tavis: good evening. from los angeles, i am tavis smiley. tonight, a conversation with emmy nominated producer and writer david steinberg. his show on showtime, entitled "inside comedy," has some of the biggest names, but p4p get to that conversation, i want to get to something we started last week on the program. we are now in our 10th season, on pbs, and we thought this was a good time to introduce you to some of the staff that makes this show possible. joining me now is my friend jerry hernandez. he started as an intern three years ago and is now our production coordinator, and i am proud to say he is about to get his mfa, master of fine arts, go trojans.

>> i want to say how grateful i am to be a part of a show that reaches out to young students and young voices and allows them the opportunity to contribute to a meaningful production like this one. tavis: we are glad to have you on. >> we are glad you could join us tonight for a conversation with conversation david steinberg, coming up. >> there is a saying that dr. king had that said there is always the right time to do the right thing. i just try to live my life every day by doing the right thing. we know that we are only halfway to completely eliminate hunger, and we have a lot of work to do. walmart committed $2 billion to fighting hunger in the u.s. as we work together, we can stamp hunger out. >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you.

thank you. tavis: as anyone who has ever tried to be funny, commonly separates the men from the boys and the women from the girls. making it look easy, one of the best in the business, david steinberg. he is not only a stand-up comedian himself, he is a director, with shows like "friends" and "curb your enthusiasm" and "weeds," and he has a look inside, appropriately called "inside comedy." here, he talks about the unexpected things that can sometimes ruin a routine. >> it can always kill you. audiences, sometimes. >> yes. >> i tell people all of the

time. it is something i learned that has stayed with me even in directing now. distraction is the death of comedy. >> correct. >> you could be -- you could have the audience right there, and anybody who has been at the improv, it is going great, and just as you get to the punch line, a waitress puts the glass down, dink, and it dies, because everybody's ear went to the glass. >> yes. >> in comedy, it is important that there are no distractions, do not break the rhythm. >> it is all about what you hear. tavis: i am a student, so it does not take much to turn me on. if there is a great interview on television, i am going to watch. what is the takeaway of a show like this to everyday people. if you are not trying to be a comedian, what is the tick away?

>> there has been a myth about stand-up comedians. not just stand up but all comedians. and that is that there is sort of a bitterness, the need for a hard drive, and all of that, and i used to have a theory, actually, that if you have had a good childhood, a good marriage, and a little bit of money in the bank, you are going to make a lousy comedian. tavis: mm-hmm. >> i have changed my attitude about that. tavis: [laughter] >> what i have found throughout my career, tavis, is that there is a great connection between all the comedians in some way, and when i started doing comedy in the 1970's, i talked just like this, so i was not loud enough for las vegas. i had to open up for jazz chords, which was the best thing that could have happened to me,

bill evans, others. the way musicians connected with each other was remarkable to me. there was such respect and humor and all of that, and i thought that is what the, the world is like. tavis: since you went there, let me follow you in. let me start with this. i love jazz. jazz is, obviously, improvisational. jazz by any other definition is really freedom, freedom to do what you do on stage, and no song ever sounds the same if it is done in the spirit of what jazz is all about. you know that from miles davis and some of the greats. is there any parallel between comedy and jazz? >> yes, improvisation is really important. you are making something up in

front of the audience. now, music helps you out a little bit. it will separate you from the audience. when it is just you, the audience will tell you how they feel. sometimes you will say something, and they will retreat. and they will retreat, and sometimes they take back the laughter that they have given you. it is like bullfighting. tavis: [laughter] >> you cannot choreograph a bullfight. it goes wherever it wants. so you have to connect with the audience, tavis. it is the most elusive craft in so many ways because you cannot cater to the audience. they will know that. you can not want to be their pet. you have to be bold, even if you think there will not like what you have to say. but what they want is an

authentic person, someone who is not like anybody else. these guys are on the show. tavis: you control the sketch. you control the skit. you control the material if you are on the stage as a comedian. the audience controls the after. -- the laughter. they control the response. they can retreat. who really is the controlling factor in this relationship between the comedian and the audience? >> while the comedian is the controlling factor, but there are such things as just a bad audience. tavis: [laughter] every time he goes on stage. not you, obviously. the audience was horrible. >> when you talk to a comedian, they will say when they walk on the stage, there was a cold spot to the left of me. without even opening their mouths, they know that. i asked robin williams about it.

