campus communities are responding to gun violence on many different fronts, including persuasion and protection. >> run, hide, fight. >> we'll show you efforts to help keep guns off campus and out of urban communities on this edition of equal time. >> you're watching equal times. exploring new issues this week giving people time competing point of views. hello from the campus of san jose state university welcome to this edition of equal times. i'm your host, journalism school director bob rockier. what will it take to curve gun

violence in the united states? a san jose state advertising class is coming up with campaigns aimed at convincing people to put guns down and leave them down. alicia moore has our story. >> these san jose state students are searching for resolutions to stop gun violence. >> we want to educate young people and the public about the danger and reality of guns. we feel that all americans have the right to live free from gun violence. >> they say their own generation is responsible for the shootings that break out. >> children and teens are three more likely to be injured than u.s. soldiers wounded in action in afghanistan. >> from the statistics he rattles off, you might think socialology or even studies at the state, but he's actually apart of this advertising class trying to come up with a basic pitch against guns. >> building is -- inner city areas and their parents and

guardians as well about the dangers of gun violence. >> professor john dollars cruise teaches the advertising class. >> for me as an outsider coming from the uk, it's really interesting to try to get you taken to this kind of grief. we don't have the gun culture in the uk that is prevalent within the inner cities across the u.s. >> now he says students were created and came up with great idea. >> our first idea was a poster that saved every 30 minutes a child their teen is shot. >> they were rn't for example, 30 minutes is the latter time it takes to organize street bowl game and that is close to the target audience, so by putting it 30 minutes into that context they could relate, the target audience could relate to the realities of gun violence. >> and what is needed is a wake up call before it's too late. >> another group had looked at

using -- by using memorial street memorial and drawing attention to them, drawing the target audience to them to see who could have murdered. when they get there, it's a mirror, it's not photograph of the kid who is being killed. it's a mirror thinking they could be next. >> so what's the benefit of using this type of art. it's direct. it's where the target is. >> these students not only pitch to each other but to advertising company in the new york via teleconference. >> do you -- i think you have a really good idea there. >> the thing that we got from agency guy is well they felt it was some strong emotions and strong messages in the campaigns of these guys were proposing. >> constructive criticism to the students and their ideas may be used for future guns. >> when we come back, run,

hide, fight. we'll take you to a class to san jose state professors are attending showing them how to react in the event of a shooting on campus.

welcome back. we've shone you how san jose state students are coming up with advertising campaign it is to persuade people nationwide to put the guns down in case a shooting should occur on campus, police are giving professors some lessons in safety. alicia moore continues our coverage. >> here is an ethical situation, you're barricaded in a room. you've done all you can. >> that is professors are not just in a faculty meeting. they're in a training program. if we tell you to do something, you go ahead and do it. but as you're running away rs again, remember yo dot no want to be perceived as a threat. >> they're sharing their concerns and learning the options it takes in case of on

campus shooting, to run, hide or to fight . we have a full staff of law enforcement officers day in and day out. >> the sergeant says the program has three simple sets. running to safe location or if that's not possible hiding and barricading in a room and fighting back as a last resort. >> most importantly you can do when you call 911 is know where you are. give them your location, i'm at

san jose state, san jose is going to key up on san jose state and they're already going to be calling us. that's the best way to go about it. the blue lighting system, most of you are familiar with it. they're in the building. >> police say calling 911 are using one of these will be proper lea enforcement in case of shooting emergency. we must also mention in our discussion of shooting and guns we did try to contact national rifle association. >> when we come back, we'll sit down with a panel of experts searching for solutions when equal time continues.

our focus today is on gun violence. let's meet our guest. >> my name is guy smith i'm an independent gun policy researcher, i'm also the author of gun facts. >> hamilton with the grady campaign to prevent gun violence. >> i'm with women against gun violence. >> i'm will professor and addresser of human rights of san jose state university. >> thank you all for being here today. we all know the whole country is talking about this. we all know that there's been serious incidents, children have been killed, politicians have been making speeches, but if anything changing, is anything going to change, we'll start with our research over

