tavis: good evening. from los angeles, i am tavis smiley. first up tonight, our conversation with sebastian junger. following the death of his friend and collaborator, junger has decided not to cover conflicts on the front line anymore. his most recent bestseller is out in paperback. also tonight, a data pinkett smith is here. her new series premieres next tuesday on tnt. journalist sebastian junger and jada pinkett smith coming up right now. >> all i know is his name is james, and he needs extra help with his reading. >> i'm james. >> yes. >> to everyone making a difference -- >> thank you. >> you help us all live better. >> nationwide insurance supports tavis smiley. with every question and every

answer, nationwide insurance is proud to join tavis in working to improve financial literacy and remove obstacles to economic empowerment one conversation at a time. nationwide is on your side. >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. [captioning made possible by kcet public television] tavis: sebastian junger is on our program tonight. the best-selling author and noted journalist has a film on his resume thanks to his documentary "restrepo." the claim has been bittersweet following the death of his friend and collaborator who was killed while covering a conflict in libya. his newest best seller "or" is

out in paperback. thank you for coming back on the program -- his newest best seller, "war" is now out in paperback. osama bin laden has been found and killed. your thoughts on this side of the issue? >> it was a watershed moment. obviously, we would not have been able to find him and kill him had we not been in afghanistan. you need to forward operating bases, the intelligence gathering in afghanistan to do that. osama bin laden was one man in al qaeda, but he is not all of it. just a few days ago that killed another guy with a groan. it is a -- they killed him with a drone. it is a complex organization. if we continue pursuing them,

will probably have to do that from a platform in afghanistan. tavis: your thoughts on whether or not we should continue pursuing them at this point, especially inside of afghanistan? >> they are not in afghanistan because we are there. they are across the border in pakistan. there are two costs, down sides to leaving afghanistan. one cost possibly is our own security. the attacks of 9/11 came out of afghanistan. it was a failed rogue nation. that is why al qaeda was there in the first place. i am not saying it would foreshore happen, but it is possible the cycle would renew itself. the other cost would be to the afghans themselves. at 4000 civilians were killed in the chaos and civil war and the 1990's. that era ended with

international forces in their country. you have gone from 400,000 civilians in afghanistan to 30,000 deaths with nato in there. if nato left tomorrow, there would be a terrible civil war just about for sure and the deaths would rise up to that 400,000 out -- 400,000 level again. tavis: taking that argument to the extreme, one is left with the impression that we should state in afghanistan forever, because the price of paying out is that a rogue nation will rise again, that we will be attacked again when we leave. >> i am not saying that. it is probably not realistic. the afghans would not want to be an occupied country, either. tavis: they have been vocal about that, president karzai has been.

of thee fighting part populations. the other parts of the populations, we're not fighting them. they are not the taliban. i think really what has to happen is the afghan people, they are very good fighters. they defeated the soviets, when they have something good to fight for. their own government is corrupt. it is a criminal syndicate. we in some ways facilitated that. the afghan people are not going to undertake their own security to protect the government did not respect. i think really the tactical military problems, we have started to figure them out, but there is no permanent solution until there is a government in place that serves the people afghanistan. the work we need to do it is to twist president karzai's are so hard that he dismantles the corrupt government. tavis: your thoughts about the troop drawdown? >> there was a 30,000 troops

surge. at had a tremendous effect against the taliban. it hit the taliban very hard. in an emmy like that, it is a good time to negotiate, because they are killed -- if you hurt an enemy like that, it is a good time to negotiate, because they are hurting. the truth afghan taliban, who have some voice in the country, now was the time to start negotiating and pressuring president karzai. if you do all of those things together and keep up military pressure, i think he could get to a place where we could start to tiptoe out of there -- i think we could get to a place where we could start to tiptoe out of theire. tavis: we are hearing more that the pakistani is were

humiliated, embarrassed by the way we went and killed bin laden, under the cover of darkness, we kill him, barry him at sea. we tell them after the fact what we have done. try to imagine someone from another country coming into america, killing someone who they want to kill, taking him out, and then telling us after the fact with have done on our soil. what is your sense of whether pakistanis have a right to feel humiliated and embarrassed? >> you have to remember that bin laden killed 3000 americans and he and his ideology killed tens of thousands of muslims, including pakistan's. i understand that was a provocative and complicated for pakistan, but only if you accept the idea that he was an