what happens when you feel that cold spot? he says he never plays to that. you play for the rest of the house, and then you slowly move over. it is a work in progress all of the time. tavis: take me back to your start. i mentioned previously that you are not just a host of that show. you have been a longstanding pretty good stand-up comedian. i want to get back to the opening of the show that you suggested that one does not have to be -- one does not have to go to the richard pryor's school to be a good comedian. we will come back to that. >> my upbringing is so unusual. my father was a rabbi. there was a synagogue in canada. so i am from canada. i left there at 16. i was at the university of chicago never having a plan about anything, and this group

came through, in the 1960's, and they were called second city. i really had no idea what i was going to do. i knew i was funny, but a lot of people are funny, and i saw this, and it was different from any professional comedy that was going on on television, radio, anywhere at the time, and i could not put my finger on the company but i said, "i do that." there was something that i do that i never even knew existed, so a friend of mine that wanted to be in show business desperately at the university of chicago, he and i did an act. i wrote it. we opened up next to second city. the community paper said second city should see these guys, and i started a whole career. tavis: next thing i know, you

are on "carson." >> just so you know, no career -- it is the failures. it is the failures that make you successful, and i had plenty of them. i starred in two broadway plays. i starred in a broadway play that was the first directing job of sidney poitier, and there was lou gossett, diana ladd, and i played a jewish kid who offered himself as a slave to two columbia students as reparations, and by the third act, and they had been chained to the radiator. the reviewer at the time perceived this as a racist play. sidney poitier, cicely tyson, we did not last very long. we used to watch the oscars all

of the time together, and i would say, "best buy is an idiot." i would talk back. and he would say, "no, no, he is a wonderful person." and i said, we can attack them. we are sitting here without oscars. " he was the nicest person. anyway, i got on "the tonight show." i will tell you this. i was working at the bitter and, and there were six people in the audience, and i had not really made an impact. trying stand. second city was not stand up. it was sketch comedy, very different. and i said to the owner of the bidder and, there are six people. usually, i had 20 people, 30 people.

he would play to 40 people at the time. and i said to the guy, let me just forget about this. and he said, "no, no. you have to go on for six people." "-- tavis: 6 people. the show must go on. >> the show must go on. when you have six people, you do not hate the people have not come, you hate to the six people. tavis: making you do it. [laughter] >> so i thought i would do it, and as i was walking on stage, sydney came in. he came in and sat down. so for sydney, i just did the best show i possibly could. he came back afterwards.

he said, "david, this is great. you have to keep doing this." and i said, "there is no one here. it is not really going that well." i went home, went to sleep, knowing that did was not going to last much longer. a friend of mine called and said, "you are in "the new york times." one of those was a reviewer for "the new york times." and i had a career. he really was important. tavis: what was the takeaway for you. forget sidney poitier, who i love dearly, but outside of him being there, what was the takeaway for you from that particular story. what did you learn from that? >> that you never, you can never judge an audience. you cannot judge them by their size. you cannot judge them by your

version of whether they are intelligent or not. you have to just connect. you cannot go out too far this way. you have to meet half way, but you have to be open. you cannot be closed. sometimes, you just cannot help it. tavis: i want to go back now to this notion of the fact that you do not have to have had a rough childhood, although the evidence to the contrary is pretty astounding. it is pretty luminous. >> yes, it is. tavis: so what do you make of that? starting with prior -- pryor. >> i do not think anybody gets away smoothly. a great life, a perfect childhood. there is always something that goes wrong in your life, always, because there are circumstances

you cannot control. how you interpret that negativity is really what it is about. so you take that negativity, and you find a positive connection through making the audience laugh with you added. you have to be unafraid to reveal anything about yourself. tavis: how much of comedy is collaboration? my friends know there are two things i love in life. i love music, and i love comedy. at any given night of the week, given the opportunity, even when i travel, i will find a music show or a comedy show. 8:00 shep over here, the 11:00 show, were ever i am. watching your show, i did not know how collaborative comedy is. i did not know that, they could be so complex. what goes into making this work. taking them one at a time, first

of all, the collaborative nature. i am amazed at how people work with teams. to get these jokes right. >> yes. you do not need somebody to write for you. but you do need, some terminology, you need you need somebody -- an ear. i thought when i was on the tonight show, nobody was going to give me something that would make a difference. not so. they would connect with me, and sometimes -- you have to find these connections. you cannot do it by yourself. i do not know if you found the chris or rock show, but referring to what he said. tavis: that is where i was going. the story that chris told me, i talked to him myself.