here. what have been you been thinking about in terms of your researchers. >> what i've been thinking about is your core causes of gun violence. that's one narrow aspect of violence in general. i think we need to pay attention to the disease, whatever is causing people to want to kill other people as opposed to the tools that they choose to kill people with. >> that doesn't seem to be anything to argue about, wouldn't you all agree. >> i think there's think there's something very valid at that point. we have serious problem with availability of guns and also 300 million guns currently right now in our society, 40% of those have been purchased without a background check. there's some real core issues that are directly linked to guns and causing people to have guns readily available then to commit these horrific crimes. >> i absolutely agree with maya. other countries have disease and mental illness, but here in this country we have easy access to guns, with the 40% of

guns going unchecked when they're sold. you're talking about purchasers such as felons, mentally ill and juveniles getting ahold of guns. so you can have a bad day, but it can turn deadly when you have a gun. >> well, that sounds like something people have been saying to us on schools and college campuses all over the country. >> sure, i mean, i think there's -- many of these points have been fairly heavily hit upon in the media we hear about issues and member illness. we hear the sort of the clearing call for rights issues, for second amendment rights issues and i think these are fairly well aired out in main stream immediate y. i think some of the variables that haven't been touched on yet is the arm's industry and it is an arm's industry. this is an international industry. it's a very large and very powerful industry and we actually what we see now in a wake of sandy hook it's not just this sort of public outrage right over guns, how everyone approached the

problem. we also see the utter power of this industry when it's focused on political arms such as the nra or nra super text. >> well, if i could just jump in. i think also the results of that is controlling what gets out to the public, so unfortunately it took sandy hook to sort of get politicians to willingly come out and make a stance and try to push legislation through. but we've had years of the nra sort of sorting any scientific studies about the real consequences of gun violence and i don't know that people, you know, know the real numbers, 34 people a day died from the gun. 46 people commit suicide with a gun. every single day 9 children die. you know, due to gun violence. that totals 1,000 people a day that are directly effected every single day outside of tragedies like sandy hook which could shouldn't be taken lightly at all. this is a very serious problem that the real consequences haven't been, i think, properly communicated to the public as a result of this influence. >> yet we have manypeople out

there who own guns who value being safe with their guns. they teach their children how to use them and store them properly. one of my best friends is hunters, he hunts on the east coast shooting deer. don't take away my guns we hear that all the time. >> when you dig down to the numbers what we discover very rapidly is when it comes to gun policy and what can be controlled there's only two groups and it's the lieutenantics and the criminals. the career criminals have this amazing ability to repeat violent crimes. in fact, gang members who are rested on a homicide charge are usually the lead suspect in two other homicide. when you boil down all the numbers, almost all criminal homicide in this country may be committed by as few as 3 to 4,000 well-known repeat violent offenders. now what do we want to pay attention to, do we want to pay to attention to the inadamant objects or do we want to pay attention who we know violating other people violating the tool

they use. >> i'm sorry. i have to disagree. guns don't fall from the sky. they come through a legal process and fall into illegal hands. so we're talking about where gun shows, people get ahold of guns without a background check cash and carry. on the internet they can get ahold of guns cash -- well, they just buy it on the internet anonymously. but as far as this idea of that it's only criminals recycling and committing the crimes, i strongly disagree because we've seen legal gun holders, you can look at the sandy hook case, the mother, adam's mother was a legal gun owner. of an assault rifle that should really never be available to civilians. and her son got ahold of it. so she wasn't the criminal and he technically was not a criminal. he didn't have any history. but he was a mentally ill person that got ahold of a

mother's gun who didn't lock them up safely. so this happens repeatedly. and we've seen it over and over again. so, again, it goes back to the issue of access. this is the only country where we are killing our people 30,000 a year. we're now up to the same numbers as car deaths. >> now, alicia you're a student and i'm a faculty person, when we hear this and particularly in the setting of an academic environment, it worries me as a faculty person knowing someone legally with a gun is having one on campus i'm not comfortable about that. how do students feel about it? >> i know it's a really scared situation just to know that any day that some kind of shooting could happen on campus. it's really scary to hear about the things that's going on in other states and cities and to think about it happening to our school or to our students or to our faculty is just a scary situation. i know we have a lot of things on campus that are there to keep us safe but it's still a scary situation. >> and there are schools around