acceptable member of pakistani society. someone knew that he was there on some level. the united states is not harboring milosevic. there are war criminals that if they were a harbinger of -- harbored in the united states and we refuse to deal with it and somebody dealt with them, it might be provocative. but it is understanding when we do because we would not be cooperating. on some level, pakistan was not cooperating, and they paid a higher price than we have. tavis: i hear the point, and that would make evidence that has not serviced yet that the pakistanis knew they were harboring him. >> there was a collaboration between the pakistan intelligence service and the taliban and al qaeda. the pakistani intelligence service trained one of the worst

terrorist organizations and the world. they were the people who committed the atrocity in mumbai, india. the connections between terrorism and pakistani intelligence is ironclad. that is known. did the top echelon of the pakistani government know that he was in that house? probably not. iran-contra, the funny of the u.s. government did not know about it, but someone know about it -- plenty of the u.s. government did not know about it, but someone did. tavis: what has been a significant since this book has come out in hardcover? >> primarily, personally, my colleague and friend tim hetherington got killed in somalia. he was covering the humanitarian disaster.

nato action stop the genocide in the sarajevo province in the early 1990's. tim was killed by a mortar shell fired by a military unit. that absolutely gutted me and has made this project look different, actually. tavis: you mean what, exactly? >> we did this together. we had this incredibly close collaboration. "restrepo" was our movie, and suddenly he is gone and it is my movie. at one of the things i worry about is will i be able to make decisions about the future of this movie and the material and the best possible way? i no longer have my friend to consult with. i would talk to him all the time. it is actually intimidating, how can i do justice to his memory with this project? tavis: does his death say

anything different to you about work? >-- about war? >> absolutely. i got an e-mail from a vietnam veteran who said he was so sore about him, i have to tell you this, you guys with your books and your movie came close to understanding what war is about, but cannot get all the way. the ultimate reality about war, the central truth is that you'll lose your brothers. that is guaranteed. he said before today, in some ways you did not understand the first thing about war, but now you know. tavis: does that change your view about war and it's worth or value and how we get into it? does it change your thoughts about the nature of war? >> i think, unfortunately, we

live in a world where people attack other people, and i think a legitimate rationale for well is the saving of lives of people who cannot defend themselves. tavis: you believe then just war? >> yes. in bosnia in the 1990's, 100,000 civilians, people like you and me and your viewers, were killed in genocide, and it was stopped by nato forces. and thank god. the idea that we cannot do that in rwanda is a moral outrage. there is a place for this, and that is why the police carry guns. sometimes they are necessary. tavis: sebastian junger, a perennial new york times best- seller. congratulations on the paperback and that the success of "restrepo." up next, our conversation with actress jada pinkett smith.

stay with us. pleased to welcome jada pinkett smith back to the program. the complete second season it is out on dvd, while the third season of "hawthorne" kicks off tuesday on tnt. i don't know how you doing it. >> i don't either. i will just keep it real. tavis: thank you and big willie. "fela!" is one of the best shows i have seen on broadway. am i am happy about that. -- >> i am happy about that. i have been a huge fan, and when we saw the piece, we said we have to invest and be part of

this. to have so many talented black folks up there making it happen, you know what i mean? we had not seen anything like that on broadway. we were really proud to be part. tavis: i loved it, so thank you. at third season? it does it feel like three seasons? >> we do 10 episodes per seaso d season. it feels like we're coming to the end of the first season. you know? but i am really happy, i am really proud of this season. tavis: we did not show the clip, but in the third season, you are no longer widowed. >> no, i am not, i got a man. it is a very adult season,

dealing with adult issues. we come on at 10:00. it is edgier, racey, and i will say things get complicated. things get complicated. tavis: speaking of complicated, put up the cover of the dvd. this pretty much says it all. it really does speak to all the characters, all the parts of your character. this is the "i am every woman" cover. >> it spoke to most women that i know, that kind of thing, you have to be the mom, the professional, a hot sex kitten for the husband. tavis: that is the third season. that will be next year's box set. >> but the many hats that all

women have to wear on a daily basis. tavis: what are you trying to portray through this character? your mom was a nurse and real life. >> which is how i really craft that this character. she was a nurse and single mother while she was raising us. christina hawthorne, for me, represents the woman who is trying to keep it all together and have everything, a professional life, be a good mother, be loved, and know how to love, and just kind of figuring it all out as she goes. as she is going, she is doing all these things. that is what cristina is about. and it takes place in a hospital, which i think is interesting because life and death happens, the extremes of lives have been in hospitals,

which is what i think people gravitate to hospital dramas. you don't consciously understand that, but those are the things we grapple with. how we live and when we are going to die. tavis: it raises the question women wrestle with, whether you could have it all? and if you cannot have it all, can you have it all at the same time? and to that, jada says? >> jada says that you could have as much as you can have, and that is to be defined for each and every woman. not one woman can define that thing. there are some women, the definition of happiness and having a ball is very different than what mine is. it -- the definition of happiness and having it all is very different than what mine is. every woman has to take the time to figure that out. people say, you are such a great role model.

