tavis: good evening. from los angeles, i am tavis smiley. tonight a conversation with grace lee boggs. her remarkable life has been cap heard in a new documentary. we are glad you joined us. a conversation with grace lee boggs is going on right now. ♪ it is a beautiful day

raining, youted would not hear this or a complaining -- this boy complaining captioned by the national captioning institute --www.ncicap.org-- >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. tavis: at almost 98 years old grace lee boggs has been a passionate participant working for justice. over her long life she has learned important lessons she is now sharing through continued work

in her hometown of detroit. she walked to her old neighborhood in detroit. i feel sorry for people not living in detroit. detroit gives a sense of civilization in a way you do not get in a city like new york. it is obvious what does not work. people are always striving to be this is how giants fall. i am honored to have you

on this program. this is my first time having you on the show. i am glad you are here. let me start by asking what is till --roit that's what is it about detroit that still makes you optimistic? that picture is the company which was producing cars when i came to detroit 60 years ago. it is now broken glass and concrete. to detroit, if you threw a stone in the air, it would hit and autoworker. it was very close to where we a few yearsn because of production of cars in

, the plant japan moved to wisconsin and stopped reducing cars, and the chrysler plant went from hiring 70,000 workers to 2000 workers. if you threw a stone on the way down it would hit a vacant lot or an abandoned house. some people thought that was the but african-americans looked at those vacant lots. they said that is an opportunity , and it gives a sense of time and change. they began to transform the city. we began to create a city that was sustainable. we grow our own food.

it is post industrial. that turning point is a great privilege. >> what do you think the future of detroit is? think detroit is already providing a model for changing the world. from all over the world to see what we are doing. people are looking for a new way of living. there is something unsustainable about the way we are living. it is recognizing all the contribution -- the contradictions of an industrial society are coming home to roost, and we have to create something new. talk to me about the

humanity of detroit. i have always loved detroit. there is a lot to love. there is so much to love about detroit, but talk to me about the people and their perseverance. we used to think the movement was going to come from labor. began to come from people. people taking charge of their neighborhood. a whole new culture i think is

important. how important do you think speaking? culturally >> we thought producing more and we believed that considering what an important figure it was, but that was not sustainable. i was born in the second decade of the 20th century, and i am here in the second decade of the 21st century. a are shaking the world with new dream. >> what is that new dream?

thehat is ringing neighborhood backs. it is bringing food from 100 miles away and using a lot of fuel. when i said bring the neighbor back into the hood. to detroit?ou get >> i believed in the labor market, and i learned differently by being in detroit and being married to jimmy boggs. >> tell me about jimmy boggs. wherewas born in alabama

there were more pigs than people, but people in the south and theyderstanding, survive. he became a writer because people could write. he knew had to take advantage of a bad situation and turn it into a good one. how did you become partners? >> i chased after him. were you chasing jimmy? >> he would laugh and say, grace has got me. i understood there was

something very fresh and very new here. i lived in new york city. i came from the big apple. i had a lot of abstract ideas, and here was somebody who was very much alive in his and to whom people .ould look for leadership it was an extraordinary experience. about theant to ask causes you have worked on in your lifetime. let me start by asking why you got involved in labor work and what do you make of the labor movement today. i was working for $10 a week in chicago in the library.

?avis: did you say $10 a week >> you do not understand, but a lot of people in 1940 did not make much more than $500 a year. i live rent free in an in the basement, and i had to face rats to get into my home. that made me one with the community. you come in contact with the black community. what was your way in? >> in 1941 philip randolph

mobilizing workers. the march on washington for jobs, and we scared the daylights out of him, and he begged randolph to call off the march. ,e finally band discrimination and that changed the whole country and the world. i said, that is what i am going to do with my life. >> for those who do not know the name, he was head of the corridors way back in the day. legend in chicago and in this country. since you mentioned randolph and the fear you put in the heart of fdr, fdr presided over a difficult time in this country economically. can you compare that difficult

time with this difficult time under obama? >> i was a student during the , and i felt it was necessary to become a philosopher. why.not know i did not know what a -- asopher was area did philosopher was. the crises are more crises of humanity. what can we do? just interested in jobs so we can become?