the country that will say, wait a minute, bob, you may not want that but some people do want. they want to be able to protect themselves and they believe and i believe them honestly that they could be a prevented force if they were allow today legally have a gun to protect students in a school environment. >> what we can say with certainty is that it does not cause harm. in 1988 there were 10 states that they allowed for concealed carry in the country. today there are 42. during that entire period not only has the handgun ply gone up in the number of state that is you can carry a gun. violent crime rate has gone down. i traded e-mails with professor john a couple of months ago and he made an interesting observation. he said of all the peer reviewed criminal observations not a single one of them have said the violent crime rate has gone up by allowing people to depend themselves in public. at very worst we can say it does not make the problem any worse than it is. >> professor john luck ha

back up for his research and that's also well-known but i want to remind you, columbine shooting, there were two armed guards outside of that school. it didn't do anything. >> i've also seen some studies, i'm sorry to jury in here, that the result of having more guns results in more gun violence. i think jumping back to your question about, you know, people not wanting to get rid of their guns, this is isn't issue about disarming the american public. frankly it's not -- we can have sensible gun legislation while respecting the second amendment. no body is trying to take away your grandfather's hunting rights. we're talking about military style weapons. the no. 1 purpose of it what is, you know, have a magazine that holds 100 rounds and fire against opponents in a war like situation. so i mean i think the type of gun is very relevant. we're not just talking about a

hunting rifle. >> i have to jump in. >> first of all, from a scholarly perspective is probably the only social scientist in the room, i can speak to the data you're talking about. actually no one can explain, there isn't a single criminologist in the country right now that has the capitol answer as to why crime is reduced in the united states. there's no evidence, zero evidence to suggest that crime has gone down in any way in relationship to people owning guns, zero. there's zero evidence for that. secondly the career criminal concept is probably one of the most -- well, one of the most criticized concepts in all of criminology so we might want to also be very skeptical about concepts of super predators and super criminals. but from an industry standpoint i think what she was saying makes a great deal of sense, so for instance just today there was a an article released in rolling stone, actually it was

yesterday in rolling stone where the data was released that many of the gun manufacturers have moved completely from hunting style weapons to assault style weapons to make a great deal of their profit margin. in 2008 pull over 50% of the arms stole in the united states that was not long ago, that was 5 years ago. today that number has dropped to 25% in total sales. 75% of total sales approximately approximately, now now are in the realm of high capacity arms. >> there is fictitious classification called assault weapon. there's a term invented by the and i had the document where they invented that term to

confuse the american public about the dish between the two. >> i said military style weapon. >> they try to go around any definition about what an assault weapon will be defined there's never a definition we can actually use because gun manufacturers are constantly circumventing anything we put in the place even as far as an assault weapons ban, gun manufacturers are manufacturing that. every single time it's used we can't use it. so a military style weapon and absolutely -- >> to the point you inaccurately said these weapons can spray a room full of bullets and you know that's incorrect. >> that's not true. >> that is correct. >> by pulling the trigger over and over again and having 100 rounds in a gun that's a rapid rate of spraying bullets we see this time and time again with gun, you know, tragedy, sandy hook, colorado. >> the only thing -- you know

the machine gun was banned, then we have this assault rifle military style assault rifle. and then the difference was the machine gun may have sprayed bullets in a matter of 2 seconds and the assault rifle does it in 5 seconds. doesn't matter. you can -- with 100 round ammunition, 15 rounds, 30 round, 40 round, whatever it is, you can kill a lot of people in a matter of seconds and there is no purpose to that for civilian use. >> i'll give you one real push back for civilian use, let's rewind our mental videotapes to rodney king riots in la. the city was on fire. there's footage that went on every major news network of this mob that was going from one area to another area. on top were the korean gun owners they did not get drug out into the street and beat,

their stores were not burned down. yes there are purposes for these. >> are you serious? >> hot home invasions, hot home invasions when three people come in arm today your house with the intent of binding you and then killing all witnesses, which is going to be the more effective weapon we're holding off that many invasion. >> studies show if you have a gun in your house for quote/unquote protection, it will be more likely used against you and the person -- >> the keller man's study going back. >> even police officers have a hard time reacting, you know, the reason that assault weapons actually are used for soldiers is because they can rapidly shoot and soldiers have such a adrenaline that a number of bullets need to be shot because their accuracy is not going to be very accurate. so a number of bullets can be shot and hopefully their target will be actually hit. you know, people that are trained every single day to pull a weapon and fire like