that is great, but at the end of the day, you have to be your own best role model and learn what makes you happy, not necessarily what society thinks you are suppose to be or women that you look up to, what they're doing. i look at that as a blueprint, but never forget that who you are is what is most important. tavis: how do you personally to find happiness? -- how to you personally to find happiness? >> happiness. to me is all about love. my family, my husband. to me, that is happiness. when i feel like i am loved it and i have a place that i loved deeply. to me, that is happiness. all this stuff is great, having a tv show, doing movies, have

kids who can sing and dance, that is great. but at the end of the day, without that love -- i see so many people in this business without love and so on happy and have all the fame and money in the world -- and so unhappy and all the fame and money in the world, and it means nothing. tavis: i have had the chance to talk to child actors on this set. every one of them typically has a parent in tow. i see you on "hawthorne," we see everything that will does. more often than not, we see you showing up with your kids when they do what they do. most parents in this business go with their kids everywhere they go. it is a beautiful thing to see, but i don't know how you do with all. >> absolutely.

right now i am doing "hawthorne," they have to stand down, period. she has to stand down, because mommy is working. she has to wait three months, which is good because she did a hard core run before i did "hawthorne," and now she is just having fun and being a kid. going to target and shopping, doing the things that she does. and he is preparing for his movie and the fall. i take these three months, and the rest of the year is dedicated to my family. we sit down and say, i am doing "hawthorne" from this month it to this month. when i am done, we will talk about what you want to do the rest of the year. a while i need is three months, and then you guys, i am talking with you the rest of the year -- i am rocking with you the rest

of the year. tavis: there are some kids who start out as child stars and get in the worst trouble down the road. had you keep them from running off the tracks? >> we will see. my son will turn 13 this year. with most kids, the paradigm shifts because they become the breadwinner, ok? so then mom and dad, they're getting paid by the kid. that paradigm shift will take a long time, ok? to outearn -- you know what i am saying? you have a ways to go before that happens! the paradigm stays in place. it all stays in place. then when you can fire your parents, that is a difficult

place to put children. because kids in these particular environments, they have to have a very secure, anchored foundation and they have to have boundaries, wide boundaries, but boundaries that they feel safe that the people around them are there specifically to love them and keep them safe. tavis: so how might you and will feel one day win willow and jaden are older, their parents love them, but they feel they are at the point in their career -- and michael jackson and others have done this -- where they say, mom and dad, we have this now, we will get a different set of management. how would you handle that? >> that is inevitable. we are already getting there.

she says, i know what i want to wear and i know my vision for my next video. all right, you got it. let's start now. i am not here -- as a parent, i believe we are here to help our children mature in a way that they can take on their own lives. i am not here to live their lives for them. that is not my job. tavis: how do you balance giving them too much leeway? >> you have to know as a parent, the freedoms. no midriffs, nothing revealing. everything else, i don't care. shave your head, she your eyebrows, i don't care. i could walk into the world with my own idea and a density of what i believe jada was and reap

the rewards or face the repercussions of those decisions and start to understand what it means to be responsible for myself. with willow, she has freedoms. her creative way of being, she has that. i stay at of the way. that is all her. same with jaden. those to meet are safe places, where they cannot hurt themselves or get themselves in trouble. when it comes to what time you are coming in at night and where that is mommy andt, daddy land, because it is our responsibility to keep you safe. there are things, because you have only been on this planet 13 years, there are things your mother and father understand that you are not privy to yet.

but we give them space and freedom were that can be themselves and explore who they are. tavis: "hawthorne," season 3. how much longer? >> as long as we have interesting stories and the audience tunes in. as soon as the audience does not tune in, it is over. tavis: it is called "hawthorne," and the premiers tuesday on tnt. that is our show tonight. thank you for watching. until next time, keep the faith. >> for more information on today's show, visit tavis smiley at pbs.org tavis: hi, i'm tavis smiley. join me next week with my guest j.j. abrams and talk show legend larry king. that is next week. we will see you then. >> all i know is his name is

james, and he needs extra help with his reading. >> i'm james. >> yes. >> to everyone making a difference -- >> thank you. >> you help us all live better. >> nationwide insurance supports tavis smiley. with every question and every answer, nationwide insurance is proud to join tavis in working to improve financial literacy and remove obstacles to economic empowerment one conversation at a time. nationwide is on your side. >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. [captioning made possible by kcet public television] captioned by the national captioning institute --www.ncicap.org--