-- so we can be materialist? we have to grow our souls. the world needs us. tavis: i love you. you know that already. and philiped fdr randolph and the work they did together. week marks the 50th anniversary of the big march in .etroit area a lot of folks do not know this. the famous i have a dream speech we will celebrate 50 this coming august. before keying it got washington to deliver this, he went to detroit right about now, and that is when he tried out the team.

he used detroit as a testing ground for a speech he would later give in august he most is famous for. he did that first in detroit. grace lee boggs was in the audience. she was one of the organizers when dr. king came to detroit for this grand celebration. i will let you tell the story. you are 98. i am only 48. tell me what happened in detroit. birmingham had happened. the movement for human rights had decided to boycott downtown in birmingham during the easter season.

after they jailed martin luther the children began marching. people saw it all over the , and they organized a rally to protest. only a few people showed up. clay got up there and said, we should have a march that will scare the devil out of the police, and they will hide area hide. they will we started organizing the march.

we had no idea what was going to happen. clay got in touch with them. we decided to meet in churches every week and announced a march. to our amazement people began pouring in from all over the state. theade a huge difference role detroit began to play and the movement. a chanceery time i get to speak i kissed the ground for what the hall represents relative to the march. every time i would go to

detroit to celebrate what happened that day in that building. detroite will celebrate not only for freedom marches but creating a whole new way of life. when this documentary that is out now, which is called the evolution of grace walks, been your what has evolution? >> when i joined the movement, the ideal revolution came from the russian revolution, from 1917, and the idea was to seize power. power means you ,ecome a prisoner of the state and we had seen the collapse of the soviet union.

i knew the concept of revolution. it was because the circumstances provided the opportunity to do so. back in the day you had one view of martin luther king, junior, and your view has shifted a bit. what did you think about king back then, and what do you think about him now? >> the movement was reoccupied with tactics. we thought it was silly. we did not have a long enough or respective, but when i saw the amount of violence that came out, particularly when king made his speech about a radical ivolution of values,

recognized he knew we were on the threshold of something very new. a book that is now out called occupy spirituality. we are on the threshold of spiritual activism. tavis: you feel a little different about dr. king in retrospect? >> i think so. he called on us to realize we are on the wrong side of evolution. he began to give us a different sense of global citizenship. it was a question of vision. tavis: you mentioned this new text that has come out not too long ago. what do you make of the occupied movement? this is the most activism they have seen in their young lives.

>> i think the occupied movement lacked vision, but i think that is beginning to emerge, and i think we have to provide it. tavis: how do we provide it? let me ask you this. what do you make of the fact -- if i had more time i could do this for hours. it is amazing to me you have outlived so many people you have not only worked with but some of the people you have critiqued and had disagreements with in your life. what do you make of that? what i do i think makes me a little wiser, which helps.

growing older you have got to but you grow at the same time in wisdom and knowledge. very longrt of a revolution. it is very helpful. tavis: now you hit on something i am dying to get an answer to. as a christian the bible i read tells the story of king solomon, who asked for one thing. he wanted wisdom. the scripture says, get an understanding. .olomon asked for wisdom you are clearly a very wise person, and you talked about going over there and gaining wisdom, gaining in knowledge. what can you say about the best way to make ourselves more knowledgeable? how do we get more wise as we

get older? >> i think the first thing is to recognize every crisis is a danger and an opportunity. another thing i have learned is human beings are not all like a school of fish. as beingf individuals very different. some people are paralyzed by crisis. some people want to do something but do not know what to do. other people began thinking very creatively. the path is to nurture those people who are taking very visionary ways. >> what gets you out of bed every day? >> what i have to do.

>> what is it you still think you have to do? >> i will not go gently into the night. tavis: you are ok with having more work to do? >> i do not know. i have to think about it erie it -- to think about it. are youn retrospect, happy? are you content with the life you have lived? >> i think i would be remiss if am.re not, so i so are we. i have waited a long time. i am delighted to have had you on this show.

thank you. what more can i say? ofhink this is a teaser what i suspect will be an award- winning documentary starring this legend in her own time. that is it for tonight. as always, thanks for watching. -- >> for more information on today's show, visit tavis smiley at pbs.org. tavis: hi, i'm tavis smiley. join me next time for a ronersation with historian james junior about his new book. that is next time. we will see you then. it is a beautiful day, and i cannot myself from smiling, and

i know there is no denying ♪ ♪ it is a beautiful day , youit started raining will not hear this boy complaining ♪ ♪it's a beautiful day >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. >> be more. pbs.xdxd

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