police officers, they're accuracy isn't that great. so a civilian to have a weapon like that in their house will easily can be compromised we see 20 times more likely that gun is used against the owner in their own home. >> and the other thing here is too, i'd like to touch and this was what i was talking about before. we're talking about a massively powerful industry. look at the conversation we're having right now, based on -- basically fantasy, right, there is no rates of sexual abuse, violence, murder, homicide, mass majority of those things in the united states are not the sort of stranger violent occurrences. this whole fantasy where some dark person from somewhere and i do mean a racial over tone is going to come and raid your neighborhood and raid your house and going to be up on your roof top with a weapon of some sort it just doesn't happen. i mean, a vast majority of violent crime in the united states is by someone you know, you're related to. it isn't this, again, same as

sexual assault, the stranger rate mist. most sexual happens people in your family. -- construction fear that. industries are profiting on hand over fist. right, and that's why you see hunting rifles only and hunting ammunition and hunting weapons only making up 25% of sales since 2008. and in fact there's even industry memos. there's even letters inside the industry talking about the obama boom in gun sales, talking about with a black president you're going to be able to use the realized fear. >> can i jump in there and say, news needs ya we hear a lot of that. as soon as gun sales go up we here right after the president makes a speech or right after an initiative. i have to tell you from the african-american community, there is some concern about that because we don't necessarily see that as being a ploy to help any industry, but

it is happening. it's a news reality, but the black community is also concerned about that as well. >> but the real fact behind -- >> propose gun control, gun sales went up. it has nothing to do with race. it has nothing to do with race, it has everything to do with you believe a politician is going to make some sort of substantial move to restrict your ability to own what fire arms you think you need to protect yourself. >> let's come back to that point. >> the real fact behind that media story is not that more people are buying guns, it's the same gun owners buying more guns. so it's a small group of people, basically, controlling our policy now in this country. and beyond assault weapons let's talk about the background checks because 74% of nra members absolutely agree with the universal background check, why, because responsible gun owners are getting a bad rap from the sandy hook, virginia

tech, columbine shooting. the real good guys are getting a bad rap r so they agreed with the universal background check. they don't have a problem giving up their information just like we do with cars, we register our cars they don't have a problem registering their gun and getting the proper education behind it. i work with two nra members, so -- and they tell me that, that they don't have a problem with the banning of the assault weapons because they don't use them for hunting. they don't have the universal background check because they're responsible gun owners. so the leadership of nra which is a puppet of the gun industry, that is the problem and the money if you trail it it all goes back to money and the money paid to the politicians. >> i just wanted to jump back to the president obama issue. the nra has done an amazing fear campaign, president obama actually in his first term expanded gun rights. so this idea that obama was going to disarm the public and

get rid of -- abolish the second amendment altogether isn't true in his first time i mean because of president obama you can open and carry in national parks. i do have to say there's been an amazing fear campaign launched and it is people arming themselves with extremely, i mean, you knee, building arsenals with extremely dangerous weapons just out of this idea that they're not going to be available any more or fear of the other. i'm not quite sure going back to your point where this fear really comes from because i live in los angeles. i've lived in the bay area. i've there traveled the world. like i don't see and i don't feel this extreme threat for my personal safety. i can guarantee you i will not feel safe or having my husband own a gun. you can look at studies and that just moves that's not the case. >> i'm hearing all of this conversation fear, motivating points on both sides. there are people out there watching this program thinking, i don't own a gun and i've always been safe and i've had a

gun and never had a problem. why can't we rationally talk about this more and come to some compromise which seems to be a dirty word. >> it should be question about sensible gun legislation. there's no reason why we can't all meet in the middle and have a conversation about going back to registration. let's take cars for example, you know, we had seat belts that are required. you can't text while driving. we have a series of laws in place. we all agree to abide by these laws in order for the betterment of society. why can't we have a sensible discussion about guns. >> you have just created something the media should do more, an opportunity to have all sides sit down and talk about it without getting -- certainly not physical. i thank you for all that. let's do more of this. i thank you for joining us for this conversation, come on back for another edition of equal times.

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