what he goes through to make a joke work. and the evolution that that takes. it is a process of getting that joke right by the time you see him do it on hbo. >> he goes to a place in florida. he says it is like, it reminded him of muhammad ali. he goes with his writers, his friends, and all of that. he starts with nothing. he is on stage for a month the audience are old jews, the weber is around there. they do not even know who is on. and he says at the end of that month, after he has worked night after night after night trying material, getting it exactly right, he can play madison square garden and never miss a night. tavis: he also said that these days, it is harder and harder to perfect your craft, because

even in florida, the old jews know how to work iphones. a 85-year-old two-person -- jew has put it on line. >> that is really tough. you just have to ask the audience to give you a break. it is a new world out there. i just came off of a tour with robin williams, and we were playing thousand seat theaters everywhere. robin is so popular. the two of us, i got to participate in that. i was asking him about his wife and all of that, and he would ask me something, and after my first laugh, all i could say was all of the young people imdbing me. who is david steinberg? it is no doubt that it is

different now. tavis: seinfeld talks but the same process he has to go through to get the jokes right. is that always the case, no matter how long you are in the game? no matter how good you are? it is still this process of trying to give birth to this joke? >> you have to say it in front of an audience. you cannot write it and expect it to work. there is a rhythm and a truth that comes out when you are in front of an audience that you just cannot find when you are sitting with yourself. put it on stage. you have to be prepared for it not to work. seinfeld is so popular. thousands of people there. and chris, an exceptional comedian, and he says when he goes through that new material, the audience can hear it. it is a silence that is unbelievable, and they wait

until, because it has a tentative quality to it. it is scary. tavis: so you are on showtime all of the time talking to the comedian's about what they have learned and their journey. i will put you on the spot. a comedian, some of the most important lessons you have learned from a comedienne in your career, from another comedian? >> i think you have to call johnny carson a comedian, and i learned from him, basically, the listening process. not just listening like you are listening to me, but you have to be listening to what an audience is picking up on. a and you cannot force an idea if it is not coming. it is about how you listen to things. it is how you listen to the news. it is how you read a book or take away something. "i can use this in this way. tavis: carson was a big reader, too. >> he was an avid reader.

he would know everything i would bring up. he would let me go, and then he would wait and wait and wait and then pop in. >> every comedian has a different way of dealing with this. i love comedy so much. i am always watching for how a comedian is going to deal with the heckler. what have you learned over the years about the best ways to deal with hecklers, because everybody does it differently? >> well, i will tell you something surprising about hecklers. most hecklers are on your side. they are just as corrupting the show. there are drug saying, "hey, david, we love you, baby." they are not against you. the best way is to increase them in some way. do not go against them. you have got to work them in and

then somehow make them calm down. basically, hecklers do not want you -- they do not care about the exchange. they want to be heard. they want to be a part of your act, so you have to let them to calm them down. otherwise, they will not stop. tavis: i can only ask this question out of my own experience as a music lover and a comedy lover. i always rebel -- i think that is the right word -- i revel in the joy that i see certain performers take in when they know that they are pleasing the audience, when they know they are bringing something good to that person's life, no matter what happened this week, no matter what happens today. they came to see me tonight. and i want to bring some joy to their life, and when i see a person onstage deliver that, reveling with humility with what they have done, it is a beautiful thing to behold.

>> it is the reason we all do it. tavis: right. >> there is no other reason to do it. when you are doing a show, and you are by yourself on stage, it is not a broadway show -- if the audience does not like you, it is not like they do not like this that or they do not like the music. they are saying they do not like you. when they go with you, you are getting an level of approval, hopefully deep things about yourself you are revealing, but by being funny. that connection, all day long, if i am doing a show that night, nothing matters except that show. i cannot connect with people during the day. i have to think about it. you really prepare yourself for it, and when you get it, it is fun. tavis: speaking of one guy on the stage all by himself put. >> yes, you know, i am a

canadian, and canadians love their canadians. canadians, they are doing a documentary on me in canada, and the reason is canadians think i am still the hottest comedian in the world. tavis: you are still up there, man. >> like i was on carson just last night. they are doing this documentary on me, and it went to my friends, and i said, and "when you go to all of my friends, they will be forced to say lovely things about me. and they talked to me about it. it is very hard to go out and do a show, as we have discussed, so i thought, a documentary, that would be a reason for me to go on stage, and i tried it up in la jolla, which is a big testing ground, and to my surprise, i enjoyed it tremendously. the audience enjoyed it. i am sort of in it a little bit.

the county playhouse. i am doing that. now, doing this one-man show a little bit. tavis: so you are still loving it. >> yes. tavis: said to catch you on the road as a one-man show, that would be a good time. for you to go see him, and if you cannot go to see him, you can go to showtime. "inside comedy." i enjoyed this immensely. >> thank you. tavis: that is our show for this time. thanks for tuning in. until next time, as always, keep the faith. today's show, visit tavis smiley at pbs.org. tavis: hi, i'm tavis smiley. join me next time for a exploration of the new book, "top dog." that is next time. we will see you then.

>> there is a saying that dr. king had that said there is always the right time to do the right thing. i just try to live my life every day by doing the right thing. we know that we are only halfway to completely eliminate hunger, and we have a lot of work to do. walmart committed $2 billion to fighting hunger in the u.s. as we work together, we can stamp hunger out. >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. thank you.