa. >> and he did not have the organization and money romney had. but there is so many unknowns. >> lost to huckaby and mccain in new hampshire. >> the whole race was full of surprises. mccain got the nomination, which people did not predict. but the poll on cnn showed huckaby and -- donald trump leading, and what -- >> romney is at 11, huckaby and trump at 19. is romney is the front-runner, he's the weakest republican front-runner we've ever seen, even weaker than john mccain. this health care thing is an albatross. there's no good way to explain it. has all the same aspects every obama care, mandate, subsidies, exchange. he has to work himself up to saying it's an experiment that failed, without being too explicit about it. [everyone talking at once] >> holds on, please!

what about the birth of this. >> totally ridiculous. but he is speaking to a segment of the conservative id out there. he's taking things that conservatives believe and stating them in an an inflammatory way that connects in a certain manner. but i don't believe he'll run. >> if people -- there's no certificate, but there is a record and the record is in the dependths of some city hall and they photograph it, where does it go from there? [everyone talking at once] >> it goes economic nationalism, john. one thing trump has going for him, he's an american first, economic nationalist is, stand up to the chinese, don't let these arabs push us around. that's -- >> will you note when the president of georgia, that's georgia in the trans-- in the caucuses, he came over to new york and he was squired around

by trump. and he wanted to be squared around by trump because trump knows the international scene and has investment opportunities and seized tunes abroad. so there's factor. >> he's a celebrity with -- and has a norm us self-confidence, and people like -- he's interesting! >> he's behaving like a fool. he's behaving like he'll to anything to keep his reality show on tv and get on cable news. he is not going to get republican nomination. he may run as an independent, and that would only that you se question, is romney the g.o.p. front-runner? yes or no? >> yes, he is. >> yes, he as many and front- runners typically have near death experience. but like bob dole and john mccain, he'll probably survive. >> what do you think? >> i'd say he's barely the republican front-runner. >> but he is? >> just barely. not as wide open -- i think as

it's ever been. [everyone talking at once] >> barely or otherwise. >> last year romney was the front-runner. i still say. that but because of the way the republican primaries are sets upstate by state, winner take all, it's different than the democrats and that could work with advantage of issue three, insides job. >> forgive me, i must start by pointing out that three years after a horrific financial crisis caused by massive fraud, not a single financial executive has gone to jail. and that's wrong! [applause] >> that is charles ferguson. he is the director of the documentary called "inside job" that analyzes the global meltdown of 2008 of with some see as the greatest economic crisis since the great depression. inside job won an oscar a month

and a half ago. upon accepting his oscar, he stated in effect, that justice had not been delivered to those responsible. well, that justice may be on the way. the u.s. senate's subcommittee on investigations this week issued a 650-page report titled "wall street and the financial crisis." gnat knee of a financial collapse. the bipartisan report targets four causes the financial meltdown, now and rocky recovery. reckless lending, banks load excessively high risk mortgages and social security that bundled riririririririririririri securities crashed. credit rating agencies. like moody says and standard & poors. they were giving tom ratings, triple-a, to junk securities based on bad mortgages. investment bank practices, like

betting against securities that had told clients to buy. when those clients lost money, the bank gained. no real government oversight. notably the office of thrift supervision, a regulator of savings banks, was irresponsible in not stopping the issuance of high risk insufficiently secured mortgages. the u.s. justice department is now reviewing the bipartisan senate committee's report for possible criminal prosecution of any offending parties named within. question, is there a perception among liberals that the cause of the global economic crisis was wall street? >> of course! of course. >> more so than any other -- >> of course. it's a very simplistic understanding, there are a lot of people to blame. as you mentioned, the ratings agencies, the banks that thought the housing bubble was going to go on forever, the lenders who were pushing out these trash subprime mortgages, and the people who were taking

them. but underlying it all was the belief that housing was going to go up forever and even among the people who didn't believer that, just thought there was too much money to be made while temporarily going up. so it's just a classic bubble and maybe 'ya that everyone believed in. >> there was fraud, one house betting against itself, knowing they were selling junk -- >> which is? >> goldman sachs. >> morgan stanley was buying the other end. not as though they were ripping off -- >> so-called business as usual it. raise a real questions about -- >> it is illegal. fraud is illegal, john. it's not easy to prosecute. but remember the s&l crisis you had how many dozens indicted? nobody has indicted. >> cover on the other side [everyone talking at once] >> it is illegal if you're not giving accurate information to the people. >> that's different. that's what happens. >> that's what at the did.

look, the movie inside job is terrific. and there are plenty of enablers. what is particularly shocking to me was all the elite academic -- >> you talking tax? >> no, the academics who went along with -- to make wall street look good. but the american public is most angry at the wall street bankers because they made out i think john will be real pressure on the united states to reinstitute the airstrikes in libya, and until we drive gaddafi out, then the pressure will come to put boots on the grounds for the aftermath. >> eleanor? >> republican plan to gut medicare will put the 25 seats in the house with the democrats need into play to make it plausible the democrats could regain the majority in two years. or year and a half. >> richard? >> a gas tax holiday passes the house. >> is that good? >> it's politics are good. >> obama will keep tax cuts for

the -- foes who are not rich but only for a million dollars, and up. >> you saw my prediction, clarence! >> i didn't know that! >> bye-bye!